Thai Nuclear Power Plant Feasibility Study Ready By Year-End

[webfact]

Nuclear power plant feasibility study to be finished by year-end

BANGKOK (NNT) -- The Electricity Generating Authority of Thailand (EGAT) affirms that within this year-end the feasibility study on nuclear power plant will be completed to be proposed to the Cabinet for approval next year.

EGAT Deputy Governor Somboon Arayasakul stated that the feasibility study of five power plants with a total capacity of 5,000 megawatts currently was on the process of location research and reaching understanding with local people. He said in some area the people were still opposed to the nuclear power plant construction. By the end of this year, the conclusion will be made on three locations for such a construction.

According to the plan, the first plant will be formed in January 2020 with the production capacity of 1,000 megawatts. Those studied projects will be proposed to the Cabinet for further approval made next year whether to continue power plant construction.

EGAT, meanwhile, is confident with security standard of nuclear power plant to meet international quality, while nuclear waste from production process will be kept inside the plants until those plants become expired with 40 years lifetime. Moreover, EGAT has also cooperated with Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation.

-- NNT 2010-07-21

[souvenirdeparis]

if they keep the waste inside it's going to be a real hot house pretty soon .

are they really going to store every suit , glove, that is used by the technicians ?

any plant routinely has "minor" leak, that needs repairing, joints changed and disposed of . That's what a re-treatment plant like La Hague is for .The Germans use it too, why don't they just store waste in some basement instead of the costly re-processing, I wonder .

Edited July 21, 2010 by souvenirdeparis

[surayu]

" Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation. "

Edit:

Quick note: if they come up with similar result of that Ramkhameng Uni in doing buffalo's mozzarella cheese is better we start escaping now !

Edited July 21, 2010 by surayu

[jayjay0]

" Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation. "

Edit:

Quick note: if they come up with similar result of that Ramkhameng Uni in doing buffalo's mozzarella cheese is better we start escaping now !

Ya that put me off too. Not sure if nuclear is the answer but they can not keep building damns. Lots of other options

[mazeltov]

" Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation. "

Edit:

Quick note: if they come up with similar result of that Ramkhameng Uni in doing buffalo's mozzarella cheese is better we start escaping now !

That is nothing unusual and common practice for fruits, vegetables and meat in a the big scale. makes your global traded apples and bell papers and pork loin always look fresh on the supermarket shelves.

Has actually nothing to do with Nuclear power plants.

Edit:

Side note: And for the "buffalo's mozzarella cheese"... Using milk of water buffalos -that is the original and traditional way to make mozzarella. the real mozzarella, a product quite different from many other version of cow milk products that supermarkets sell as mozzarella cheese.

Edited July 21, 2010 by mazeltov

[dom samui]

Nuclear somtam is good for you !

[pepi2005]

Why do I already 'know' what the result of this study will be?

If they do it, it's time to leave Thailand ASAP. They can't even keep roads in shape, corruption is unchanged and has proven to create health hazards for the people, work ethics and responsibility is even worse than in a 3rd world country (see the behavior of the brown boys and parts of the military during the riots of the last years). A horror idea. :ph34r: :ph34r:

For Thailand, I hope they get on track with their 'reconciliation process' before the power plant will go online.

"Two killed in rebel attack on Russian power station"

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LDE66K01C.htm

Edited July 22, 2010 by pepi2005

[hhiser]

" Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation. "      

Edit:

Quick note:  if they come up with similar result of that Ramkhameng Uni in doing buffalo's mozzarella cheese is better we start escaping now !

Ya that put me off too. Not sure if nuclear is the answer but they can not keep building damns. Lots of other options

What about Solar? Seems like a perfect fit for a place as sunny as Thailand!

[Humphrey Bear]

" Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation. "      

Edit:

Quick note:  if they come up with similar result of that Ramkhameng Uni in doing buffalo's mozzarella cheese is better we start escaping now !

Ya that put me off too. Not sure if nuclear is the answer but they can not keep building damns. Lots of other options

What about Solar? Seems like a perfect fit for a place as sunny as Thailand!

PV power generation is costly and currently there is a severe shortage of PV cells. Production cannot keep up with demand, so prices are rising.

Nothing to beat hydro for long-term generation. And Thailand has lots of rivers, so why not keep building dams?

[Piengrudee]

If North Korea can have nuclear energy, why not Thailand? I don't think Thailand is less advance than North Korea.

