After 15 Years In Thailand And Going Back To The Us

[mark45y]

Good education here is expensive and for the elite. In the US, its free.

Should they not be massacred by M1 assault riffles mid-geography lesson.

Obviously never lived in or visited the US. Get a grip.

[phetaroi]

The OP said:

* "After living in Thailand I'm amazed that Thailand is actually technologically more advanced than the US, the US is lagging behind big time."

* "Shopping malls are old, movie theaters are old and smelly"

* "public transport is old, roads are cracked with pot holes"

* "food and cigarettes have risen substantially. - and since when were you allowed to 'self checkout'"

* "America has become so automated and lazy and its virtually impossible to speak to a live person over the phone if you have issues with your bank."

* "A walk through the mall or a drive down the street in the wrong part of town can literally be dangerous, in Thailand no matter how ghetto it is it still feels safer than here."

* "I'd have to say the banking system in Thailand is light years ahead of the US, ATM's on every corner, convenient locations everywhere and secure online access that is on par with US banks. Much more courteous service than Carlos would give you at the local Wells Fargo branch around here, not too mention heaps cuter even the mean ones."

* "Stepping out of my house I look around and not a taxi, tuk tuk , bus, MRT, BTS or mocye in sight"

* ".....not too mention no street food or a outdoor market i can go to pick up a quick bite."

* "I miss my mocye (motorcycle) In Thailand its just a way of life, in America you have to struggle to see even 1 bike per day. A ride through the mountains when I get the yearning as when I was living in Chiang Mai is no longer on the list, I see a guy on a Ducati once at the stoplight and say to myself "if he knew, if he only knew"....Besides I'm not sure if i would even want a bike here in the US, people drive like psychos and the speed limit is now 65-70 on Interstates. I'd probably get hit by some redneck in a lifted dodge truck while freezing my nads off during winter time."

* "I gorged on mexican food when i came back only to realize that its not really all that bad in thailand to begin with, if people in thailand would start to use the right tortillas to make enchiladas it would be 90% similar.But I have to admit the food here in the US is better, kinda strange because this applies to the Thai food also, the ingredients are of a higher grade and it is good if you know where to go get it, the Thai temples in the US are the best places not the restaurants.Beef steaks here win hands down over steaks in Thailand, should I stay in the US just for the steak? It's tempting...aint nothing like a USDA prime choice cut, nevermind the aged beef, i never liked that fact that someone let mold grow on my steak before i eat it."

* "Well I cant think of any other reasons why I would want to stay in the US any longer than i have to, the food cost more, the beer is weak, rent and real estate is too high, wages are low, public transport sucks, people are rude, theaters smell like ass, too many cops, too many mexicans,and not enough mocye's..."

Although I only lived in Thailand for about a year and a half, I recently returned, too (shortly after May 19). I don't see things the same way you do. But, I think that may be the real point here...we judge reality on what we personally see. Let me respond to the comments above:

In my view, Thailand is not more advanced technologically than here in the States. Far more people here are connected to the internet. Cable television is MUCH clearer here and with far more channels to choose from, and I can choose from one cable company or two satellite companies. I have Onstar here, nothing like that in Thailand that I'm familiar with. We're on 4G here...what's Thailand struggling with...and how do farangs feel about True?

Shopping malls old in the U.S. That very much depends on where you are. Here in Colorado Springs, that's very true' I'm not very impressed. On the other hand, when I drive up to Denver (about 60 miles away), there's at least one shopping mall that is as good or better than anything in Bangkok. And, impressive shopping malls in Thailand pretty much exist in Bangkok, and to some extent Chiang Mai.

Movie theatres. I can drive 5-10 minutes in two different directions here in Colorado Springs and be in movie complexes that are as nice as the theaters that were in Central World. And have popcorn that actually tastes good and fresh.

Public transport is old? Well, here the emphasis is on private cars, rather than mass transit. I agree that I miss the Sky Train and subway. It varies very much on a city by city basis. Not sure how you really compare. I guess if you take the two capitals, you have Bangkok's Sky Train and subway that don't serve most of the city, or you have Washington's subway that serves a greater percentage of the city. But of course, Bangkok has that wonderful mass transit line that goes up to Don Muang (ahem). The roads in America are cracked an full of potholes. Certainly true in Colorado Springs...of course, the freezing and thawing in winter weather takes it toll, while Bangkok has no such enemies of pavement. And, there an awfully lot of places in Thailand where good roads don't even exist when you get out in the boonies.

Yes, grocery store prices here are higher in the U.S. But there's a lot more selection in my local stores here than those I frequented in Bangkok. And what's wrong with self-checkout? You don't have to use it. It's an option. But perhaps you're correct...a Thai clerk telling me that I can't buy ROOT beer at certain times because it is an alcoholic beverage is certainly much better.

Yes, you're correct, the automated phone systems here in the States are maddening. Of course, I found it equally maddening that depending on which particular branch of a bank you might go to in Bangkok, you might be told that you could or could not conduct certain types of transactions. Yes, there were ATMs everywhere in Bangkok...that for no good reason ate my ATM card twice.

Yes, no street food here in the States...but I've only had food poisoning here in the States in the last 6 months...well, zero times.

