Cbr 250 Vs Ninja 250

[taichiplanet]

just thinking out loud...the internet wasnt really even around when the ninja 250 first came out.

Yeah, the fight between VHS and Betamax video tapes was still in it's death throws!

Seems the CBR is doing the job it was intended for; introducing more people to (or back into) riding. The trouble is that in many markets there is slow delivery, seems the factory in Thailand is not doing its job properly.

how can you say that the factory in thailand is not doing its job?

If anyone is to blame it should be the factory in India...

or honda for underestimating the demand for this bike...

We cant expect one factory to supply the whole world when it is not designed to...

The factory in India has started producing, not sure if delivering yet, but as far as i know the Indian made CBRs are only for India and South America. I am happy to be proven incorrect but that was according to the initial press release.

http://world.honda.com/news/2010/2101027CBR250R/ (paragraph 4)

Besides India and South America (to paraphrase Monty Python from 'The Life of Brian') it does appear the factory in Thailand was designed to supply the CBR250 to the whole world.

When dealers in the USA have taken preorders for the last couple of months, and only had 1 or 2 bikes delivered to them after being allocated more than that then i reckon there is a problem with the Thai factory. One guy in the US was told the delay in delivery was due to the earthquake/tsunami in Japan!

[visions]

In Australia you can i believe buy a Non ABS off the showroom floor, but ABS versions have a 1 or 2 month wait list.

Price in Australia.......Non ABS (in baht) 204,000 Baht

ABS 220,000 Baht.

Gotta be a bargain price buying in Thailand.

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Edited May 8, 2011 by visions

[bobbin]

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Approximately Bt.45,000.

This was inevitable in those markets where there is a significant price differential between the two bikes.

Kawasaki Thailand must respond as well or end up with a lot of unsold machines, yes?

[visions]

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Approximately Bt.45,000.

This was inevitable in those markets where there is a significant price differential between the two bikes.

Kawasaki Thailand must respond as well or end up with a lot of unsold machines, yes?

Kawasaki Thailand's stated intention is NOT to drop their price. But TiT and when sales are zero maybe they will change their minds?

But think of all the poor guys that have just recently bought their 250 Ninjas in Australia...instant loss of resale value. Even older bikes will lose out. How happy would you be if you bought your new bike days before the price drop!!

Seems like a 2 month wait list for ABS CBR250 here, talking to a sales rep this morning.

[JonnyF]

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Approximately Bt.45,000.

This was inevitable in those markets where there is a significant price differential between the two bikes.

Kawasaki Thailand must respond as well or end up with a lot of unsold machines, yes?

I doubt it, the market's a bit different here. Look at the popularity of Mini Coopers despite the crazy price tag. EVERY girl in my office wants one, if they were priced the same as a Vios and every Bangkok condo had 20 of them in the car park then i don't think this would be the case. Kawasaki don't realistically expect sales to be anywhere near the Honda no matter what the price was. I don't think dropping the price by 30-40,000 baht to compete with the super cheap Honda would be a good move.

[bobbin]

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Approximately Bt.45,000.

This was inevitable in those markets where there is a significant price differential between the two bikes.

Kawasaki Thailand must respond as well or end up with a lot of unsold machines, yes?

I doubt it, the market's a bit different here. Look at the popularity of Mini Coopers despite the crazy price tag. EVERY girl in my office wants one, if they were priced the same as a Vios and every Bangkok condo had 20 of them in the car park then i don't think this would be the case. Kawasaki don't realistically expect sales to be anywhere near the Honda no matter what the price was. I don't think dropping the price by 30-40,000 baht to compete with the super cheap Honda would be a good move.

Yes, the Thai market certainly is different! Fewer sales require raising the price!

But seriously, if the two bikes had an insignificant price differential, Kawasaki has a better chance to shine. This should make the Ninja supporters happy. And why wouldn't Kawasaki Thailand want to increase their market share?

The Mini Cooper analogy isn't a good one, because it is an imported model versus a domestic model. The people who can afford the Mini know everyone else knows it's expensive, so added "face". The two motorcycles are both domestic models.

The Honda is only super cheap in relation to the Kawasaki here in Thailand. In America they are the same price. Unless you want the nice paint job with the cool graphics, then Kawasaki charges a few hundred dollars more. Or if you want ABS, then Honda charges a few hundred dollars more.

[JonnyF]

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Approximately Bt.45,000.

