March 12, 201115 yr Other British styles like IPA and Porter can be fantastic ales but these are hard to find. They are popular styles with craft and home-brewers. Finally, German Kellerbiers (cellar beer) are similarly cask-conditioned, and for lagers, the only ones I've tried, quite amazing. The pub I mentioned earlier has both Porter and an excellent IPA also a seven hop IPA at 7.7%! German beer is good across the board only shame about the sausages.... I was walking down Hart Avenue in Tsim Sha Tsui and I came across a pub selling Deuchars IPA Mind, that was two or three years back... SC Deuchars IPA has been all over London for a few years now. Something to do with a brewery buy out. Doesn't surprise me to find its travelling to Hong Kong......plenty expat Scots over there! The Belhaven Stout has gone from JBs on Shi Da Road, so I'm told; I've stopped going to Tai Pei since I heard that SC
March 12, 201115 yr I still remember my first pint of Belhaven 90/ served at the Tally Ho in Dundee in the late '80s. Thought I was in a bakery for a moment! After three I'd no idea where I was.....
March 12, 201115 yr As I undwerstand, IPA was brewed to be pasteurised, kegged and shipped to foreign countries to make the soldiers bad tempered and belligerent; the Pale either refers to the morning after, or is a mis-spelling of pail - again, could be referring to the morning after, or the serving measureAs I say, of course the British know more about beer than the rest of you, but most of it we make up on the spur of the moment... SC IPA, or India Pale Ale, is named Pale for the Pale Malt(ed) Barley used to make this stronger style of ale, meant to survive months at sea, it was not pasteurized. Porter, an even darker style (made with chocolate malt, barley that is roasted), is so named for the people who drank it during the day, specifically Porters. During my visits to England I did search our real ales, and believe me it was quite challenging. Cask ale has made a pretty decent comeback as people realize how much better it is than mass-produced ale.
March 12, 201115 yr Last night I was drinking next to a Brit. After about 8 Changs I think Brits know everything about everything. Like sitting next to Cliff Claven.
March 12, 201115 yr Last night I was drinking next to a Brit. After about 8 Changs I think Brits know everything about everything. Like sitting next to Cliff Claven. NO, l only had 6 Chang's.
March 12, 201115 yr I think everyone thinks they are more intelligent when drunk. Brits just like to make sure everyone else knows it too. Louts. Seriously, based on the posts here I'd say the answer to the OP's question in a resounding "No". Disappointing? Yes. Unexpected? No.
March 12, 201115 yr I think everyone thinks they are more intelligent when drunk. Brits just like to make sure everyone else knows it too. Louts. Seriously, based on the posts here I'd say the answer to the OP's question in a resounding "No". Disappointing? Yes. Unexpected? No. Don't tell me, eeeeeeeer, your a yank.
March 12, 201115 yr I would say that most Brits of a certain age know a lot about British beer just as the American beer drinkers know about American beers. Britain has always had a 'pub culture' and the pub has always been an important part of the community. The reason that I mention age is that things do seem to be changing in the UK and most youngsters drink 'alchopop' type drinks. although strong ciders seem to be making a come back. I refer to 'Mangers' which seemed to be very popular during my last visit. The older guys like me prefer the real ales and there are many to be had in the North of England. I come from 'Taylors' country and most of the town pubs have this and guest beers on draft every day of the week. Taylor's landlord is one of the best bottled/draft beers that I have ever tasted and has won many a prize in the UK. Cheers, Rick
March 12, 201115 yr I still remember my first pint of Belhaven 90/ served at the Tally Ho in Dundee in the late '80s. Thought I was in a bakery for a moment! After three I'd no idea where I was..... Never try to spit after drinking Belhaven 90/... Reminds me of the joke about the chap who is challenged to take a drink from the spittoon "Steady on, mate, you didn;t need to drink it all!" "But it was all one big one" SC
March 12, 201115 yr I think everyone thinks they are more intelligent when drunk. Brits just like to make sure everyone else knows it too. Louts. Seriously, based on the posts here I'd say the answer to the OP's question in a resounding "No". Disappointing? Yes. Unexpected? No. Ahh yes lomatopo. This is the poster who said it was 'impossible' to have a pub serving 20 real ales at once and proceeded to attempt to lecture us on the reason why. Oddly enough you have been silent on the subject since being proved wrong haven't you? In fact when asked for specific information I provided exactly what you asked for...and could do the same for lots of places in the UK. Don't like that do you? You sir are a k***. Send me a PM if you need a translation.
