Bangkok Needs To Change Its Thinking On South

[webfact]

BURNING ISSUE

Bangkok needs to change its thinking on South

By Pravit Rojanaphruk

The Nation

Unable to break the cycle of violence and ignorance caused by ultra-nationalism, many Thais appear trapped, as melodramatic tragedy in the three provinces of the deep South unfolds yet again.

Last week's attack on an Army outpost in Narathiwat province by alleged separatist militants that led to four deaths, at least seven injuries and the theft of dozens of guns is another classic example which is bound to repeat itself.

This time Army Captain Krit Kampirayan, who was among those killed, was the main "protagonist" to be dramatised by the Thai media.

In the following days, thanks to the mainstream media, we learned quite a bit about his personal life, his soon-to-be-completed PhD studies, his fiancee, his family and even his honeymoon plans. And so the public wept for him.

Little is known about the lower-ranking officers killed or injured, however. And whenever alleged separatists are killed or captured, they are treated by the media as if they are statistics.

The cycle then continues: a new "protagonist" is killed, eulogised in a melodramatic way for a few days by the media and then it's "over". The only differences may be the province where the tragedy takes place and the number of those killed. Then we're ready for the cycle to repeat itself anew with little or no change in the psyche of the Thai public.

The majority of the public will somehow never learn to ask how the distorted Bangkok-centric history of Thailand and Pattani we learned at school shaped our view that more suppression, distrust and denial of local people's rights is the answer.

People will continue to fail to connect this with the fact that schoolteachers in the deep South are so often targeted by separatists - as if education cannot be used as a propaganda tool.

The mainstream media, especially the Thai-language media, will continue to refer to the majority of people in the deep South not as Thai-Malay Muslims, but merely as Thai Muslims, denying their living Malay identity.

Separatists, meanwhile, will continue to be branded by the media as "southern goons" or "jon tai" in Thai, as if they have no political ideology whatsoever.

A few years back this writer asked a senior police officer in Pattani if an elected governor might help alleviate the sense of alienation among Thai-Malay Muslims, who since being co-opted into Thailand a century ago have had to put up with governors appointed by Bangkok. The answer was a definite "no".

"This will surely become a highway to secession," the officer replied.

Given these circumstances, the question we ought to ask is this: How many more will have to die before we come to our senses and recognise that the problem is rooted in the fact that Pattani did not willingly join Siam and was never really treated as equal?

In any marriage, people ought to have the right to divorce if one or both parties are unhappy. But this was a rape. If we fail to ensure that a decent level of respect and rights are accorded to the Thai-Malay Muslims of today, what's the point in hanging on?

The melodramas played out in the aftermath of tragedy will continue until there is a substantial change in the public and the government's attitude to addressing the issue.

As long as Pattani and the surrounding areas continue to be treated as an internal colony of Thailand ruled by the military, as long as arrest without charge and re-training camps are acceptable, as long as torture and forced disappearances continue, there will be no ending to this melodramatic cycle of tragedy.

-- The Nation 2011-01-26

[Edwin Buurman]

Igreat and refreshing article

[junglist]

The most wisdom I have seen in print regarding the matter. The endless violence needs to stop and parties on both sides need to be praised and punished. The Thai culture will have to adapt to fit these people or it will have to let them go their own way to see the senseless violence end. We put author, well put.

[jillwilliams999]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

Edited January 27, 2011 by metisdead
Speculation, comments and discussion of either a political or personal nature are not allowed when discussing HM The King or the Royal family.

[OzMick]

YES! Great article. the Neville Chamberlain solution to all Thailand's problems. Worked with the Japs, didn't it - drop your tweeds, bend over, it won't hurt much.

<br>But where do we stop? There are substantial Muslim populations in all the southern provinces at least as far north as Ranong and Chumpon, quite a few mosques in BKK. When muslims in those areas demand madrassas instead of public schools, give it to them, let them turn out unemployable brain-washed idiots who feel discriminated against because they can't get a decent job. A generation or 2 later, whoops, there goes another 3 or 4 provinces to the Greater Islamic Nation. You might also ask who is funding these modern day Robin Hoods?<br><br

