Thai Red Shirts Stage Mass Rally

[webfact]

Thai 'Red Shirts' stage mass rally

by Pornchai Kittiwongsakul

AYUTTHAYA (AFP) -- Thousands of Thailand's anti-government "Red Shirts" joined a mass rally on Sunday in the latest large-scale demonstration by the movement in recent weeks.

Police estimated at least 8,000 people had joined the gathering in a football stadium in the town of Ayutthaya about one hour's drive north of Bangkok.

Over 1,000 police were deployed to provide security for the event but authorities said the mood remained calm.

"The situation so far is normal, there is no sign of any trouble," said police Colonel Sombat Choochaiya.

Protesters from Bangkok and other regions in the kingdom wore their signature colour and sang songs including their anthem "Red in the Land" in the stadium after tying red ribbons on to a bridge in the centre of the town.

Sombat Boonngarmanong, one of the rally organisers, told the crowd that the movement would avoid holding protests where people might be at risk of attack by the authorities, referring to Bangkok's deadly protests in April and May.

"But our activities will remain, we will increase the red presence every Sunday in every province," he said.

Bangkok and three surrounding provinces -- but not Ayutthaya -- remain under a state of emergency, which gives the authorities broad security powers.

The mainly poor and working class Reds accuse the ruling government of being elitist and undemocratic.

Protesters, mostly supporters of fugitive former premier Thaksin Shinawatra who was ousted in a 2006 coup, took to the streets in mid-March demanding snap polls.

Clashes between between demonstrators and armed soldiers ensued, resulting in the deaths of over 90 people -- mainly civilians -- and leaving nearly 1,900 injured.

"When election day comes, we will wear red to cast our vote," Sombat said.

The rally is expected to go on late into the evening and include speeches by opposition Puae Thai party members and a firework display.

A similar Reds gathering in Bangkok on September 19 saw an estimated 6,000 people join a rally to mark four years since a coup ousted their hero Thaksin Shinawatra as premier and commemorate those slain in a May crackdown on the movement's protests in the capital.

Last Sunday another 6,000 people rallied in Bangkok to mark six months since a night of bloody clashes with the military, which left 25 people dead.

Emergency rule, which was introduced in early April in response to the Reds' rallies, which peaked at 100,000 people, was recently extended in the capital just hours before a blast killed four people at an apartment block in Bangkok.

The government, which has stepped up security following a string of other small blasts in Bangkok, was quick to blame the Red Shirts for the explosion.

But the Reds deny any involvement in the unrest and have accused the authorities of a plot to justify tougher security powers.

Though no-one has been convicted, 19 senior Reds are currently in jail in Thailand on terrorism charges relating to the unrest in April and May, while others thought to have played key roles remain on the run.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2010-10-18

[Buchholz]

here's one high-functioning Red who didn't attend the mass rally:

Police Arrest Suspect Who Left Black Bag at Privy Council President's Residence

Samsen police have arrested a man, suspected of leaving a black trash bag filled with feces and curses against the Privy Council president, at his residence yesterday.

They used CCTV footage to identify the man, who confesses to being a red-shirt supporter and to having done this 5 times already.

[brahmburgers]

"When election day comes, we will wear red to cast our vote," Sombat said.

Good. Wear whatever colors you want. Voting is a good thing. Just don't harass other voters. Ok? The ones who aren't wearing red shirts. And while you're paying attention to things you don't want to hear: Don't harm, harass or kill those campaigning from other parties ....as Red hot heads have been known to do.

[jayjay0]

" told the crowd that the movement would avoid holding protests where people might be at risk of attack by the authorities,"

Still with the lies. If he was honest he would have said put people at risk. Just a endless line of uninformed people ready to wallow there crap.

I wonder how many of those followers are smart enough to know you don't have to wear a red shirt to believe in freedom and democracy. Actually hey don't believe in freedom unless they are the ones telling you what to do.

[jayjay0]

Picked this bit of red shirt programing up off another thread.

(A red-shirt leader warned Thursday certain red-shirt people may turn suicide bombers to avenge the government crackdowns and fight for democracy.)

I guess if the government won't attack them they will do it themselves.

You either have to be greedy or pretty dense to buy into the red shirts.

If I offend any one I am not sorry.

Edited October 18, 2010 by jayjay0

[hyperdimension]

I guess if the government won't attack them they will do it themselves.

... including to each other, which they may have already done as there is a possibility that UDD militants ("black shirts") shot their own supporters during the riots.

There is also a possibility that Khattiya Sawasdipol was shot by someone aligned with Thaksin, as Khattiya was revealing a lot of information to the media at the time. Maybe they didn't want him to be taken in by authorities for interrogation.

