Success In Business

[joinme2leave]

the only farang i know and having made a rrrreal fortune is - as mentioned earlier this thread- Dietrich Mateschitz. And he did NOT come with lots of fortune. He was .... just lucky at the right time. And he was smart enough to proceed and NOT stay in thailand. The ones who made their fortunes with any kind of thai connection would not LIVE here but probably COME BACK for a holiday (or a weekend visit). And they will spend their thai holiday at places non of us will ever have a chance to meet them.

[chownah]

the only farang i know and having made a rrrreal fortune is - as mentioned earlier this thread- Dietrich Mateschitz. And he did NOT come with lots of fortune. He was .... just lucky at the right time. And he was smart enough to proceed and NOT stay in thailand. The ones who made their fortunes with any kind of thai connection would not LIVE here but probably COME BACK for a holiday (or a weekend visit). And they will spend their thai holiday at places non of us will ever have a chance to meet them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The OP is asking about making multi-millions with a business in Thailand. Dietrich Mateschitz started a company that became Red Bull. He started it in Austria and originally marketed it in Europe. He had two Thai partners but the business is in Austria. Dietrich did not make multi-millions in Thailand.....he made it in Austria.

Sorry but I think Dietrich is disqualified.

[Ted]

Hang on - knowone has mentioned Bill Heinecke - he made almost his entire fortune in Thailand and has more than thirty companies variously tied to his empire and grossing more than $80 million a year.

http://www.business-in-asia.com/bill_heinecke.html

Good for him - shows it can be done

[Tornado]

Hang on - knowone has mentioned Bill Heinecke - he made almost his entire fortune in Thailand and has more than thirty companies variously tied to his empire and grossing more than $80 million a year.

http://www.business-in-asia.com/bill_heinecke.html

Good for him - shows it can be done 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was trying to think of the guys name, he really is a winner here in Thailand.

I heard the guys at Sunbelt are also doing pretty good with their franchises - great to see!

[Ted]

I don't suppose anyone on TV has run into Bill have they?

[OldAsiaHand]

I don't suppose anyone on TV has run into Bill have they?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know Bill quite well. What is it you want to know?

[chownah]

WILLIAM E. HEINECKE came to Thailand with his parents when he was 14 years old. He graduated from the International School of Bangkok. I think his parents were rich already but don't know for sure. Does anyone know if the family was rich? If they lived in Thailand and could afford to send their son to the International School of Bangkok in 1964 then it is quite likely they were rich.

He is a Thai citizen...so is he a farang? Of course he is but not really. Today it takes a million dollars to become a Thai citizen.

In an interview I found on the internet he said:

"The Thai economy is so advanced today that it would be much more difficult to start out with the limited amount of capital with which I began. There are still certain countries where I think a young entrepreneur could make the sort of start I did - Vietnam, parts of China and maybe Indonesia which is going through something of a rebirth. Times have changed and Asia’s markets are much more developed today than when I started out in the late 1960’s."

He is suggesting what I posted above...namely that it is possible for a foreigner to make multi-millions but it is more likely to happen elsewhere.

[Dakhar]

So an "advanced" economy supresses chances to make it rich starting with little....

If that is the case, America must be the most advanced economies out there, because the days of the little guy making it are over. The guys that already have their fortune make sure of that.

[Ted]

Old Asia Hand - guess I'd be interested in the personality of a guy who has succeed financially so well - and in Thailand. Is he the kind of guy who would have succeeded in any market or do you think his personality and approach lends much better to Thailand?

[Heng]

WILLIAM E. HEINECKE came to Thailand with his parents when he was 14 years old.  He graduated from the International School of Bangkok.  I think his parents were rich already but don't know for sure.  Does anyone know if the family was rich?  If they lived in Thailand and could afford to send their son to the International School of Bangkok in 1964 then it is quite likely they were rich.

He is a Thai citizen...so is he a farang?  Of course he is but not really.  Today it takes a million dollars to become a Thai citizen.

