Can I Cut The Salary For An Employee?

[ayayay]

Can i cut the salary for an employee that is taking leave?

If my employee has taken two days off this month (we only work Monday to Friday) and his salary is 8500 THB a month, can i cut his salary with 772 THB?

My calculation is 22 days of work in November. 8500/22 = 386 for one day. Two days off means 772 THB.

Am I allowed to do that according to the thai law?

[jdinasia]

I think you will need to give some more specifics.

Is it sick leave? Then no.

[dave111223]

If our employees take days off then the days are cut from any available holiday days that they have.

If they don't have any holiday days left then we would cut the salary as you described. We have never had a problem with this as employees have always considered this fair (this is Thailand...why would you get paid for not coming to work..)

We don't differentiate between "sick" and "holiday". Obviously if a serious illness arises we'd consider this on a case by case.

[2008bangkok]

Thai Law says 30 days sick leave per year..

Kind of stingy to dock someone 772 baht when they only get 8500 anyway,...give the man a break

Edited November 26, 2010 by 2008bangkok

[onnut]

Thai Law says 30 days sick leave per year..

Kind of stingy to dock someone 772 baht when they only get 8500 anyway,...give the man a break

That's right, then he will take the piss and take more time off coz he will get paid anyway.

If he asked for holiday then should be paid if holidays are left. If he just took the days off without permission then dock his salary.

If his holidays are used up then dock his salary also.

Edited November 26, 2010 by onnut

[jdinasia]

If our employees take days off then the days are cut from any available holiday days that they have.

If they don't have any holiday days left then we would cut the salary as you described. We have never had a problem with this as employees have always considered this fair (this is Thailand...why would you get paid for not coming to work..)

We don't differentiate between "sick" and "holiday". Obviously if a serious illness arises we'd consider this on a case by case.

If you do not differentiate between sick days and holidays you are quite likely in breach of Thai labor law.

[ayayay]

Thai Law says 30 days sick leave per year..

Kind of stingy to dock someone 772 baht when they only get 8500 anyway,...give the man a break

Problem is when you have more than one person working for you, and the other ones who have a higher salary, would you then also give them holidays every now and then? If not, it would be unfair to the other employees. Following your strategy it would mean, the less you earn, the more holidays you can expect?

Edited November 26, 2010 by ayayay

[ayayay]

I think you will need to give some more specifics.

Is it sick leave? Then no.

It is not sick leave.

They still get the regular 30 days sick leave, plus all the regular holidays, plus 2 weeks paid christmas holiday, even though thais do not celebrate christmas. And they only work 5 days a week.

[ayayay]

If our employees take days off then the days are cut from any available holiday days that they have.

If they don't have any holiday days left then we would cut the salary as you described. We have never had a problem with this as employees have always considered this fair (this is Thailand...why would you get paid for not coming to work..)

We don't differentiate between "sick" and "holiday". Obviously if a serious illness arises we'd consider this on a case by case.

Interesting, well my employees get the usual 30 days sick leave (which i think is a lot as it is), plus the regular thai public holidays, and they never work on Saturdays, plus two weeks paid holiday during christmas, even though thais do not celebrate christmas.

That is why I am a little concerned, I think I give them a lot of holidays as it is, should they then on top of that also get random days off without losing anything?

[ayayay]

Thai Law says 30 days sick leave per year..

Kind of stingy to dock someone 772 baht when they only get 8500 anyway,...give the man a break

That's right, then he will take the piss and take more time off coz he will get paid anyway.

If he asked for holiday then should be paid if holidays are left. If he just took the days off without permission then dock his salary.

If his holidays are used up then dock his salary also.

Yes, this sounds reasonable to me, but I would like to know if anyone knows if this is according to the law, or not.

[stenfred]

Interesting, well my employees get the usual 30 days sick leave (which i think is a lot as it is), plus the regular thai public holidays, and they never work on Saturdays, plus two weeks paid holiday during christmas, even though thais do not celebrate christmas.

That is why I am a little concerned, I think I give them a lot of holidays as it is, should they then on top of that also get random days off without losing anything?