Edited October 18, 2010 by hyperdimension

[hanuman1]

I guess if the government won't attack them they will do it themselves.

... including to each other, which they may have already done as there is a possibility that UDD militants ("black shirts") shot their own supporters during the riots.

There is also a possibility that Khattiya Sawasdipol was shot by someone aligned with Thaksin, as Khattiya was revealing a lot of information to the media at the time. Maybe they didn't want him to be taken in by authorities for interrogation.

There is also the possibility that you are wrong. Isn't there?

[Pi Sek]

I guess if the government won't attack them they will do it themselves.

... including to each other, which they may have already done as there is a possibility that UDD militants ("black shirts") shot their own supporters during the riots.

There is also a possibility that Khattiya Sawasdipol was shot by someone aligned with Thaksin, as Khattiya was revealing a lot of information to the media at the time. Maybe they didn't want him to be taken in by authorities for interrogation.

There is also the possibility that you are wrong. Isn't there?

Hanuman, I disagree with 99% of your posts, but your post here is the voice of reason. Well done :jap:

Of course, there is also the possibility that he is right. I personally think that the first bit is most likely true, and I'm undecided on the second bit.

[hanuman1]

I guess if the government won't attack them they will do it themselves.

... including to each other, which they may have already done as there is a possibility that UDD militants ("black shirts") shot their own supporters during the riots.

There is also a possibility that Khattiya Sawasdipol was shot by someone aligned with Thaksin, as Khattiya was revealing a lot of information to the media at the time. Maybe they didn't want him to be taken in by authorities for interrogation.

There is also the possibility that you are wrong. Isn't there?

Hanuman, I disagree with 99% of your posts, but your post here is the voice of reason. Well done :jap:

Of course, there is also the possibility that he is right. I personally think that the first bit is most likely true, and I'm undecided on the second bit.

I'll try not to consider your 'Well done' as being a condescending remark and will take it in the spirit I hope it was meant.

And do please let us know when you do actually 'decide' on the second bit. It could mean that you have information that the media as well as law enforcement agencies would very much like to know about. Unless you were just guessing like everyone else.

Edited October 18, 2010 by hanuman1

[OzMick]

"Police estimated at least 8,000 people had joined the gathering............"

"Last Sunday another 6,000 people rallied in Bangkok................"

IMHO it is a fair assumption that some, if not many, of the 8000 turned out last week.

From another news item;

"82% of 1,498 people surveyed are most concerned with the continuous bombing news"

And who is copping the blame for it - the same movement, if not the same people, politically represented by PTT.

And T thinks that PTT can win the next election by a landslide - there's not enough votes there to elect a single candidate, even if they all came from the same electorate!

Self-delusion bordering on egomaniacal insanity.

[asiawatcher]

Even with the numbers of 100,000 in protest months back, that does in no way reflect the ideals of 64M Thai people. Only the next poll will decide this countries direction and the sooner the better and should more violence break out - suicide bombers etc - originating from Reds - they will dissolve their chances exponentially every time there is a death and collateral damage. Once the first one happens, its all over for them.

There is also no doubt in my mind there are militants within the reds who care nothing of the man beside them and only want the chance to vent violence. The more there are mass rallies the more recruits these militant members can gain. It is no different from Osama Bin Laden's modus operandi. Find the most militant and recruit them for the greater good (their control) - their willingness (stupidity) to sacrifice their lives.

And the dark side within the ranks of reds who take out others are a stern warning, don't try to gain too much too soon without your mentors consent. Sah Daeng was a prime example and exemplifies the fact no one is safe from the men in black who are policing the red movement. There is a lot more to the reds and Thaksin than meets the eye.

[Pi Sek]

I'll try not to consider your 'Well done' as being a condescending remark and will take it in the spirit I hope it was meant.

And do please let us know when you do actually 'decide' on the second bit. It could mean that you have information that the media as well as law enforcement agencies would very much like to know about. Unless you were just guessing like everyone else.

Yes, the 'well done' was not meant as condescending... re-reading it, I can accept it might seem that way (depending on out of which side of bed you got up this morning ). I apologise if you may have taken it that way.

I will 'decide' on the second bit when I see the facts, but there's a strong case for both arguments. I only have the same information as the media - and I think I have collected my opinion from a wide range of media - so, yes, I am only guessing like everyone else. There's no way that Oswald killed Kennedy, so I'll try to keep an open mind.

[Pi Sek]

"Police estimated at least 8,000 people had joined the gathering............"

"Last Sunday another 6,000 people rallied in Bangkok................"

