The New Skytrain

[planr]

41 minutes ago, Lakegeneve said:

I mentioned in the previous update that I would post a summary of new rolling stock orders;

 

A) BEM Blue Line (MRT) -

BEM finally placed an order with Siemens a few weeks ago for new rolling stock!!! Originally, they were going to order more stock in 2008 but had to defer due to debt restructuring issues so it has been a long wait! BEM has ordered 35 new 3 car sets which will be delivered in 3 stages ; 

1) 3 sets in late 2018,
2) 15 sets in early 2019,
3) 17 sets in late 2019.
(Note: BEM should be moving to 4 or 5 cars sets by now as expected pax after the extension are 750k-800k rising to 1m by 2022)

 

 

Thanks LG - If I understand you correctly, BEM is not planning any capacity expansion, only enough to maintain existing frequencies once the extensions open?

[Crossy]

Just for information:-

 

When Yellow and Pink open there will be seamless transfers, Yellow, Pink, Green. Buy a ticket on the Pink and ride Green and Yellow on the same ticket. Go from Samut Prakan to Immigration on one ticket.

AND

Your Rabbit card will work on all three.
AND

In a couple of years (realistically, ignore whatever "announcements" are made) your Mangmoom card will do all the above and will work on the BRT, Blue, Purple, Red and Airport Express plus the city buses. MOU's to be signed this month (hopefully).

AND

Coming soon (as soon as next year), Rabbit Line Pay will allow you to link your Rabbit card to your Line Pay account (and hence to your bank or credit card), never run out of credit again

 

 

[ExpatOilWorker]

16 hours ago, Lakegeneve said:

 

 

BTSC Dark Green (Suk) line  (BTS) -

1) The BTSC has ordered for 22 new 4 car sets from Siemens in May 2016 for the when the Samut Prakhan extension. These are being built in Turkey with expected deliveries in late 2018 & early 2019.

2) At the same time, the BTSC ordered 24 more 4 car sets of CRRC (Chinese) for the North ext to KuKot/Lam Lukka rd. These should be delivered in late 2018.

(Note: 4 sets will be kept for reserve/repairs etc)

 

Thanks for the update. 

Has any quality difference between the Siemens and the Chinese mad rolling stock been reported?

As a passenger I feel the Siemens train stops much smoother while the Chinese breaks jerks, especially when it rains and the track is wet.

Still no plans for 5 car sets on the Silom/Sukhumvit BTS green lines?

[Lakegeneve]

On 10/6/2017 at 5:26 PM, planr said:

 

Thanks LG - If I understand you correctly, BEM is not planning any capacity expansion, only enough to maintain existing frequencies once the extensions open?

Based on the rolling stock #s ordered I do believe that you are correct.

 

However, I would suggest that they should be able to achieve around 3min to 3.30 min headways (from the current 4 mins) during a couple of hrs of morning and evening peak periods which would manage the pax numbers a little better?

[Lakegeneve]

On 10/7/2017 at 9:30 AM, ExpatOilWorker said:

Thanks for the update. 

Has any quality difference between the Siemens and the Chinese mad rolling stock been reported?

As a passenger I feel the Siemens train stops much smoother while the Chinese breaks jerks, especially when it rains and the track is wet.

Still no plans for 5 car sets on the Silom/Sukhumvit BTS green lines?

Still no plans for 5 cars sets yet, though they should have already have been introduced a couple of years ago in my view.

 

I think that we can all take it for granted regarding the quality difference between Siemens and CNR group rolling stock. I'm not sure on the breaking front but I do remember that there was some issue there previously and I do also notice what you have observed.

 

The main issue that I am aware of which was posted by an engineer after the first batch arrived was that there were significant manufacturing metallurgical differences with the body of the rolling stock between both manufacturer. He stated that the Chinese trains has strength integrity concerns and that they could potentially 'deteriorate'  more quickly in the Bangkok climate, leading to metal fatigue issues arising.  It would be interesting to compare crash test results of both models....

 

It's not my area of expertise....

[Lakegeneve]

1) BMA private Gold monorail Line progressing:

The EIA is done and last week Ital-Thai was selected to do the civil works construction. It is suggested that they will start early next year....however, let's wait and see if that happens.

