Two Thai Teenagers Held Over 9y-Old Schoolboy Shooting

[webfact]

Two teenagers held over Thai schoolboy shooting: police

BANGKOK (AFP) -- Two Thai teenagers aged 16 and 19 were arrested on suspicion of murder Thursday over the shooting of a nine-year-old boy on his way to school in Bangkok, police said.

The younger suspect, whose name has been withheld to protect his identity, appeared at a police press conference with his face hidden by a balaclava and confessed to firing the shots that killed Jatupon Ponpaka on Wednesday.

"I did not intended to hurt him. I apologise to his family," he told reporters.

The male teenagers were both vocational students in the Thai capital, said Deputy Commander Colonel Somboon Phuthapong of Bangkok's police force.

He said both the 16-year-old and the 19-year-old, who was named as Pariwat Lohphuwee, were charged with murder.

Jatupon was killed when a student gang fired at his bus in an apparent attack on pupils from a rival school, who were also passengers in the vehicle.

About 10 teenagers launched the attack at a stop in eastern Bangkok and Jatupon, who was about to get off with his elder brother, was shot in the face and neck as the bus sped away.

Ungsu Khamwong, Jatupon's mother, has called for an end to street fights between school gangs, which are a common menace in Thailand and often result in innocent people getting caught up in the violence.

Education Minister Chinaworn Boonyakiat called a meeting of 18 vocational schools in Bangkok to address the attacks, which have escalated in recent days, threatening them with eventual closure if the brawls persist.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2010-09-02

[Thai at Heart]

What about the other 8?

I can't help feeling that having watched hundreds of thousands of adults in colourer shirts getting away with civil disobedience, shootings, arson and various other offences with no consequence may have bent most people's concept of right and wrong.

[TAWP]

Every time you fire a gun you are solely responsible for what happens due to this.

Could the parents be lined up at the arrest too?

[Tokay]

Tragic.

They all learn from their surroundings and the media (movies, news...).

[poldebol]

Tragic.

They all learn from their surroundings and the media (movies, news...).

Rightm but some kill and others don't

[cup-O-coffee]

The remarkable thing about kids is that they are human beings too, who happen to be more dramatic in expressing their emotions. They haven't grown up enough to know to conceal their true feelings and resort to cunning and trickery. So, reading about these kids behavior is a good indicator of the social undercurrent going on, but that the kids have not learned to conceal yet.

Thailand's problem solving process goes like this; fight or flight.

When they fight, it is no holds barred and no quarter asked for or given.

When they make flight, there is no possibility to get them to return to the issue or location to talk rationally. They have no rationale. This is how they get programmed through their childhood. No human is born with Intel Pentium inside, and a host of software to know how to cope with life. It has to get programmed in as the human grows up. Clearly, the evidence surrounding us is a strong indicator of what type of programming is going on. Animal from the start, and human being by programming that brings out our better nature; otherwise, our animal nature will rule.

These days in Western countries, if a father administers tough love and corrects his children with a swat to the bum, he goes to jail, gets a restraining order, goes through mandatory anger management class, etc. The old days are gone, and the new Western world will see the affects of children who do not respect each other due to the inability to understand and respect each individual's boundaries.

The West is a good example of how wrong it is for governments to involve themselves in matters far better left to responsible, caring, and loving parents. Mommy is the nurturer, and Daddy is "The Line". Don't step over the line. But the West has systematically removed Daddy from the home, which is now run by the remainder of the family unit. I hope Thailand's government does not intervene as the West has. I hope they begin putting the yoke of responsibility back onto the Father and Mother.

But one problem here with the Thai fathers is one that bring s a saying to mind: "I am my father's son". The governments of the West had to make laws to get the father out of the home. The irony here is that Thailand needs to make laws to get the fathers back into the the home. There never was any need to get the fathers out of the home because the culture here does not seem to cultivate a patriarchal responsibility in a society that is known to be matriarchal. Hence the mom making a statement, and leaving me asking, "where the heck is dad?".