This was inevitable in those markets where there is a significant price differential between the two bikes.

Kawasaki Thailand must respond as well or end up with a lot of unsold machines, yes?

I doubt it, the market's a bit different here. Look at the popularity of Mini Coopers despite the crazy price tag. EVERY girl in my office wants one, if they were priced the same as a Vios and every Bangkok condo had 20 of them in the car park then i don't think this would be the case. Kawasaki don't realistically expect sales to be anywhere near the Honda no matter what the price was. I don't think dropping the price by 30-40,000 baht to compete with the super cheap Honda would be a good move.

Yes, the Thai market certainly is different! Fewer sales require raising the price!

But seriously, if the two bikes had an insignificant price differential, Kawasaki has a better chance to shine. This should make the Ninja supporters happy. And why wouldn't Kawasaki Thailand want to increase their market share?

The Mini Cooper analogy isn't a good one, because it is an imported model versus a domestic model. The people who can afford the Mini know everyone else knows it's expensive, so added "face". The two motorcycles are both domestic models.

The Honda is only super cheap in relation to the Kawasaki here in Thailand. In America they are the same price. Unless you want the nice paint job with the cool graphics, then Kawasaki charges a few hundred dollars more. Or if you want ABS, then Honda charges a few hundred dollars more.

I don't think the Ninja supporters really care how many they sell. If my Ninja is one of just a few on the road vs. hundreds of CBR's then that's fine by me. I've never seen another gsxr600 in Thailand either, I'm sure they exist but I've never seen one in the flesh (seen a few gsxr1000's) and it's irrelevant to me. The only issue is that I know i have to import parts when I need them so I order them a couple of months in advance and it's never caused me a problem.

I think the Mini analogy is valid, the reason people want them is because they are expensive and rare (exclusive) compared to the hordes of Vios' and Honda City's filling Thailand's carparks - not because they are imported (although clearly they are expensive because they are imported). Look at Triumph, they're made here but they're still expensive due to BOI (and therefore you don't see many of them) which is why they maintain their exclusivity. I'm not saying the Ninja is on the same level as either of these examples because clearly it isn't, but I still don't think that dropping the price of the Ninja to compete with the incredibly low rrp of the CBR (even though it's very tough to buy the CBR at rrp) is a good marketing move considering how Kawasaki have set themselves in the market. It wouldn't make sense to do so.

[KRS1]

Right now there are lots and lots and lots of second hand CBR 250's for sale on the Thai market going for 90-95k, so many its ridiculous.

Not many Ninja 250's though

[taichiplanet]

I'd rather Kwaka bring out an updated version of the 250 (with ABS option) at the current price, rather than dropping the price.

[KRS1]

I dont think thats going to happen for a couple of years , since the updated ninja 250 only came out a few years ago.

Any changes I would expect would be minor changes in cosmetics or tooling of the fairings.

[bobbin]

I still don't think that dropping the price of the Ninja to compete with the incredibly low rrp of the CBR (even though it's very tough to buy the CBR at rrp) is a good marketing move considering how Kawasaki have set themselves in the market. It wouldn't make sense to do so.

It obviously made sense to Kawasaki (Australia)!

It might be time for Kawasaki Thailand to drop selling the 250 from their Big Bike Shops and endeavor to move it over to mainstream dealers. After they drop the price of course.

The current price-gouging on the Honda is not a permanent condition.........

[JonnyF]

I still don't think that dropping the price of the Ninja to compete with the incredibly low rrp of the CBR (even though it's very tough to buy the CBR at rrp) is a good marketing move considering how Kawasaki have set themselves in the market. It wouldn't make sense to do so.

It obviously made sense to Kawasaki (Australia)!

It might be time for Kawasaki Thailand to drop selling the 250 from their Big Bike Shops and endeavor to move it over to mainstream dealers. After they drop the price of course.

The current price-gouging on the Honda is not a permanent condition.........

Like I said it's a different market to Australia.

If you look at the prices of the 2 bikes elsewhere then I would actually argue that the Honda is under-priced in Thailand rather than the Kawasaki being over-priced. Hence the lack of supply in comparison to the demand, the result being that dealers are quoting well above the RRP and still selling what few bikes they have, making the extra profits themselves at the expense of the reputation of AP Honda. That's Honda's problem not Kawasaki's. Good for the consumers that like the CBR250 though (assuming they can get it within 10k of RRP).