In an interview I found on the internet he said:

"The Thai economy is so advanced today that it would be much more difficult to start out with the limited amount of capital with which I began. There are still certain countries where I think a young entrepreneur could make the sort of start I did - Vietnam, parts of China and maybe Indonesia which is going through something of a rebirth. Times have changed and Asia’s markets are much more developed today than when I started out in the late 1960’s."

He is suggesting what I posted above...namely that it is possible for a foreigner to make multi-millions but it is more likely to happen elsewhere.

He didn't get his citizenship the "normal" way (jumping through flaming hoops and playing freeze tag, etc.). Like Jim Thompson, he got his through "friends" (in this case, friends of his father: at least so "they" say).... naturally this isn't mentioned in any public interview. Perfectly legal through special treatment. No different than a police officer giving you a warning instead of a ticket.

To build a company from virtually nothing and take it public on a stock exchange isn't a cakewalk anywhere. It doesn't mean that becoming an ordinary $ millionaire here is more or less difficult than anywhere else. A lot depends on one's ability to adapt. Bill had a head start in moving here as a teenager and living here (at least for a time) with his family.... thereby essentially starting at square one as "almost a local."

Here, the gov't doesn't expect (and when they do, there is very little enforcement) you to pay taxes if you're making next to nothing. Many businesses exist for years and sometimes their entire lives without paying anywhere near full tax (take just about any business where you get a receipt that says "cash receipt"). Thus it's like building a start up in a virtual tax haven. In many places in the west... they expect you to file a tax return no matter how much you're making.

Also here... you're essentially only going to have to compete with 20% of the population (the merchant class Thai Chinese and Thai Indians and to a lesser extent the few hundred thousand indigenous Thais with some business acumen). That's a big advantage.

[pyros]

Old Asia Hand - guess I'd be interested in the personality of a guy who has succeed financially so well - and in Thailand. Is he the kind of guy who would have succeeded in any market or do you think his personality and approach lends much better to Thailand?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just my opinion is ... you can make it everywhere , even with little money if you have the right product at the right timing . Doesn't have to be a difficult product , or doesn't need much advertising or whatever ... just mouth to mouth speaking will do the job . For ex. a couple of years ago ( 4??? ) there was a very young schoolboy , i think he was 12 or 13 . For his schoolwork he had to make something on pc , he made a website . The site wasn't flashy or didn't cost anything . The thing which was on the website was just the right thing at the right timing which was ... telephone costs with different operators for cellphones ( GSM) . At that time , gsm was just at the boom and there where so many formulas from different operators nobody could figure out what was best for him . He just made a list comparing the lot . The word started to get around and the phone companies noticed it also that they came from his website . So they gave him money for every client which came through his website . He made quite a lot off money from this stupid thing ... more then enough never to beg for work anymore if he didn't touch the money till 18 . His parents actually became working for him ... Stupid ex. but that is the way things go . Timing and the right product ... that's all that takes ... more is better but those 2 factors are the most important .

[chownah]

Well, so far two people have been put forward as foreigners who have made multi-millions starting businesses in Thailand.....and.....one never even started a business in Thailand but in Austria......and the other came from a well todo and well connected family (or so it appears), moved here when he was 14 attended school here, got Thai citizenship, and then started a business which made him multi-millions.....and he agrees with me that its unlikely to happen now since things were different back in the '60s when he started his business.

I think its looking pretty bleak for those who are trying to come up with an example of a foreigner who has started a company in Thailand and made multi-millions.

Can any of you come up with just one?