[hoaker]

This ain't gonna happen in thailand. Not enough technology here and too expensive for hiring foreign company. The budget for the project will have to allocated for corruption

[noudb]

I wonder if the possible sites mentioned in 2007 are still the same

"The sites for the plants have yet to be confirmed, but Ranong, Chumphon and Surat Thani provinces o­n the southern coast have been cited as possible locations."

source: http://www.irrawaddy...php?art_id=7889

[123ace]

If North Korea can have nuclear energy, why not Thailand? I don't think Thailand is less advance than North Korea.

Is this a joke?

[anotheruser]

1,000 MW is not enough to make a difference.

[souvenirdeparis]

If North Korea can have nuclear energy, why not Thailand? I don't think Thailand is less advance than North Korea.

Idon't think NK has nuclear power PLANTS ; they have nuclear power BOMBS, which is not the same technology.

[zthyadat]

If North Korea can have nuclear energy, why not Thailand? I don't think Thailand is less advance than North Korea.

Who said it was a good idea for NK to have nuclear power or bombs?

Surely you can't be a real person - your comments just smack of troll... But just in case you are real...

All rules and regulations are for sale in Thailand if the price is right. For example: Missing rivets on the wings of your commercial aircraft? Your building is twice as tall as regulations allow? Fire regulations won't let you lock the fire escape doors of your factory (to prevent workers from sneaking extra breaks)? A bribe to the inspector will make all those problems go away...

I have come to realise that many people here actually believe that the problem genuinely goes away if the right person is bribed, as if cash or compliance are the two options within the natural laws of the universe... And by some miracle the plane won't crash, the ten story building that is supposed to be five stories won't collapse, and the factory employees won't burn to death in a fire.

And you really think Thailand can handle a nuclear power plant? The country has shown itself incapable of properly handling tall buildings, international airports, automobiles, etc. etc. and you reckon nuclear power is a good idea?

[HerbalEd]

As someone who worked on nuclear reactors as a radiological safety technician for two years, I say nuclear reactors for generating electricity is a very bad idea .... here in Thailand or anywhere else. In USA I have seen many problems and minor accidents that never get in the news. Nuclear energy is neither safe nor clean .... and if you look at the long-range, big picture it is very, very expensive.

[brahmburgers]

If North Korea can have nuclear energy, why not Thailand? I don't think Thailand is less advance than North Korea.

It's not a question of 'advancement,' my dear. The issue is the technology of nuclear, it's costs / risks vs perceived benefits. A crucial factor in the whole debate is EGAT is not being honest when it comments about nuclear power plants. Instead, EGAT is like a car salesman trying to sell a modest family a 24 cylinder U-fuel injected speedster that will need 'round the clock' security - not just for the speedster itself, but also for its 60,000 year residual radioactivity (after its decommissioned).

This ain't gonna happen in thailand. Not enough technology here and too expensive for hiring foreign company. The budget for the project will have to allocated for corruption

EGAT tries to hoodwink the public by saying 'nuclear power plants have zero greenhouse gasses.' Wrong again. It will take fossil fuels to build it, to ship the U from overseas, to decommission it, and to dispose of radioactive waste it generates. BTW, not one country on the planet has a decent method for disposing of radioactive garbage (not Russia, nor the US nor Japan nor any European country), Yet technological backwater Thailand thinks it can buck the trend.

As someone who worked on nuclear reactors as a radiological safety technician for two years, I say nuclear reactors for generating electricity is a very bad idea .... here in Thailand or anywhere else. In USA I have seen many problems and minor accidents that never get in the news. Nuclear energy is neither safe nor clean .... and if you look at the long-range, big picture it is very, very expensive.

Thanks Ed for adding a voice of experience to the debate. My only experience (with N Plants) is being involved in closing down Rancho Seco N Power Plant in Sacramento California. It was a functioning plant, but millions of nearby residents decided they didn't want it.

Can you imaging how things would unfold if nearby Thai residents voted in a majority to shut down an already-built plant in Thailand? Those residents would be shot or shouted down faster than you can say 'faux democracy.'

[TPI]

I don't understand what all the comotion is about? Just think for a minute how long they have argued about 3G!<BR><BR>On top of that, now that there is a "Long An" shortage because of the drought where are the 90,000 tonnes of the dried product that was stored in Issan? There never has been any result of any committee to look into the theft?<BR><BR>If they can't control some dried fruit what chance a nuclear power plant? I'll bet Takki will barrel back for a piece of that action?

[CrossBones]

The plan is the plant will be run by Thai national nuclear scientists. Foreign know how is not required to build the power station since employing foreigners could be a blow to national pride. They will use Burmese workers in wetsuits to scrub the reactors. Run for the hills boys!