[dave_boo]

Kawasaki Australia has dropped the price of the Ninja 250 by A$1500 and are still more expensive than the CBR250.

Approximately Bt.45,000.

This was inevitable in those markets where there is a significant price differential between the two bikes.

Kawasaki Thailand must respond as well or end up with a lot of unsold machines, yes?

I doubt it, the market's a bit different here. Look at the popularity of Mini Coopers despite the crazy price tag. EVERY girl in my office wants one, if they were priced the same as a Vios and every Bangkok condo had 20 of them in the car park then i don't think this would be the case. Kawasaki don't realistically expect sales to be anywhere near the Honda no matter what the price was. I don't think dropping the price by 30-40,000 baht to compete with the super cheap Honda would be a good move.

Staying off subject I never understood the Mini pricing in LOS...it's way above what even a BMW is priced isn't it? I am talking above and beyond the taxes/tariffs that should be associated with it.

I also question the idea that if they were Yaris/Fit priced that they would somehow be less desirable; case in point is the ever-popular Yamaha Fino. Seems like you can't fart in any direction without accidentally providing at least one of them with a shot of NOS and yet they are still really popular. Yamaha doesn't charge a premium over say the Click for the bike do they?

However I agree that Kawasaki can not drop their prices. Even being a Honda whore I have to admit that Kawasaki took care of business just right. Availability was an issue when first released, but I have not seen any reports of serious issues with the bikes nor dealership incompetence. Is some of the margin going towards making sure that they can 'afford' this? I'd like to think so.

There's also a question of the aftermarket which others have touched upon; should you be able to snatch up a new Ninja 250 for a few thousand more than owners are asking for their slightly used ones there will probably be some sort of backlash.

Your sales point is most likely valid also. There can't be too big of a market for +75 000 THB bikes in LOS. I'd imagine that Kawasaki may have sold as many as they can at the price point they have. Will there be a cachet in owing a Ninja over a CBR? Perhaps. Also perhaps that will help the company maintain sales.

Another thing I've been dwelling on that may help bolster Ninja sales is the brand loyalty. What other company offers a 'pit bike' (KSR), a 'dual-sport'(KLX), a 250 sporty/stepping stone (Ninja), a 650 'standard' (ER-6*), 'big sports' (ZX-*R), and 'cruiser' (Vulcan) bikes?

I think that Kawasaki is in a position to pull a 'McDonald's'. I.E., get them started off on the smaller fun bikes and keep them up to your top of the line models.

[dave_boo]

I still don't think that dropping the price of the Ninja to compete with the incredibly low rrp of the CBR (even though it's very tough to buy the CBR at rrp) is a good marketing move considering how Kawasaki have set themselves in the market. It wouldn't make sense to do so.

It obviously made sense to Kawasaki (Australia)!

It might be time for Kawasaki Thailand to drop selling the 250 from their Big Bike Shops and endeavor to move it over to mainstream dealers. After they drop the price of course.

The current price-gouging on the Honda is not a permanent condition.........

Like I said it's a different market to Australia.

If you look at the prices of the 2 bikes elsewhere then I would actually argue that the Honda is under-priced in Thailand rather than the Kawasaki being over-priced. Hence the lack of supply in comparison to the demand, the result being that dealers are quoting well above the RRP and still selling what few bikes they have, making the extra profits themselves at the expense of the reputation of AP Honda. That's Honda's problem not Kawasaki's. Good for the consumers that like the CBR250 though (assuming they can get it within 10k of RRP).

Either we can say the Kawasaki is over-priced since it costs more than it does 1/2 the way around the world (even if you want to make the point about the FI, there's still S&H and import and certification and...) or we can say that the Honda is under-priced since it cost so much less than it does 1/2 the way around the world (a directly comparable situation).

If we're to assume that HondaUSA dealers make 5% on each CBR they sell, and they're paying LOS MSRP, than shipping/fees is some 14 300 THB. If Kawasaki dealers in the States pay the same shipping/fees, and have the same profit margin, that means that they're getting the carb'd Ninja for the same 100 000 THB. Is the fuel injection system on the LOS version really worth 47 000 THB?

[JonnyF]

I still don't think that dropping the price of the Ninja to compete with the incredibly low rrp of the CBR (even though it's very tough to buy the CBR at rrp) is a good marketing move considering how Kawasaki have set themselves in the market. It wouldn't make sense to do so.

It obviously made sense to Kawasaki (Australia)!