IMHO it is a fair assumption that some, if not many, of the 8000 turned out last week.

From another news item;

"82% of 1,498 people surveyed are most concerned with the continuous bombing news"

And who is copping the blame for it - the same movement, if not the same people, politically represented by PTT.

And T thinks that PTT can win the next election by a landslide - there's not enough votes there to elect a single candidate, even if they all came from the same electorate!

Self-delusion bordering on egomaniacal insanity.

Whilst I consider spelling and grammar important, I realise it's not everyone's first language so I won't bring it up if someone mis-spells or whatever.

But PTT is a petrol station company dude!

[OzMick]

"Police estimated at least 8,000 people had joined the gathering............"

"Last Sunday another 6,000 people rallied in Bangkok................"

IMHO it is a fair assumption that some, if not many, of the 8000 turned out last week.

From another news item;

"82% of 1,498 people surveyed are most concerned with the continuous bombing news"

And who is copping the blame for it - the same movement, if not the same people, politically represented by PTT.

And T thinks that PTT can win the next election by a landslide - there's not enough votes there to elect a single candidate, even if they all came from the same electorate!

Self-delusion bordering on egomaniacal insanity.

Whilst I consider spelling and grammar important, I realise it's not everyone's first language so I won't bring it up if someone mis-spells or whatever.

But PTT is a petrol station company dude!

It's early - rush of blood - beezheimer's

[UberBraun]

And T thinks that PTT can win the next election by a landslide - there's not enough votes there to elect a single candidate, even if they all came from the same electorate!

Self-delusion bordering on egomaniacal insanity.

Never discount the power of money.

[Jingthing]

And T thinks that PTT can win the next election by a landslide - there's not enough votes there to elect a single candidate, even if they all came from the same electorate!

Self-delusion bordering on egomaniacal insanity.

Never discount the power of money.

Or overestimate it either.

[UberBraun]

I will 'decide' on the second bit when I see the facts, but there's a strong case for both arguments. I only have the same information as the media - and I think I have collected my opinion from a wide range of media - so, yes, I am only guessing like everyone else. There's no way that Oswald killed Kennedy, so I'll try to keep an open mind.

Well, if you look at the media interviews Seh Daeng gave during the two weeks prior to his shooting, you will see he was saying Thaksin said this, Thaksin said that, Thaksin wants this, Thaksin doesn't want that etc. So he was rather publicly pointing the finger at Thaksin. It would not surprise me in the least if Thaksin phoned someone in the PT party and said 'shut this f**ker up'.

And they did.

[Pi Sek]

I will 'decide' on the second bit when I see the facts, but there's a strong case for both arguments. I only have the same information as the media - and I think I have collected my opinion from a wide range of media - so, yes, I am only guessing like everyone else. There's no way that Oswald killed Kennedy, so I'll try to keep an open mind.

Well, if you look at the media interviews Seh Daeng gave during the two weeks prior to his shooting, you will see he was saying Thaksin said this, Thaksin said that, Thaksin wants this, Thaksin doesn't want that etc. So he was rather publicly pointing the finger at Thaksin. It would not surprise me in the least if Thaksin phoned someone in the PT party and said 'shut this f**ker up'.

n't want

And they did.

I'd be inclined to agree, UberBraun, but I'll keep an open mind until the facts are forthcoming.

I'm sure the army weren't too happy that there was some rogue soldier running around mouthing off about how the army got outmanoevred by "ronin warriors". So I'm sure there are one or two soldiers that would have killed him in an instant.

But I'm also sure that Thaksin and the red brigade didn't want to be associated with the black brigade because they didn't want to be accountable. It's common knowledge Seh Daeng wasn't all there - maybe one or two "hand grenade dances" too many - and his media statements were almost all "yeah, my boys in black trump the army any day and I'm here to protect the reds when the army come shooting".

But it could have been anyone, even outside the govt/UDD. A lot of people were pretty angry at him.

[rubl]

here's one high-functioning Red who didn't attend the mass rally:

Police Arrest Suspect Who Left Black Bag at Privy Council President's Residence

Samsen police have arrested a man, suspected of leaving a black trash bag filled with feces and curses against the Privy Council president, at his residence yesterday.

They used CCTV footage to identify the man, who confesses to being a red-shirt supporter and to having done this 5 times already.

He confessed, was fined THB 5000, paid and released. Probably also told not to do this again (,you naughty boy). Almost like a children's prank.

Next.

[rubl]

begin removed ...

Sombat Boonngarmanong, one of the rally organisers, told the crowd that the movement would avoid holding protests where people might be at risk of attack by the authorities, referring to Bangkok's deadly protests in April and May.