On a side note, I find it interesting that of all the children in orphanages in Thailand, over 60% have parents who have not yet signed a waiver of release for their kids to be in an orphanage. Hence they cannot get adopted. Is this another facet of an issue where Thai parents simply do not want to be involved with their children after they get past that cute and cuddly age? If the beast is not programmed to be a human of better nature, then it will grow into an adult beast, with all the facade of simulating a normal adult. But when you look at the track record, the diagnosis is clear.

What makes a person stop-check their self before stepping across the line? Clearly, Thailand has not found an answer to that, nor a deterrent to those who do. I think the reason for this is that tugging at any one strand of this social structure will cause the entire web to tremble.

To the people who abhor any form of physical correction towards children, then I wonder if they are also against having a strong military presence to protect their right to abhor violence. After all, isn't a military supposed to be prepared to punch the enemy in the snout and make them think twice about stepping across the line?

Idealists seem to hide behind the ankles of the realists when the doo-doo hits the fan. But when everything is peaceful and serene, they come out from under their rocks and condemn violence in all forms, regardless of the necessity in life to administer it at certain times, and to certain individuals, as a deterrent to far worse behavior - to get that beast back on the track to becoming a human of better nature.

Let's corral the idealists together and put them in the same neighborhood where these unruly animals live. I wonder if they will start a neighborhood charity and spend time with these not fully matured, feral humans, and mentor them onto the path of becoming human beings of a better nature. I am quite certain it will not be long before they cry for someone other than themselves to "get tough" on these kids.

You will never find an idealist in a fox-hole, and negotiating with children is the height of folly!

[ThaiRich]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

[jbrewer]

Tragic.

They all learn from their surroundings and the media (movies, news...).

Rightm but some kill and others don't

exactly

[Scott]

My very deepest sympathies to the family, friends and classmates of the victim.

This happened in the neighborhood where I live and work and is quite upsetting. A few months back, two colleagues were on a bus on that route (maybe the same number--I don't recall) and were held on the floor at gun point along with other passengers. The young men who had them get on the floor, did so for their own protection. It seems they had fled a fight with another school (or gang) and some of the students from the other school were approaching with guns out, so they told everyone to get down on the floor. When the bus stopped, the students fled. No shots fired on the bus or at the bus, but still a little too close to home.

[prakhonchai nick]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

BRING BACK THE DEATH PENALTY!!!

Edited September 2, 2010 by prakhonchai nick

[Thai at Heart]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

BRING BACK THE DEATH PENALTY!!!

In Thailand did it ever go away?

If as reported among other threads this type of thing (with guns specifically) has been going on for a while one can only wonder why there appears to have been absolutely no media coverage, or police intervention to handle this thing. It is the ability of everyone to apparently thumb their nose at the law with impunity for extended periods that allow these thing to escalate until there is a crisis or tragedy.

The lack of sanction at the very beginning of these problems when they are small leads to more and more daring on the part of irresponsible people.

[Gonzo the Face]

cup-O-coffee, post #6

Good post, thanks for that.

G

Edited September 2, 2010 by Gonzo the Face

[Netfan]

"I did not intended to hurt him. I apologise to his family," he told reporters.

Well, that makes it all okay then. Condolences to the family of the slain boy. It did not have to happen. There is plenty of blame to go around here, but it starts with these two punks. Life without parole. Done. Next time we hear anything about them is in 2060 when its reported they've died in prison. Next in responsibility are the heads of the schools. For years their line has been "boys will be boys" and they have refused to come down on the rivalries between these schools, they have even promoted the rivalries. Give the headmaster of this school the word - shut down the school if he does not resign. The education minister should be called in front of the governor or PM and have a plan within 48 hours to clean up the rest of the schools or he's gone. Word goes out to all schools, next sign of trouble, they all shut down, for good.

Edited September 2, 2010 by Netfan

[Thules]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

Well said, Rich !

This tragedy occured through some unfortunate kid being shot in the face and neck. The report didn't make it clear whether this was by one bullet or multiples. Either way, even for a 16 year old, you've probably got to be a living Saint to believe the statement "I didn't intend to hurt him"

My condolences to the victim's family and friends for this tragic and completely senseless loss of a loved one. RIP young fella

[sangfroid]

"I did not intended to hurt him. I apologise to his family," he told reporters.