[boris]

I don't suppose anyone on TV has run into Bill have they?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know Bill quite well. What is it you want to know?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Don't want to pre-empt Asia Old Hand's reply and I will be interested to see it.Bill Heinecke, whom I also know though not that well, isn't really a farang at all other than in the strict ethnic sense.He's essentially a Sino-Thai Bangkok tycoon with all the tricks of the Thailand corporate trade (and these are legion).He is certainly a talented businessman though a very prominent Thai investment banker once commented to me it was a puzzle why Bill wasn't a lot more substantial.Bill nearly went under in the economic crisis but is now doing very well.He has a streak of ruthlessness and piles of genine charm.Weakness is his tendency to micromanage.I like him a lot but he is a world to himself and no real example for budding foreign entrepreneurs.Funny thing is his grasp of the Thai language is rather poor!

[marquess]

Well, so far two people have been put forward as foreigners who have made multi-millions starting businesses in Thailand.....and.....one never even started a business in Thailand but in Austria......and the other came from a well todo and well connected family (or so it appears), moved here when he was 14 attended school here, got Thai citizenship, and then started a business which made him multi-millions.....and he agrees with me that its unlikely to happen now since things were different back in the '60s when he started his business.

I think its looking pretty bleak for those who are trying to come up with an example of a foreigner who has started a company in Thailand and made multi-millions.

Can any of you come up with just one?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think that the above post answers my question. In the current xenephobic climate, it is extremely, extremely unlikely that any farang could make big money here in Thailand.

[Heng]

Well, so far two people have been put forward as foreigners who have made multi-millions starting businesses in Thailand.....and.....one never even started a business in Thailand but in Austria......and the other came from a well todo and well connected family (or so it appears), moved here when he was 14 attended school here, got Thai citizenship, and then started a business which made him multi-millions.....and he agrees with me that its unlikely to happen now since things were different back in the '60s when he started his business.

I think its looking pretty bleak for those who are trying to come up with an example of a foreigner who has started a company in Thailand and made multi-millions.

Can any of you come up with just one?

There are probably some around... it's just that like those who are self made anywhere, it's a finite percentage who wish to wave the flags and trumpet it for all to see and hear.

[Mr Helper]

Your also forgetting the people who have made mi££ions through Thailands er 'other products'. Many farangs make 6 and 7 figure sums by having TG's working in their brothels/saunas/massage parlours. The famous welshman 'Howard Marks' made millions through the Cannabis business, and others have made astronomical fortunes through the Herion trade, and STILL do! Also people have made fortunes through the Counterfit business, I know of a girl who used to make £20,000 (1,470,000 baht) per trip to bkk through the counterfit business! She always flew 1st class, was never caught, and started this when she was 25 yrs old!!!

Edited June 12, 2005 by Mr Helper

[chownah]

Well, so far two people have been put forward as foreigners who have made multi-millions starting businesses in Thailand.....and.....one never even started a business in Thailand but in Austria......and the other came from a well todo and well connected family (or so it appears), moved here when he was 14 attended school here, got Thai citizenship, and then started a business which made him multi-millions.....and he agrees with me that its unlikely to happen now since things were different back in the '60s when he started his business.

I think its looking pretty bleak for those who are trying to come up with an example of a foreigner who has started a company in Thailand and made multi-millions.

Can any of you come up with just one?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There are probably some around... it's just that like those who are self made anywhere, it's a finite percentage who wish to wave the flags and trumpet it for all to see and hear.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well I guess since no one seems to be able to come up with even one example and the examples that people do come up with are either bogus or extremely special I guess it is becoming more evident that it is unlikely to happen here. Not impossible, but very unlikely. Better to try to get rich somewhere else. If you do try to get rich in Thailand it is much easier in the south...not the north..no money in the north...definitely no money....definitely....

Edited June 12, 2005 by chownah

[Heng]

It's certainly not likely to happen for those with negative outlooks, that's for sure.

[meom]

Well, so far two people have been put forward as foreigners who have made multi-millions starting businesses in Thailand.....and.....one never even started a business in Thailand but in Austria......and the other came from a well todo and well connected family (or so it appears), moved here when he was 14 attended school here, got Thai citizenship, and then started a business which made him multi-millions.....and he agrees with me that its unlikely to happen now since things were different back in the '60s when he started his business.