March 12, 201115 yr Author From what I have read I would say Brits know more about beer than most others. I was kind of hoping for a German to post but none have. It would have been an interesting discussion the difference between top and bottom fermenting yeasts.
March 12, 201115 yr From what I have read I would say Brits know more about beer than most others. I was kind of hoping for a German to post but none have. It would have been an interesting discussion the difference between top and bottom fermenting yeasts. Oddly enough I like both but German lagers are fabulous. Yeah I would like to hear from a German brewer as well. I tried an Organic lager today which was no better than ordinary...UK real ale brewers are a long way off the mark with lagers but spot on with ales in my experience.
March 14, 201115 yr Lomatopo When in the UK try Weatherspoons(Witherspoons) pubs you'll find real at good prices They could be a chain of pubs selling top quality real ales showcasing the best of british food and being great places to visit. Only they are not. I'll leave it at that. Cheap beer is cheap beer... totster
March 14, 201115 yr Not much has changed in wine and the vineyards that produce them...eh? Apparently you are not aware of the competitions that began in 1976 where California vineyards trumped those in France. In France no less with French judges. http://www.wineintro...976tasting.html That is actually my point. There are people who can tell a great wine from a cheap wine. The people in 1855 who classified the French vineyards would have also been able to tell the excellence of Californian vineyards. The excellence of a wine establishes it's price not the reverse. Finding out how to judge wines takes a lot of study and experience. It also takes a lot of cash. It is not some marketing ploy. A person raised on Budweiser is not going to make a very good judge of excellence in beers. Once you know about ales it is not much of a stretch to learn about other beers. There are German beers and British beers the rest are combinations or descendent's of those two brewing styles. My basic point is that education or cultural values are necessary to appreciate good food and or beer or wine. I am not trying to dictate tastes but there is a difference between good food and average food. Som tom is not an example of culinary excellence nor is beer Chang beer. I could like som tom or Chang beer but I would never imply they great examples of excellence in cooking or brewing. The napa vineyard that won was educated but set thier first foot in France prior to wining the blind taste test. They actually gained most of their knowledge from migrants with no upper education. They(Cali) have dominted every blind french tasting since. It does not take money or education to educate a palate. A plethora of less expensive yet quality wines have been produced since at much less the price you insisit upon. You have a good knowledge of British ale but know little about wine. I have yet to see you admit you were wrong in anything you consider to be your field of expertise. If lack of humility were a crime you would be doing life
March 15, 201115 yr How Big is Anheuser-Busch/InBev? Anheuser-Busch/InBev is huge. There's simply no denying it. But how huge is huge? Let's take a moment to compare it against two other beer companies, and some of their brands. First off, Seattle based Elysian Brewing Company - Elysian Brewing (United States) The Immortal IPA The Wise ESB Dragonstooth Stout Perseus Porter Zephyrus Pilsner Elysian Fields Pale Ale Okay, Okay. Perhaps it's a bit unfair to compare a Microbrewery against the world's largest beer maker. Let's take the brands for the number two beer company in the United States, MillerCoors: Águila (Columbia) Coors (United States) Aspen Edge Barman Pils Blue Moon Belgian White Coors Coors Extra Gold Coors Light