Thailand To Consider Amnesty For Red-Shirts Leaders

[ChiangMaiFun]

I don't understand the reaction and praise for the army spokesman Abhisit. This option comes 7 weeks to late. Logically, he had no chance than to give in for this public demand. He even admitted that he's not happy of the way he came to power.

Right!

[difos57]

In order for Thailand to move forward ... there can be no amnesty, no rewards and sever penalties for those who blatantly broke the law when it comes to violence, hurting Thailand and the people of Thailand in an attempt to force change or overthrow the government. Elections will be meaningless unless these people are prosecuted and the people of Thailand see this is not only not the way to change but a guaranteed way to lose your freedoms and possibly life.

There has been a coup almost for every 4 year election cycle in the last 75 or so years. So, if you think the PM is serious about change then you will realize there can be NO amnesty. But they certainly are not going to go after those for simply being part of the mob unless they are still there in the coming days. The PM has made it clear over the last weeks he had a goal of clearing out all but the hardcore group from the mob to avoid injury and loss of life to those simply sucked up into this mess. So, guess what, that time is now. If the reds don't take the offer unconditionally then troops move in and the vast majority of Thailand will approve this and the PM will gain more popularity.

The reds lost. They could have walked away as winners when the PM offered this almost same exact deal when he agreed to talk to them live on TV and they refused to negotiate and instead have gone onto put 60k+ people out of work, cause untold economic damage to Thailand as well as many deaths and hundreds of injuries. All for what??? To take a deal they were offered at the start of this mess.

The lawless red mob has nothing to offer and nothing to negotiate with and the PM would only lose credibility if he talks with the anymore except to tell them how it is and how it is going to be.

Amnesty is a very helpful feature of an offer in a situation like this. Any deal will require it. It should also cover Abisit himself and the Army and police for April 10th and 29th. It could also cover the yellows for their acts at the airport in 2008. Without it, the reds will not accept any deal and we probably are going to move to much more instability and violence.

In my opinion, Thailand has changed forever and people in Bangkok better figure it out soon before this gets totally out of hand. Cut a deal. It will cost some money and some people will lose face but the alternative is drawn out insurrection like in the South spiraling down into more and more violence begetting more violence. Think Beirut, Belfast, Bosnia. Is that what you want?

What did Abhisit do wrong? He did not hire the men in black. The reds wanted a blood bath from the start. Abhisit should be commended for not being sucked into the red propaganda and seen this thru with the fewest lives lost, given all of the scenarios. He is a heroe.

The yellows crimes pale in comparison with the red terrorists.

This sounds like desperation by the last days of the reds.

I think there may be a new definition of stupidity: Taksin.

[difos57]

whining and distortion sets in ...

Jatuporn: No attempt whatsoever to arrest those responsible for killing protesters.

half a minute ago via TweetDeck

Jatuporn: DSI making up evidence and false witnesses against reds.

1 minute ago via TweetDeck

Jatuporn: We won't trade fake terrorism charges with real charges of murdering the people.

1 minute ago via TweetDeck

Ok, here we go again. The reds now put DSI on their hit list. What are they going to do? Bomb them.

The reds answer to everything. Bomb them. Now we know why there was so many bombings in the south.

They reds have to be stopped.

[bangkokjohn]

Elections and amnesty for all saves lives, creates a new coalition government and give us back the peaceful place we all love. What is not to like?

Because the nano second the next elections are over, the yellows will be out on the street with the motivation of 'anything you can do I can do bigger and better', and we are back at stage one. If the PM holds elections right now, it is effectively with a gun held to his head. Democracy?? Helloooo!

Amnesty for what? For inciting violence, corruption, murder, overthrow, stealing of weapons etc etc etc. You have to be kidding. All an amnesty does is make sure they can do it all again next time and believe me if a line is not drawn in the sand by Abshivit now, this country will go further down the tubes than it already is.

Amnesty for peace. Amnesty for the Generals who staged the coup in 2006 which started this mess. Amnesty for the yellows who first gave us the mass disruptions. Amnesty for Ahbist who allowed troops with live ammo to face off civilian protesters and ended up killing 20 of them. Amnesty for the Reds who have mad a mess of things lately but overall are not too bad considering they have been shat on for 500 years.

