Fill In The Blank "Exceptionalism" -- Do You Believe In Your Home Country'S Exceptionalism?

[Jingthing]

Wiki definition of American exceptionalism. Do you feel your home country is similarly exceptional?

American exceptionalism refers to the opinion that the United States is qualitatively different from other nations. Its exceptionalism stems from its emergence from a revolution, becoming "the first new nation",[1] and developing a unique American ideology, based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, populism and laissez-faire". This observation can be traced to Alexis de Tocqueville, the first writer to describe the United States as "exceptional". Although the term does not imply superiority, some writers have used it in that sense.[1] To them, the United States is a "shining city on a hill", and exempt from historical forces that have affected other countries.

In the US now, "American exceptionalism" has become a big political issue. Generally the right wing believes in it, and the left doesn't. Basically, exceptionalism means you feel your country is so special that it doesn't fall under the same rules and standards as other countries in the world. It is very different than basic patriotism and love of country.

So, in the context of farang pub with so many nationalities here, I thought it would be interesting to see how the different nationalities felt about their own countries exceptionalism. Is this mostly an American thing, a big power thing, or not?

Sorry there are only ten countries to choose from. Preference given to English speaking countries and many major countries left out. The poll is for discussion and entertainment purposes only and not meant to include every country in the world. Nothing personal if yours didn't make the list.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/11/28/AR2010112804139.html

Edited November 29, 2010 by Jingthing

[GooEng]

as an obvious oversight, you have forgotten to include scotland on you list. i forgive you.

have a browse of this list of scottish inventions :

1. TELEVISION - John Logie Baird (1888-1946), Helensburgh, Scotland:

2. TELEPHONE Alexander Graham Bell (1847-1922), Edinburgh, Scotland.

3. IMPROVEMENTS TO THE STEAM ENGINE- James Watt (17361819), Greenock, Scotland.

4. PENICILLIN Sir Alexander Fleming (1881-1955), Lochfield farm near Darvel in East Ayrshire, Scotland.

5. THE PEDAL BICYCLE Kirkpatrick Macmillan (1813-1878), Thornhill, Dumfriesshire, Scotland.

6. FIRST WORKABLE RADAR SYSTEM Sir Robert Alexander Watson-Watt, a descendant of James Watt, (1892-1973) Brechin, Scotland.

7. ADHESIVE STAMPS and POSTMARK John Chalmers (1782-1853), Arbroath, Scotland.

8. INSULIN John James Richard MacLeod (18761935) of Clunie, Perth and Kinross, Scotland.

9. TARMACADAM (TARMAC) ROADS John Loudon Macadam (1736-1856) Ayr, Scotland.

10. THE U.S. NAVY John Paul Jones (1747-1782) Kirkcudbright (Kirkoodbree), Scotland.

11. WHISKY Derived from Gaelic word for water, and given its full title of uisge-beatha Water of Life.

12. THE PNEUMATIC TYRE John Boyd Dunlop (1840-1921), Dreghorn, Scotland.

13. BRIDGE DESIGN Sir William Arrol (1838-1913) Houston, Renfrewshire, Scotland; Thomas Telford (1757-1834) Westerkirk, Scotland; & John Rennie (1761-1821) East Linton, Scotland.

14. PIONEERING THE USE OF ANTISEPTICS Joseph Lister (1827-1912) Edinburgh, Scotland

15. CHLOROFORM, AN ANAESTHETIC discovered by Sir James Young Simpson of Bathgate, Scotland.

16. LIGHTHOUSE DESIGN Robert Stevenson (1772-1850)

17. THE ULTRASOUND SCANNER Ian Donald (1910-1987)

18. BANK OF ENGLAND founded by William Paterson of Dumfries, Scotland

19. GOLF circa. 1100

20. FOOTBALL The first known rules of the game were published in Scotland. Edinburgh was home to the worlds first club The Edinburgh Foot Ball Club.

21. BASKETBALL James A. Naismith (1861-1939) Although its origins hail from Canada, his parents were both emigrants. Guess where from?