Well, that makes it all okay then. Condolences to the family of the slain boy. It did not have to happen. There is plenty of blame to go around here, but it starts with these two punks. Life without parole. Done. Next time we hear anything about them is in 2060 when its reported they've died in prison. Next in responsibility are the heads of the schools. For years their line has been "boys will be boys" and they have refused to come down on the rivalries between these schools, they have even promoted the rivalries. Give the headmaster of this school the word - shut down the school if he does not resign. The education minister should be called in front of the governor or PM and have a plan within 48 hours to clean up the rest of the schools or he's gone. Word goes out to all schools, next sign of trouble, they all shut down, for good.

[The education minister should be called in front of the governor or PM and have a plan within 48 hours to clean up the rest of the schools or he's gone.]

Are you serious? Do you know how much that job cost him??

[souvenirdeparis]

the govt talks of closing schools, so he won't do it ; just more hot air. first you close, then you announce it's done ; in a month's time another unit is opened ,with 80% of the pupils,the bad lot may go work rice paddy.

-killer went toschool with gun

-all schools must be searched now.

-killer got money for gun & ammunitions from? from dope-dealing or blind mom's credit card?

-killer practised shooting before

-killer can't say he didn't want tokill, or he's a retard. He aimed .

-In times of civil war, kids will always play war between themselves, but usually with plastic guns; and this applies moreto younger kids.( children were killed in Ulster because playing with plastic guns near patrols) . There are child -soldiers. But kids killings kidsfor play because of civil war, this isn't a pattern.

[souvenirdeparis]

@Netfan

next sign of trouble, they all shut down, for good.

§§

can shut some of them some of the time, but not all of them all the time, or you have to import technicians from wherever ; they don't learn needlework in these schools; they probably learn good , decently-paid trades there, and feel cock proud about it ;they'll earn more than their teachers .So, temporaryclosure to let them cool down , then re open with 2 or three bad citizens refused re admission in every class, with mandatory army enlistment ( assigned to Deep South) .

Wonder if there are any religion -related conflict in those school feuds? just asking.

[Willeyeam]

The remarkable thing about kids is that they are human beings too, who happen to be more dramatic in expressing their emotions. They haven't grown up enough to know to conceal their true feelings and resort to cunning and trickery. So, reading about these kids behavior is a good indicator of the social undercurrent going on, but that the kids have not learned to conceal yet.

Thailand's problem solving process goes like this; fight or flight.

When they fight, it is no holds barred and no quarter asked for or given.

When they make flight, there is no possibility to get them to return to the issue or location to talk rationally. They have no rationale. This is how they get programmed through their childhood. No human is born with Intel Pentium inside, and a host of software to know how to cope with life. It has to get programmed in as the human grows up. Clearly, the evidence surrounding us is a strong indicator of what type of programming is going on. Animal from the start, and human being by programming that brings out our better nature; otherwise, our animal nature will rule.

These days in Western countries, if a father administers tough love and corrects his children with a swat to the bum, he goes to jail, gets a restraining order, goes through mandatory anger management class, etc. The old days are gone, and the new Western world will see the affects of children who do not respect each other due to the inability to understand and respect each individual's boundaries.

The West is a good example of how wrong it is for governments to involve themselves in matters far better left to responsible, caring, and loving parents. Mommy is the nurturer, and Daddy is "The Line". Don't step over the line. But the West has systematically removed Daddy from the home, which is now run by the remainder of the family unit. I hope Thailand's government does not intervene as the West has. I hope they begin putting the yoke of responsibility back onto the Father and Mother.

But one problem here with the Thai fathers is one that bring s a saying to mind: "I am my father's son". The governments of the West had to make laws to get the father out of the home. The irony here is that Thailand needs to make laws to get the fathers back into the the home. There never was any need to get the fathers out of the home because the culture here does not seem to cultivate a patriarchal responsibility in a society that is known to be matriarchal. Hence the mom making a statement, and leaving me asking, "where the heck is dad?".