This chaos can be stopped but we are running out of time. The PM will have to make clear that all Thais have to respect the results of a new election - Yellow, Reds, multicolors. Any blocking of major centers of commerce after new elections should be cleared quickly with normal crowd control techniquies - no bullets.

I know what you will say. "Reds cheat at elections and buy votes, bla bla bal." All parties cheat - the Democrats, including Ahbist - are about to be disbanded by the election committee for illegal campaign donations. Let everybody who wants form a party, spend money and run. Let the best man(and vote buyer) win and let's get back to talking about women and sports!

Amnesty + new elections = peace.

[elcent]

What did Abhisit do wrong? He did not hire the men in black. The reds wanted a blood bath from the start. Abhisit should be commended for not being sucked into the red propaganda and seen this thru with the fewest lives lost, given all of the scenarios. He is a heroe.

The yellows crimes pale in comparison with the red terrorists.

This sounds like desperation by the last days of the reds.

I think there may be a new definition of stupidity: Taksin.

there was a huge public demand for him to clear up his acts. Over a year now and still no progress in amending the charter. He probably thought that he can get over it quietly. Also the opposition party made tons of mistakes because of Thaksin's influence.

I agree that he shouldn't give in to thugs, but the public demand has nothing to do with the red leaders and their threats.

Just common sense would do the trick. One doesn't have to show off their (in)abilities so obviously.

Even they did some good, but then one could say "every broken watch is right two times a day", - the same for Thaksin and the opposition.

Nobody of them kept the interest of the country in mind when they acted, - nobody.

Proof for today/yesterday is that Abhisit acts just a spokesman for the army, hence the remarks from Chuan, who didn't know anything about the road map. So who runs the show then?

Be honest all, this is not democracy either.

Thailand needs to make a real step forward and without interference of power brokers and army.

If a personality like Anand would have been in the position of Abhisit, things would have been cleared a long time ago already, he's one of the rare selfless people, apart from the millions of commoners willing and ready to do the right thing.

[brahmburgers]

What's all the discussion about? Red leaders said several times today they won't ask for amnesty. Admittedly, it's surprising, but that's what they said. Indeed, I'll be surprised if they stick with that line. After a few days, and the likelihood of them getting in serious doo doo sinks in their thick skulls, they'll probably ask for amnesty.

As for Lese Majeste charges; I think it's good for all concerned, to drop that like a hot potato.

BTW, don't be surprised if Abhisit gets nominated for a Nobel Peace Prize. I jest not. You heard it first here, and I wouldn't be surprised if he nabs it. Few, if any, world leaders would have kept things so relatively violence-free in such a prolonged and challenging several weeks as he has. My hat's off to you sir, bravo.

Edited May 4, 2010 by brahmburgers

[kissdani]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

[brahmburgers]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

You claim; "Abhisit's abuse of power" ....What abuse of power? You mean being so standoffish as to appear meek? You mean not having enough gumption (or authority) to demand security forces to do what they're supposed to do (protect Thai people and property).

Here's an expression that fits kissdani's misdirected claim:

'BARKING UP THE WRONG TREE'

[elcent]

guess the democrats are celebrating at the commerce minister's relatives massage parlor today.

[jdinasia]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

You are right again but come to the wrong conclusions .. again. If you keep this up you might have me thinking that you are a bit more red than Weng

Abuse of power? I have certainly seen that in Thailand. In fact Thaksin was found guilty of it. Defending civil liberties? Abhisit has done that. Then again Thaksin got a brutal insurgency rolling in the South. Thaksin is responsible for the extra-judicial killings of 2700+ Thais. (Isn't right to life the first civil liberty, followed by the right to freedom from unlawful imprisonment and then the right to a fair and speedy trial? 2700+ Thais killed without a trial!)

Abhisit, on the other hand, was calm and patient and reasonable even when the protest leaders spoke out for violence, sedition, treason .......