>It is the stated aim of Muslim expansionists that Thailand, PI and AUSTRALIA will become muslim countries - not just Pattani, or Mindanoa, or Bankstown. It may take centuries, but persistence wins unless it is stopped by their arch enemy EDUCATION. Why do you think so many teachers have been targeted in the south? The harsh light of informed critical thought kills blind faith stony dead. <b

r>Any 6 year-old not fed on religious crap will look at the myth of Adam and Eve and ask who did their sons marry. Any 7 year-old who grasps that matter is neither created or destroyed will ask Noah where did all that water come from and go to. And when just one story in the infallible word of god is exposed as a lie, the whole stinking turd gets flushed away.<br

><br>So you want a solution, Close all private schools, or at least impose a strictly supervised curriculum with a minimum of religious education, and an emphasis on Maths, Reading & Writing, , and transportable job skills. You could even try a little Sex Education and Critical Thinking 101, but teaching those would be a high-risk occupation. the Jesuits say "Give us the boy and we will give you the man," keep them away from malleable young minds and the youth will tell them to stick their stupid ideas.<br>

<br>Do you know what one of the loudest complaints by the locals against the RTA? Too many muslim girls are attracted to the smooth-talking big-city slick-Harry soldiers, having relationships with them (punishment ranges from whipping to stoning to death if they got past hand-holding), and worst of all, even marrying a heathen and moving to the god-forsaken north. That is theft of a valuable chattel!  <br>

Edited January 26, 2011 by OzMick

[AZBill]

But this is the great democracy of SE Asia! A shining example to all those other corrupt and oppressive governments over here! Of course any of us that have actually lived in a democracy know that we view their claim to democracy as a very bad joke. Only the Thais are under the dilusion - not the rest of the civilized world. Of course no decent government operating on democratic ideals treats any part of their population like this. The Thai government is cronyism at its worst and I put it in the lowest tier of 3rd world backward governments. Until the Thai people demand better, they will never get better. We in the US fought a revolution for our democracy. I doubt such boldness will ever happen here. The only fights here occur between waring factions of the corrupt elite so same same! BTW - its so sweet the Thai government allows its own citizens to buy land and that some on this board compare these people to dogs. In a true democracy everyone has an equal opportunity - even us lowly farangs!. That is precisely why Thai claims to democracy are a complete joke to the rest of the world and we view their so-called elite as another joke where by our western standards even a middle class American has far more wealth than they pretend to have here in their "elite" class - farang all rich right? RIGHT!!!!!! And why is that? Because we come from a true democracy where we are rewarded for our efforts and not on how white our skin is! That kind of idiotic prejudice alone says it all! Note - the sun is actually good for you!

[OzMick]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

If you pick up a starving Dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This Is the main difference between a Dog and a Man.

- Mark Twain -

but what if the dog refuses to become prosperous?

[OzMick]

But this is the great democracy of SE Asia! A shining example to all those other corrupt and oppressive governments over here! Of course any of us that have actually lived in a democracy know that we view their claim to democracy as a very bad joke. Only the Thais are under the dilusion - not the rest of the civilized world. Of course no decent government operating on democratic ideals treats any part of their population like this. The Thai government is cronyism at its worst and I put it in the lowest tier of 3rd world backward governments. Until the Thai people demand better, they will never get better. We in the US fought a revolution for our democracy. I doubt such boldness will ever happen here. The only fights here occur between waring factions of the corrupt elite so same same! BTW - its so sweet the Thai government allows its own citizens to buy land and that some on this board compare these people to dogs. In a true democracy everyone has an equal opportunity - even us lowly farangs!. That is precisely why Thai claims to democracy are a complete joke to the rest of the world and we view their so-called elite as another joke where by our western standards even a middle class American has far more wealth than they pretend to have here in their "elite" class - farang all rich right? RIGHT!!!!!! And why is that? Because we come from a true democracy where we are rewarded for our efforts and not on how white our skin is! That kind of idiotic prejudice alone says it all! Note - the sun is actually good for you!

" even a middle class American has far more wealth than they pretend to have here in their "elite" class"

I don't think this is true even before the financial crisis. And with the Yankee Peso trading at B30, the "value" of US housing dropping in $ terms, it is even less believable. But I will happily admit that I am wrong when you show your refences.

"........ not on how white our skin is! That kind of idiotic prejudice........." echoes of MLK, but they shot him, didn't they.

Edited January 26, 2011 by OzMick

[junglist]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

History is not your strong point. There might be no country called Thailand without these Dogs you spoke of. They helped stop Thailand from becoming The People Republic of Siam and got stabbed the back for it from the Thais, USA and UK. I just see a sad story getting sadder every day.

[phetaroi]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

When discussing serious topics, a little humor is always welcome.