It might be time for Kawasaki Thailand to drop selling the 250 from their Big Bike Shops and endeavor to move it over to mainstream dealers. After they drop the price of course.

The current price-gouging on the Honda is not a permanent condition.........

Like I said it's a different market to Australia.

If you look at the prices of the 2 bikes elsewhere then I would actually argue that the Honda is under-priced in Thailand rather than the Kawasaki being over-priced. Hence the lack of supply in comparison to the demand, the result being that dealers are quoting well above the RRP and still selling what few bikes they have, making the extra profits themselves at the expense of the reputation of AP Honda. That's Honda's problem not Kawasaki's. Good for the consumers that like the CBR250 though (assuming they can get it within 10k of RRP).

Either we can say the Kawasaki is over-priced since it costs more than it does 1/2 the way around the world (even if you want to make the point about the FI, there's still S&H and import and certification and...) or we can say that the Honda is under-priced since it cost so much less than it does 1/2 the way around the world (a directly comparable situation).

If we're to assume that HondaUSA dealers make 5% on each CBR they sell, and they're paying LOS MSRP, than shipping/fees is some 14 300 THB. If Kawasaki dealers in the States pay the same shipping/fees, and have the same profit margin, that means that they're getting the carb'd Ninja for the same 100 000 THB. Is the fuel injection system on the LOS version really worth 47 000 THB?

I think you're comparing to the US right?. Bikes are notoriously cheap in the US. If you compared to Europe then the Ninja is still pretty good value in LOS. The strength of the baht (or at least the relative weakness of some of our home currencies such as USD, GBP etc) also makes the bike look more expensive here than it really is, you can't expect Kawasaki Thailand to reduce the cost of a bike because expats are dividing the baht price by 30 to decide if it's good value instead of dividing by 40. Plus as you say the spec of the Ninja in the US is lower (carb vs. FI).

[dave_boo]

I think you're comparing to the US right?. Bikes are notoriously cheap in the US. If you compared to Europe then the Ninja is still pretty good value in LOS. The strength of the baht (or at least the relative weakness of some of our home currencies such as USD, GBP etc) also makes the bike look more expensive here than it really is, you can't expect Kawasaki Thailand to reduce the cost of a bike because expats are dividing the baht price by 30 to decide if it's good value instead of dividing by 40. Plus as you say the spec of the Ninja in the US is lower (carb vs. FI).

Yep, was comparing to the States. Everything is cheaper in the States (well except probably love). However, even though the Ninja was released in 2008, and other than a slight increase it has remained essentially the same price in the States. Since mid 2008 the USD has fallen some 12% against the THB...and yet the Ninja hasn't gone up +12%...has it?

Guess I'm trying to figure out exactly how much 'overpriced' it is in LOS. The lower spec bike sold in the States has stayed the same price and in fact has started to make the dealerships less money, and so why is the slightly higher spec (even though it makes less power according to numerous FI dyno graphs) bike cost so much more?

Edited May 9, 2011 by dave_boo

[JonnyF]

I think you're comparing to the US right?. Bikes are notoriously cheap in the US. If you compared to Europe then the Ninja is still pretty good value in LOS. The strength of the baht (or at least the relative weakness of some of our home currencies such as USD, GBP etc) also makes the bike look more expensive here than it really is, you can't expect Kawasaki Thailand to reduce the cost of a bike because expats are dividing the baht price by 30 to decide if it's good value instead of dividing by 40. Plus as you say the spec of the Ninja in the US is lower (carb vs. FI).

Yep, was comparing to the States. Everything is cheaper in the States (well except probably love). However, even though the Ninja was released in 2008, and other than a slight increase it has remained essentially the same price in the States. Since mid 2008 the USD has fallen some 12% against the THB...and yet the Ninja hasn't gone up +12%...has it?

Guess I'm trying to figure out exactly how much 'overpriced' it is in LOS. The lower spec bike sold in the States has stayed the same price and in fact has started to make the dealerships less money, and so why is the slightly higher spec (even though it makes less power according to numerous FI dyno graphs) bike cost so much more?

Yeah it's all relative. When I paid 139,000 for the NInja at around 60 to the pound it was about 2300 pounds in LOS compared to just under 4000 in the UK. Even with the price increase of the Ninja and crash of the pound it's 3000 pounds here compared to 4100 in the UK. The CBR is priced around the same as the Ninja over there which is why I said that the CBR is underpriced here rather then the Ninja being overpriced. The market reaction to the CBR here kind of proves my point (more demand than supply, dealers fleecing customers etc). Of course if you compare Thailand to one of the cheapest countries in the world to buy bikes (who's currency has also recently collapsed) then you can make a case for the Ninja being expensive here, but there's a whole world outside of the US that says the Ninja price here is about right.