 

2) BTS Route maps

The BTSC is gradually introducing new electronic tri-language route maps for all carriages. 

 

 

[Lakegeneve]

On 8/16/2017 at 5:06 PM, Lakegeneve said:

The new 7 sets fo 5 car rolling stock will be ordered by the end of the year. (They promise with fingers crossed!).

New ARL rolling stock....

The SRT Board stated last week that they are deferring placing the order for the new 7 sets of rolling stock until such time as the Central Government finalises it decision regarding the Eastern HSR line!!!

 

A reminder that the budget was originally approved in 2013 for these new ARL trains which at the time were stated to arrive by the end of 2015 to deal with overcrowding back then! In 2013, overcrowding was in terms of around 45k-50k a day, now the daily pax ave is about 65k-70k a day!

 

IF placed, an early 2018 order would mean a mid 2020 delivery date! 

 

 

[ExpatOilWorker]

13 minutes ago, Lakegeneve said:

New ARL rolling stock....

The SRT Board stated last week that they are deferring placing the order for the new 7 sets of rolling stock until such time as the Central Government finalises it decision regarding the Eastern HSR line!!!

 

A reminder that the budget was originally approved in 2013 for these new ARL trains which at the time were stated to arrive by the end of 2015 to deal with overcrowding back then! In 2013, overcrowding was in terms of around 45k-50k a day, now the daily pax ave is about 65k-70k a day!

 

IF placed, an early 2018 order would mean a mid 2020 delivery date! 

 

 

ARL? HSR line?

What line are we talking about here? Color/name?

[Crossy]

2 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

ARL? HSR line?

What line are we talking about here? Color/name?

ARL - Airport Rail Link

 

HSR - High Speed Rail - In this case the Eastern route which COULD be an extension of the ARL down to Pattaya and beyond. But if they are going to wait for government direction ...

 

 

[CLW]

ARL - Airport Rail Link
 
HSR - High Speed Rail - In this case the Eastern route which COULD be an extension of the ARL down to Pattaya and beyond. But if they are going to wait for government direction ...
 
 

I wrote it in another post already. An upgrade of the tracks from BKK to Pattaya would generate a lot of passengers in my opinion.
Nothing fancy or high speed. 2nd class a/c commuter trains with avg 120-160 km/h

[Lakegeneve]

10 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

ARL? HSR line?

What line are we talking about here? Color/name?

To add to Crossey's post.

 

The Eastern HSR line to Rayong (first proposed in 1996 and which the Dems stated in the 2011 election they would start by 2012 - not realistic but 2013 probably was) had been delayed by two govt changes. The Yingluck govt election in 2011 and the subsequent military coup in May 2014 resulted in each new govt reviewing HSR plans for at least 18 months each. The original MOT idea had the Eastern HSR using the ARL as a backbone and Makkasan as a Terminus.

 

When the ARL was first proposed and then built, the eventual plan was to extended it to DMK using the Express service only. Indeed, you can read back in this thread that the ARL ext.  was a priority for the Yingluck govt in 2013 to get this extension started.

 

The current govt wants to use the Eastern HSR to Rayong to link the now expanded U-Tapao Airport, Swampy and DMK airports. There is an obvious element of duplication with the ARL ext. As Crossey will tell you there was previously a plan to use wide body, high capacity Japanese rolling stock for the Eastern line which meant that the trains could not use the ARL line and would thus terminate at Lat Krabang where pax from the Eastern seaboard would then have to change to the ARL to go to Makkasan & Phaya Thai!

 

Currently, the wonderful SRT already has 3 viaducts proposed to be built for the SRT northern line in the section Phaya Thai to Bang Sue to DMK corridor;

1) The SRT Dark Red commuter line (under construction),

2) The SRT ARL ext to DMK, (new viaduct alongside the Dark Red)

3) The SRT HSR North and Northeastern lines viaduct (which the now extended Eastern will use unless they go for differing rolling stock and track configuration which would be stupid).

 

I've suggested  since 2009 that the obvious sensible plan would have been to integrate all 3 SRT projects and build a super viaduct from the outset that can accommodate all 3 projects. (And I'm not mentioning the stupidity that the SRT still plans to extended the Light Red line right alongside the ARL line to Hua Mark with a completely new viaduct and new stations right next to the ARL stations!)