You are joking, aren't you?

[junglist]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

When discussing serious topics, a little humor is always welcome.

You are joking, aren't you?

I wish. Sad but true this is a common view. Most Thais are doomed to repeat the History the schools do teach. The videos of the soldiers torturing the southerners are now all over YouTube and Aljazeera. Things will get worse; they demanded justice even took their case to the highest court in the land only to be made fools. Instead of justice they were given false teeth.

A father beaten to death in front of his two sons no one punished. The military has just produced a generation who only know hate and want revenge. Sad times.

[mrdjt]

YES! Great article. the Neville Chamberlain solution to all Thailand's problems. Worked with the Japs, didn't it - drop your tweeds, bend over, it won't hurt much.

<br>But where do we stop? There are substantial Muslim populations in all the southern provinces at least as far north as Ranong and Chumpon, quite a few mosques in BKK. When muslims in those areas demand madrassas instead of public schools, give it to them, let them turn out unemployable brain-washed idiots who feel discriminated against because they can't get a decent job. A generation or 2 later, whoops, there goes another 3 or 4 provinces to the Greater Islamic Nation. You might also ask who is funding these modern day Robin Hoods?<br><br

>It is the stated aim of Muslim expansionists that Thailand, PI and AUSTRALIA will become muslim countries - not just Pattani, or Mindanoa, or Bankstown. It may take centuries, but persistence wins unless it is stopped by their arch enemy EDUCATION. Why do you think so many teachers have been targeted in the south? The harsh light of informed critical thought kills blind faith stony dead. <b

r>Any 6 year-old not fed on religious crap will look at the myth of Adam and Eve and ask who did their sons marry. Any 7 year-old who grasps that matter is neither created or destroyed will ask Noah where did all that water come from and go to. And when just one story in the infallible word of god is exposed as a lie, the whole stinking turd gets flushed away.<br

><br>So you want a solution, Close all private schools, or at least impose a strictly supervised curriculum with a minimum of religious education, and an emphasis on Maths, Reading & Writing, , and transportable job skills. You could even try a little Sex Education and Critical Thinking 101, but teaching those would be a high-risk occupation. the Jesuits say "Give us the boy and we will give you the man," keep them away from malleable young minds and the youth will tell them to stick their stupid ideas.<br>

<br>Do you know what one of the loudest complaints by the locals against the RTA? Too many muslim girls are attracted to the smooth-talking big-city slick-Harry soldiers, having relationships with them (punishment ranges from whipping to stoning to death if they got past hand-holding), and worst of all, even marrying a heathen and moving to the god-forsaken north. That is theft of a valuable chattel!  <br>

Nice one Mick.

[TimTang]

The Saudis are building mosques, and madrassas, funding them and providing religious clerics to ensure that the boys are being raised and indoctrinated in the brutal wahabi form of Islam prevalent in Saudi.

Before the war in Iraq, Thai muslims were receiving terrorist and military training in both Iraq and Syria. I'm not sure where they're being trained now but I'm sure it's still happening.

If Thailand granted them independence they would slowly migrate into the next province, multiply like rabbits then start the same covert low intensity war fare we see today. They would then claim that they are victims and demand possession of that province as well. The media would report "the predominantly muslim province of _______"; They always say "predominantly muslim" because anyone that values their life would be stupid to remain. It's like saying "The predominantly muslim city of Constantinople will be changing their name to Istanbul after the successful genocide campaign reduced the Christian population by 90%".

The whole world (not just Thailand) has become too PC to effectively deal with the expansionist nature of Islam. Sooner or later the $hit is gonna hit the fan.

Edited January 26, 2011 by TimTang

[TheGhostWithin]

TimTang,

Your statement that Thais receive training in Terrorist camps is true - before Iraq and Syria, now the Phils and particularly Indonesia, Malaysia.

The latest bombing happened in Yaha district, less than 2 hours from the Malaysian border. The weapons and violence are coming from Malaysian borders, and are being funded by (as you suggest the Saudis, possibly, though I have no proof of this), Muslim businesses within Thailand (I NEVER buy from someone I can see is a Muslim, even if it is the last drop of water on the planet), and drugs coming from Malaysia. How do you think they get all of those new motorbikes in the south if they have such high unemployment?

