Top Thai Judge In The Spotlight After Clips

[SergeiY]

In the pay of Thaksin ! You couldn't make it up.

With Thaksin's lawyers caught in an attempted payoff of the courts not too long ago ... you don't HAVE to make it up

Who knows. That was maybe just a set up, a trap to frame Thaksin. Planned by someone in the background who placed these lawyers as 'sleepers' near Thaksin many many years ago.

No need for elaborate conspiracies ... Thaksin's bought people and attempted to buy people in the past. Occam's Razor suggests that he did that with Chat's aide. Remember during the recent redshirt insurrection in BKK when one of the leaders shot his mouth off about the cash he had in the bank?

yawn.

Occam's Razor suggests that you just spin another conspiracy theory, obviously based on your own confirmation bias.

[Buchholz]

In the minds of hysterical foreigners with nothing on their minds but the next visa run, perhaps.

Thanks for such a kind bit of flaming I am neither hysterical nor do I make visa runs (nor am I a teacher:), but if it makes you happy to attack the man instead of the argument, then by all means, continue

Hmmm... not hysterical, not a visa runner, and not a teacher?

Well then, surely you must fall within jayboy's other favorite flame to pigeon-hole members who he disagrees with:

This and your subsequent comments suggest, along with your bar room style of discussion ...

(as well as the few semi educated saloon bar experts on this forum).

[Crushdepth]

He's still AWOL and has been gone 3 weeks now. His passport has been revoked and Hong Kong has been asked to locate him.

If the clips are legitimate why did he flee the country? And how does he plan to support himself?

Must be on somebody's payroll, now I wonder which criminal fugitive ex-prime minister would like to tarnish the reputation of the court?

[whybother]

The first set of tapes were a failure by the PTP to discredit the Democrats and the Constitution Court.

The second set of tapes appear to be a bit more incriminating against the court.

According to the PTP, the third set of tapes are said to be even more incriminating? Are the PTP involved in a some black mail, seemingly controlling the release of the videos?

[jayboy]

Hmmm... not hysterical, not a visa runner, and not a teacher?

Well then, surely you must fall within jayboy's other favorite flame to pigeon-hole members who he disagrees with:

This and your subsequent comments suggest, along with your bar room style of discussion ...

(as well as the few semi educated saloon bar experts on this forum).

It's not a matter of pigeon holing people I disagree with.Actually I'm always pleased to be proved wrong when done with intelligence and authority.One can always learn something new or see a new perspective.

I do object however to uninformed and obsessive one note rants and unsurprisingly many seem half educated, as do many barflies, visa runners (even those who deny being one), sexpats and certain "teachers".

Moving to the question being considered the key point is made by Tulsahit (quoted in another thread on the forum) in today's Nation.

"The public is not so eager to know who shot the clips or who paid him or her to do so. The bigger question on everybody's mind is whether the Constitution Court is still an institution we can trust."

Yet for some it's just a question of Thaksin paying off some wretched clerk.Some of these deluded obsessives should retire to a dark room and ponder their stupidity.

Edited November 3, 2010 by jayboy

[rubl]

He's still AWOL and has been gone 3 weeks now. His passport has been revoked and Hong Kong has been asked to locate him.

If the clips are legitimate why did he flee the country? And how does he plan to support himself?

Must be on somebody's payroll, now I wonder which criminal fugitive ex-prime minister would like to tarnish the reputation of the court?

Objection, your honor, leading question

[Robby nz]

"The public is not so eager to know who shot the clips or who paid him or her to do so. The bigger question on everybody's mind is whether the Constitution Court is still an institution we can trust"

This of course begs the questions of who would want to discredit the court and to whoes advantage would it be?

Yet for some it's just a question of Thaksin paying off some wretched clerk.

Another question is 'why would he do it?'

If there was no payment or threat held over him why would he want, particularly at this time, to discredit his employer?

If he was not paid where did he get the money to run?

As he had fled the scene before the tapes were released who was it that brought them fourth?

It would seem that Jataporn, by his own words, has inside info on the release of more tapes.

Therefore it would seem likely the tapes are coming from an anti govt source.

The only reason an anti govt group or person would want to discredit the court must be to discredit their decision in the present proceedings.

If the Dems lost and were disbanded then there would be little point of the anti govt group discrediting the court and the decision so it stands to reason that those who released the tapes believe the decision will go in favour of the dems.

[jdinasia]

Hmmm... not hysterical, not a visa runner, and not a teacher?

Well then, surely you must fall within jayboy's other favorite flame to pigeon-hole members who he disagrees with:

This and your subsequent comments suggest, along with your bar room style of discussion ...