 

Frankly, like much in the mass transit policy world these SRT plans have been a dogs breakfast......regurgitated a bunch of times!

[Crossy]

20 minutes ago, Lakegeneve said:

Frankly, like much in the mass transit policy world these SRT plans have been a dogs breakfast......regurgitated a bunch of times!

Tell me about it LG. Since I first had any involvement with it the Red Line has been standard gauge, metre gauge, dual gauge (standard + metre) and now back to metre gauge.

 

If you look at the western section the viaducts and stations were built to the standard gauge design and now look "wrong" with metre gauge trackwork installed.

[Lakegeneve]

On 9/12/2017 at 6:02 PM, Lakegeneve said:

D)

11) Purple Line southern ext: The MRTA has announced that the tender will be delayed from next month until December. That shoudl still mean a mid 2018 construction start if no other delays.

12) Orange Line Phase 2 west section: The MRTA has been asked by Cabinet to look at private investment, perhaps a 50:50 PPP funding option. There will be a delay of 4 months while consultants evaluate various options.

13) The Blue line west ext: still expected to go to Cabinet in the next month or 2. Should be tendered by the end of the year assuming no delay.

All of the above tenders have been further delayed until early next year as the govt. looks to do PPP funding arrangements for the Purple and Orange extensions.

 

I'll do another general update for all projects in a couple of weeks. 

[Thian]

I don't like the new purple line,

the stations are far too high above the road,

trains too slow, stations too large,

trains wait too long before departing, have to wait too long for the driver to check the trains for left luggage (read bombs). Bad connection at Mo-chit (have to walk too far, should have escalator directly to the bts.

The cardreaders work bad

There are no fans for waiting passengers

At the connection for Sukhumvit they only use 2 entrancegates while they use 4 for incoming passengers (which are not there). So there's a qeueu.

 

Now if they even extend the purple line the whole trip to Paragon will take more than an hour, that's far too long. They need more hubs and high speed trains inbetween them.

 

 

 

[DDBKK]

Ground works have commenced for the yellow line at some of the station locations along Srinakarin Road. 

 

Should be interesting watching it all go up in the next couple of years.

[FarangryBirds]

I hope the Green extension from Bearing-Kheha is finished real soon.

As the current end of line station, Samrong is barely fit for purpose.

-Only ticket booths and gates at one end of the platform...the end closest to BigC Imperial towards Bearing, not the end facing Samut Prakan. This means exiting the station towards SP currently involves doubling back on yourself and passing through a slim gap next to the ticket barriers to reach the exits at the other end.
- There are other entrances built into nearby shop buildings, same as Asok but to date still remain cordened off and unopened.
- no escalators upto the station at all, the exits merge into the aging footbridges that already existed there before the BTS line was built.
- The station has one platform with the escalators feeding into the middle, only one line active currently, platform becomes crowded quite easily.

It all smells of a rush job to have it ready for April.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Crossy]

Ok, a bunch of off-topic posts have been removed along with the replies to them.

 

Let's try to avoid clogging up the thread shall we?

 

[Crossy]

11 hours ago, FarangryBirds said:

I hope the Green extension from Bearing-Kheha is finished real soon.

Current target for opening is December 2018.

 

I agree the ticketing at Samrong isn't ideal but in order to get open on the required date kit had to be borrowed from other stations and there just isn't the spare capacity to remove any more.

 

Also it's worth noting that there will be a major update the the ticketing starting early next year, if you have a Rabbit card it won't affect you other than the occasional gate being out of service and slightly longer queues, but single-ride users will need to look for signage (I have asked for it to be in English too).

 

Samrong will be fully operational around the same time (maybe a little later than December).

[Lakegeneve]

On 11/24/2017 at 9:54 PM, Thian said:

I don't like the new purple line,

the stations are far too high above the road,

trains too slow, stations too large,

trains wait too long before departing, have to wait too long for the driver to check the trains for left luggage (read bombs). Bad connection at Mo-chit (have to walk too far, should have escalator directly to the bts.

The cardreaders work bad

There are no fans for waiting passengers

At the connection for Sukhumvit they only use 2 entrancegates while they use 4 for incoming passengers (which are not there). So there's a qeueu.