The government should not bow to these terrorists, instead they should be closing the Muslim schools in the south, and have government run Muslim teaching institutions where the Government has complete control over what is taught - in THAI language, and Thai script writing.. none of this Malaysian writing rubbish. The border needs to be strengthened on both Thai and Malay sides, and anyone going in or out needs to be checked much like the system in USA. I’m proud of what the soldiers do, and admire the Buddhists for holding their ground.

Appointing Muslims to power to satisfy them does not work - in my own workplace, we took on a Muslim within management, and since then his "brothers" are the only ones to receive promotion while my fellow New Zealanders sit and watch Muslims promoted above them, even though the Muslims are only new to the company. Remember, anyone who is a non believer is the enemy - they never lose sight of it, nor should we - and we should act accordingly, as they do. They would not promote us before their brethren, so why should we? The only ones who have repelled terrorist acts are Israel, and love them or hate them their example is the only way that has worked. I small city state that has repelled every terrorist organisation you can think of, and done a dam_n good job of it.

Remember, the Muslim religion is fighting a "holy war" against Buddhists in Thailand, against Catholics in Philippines, Christians in Indonesia, Christians in Iraq, Christians (the west) in Afghanistan, Christians in Sudan, Orthodox Christians in Russia, the Chinese in western China, the government of Myanmar/Burma (from Aceh province) , and Hindus in India - that is just off the top of my head, now, tell me who is the real aggressor? Show me one other religion fighting against as many religions as this, at any one time. I don’t buy from Muslim shops, don't interact with Muslims, don’t employ Muslims, wouldn't sell my land to Muslims. This PC approach to stopping terrorism and Muslim aggression has to end if we are ever going to have peace.

Edited January 26, 2011 by TheGhostWithin

[khaowong1]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

[khaowong1]

TimTang,

Your statement that Thais receive training in Terrorist camps is true - before Iraq and Syria, now the Phils and particularly Indonesia, Malaysia.

The latest bombing happened in Yaha district, less than 2 hours from the Malaysian border. The weapons and violence are coming from Malaysian borders, and are being funded by (as you suggest the Saudis, possibly, though I have no proof of this), Muslim businesses within Thailand (I NEVER buy from someone I can see is a Muslim, even if it is the last drop of water on the planet), and drugs coming from Malaysia. How do you think they get all of those new motorbikes in the south if they have such high unemployment?

The government should not bow to these terrorists, instead they should be closing the Muslim schools in the south, and have government run Muslim teaching institutions where the Government has complete control over what is taught - in THAI language, and Thai script writing.. none of this Malaysian writing rubbish. The border needs to be strengthened on both Thai and Malay sides, and anyone going in or out needs to be checked much like the system in USA. I’m proud of what the soldiers do, and admire the Buddhists for holding their ground.

Appointing Muslims to power to satisfy them does not work - in my own workplace, we took on a Muslim within management, and since then his "brothers" are the only ones to receive promotion while my fellow New Zealanders sit and watch Muslims promoted above them, even though the Muslims are only new to the company. Remember, anyone who is a non believer is the enemy - they never lose sight of it, nor should we - and we should act accordingly, as they do. They would not promote us before their brethren, so why should we? The only ones who have repelled terrorist acts are Israel, and love them or hate them their example is the only way that has worked. I small city state that has repelled every terrorist organisation you can think of, and done a dam_n good job of it.

Remember, the Muslim religion is fighting a "holy war" against Buddhists in Thailand, against Catholics in Philippines, Christians in Indonesia, Christians in Iraq, Christians (the west) in Afghanistan, Christians in Sudan, Orthodox Christians in Russia, the Chinese in western China, the government of Myanmar/Burma (from Aceh province) , and Hindus in India - that is just off the top of my head, now, tell me who is the real aggressor? Show me one other religion fighting against as many religions as this, at any one time. I don’t buy from Muslim shops, don't interact with Muslims, don’t employ Muslims, wouldn't sell my land to Muslims. This PC approach to stopping terrorism and Muslim aggression has to end if we are ever going to have peace.

Well said. As a Buddhist, I don't believe in violence but turning the other cheek, so to speak. But even we Buddhists don't understand the Muslim religion. Can someone explain how this crap can come to a decent ending?

[khaowong1]

The Saudis are building mosques, and madrassas, funding them and providing religious clerics to ensure that the boys are being raised and indoctrinated in the brutal wahabi form of Islam prevalent in Saudi.

Before the war in Iraq, Thai muslims were receiving terrorist and military training in both Iraq and Syria. I'm not sure where they're being trained now but I'm sure it's still happening.