On a side note, I find it interesting that of all the children in orphanages in Thailand, over 60% have parents who have not yet signed a waiver of release for their kids to be in an orphanage. Hence they cannot get adopted. Is this another facet of an issue where Thai parents simply do not want to be involved with their children after they get past that cute and cuddly age? If the beast is not programmed to be a human of better nature, then it will grow into an adult beast, with all the facade of simulating a normal adult. But when you look at the track record, the diagnosis is clear.

What makes a person stop-check their self before stepping across the line? Clearly, Thailand has not found an answer to that, nor a deterrent to those who do. I think the reason for this is that tugging at any one strand of this social structure will cause the entire web to tremble.

To the people who abhor any form of physical correction towards children, then I wonder if they are also against having a strong military presence to protect their right to abhor violence. After all, isn't a military supposed to be prepared to punch the enemy in the snout and make them think twice about stepping across the line?

Idealists seem to hide behind the ankles of the realists when the doo-doo hits the fan. But when everything is peaceful and serene, they come out from under their rocks and condemn violence in all forms, regardless of the necessity in life to administer it at certain times, and to certain individuals, as a deterrent to far worse behavior - to get that beast back on the track to becoming a human of better nature.

Let's corral the idealists together and put them in the same neighborhood where these unruly animals live. I wonder if they will start a neighborhood charity and spend time with these not fully matured, feral humans, and mentor them onto the path of becoming human beings of a better nature. I am quite certain it will not be long before they cry for someone other than themselves to "get tough" on these kids.

You will never find an idealist in a fox-hole, and negotiating with children is the height of folly!

There is a great deal of truth in what you say, a great deal! and very well put.

[dominique355]

Someone well acquainted with the situation told me that these kids are sometimes encouraged by their teachers to go out and "set the record straight" or "revenge" a previous attack. Seems to be almost a "tradition" in many schools.

And another thought: This kind of assault must be considered as premeditated murder. Nobody can claim that these kids did not know what they were doing. They know bullets kill. Maybe they did not want to kiss this young boy, but they knew that this could happen and knowing this, they shot. That is sometimes called "dolus evenualis", which is treated the same as normal premeditation.

[Phuket_Brad]

There is a law in Thailand that the parents can be held responsible for their kids up to the age of 20 years old - maybe need to start enforcing that law! Don't know the details but sure need to think about it!

[Willeyeam]

"I did not intended to hurt him. I apologise to his family," he told reporters.

Well, that makes it all okay then. Condolences to the family of the slain boy. It did not have to happen. There is plenty of blame to go around here, but it starts with these two punks. Life without parole. Done. Next time we hear anything about them is in 2060 when its reported they've died in prison. Next in responsibility are the heads of the schools. For years their line has been "boys will be boys" and they have refused to come down on the rivalries between these schools, they have even promoted the rivalries. Give the headmaster of this school the word - shut down the school if he does not resign. The education minister should be called in front of the governor or PM and have a plan within 48 hours to clean up the rest of the schools or he's gone. Word goes out to all schools, next sign of trouble, they all shut down, for good.

If the bloody schools, for want of a better word actually EDUCATED children, they might find that this sort of behaviour would begin to decline. Let's face it, these are not schools, they are places for kids to go during the week, the standard of education is a disgrace from the word go.

Even when the kids come home they are bombarded by purile screeching drivel from every channel on the TV, why not put some educational programs on there for a start....ahhhh, of course, if the kids got an education the Poo Dees would have no slaves!

[Willeyeam]

There is a law in Thailand that the parents can be held responsible for their kids up to the age of 20 years old - maybe need to start enforcing that law! Don't know the details but sure need to think about it!

What good is that? The dam_n parents are incapable of being responsible for themselves, have you ever watched them riding a motorbike or driving a car?? I would rather the family cat was responsible for the children than some of the parents.

[asiawatcher]

What about the other 8?

I can't help feeling that having watched hundreds of thousands of adults in colourer shirts getting away with civil disobedience, shootings, arson and various other offences with no consequence may have bent most people's concept of right and wrong.

Yes - they learn by example. AT how do teens get hold of guns which are of course, illegal? The Singapore system of the Rataan Cane is appropriate.

[gorshar]

Back in the 1990s I worked at a public institution (an RIT school) in Bangkok that had a vocational division.

