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Dhl/Customs At It Again


imaneggspurt
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PB, i understand your advice about shipping agents... But I'm wondering, not knowing the charges/pricing for that kind of service, whether pursuing that would really make any economic sense for the typical casual, and only occasional, expat shipper.

If I was bringing things in regularly for a business or something, then I could understand that... But for someone who just occasionally orders stuff for home use, and goes the U.S.P.S-Thai Post route, I'm wondering whether a shipping agent would be irrelevant and have no role to play.

Certainly if you are sending / receiving "once off" items etc. then you have to make a decision - send via Courier with a Tracking Number, Insurance (if you choose that option) etc. and accept that you will inevitably be charged Duty and VAT via the Courier Company - or take a (minimal - in my opinion) risk and ship via standard Post and if the parcel is lost you also lose out .... so you try again.

Personally I agree with you that the best route in that situation would be via U.S.P.S - Thai Post.

I Import via Airfreight regularly for my business here so I use the Forwarder / Customs Clearing Agent system and it has never given me problems; we Import basically the same equipment several times a year and once, years ago, the Forwarding Agents / me / Customs Department agreed on the Tariff Code (NOTE: NOT the percentage of Duty) every shipment after that is passed with absolutely no problems, it arrives at the Airport and is delivered to my Office within 2 or 3 days. (When we first started Importing some of this equipment the Duty for the Tariff Code we all agreed was 30% - over the last 12 - 15 years this has reduced to 0% and the Customs Deparment have watched the decrease and never tried to change the Code to impose Duty).

Patrick

Edit : Also of course since mine is a genuine business transaction I need Customs Duty / VAT Receipts to enabe my Company to charge these expenses to our P & L Account etc..

Edited by p_brownstone
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Well, I'm sorry, but I simply dont have any of the problems you're having. I guess you're just unlucky...:cheesy:

On a similar topic, if corruption is so bad in Thailand, why dont you go back to wherever you came from, that way there will be no more grief? Huh?:giggle:

Typical foolish apologist comment. Excuse me, but go read the multiple threads on editorials discussing how completely overwhelming Thailands corruption is. Yes corruption in Thailand is THAT BAD. We don't need to lie to ourselves about it or apologise for it in order to live in Thailand. It is you that has been lucky if nothing bad ever happens to you.

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On a similar topic, if corruption is so bad in Thailand, why dont you go back to wherever you came from, that way there will be no more grief? Huh?:giggle:

:jerk:

Out comes the Saffron tinted spectacle brigade. Boring, predictable response. Thai Customs are well known for their corruption. Do you condone corruption? :D

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Well, I'm sorry, but I simply dont have any of the problems you're having. I guess you're just unlucky...:cheesy:

On a similar topic, if corruption is so bad in Thailand, why dont you go back to wherever you came from, that way there will be no more grief? Huh?:giggle:

Typical foolish apologist comment. Excuse me, but go read the multiple threads on editorials discussing how completely overwhelming Thailands corruption is. Yes corruption in Thailand is THAT BAD. We don't need to lie to ourselves about it or apologise for it in order to live in Thailand. It is you that has been lucky if nothing bad ever happens to you.

Well, given the fact that I live in LOS I'm fully aware of what is going on. The one thing I struggle to grasp is how I could possibly have imported goods more than 15 times without experiencing any foul play. It cant just be luck, dont you agree? That you get sucker punched all the time has to be related to something else, dodgy or incorrect declarations perhaps..?

But hey, I take the argument that I'm just plain lucky!

Edited by Forethat
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On a similar topic, if corruption is so bad in Thailand, why dont you go back to wherever you came from, that way there will be no more grief? Huh?:giggle:

:jerk:

Out comes the Saffron tinted spectacle brigade. Boring, predictable response. Thai Customs are well known for their corruption. Do you condone corruption? :D

Absolutely not. I'm just not experiencing any when importing stuff to LOS via FedEx, DHL or UPS.