If Thailand granted them independence they would slowly migrate into the next province, multiply like rabbits then start the same covert low intensity war fare we see today. They would then claim that they are victims and demand possession of that province as well. The media would report "the predominantly muslim province of _______"; They always say "predominantly muslim" because anyone that values their life would be stupid to remain. It's like saying "The predominantly muslim city of Constantinople will be changing their name to Istanbul after the successful genocide campaign reduced the Christian population by 90%".

The whole world (not just Thailand) has become too PC to effectively deal with the expansionist nature of Islam. Sooner or later the $hit is gonna hit the fan.

Do you mean, &lt;deleted&gt;, is going to hit the fan.

[cyberia]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

are you Thai?

[TimTang]

...Remember, the Muslim religion is fighting a "holy war" against Buddhists in Thailand...

I'm just worried about when they'll decide to start their covert war in Bangkok. They've already prepared for it, they are just waiting for the green light.

The next time you drive into Bangkok, regardless where your coming from, you'll notice there are large mosques lining the highway as you enter the city. If you take a closer look you'll notice they're practically empty. Each one has a staff of about 3 or 4 that just maintain it and scream out their prayers 5 times a day.

Why do you suppose the Saudi's would fund the building of large mosques at a cost of millions if not billions world wide, which are virtually empty and are in neighborhoods where there are very few if any muslims? Firstly they serve as a subliminal billboard for Islam, Secondly they are optimistic that if their plan is successful they won't be empty when their ultimate plan has taken effect. In the event of war they become command and control centers for plotting and planning, a place to store arms, and a focal point for pep rallies to rile up the believers with the necessary blood-lust to go out a kill the infidels.

Take a boat ride some day on one or any of the klongs. You'll notice that most of these regions have been monopolized with mosques. It's just one after another; mosque after mosque after mosque. If you were engaged in a civil war within a metropolis wouldn't it be handy to have a waterway to supply the necessary weaponry and other essentials?

These people are at war with us but we refuse to even acknowledge it. I hope people start to wake up, look around, and get a grip with what's happening in our midst before it's too late. Since our own media is now owned and controlled by petrol dollars, not to mention the Saudi lobbyists that also control our own politicians, the odds are pretty slim that will ever happen soon.

[asiawatcher]

TimTang,

Your statement that Thais receive training in Terrorist camps is true - before Iraq and Syria, now the Phils and particularly Indonesia, Malaysia.

The latest bombing happened in Yaha district, less than 2 hours from the Malaysian border. The weapons and violence are coming from Malaysian borders, and are being funded by (as you suggest the Saudis, possibly, though I have no proof of this), Muslim businesses within Thailand (I NEVER buy from someone I can see is a Muslim, even if it is the last drop of water on the planet), and drugs coming from Malaysia. How do you think they get all of those new motorbikes in the south if they have such high unemployment?

The government should not bow to these terrorists, instead they should be closing the Muslim schools in the south, and have government run Muslim teaching institutions where the Government has complete control over what is taught - in THAI language, and Thai script writing.. none of this Malaysian writing rubbish. The border needs to be strengthened on both Thai and Malay sides, and anyone going in or out needs to be checked much like the system in USA. I'm proud of what the soldiers do, and admire the Buddhists for holding their ground.

Appointing Muslims to power to satisfy them does not work - in my own workplace, we took on a Muslim within management, and since then his "brothers" are the only ones to receive promotion while my fellow New Zealanders sit and watch Muslims promoted above them, even though the Muslims are only new to the company. Remember, anyone who is a non believer is the enemy - they never lose sight of it, nor should we - and we should act accordingly, as they do. They would not promote us before their brethren, so why should we? The only ones who have repelled terrorist acts are Israel, and love them or hate them their example is the only way that has worked. I small city state that has repelled every terrorist organisation you can think of, and done a dam_n good job of it.

Remember, the Muslim religion is fighting a "holy war" against Buddhists in Thailand, against Catholics in Philippines, Christians in Indonesia, Christians in Iraq, Christians (the west) in Afghanistan, Christians in Sudan, Orthodox Christians in Russia, the Chinese in western China, the government of Myanmar/Burma (from Aceh province) , and Hindus in India - that is just off the top of my head, now, tell me who is the real aggressor? Show me one other religion fighting against as many religions as this, at any one time. I don't buy from Muslim shops, don't interact with Muslims, don't employ Muslims, wouldn't sell my land to Muslims. This PC approach to stopping terrorism and Muslim aggression has to end if we are ever going to have peace.