Good news if you live in Thailand and like the CBR.

Edited May 9, 2011 by JonnyF

[JUDAS]

I still don't think that dropping the price of the Ninja to compete with the incredibly low rrp of the CBR (even though it's very tough to buy the CBR at rrp) is a good marketing move considering how Kawasaki have set themselves in the market. It wouldn't make sense to do so.

It obviously made sense to Kawasaki (Australia)!

It might be time for Kawasaki Thailand to drop selling the 250 from their Big Bike Shops and endeavor to move it over to mainstream dealers. After they drop the price of course.

The current price-gouging on the Honda is not a permanent condition.........

Do Kawasaki actually still have dealerships in Thailand apart from those offering the 'big bikes?' As far as I know, the only scooter they still sell here is the Kaze. In 12 years here I honestly can't recall ever seeing a Kawa shop selling scooters.

[snowflake]

Why all the bickering of the cost of these two bikes? Who really cares?

A few thousand baht is nice to save, but the people that can afford these bikes dont care... I have said before- honda has a dealership here in town- kawa does not... That is the deciding item for me... Two good bikes, not very different but enough to pick one above the other... If you cant afford either, get the cbr 150 or stay away from bikes...

What it cost on the other side of the world is not relevant- why? We are not there, we are here... Grow up or move there!

The kawa is sports focused- the cbr is not... Which is better? Hard to say since the small differences makes them aimed at different beginners...

Honda is brilliant since they sell these bikes at all dealerships- kawa should do the same...

Rant is over...

[snowflake]

Why all the bickering of the cost of these two bikes? Who really cares?

A few thousand baht is nice to save, but the people that can afford these bikes dont care... I have said before- honda has a dealership here in town- kawa does not... That is the deciding item for me... Two good bikes, not very different but enough to pick one above the other... If you cant afford either, get the cbr 150 or stay away from bikes...

What it cost on the other side of the world is not relevant- why? We are not there, we are here... Grow up or move there!

The kawa is sports focused- the cbr is not... Which is better? Hard to say since the small differences makes them aimed at different beginners...

Honda is brilliant since they sell these bikes at all dealerships- kawa should do the same...

Rant is over...

[hachii]

This is the best review yet,

http://www.mcnews.co...2011Apr250s.pdf

very comprehensive, it covers most of the important aspects, not on sheer performance only.

Edited May 9, 2011 by hachii

[BigBikeBKK]

Why all the bickering of the cost of these two bikes? Who really cares?

A few thousand baht is nice to save, but the people that can afford these bikes dont care... I have said before- honda has a dealership here in town- kawa does not... That is the deciding item for me... Two good bikes, not very different but enough to pick one above the other... If you cant afford either, get the cbr 150 or stay away from bikes...

What it cost on the other side of the world is not relevant- why? We are not there, we are here... Grow up or move there!

The kawa is sports focused- the cbr is not... Which is better? Hard to say since the small differences makes them aimed at different beginners...

Honda is brilliant since they sell these bikes at all dealerships- kawa should do the same...

Rant is over...

Feel better?

Funny- you've posted several times that one reason you bought the CBR is because you can't afford anything bigger... (But you're saving for a Versys...)

Sure, Honda sells these bikes at more dealerships, but are those dealers actually trained to service and repair said bikes? As we've read from other CBR owners, the answer seems to be NO- when the bikes break they need to be sent back to the factory or a main dealer for repairs.

Hope you enjoy your bike.

Happy Trails!

[skybluestu]

This is the best review yet,

http://www.mcnews.co...2011Apr250s.pdf

very comprehensive, it covers most of the important aspects, not on sheer performance only.

I agree, the most in-depth review yet which covers pretty much everything.

Guess this thread can be closed now as, apart from a couple of big-bike owners who think they're Max Biaggi, the majority of the vastly experienced motorbike journalists who have compared the two bikes have given their verdict to the CBR

I know whose opinion I'll be listening to

[JonnyF]

Why all the bickering of the cost of these two bikes? Who really cares?