Are you taking the piss, mate? Of course you dock their pay if they are absent without leave.

EOD

[Spoonman]

Sounds to me like your staff need to learn to ring in sick when they need a day off, Isn't that what sick days are for ??

Edited November 26, 2010 by Spoonman

[onnut]

Thai Law says 30 days sick leave per year..

Kind of stingy to dock someone 772 baht when they only get 8500 anyway,...give the man a break

That's right, then he will take the piss and take more time off coz he will get paid anyway.

If he asked for holiday then should be paid if holidays are left. If he just took the days off without permission then dock his salary.

If his holidays are used up then dock his salary also.

Yes, this sounds reasonable to me, but I would like to know if anyone knows if this is according to the law, or not.

Yes it is. I have had over 100 staff under my management for 6 years. only twice was I called up to labour court and only one time I had to pay out. that was the first time. I have learnt a lot over the years and not had any problems since.

if they do not turn up and were suposed to then do not pay. the law is on your side.

if they have holiday days left and dont turn up when they were suposed to, then dont pay. they didnt get written agreement that they can have leave.

if they do not turn up for 3 days in a row without consent, fire them. the law is on your side.

Be firm but fair and you will have less problems.

I used to have an agreement with the staff. if they wanted extra days off they had to give 3 days notice for this minimum. and I would pay them or swap shifts with other staff. but no notice, no money, plus a warning to boot. it will stop straight away.

Edited November 26, 2010 by onnut

[jdinasia]

If your employees are using the 30 days .. then you dock them. if you know they are not sick and do not have holiday time coming you can dock them. If they are taking the piss enough to use all their sick days and do not have a major illness, fire them for some other (reasonable) cause. Sick days are NOT personal days.

We give personal time off without docking employees IF they are decent employees not soaking us for every sniffle.

Your point about 2 weeks at Christmas ... WHY? (you do not have to give 2 weeks AND it really should be at a time that works for your employees if it does not make work impossible.) If you have more than 10 employees you are required to have an employe handbook.

Thai labor law is what matters here. It is available in English online.

[2008bangkok]

I think you will need to give some more specifics.

Is it sick leave? Then no.

It is not sick leave.

They still get the regular 30 days sick leave, plus all the regular holidays, plus 2 weeks paid christmas holiday, even though thais do not celebrate christmas. And they only work 5 days a week.

Ill retract my statement

If it isnt sick leave then and just a random i cant be arsed to go into work and i wont phone anybody day off then yes cut them and a warning

[dave111223]

If our employees take days off then the days are cut from any available holiday days that they have.

If they don't have any holiday days left then we would cut the salary as you described. We have never had a problem with this as employees have always considered this fair (this is Thailand...why would you get paid for not coming to work..)

We don't differentiate between "sick" and "holiday". Obviously if a serious illness arises we'd consider this on a case by case.

Interesting, well my employees get the usual 30 days sick leave (which i think is a lot as it is), plus the regular thai public holidays, and they never work on Saturdays, plus two weeks paid holiday during christmas, even though thais do not celebrate christmas.

That is why I am a little concerned, I think I give them a lot of holidays as it is, should they then on top of that also get random days off without losing anything?

Only 5 days per week + 30 days of sick leave + 2 weeks paid holiday + public holidays! You're employees must be having a right laugh, if i had people on that kind of setup and they didn't show up to work they'd be looking for a new job immediately!

Sound like they are on the "he doesn't know he's in Thailand expat owner package"?

Edited November 26, 2010 by dave111223

[chainarong]

Ya old scrooge.

[onnut]

Ya old scrooge.

You wont last long in business if you let your staff control everything! you have to have rules and they need to know what happens if they break them.

I think his staff are lucky.

two days off every week

two weeks off at Christmas

on top of that, 30 days sick leave, by law

so many days personal business leave, I think 2 by law. Cant remember now.

and the typical Thai Buddha Holidays.

His staff are not working much really. so if they want extra they should get docked for it.

[chainarong]

Ya old scrooge.

You wont last long in business if you let your staff control everything! you have to have rules and they need to know what happens if they break them.