I think its looking pretty bleak for those who are trying to come up with an example of a foreigner who has started a company in Thailand and made multi-millions.

Can any of you come up with just one?

There are probably some around... it's just that like those who are self made anywhere, it's a finite percentage who wish to wave the flags and trumpet it for all to see and hear.

Well I guess since no one seems to be able to come up with even one example and the examples that people do come up with are either bogus or extremely special I guess it is becoming more evident that it is unlikely to happen here. Not impossible, but very unlikely. Better to try to get rich somewhere else. If you do try to get rich in Thailand it is much easier in the south...not the north..no money in the north...definitely no money....definitely....

Some people reckon Warren Buffet made a lot of money in Thailand.

Billions in fact and I think he didn't even have a workpermit.

[Soi Mongrel]

There are lots and lots of examples of foreigners who have come to Thailand and made out big -- multimillions. The Benedettis (Ital-thai), the Links (B. Grimm), the Booths (Jim Thompson)...then there are the law firms, owned by people like David Lyman, Harvey Price, Domnern Garden. Oh, and Ray Eaton (before he lost it all in the divorce).

You all should get out more.

[Dakhar]

"you all should get out more..."

Why so I could kiss rich people's @@@

No thanks...

[dr_Pat_Pong]

[chownah]

There are lots and lots of examples of foreigners who have come to Thailand and made out big -- multimillions.  The Benedettis (Ital-thai), the Links (B. Grimm), the Booths (Jim Thompson)...then there are the law firms, owned by people like David Lyman, Harvey Price, Domnern Garden.  Oh, and Ray Eaton (before he lost it all in the divorce).

You all should get out more.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is this the Thai star M. Benedetti? Not foreigner...she's Thai.

Jim Thompson is dead and made his fortune before most TV posters were born. His experience has nothing to do with making a fortune TODAY.

David Lyman didn't start a company...he's a lawyer educated overseas who got a good job with Tilleke & Gibbins...a big multinational law firm....where he still works...although he is the boss now....did not start a company and make multi-millions.

Harvey Price works for Deacon...another multi national law firm started in England. I think Harvey actually works in California...but I'll ask him next time we go 18 holes.

Ray Eaton is probably a liar....the only thing good about getting a divorce is you can lie about how much money you had so everyone will feel sorry for you and hate the bitch/bastard!!!!!

This is really lame. How many bogus self made multi-millionaires can YOU name?

It is looking less and less likely that anyone can do it today....based on the &lt;deleted&gt; put forward here.

Edited June 13, 2005 by chownah

[boris]

There are lots and lots of examples of foreigners who have come to Thailand and made out big -- multimillions.  The Benedettis (Ital-thai), the Links (B. Grimm), the Booths (Jim Thompson)...then there are the law firms, owned by people like David Lyman, Harvey Price, Domnern Garden.  Oh, and Ray Eaton (before he lost it all in the divorce).

You all should get out more.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who are the Benedettis, or are you just a deranged Nat Myria fan? You dont mean Georgio Berlingieri by any chance who was founding father of Italthai with Chaiyudh Karnasuta.The trading Links go decades and decades back.None of your examples are in the recent past.Ray Eaton isn't in this class at all and in any event never made much money in Thailand.Yes there have been some very successful lawyers (you could have mentioned Al Chandler).But the general rule holds on the extreme difficulty of entrepreneurs making money in Thailand.You obviously got out once but not in living memory.

[Soi Mongrel]

David Lyman inherited the firm from his parents. Harvey Price, I believe, started his own firm in Thailand (Price, Sanand, Praphas and Wynne?), which later joined the Deacons organization.

[Vit42]

Some perspective: The U.S. has about 7.5 million millionaires or about 2% of the total population. Much of the newly minted wealth was accumulated in the stock market where 37% of investments are made. Much of the old money was made over years of drudgery by penny-pinching, self-employed, hard-working types – males now over the age of 57.