(as well as the few semi educated saloon bar experts on this forum).

Nope ....

Hmmm I don't frequent bars and have had a total of about 7 or 8 small beers this year (and haven't finished most of them. No other alcohol at all. No drugs .. no nothing. It is kind of interesting to sit back and watch how long jayboy can go on with his flames though

Pointing out that Thaksin via his lawyers has tried to bribe the court (bribery charges dropped since the bribe wasn't taken? but the 6 month jail terms for contempt of court stood!; seems to have made jayboy go on the personal attack. After all if you can't attack the argument then by all means attack the man!

As Robby NZ has pointed out in a post just above this.... who benefits from this? and how? Chat's aide that shot the video is on the run --- for basically harmless video. The first batch just didn't amount to anything other than a series of massive breaches of protocol and law that make the guy guilty of various crimes with severe penalties. Maybe justice Chat upset his aide on some personal matter? If so then why target the Dems and the other justices? Oh wait .......

He was paid. By Whom? Thaksin! Directly? Who knows! Did Jatuporn shoot his mouth off in advance of it? Yes. Does that tell even the dimmest of bulbs WHY the aide shot the video? Yes. The only one to see any benefit from this is the guy that I suggest is responsible. Who else has both the cash AND the motive AND the connections to the pre-informed Jatuporn? Does MP Jatuporn need this too? Absolutely! After his performances on stage and the outstanding charges against him that he is currently out on bail from due to his parliamentary immunity, his only chance of redemption and not rotting away in a jail is if he can get Thaksin back and immunity from prosecution.

But back to my friend Jayboy ..... I eagerly await the next attempted character assassination attempt ... that will be as equally edifying as his last couple ... 100% wrong and not addressing any point made.

[jayboy]

But back to my friend Jayboy ..... I eagerly await the next attempted character assassination attempt ... that will be as equally edifying as his last couple ... 100% wrong and not addressing any point made.

Forget about me.I'm certainly not interested in you personally or your character.You have a hysterical and slightly absurd obsession with Thaksin (like Mr Dick with King Charles' head in David Copperfield) but it doesn't need me to point that out.

Consider further the quote from Tulsie in The Nation

"The public is not so eager to know who shot the clips or who paid him or her to do so. The bigger question on everybody's mind is whether the Constitution Court is still an institution we can trust."

That's the real point isn't it?

[Robby nz]

Consider further the quote from Tulsie in The Nation

Arnt you one of those who has a go at the Nation as being terrible journalism?

"The public is not so eager to know who shot the clips or who paid him or her to do so. The bigger question on everybody's mind is whether the Constitution Court is still an institution we can trust."

Whether thats true or not has little relivence, and incidentaly "The public and everybody" is a pretty big generalisation dont you think?

Whe big question, as I asked before, is "WHY" at this point would anyone want to discredit the court?

And the WHO obviously follows on from there.

[jayboy]

Whe big question, as I asked before, is "WHY" at this point would anyone want to discredit the court?

The trouble is that's not the big question except in the fevered imagination of the "Thaksin is the root of all evil" brigade.

The real question is of course whether the court is discredited by its own actions or not.I agree that once this question is settled, it's legitimate to enquire whether corruption was involved or not but the critical path demands an answer to the former issue first.

Yes I tend to think Tulsie is barking mad but even a broken clock shows the right time twice a day.

[Robby nz]

The real question is of course whether the court is discredited by its own actions or not

Hardly by the courts own actions.

There is one (vanished) secratery who has apparantly set out, probably with the encouragment of someone who would benefit, to discredit the court on one particular issue, the case against the Dems.

It does not look like said Sec was ordered by any of the judges to set up any of the meetings or that he passed on any of what took place at those meetings to any of the judges.

So therefore his motives must have been to discredit the court and the judgment they make in the Dems case.

Its hardly likely he would do this without some large incentive, cash or otherwise for he obviously knew he would at the very least lose his job and likely become a fugitive from the law.

Also I have seen nothing to suggest that the court has been corrupted on any other issue.

So therefore the WHY, in this particular case, and of course the WHO, the backer(s), are what matters.

[jayboy]

Hardly by the courts own actions.

By repeating yourself nothing is added I'm afraid.

Rational people query why the efforts of the Court are focused on pursuing the whistle blower, while keeping silent about the alleged misconduct.

It's as simple as that.The question of any involvement by outside parties can certainly be followed up but to all but a few obsessives that's a secondary matter.

The Bangkok Post makes all this very clear in its editorial today.