You're correct, you have to be careful where you find yourself in many American cities. On the other hand, I don't expect to have to pay a cop a bribe here, either. I'd have to say that there more of a real justice system here (not that it's perfect), than in Thailand.

Okay, I can see why you like your motorcycle. But I've enjoyed taking the interstate up to Estes Park and getting off on the rural roads that go through Rocky Mountain National Park (as just one example).

Wages are low in America? Let's see...my Thai friend has two college degrees and works in the mid-level management of one of the Thai ministries. He makes less in one year than what I made in less than one month in a very comparable job.

Here's my bottom line response to your posting -- you see what you want to see. And, it sounds as if you genuinely prefer the lifestyle in Thailand. And that's fine. Perhaps that's where you should be.

But you know, I have to make one further comment that sort of relates to your post. When I moved to Thailand I wanted to maintain close to the lifestyle I had in the U.S. We had a 3 bedroom apartment down off Sukhumvit. We paid $1800 US a month. It's difficult to compare rent and mortgage, but for that $1800 a month, I had half the living space I have here in the States, the Thai apartment wasn't as nice in many aspects, it was noisier in Bangkok, well, I could go on. And, on May 19 dense black smoke billowed down our soi in Bangkok...haven't had that happen here. It's a different lifestyle...in many ways not comparable. And it just depends on what you want. Neither place is heaven on earth.

[phetaroi]

...Hawaii has one of if not THE biggest homeless population in the US...

...Sure if something is built first it will age first, but even the Thai shopping malls and every establishment which gets high volume of traffic has the good sense to renovate...

I guess i should elaborate on my view point of the Thai vs American educational system...You know what? the Universities here aren't all that bad. The mathematics sure did kick my ass, maths here are definately tougher than they are in the states, and a large majority of students are definately more dedicated than their US counterparts...Universities like Thammasat and Chula are world class, compared to the University of Houston.Probably the biggest thing that is different in Thailand than in the US is that when highschool starts, you won't have to worry about "Leroy bringin' a gat to school to bust some caps in yo' dome..."

Free enterprise...in America ? nope, Thailand is definately better. In Thailand you dont need insurance to start up a company or retail store, if the customer is stupid enough to fall down in your store, than the judge knows he's uncoordinated and probably falls anywhere... Nope not in the US, everything is regulated for this and that and you have to follow so and so code in order to abide by revision something in order to comply to sell a burger. In thailand you get a bbq grill go down to lotus and invest in your nights business of selling charbroiled chicken, and you are in business as soon as you find a good street corner - free enterprise? America is just an illusion...

Yes, homelessness in America is a problem. No question about it. But do you really not see the homeless in Bangkok??? Or, then there are the people who live in tin shacks. Perhaps you missed them.

Yes, Thai shopping malls do tend to renovate...or get shabby and no one shops there anymore. But I hope you don't think that Thai hotels upcountry renovate on a regular basis. No, they just get run down real fast.

I have more respect for Thai schools than most people do, although I also realize that many Thais don't even go to high school, and an even smaller percent go on to college. When I was a school principal in the States, we always had a handful of Thai students...and all the parents had moved to the States for one sole purpose...their child's education, which they felt was far superior here...and often moved back to Thailand AFTER their American education was over. And I have tutored Thai students at Chula who are trying to read American texts and journals, and haven't the foggiest idea what they are reading.

And please don't tell me how wonderful Thai free enterprise is. Although slightly paraphrased, a real conversation at a Thai department store just two years ago:

Me: "Does this DVD player play American DVDs?"

Clerk" "I give you 10% discount."

Me: "No, what I need to know is whether I will be able to play my American-made DVDs in this machine."

Clerk: "Sir, I give you 10% discount."

Me: "Here, I brought an American DVD with me. Can you play it for me?"

Clerk: "No. You take home and test."

Me: "And if it doesn't play my American DVDs I can bring it back?"

Clerk: "No. You already buy."

Oh, and as my THAI tutor explained to me -- "In America, customer always right. In Thailand, customer always wrong."

Edited January 6, 2011 by phetaroi

[rijb]

That's long time to be insecure about your move to Thailand. Using exaggeration, over-generalization and self-rationalization to help you feel better about your moving decision kinda smells like ass.

[bonobo]

So then compare the best that America has to offer and what it would take to live in that neighborhood.

Your home in San Diego which you may think is better constructed and more than likely built from a wooden frame will start to rot in 20 years. I've yet to see any modern built house in Thailand that DOES NOT use concrete, rebar and brick for the primary building materials.

.

Actually, I have compared, and houses are better made and cheaper in San Diego than in Bangkok.

I have looked at many used homes over the last 6 months. Not one has had a solid foundation. Not one could have been legally sold in San Diego. One home I really wanted had one half of the house settle by over a foot--and this was a 7-year old home. I brought in an engineer to see if it could be salvaged, but the cost to fix the home was more than the cost.

Homes made to code will invariably be better than homes made to no code.

I own a wooden home in North Carolina. It is 53 years old now and without problem. I have replaced the roofing shingles once and a few windows. And in San Diego, homes in Hillcrest are over 70 years old and still going strong. The only homes I have found in Thailand that old which are still habitable are old wooden homes. I know a guy who has one well over a hundred years old on his property in northern Bangkok (he doesn't actually live in it but uses it as an artist studio.)