[elcent]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

You are right again but come to the wrong conclusions .. again. If you keep this up you might have me thinking that you are a bit more red than Weng

Abuse of power? I have certainly seen that in Thailand. In fact Thaksin was found guilty of it. Defending civil liberties? Abhisit has done that. Then again Thaksin got a brutal insurgency rolling in the South. Thaksin is responsible for the extra-judicial killings of 2700+ Thais. (Isn't right to life the first civil liberty, followed by the right to freedom from unlawful imprisonment and then the right to a fair and speedy trial? 2700+ Thais killed without a trial!)

Abhisit, on the other hand, was calm and patient and reasonable even when the protest leaders spoke out for violence, sedition, treason .......

There's no question that army spokesman Abhisit gets the go before Thaksin. Although he isn't as innocent as he looks like.

[jdinasia]

Elections and amnesty for all saves lives, creates a new coalition government and give us back the peaceful place we all love. What is not to like?

Because the nano second the next elections are over, the yellows will be out on the street with the motivation of 'anything you can do I can do bigger and better', and we are back at stage one. If the PM holds elections right now, it is effectively with a gun held to his head. Democracy?? Helloooo!

Amnesty for what? For inciting violence, corruption, murder, overthrow, stealing of weapons etc etc etc. You have to be kidding. All an amnesty does is make sure they can do it all again next time and believe me if a line is not drawn in the sand by Abshivit now, this country will go further down the tubes than it already is.

Amnesty for peace. Amnesty for the Generals who staged the coup in 2006 which started this mess. Amnesty for the yellows who first gave us the mass disruptions. Amnesty for Ahbist who allowed troops with live ammo to face off civilian protesters and ended up killing 20 of them. Amnesty for the Reds who have mad a mess of things lately but overall are not too bad considering they have been shat on for 500 years.

This chaos can be stopped but we are running out of time. The PM will have to make clear that all Thais have to respect the results of a new election - Yellow, Reds, multicolors. Any blocking of major centers of commerce after new elections should be cleared quickly with normal crowd control techniquies - no bullets.

I know what you will say. "Reds cheat at elections and buy votes, bla bla bal." All parties cheat - the Democrats, including Ahbist - are about to be disbanded by the election committee for illegal campaign donations. Let everybody who wants form a party, spend money and run. Let the best man(and vote buyer) win and let's get back to talking about women and sports!

Amnesty + new elections = peace.

hmmmmm you even start with an erroneous assumption .....

The military coup of 2006 was NOT the cause of the current political crisis. Thaksin was .. and yes, Thaksin is STILL the root problem politically.

[Beardog]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

What civil liberties are you talking about? Even the ngo's know this is all about Taksin & his money.not even related to the poor red puppets who believe they are fighting for a cause & even at that when is enough -enough? Maybe a couple more malitovs or 1/2 dozen grenades will do hey there are always more hospitals to terrorize. Protesting -Not a crime acts of violence terrorism & not using your brain is. Besides how do you think they will get these civil liberties ? You may have guessed equal taxation for legal representation. When you pay no tax into the kitty you don't get <deleted> ,but I don't suppose those who think they are marching for liberation had a thought of what further sacrifices they will be asked to make.if you really believe you have any vision run for

Abhisits position & if your not Thai what the hel_l does it matter to you anyway as you are helpless in this situation albeit another armchair quarterback.

[elcent]

first and foremost you all can thank and bow to army general Anupong who didn't bow to Abhisit's demand to disperse the reds with utmost force. TRUTH! drama queen Suthep is even worse.

Edited May 4, 2010 by elcent

[anon7867763]

Abhisit has lost control so its actually good that he disolves parlaiment which is very sad , especially if the other (redish) side wins

watch out for boxes of money moving around the countryside

If he can´t bring the perpertraters to justice , whats the point of him hanging around ?

Welcome to red Thaksin Thailand , scarey isn´t it.

[jdinasia]

I don't understand the reaction and praise for the army spokesman Abhisit. This option comes 7 weeks to late. Logically, he had no chance than to give in for this public demand. He even admitted that he's not happy of the way he came to power.