22. THE FOUNTAIN PEN Robert Thomson (1822-1873)

23. THE MRI BODY SCANNER John Mallard in 1980

24. THE BREECH-LOADING RIFLE Captain Patrick Ferguson of Pitfours, Scotland.

happy st. andrews day everyone!!

Edited November 30, 2010 by joe ekkamai

[smokie36]

[StreetCowboy]

90% of Scots think that their country is the best in the world, and 15% would be prepared to live there, if necessary

SC

And a happy St Andrew's Day to you all.

I don't think that JT meant any offence in his omission, even on our patron saint's day

'There is no slight so light of spite as not to blight the sight of a good Scots man'

Edited November 30, 2010 by StreetCowboy

[smokie36]

90% of Scots think that their country is the best in the world, and 15% would be prepared to live there, if necessary

SC

And a happy St Andrew's Day to you all.

I don't think that JT meant any offence in his omission, even on our patron saint's day

'There is no slight so light of spite as not to blight the sight of a good Scots man'

Very true....I'm sure JT will take it in the spirit it was intended......and enjoy a wee dram and toast to all our achievements.

For me It'll be a hot toddy or two later.....at minus whatever here and got the sniffles....

[StreetCowboy]

90% of Scots think that their country is the best in the world, and 15% would be prepared to live there, if necessary

SC

And a happy St Andrew's Day to you all.

I don't think that JT meant any offence in his omission, even on our patron saint's day

'There is no slight so light of spite as not to blight the sight of a good Scots man'

Very true....I'm sure JT will take it in the spirit it was intended......and enjoy a wee dram and toast to all our achievements.

For me It'll be a hot toddy or two later.....at minus whatever here and got the sniffles....

IS that you whinging about being in the 15% again?

My wee boy was complaining about missing the snow again. I didn't have the heart to tell him that his grandfather had had to dig the car out, and that my dear old mother still couldn't get her car onto the drive of her new house because the snow came down as soon as the blacktop (sorry, tarmacadam) was laid ...

I laughed watching the rugby from Pittoddrie, seeing the ball just sat in the snow on the roof of the stand, though it seemed just spiteful to invite the Samoans to play there...

SC

[Jingthing]

Scotland, eh? Well, I must say it did cross my mind. However, I did say preference was given to English speaking countries ...

Edited November 30, 2010 by Jingthing

[StreetCowboy]

Scotland, eh? Well, I must say it did cross my mind. However, I did say preference was given to English speaking countries ...

fit'ytryintaesaewhacannaespeekinglishjimmy?

ananaurhing,yed'aeneedtae...achtacannaebebothertkenwhitameenanatjimmy

SC

[Ulysses G.]

In the US now, "American exceptionalism" has become a big political issue. Generally the right wing believes in it, and the left doesn't. Basically, exceptionalism means you feel your country is so special that it doesn't fall under the same rules and standards as other countries in the world. It is very different than basic patriotism and love of country.

This sounds like your personal definition. Here is a quite different one.

American exceptionalism refers to the opinion that the United States is qualitatively different from other nations. Its exceptionalism stems from its emergence from a revolution, becoming "the first new nation",^[1] and developing a unique American ideology, based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, populism and laissez-faire". This observation can be traced to Alexis de Tocqueville, the first writer to describe the United States as "exceptional". Although the term does not imply superiority, some writers have used it in that sense.^[1] To them, the United States is a "shining city on a hill", and exempt from historical forces that have affected other countries.^[2]

In the 1960s "postnationalist" scholars rejected American exceptionalism, arguing that the United States had not broken from European history, and had retained class inequities, imperialism and war. Furthermore, they saw every nation as subscribing to some form of exceptionalism.^{[3]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism}

[Jingthing]

In the US now, "American exceptionalism" has become a big political issue. Generally the right wing believes in it, and the left doesn't. Basically, exceptionalism means you feel your country is so special that it doesn't fall under the same rules and standards as other countries in the world. It is very different than basic patriotism and love of country.