 

Now if they even extend the purple line the whole trip to Paragon will take more than an hour, that's far too long. They need more hubs and high speed trains inbetween them.

I'm confused about some of these complaints as the Purple Line obviously doesn't go to Mo Chit not connect with Sukhumvit.

 

You are mixing up two different lines here right? MRT Purple and MRT Blue line.

 

BTW, drivers don't check the trains, the security guards do. Also, that turn around time usually also allows a cleaner to go through each carriage and collect rubbish. If you think about it, it's basically the same amount of time that it takes the driver to walk from one cabin of the train to the other at the other end so there is no real delay with that process.

 

Paragon shoppers don't tend to be metro users....they like to drive.

[Lakegeneve]

On 11/28/2017 at 4:37 AM, DDBKK said:

Ground works have commenced for the yellow line at some of the station locations along Srinakarin Road. 

 

Should be interesting watching it all go up in the next couple of years.

Yes. And much work has commenced along the Pink line route too, avoid Chaeng Wattana and Ram Inthra for a few years!

[blackcab]

@Lakegeneve Any progress or news on the Yellow Line phase 2?

[Lakegeneve]

15 hours ago, blackcab said:

@Lakegeneve Any progress or news on the Yellow Line phase 2?

Site prep works have started and you'll be happy to hear that the BTSC partners have decided to build the whole line all at once as they are doing with the MRT Pink Line.

 

You'll see that change in the next update.

[Lakegeneve]

Before doing the next update I thought that I'd post these BTSC charts for some guidance (though not all dates are accurate)

 

1) Firstly, an update of current texts and lines which will be operated by the BTS Group. All of these lines/exts are MRTA projects.

 

Main points to note, the Samrong to Samut Prakan ext will open by Dec 2018 and work has started on the MRT Pink Monorail line. The operations dates for the MRT Pink and MRT Yellow lines are also unrealistic. Expect mid 2022 at the earliest.

2) Next group of lines that BTSC wants to bid for operations. Note that seem keen on the Orange line which will be news to BEM who will assume that they have the inside running.

 

Also, the suggested timelines on the BMA Grey monorail Line and the long proposed link from Bang Na to the Airport (called LRT here) are wildly optimistic. Cabinet and the MRTA already has Purple southern ext approved (tender delayed), the Orange Western ext and Blue Line west ext as priority projects to get tendered in the first half of 2018. Plus a couple of the SRT Red line ext.

 

I would think that the BTS Bang Wa to Taling Chan ext (Called Western here but actually it is the "South" line) will be tendered well before the BMA Grey line but let's see.

 

Also, both the BTS final south and north exts are more advanced for possible tender in 2018, than the Bang Wa ext.

[Lakegeneve]

3) Finally, BTS Group attempts to give an overview of all lines and ext and their concession period. An okay summary of all planned lines but missing a few others such as like the MRT Brown line (years away), Light Blue line (status still not determined) and the final part of the SRT Dark Red line (Hualumphong to Mahachai) and a couple of other proposed monorails/LRTs.

 

[Lakegeneve]

 

If you wish to have a good sense on how the BTS Northern ext is progressing (currently at 51.5% progress) watch this video.

 

The first part of the ext to open will be the long awaited Lat Phrao station (N9) in the first quarter of 2019. N6 might finally also be built by then as well......

[DDBKK]

Nice update. Knew the yellow line construction schedule was way off. 4 years sounds much more realistic.

[Lakegeneve]

The usual caveat....this is only a summary and all is subject to change. Politics, dysfunction and an endemic lack of coordination abounds in the implementation of mass transit policy and projects. Please note that the list numbers only refer to projects/lines or expected extensions based on future plans - numbers have nothing to do with the MOT/OTP M-MAP 10 line master plan (which is currently being reviewed and updated).

 

Some notes;

1) The main progress since my last update in July 2017 (see #596) is that the Orange line construction is well underway and that the MRT Pink line has also started some site construction work. The MRT Yellow line has some preliminary work underway but proper construction is still at least a few months away. The 1.8km ‘toy’ Gold line Auto monorail line has supposedly also started construction but I’m a little skeptical of that.