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It'd be interesting to hear who you guys claim to be the corrupt party here - Thai customs or the shipping agent..?

Seriously, I'm interested in knowing why you guys are victimized all the time and I'm not!

Edited by Forethat
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It'd be interesting to hear who you guys claim to be the corrupt party here - Thai customs or the shipping agent..?

Seriously, I'm interested in knowing why you guys are victimized all the time and I'm not!

At which point have I suggested that I was victimized?

It's probably likely that both shipping agent and customs are in on a number of the scams together. I receive around 3-4 parcels a month from the UK - various items, of varying values over a period of five years. I have only once been charged duty - which I still have been unable to figure out as to why, and how they concluded the amount of duty. You may well have been lucky, but there are plenty of stories from credible sources about the extortion of money for people shipping stuff into Thailand.

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It's probably likely that both shipping agent and customs are in on a number of the scams together. I receive around 3-4 parcels a month from the UK - various items, of varying values over a period of five years. I have only once been charged duty - which I still have been unable to figure out as to why, and how they concluded the amount of duty. You may well have been lucky, but there are plenty of stories from credible sources about the extortion of money for people shipping stuff into Thailand.

Sure, I have plenty of examples of foul play myself. Its just that none of them involves FedEx, DHL or UPS shipping goods IN to Thailand. Shipping OUT of Thailand is a different beast.

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Well once was enough for me. Thai customs wanted 100% tax on a single item. Never do that again.

If I ask nicely, would you be so kind as to tell us the circumstances of this case? What was the declared value? Shipping cost? How much was the fee and how much was the tax, VAT etc...?

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So first of all, for all of you who blaims Thai customs for this: your item is first cleared by the shipping company; that'd be DHL, FedEx or whatever, they will then charge you that amount PLUS their handling fee. If you think there is something wrong you can just file a complaint with that company. MAke sure you make the intial payment using your VISA or Amex and you're in a perfect position to walk away with no damage.

How does the Thai customs become a foul player in this..?

I can answer that, ive just been sent notice that a helmet i bought in the US FOR $34 has arrived with FEDEX, their charges 1500 baht, customs 2000 baht, ,total 3500 for a $34 item, i have told them to get stuffed and keep it,
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Simple lesson, do not send things by DHL, Fed Ex, etc, send item in an ordinary postpack envelope with declared value nil, gift or secondhand book.

Never opened.

Fine, what about if its 20kilos and a big box, ?
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It may depend on what kinds of things you're actually shipping...and if you're accurately completing the customs declarations...

For example, clothing items have a particularly high Thai official duty on them. I remember ordering something via a U.S. web site (because I'm tall and can't get the items here) that was shipped here by DHL...

I posted the details in another TV thread at the time. But basically, the shipping cost and the duties each were almost the price of the clothing items themselves. And actually, the customs duty, VAT and handling charges in total ended up costing more together than the total value of the 4 or 5 clothing items (shirts and pants) I had shipping. In other words, the total duty and tax (apart from the actual DHL shipping fee) was more than 100% of the value of the my goods.

Why don't you give some specifics of the kinds of things you've been shipping, and how the duties/customs/VAT charges have compared to the value of your items shipped.

I pay according to what is stipulated in Thai law. What else do you need to know?

http://www.thaivisa....land_vat.0.html

I have already told you what I have imported. Golf clubs, electronic equipment. I have also imported jewelry and clothes.

I really don't see the problem here, are you guys doing something dodgy and get pissed off when you can't get away with it! (Like having the sender incorrectly label the item as a gift or something that's broken?)?