... some removed ...

Though no-one has been convicted, 19 senior Reds are currently in jail in Thailand on terrorism charges relating to the unrest in April and May, while others thought to have played key roles remain on the run.

K. Sombat seems to say one thing to his fellow reds and another to the press. Wait and see what the UN chief will be told.

This government is not known to attack protesters, it's more the other way round from what I've seen. The government has tried and with difficulties succeeded in clearing protests of more-and-more violent and illegal nature in May. As long as the reds gather peacefully and disband the same day as agreed with authorities there is no problem at all as we have seen with the gatherings the last few weeks.

With a complicated case like the 19 UDD leaders it would really be undemocratic if the accused had been convicted already. The courts are also a wee bit busy at the moment. Too many red and yellow cases, plus those filed by politicians, and other animals.

PS can I put an image with BTS Saladaeng and k. Seh Daeng and text 'people died here' on slippers and sell them at the next rally ?

Edited October 18, 2010 by rubl

[Buchholz]

here's one high-functioning Red who didn't attend the mass rally:

Police Arrest Suspect Who Left Black Bag at Privy Council President's Residence

Samsen police have arrested a man, suspected of leaving a black trash bag filled with feces and curses against the Privy Council president, at his residence yesterday.

They used CCTV footage to identify the man, who confesses to being a red-shirt supporter and to having done this 5 times already.

He confessed, was fined THB 5000, paid and released. Probably also told not to do this again (,you naughty boy). Almost like a children's prank.

He also runs a chain of restaurants. I hope he washed his hands afterwards each time.

Given the repetitious nature of the Red <deleted> stirrer and the ramifications of the criteria, he's one kinky Red:

Coprophilia is the paraphilia involving sexual pleasure from feces. In the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of the American Psychiatric Association (DSM-IV-TR), it is classified under 302.9 Paraphilia Not Otherwise Specified and has no diagnostic criteria other than a general statement about paraphilias that says "the diagnosis is made if the behavior, sexual urges, or fantasies cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning".

Furthermore, the DSM-IV-TR notes, "Fantasies, behaviors, or objects are paraphilic only when they lead to clinically significant distress or impairment, eg. are obligatory, result in sexual dysfunction, require participation of nonconsenting individuals, lead to legal complications."

Edited October 18, 2010 by Buchholz

[Bagwan]

Coprophilia is the paraphilia involving sexual pleasure from feces. In the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of the American Psychiatric Association (DSM-IV-TR), it is classified under 302.9 Paraphilia Not Otherwise Specified and has no diagnostic criteria other than a general statement about paraphilias that says "the diagnosis is made if the behavior, sexual urges, or fantasies cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning".

Furthermore, the DSM-IV-TR notes, "Fantasies, behaviors, or objects are paraphilic only when they lead to clinically significant distress or impairment, eg. are obligatory, result in sexual dysfunction, require participation of nonconsenting individuals, lead to legal complications."

Is that so, John? Well I never. Who would have thought? I'm glad that you shared that with us - I think.  

[brahmburgers]

Speaking of Seh Daeng, how's the murder investigation going? What's that you say? There is no investigation?!? Oh, how silly of me. For a moment I forgot this is Thailand, and of course there's no real investigation of that murder.

When a scenario makes such a big splash, everyone (including investigators) steps back out of the way. Plus, in a country so steeped in superstitious beliefs (and the belief that people can read other peoples' minds) - coupled with the unmentioned assumption that everyone thinks pretty much alike, there's no need to investigate, as one individual's perception is assumed to be everyone's truth. Plus, Thais are world famous non-complainers, and are all properly immersed in accepting the concept that 'odd things happen,' and there's nothing you or me can do about it.

[scorecard]

Even with the numbers of 100,000 in protest months back, that does in no way reflect the ideals of 64M Thai people. Only the next poll will decide this countries direction and the sooner the better and should more violence break out - suicide bombers etc - originating from Reds - they will dissolve their chances exponentially every time there is a death and collateral damage. Once the first one happens, its all over for them.

There is also no doubt in my mind there are militants within the reds who care nothing of the man beside them and only want the chance to vent violence. The more there are mass rallies the more recruits these militant members can gain. It is no different from Osama Bin Laden's modus operandi. Find the most militant and recruit them for the greater good (their control) - their willingness (stupidity) to sacrifice their lives.

And the dark side within the ranks of reds who take out others are a stern warning, don't try to gain too much too soon without your mentors consent. Sah Daeng was a prime example and exemplifies the fact no one is safe from the men in black who are policing the red movement. There is a lot more to the reds and Thaksin than meets the eye.