Coors Non-Alcoholic Full Moon Winter Ale Harvest Moon Pumpkin Ale Herman Joseph's Special Reserve Honey Moon Summer Ale Keystone Ice Keystone Light Keystone Premium Killian's Irish Red Pale Moon Rising Moon Spring Ale Rising Sun Spring Ale Cristal (Peru) Cusqueña (Peru) Premium Dark Premium Peruvian Foster's Premium Ale(Australia) Grolsch (The Netherlands) Amber Ale Blonde Lager Light Lager Premium Lager Hamm's (United States) Lager Golden Draft Special Light Henry Weinhard's (United States) Belgian Style Wheat Blonde Blue Boar Classic Dark Lager Hefeweizen India Pale Ale Private Reserve Summer Wheat Ale Lech (Poland) Leinenkugel's (United States) Berry Weiss BIG BUTT Dopplebock Classic Amber Lager Creamy Dark Fireside Nut Brown Honey Weiss Light Oktoberfest Lager Original Lager Red Lager Summer Shandy Sunset Wheat Millers (United States) Frederick Miller Classic Chocolate Lager Harley Davidson Beer Icehouse Magnum 40 Meister Bräu Meister Bräu Light Mickey's Mickey's Ice Mickey's Stinger Miller Chill Miller Genuine Draft Miller Genuine Draft Light 64 Miller High Life Miller High Life Ice Miller High Life Light Miller Lite Miller Lite Amber Miller Lite Blonde Ale Miller Lite Ice Miller Lite Wheat Milwaukee's Best Milwaukee's Best Dry Milwaukee's Best Ice Milwaukee's Best Light Olde English 800 Olde English 800 High Gravity Penguin Beer Red Dog Red Dog 32 Oz Red, White & Blue Sharp's Sheaf Stout Snow Beer Southpaw Light Molson (Canada) Molson Canadian Molson Canadian Sub-Zero Molson Canadian Light Molson Canadian Ice Molson Canadian Cold Shots 6.0 Molson Dry Molson Exel Molson Export Molson Golden Molson Ice Molson Kick Molson Stock Ale Molson XXX Peroni Nastro Azzurro (Italy) Pilsner Urquell (Czech Republic) Steel Reserve (United States) High Gravity Triple Export Tyskie (Poland) Okay... so that's a lot of beer. But let's take a look at A-B/InBev's Catalog (And note, it's likely that I've missed a few). Take special note to find out what beer you thought was independently or privately owned is actually run by these guys. Alexander Keith's (Canada) India Pale Ale Light Ale Honey Brown Red Amber Ale Antarctica (Brazil) Chopp Cristal Malzbier Original Pilsen Pilsen Extra Serramalte Astika Fine Quality Lager (Bulgaria) Baisha (China) Gold Regular BagBier (Russia) BagBier BagBier Classicheskoye BagBier Krepkoye BagBier Nashe Bass (United Kingdom) Beck's (Germany) Beck's Beck's Alkoholfrei Beck's Dark Beck's Gold Beck's Green Lemon Beck's Ice Beck's Light Beck's Next Beck's Oktoberfest Beck's Premier Light Becks's Vier Haake Beck Krausen Haake Beck NA Haake Beck Pils Belle-Vue (Belgium) Kriek Kriek Extra Framboise Gueuze Bergenbier (Romania) Boddingtons (United Kingdom) Bohemia (Brazil) Escura Original Weiss Borsodi Sör (Hungary) Borsodi Sör: pale ale Borsodi Bivaly: lager Borsodi Barna: dark German style Borsodi Póló: non-alcoholic beer Borostyán: amber Bozicno (Croatia) Borostyán (Hungary) Budwesier (United States) 9th Street Market Blood Orange Grapefruit 9th Street Market Lime & Cactus Fruit / Vegetable Beer 9th Street Market Pomegranate Raspberry 9th Street Market Tuscan Orange & Grapefruit Ascent 54 B-to-the-E Bare Knuckle Stout Beach Bum Blonde Ale Blue Horizon (Blueberry Lager) Bud Dry Bud Ice Bud Ice Light Bud Light Bud Light Chelada Bud Light Lime Budweiser Budweiser American Ale Budweiser Chelada Budweiser NA Budweiser Select Busch Beer Busch Ice Busch Light Busch NA Demon's Hop Yard IPA Devil Ray Red Hurricane Hurricane High Gravity Lager Hurricane Ice Jack's Pumpkin Spice Ale Killarney's Red Lager King Cobra Premium Malt Liquor Kingsbrucke Lone Palm Ale Majestic Flight Lager Mule Kick Oatmeal Stout Natty Up Natural Ice Natural Light O'Doul's Low Alcohol Beer O'Doul's Amber Low Alcohol Beer Organic Wild Hop Lager Pacific Ridge Pale Ale Phillies Red Lager Red Fox Amber Ale Red Wolf Redbridge Safari Amber Shock Top