Im sorry i have to agree with some other posters that you almost seem to acting for the couriers/customs !, ,heres another example, i was sent 2 items declared at $50 from china ,,( EMS) we were advised the import charges were 5200 baht, my wife called to say there was a mistake, on the phone they told her come to lam chabang customs office and "make an offer " ,so of we go, i immediatly asked them to open the box, inside the goods were as stated, i said all ill pay is the correct tarrif or we will walk, after 15 minutes of haggling and him punching a calculator we paid 152 ( one hundred and fifty two ) baht and were on our way ,p1ss takers at best, thives at worst is my thoughts,.
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Silly guy... Don't you realize, the Thai customs guys are just doing their best to protect the thriving Thai helmet manufacturing industry!!!! :lol:

I can answer that, ive just been sent notice that a helmet i bought in the US FOR $34 has arrived with FEDEX, their charges 1500 baht, customs 2000 baht, ,total 3500 for a $34 item, i have told them to get stuffed and keep it,

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So first of all, for all of you who blaims Thai customs for this: your item is first cleared by the shipping company; that'd be DHL, FedEx or whatever, they will then charge you that amount PLUS their handling fee. If you think there is something wrong you can just file a complaint with that company. MAke sure you make the intial payment using your VISA or Amex and you're in a perfect position to walk away with no damage.

How does the Thai customs become a foul player in this..?

I can answer that, ive just been sent notice that a helmet i bought in the US FOR $34 has arrived with FEDEX, their charges 1500 baht, customs 2000 baht, ,total 3500 for a $34 item, i have told them to get stuffed and keep it,

You're missing my point here: WHO is charging you excessive amounts? Thai customs or Fedex?

And how much was the shipping fee...?

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It may depend on what kinds of things you're actually shipping...and if you're accurately completing the customs declarations...

For example, clothing items have a particularly high Thai official duty on them. I remember ordering something via a U.S. web site (because I'm tall and can't get the items here) that was shipped here by DHL...

I posted the details in another TV thread at the time. But basically, the shipping cost and the duties each were almost the price of the clothing items themselves. And actually, the customs duty, VAT and handling charges in total ended up costing more together than the total value of the 4 or 5 clothing items (shirts and pants) I had shipping. In other words, the total duty and tax (apart from the actual DHL shipping fee) was more than 100% of the value of the my goods.

Why don't you give some specifics of the kinds of things you've been shipping, and how the duties/customs/VAT charges have compared to the value of your items shipped.

I pay according to what is stipulated in Thai law. What else do you need to know?

http://www.thaivisa....land_vat.0.html

I have already told you what I have imported. Golf clubs, electronic equipment. I have also imported jewelry and clothes.

I really don't see the problem here, are you guys doing something dodgy and get pissed off when you can't get away with it! (Like having the sender incorrectly label the item as a gift or something that's broken?)?

Im sorry i have to agree with some other posters that you almost seem to acting for the couriers/customs !, ,heres another example, i was sent 2 items declared at $50 from china ,,( EMS) we were advised the import charges were 5200 baht, my wife called to say there was a mistake, on the phone they told her come to lam chabang customs office and "make an offer " ,so of we go, i immediatly asked them to open the box, inside the goods were as stated, i said all ill pay is the correct tarrif or we will walk, after 15 minutes of haggling and him punching a calculator we paid 152 ( one hundred and fifty two ) baht and were on our way ,p1ss takers at best, thives at worst is my thoughts,.

First of all, you cant declare an item at a value much lower than market value and expect that Thai customs will let it pass,can you?

I'm not telling you that is what you've done, but I've found that when people are whining and moaning about charges it turns out they've shipped the stuff as "gifts", "repairs" or similar, and most commanly at a MUUUCH lower valuethan the REAL value, but in reality it's a spanking new item.

If you cant pay the tax for the stuff you buy, dont by 'em. If you're being subject to foul play, tell your Credit Card issuer and you'll get all your money back again. Unless, of course, there's something dodgy going on.

But I'm confident all farangs in Thailand are genuinly honest, taxpaying citizens, so you dont have to worry about that..

Edited by Forethat
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Because the Thai customs process is so arbitrary and capricious in the way duties are charged -- and thus it's virtually impossible to know ahead of time how much the duty/VAT/handling, etc. on any particular item is likely to be -- I think it very unlikely that people would have any ability to challenge a rejected purchase via their credit card company.