This sounds like your personal definition. Here is a quite different one.

American exceptionalism refers to the opinion that the United States is qualitatively different from other nations. Its exceptionalism stems from its emergence from a revolution, becoming "the first new nation",^[1] and developing a unique American ideology, based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, populism and laissez-faire". This observation can be traced to Alexis de Tocqueville, the first writer to describe the United States as "exceptional". Although the term does not imply superiority, some writers have used it in that sense.^[1] To them, the United States is a "shining city on a hill", and exempt from historical forces that have affected other countries.^[2]

In the 1960s "postnationalist" scholars rejected American exceptionalism, arguing that the United States had not broken from European history, and had retained class inequities, imperialism and war. Furthermore, they saw every nation as subscribing to some form of exceptionalism.^{[3]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism}

Fine UG, I was trying to boil it down, and yes, they were my own words, so sue me.

Here is a good example of the strangeness of exceptionalism, American style.

Believers in American exceptionalism tend to assert goofy things like -- America has the best health care system in the world!

Actually, they have a strong tendency to believe America is the best in EVERYTHING. Now that really would be exceptional.

Exceptionalism non-believers consult the more OBJECTIVE World Health Organization ratings which rates the system at 37th in the world of 191 countries rated.

Edited November 30, 2010 by Jingthing

[naboo]

fit'ytryintaesaewhacannaespeekinglishjimmy?

ananaurhing,yed'aeneedtae...achtacannaebebothertkenwhitameenanatjimmy

Worryingly, I understood that more easily than I understand some people from England.

[Ulysses G.]

Exceptionalism non-believers consult the more OBJECTIVE World Health Organization ratings which rates the system at 37th in the world of 191 countries rated.

Why do people fly in from all over the world to use the 37th best health system in the world? Probably because the US has a great health system if one has the money to pay for it.

[StreetCowboy]

Exceptionalism non-believers consult the more OBJECTIVE World Health Organization ratings which rates the system at 37th in the world of 191 countries rated.

Why do people fly in from all over the world to use the 37th best health system in the world? Probably because the US has a great health system if one has the money to pay for it.

I think you meant to post in this thread...

http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__4046060

SC

[smokie36]

90% of Scots think that their country is the best in the world, and 15% would be prepared to live there, if necessary

SC

And a happy St Andrew's Day to you all.

I don't think that JT meant any offence in his omission, even on our patron saint's day

'There is no slight so light of spite as not to blight the sight of a good Scots man'

Very true....I'm sure JT will take it in the spirit it was intended......and enjoy a wee dram and toast to all our achievements.

For me It'll be a hot toddy or two later.....at minus whatever here and got the sniffles....

IS that you whinging about being in the 15% again?

My wee boy was complaining about missing the snow again. I didn't have the heart to tell him that his grandfather had had to dig the car out, and that my dear old mother still couldn't get her car onto the drive of her new house because the snow came down as soon as the blacktop (sorry, tarmacadam) was laid ...

I laughed watching the rugby from Pittoddrie, seeing the ball just sat in the snow on the roof of the stand, though it seemed just spiteful to invite the Samoans to play there...

SC

You could reverse the figures from May to September when I wouldn't really want to live anywhere else. Yeah my family in Oz have been saying they miss the snow....I love it myself for the first couple of days...then it gets icy....then slush......hmmm and the sense of losing a good friend when my snowman melts......

I need to get out more.....Its a cry for help or what I have no idea.

Anyway there's nothing exceptional about it. Are we talking exceptional individuals or as a collective group...ie as a country?

[smokie36]

90% of Scots think that their country is the best in the world, and 15% would be prepared to live there, if necessary

SC

And a happy St Andrew's Day to you all.

I don't think that JT meant any offence in his omission, even on our patron saint's day

'There is no slight so light of spite as not to blight the sight of a good Scots man'

Very true....I'm sure JT will take it in the spirit it was intended......and enjoy a wee dram and toast to all our achievements.