 

Currently, some 140kms of new lines are under construction (The current network is around 113kms of what will eventually be some 540kms of metro and suburban lines) 

 

2) In the first half of 2018, we should also see tenders on the Purple Line southern extension (delayed from last year), the MRT Blue line 7.8km west extension, and also the Western section of the Orange line which Cabinet is pushing as a PPP model.

 The SRT Dark Red Line ext to Thammasat Uni and SRT Light Red line to Salaya exts are also expected to be tendered this year.

 There is also a small chance that one of the 3 BTS exts may be tendered but given the ongoing standoff between the MRTA and BMA on the current 2 extensions, I don’t see another tender going out until next year.

 

4) 2018 Openings: The BTS Suk line southern ext from Samrong to Kheha SP will open in December.

 

5) After nearly 20 years the 2 ‘missing’ BTS stations, S4 & N6, are finally being built. Work should begin in 2018.

 

Feel free to ask queries as they are a few people here with specialist knowledge but pls don't quote the complete list if you do post a query.

 

BANGKOK METRO & SUBURBAN NETWORK - UPDATED SUMMARY LIST (Jan 2018)

 

A) LINES/EXTS CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION:

1) MRTA Blue Line ring ext (subway) Tha Phra & Bang Khae ext: (Civil works progress 97%)
a) Hua Lamphong - Lak Song, 13.9 km , 7 elevated & 4 underground stations. Opens March 2019. 

Bang Sue - Tha Phra, 13.1 km, 7 elevated stations, Opens 2020. Website: http://www.mrta-blueline.com/

2) BTS Dark Green line (Suk Line Southern Ext) Samrong to Kheha Samut Prakan ext (MRTA): 11.4km, 6 stations. Opens in Dec 2018. (Civil works progress 100%). Website: http://www.mrta-greenline.net/
 

3) SRT Dark Red Line suburban line from Bang Sue to Rangsit: 26km, 8 stations* (Started March 2013, opens June 2020 - civil works progress 89%). *SRT Dark Red Line is metre gauge, electric. 
 

4) BTS Dark Green line (Suk Line Northern Ext):
a) Mo Chit to Saphan Mai ext ( MRTA): 11.4km, 11 stations, 

b ) Saphan Mai to Kukot/Lam Lukka rd: 6.8km, 5 stations .
(Construction started late 2015, opening in 2019 - civil works progress 51.21%).  1^st Phase to Lat Phrao station to open early 2019.  Website: http://www.mrta-greenline.net/

 

5) MRTA Orange Line eastern section Phase 1: 20km, 17 stations (10 underground, 7 elevated) Thai Cultural Center to Minburi. Construction stated July 2017, to open 2022. (Civil works progress 3.79% Website: http://www.mrta-orangeline.net/ and

 

6) MRTA Pink Line (Monorail): Khae Rai intersection to Miniburi via Pakred, Chaeng Wattana & Ram Inthra 36km, 30 stations. Construction started Dec 2017, to open April 2021 but expect 2022 as being more realistic. http://www.mrta.co.th/pinkline/index.html

7) MRTA Yellow Line (Monorail): 30.4km, 23 stations elevated. Latphrao to Hua Mark to Samrong. Prelim. construction starting soon after public consult., to open April 2021 but expect 2022 as being more realistic. http://www.mrta-yellowline.com/

 

8) BMA Gold Line (Auto monorail): 1.8km, 3 stations, Krung Thonburi to Klong San. Construction has reportedly started in late Dec 2017, to open late 2019.

 

9) New Intercity terminal at Bang Sue for all N, NE and S SRT intercity trains, Airport Line extension and both SRT Red Lines. (Construction started May 2014, opening 2019/20 – (civil works progress 57.50%). 

 

LINES/EXTS TO BE TENDERED IN 2018:

10) Purple Line ext south. Taopoon to WWY then to Ratburna: 23.6 km. 17 stations (12.6km 10 stations underground, 11km 7 stations elevated). Note: Approved for tender by Cabinet on 25 July. Tender delayed due to PPP proposal. If construction starts by mid 2018, a 2024 is likely. 

Route: https://www.facebook.com/MRTA.PR/videos/1875103962706329

11) Orange Line Phase 2, west section: From TCC to Bang Khun Non (Charan Sawitwong rd). 17.5km, 13 stations underground. Tender delayed due to PPP proposal.
12) Blue Line west ext to Phutthamonthon sai 4: 7.8km, 4 stations elevated.