I really love Thailand, and I miss it when I am gone. But that does not mean that I think Thailand has everything better than the US.

[bonobo]

Crazy drivers in the US compared with Thailand? That is a reach. After some areas in Europe, American drivers are perhaps the most considerate and safe in the world, from my experience. Thais don't even come close.

I respect your opinion, bonobo, but I have to really question the soundness of your perspective. I drove in America. For a lot of years. I'm sure you've heard the term "road rage." I believe that originated in the US and I've seen some of that with my own eyes. Americans are not very patient drivers and if you do something like cut someone off, they will give you the finger or worse. The cell phone craze started to hit about the time I left and some of these horrible drivers became even worse when they're on the phone. Zig zagging all over the road, changing lanes without looking/signaling, going crazy slow, completely oblivious to all around them. And if you ride a motorcycle, forget it. You're basically invisible to the average driver. There are examples of good and bad (and ugly) for both America and Thailand, but I can argue the case that Thai drivers are just as considerate and safe as Americans....GIVEN THE CIRCUMSTANCES. I'm talking the condition of the roads, basic design, narrow roads, number of cars/motorcycles, non-functioning lights, etc. There are some bad Thai drivers, certainly. But frankly, some of the very worst drivers I've seen in Thailand are farangs.

The only place where I have seen more attention to driving laws than the US is in Western Europe, Germany and Austria in particular. Red lights mean stop, and lanes only go in one direction. Motorcycles and cars do not go the wrong way towards oncoming traffic. True, Thais do not get upset as much with line cutters and being cut off. But they also do not stop to let people merge and such.

Without a doubt, I would rather drive in the US than Thailand. I would rather get the finger, which does me no harm, then get hit by another car.

[phetaroi]

Could you afford to live in the US though? I ask because retired American friends here say on their pensions (retired fire/police) they'd really struggle and would still have to work.

At least here we have the freedom to be poor.

I'm a retiree, and everyone I know who is also retired is living decently here in the U.S. Most of the people living on my block of townhouses here in Colorado Springs are retired and older than me. They're all doing fine. One really has to watch her spending closely, but is managing, and owns her own home. I am a retired teacher/school administrator, and am making almost as much now as I did when I was working...bought a townhouse when I returned, remodeled it, travel as I want to, and am paying less in my monthly mortgage than I did for rent for a not-comparable place in Bangkok. I do know one couple back east who are having financial problems in their retirement. They're making it, but just barely. They live very modestly, but probably better than most Thais.

So, can retired folks afford to live in the States? Millions and millions are.

[Chunky1]

Just a few foods that I think are hard to come by here.

Edited January 7, 2011 by cdnvic
Too many photos makes the page difficult to load for some. Please reduce the size and/or number of photos.

[endure]

2) The Thai banking industry is living in the 20th century. Their auditing and accounting practices are archaic. Have you ever tried to deposit a foreign drawn check in a Thai bank. 30 days to clear - what a joke!

A cheque is only a piece of paper. In order for it to be paid on a collection basis it has to be sent back to the originating bank to make sure that funds are available. 30 days is quite good. Paying foreign cheques on a collection basis can take anything up to six weeks and that's not just in Thailand. Trying paying in a cheque denominated in Baht into your US bank account the next time you're over there.

[endure]

Just a few foods that I think are hard to come by here.

And lots of other pictures.

Blimey! Death on a plate.

[PingManDan]

So when are you moving back to Thailand, after the disapointment there?

[cdnvic]

Good education here is expensive and for the elite. In the US, its free.

Should they not be massacred by M1 assault riffles mid-geography lesson.

Please refrain from ridiculous comments like this.

[KRS1]

While I prefer Thailand to the US, let me enlighten you about some of the realities of Thailand:

1) The internet has piss poor speed out of all of Thailand, so to say that Thailand is more technologically advanced is a joke.

2) The Thai banking industry is living in the 20th century. Their auditing and accounting practices are archaic. Have you ever tried to deposit a foreign drawn check in a Thai bank. 30 days to clear - what a joke! How is having a lot of ATM's a better banking system?

3) Thai beer is awful, American beer is awful (except for micro-brews)

I do agree with you about the food, particularly the Mexican restaurants in Thailand. However, I have found that you can make adequate Mexican food at home, although I do miss quality white corn tortillas. Since you lived in Honolulu, you probably know that Keo's is superior to any Thai restaurant in Thailand. I can't say the same for other Thai restaurants in America.

When I first got back I was expecting a super blazing fast internet connection, turns out its not much faster at all. Would you rather use an ATM from a bank you know and trust or some weird looking box without a name on it and with $3 ATM fees, its nice to use my l own banks ATM without having to incur any fees.

Have you ever tried to deposit a foreign check into a US account? its just as slow.

Keo's ??? That's not even real Thai food a guy from Laos owns it !

[dave_boo]

Can't call Houston, Tx my hometown but lived there for six years...essentially as long as in NakWan.