Wealth accumulation is a function of the environment to product wealth. The land mass, the population, the per capita income, the natural resources, the infrastructure, the sophisticated financial markets, and much more are totally incomparable to many other nations of the world. It took time and an evolved market for people to become millionaires in the U.S.

So your question is irrelevant on many points. Not to say that you can’t do it in Thailand but if my goal was to become a millionaire I certainly wouldn’t be stupid enough to pick Thailand to try it versus many other countries.

If you’re suggesting that the lack of farang millionaires in Thailand is due to suppressive forces, you obvious aren’t making a fair comparison and don’t understand the economics of business.

[chownah]

David Lyman inherited the firm from his parents.  Harvey Price, I believe, started his own firm in Thailand (Price, Sanand, Praphas and Wynne?), which later joined the Deacons organization.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't know what your source of information is about these two gents....mine is the internet...specifically...profiles of them created by their companies.

Since you say the Lyman inherited his firm (not sure I agree with this) then he IS NOT a self made multimillionaire.

I haven't found anything about any company that Price might have owned but at any rate he started his career in Thailand in 1967.....so it is probably not relevant to the question of foreigners making multi-millions in Thailand TODAY.

Does not apply.......

During the war between North Vietnam and the USA(approx mid '60s to mid '70s), there was a great love of Americans in Thailand because Thailand was fighting its own communist insurgency and the US was seen by Thai authorities as their savior. Everything and almost anything to keep the US here, happy, and on point was done. It was acceptable and even fashionable to encourage foreigners (esp. Americans) to do business here and to get as involved as possible. But....just like all fashion...it changed.....now the US is not the savior of Thailand...on the contrary....foreigners are a bit disliked in Thailand in many places.....and certainly if you bring in alot of money (one million dollars american approximately) you can even become a citizen....but....other than that ......

Edited June 13, 2005 by chownah

[Heng]

What is self made anyway? Starting with 1 cent in your pocket? I think sometimes the "he just inherited it" and "he's not self made in Thailand" comments are just sour grapes about their own genetic lines since the beginning of time resulting in family estates with the sum total (after thousands of years) of $3,000.

There's nothing at all in Thailand to stop people from managing their portfolios (overseas if they must) from a modest sum like $100,000 into $1,000,000 through etrade, ameritrade, gs, charles schwab or whatever.

[kreon]

There are lots and lots of examples of foreigners who have come to Thailand and made out big -- multimillions.  The Benedettis (Ital-thai), the Links (B. Grimm), the Booths (Jim Thompson)...then there are the law firms, owned by people like David Lyman, Harvey Price, Domnern Garden.  Oh, and Ray Eaton (before he lost it all in the divorce).

You all should get out more.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is this the Thai star M. Benedetti? Not foreigner...she's Thai.

Jim Thompson is dead and made his fortune before most TV posters were born. His experience has nothing to do with making a fortune TODAY.

David Lyman didn't start a company...he's a lawyer educated overseas who got a good job with Tilleke & Gibbins...a big multinational law firm....where he still works...although he is the boss now....did not start a company and make multi-millions.

Harvey Price works for Deacon...another multi national law firm started in England. I think Harvey actually works in California...but I'll ask him next time we go 18 holes.

Ray Eaton is probably a liar....the only thing good about getting a divorce is you can lie about how much money you had so everyone will feel sorry for you and hate the bitch/bastard!!!!!

This is really lame. How many bogus self made multi-millionaires can YOU name?

It is looking less and less likely that anyone can do it today....based on the &lt;deleted&gt; put forward here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i can mention a lot but not for obviuos reasons, but these two i can

both have public companies!!

bob kervorkian - construction(k-tech) - god bless you wherever you are

simon bonningtan - volvo(swedish motors) and property development

[Soi Mongrel]

That's Bonython, I believe.