 

13) SRT Dark Red Line north ext suburban line from Rangsit to Thammasat Uni: 8.5kms, 4 stations

14) SRT Light Red line extension: Taling Chan to Salaya to Siraj, 13km, 6 stations

15) BTS S4 Suksa Wittaya station to be built in 2018.

16) BTS N6 Sena Ruam station to be built in 2018

 

C) LINES/EXTS TO BE TENDERED IN 2019-2020??

17) BTS Dark Green (Sukhumvit) line south from Paknam to Bang Pu: 4 stations (planned)

18) BTS Dark Green (Sukhumvit) line north ext: from Kukot to Outer Ring rd, 4 stations (planned)

19) BTS Light Green (Silom) line ext from Bang Wah to Taling Chan: 7km, 6 stations (planned) 

20) Airport Rail Link (ARL) extension from Phayathai to Bangsue to Don Meaung (DMK): 21.8km, 5 stations (much delayed)
21) MRTA Grey Monorail Line: 26km, 21 stations. Rama 9 Bridge to Kaset-Nawamin/Ram Inthra (Completing EIA). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MRT_Grey_Line

 

D) NEXT BATCH OF LINES/EXTs (2022>) - assuming that all goes well in the next 2-3 years
22) BTS Light Green (Silom Line) west: 1-2 station ext west from National Stadium to Krung Kasem rd to link with the future SRT Dark Red Line.
23) SRT Dark Red Line south ext: 59 km, 22 stations
a) Bang Sue to Hualumphong to Wong Wian Yai, 7 stations
b ) WWY to Mahachai, 15 stations

24) SRT Light Red ext from Bang Sue to Hua Mark, 7 stations (Note: duplicates the ARL line)

25) BTS Dark Green (Sukhumvit) spur line or LRT from Bang Na intersection to Central Bang Na & BKK Airport (planned)

E) THEREAFTER OR UNDER STUDY (2025 >)

26) Brown Monorail Line: 20.5km, 21 stations. Monorail Khae Rai intersection along Ngam Wong Wan, Kaset-Namawin to Lam Sali intersection (interchange with Yellow and Orange). (Feasibility study until mid 2018) http://www.brownline-fs2560.com/index.html
27) MRTA Purple Line north ext : 4.5km ext to Sai Noi intersection (requested by Nonthaburi province but no confirmation).
28) BMA Light Blue Line: 9.5km, 9 stations. Monorail. Sathon to Pracha Songkhro. (Status TBC)

 

[Lakegeneve]

On 7/31/2017 at 4:34 PM, Lakegeneve said:

 

The all important map, I'm only posting one for now. Credit to Archstudent.

 

 

[Lakegeneve]

On 16 October 2017 at 8:49 PM, Lakegeneve said:

New ARL rolling stock....

The SRT Board stated last week that they are deferring placing the order for the new 7 sets of rolling stock until such time as the Central Government finalises it decision regarding the Eastern HSR line!!!

 

A reminder that the budget was originally approved in 2013 for these new ARL trains which at the time were stated to arrive by the end of 2015 to deal with overcrowding back then! In 2013, overcrowding was in terms of around 45k-50k a day, now the daily pax ave is about 65k-70k a day!

 

IF placed, an early 2018 order would mean a mid 2020 delivery date! 

 

 

According to an article in the Post today, the Deputy Transport minister has reaffirmed that there will be no new ARL train order until the Eastern HSR line plans are finalised which will not be until at least mid 2018. So don't expect any decision on new rolling stock until the end of the year......sigh...

 

The ARL will start operating from 5.30am from Feb. 

[siam2007]

On 1/21/2018 at 10:00 AM, Lakegeneve said:

According to an article in the Post today, the Deputy Transport minister has reaffirmed that there will be no new ARL train order until the Eastern HSR line plans are finalised which will not be until at least mid 2018. So don't expect any decision on new rolling stock until the end of the year......sigh...

 

The ARL will start operating from 5.30am from Feb. 

 

The only improvement to be seen is the fact that they now plan to convert the useless and completely unused small luggage carriage at the end of each train and fit it with seats so this carriage will be turned into a regular passenger carriage. It should increase the number each train can carry by maybe 10-15%