After living in Thailand I'm amazed that Thailand is still so far behind technologically compared to the US, the US is lagging behind big time. There's only a preium single satellite provider that charges 2x the money for only 1/5the channels. Outside of Bangkok you are lucky to have more than one choice of an ISP that promises good speed and redirects your speedtests to a local server. All the (admittedly unlocked) phones are usually over priced. Finding good prices on any recent electronics is a nightmare. I spent time in Chonburi, Samut Prakarn and finally here in Nakhon Sawan and can attest to Thailand's deficiency in almost every aspect...Most shopping malls are old, movie theaters are old and show movies that are edited sometimes to the point of absurdity, public transport is old, roads are cracked with pot holes, and food and cigarettes have risen substantially. - and since I am not a babbling idiot I do miss the 'self checkout'...and the modicum of knowledge that most all people that work in stores in the States are able to demonstrate (along with not following me around like I'm casing the joint).

This is only one of the things that depressed me, essentially whenever you need to find information you'd be better off asking a mute donkey than a Thai. How can someone work in a industry and not be able to answer the most basic questions? A walk through the mall or a drive down the street in the wrong part of town can literally be dangerous, in America pretty much no matter where you are you can count on not being ran over using the crossing lanes, expect your taxi driver to be yaa baa free, and if an accident does occur the other party to be responsible enough to stay around until it is resolved...and for you to be able to get first class care if it's serious enough.

I'd have to say the banking system in Thailand is light years behind of the US, ATM's on every corner, convenient locations everywhere and secure online access that sometimes works do nothing to make up for the appalling lack of customer service inside the branches.

When I stepped out of my house I look around and not a taxi, tuk tuk , bus, MRT, BTS or mocye in sight.....but a whole bunch of panderias and taquerias where i can go to pick up a quick bite. At no point doe my heart yearns to wave down a mocye taxi, go to the market and pick a dish for 30 baht and get it wrapped up in a plastic bag tied with a rubber band--I didn't have to worry about food poisoining. Price, especially considering that I made more than 5x what a Thai government official made, was only 3x as expensive for juevos rancheros, bacon, fresh made tortillas, and coffee. Thus I actually paid 60% of what a Thai would in Thailand.

I'm glad I'm not a drunk who moved to Thailand to satisfy my need to feel important by picking up birds that are so much younger than I. When I do go out to party in the States the selection is much bigger and at cheaper prices..and that's not even talking about buying from the store!

I miss the dirt cheap prices and selection of cars from the States. There is something infinitely cool about picking up a small block V8 for ~1500 USD (45 000 THB) and dropping another 3500 USD on it to have a car that will make a tickle in your pickle. And let's not even discuss the motorbike pricing. Roads to drive on are sensibly laid out, they're clearly marked and there's a wide variety that are mostly in good repair. Traffic rules are enforced across the board (you don't have rich families kids driving unliscensed and public out rage that they murder 9 people and are probably going to get a 400 THB fine or going crazy and running people over at a bus stop).

Season changes I miss most of all; there's nothing like watching the leaves turn and knowing that soon the earth will be covered with a soft blanket of white.

Wow, that was too easy!

[KRS1]

Crazy drivers in the US compared with Thailand? That is a reach. After some areas in Europe, American drivers are perhaps the most considerate and safe in the world, from my experience. Thais don't even come close.

The OP was referring to Houston. Being from Dallas, I think he has a point. In Texas, people will pull out semi-automatic weapons and shoot you dead if you anger them on the road. And if you happen to displease some mexican gang member, you might be facing even something full auto. And Texas is full of drunk mexicans, driving w/o licenses the wrong way down freeways. For all the crazy driving on Thai roads, for some reason, I remember seeing many more accidents on American roads than I ever do, here.. The one thing in your favor in the US, however, is that if you do have a serious road accident, paramedics and qualified rescue teams might give you a chance to survive. Here, in Thailand, you're a goner for sure.

The description certainly fits in certain parts of town. Not so sure about the highways though. In Dallas, it doesn't sound like a description of say Highland Park, or in Houston of Spring Branch. In Austin, we don't have anything like the above description in Westlake. I wouldn't feel that the nastier sides of life here are representative of any particular city or country either. It's possibly to live a cut above here or in any major metropolis back home in the US. It's all relative... if 'home' is the equivalent of South Central LA then it's hard not to find 'somewhere else' more appealing.

Highland park is just right around the corner from Love field, which is a pretty ghetto hispanic area. My mother lives on Turtle Creek Blvd, if you know where that is then you know its a posh area. However if I go down 2 lights and I'm back at the ghetto. Her Benz got broken into in front of Ross.

I think it may have been a while since you've been around Spring Branch, that whole area between I-10 and 290 is went down hill, even more so than when I left 15 years ago. Everyone's migrating to the Eldridge area these days.

My father lives in West U so its fairly decent and safe, but roll down Bissonet/Bellaire towards Sharpstown mall and its on.

[KRS1]

The OP said:

* "After living in Thailand I'm amazed that Thailand is actually technologically more advanced than the US, the US is lagging behind big time."

* "Shopping malls are old, movie theaters are old and smelly"

* "public transport is old, roads are cracked with pot holes"

* "food and cigarettes have risen substantially. - and since when were you allowed to 'self checkout'"

* "America has become so automated and lazy and its virtually impossible to speak to a live person over the phone if you have issues with your bank."

* "A walk through the mall or a drive down the street in the wrong part of town can literally be dangerous, in Thailand no matter how ghetto it is it still feels safer than here."