For me It'll be a hot toddy or two later.....at minus whatever here and got the sniffles....

IS that you whinging about being in the 15% again?

My wee boy was complaining about missing the snow again. I didn't have the heart to tell him that his grandfather had had to dig the car out, and that my dear old mother still couldn't get her car onto the drive of her new house because the snow came down as soon as the blacktop (sorry, tarmacadam) was laid ...

I laughed watching the rugby from Pittoddrie, seeing the ball just sat in the snow on the roof of the stand, though it seemed just spiteful to invite the Samoans to play there...

SC

You could reverse the figures from May to September when I wouldn't really want to live anywhere else. Yeah my family in Oz have been saying they miss the snow....I love it myself for the first couple of days...then it gets icy....then slush......hmmm and the sense of losing a good friend when my snowman melts......

I need to get out more.....Its a cry for help or what I have no idea.

Anyway there's nothing exceptional about it. Are we talking exceptional individuals or as a collective group...ie as a country?

For exceptional people to me doesn't matter quite so much the quirk of birth but their drive and determination to succeed....can't think of any country as such encourages this more than others.....some far less for sure...

[doggie888888]

It's another way of saying "oh, we think we are the best according to us because we happen to have been rather successful, so therefore we have a god given right to push our values on everyone else, whether they want it or not".

Sure, by all means think of your own countries as exceptional but to then use it as a pre-text to justify own self interest globally is frightening. It only takes 2 powerful countries, who each think themselves exceptional and thus need not compromise with anyone else, to start a war. It's like one country saying God gave us the right to be No1 and another saying God said we ought to fight for our cause (familiar??) ...so each will fight till there is nothing left for anyone.

Besides, if one goes back further in time, there has been various exceptional civilisations (Greek, Roman, Chinese, Ottoman etc) but each surrendered their eminent positions to newcomers either through wars or internal decay. Who is to say American exceptionalism is not just another accident of events that will merely disappear into history once the next newcomer comes along? I only hope it will not take a world war for extremist Americans (who justify current US status either as a god given right or as a right by way of its "exceptionalism") to force a passing (or sharing) of the baton to the next superpower. Maybe the decline of American exceptionalism will be gradual as it loses its economic might and the result of being drained by recent wars. Or maybe they will resort to all kinds of tactics (legal and illegal, ethical and unethical) to prolong a slow death, rather than to willingly accept their cause is not so exceptional after all and that it is time for someone else to shine, as has happened in history many times before? Who knows, only time will tell.

[Ulysses G.]

Who knows, only time will tell.

Well said! You should have left it at that.

[StreetCowboy]

Who knows, only time will tell.

Well said! You should have left it at that.

I think, as the oldest surviving democracy, the Isle of Man is exceptional, and that should give it certain rights and privileges, but surprisingly

a) it was not on JT's list

Her Majesty's Revenue and Excise officers think differently

SC

[smokie36]

Who knows, only time will tell.

Well said! You should have left it at that.

I think, as the oldest surviving democracy, the Isle of Man is exceptional, and that should give it certain rights and privileges, but surprisingly

a) it was not on JT's list

Her Majesty's Revenue and Excise officers think differently

SC

I liked the statue of Norman Wisdom....and there's a decent real ale pub.....let's leave it at that.

[StreetCowboy]

Who knows, only time will tell.

Well said! You should have left it at that.

I think, as the oldest surviving democracy, the Isle of Man is exceptional, and that should give it certain rights and privileges, but surprisingly

a) it was not on JT's list

Her Majesty's Revenue and Excise officers think differently

SC

I liked the statue of Norman Wisdom....and there's a decent real ale pub.....let's leave it at that.

As a convenient gambling and tax haven, it (the Isle of Man) has a unique right to stage road races, alongside Monaco and Macau.

I understand that Singapore is considering introducing special tax laws for the Marina district, in order to give their GP more credibility.