Belgian White Skipjack Amber Sun Dog Amber Wheat Tarpon Spoon Tomahawk Amber Ale UC Davis Centennial Celebration Oktoberfest Wild Blue (Blueberry Lager) Winter's Bourbon Cask Ale Ziegen Light ZiegenBock Amber Cafri (South Korea) Caracu (Brazil) Cass (South Korea) Original Lager Red Ice Light Castlemaine (United Kingdom) Chernigivske (Ukraine) Chernigivske Svitle Chernigivske Premium Chernigivske Mitsne Chernigivske Temne Chernigivske Bile Chernigivske Bila Nich Chernigivske Bagryane Chernigivske Fitness Diebels (Germany) Diekirch (Luxembourg) Lager Grand Cru Grande Réserve Exclusive Dimix (Germany) Dommelsch (The Netherlands) Double Deer (China) E-generation Premium Light Dry Beer Franziskaner (Germany) Weissbier Hefe-Weissbier Hell Hefe-Weissbier Dunkel Weissbier Kristallklar Gilde Ratskeller (Germany) Haake-Beck (Germany) Hasseröder (Germany) Harbin (China) Hertog_Jan (The Netherlands) Karakter Grand Prestige Lentebock Bockbier Dubbel Tripel Hoegaarden (Belgium) Witbier Rosé Citron Das Speciale Grand Cru Verboden Vrucht Hougaerdse Das (Belgium) Jelen Pivo (Serbia-Montenegro) Jinling (China) Jinlongquan (China) Draft Refreshing Julius (Belgium) Jupiler (Belgium) KK (China) Klinskoye (Russia) Svetloye Zolotoye Lux Redkoye Arriva Samurai Kamenitza (Bulgaria) Kokanee (Canada) Lager Light La Bécasse (France) Kriek Raspberry Gueuze Labatt's (Canada) Blue Blue Light Family Ice Sterling Lakeport (Canada) Brava Honey Ice Light Pilsener Red Steeler lager Strong Wee Willy Leffe (Belgium) 9 Blonde Brown Radieuse/Vieille Cuvée Ruby Triple Liber (Brazil) Löwenbräu (German) Original Pilsener Dunkel Triumphator Löwen Weisse Urtyp Oktoberfestbier Michelob (United States) Michelob Michelob Amber Bock Michelob Bavarian Style Wheat Michelob Black & Tan Michelob Celebrate Cherry Lager Michelob Celebrate Chocolate Lager Michelob Celebrate Vanilla Oak Michelob DunkelWeisse Michelob Golden Draft Michelob Golden Draft Light Michelob Honey Lager Michelob Honey Wheat Ale Michelob Hop Hound Amber Wheat Michelob Irish Red Michelob Light Michelob Marzen Michelob Original Lager Michelob Pale Ale Michelob Porter American Porter Michelob Pumpkin Spice Ale Michelob Ultra Michelob Ultra Amber Michelob Ultra Lime Cactus Michelob Ultra Pomegranate Raspberry Michelob Ultra Tuscan Orange Grapefruit Mousel (Luxembourg) Murphy's* (United Kingdom) Nik (Serbia-Montenegro) Cool Gold Niksicko (Serbia-Montenegro) Pivo Tamno Noroc (Romania) OB (South Korea) Oranjeboom (The Netherlands) Ozujsko (Croatia) Cool Fresssh Pivo Paceña (Bolivia) Permskoye Gubernskoye (Russia) Permskoye Gubernskoye Permskoye Gubernskoye Svetloye Piedboeuf (Belgium) Blonde Brown Original Triple Quilmes (Argentina) Bock Cristal Stout Red Shiliang (China) Rifey (Russia) Uralskoye Originalnoye Krepkoye Osoboye Krepkoye Rogan (Ukraine) Legke Tradytsiyne Monastyrske Svitle Monastyrske Temne Veselyi Monach Bezalkogolne Kampai Arriva Safir (Belgium) Santai (China) Sedrin (China) Sibirskaya Korona (Russia) Klassicheskoye Originalnoye Prazdnichnoye Krepkoye Lux Rubinovoye Yantarnoye Beloye Georgievskoye Skol (Brazil) Original Chopp Claro Chopp Escuro Spaten (Germany) Münchner Hell Pils Oktoberfestbier Diät-Pils Non-alcoholic Franziskaner Weissbier Dopplebock Optimator St.Pauli Girl (USA)** Lager Special Dark Non-Alcoholic Malt Beverage Staropramen (Czech Republic) le?ák Černý Granát Braník brands Ostravar brands Stella Artois (Belgium) Artois Bock Atlas Bergenbrau Club De Stella Artois Dutch Gold Imported Eiken Artois Ginder Ale Horse-Ale La Becasse Framboise La Becasse Gueuze La Bécasse Kriek Loburg Noblis Peeterman Stella Artois Stella Artois 4% Stella Artois Dry Stella Artois Light Stella Artois NA Taller (Ukraine) Chill Ice Original Tennent's (United Kingdom) Super Ember Extra Lager Light Ale Pilsner Special Velvet Ale Stout (Export) 1885 Lager (Export) Scotch Ale (Export) Tolstiak (Russia) Dobroye Svetloye Zaboristoye Krepkoye Grechishnoye Tomislav (Croatia) Vieux Temps (Belgium) Yali (China) Yantar (Ukraine) Svitle Temne Mitsne Zizhulin (China) Zhujiang (China)