I couldn't agree more - and the time to get tough is now - as mentioned in previous posts - there are arguments for both sides. Human rights (I hate that cliche) and the 'rights' of ethnic Thai's to live peacefully in their chosen province is all able to be integrated only if the Muslim 'hate' machine is stopped. You may refuse to integrate with Muslims but the same is true of them - they do not integrate, usually keep to themselves and create Muslim caches in suburbia in all countries. It may be a tough call but unless there is some sanity such as banning speakers blaring out 'the message' across population that has no interest in their garbage, and unless there is change of (as OzMick says) education, this will continue. It may not be a popular decision and it will be a tough call to administer to start but it HAS to happen and Thailand should be the first to get past all this political correctness bullsh*t. After all - it is the Muslims who are declaring the war on the rest of the world, not us.

Edited January 27, 2011 by asiawatcher

[jayjay0]

TimTang,

Your statement that Thais receive training in Terrorist camps is true - before Iraq and Syria, now the Phils and particularly Indonesia, Malaysia.

The latest bombing happened in Yaha district, less than 2 hours from the Malaysian border. The weapons and violence are coming from Malaysian borders, and are being funded by (as you suggest the Saudis, possibly, though I have no proof of this), Muslim businesses within Thailand (I NEVER buy from someone I can see is a Muslim, even if it is the last drop of water on the planet), and drugs coming from Malaysia. How do you think they get all of those new motorbikes in the south if they have such high unemployment?

The government should not bow to these terrorists, instead they should be closing the Muslim schools in the south, and have government run Muslim teaching institutions where the Government has complete control over what is taught - in THAI language, and Thai script writing.. none of this Malaysian writing rubbish. The border needs to be strengthened on both Thai and Malay sides, and anyone going in or out needs to be checked much like the system in USA. I'm proud of what the soldiers do, and admire the Buddhists for holding their ground.

Appointing Muslims to power to satisfy them does not work - in my own workplace, we took on a Muslim within management, and since then his "brothers" are the only ones to receive promotion while my fellow New Zealanders sit and watch Muslims promoted above them, even though the Muslims are only new to the company. Remember, anyone who is a non believer is the enemy - they never lose sight of it, nor should we - and we should act accordingly, as they do. They would not promote us before their brethren, so why should we? The only ones who have repelled terrorist acts are Israel, and love them or hate them their example is the only way that has worked. I small city state that has repelled every terrorist organisation you can think of, and done a dam_n good job of it.

Remember, the Muslim religion is fighting a "holy war" against Buddhists in Thailand, against Catholics in Philippines, Christians in Indonesia, Christians in Iraq, Christians (the west) in Afghanistan, Christians in Sudan, Orthodox Christians in Russia, the Chinese in western China, the government of Myanmar/Burma (from Aceh province) , and Hindus in India - that is just off the top of my head, now, tell me who is the real aggressor? Show me one other religion fighting against as many religions as this, at any one time. I don't buy from Muslim shops, don't interact with Muslims, don't employ Muslims, wouldn't sell my land to Muslims. This PC approach to stopping terrorism and Muslim aggression has to end if we are ever going to have peace.

I couldn't agree more - and the time to get tough is now - as mentioned in previous posts - there are arguments for both sides. Human rights (I hate that cliche) and the 'rights' of ethnic Thai's to live peacefully in their chosen province is all able to be integrated only if the Muslim 'hate' machine is stopped. You may refuse to integrate with Muslims but the same is true of them - they do not integrate, usually keep to themselves and create Muslim caches in suburbia in all countries. It may be a tough call but unless there is some sanity such as banning speakers blaring out 'the message' across population that has no interest in their garbage, and unless there is change of (as OzMick says) education, this will continue. It may not be a popular decision and it will be a tough call to administer to start but it HAS to happen and Thailand should be the first to get past all this political correctness bullsh*t. After all - it is the Muslims who are declaring the war on the rest of the world, not us.

Well said.

The only solution is to end it now. Human rights will be better served if the government concentrates on the human rights of the majority and crushes the minority.

Why is that when ever human rights are mentioned the only ones to benefit are the trouble makers.

They should have learned from the red shirts that there is no satisfactory answer for these people. The only way to stop them is with violence. and I don't mean Thaksin type violence.

[junglist]

your quote:

"They should have learned from the red shirts that there is no satisfactory answer for these people. The only way to stop them is with violence. and I don't mean Thaksin type violence."