Well said. And in regard to sae daeng, thaksin went totally hot (at time embracing him as a loved dear brother, with lots of publicity photos) and at other times 't' was totally cold on this guy with severe criticism and total disowning.

Is / was sae daeng dispensable to the 't' machine? Absolutely yes!

[chantorn]

I guess if the government won't attack them they will do it themselves.

... including to each other, which they may have already done as there is a possibility that UDD militants ("black shirts") shot their own supporters during the riots.

There is also a possibility that Khattiya Sawasdipol was shot by someone aligned with Thaksin, as Khattiya was revealing a lot of information to the media at the time. Maybe they didn't want him to be taken in by authorities for interrogation.

Agree, as the shooter was MOST LIKELY a sniper in army uniform, behind the army line.That is the reason why the govt cannot release the report of the bullet trajectory.

Edited October 18, 2010 by chantorn

[jayjay0]

Speaking of Seh Daeng, how's the murder investigation going? What's that you say? There is no investigation?!? Oh, how silly of me. For a moment I forgot this is Thailand, and of course there's no real investigation of that murder.

When a scenario makes such a big splash, everyone (including investigators) steps back out of the way. Plus, in a country so steeped in superstitious beliefs (and the belief that people can read other peoples' minds) - coupled with the unmentioned assumption that everyone thinks pretty much alike, there's no need to investigate, as one individual's perception is assumed to be everyone's truth. Plus, Thais are world famous non-complainers, and are all properly immersed in accepting the concept that 'odd things happen,' and there's nothing you or me can do about it.

Other than the fact that he had a large part in the death of dam_n near 90 people why would you want to find out who shot him any more than who shot the rest of the people. Seh Daeng got a easy way out. If he had got what he deserved he would have been asking for the bullet.

Edited October 18, 2010 by jayjay0

[rubl]

Speaking of Seh Daeng, how's the murder investigation going? What's that you say? There is no investigation?!? Oh, how silly of me. For a moment I forgot this is Thailand, and of course there's no real investigation of that murder.

When a scenario makes such a big splash, everyone (including investigators) steps back out of the way. Plus, in a country so steeped in superstitious beliefs (and the belief that people can read other peoples' minds) - coupled with the unmentioned assumption that everyone thinks pretty much alike, there's no need to investigate, as one individual's perception is assumed to be everyone's truth. Plus, Thais are world famous non-complainers, and are all properly immersed in accepting the concept that 'odd things happen,' and there's nothing you or me can do about it.

One of these days the DSI will come with a full report on the 91 deaths. Seh Daeng's one of them. Somehow I think for most the cause of death will be 'shot', with only army personel and some bystanders killed by shrapnel from RPG/M79 grenade attacks.

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

One of these days the DSI will come with a full report on the 91 deaths. Seh Daeng's one of them. Somehow I think for most the cause of death will be 'shot', with only army personel and some bystanders killed by shrapnel from RPG/M79 grenade attacks.

Are you implying that the red shirts and their black shirt guards only had RPGs and hand grenades, and no guns? How naive!

[anterian]

I subscribe to this forum by email, I get daily updates. I have commented 11 times in about 5 years, mostly I cannot be bothered and for the following two reasons. Firstly I cannot comment directly but have to log in, secondly the members are so bigoted and biased in their comments on anything to do with the Red shirts. To most members here they view the Red shirts as illiterate morons full of deception, lies and violence.

Now I know many intelligent sincere Red shirts, I also participated in the early PAD rallies in Bangkok where I met many illiterate PAD morons, so I wonder why so many forum members have such rigidly biased views regarding the Reds and Yellows? Is it a case of "birds of a feather"?

If I did not live in Thailand and my sources of information were just the Nation and the BP plus this forum I would have a very distorted view of events, is this the intention of the Thaivisa management or the moderators, or a conspiracy by the members?

I have realised that the more you treat people with contempt the more they tend to behave in a contemptible manner, it becomes a self fullfilling prophecy. Further the longer this mental attitude persists the longer Thailand will stay a divided nation.

I was present during the Aldermarston marches in England, yes I am old, they were intended to be peaceful protests yet they had their share of malcontents, trouble makers and violent incidents against the authorities. I am sure if guns were as readily available in England then as they are presently in Thailand there would have been deaths.

[whybother]

<snip>

"To most members here they view the Red shirts as illiterate morons full of deception, lies and violence."

Not at all. Sure, the red shirts have some illiterates. Sure, the red shirts have some morons (as do the yellow shirts).

But it's the red shirt leaders that are full of deception, lies and violence.

Edited October 19, 2010 by whybother