Brawls on the soccer field were frequent. If you were lucky it was only sticks and knives, but guns were drawn from time to time and I witnessed gunfire on more than one occasion and did once see a kid get shot in the stomach. Fortunately the kid that was shot survived, but we also had several kids from the school that were not so lucky when gunfire was exchanged off-campus and yes, on a bus.

The shootings on campus never made the news media. There were no police cars. No ambulances. Nothing. It never happened. Injured kids were quietly taken to the hospital and nobody talked about it. During my tenure the school director was even voted RIT Director of the Year despite the soccer field hosting as many brawls as it did football games.

The brawls were always between departments in the school, i.e Automotive vs Welding. The school's response was to suspend every kid in the department for two weeks. Well, who did the shooting? Never mind, they are all equally guilty so everybody gets a two-week holiday to cool off.

I wondered, and still wonder if maybe the kids didn't spend every waking minute together but actually had the courses mixed up with other kids there might be less violence? Imagine if for non-department courses, i.e. English, history, etc the automotive kids were mixed with the welding kids, mixed with the masonry kids, mixed with the HVAC kids, etc and they actually got to know each other has someone other than the "enemy" they might get along better. I mentioned this once to a few of the Thai teachers around me whose response was along the lines that such a move would be a terrible complication of scheduling, entirely too much work for someone, and why are you even thinking about it? Yes, I know, gin kao de-gwah.

I also found remarkable the awareness or lack thereof of what bullets can do. One time I was walking along the edge of the soccer field, our office over-looked one end of it, when from the north side of the field (the vocational side of the school) one group of students began chasing another onto the field. Myself and a few other teachers stopped to look. Then we heard the sound... pop... pop... pop... pop... pop... I ducked behind a cement pillar. The other teachers stayed where they were. Several laughed that I ducked for cover and was yelling for them to do the same. "Mai bpen rai" they said, "they are not shooting at us'" Amazing Thailand indeed.

[Mario2008]

Fool. This is Thailand. They still have the death penalty. Idiot.

You could have fooled me!

Why then isn't it used regularly? It should be. Murderers should not be incarcerated at the Thai peoples expense!

Even most countries who still have the death penalty would consider it barbaric to execute a minor.

Anyway, "hang'm high" posts are not appreciated on the forum.

[ThaiFelix]

cup-O-coffee, post #6

Good post, thanks for that.

G

Yeah, I'll second that, interesting post.

[sirchai]

" I didn't intend to hurt him".

What did he think would happen when he fired the bullet at the people inside the bus? Did he think it tickle? If you point a gun and fire it and it discharges a bullet, YOU INTEND TO HURT SOMEONE.

Hope he has lots of fun in jail.

Well, when people are watching Holly,- or Bollywood movies nobody gets hurt. They should fire water guns.

[Seanextra]

cup-O-coffee I aggree totally with your statement and as noted before well put, Thankyou! Willeyeam I aggree THAI TV is S_H_I_T_E ! No Educational content bar a few minor english words that i have seen a few times, no enviromental or educational programs just Rubbish Drama! Sorta makes me want to shoot someone, luckily i get Australian Network for free, even if the thai tv soaps/dramas were in English it would be mind altering rubbish. (but at least they do blur the alcohol out....LOL)

Seriously there is far too many issues to start a list of whats wrong as we all well know but there really needs to be some sort of changes made before this place just rots away!

Maybe a good start would be an honest fair election?

[astral]

This school rivalry has to be contained.

I remember seeing youths in school uniform, in Jakarta, wielding heavy leather belts,

and that was 20 years ago.

Thailand is descending to the same levels, and worse.

[sirchai]

My very deepest sympathies to the family, friends and classmates of the victim.

This happened in the neighborhood where I live and work and is quite upsetting. A few months back, two colleagues were on a bus on that route (maybe the same number--I don't recall) and were held on the floor at gun point along with other passengers. The young men who had them get on the floor, did so for their own protection. It seems they had fled a fight with another school (or gang) and some of the students from the other school were approaching with guns out, so they told everyone to get down on the floor. When the bus stopped, the students fled. No shots fired on the bus or at the bus, but still a little too close to home.

Scott is a hero.

.