* "I'd have to say the banking system in Thailand is light years ahead of the US, ATM's on every corner, convenient locations everywhere and secure online access that is on par with US banks. Much more courteous service than Carlos would give you at the local Wells Fargo branch around here, not too mention heaps cuter even the mean ones."

* "Stepping out of my house I look around and not a taxi, tuk tuk , bus, MRT, BTS or mocye in sight"

* ".....not too mention no street food or a outdoor market i can go to pick up a quick bite."

* "I miss my mocye (motorcycle) In Thailand its just a way of life, in America you have to struggle to see even 1 bike per day. A ride through the mountains when I get the yearning as when I was living in Chiang Mai is no longer on the list, I see a guy on a Ducati once at the stoplight and say to myself "if he knew, if he only knew"....Besides I'm not sure if i would even want a bike here in the US, people drive like psychos and the speed limit is now 65-70 on Interstates. I'd probably get hit by some redneck in a lifted dodge truck while freezing my nads off during winter time."

* "I gorged on mexican food when i came back only to realize that its not really all that bad in thailand to begin with, if people in thailand would start to use the right tortillas to make enchiladas it would be 90% similar.But I have to admit the food here in the US is better, kinda strange because this applies to the Thai food also, the ingredients are of a higher grade and it is good if you know where to go get it, the Thai temples in the US are the best places not the restaurants.Beef steaks here win hands down over steaks in Thailand, should I stay in the US just for the steak? It's tempting...aint nothing like a USDA prime choice cut, nevermind the aged beef, i never liked that fact that someone let mold grow on my steak before i eat it."

* "Well I cant think of any other reasons why I would want to stay in the US any longer than i have to, the food cost more, the beer is weak, rent and real estate is too high, wages are low, public transport sucks, people are rude, theaters smell like ass, too many cops, too many mexicans,and not enough mocye's..."

Although I only lived in Thailand for about a year and a half, I recently returned, too (shortly after May 19). I don't see things the same way you do. But, I think that may be the real point here...we judge reality on what we personally see. Let me respond to the comments above:

In my view, Thailand is not more advanced technologically than here in the States. Far more people here are connected to the internet. Cable television is MUCH clearer here and with far more channels to choose from, and I can choose from one cable company or two satellite companies. I have Onstar here, nothing like that in Thailand that I'm familiar with. We're on 4G here...what's Thailand struggling with...and how do farangs feel about True?

Shopping malls old in the U.S. That very much depends on where you are. Here in Colorado Springs, that's very true' I'm not very impressed. On the other hand, when I drive up to Denver (about 60 miles away), there's at least one shopping mall that is as good or better than anything in Bangkok. And, impressive shopping malls in Thailand pretty much exist in Bangkok, and to some extent Chiang Mai.

Movie theatres. I can drive 5-10 minutes in two different directions here in Colorado Springs and be in movie complexes that are as nice as the theaters that were in Central World. And have popcorn that actually tastes good and fresh.

Public transport is old? Well, here the emphasis is on private cars, rather than mass transit. I agree that I miss the Sky Train and subway. It varies very much on a city by city basis. Not sure how you really compare. I guess if you take the two capitals, you have Bangkok's Sky Train and subway that don't serve most of the city, or you have Washington's subway that serves a greater percentage of the city. But of course, Bangkok has that wonderful mass transit line that goes up to Don Muang (ahem). The roads in America are cracked an full of potholes. Certainly true in Colorado Springs...of course, the freezing and thawing in winter weather takes it toll, while Bangkok has no such enemies of pavement. And, there an awfully lot of places in Thailand where good roads don't even exist when you get out in the boonies.

Yes, grocery store prices here are higher in the U.S. But there's a lot more selection in my local stores here than those I frequented in Bangkok. And what's wrong with self-checkout? You don't have to use it. It's an option. But perhaps you're correct...a Thai clerk telling me that I can't buy ROOT beer at certain times because it is an alcoholic beverage is certainly much better.

Yes, you're correct, the automated phone systems here in the States are maddening. Of course, I found it equally maddening that depending on which particular branch of a bank you might go to in Bangkok, you might be told that you could or could not conduct certain types of transactions. Yes, there were ATMs everywhere in Bangkok...that for no good reason ate my ATM card twice.

Yes, no street food here in the States...but I've only had food poisoning here in the States in the last 6 months...well, zero times.

You're correct, you have to be careful where you find yourself in many American cities. On the other hand, I don't expect to have to pay a cop a bribe here, either. I'd have to say that there more of a real justice system here (not that it's perfect), than in Thailand.

Okay, I can see why you like your motorcycle. But I've enjoyed taking the interstate up to Estes Park and getting off on the rural roads that go through Rocky Mountain National Park (as just one example).

Wages are low in America? Let's see...my Thai friend has two college degrees and works in the mid-level management of one of the Thai ministries. He makes less in one year than what I made in less than one month in a very comparable job.

Here's my bottom line response to your posting -- you see what you want to see. And, it sounds as if you genuinely prefer the lifestyle in Thailand. And that's fine. Perhaps that's where you should be.