Did you order the item? Yes. Was the item shipped? Yes. Did you receive it? No, I didn't want to pay the customs duty and tax that was assessed.... Good luck with that...

If you could know ahead of time, with some certainty, how much those kinds of charges likely would be on a particular purchase, that would be one thing. But unless you've ordered those exact items before, and thus have already been assessed before, I think knowing is mostly impossible. And even if you have ordered the same things before, that certainly doesn't mean the duty assessed the next time will be the same as the first time.

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Forethat is obviously a Thai loving falang hating expat ( a typical syndrome) and no matter what we say somehow we are at fault and scamming the poor innocent Thais. Everyone knows the Thai customs are simply just an extortion mafia but he will never accept that. Nobody is stupid enough to complain if they were under declaring their item and the PROPER tax was asked for, in my case it was a $100 plastic TOY (price in the mall) and my tax was another $100. I was ROBBED.

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It may depend on what kinds of things you're actually shipping...and if you're accurately completing the customs declarations...

For example, clothing items have a particularly high Thai official duty on them. I remember ordering something via a U.S. web site (because I'm tall and can't get the items here) that was shipped here by DHL...

I posted the details in another TV thread at the time. But basically, the shipping cost and the duties each were almost the price of the clothing items themselves. And actually, the customs duty, VAT and handling charges in total ended up costing more together than the total value of the 4 or 5 clothing items (shirts and pants) I had shipping. In other words, the total duty and tax (apart from the actual DHL shipping fee) was more than 100% of the value of the my goods.

Why don't you give some specifics of the kinds of things you've been shipping, and how the duties/customs/VAT charges have compared to the value of your items shipped.

I pay according to what is stipulated in Thai law. What else do you need to know?

http://www.thaivisa....land_vat.0.html

I have already told you what I have imported. Golf clubs, electronic equipment. I have also imported jewelry and clothes.

I really don't see the problem here, are you guys doing something dodgy and get pissed off when you can't get away with it! (Like having the sender incorrectly label the item as a gift or something that's broken?)?

Im sorry i have to agree with some other posters that you almost seem to acting for the couriers/customs !, ,heres another example, i was sent 2 items declared at $50 from china ,,( EMS) we were advised the import charges were 5200 baht, my wife called to say there was a mistake, on the phone they told her come to lam chabang customs office and "make an offer " ,so of we go, i immediatly asked them to open the box, inside the goods were as stated, i said all ill pay is the correct tarrif or we will walk, after 15 minutes of haggling and him punching a calculator we paid 152 ( one hundred and fifty two ) baht and were on our way ,p1ss takers at best, thives at worst is my thoughts,.

First of all, you cant declare an item at a value much lower than market value and expect that Thai customs will let it pass,can you?

I'm not telling you that is what you've done, but I've found that when people are whining and moaning about charges it turns out they've shipped the stuff as "gifts", "repairs" or similar, and most commanly at a MUUUCH lower valuethan the REAL value, but in reality it's a spanking new item.

If you cant pay the tax for the stuff you buy, dont by 'em. If you're being subject to foul play, tell your Credit Card issuer and you'll get all your money back again. Unless, of course, there's something dodgy going on.

But I'm confident all farangs in Thailand are genuinly honest, taxpaying citizens, so you dont have to worry about that..

irrelevant dribble, dosent appy to me or this subject, goods were declared at purchased price and a receipt for the payment sent to thai customs
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So first of all, for all of you who blaims Thai customs for this: your item is first cleared by the shipping company; that'd be DHL, FedEx or whatever, they will then charge you that amount PLUS their handling fee. If you think there is something wrong you can just file a complaint with that company. MAke sure you make the intial payment using your VISA or Amex and you're in a perfect position to walk away with no damage.

How does the Thai customs become a foul player in this..?