March 15, 201115 yr Author Not much has changed in wine and the vineyards that produce them...eh? Apparently you are not aware of the competitions that began in 1976 where California vineyards trumped those in France. In France no less with French judges. http://www.wineintro...976tasting.html That is actually my point. There are people who can tell a great wine from a cheap wine. The people in 1855 who classified the French vineyards would have also been able to tell the excellence of Californian vineyards. The excellence of a wine establishes it's price not the reverse. Finding out how to judge wines takes a lot of study and experience. It also takes a lot of cash. It is not some marketing ploy. A person raised on Budweiser is not going to make a very good judge of excellence in beers. Once you know about ales it is not much of a stretch to learn about other beers. There are German beers and British beers the rest are combinations or descendent's of those two brewing styles. My basic point is that education or cultural values are necessary to appreciate good food and or beer or wine. I am not trying to dictate tastes but there is a difference between good food and average food. Som tom is not an example of culinary excellence nor is beer Chang beer. I could like som tom or Chang beer but I would never imply they great examples of excellence in cooking or brewing. The napa vineyard that won was educated but set thier first foot in France prior to wining the blind taste test. They actually gained most of their knowledge from migrants with no upper education. They(Cali) have dominted every blind french tasting since. It does not take money or education to educate a palate. A plethora of less expensive yet quality wines have been produced since at much less the price you insisit upon. You have a good knowledge of British ale but know little about wine. I have yet to see you admit you were wrong in anything you consider to be your field of expertise. If lack of humility were a crime you would be doing life I wonder why people don't read. I said “Education or cultural values.” If you grew up in a wine producing region chances are you will know something about wine. Viticulture is a complex subject. To produce an excellent wine from selecting the vines, growing and harvesting and aging and bottling. It is difficult to grow Cabernet Sauvignon grapes in Arkansas. The region is more like Germany and conducive to white sweet wines. There is one person in Arkansas who uses a kidney machine to filter his wines. Technology can do wonders. If you have been raised in the UK chances are you know something about Ales. The world's most expensive drinkable wine was sold in auction in New York City in 2001 as a seven-bottle case, for $23,929 per bottle (a $167,500 total). It was a Montrachet 1978 from Domaine de la Romanée-Conti, a white wine (curiously, red wines fetch much higher prices in auction). Any list of expensive drinkable wines will be dominated by French wines. In almost any international restaurant it is easier to sell a bottle of $1000 French wine than a $1000 bottle of California wine. Why would I admit to being wrong when I am obviously right? To suggest that modern viticulture techniques are the result of listening to uneducated migrants is just foolish. It is like comparing the building of a 16th century sailing vessel to the yachts that race for the America's cup today. If you want an educated palate you must have some education. That education might come from years of experience pub crawling or a simpler and faster way would be to go to school. In the same vein all the education in the world is not going to replace hands on, experience. Not only do