SC

[smokie36]

I prefer Jersey.....even though the taxes are slightly higher......the TT races are a week's worth of fun.....try visiting in the off season......has the feel of Bootle by the beach....but with less crime I suppose....

[bkk_mike]

as an obvious oversight, you have forgotten to include scotland on you list. i forgive you.

have a browse of this list of scottish inventions :

1. TELEVISION - John Logie Baird (1888-1946), Helensburgh, Scotland:

2. TELEPHONE – Alexander Graham Bell (1847-1922), Edinburgh, Scotland.

3. IMPROVEMENTS TO THE STEAM ENGINE- James Watt (1736–1819), Greenock, Scotland.

4. PENICILLIN – Sir Alexander Fleming (1881-1955), Lochfield farm near Darvel in East Ayrshire, Scotland.

5. THE PEDAL BICYCLE – Kirkpatrick Macmillan (1813-1878), Thornhill, Dumfriesshire, Scotland.

6. FIRST WORKABLE RADAR SYSTEM – Sir Robert Alexander Watson-Watt, a descendant of James Watt, (1892-1973) Brechin, Scotland.

7. ADHESIVE STAMPS and POSTMARK – John Chalmers (1782-1853), Arbroath, Scotland.

8. INSULIN – John James Richard MacLeod (1876–1935) of Clunie, Perth and Kinross, Scotland.

9. TARMACADAM (TARMAC) ROADS – John Loudon Macadam (1736-1856) Ayr, Scotland.

10. THE U.S. NAVY – John Paul Jones (1747-1782) Kirkcudbright (‘Kir’kood’bree‘), Scotland.

11. WHISKY – Derived from Gaelic word for “water”, and given its full title of “uisge-beatha” Water of Life.

12. THE PNEUMATIC TYRE – John Boyd Dunlop (1840-1921), Dreghorn, Scotland.

13. BRIDGE DESIGN Sir William Arrol (1838-1913) Houston, Renfrewshire, Scotland; Thomas Telford (1757-1834) Westerkirk, Scotland; & John Rennie (1761-1821) East Linton, Scotland.

14. PIONEERING THE USE OF ANTISEPTICS – Joseph Lister (1827-1912) Edinburgh, Scotland

15. CHLOROFORM, AN ANAESTHETIC discovered by Sir James Young Simpson of Bathgate, Scotland.

16. LIGHTHOUSE DESIGN – Robert Stevenson (1772-1850)

17. THE ULTRASOUND SCANNER – Ian Donald (1910-1987)

18. BANK OF ENGLAND founded by William Paterson of Dumfries, Scotland

19. GOLF circa. 1100

20. FOOTBALL The first known rules of the game were published in Scotland. Edinburgh was home to the world’s first club The Edinburgh Foot Ball Club.

21. BASKETBALL James A. Naismith (1861-1939) Although its origins hail from Canada, his parents were both emigrants. Guess where from?

22. THE FOUNTAIN PEN Robert Thomson (1822-1873)

23. THE MRI BODY SCANNER John Mallard in 1980

24. THE BREECH-LOADING RIFLE – Captain Patrick Ferguson of Pitfours, Scotland.

happy st. andrews day everyone!!

You forgot Dolly the sheep (cloning), and the fact that Scotland was the first country in the world to introduce universal education.

i.e. I'm Scottish and believe, for it's relatively tiny populaton size, there's definitely something exceptional about Scotland. (Something in the water?)

Admittedly, I also choose not to live there...

Edited December 5, 2010 by bkk_mike

[commonparlance]

I agree with the wiki definition of exceptionalism as it applies to the United States, but I don't think that means the same thing as being an American chauvinist, which is more along the lines of how the OP defines it. It's undeniable that the US developed historically along completely different lines than other Western/industrialized nations. Every country is different, but a number of factors (its geographical isolation, formation by revolution, republican ideals, and the influence of continuous waves of immigrants, among many others) make the US truly exceptional. The debate is whether a different set of standards applies to America than to the rest of the developed world.