Please tell me about the other types of violence you speak of? I have been waiting for more of the racist to post and you all said what I thought you would. You said I am scared and don't understand the people in the south. You want to fix this problem its simple. Punish the people on both sides that comment this terrible crime. The people in the south see a corrupt country filled with alcoholics that don't care about them and they have a point. The have lost faith in the Thai government and who can blame them. No all Muslims are bad not all Buddhist are good. Both sides need to shake the rotten fruit from their trees.

An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind.

Mohandas Gandhi

Edited January 27, 2011 by junglist

[Macmundi]

Not the muslims. Its only that bunch of extremists who we need to eradicate.

[junglist]

Not the muslims. Its only that bunch of extremists who we need to eradicate.

Now we have wisdom again.

[spidermike007]

The southern Muslim should have some gratitude to the Thai people and especially the <reference removed>. Thai people take them in, provide shelter, and protection from the Malay bandit. Thai people even allow Muslim to buy land (unlike Farang), and allow them 100% freedom to settle in Thailand with equal voting rights as Thai people (go ask a Kurd or Tibetan if they can vote). Give them an inch, and now they want a foot. What's next? A mile? ? ? Just imagine this story. A man was on his way back from market spot a helpless and homeless dog ran over by a bus. He pick it up, carry him home, nurse it, feed it, and provide a small shelter at the back of the house for the poor dog. He even provid it the freedom to roam around at will; unlike the chicken & pigs the owner kept. The dog survived and grew stronger everyday due to the celestial love given by the owner of the house. However, the dog think to itself. If I can chase the owner away, I will have the whole house to myself and all the food from the fridge, plus be a master of the chickens and pigs. So it began to bite the owner, trying to chase him off the house. This is no Aesop Fables or George Orwell, but kind of similar to the situation in Southern Thailand right now.

History is not your strong point. There might be no country called Thailand without these "Dogs you spoke of". They helped stop Thailand from becoming "The People Republic of Siam" and got stabbed the back for it from the Thai's, USA and UK. I just see a sad story getting sadder every day.

Yes, history is something that does not even enter the realm of your consciousness, does it? Thailand conquered the northern Malay provinces back in 1902, when they were referred to as the Pattani Sultanate. Has anyone ever given any serious thought to the idea of returning Pattani, Narathiwat, Yala, and Songkla to the Malaysians? Though it would be a potential "loss of face", what about the upside? Let Malaysia deal with their factions, and their extremists. No longer Thailand's problem. Think of what the country could achieve with lasting peace, and the potential prosperity that would ensue from it. What would they lose really?

[TimTang]

...You want to fix this problem its simple. Punish the people on both sides that comment this terrible crime. The people in the south see a corrupt country filled with alcoholics that don't care about them and they have a point...

"...I have been waiting for more of the racist to post..."

First of all Islam is not a race it's a religion and political ideology. Mohammed the so called prophet was WHITE and had RED HAIR. So don't throw the race card into the mix, that's already been tried and failed before.

So you say the entire country, with the exception of muslims, are a bunch of corrupt drunken alcoholics and you share their point of view. So it's OK for muslim terrorists to chop off the heads and burn the bodies of innocent rubber workers, bomb market places with the intent to kill as many innocent non-muslims as possible, murder teachers, policemen, and soldiers that have done absolutely nothing to anybody? In the mean time the GOOD muslims quietly support their actions both morally and financially while refusing to report the ones doing the killing.

Punish the people on BOTH SIDES? Have you been hiding in a cave for the last 20 years? Here's a news flash for you: It's the muslim terrorists that are committing the "terrible crimes". The reason that the army is down there in the first place is BECAUSE of the muslims committing those terrible crimes.

People like you that APOLOGIZE for the heinous crimes committed by muslims are just as guilty as the ones that swing the machetes. Muslims have been terrorizing their infidel neighbors for 1400 years and what we see happening in the south right now is straight from their war manual called the qaran.

Then you have the audacity to quote Ghandi to support you sick point of view. Ghandi realized that muslims simply cannot coexist with others and the only way to crate peace was to separate them from the rest of the population, so he created Pakistan.

Pakistan is now the number one terrorist state in the world. Along with exporting terror throughout the world they are also killing each other for being the wrong kind of muslim, not being muslim enough, or being non-muslim.