[hammered]

Basically there is a scorched earth power struggle going on with everyone trying to utterly discredit everyone else and every party, person or institution (excepting one) aligned or seen as aligned with one group or another is being seen as fair game and attacked.

Right now the executive, legislature, judiciary, and every political party of note are seen as tainted by at least a large minority, and the police by just about everyone. The only institution that has managed a sudden and rather dramatic turnaround has been the army which has been dramatically at the forefront of the flood relief as pointed out in an article by the resident military expert in the unmentionable news source today. Whether that remains the case remains to be seen, but when those guys are held in higher esteem than any of the other players and are seen as just about the only group that can actually do anything it usually has political implications.

[Robby nz]

Seems this whole thing is getting off track.

If we go back to the origional motive for the whole thing we see that it was not an attempt to discredit the court as such but in fact an attempt to show that the Dems were illegaly approaching a court exec in an attempt to influance a case under consideration.

That being the case it was, is, the Dems who are being directly targeted and not the court.

Although any verdict of the court would have also been put into question.

The slur on the court began when the Sec in question ran away.

For the scheme to work the Sec would have had to leap up on his hind legs and yell "Look what these lawyers for the defendant are doing. They are trying to influance the court through me in order to get a favourable verdict, and I have proof"

To do that would have mede him the good guy and the Dems the villans and they would have had to prove that was not the case.

But in 'shooting through' he has cast doubts on the integrity of everybody, and proved his own lack thereof.

Someone has miscalculated, wonder if a firm of lawyers headed by a gent with the initials R A had any input?

[jayboy]

Someone has miscalculated, wonder if a firm of lawyers headed by a gent with the initials R A had any input?

Beyond parody.The bizarre part is he seems to have no sense of how ridiculous he sounds.

[animatic]

Basically there is a scorched earth power struggle going on with everyone trying to utterly discredit everyone else and every party, person or institution (excepting one) aligned or seen as aligned with one group or another is being seen as fair game and attacked.

Right now the executive, legislature, judiciary, and every political party of note are seen as tainted by at least a large minority, and the police by just about everyone. The only institution that has managed a sudden and rather dramatic turnaround has been the army which has been dramatically at the forefront of the flood relief as pointed out in an article by the resident military expert in the unmentionable news source today. Whether that remains the case remains to be seen, but when those guys are held in higher esteem than any of the other players and are seen as just about the only group that can actually do anything it usually has political implications.

Agreed.

A well made point without any hints of character assignation of other posters.

I await the usual attempts to impugn Hammered, that should be along shortly.

They won't do any good, but distraction is the big aim here anyway.

Forget the argument and attack the person who has a divergent idea.

Childishness dress up like it is an adult argument.

Hammered you keep posting your logical ideas

and let the attacks run off like the thin water they are.

Edited November 4, 2010 by animatic

[jdinasia]

Someone has miscalculated, wonder if a firm of lawyers headed by a gent with the initials R A had any input?

Beyond parody.The bizarre part is he seems to have no sense of how ridiculous he sounds.

And again a personal attack .... it continues unabated.

[jdinasia]

But back to my friend Jayboy ..... I eagerly await the next attempted character assassination attempt ... that will be as equally edifying as his last couple ... 100% wrong and not addressing any point made.

Forget about me.I'm certainly not interested in you personally or your character.You have a hysterical and slightly absurd obsession with Thaksin (like Mr Dick with King Charles' head in David Copperfield) but it doesn't need me to point that out.

Consider further the quote from Tulsie in The Nation

"The public is not so eager to know who shot the clips or who paid him or her to do so. The bigger question on everybody's mind is whether the Constitution Court is still an institution we can trust."

That's the real point isn't it?

You have a hysterical and slightly absurd obsession with Thaksin

--- yet another untrue characterization and personal attack. The FACT that his (Thaksin's) lawyers have in the past been convicted and served time for contempt of court is damning. Your unwillingness to look at, and address this fact suggests things to people that your bias is certainly as strong as mine.

That is the question, yes ...... and it can be answered by showing collusion on the part of Thaksin and his gang as instigators of the illegal recordings or not. As far as I know there isn't a person named Tulsie, but his opinion in an editorial is just that ... an opinion, Sometimes I agree with his opinions and sometimes I don't. You repeating HIS opinion repeatedly as if it were fact, seems a bit similar to the way you characterize other posters in this thread.

[Robby nz]

Someone has miscalculated, wonder if a firm of lawyers headed by a gent with the initials R A had any input?

Beyond parody.The bizarre part is he seems to have no sense of how ridiculous he sounds.

I take it by your response, such as it is , that you dont believe this whole thing was set up be anyone.