[Piengrudee]

Thailand have have the French to build and run the Nuclear facilities. I think France have the most nuclear power experience than any other counties. From memory, 70% of French electric comes from nuclear. This should be acceptable to ThaiVisa members, I suppose.

[Garry9999]

Does anyone know how a Thai nuclear power plant would be funded. Foreign investment or internal? I image they don't come cheap.

[souvenirdeparis]

The plan is the plant will be run by Thai national nuclear scientists. Foreign know how is not required to build the power station since employing foreigners could be a blow to national pride. They will use Burmese workers in wetsuits to scrub the reactors. Run for the hills boys!

BTW, Burma wants an A bomb, as a political trump card like N Korea . Wonder what country they could reach with a bungfai -style rocket?

[souvenirdeparis]

for these of you who have never visited a N plant, they are giant concrete constructions , with giant dynamoes ; I went to Flamanville when it was under completion ; plants need a lot of space all around . Plants must have lots of water at all times.

Our "ultimate waste" ie after re-processing and kept in thick glass canisters called "castors" (like for salt and pepper)will eventually be buried very deep in geologically stable locations , to the great benefit of people living over ground .

I keep wondering at the notion of waiting 40 years to start re processing the waste all in one time . Dismantling a plant from what I read is 100 times more of a headache than asbestos buildings.

5 plants to build must cost an arm and a leg.

Pienbrudee says it'd be French made, so finally someone is brave enough to try our latest models, which are deemed not too safe and nobody wants this design of so called super generators if it's that (produce more uranium than it burns or something like that).

Edited July 22, 2010 by souvenirdeparis

[thaifrelst]

It is already decided that China will build and operate the 7 nuclear plants. The locations are also set. They will use an old and risky technology. But good enough for the investors.

[witsawakorn]

" Kasetsart University to conduct a research in using nuclear radiation for agricultural activities such as food preservation. "

Edit:

Quick note: if they come up with similar result of that Ramkhameng Uni in doing buffalo's mozzarella cheese is better we start escaping now !

Ya that put me off too. Not sure if nuclear is the answer but they can not keep building damns. Lots of other options

What about Solar? Seems like a perfect fit for a place as sunny as Thailand!

You are right. The largest PV solar power plant in asia if not the world is going to start construction in Thailand this year. EGAT has one of the most aggresive incentive programs in the world( meaning they pay a premium for solar and other renewable power)Windfarm construction is going to start very soon too. The problem is that you need a lot of windmills and solar panels to produce 1000MW plus you only get solar during daylight hours( surprise!) and wind farm availability is something like 15% so the answer has to be a balance of technologies which no country has got right yet.

[witsawakorn]

1,000 MW is not enough to make a difference.

The last PDP (Power Development Plan) that I saw shows 2 x1000MW nukes which is about 8% of the current installed capacity.

[brahmburgers]

It is already decided that China will build and operate the 7 nuclear plants. The locations are also set. They will use an old and risky technology. But good enough for the investors.

...and your source for that info?

Incidentally, though Thailand has a lot of coastline, none of it is more than 160 Km from bordering countries - and much of the coastline is quite close to Burma, Cambodia and Malaysia. Any Thai N plant will be on the coast (one exception: at a large lake in central Thailand - v. low probability) because N plants need lots of cooling water. So any major breach of radioactivity will affect not only local Thai communities, but will likely affect one or more neighboring countries. The potential scenarios are sobering (at least) or catastrophic at worst.

Even the most tech advanced Asian country, Japan, had a breach at its largest and most modern N reactor. How can tech-challenged Thais claim to be able to do it safer than Japan? And who will guarantee insurance policies - the Thai government? - Egat? ....and who will safeguard the plants - the Thai military? .....Thai Police? ...the same military and police who couldn't do a thing while downtown Bangkok was barricaded for two months?

The #1 thing Thais need to do for their energy future is learn how to conserve energy Learn how to use only what's needed. Turn off lights and air.con not needed. Accept comfortably warm temps indoors instead of insisting on near-arctic coolness. Put one pump on water systems instead of two (97% of house/apt/biz water systems have at least 2 pumps, when only one is needed) ...etc. etc.

The next thing Thais have to understand is nuclear is not the cheapest, not the safest, and certainly not cleanest option for Thailand's future electric needs. Learn about concentrated solar. Also, many places in Thailand have thermal hot springs underground - a viable resource for pre-heating water. After all, that's basically what electricity plants do: heat water to turn turbines, to produce electricity. The exception is photovoltaic (PV) - though concentrated solar also heats water - using the solar system's biggest nuclear power source. The sun is 93 million miles away, so no chance it will be taken over by Red Shirt rowdies aimed at causing mayhem.