A few thousand baht is nice to save, but the people that can afford these bikes dont care... I have said before- honda has a dealership here in town- kawa does not... That is the deciding item for me... Two good bikes, not very different but enough to pick one above the other... If you cant afford either, get the cbr 150 or stay away from bikes...

What it cost on the other side of the world is not relevant- why? We are not there, we are here... Grow up or move there!

The kawa is sports focused- the cbr is not... Which is better? Hard to say since the small differences makes them aimed at different beginners...

Honda is brilliant since they sell these bikes at all dealerships- kawa should do the same...

Rant is over...

The deciding factor was Honda having a dealership in town and yet you've repeatedly posted about swapping the CBR for a bigger Kawasaki in a few months time? OK

PS this is a forum, if you don't like people debating the pros and cons of the 2 bikes then don't click on the thread any more.

[JonnyF]

This is the best review yet,

http://www.mcnews.co...2011Apr250s.pdf

very comprehensive, it covers most of the important aspects, not on sheer performance only.

I agree, the most in-depth review yet which covers pretty much everything.

Guess this thread can be closed now as, apart from a couple of big-bike owners who think they're Max Biaggi, the majority of the vastly experienced motorbike journalists who have compared the two bikes have given their verdict to the CBR

I know whose opinion I'll be listening to

Short memory? Or just selective? I think you've conveniently missed a few reviews by experienced journalists posted right here on this thread. You might want to go back and watch the YouTube reviews a couple of pages back if you've forgotten them already.

[nikster]

This is the best review yet,

http://www.mcnews.co...2011Apr250s.pdf

very comprehensive, it covers most of the important aspects, not on sheer performance only.

All I can say after reading this is - 'nuff said. Most informative comparison test so far, and it has *all* the test data, dyno data, specs, and practical ride tests you could ever want. The Ninja 250 wins by a hair in nearly all tests (acceleration, top speed, braking), yet the CBR 250R is more practical and fun to ride day to day thanks to low rev torque. ABS would make it better at braking, too.

Tony's right that the dealership "advantage" Honda has is a bit of an illusion. Quantity over quality there. Loads of clueless dealers vs. a handful high quality kawasaki-trained garages. Still if you're out in the sticks, one clueless dealer is probably better than none at all....

[thaicbr]

+1 to what Nikster said.. A very good review.

[skybluestu]

This is the best review yet,

http://www.mcnews.co...2011Apr250s.pdf

very comprehensive, it covers most of the important aspects, not on sheer performance only.

Nikster, did you actually read the review? Here are results in a nutshell

Engine-CBR

Transmission/Clutch-CBR

Chassis/Handling-Tie

Suspension-Ninja

Brakes/Wheels/Tyres-Ninja

Riding impression- Tie

Instruments & Controls-Tie

Attention to detail-CBR

Value-CBR

Ergonomics-CBR

OVERALL-CBR

Both the testers, Dave Searle & Danny Coe, said they preferred the CBR.

All I can say after reading this is - 'nuff said. Most informative comparison test so far, and it has *all* the test data, dyno data, specs, and practical ride tests you could ever want. The Ninja 250 wins by a hair in nearly all tests (acceleration, top speed, braking), yet the CBR 250R is more practical and fun to ride day to day thanks to low rev torque. ABS would make it better at braking, too.

Tony's right that the dealership "advantage" Honda has is a bit of an illusion. Quantity over quality there. Loads of clueless dealers vs. a handful high quality kawasaki-trained garages. Still if you're out in the sticks, one clueless dealer is probably better than none at all....

[skybluestu]

+1 to what Nikster said.. A very good review.

How can you say +1 when he claimed the Ninja was the winner when it wasn't?!

[thaicbr]

i can say that because he said "Ninja 250 wins by a hair in nearly all tests (acceleration, top speed, braking)" which it did.........The Honda won on some other tests.

Jeeze even after all these pages you guys STILL haven't figured out what this test has in black and white.

IF you want a very good all round bike, good comfort etc and the option of ABS then the CBR250 is the one.

IF you want a bike for all round use BUT also a bit more sporty/track oriented then the Ninja is the one.

i PERSONALLY prefer the Honda CBR for what i believe is a better riders position for every day riding (at least for me) and the ability to transport a pillion in comfort/safety.

ps The comments on the suspension of the CBR are a little unsettling as i also noted them.eg slightly harsh. i wonder if the front forks are set up correctly oil weight/ quantity. Or in fact do they break in and get smoother.

Edited May 10, 2011 by thaicbr