But you know, I have to make one further comment that sort of relates to your post. When I moved to Thailand I wanted to maintain close to the lifestyle I had in the U.S. We had a 3 bedroom apartment down off Sukhumvit. We paid $1800 US a month. It's difficult to compare rent and mortgage, but for that $1800 a month, I had half the living space I have here in the States, the Thai apartment wasn't as nice in many aspects, it was noisier in Bangkok, well, I could go on. And, on May 19 dense black smoke billowed down our soi in Bangkok...haven't had that happen here. It's a different lifestyle...in many ways not comparable. And it just depends on what you want. Neither place is heaven on earth.

I prefer paying the cops off for 100 baht, it saves me time and money.

Try getting a high rise condo smack dab in the middle of any metropolitan city in the US and you'll be paying a whole lot more, something tells me your condo comparison isn't eye to eye to what you have/had in the US. Not too mention the drastic difference in maintenence fees you would pay if you actually owned the condo.

I had my ATM card taken once when I first got to Thailand, thats because I was typing in the wrong PIN more than 3 times.

If I went grocery shopping and wanted to get strictly thai foods in the US of course i would pay more too, but what do you expect?

Roads? I've never seen a main road in Bangkok go unrepaired for more than a year. (main road) not a small soi road.

I guess wages depends on the type of job you have. I made more in Thailad than I am now, and could save more every month because the expenses were lower, and I'm just a mid level IT guy. My condo in Thailand is paid off though.

I'll be back when the exchange rate goes back up, i got there at 55:1

[frozenpuck]

I live in Canada but pretty much the same as the US except maybe not as run down, the economy here never took the huge hit the US has. Never the less I came back because my Thai wife very badly wanted to come to Canada. Its great for her, she was given an opportunity and she has made the best of it. In just 6 years she has over a million baht in the bank and owns her own restaurant.

For me not so great, just before it was time to leave Thailand to bring her to Canada I remember thinking about it while I was looking at a beautiful book of diving in Thailand at a bookstore in phuket town, and I while I was looking at all of these beautiful pictures of Thailand I started to break out in cold sweat thinking this a mistake. Well 6 years later she is doing great but the last 6 years for me has been predictably very stressful and frustrating. The reason I left canada from the beginning is because i was fed up and disgusted with high taxes, over regulation, massive mounds of paperwork regardless of what you do ect. ect. not to mention the shear arrogance and ignorance of the everyday people here. Now I have 3 times the stress than ever before because now I have to do all admin, taxes, paperwork, schools ect. ect. not just for myself but for her, her son, and the restaurant she runs.

In a nutshell its been great for her, hell for me. So what I am trying to say is its all a matter of persepctive. For the Thai foriegn workers here they work, put money in the bank and if they are smart and dont send it all home they can go back to Thailand with a miilon baht in 3 years. For me who has to pay mortgage, high taxes, and high everything else it's just a day to day struggle to meet the bills. Now I'm coming to Thailand by myself this year simply because I cant take it any more. So ladies and gentleman if your Thai spouse or partner is working on you to take her back to your country. I have three words of advice. Dont do it!

[dave_boo]

Disgusting...no wonder Americans are such fat slobs and 50% of the children suffer from early onset Type 2 diabetes.

At the risk of lending credence to your 'fat slobs' tripe, the current rate of obesity in the States stands at some 26%if you define obesity as a BMI of over 30. At an average height of 1,76m that means the American would have to be greater than 93 kg....do you wish to rephrase that?

I would also like you to look at your claims of "50%" again; per this paper one in 523 people (aged 20 or younger) has diabetes.

[Ulysses G.]

Disgusting...no wonder Americans are such fat slobs and 50% of the children suffer from early onset Type 2 diabetes.

So says "Farang Buddha" a loving model of compassion and no doubt perfect himself. :lol:

Edited January 7, 2011 by Ulysses G.

[Ricardo]

Isn't it a 'given', that all TV-members are perfect, UG ?

I myself am often called 'hansum man', when walking down the road, and was recently called 'sexy man', when I walked down Pattaya's infamous Walking-Street in T-shirt & swimming-trunks, on my way back from Bali-Hai Pier to my hotel !

It made my day !

[craigt3365]

Disgusting...no wonder Americans are such fat slobs and 50% of the children suffer from early onset Type 2 diabetes.

So says "Farang Buddha" a loving model of compassion and no doubt perfect himself. :lol:

I love Thai food, but you can't say it is entirely healthy. Deep fried foods abound. Sausages, "organ" type foods, coconut milk, palm oil, etc. Not everybody in the US eats the lousy types of food pictured. Most of my friends in the US don't...but for sure, many do.

I am here now visiting my Mom. I have to say we sure miss what is available here...but also miss many aspects of Thailand...primarily the great weather, cheap food and...mostly...the inexpensive living.

Shopping here is awesome. I'm in Vegas and the malls and stores are great. Lots more stuff available and usually at cheaper prices than in Thailand (if you compare apples to apples). I just returned from Fry's. Unreal. Sports Authority was great, as is many of the "Home Depot" type of stores. I live in Pattaya, and these types of stores are just not available there. We came here with empty suitcases and are returning with them full.

As has been posted before, many things in the US are quite good. Roads, drivers, internet, TV, etc. I don't agree with the OP. Sure, some things are much better in LOS, but some things are not.