I think his staff are lucky.

two days off every week

two weeks off at Christmas

on top of that, 30 days sick leave, by law

so many days personal business leave, I think 2 by law. Cant remember now.

and the typical Thai Buddha Holidays.

His staff are not working much really. so if they want extra they should get docked for it.

Humbug

[ayayay]

First off, thanks for all the comments.

I am very well aware of that I give them a lot of free time compared to many other companies.

This particular employee takes about 3 days off every month (outside of the usual holidays, sick days etc) and it is not fair to the other employees and it is not fair to me and the company.

Many of you suggests that it would be ok to cut the salary if he did not show up when expected, but he always tells me a few days in advance that he will gonna take leave, but still, I think it is too much, and I would like to cut his salary, but would feel hesitant if I knew it was not common practice to do so.

Edited November 26, 2010 by ayayay

[Spoonman]

Only 5 days per week + 30 days of sick leave + 2 weeks paid holiday + public holidays! You're employees must be having a right laugh, if i had people on that kind of setup and they didn't show up to work they'd be looking for a new job immediately!

Sound like they are on the "he doesn't know he's in Thailand expat owner package"?

Must be a sucky expat position if they are only getting 2 weeks annual leave per year.

[dave111223]

This particular employee takes about 3 days off every month (outside of the usual holidays, sick days etc) and it is not fair to the other employees and it is not fair to me and the company.

Many of you suggests that it would be ok to cut the salary if he did not show up when expected, but he always tells me a few days in advance that he will gonna take leave, but still, I think it is too much, and I would like to cut his salary, but would feel hesitant if I knew it was not common practice to do so.

If he asks you to take a day off and he's already used up all his holiday why not just say "No"? Or "You can take a day off but i'm going to cut the pay for that day"

[ayayay]

This particular employee takes about 3 days off every month (outside of the usual holidays, sick days etc) and it is not fair to the other employees and it is not fair to me and the company.

Many of you suggests that it would be ok to cut the salary if he did not show up when expected, but he always tells me a few days in advance that he will gonna take leave, but still, I think it is too much, and I would like to cut his salary, but would feel hesitant if I knew it was not common practice to do so.

If he asks you to take a day off and he's already used up all his holiday why not just say "No"? Or "You can take a day off but i'm going to cut the pay for that day"

Yes, this is exactly what I want to do, that is why I ask if I can do it, from a legal point of view, or/and if it is common practice by others to do so.

So in summary, I get the idea that it seems to be ok to cut the salary if he does not show up without saying anything, this is however not a problem, he always tells me in advance that he will take leave, so know we just need to know, if I can tell him that I will cut his salary if he takes leave.

[onnut]

Yes, this is exactly what I want to do, that is why I ask if I can do it, from a legal point of view, or/and if it is common practice by others to do so.

So in summary, I get the idea that it seems to be ok to cut the salary if he does not show up without saying anything, this is however not a problem, he always tells me in advance that he will take leave, so know we just need to know, if I can tell him that I will cut his salary if he takes leave.

If he has no holiday days left and if he has used up his personal business days which you get 2 by law I think. Then you can cut his salary.

You will have to tell him before you cut it though and why.

[chainarong]

This particular employee takes about 3 days off every month (outside of the usual holidays, sick days etc) and it is not fair to the other employees and it is not fair to me and the company.

Many of you suggests that it would be ok to cut the salary if he did not show up when expected, but he always tells me a few days in advance that he will gonna take leave, but still, I think it is too much, and I would like to cut his salary, but would feel hesitant if I knew it was not common practice to do so.

If he asks you to take a day off and he's already used up all his holiday why not just say "No"? Or "You can take a day off but i'm going to cut the pay for that day"

Yes, this is exactly what I want to do, that is why I ask if I can do it, from a legal point of view, or/and if it is common practice by others to do so.

So in summary, I get the idea that it seems to be ok to cut the salary if he does not show up without saying anything, this is however not a problem, he always tells me in advance that he will take leave, so know we just need to know, if I can tell him that I will cut his salary if he takes leave.

If the employee is not on AL or sick leave then any days off whether he advise he will be off or not, is without pay, no work no pay.