Hmmmmm

Let's see ... 7 weeks ago Abhisit gives in ... looks totally spineless.

Now ... he looks steady, patient, resourceful, willing to compromise, etc etc

Let's see the reds -- the could have taken a compromise that was 6 weeks longer ... when they negotiated but in the meantime they have killed, raided hospitals, threatened more violence.

[jdinasia]

first and foremost you all can thank and bow to army general Anupong who didn't bow to Abhisit's demand to disperse the reds with utmost force. TRUTH! drama queen Suthep is even worse.

Strange -- in multiple threads tonight you call Abhisit the "army spokesperson" but in this one you talk about him openly telling the army what to do and point out that the army failed to do so. Drama?

I don't think the army deliberately or directly disobeyed (probably). I think instead that Abhisit learned from Chavalit's failure on Oct 7th 2008 when he ORDERED action that failed AND looked bad internationally.

[321niti123]

FASCISM EMERGES IN THAILAND

It is high time that we face up to the fact that the UDD Red Shirt movement and its political brother the Puea Thai Party, represent an obvious expression of fascism. We should all stop "beating around the bush" and publicly recognize this overt threat to true Democracy.

Fascism

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fascists believe that a nation is an organic community that requires strong leadership, singular collective identity, and the will and ability to commit violence and wage war in order to keep the nation strong.[15] They claim that culture is created by collective national society and its state, that cultural ideas are what give individuals identity, and thus rejects individualism.[15] In viewing the nation as an integrated collective community, they claim that pluralism is a dysfunctional aspect of society, and justify a totalitarian state as a means to represent the nation in its entirety.[16][17] They advocate the creation of a single-party state.[18] Fascist governments forbid and suppress openness and opposition to the fascist state and the fascist movement.[19] They identify violence and war as actions that create national regeneration, spirit and vitality.[20]

Fascists reject and resist autonomy of cultural or ethnic groups who are not considered part of the fascists' nation and who refuse to assimilate or are unable to be assimilated.[21] They consider attempts to create such autonomy as an affront and threat to the nation.[21]

History and common sense tells us that you cannot appease, negotiate, reconcile, or compromise with fascists because they do not respect other points of view and cannot be trusted to adhere to agreements that are contrary to their core beliefs (ie. allowing unimpeded electoral campaigning).

Those who are entrusted to preserving the democratic state need to remove all such threats to society. As such, the UDD and the Puea Thai Party should be banned, dissolved, and designated as illegal entities and their leaders should be arrested and put in jail for terrorist actions, and treason.

True Democracy must be vigorously defended! A minority of ill-intentioned individuals or organizations must not be allowed to break the law and use violence and threats to usurp the rights of all good law-abiding citizens.

Actually the ideas they propagandize are communist and i have nothing against communism which is a beautiful but impracticle ideology. Even though their ideas are to share the wealth their leaders dont feel the same way and they certainly dont act the part.

[kissdani]

I haven't seen the PAD asking for amnesty at all .... in fact, the law may side with them on almost everything brought against them. I have seen Thaksin and Amnesty mentioned together often -- including a petition for exactly that. You blaming the PAD for 27 deaths is kinda silly.

Oh BTW --- you missed 20 PAD deaths and 1 unexplained death during the last days at Government house and the tie the PAD was at the airport.

You also missed the redshirt that died on Sept 1st/2nd when the reds attacked the PAD

You also missed the man that was beaten then murdered in Chiang Mai when the reds pulled him from the car.

There are several more ....

20 Pad deaths? Have you a source for it?

[elcent]

first and foremost you all can thank and bow to army general Anupong who didn't bow to Abhisit's demand to disperse the reds with utmost force. TRUTH! drama queen Suthep is even worse.

Strange -- in multiple threads tonight you call Abhisit the "army spokesperson" but in this one you talk about him openly telling the army what to do and point out that the army failed to do so. Drama?