[zydeco]

Just a few foods that I think are hard to come by here.

Disgusting...no wonder Americans are such fat slobs and 50% of the children suffer from early onset Type 2 diabetes.

You're absolutely correct about that menu for a ready made heart attack.

Except for the pecan pie, which is a necessity of life, and the picture of which, btw, is missing the whipped cream.

[cdnvic]

Removed an argument and one post that quoted 15mb of photos only to add a one line reply.

[maccaroni man]

Can't call Houston, Tx my hometown but lived there for six years...essentially as long as in NakWan.

After living in Thailand I'm amazed that Thailand is still so far behind technologically compared to the US, the US is lagging behind big time. There's only a preium single satellite provider that charges 2x the money for only 1/5the channels. Outside of Bangkok you are lucky to have more than one choice of an ISP that promises good speed and redirects your speedtests to a local server. All the (admittedly unlocked) phones are usually over priced. Finding good prices on any recent electronics is a nightmare. I spent time in Chonburi, Samut Prakarn and finally here in Nakhon Sawan and can attest to Thailand's deficiency in almost every aspect...Most shopping malls are old, movie theaters are old and show movies that are edited sometimes to the point of absurdity, public transport is old, roads are cracked with pot holes, and food and cigarettes have risen substantially. - and since I am not a babbling idiot I do miss the 'self checkout'...and the modicum of knowledge that most all people that work in stores in the States are able to demonstrate (along with not following me around like I'm casing the joint).

This is only one of the things that depressed me, essentially whenever you need to find information you'd be better off asking a mute donkey than a Thai. How can someone work in a industry and not be able to answer the most basic questions? A walk through the mall or a drive down the street in the wrong part of town can literally be dangerous, in America pretty much no matter where you are you can count on not being ran over using the crossing lanes, expect your taxi driver to be yaa baa free, and if an accident does occur the other party to be responsible enough to stay around until it is resolved...and for you to be able to get first class care if it's serious enough.

I'd have to say the banking system in Thailand is light years behind of the US, ATM's on every corner, convenient locations everywhere and secure online access that sometimes works do nothing to make up for the appalling lack of customer service inside the branches.

When I stepped out of my house I look around and not a taxi, tuk tuk , bus, MRT, BTS or mocye in sight.....but a whole bunch of panderias and taquerias where i can go to pick up a quick bite. At no point doe my heart yearns to wave down a mocye taxi, go to the market and pick a dish for 30 baht and get it wrapped up in a plastic bag tied with a rubber band--I didn't have to worry about food poisoining. Price, especially considering that I made more than 5x what a Thai government official made, was only 3x as expensive for juevos rancheros, bacon, fresh made tortillas, and coffee. Thus I actually paid 60% of what a Thai would in Thailand.

I'm glad I'm not a drunk who moved to Thailand to satisfy my need to feel important by picking up birds that are so much younger than I. When I do go out to party in the States the selection is much bigger and at cheaper prices..and that's not even talking about buying from the store!

I miss the dirt cheap prices and selection of cars from the States. There is something infinitely cool about picking up a small block V8 for ~1500 USD (45 000 THB) and dropping another 3500 USD on it to have a car that will make a tickle in your pickle. And let's not even discuss the motorbike pricing. Roads to drive on are sensibly laid out, they're clearly marked and there's a wide variety that are mostly in good repair. Traffic rules are enforced across the board (you don't have rich families kids driving unliscensed and public out rage that they murder 9 people and are probably going to get a 400 THB fine or going crazy and running people over at a bus stop).

Season changes I miss most of all; there's nothing like watching the leaves turn and knowing that soon the earth will be covered with a soft blanket of white.

Wow, that was too easy!

BRAVO well done :jap:

[barrybankruad]

Disgusting...no wonder Americans are such fat slobs and 50% of the children suffer from early onset Type 2 diabetes.

So says "Farang Buddha" a loving model of compassion and no doubt perfect himself. :lol:

I love Thai food, but you can't say it is entirely healthy. Deep fried foods abound. Sausages, "organ" type foods, coconut milk, palm oil, etc. Not everybody in the US eats the lousy types of food pictured. Most of my friends in the US don't...but for sure, many do.

I am here now visiting my Mom. I have to say we sure miss what is available here...but also miss many aspects of Thailand...primarily the great weather, cheap food and...mostly...the inexpensive living.

Shopping here is awesome. I'm in Vegas and the malls and stores are great. Lots more stuff available and usually at cheaper prices than in Thailand (if you compare apples to apples). I just returned from Fry's. Unreal. Sports Authority was great, as is many of the "Home Depot" type of stores. I live in Pattaya, and these types of stores are just not available there. We came here with empty suitcases and are returning with them full.

As has been posted before, many things in the US are quite good. Roads, drivers, internet, TV, etc. I don't agree with the OP. Sure, some things are much better in LOS, but some things are not.

This has been an interesting thread. I have never been to the States but the various comparisons between there and here in Thailand have been very informative. One thing that does not appear to have been discussed is comparisons of medical facilities. Cost, availability, insurance, treatments etc. Would anyone like to comment?