The new scam in Pakistan is killing Christians for blasphemy; last week a woman was charged with blasphemy for offering water to thirsty muslims. The muslims claimed the water was impure because it had been handled by an infidel. The lawyer that defended her case was shot cold blooded in broad daylight in front of hundreds of people. The shooter is now considered a national hero.

Edited January 27, 2011 by TimTang

[TimTang]

Thailand conquered the northern Malay provinces back in 1902, when they were referred to as the Pattani Sultanate. Has anyone ever given any serious thought to the idea of returning Pattani, Narathiwat, Yala, and Songkla to the Malaysians? Though it would be a potential "loss of face", what about the upside? Let Malaysia deal with their factions, and their extremists. No longer Thailand's problem. Think of what the country could achieve with lasting peace, and the potential prosperity that would ensue from it. What would they lose really?

"1785 - An Islamic takeover of Thailand was prevented by a Thai victory in over the Sultanate of Pattani in 1785. But for the people of Pattani, this war has not ended. The Muslim converts of Pattani never reconciled to the reconquest of Pattani by the Thais and continued to terrorize the Buddhist population intermittently throughout the 18th and 19th centuries. In the 20th and 21st centuries this rebellion has taken the form of an insurgency."

So you see they don't just want the bottom 5 provinces, they want the whole country. They've tried it many times before.

"Let Malaysia deal with their factions, and their extremists." Malaysia is already doing just that! Where do you think the weapons, foot soldiers, and financial support is coming from. Who do you think protects the terrorists when they flee south of the border?

You think by giving the provinces to Malaysia all fighting will stop? What will happen to the non-muslims that live there? Infidels are considered second class citizens in an Islamic theocracy. They are given three choices: 1)convert, 2)pay jizya tax and live as second class citizens, 3)DIE.

Why doesn't India just give Kashmir to Pakistan? Why doesn't Greece just give Cyprus to Turkey? Why doesn't Spain just rename the country to Andalusia and give it back to the muslims? Why doesn't East Timor give the country back to Indonesia? Why doesn't Israel give Gaza back to the Palestinians? Oh wait!...They already did, and we can see from the daily news how peaceful that turned out.

Edited January 27, 2011 by TimTang

[housepainter]

It is a cowardly article that offers nothing other than criticism.

The ultra nationalism engered amongst Thais is considerably by way of spouting the national anthem twice daily from cradle to grave. The words are extreme and offensive.

Do something about that. Like scrap it. In a sentence I have done more by way of positive proposal than you will find in the entire article. And yet Thais will not criticise their own system at the same time as suggesting alternative change.

Criticising reporting methods and then aping them is pure hypocrosy.

The Thais are incapable of diplomatic negotiation; they do not function at home and certainly not on a world stage; an igorant, violent people can not embrace peace. They remain a smiling murderous cruel people who beat to death the mentally ill on the streets of Bangkok who damage buddha images. That rivals any Iranian stoning or Pakistani cruelty.

Four kilometres of nothing land have the country poised on the brink of war. A turf war. And yet this article questions why there isn't a resolution for the South. The reds and yellows on the streets of Bangkok manage to paralyse the capitol now year in and year out. That small local difficulty is beyond the Thai mind as being unfathomable.

Then you have something that mirrors international problems by way of it being terrorisism. Complete meltdown.

The system like all rotten countries is awash with rampant corruption that allows for bottom of the barrell standards of Police, justice, education and welfare. Add to the mix the standard of living [in poverty] and the amount both debt and of prostitution, the hopless political situation and the threadbare democracy and you have a state balanced on the edge of failure.

The problems in Thailand are massive. You have thrid world amoral people in power.

The situation is hopeless.

We will continue to cherry pick and as soon as the mess impacts on expats and tourists we'll be on the next flight elsewhere.

[HAL9000]

We don't need to reinvent the wheel. General MacArthur solved the problem of dealing with violent religion in post-war Japan with the Shinto Directive.

In short, it allowed people to keep their religion as a personal and private devotion, but its manifestation in public was prohibited, such as education and politics.

Learn more here. Read into the comments section for historical information:

http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2010/08/robert-spencer-proposed-realistic.html

[Celticabdullah]

ting tang you have obviously studied islam and have decided to go on the path of deriding it like other no hopers.Allah says in Quran<this is a book that makes things clear>so i know u understood but have decided 2 to try and corrupt the unread 4 worldly gain.if u sow seeds well u get flowers otherwise thorns,may Allah make your garden grow,amin.