Just the good intentioned actions of a concerned court official.

Even with K Jutaporn coming out with "more to come" statements it doesnt cross your mind that that certain parties who you appear to support could possibly be behind the whole thing?

[canuckamuck]

The judges are corrupt, it doesn't matter if Jack the Ripper was the one who got the evidence. Why not deal with the reality that they got to go. Being a corrupt judge should be a hangin offense.

[animatic]

Admitting that 'it is 'possibly any kind of a set up', which is the logical conclusion,

would be admitting that one side is very much wrong, in methods,

and moral stance to winning power, and that if you support that side,

then distracting from comments taking that side to task, is the only option.

It also makes clear the moral stance of those agreeing that these are viable methods.

Regardless of what the judges may say in private, or ostensibly private conversations

the taping of those conversations and manipulation of them for political gain,

does not stand as grounds for their validation as correct assesments.

Considering TRT/PPP/PTP typical nepotism levels it is rather more than ironic

that they are trying to take the court to task for hiring their friends.

Most people prefer hiring those they like vs hiring enemies.

Because the PTP proffered cases against the Dems are so weak

they have little option as to how to politically massage the coming verdicts.

One of the few is to take every possible step to discredit the entire court system

BEFORE the verdicts. They they can scream the COURTS are tainted,

without breaking the law of saying that the verdicts are tainted.

And most specifically those courts that ;

a ) have ' harmed Thaksins interests'

b ) have been hardest to sway in practice in the past.

There has been several years to formulate stratagies against those courts,

and placing a ringer inside their ranks looking for opportunities to do harm to them

when the time came to act, would seem a very prudent method for least money

to create the greatest harm and sow the greatest distrust.

[animatic]

The judges are corrupt, it doesn't matter if Jack the Ripper was the one who got the evidence. Why not deal with the reality that they got to go. Being a corrupt judge should be a hangin offense.

Ah, but being a 100% honest judge can be a shooting offense in Thailand.

[cdnvic]

Inflammatory post removed. More will result in harsher action.

[whybother]

The judges are corrupt, it doesn't matter if Jack the Ripper was the one who got the evidence. Why not deal with the reality that they got to go. Being a corrupt judge should be a hangin offense.

That would be a good idea. Adjourn the case until a completely non-corrupt judge can be found.

[SkyHigh]

I wonder what's wrong with anti-Thaksin camp. When they figure out PTP/Reds problably benifit from this, they endlessly blame 'illegal action'.

They dont even know who set up the whole scene. Content in these clips even suggest it's possible there will be more, a lot more.

Now. If you think these judges absolutely right. So rightous that they dont need to explain or take any liable responsibility.

Why keep defending ? Jail the guy who made the tape and all should done. People are happy, case resolved ?

No.

The truth is this scandal is outrageous to the public. It proves that there is an extreme bias among court members. And it shows thoroughly 'double standard' does exist.

Most of the people could care less about PTP. You can dissolve this party once again. But it will NOT bring back respect & trust these judges once held.

They dont care whoever made the tape. They saw the clips and they suddenly - clearly - knew the system was badly corrupted.

[animatic]

The truth is the scandal is outrageous to SOME segments of the public,

and not all of them for the same reasons. Often the opposite reasons.

Most of the public just thinks it's political business as usual, and that itself

is what's scandalous to them.

The only ones to benefit from discrediting the court will be those doing the

attempts at discrediting. For the Dems if this was their game, just showing them

quietly to the Judges would have been enough. But that's not who has been

trumpeting these videos. Slowly salting them out sequentially as the court

decision nears, is purely political showmanship.

How they came up with these videos is quite germain to the discussion,

and the validity of these videos.

Edited November 4, 2010 by animatic

[Piengrudee]

Have you seen the latest clip last night. Head that it is already blocked. Anyone have the link?

[gymboy33]

its getting rather cruel the way their releasing different clips bit by bit..

Just as one clip is fading a way a little bit,,another clip pops up..

Its like a form of chinese torture!!

do you think their keeping the jucier bits for the latter stages..

[Piengrudee]

I don't know why ICT bother block this clip คำสารภาพคนโกงข้อสอบ (translated as the confession of the exam cheaters) by ohmygod3009. A normal person with the normal ability to do youtube search will find that various people have re-posted the same clip in you tube already. It has bloom like a mushroom. The more ICT block it, more & more people overseas will post it. . . . . . . Just like trying to ban a book/movie/song, will end up promoting it. Remember "One night in Bangkok", "The King and I", "The Satanic Verses", "Kama Sutra", etc?