[Lancelot]

I used to debate with detractors about the merits of the USA (UK, Germany, ets..) vs. Thailand but I have ceased to engage in that futile endeavor. Now when folks tell me how undesirable it is to live in the USA (and countries mentioned above) I simply say "Man, you got that right" then walk away

However, if the developed world is so bad, why are so many people from the third/second world voting with their feet and doing every thing humanly possible to get in?

[bangkokcitylimits]

Forwarded this nice written story to a friend in Illinois, an old 'hippie' who always thinks in America everything is better, but actually haven't been over the border all his life.

Keep on writing please !

[bonobo]

Try getting a high rise condo smack dab in the middle of any metropolitan city in the US and you'll be paying a whole lot more, something tells me your condo comparison isn't eye to eye to what you have/had in the US.

Luxury condos in downtown San Diego are cheaper than in Bangkok. And in Chicago, right over the Navy Pier, the prices are less than half of what a similar place would cost in Bangkok and the place is much better quality. I expect a Manhattan condo would be higher, but San Diego and Chicago cannot be outliers, and condos in other cities should be cheaper than Bangkok as well.

You like Thailand and don't like the US. I get it. I like Thailand, too. I choose to live here. But it isn't right to make blanket statements condemning the US when those statements just aren't true.

.

[mark45y]

I'm just an old retired guy who came to Thailand to find some peace and quiet to write and contemplate the end of my life. I'm not into establishing a major cash flow or accumulating wealth. I have enough to live a simple stress free life here.

After reading all these posts I don't now whether to be impressed or conned but one thing I sure have not heard mentioned much is the ease of being a crook here.

It sure must be a lot easier than the West. This is a cash society. The West is credit cards and checks and paper trails. Here is gold and Baht and no receipt.

Phone, rent, travel,transfer of funds is so much different here. One can cross borders with relative ease. I have never been a spy, well almost never, but if I wanted to sell tanks or rockets this is the place I would come.

Viktor was highly visible. I don't think most in his line of work are. I have a friend here who for 40 years worked for the ********. He checked shipments of arms when they arrived to make sure everything was there. Not a Rambo or James Bond type just a clerk who knew a lot about military hardware. You know when an African dictator buys a weapons system someone has to check the stuff after the spy guys unload it. The Viktors get the publicity but there are always clerks who check the stuff in. You know, the guy in the background who says, “I can make that Play station console fly that rocket, no problem.”

Anyway, he lives in Thailand because he can disappear here. I don't know if his real name is his real name. I don't know which passport he is using today. He moves every 90 days. Not much of a problem here.

I have another friend who is a high risk miner. He mines gold in deep cold dangerous places and comes back to Thailand and buys small businesses.

No wives no kids no bank accounts, gold and girls and go go's. This place is a pirates paradise. I am convinced that Osama lives in a condo close to walking street, hangs out in Boy's Town and everyone knows this. Thai Visa is infiltrated by DEA agents married to Corsican maidens with Laotian mia nois.

So where are the stories of the guys who can't leave Thailand because they can't do their laundry in the States or UK?

[bonobo]

Disgusting...no wonder Americans are such fat slobs and 50% of the children suffer from early onset Type 2 diabetes.

So says "Farang Buddha" a loving model of compassion and no doubt perfect himself. :lol:

I love Thai food, but you can't say it is entirely healthy. Deep fried foods abound. Sausages, "organ" type foods, coconut milk, palm oil, etc. Not everybody in the US eats the lousy types of food pictured. Most of my friends in the US don't...but for sure, many do.

I am here now visiting my Mom. I have to say we sure miss what is available here...but also miss many aspects of Thailand...primarily the great weather, cheap food and...mostly...the inexpensive living.

Shopping here is awesome. I'm in Vegas and the malls and stores are great. Lots more stuff available and usually at cheaper prices than in Thailand (if you compare apples to apples). I just returned from Fry's. Unreal. Sports Authority was great, as is many of the "Home Depot" type of stores. I live in Pattaya, and these types of stores are just not available there. We came here with empty suitcases and are returning with them full.

As has been posted before, many things in the US are quite good. Roads, drivers, internet, TV, etc. I don't agree with the OP. Sure, some things are much better in LOS, but some things are not.

This has been an interesting thread. I have never been to the States but the various comparisons between there and here in Thailand have been very informative. One thing that does not appear to have been discussed is comparisons of medical facilities. Cost, availability, insurance, treatments etc. Would anyone like to comment?

Quality medical care for those who don't want to go to a public hospital is far, far superior in Thailand. I needed an MRI, so I went to one of the high-end private hospitals and had it done for 8,000 baht. It was done just as professionally as if I had had it done in the US and at a fraction of the cost.

While some procedures are very complicated and should be done in the US, if you are paying as you go, the vast majority of the care can be done in Thailand, and some things, such as certain cosmetic surgeries, might be better in Thailand.

For the poor, the 30-baht service has resulted in a very low quality of treatment. It might be OK for the cold or some such, but the free treatment provided to the poor in public emergency rooms in the US is better, even if the wait might be very long.

Just as an example, I had an old parachute injury to my knee. In Thailand, at a jetski tourney in Korat, I re-injured the knee. I was taken to the local public hospital where the doctor seriously told me that my knee wasn't injured, it was because I must have a high fat diet. (I went back to the US to have it operated on.)