I don't think the army deliberately or directly disobeyed (probably). I think instead that Abhisit learned from Chavalit's failure on Oct 7th 2008 when he ORDERED action that failed AND looked bad internationally.

explain please how Chuan didn't know what his alleged poodle was doing. Maybe that helps me to understand.

There will be not much good for the democrats in the upcoming election. Unfortunately, the opposition is even worse. But there is still hope that some others may emerge.

The whole thing has cost the country billions. Not those in the big business but the little man is most effected.

So, spare your election campaign, it's still not over yet.

oops, by the way, it was the army who asked him to do this now or else ... go figure.

I only give credit to whom credit is due. I'm not a groomer to get Mr. handsome superstar into the limelight for things he didn't do, never wanted too.

Edited May 4, 2010 by elcent

[elcent]

the most balanced democracies in the world have strong worker Unions. I think this should be a major consideration during upcoming talks.

[kissdani]

That weird Aussie dude, Conor David Purcell, should have no amnesty either.

I think we all can agree on this.

What he did?

[bendejo]

THE NATION: Thaksin: I just echoed an astrologer's prediction when I said I would come back before year end.

Superstition not common sense prevails.

Didn't say if he would be breathing when he arrives.

[elcent]

THE NATION: Thaksin: I just echoed an astrologer's prediction when I said I would come back before year end.

Superstition not common sense prevails.

Didn't say if he would be breathing when he arrives.

this guy is obsessed with demons singing to him all the time.

[kissdani]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

You are right again but come to the wrong conclusions .. again. If you keep this up you might have me thinking that you are a bit more red than Weng

Abuse of power? I have certainly seen that in Thailand. In fact Thaksin was found guilty of it. Defending civil liberties? Abhisit has done that. Then again Thaksin got a brutal insurgency rolling in the South. Thaksin is responsible for the extra-judicial killings of 2700+ Thais. (Isn't right to life the first civil liberty, followed by the right to freedom from unlawful imprisonment and then the right to a fair and speedy trial? 2700+ Thais killed without a trial!)

Abhisit, on the other hand, was calm and patient and reasonable even when the protest leaders spoke out for violence, sedition, treason .......

Forget the 10. April massacre, the unconstitutional censorship?

Why talking about Thaksin here? Is he the excuse for everything? Another strawman attack.

[kissdani]

Defending civil liberties and rights is not a crime but a duty for every citizen.

Abhisits abuse of power needs to be investigated and punished accordingly. That is it.

What civil liberties are you talking about? Even the ngo's know this is all about Taksin & his money.not even related to the poor red puppets who believe they are fighting for a cause & even at that when is enough -enough? Maybe a couple more malitovs or 1/2 dozen grenades will do hey there are always more hospitals to terrorize. Protesting -Not a crime acts of violence terrorism & not using your brain is. Besides how do you think they will get these civil liberties ? You may have guessed equal taxation for legal representation. When you pay no tax into the kitty you don't get <deleted> ,but I don't suppose those who think they are marching for liberation had a thought of what further sacrifices they will be asked to make.if you really believe you have any vision run for

Abhisits position & if your not Thai what the hel_l does it matter to you anyway as you are helpless in this situation albeit another armchair quarterback.

Civil liberties only for those who pay the most taxes?

You are a Farang USA, right?

[kissdani]

first and foremost you all can thank and bow to army general Anupong who didn't bow to Abhisit's demand to disperse the reds with utmost force. TRUTH! drama queen Suthep is even worse.

Exactly!

[hextac]

That weird Aussie dude, Conor David Purcell, should have no amnesty either.

I think we all can agree on this.

What he did?

His crimes are far too heinous to be explained here.

[Neilly]

That weird Aussie dude, Conor David Purcell, should have no amnesty either.

I think we all can agree on this.

What he did?

Google him...and take a pinch of salt

[Tigs]

That weird Aussie dude, Conor David Purcell, should have no amnesty either.

I think we all can agree on this.

What he did?

His crimes are far too heinous to be explained here.

This is him. Be warned this is almost to embarrassing to watch. There is a part two but I need a rest before I consider watching it! He seems to be ok for someone claiming to have been sht twice on Apr 10.