I can answer that, ive just been sent notice that a helmet i bought in the US FOR $34 has arrived with FEDEX, their charges 1500 baht, customs 2000 baht, ,total 3500 for a $34 item, i have told them to get stuffed and keep it,

You're missing my point here: WHO is charging you excessive amounts? Thai customs or Fedex?

And how much was the shipping fee...?

Total charge cif is $56 ,1500 baht for fedex, 2000 for customs, so to answer your question, both !.or do you disagree ?
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Forethat is obviously a Thai loving falang hating expat ( a typical syndrome) and no matter what we say somehow we are at fault and scamming the poor innocent Thais. Everyone knows the Thai customs are simply just an extortion mafia but he will never accept that. Nobody is stupid enough to complain if they were under declaring their item and the PROPER tax was asked for, in my case it was a $100 plastic TOY (price in the mall) and my tax was another $100. I was ROBBED.

In todays paper ( thai ) the thai customs are congratuling themselves on the amount of taxes they collected last month, i had to laugh, how much over and above the declared amount did they pocket i wonder ?.......what i find not funny is why the spineless thais and others let them get away with that, and i hate to say it but my wife wont take up a challenge either ,all this loss of face <deleted>, and for all you thai defenders saying " well if you dont like it go home " well we are in 3 weeks thankyou.
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So first of all, for all of you who blaims Thai customs for this: your item is first cleared by the shipping company; that'd be DHL, FedEx or whatever, they will then charge you that amount PLUS their handling fee. If you think there is something wrong you can just file a complaint with that company. MAke sure you make the intial payment using your VISA or Amex and you're in a perfect position to walk away with no damage.

How does the Thai customs become a foul player in this..?

I can answer that, ive just been sent notice that a helmet i bought in the US FOR $34 has arrived with FEDEX, their charges 1500 baht, customs 2000 baht, ,total 3500 for a $34 item, i have told them to get stuffed and keep it,

You're missing my point here: WHO is charging you excessive amounts? Thai customs or Fedex?

And how much was the shipping fee...?

Total charge cif is $56 ,1500 baht for fedex, 2000 for customs, so to answer your question, both !.or do you disagree ?

Just to clarify this:

How much did you pay for the goods (excluding shipping)? Is this what you paid $56 for?

What was the declared value of the item?

How much did you pay for the shipping? Is this included in the $56?

Am I right understanding FedEx charged you 1500 in handling fee?

Customs charged you 2000?

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irrelevant dribble, dosent appy to me or this subject, goods were declared at purchased price and a receipt for the payment sent to thai customs

Utterly deceptive twaddlespeak says I.

Items are subject to tax based on value, not on purchase price.

This explains it all, really.

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Forethat is obviously a Thai loving falang hating expat ( a typical syndrome) and no matter what we say somehow we are at fault and scamming the poor innocent Thais. Everyone knows the Thai customs are simply just an extortion mafia but he will never accept that. Nobody is stupid enough to complain if they were under declaring their item and the PROPER tax was asked for, in my case it was a $100 plastic TOY (price in the mall) and my tax was another $100. I was ROBBED.

For obvious reasons, your difficulties in life are as inevitable as apparent.

Edited by Forethat
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Well, Khun Abhisit is supposed to be clamping down on corruption so maybe the customs department should be second on his list, once he's sorted out the police!

Don't hold your breath.

DM

LOL he had better look into the mirror to see real corruption at it best.

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irrelevant dribble, dosent appy to me or this subject, goods were declared at purchased price and a receipt for the payment sent to thai customs

Utterly deceptive twaddlespeak says I.

Items are subject to tax based on value, not on purchase price.

This explains it all, really.

How long have you worked for customs and excise ?. :bah:
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irrelevant dribble, dosent appy to me or this subject, goods were declared at purchased price and a receipt for the payment sent to thai customs

Utterly deceptive twaddlespeak says I.

Items are subject to tax based on value, not on purchase price.

This explains it all, really.

Now you are getting somewhere, yes based on THEIR ( thai customs) assessed value, which usually is utter <deleted>
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