Edited July 23, 2010 by brahmburgers

[brahmburgers]

The largest PV solar power plant in asia if not the world is going to start construction in Thailand this year. EGAT has one of the most aggresive incentive programs in the world( meaning they pay a premium for solar and other renewable power)Windfarm construction is going to start very soon too. The problem is that you need a lot of windmills and solar panels to produce 1000MW plus you only get solar during daylight hours( surprise!) and wind farm availability is something like 15% so the answer has to be a balance of technologies which no country has got right yet.

Large scale PV (photovoltaic) is one way to go with solar, but is not the only and probably not the smartest way to use the sun to make electricity. A better way to do large scale solar is by using large arrays of mirrors to heat water. There are several viable options for doing that - some of them currently on-line overseas. Thailand is well suited for that.

There are also several viable options for storing solar energy for times when the sun isn't shining. One is to pump water in to a reservoir during peak production hours, and then use that stored water to produce power at other times. Incidentally, I have two PV functioning in northern Thailand, and they both work when it's semi-cloudy (thin clouds, not thick clouds). So, with current technology, there doesn't need to be clear skies for PV panels to produce electric.

Not sure if there's enough steady wind for wind farms in Thailand. However, wind harnessing technology is developing at a fast pace, so stay tuned for encouraging news on that.

[RickBradford]

However, wind harnessing technology is developing at a fast pace, so stay tuned for encouraging news on that.

Well, the windmill industry could sure use some encouraging news, because the current situation isn't good:

* Wind power (now about 0.5 percent of US electricity compared with 50 percent for coal) has very little growth capacity, is unreliable, remote from areas of high demand, and depends upon a "spinning reserve" of natural gas when winds are too weak or strong (most of the time). (Larry Bell, University of Houston.)

* In the third week of May, the total wind power industry across southeastern Australia delivered zero power…so you don't only need installed back-up fuel power almost equivalent to the wind industry, to pick up the slack when it comes, but you need to keep the fuel power running, rendering utterly pointless having the wind power anyway.

* In autumn/winter 2006/7 there were 17 days when output from Britain's wind turbines was less than 10 per cent of their total capacity. On five of those days, output was below 5 per cent and on one day it was only 2 per cent. And those were the windier seasons, in the windiest country in Europe.

* Energy firms will receive thousands of pounds a day per wind farm to turn off their turbines because the UK National Grid cannot use the power they are producing, because it is so intermittent and unreliable.

* In fiscal year 2007-08 U.K. electricity customers were forced to pay a total of over $1 billion in subsidies to the owners of wind turbines. That figure is due to rise to over $6 billion a year by 2020. British consumers are paying twice over for their electricity, funding its means of production and paying for its use as end users, with gas and electricity prices rising by 29.7 percent.

* Spain's concerted government-funded drive towards wind (and solar) power has been an utter catastrophe. Electricity costs have risen by 60 per cent while the 50,000 "green jobs" it created cost 571,000 Euros per job via government subsidy, effectively losing 2.2 jobs in the real economy for every one created in the green one.

* The ludicrous subsidies required to make the windmills 'pay' for themselves is unsurprisingly attracting some unsavoury characters - Italian and EU subsidies for the building of wind farms and the world's highest guaranteed rates, €180 ($240, £160) per kwh, for the electricity they produce have turned southern Italy into a highly attractive market exploited by organised crime, according to Sicilian police

* Michael Jefferson, professor of international business and sustainability at London Metropolitan Business School, says that only the huge subsidies encourages the construction of wind farms."The subsidies make it viable for developers to put turbines on sites they would not touch if the money was not available."

* Many windmill gearboxes, designed for a 20-year life, are failing after six to eight years of operation, causing wind turbine operation and maintenance (O&M) costs to increase sharply, rising to two or three times more than first projected

The UK government agency Ofgem says that many of the problems arise when renewable targets are set from on high, such as from the European Union: "It wants 20 percent of energy across Europe to be generated from renewable sources by 2020," a situation which is described as "folly of the highest order", if the only way it can be done is inefficiently and expensively and at the cost of damaging our environment. Far better, says the paper, "to push on with technologies we know can deliver, such as nuclear and clean coal."

As the UK journalist James Delingpole put it: "If there's an industry in the world that deserves to be stigmatised more than any other, it's the despicable, reprehensible, money-grubbing, mendacious, taxpayer-fleecing, bird-mangling, landscape-ruining, economy-blighting wind farm business.."

Thailand has enough problems -- it sure doesn't need to add wind power to the list