you have to do the book learning but travel to the areas where the product is produced. I have no other way to describe it to you. If you want to find out what a $10,000 bottle of wine tastes like you have to drink one. That takes $10,000 cash. If you want to find out about good Ales you have to go the the UK. Guinness tastes different in Africa and Ireland. Sorry, but the only way to find out that is to go to Ireland and Africa. If you want to taste Uno's pizza you have to go to Chicago. They tried to make a chain but it didn't work. It didn't travel well. I know I ate at 20 of them. Not the same. The gentlemen who posted about English Ale in this thread have a wealth of experience over many years. If a young man wanted to find about English Ale he would be advised to spend some time with a group of them visiting different pubs and drinking and listening. That is very much like a college experience. Listen to the professor and then do the research. If one wanted to brew Ale today or set up a wine producing business he would be advised to start in college and then get a job for hands on experience. My original statement about education, experience and cash I feel is correct.
March 16, 201115 yr I am myself a wine and food lover. And mostly agree that taste and appreciation of “Good” wines and food is a matter of adduction and mostly experience. I miss one point in this story that is emotion, state of mind, feeling and environment. When eating just because you are hungry, emotion, feeling, state of mind and environment have little or no influence on your experience and taste of the meal you are eating, first priority is to still the hunger feeling. While eating and drinking ( I prefer to call this tasting) quality food/wine by knowledgeable people. Emotion, state of mind , feeling and environment playing a huge role in the experience/taste of that meal/dish or wine.
March 16, 201115 yr I am myself a wine and food lover. And mostly agree that taste and appreciation of "Good" wines and food is a matter of adduction and mostly experience. I miss one point in this story that is emotion, state of mind, feeling and environment. When eating just because you are hungry, emotion, feeling, state of mind and environment have little or no influence on your experience and taste of the meal you are eating, first priority is to still the hunger feeling. While eating and drinking ( I prefer to call this tasting) quality food/wine by knowledgeable people. Emotion, state of mind , feeling and environment playing a huge role in the experience/taste of that meal/dish or wine. 1. Food 2.Friends/Family 3.Wine/Beer/Water 4.Ambience 5.Price
March 16, 201115 yr I am myself a wine and food lover. And mostly agree that taste and appreciation of "Good" wines and food is a matter of adduction and mostly experience. I miss one point in this story that is emotion, state of mind, feeling and environment. When eating just because you are hungry, emotion, feeling, state of mind and environment have little or no influence on your experience and taste of the meal you are eating, first priority is to still the hunger feeling. While eating and drinking ( I prefer to call this tasting) quality food/wine by knowledgeable people. Emotion, state of mind , feeling and environment playing a huge role in the experience/taste of that meal/dish or wine. 1. Food 2.Friends/Family 3.Wine/Beer/Water 4.Ambience 5.Price I suppose whenever I've gone somewhere for the sake of a specific band or quality of beer, it has been as much about the journey as the beer. But on the other hand, once you've got your crew assembled, so to speak, you need something to make the mission worth while - usually something trivial and irrelevant, like Scotch Eggs - but still, you need a differentiating feature for your planned destination - a wine fairy, contra-rotating carousels, the alleged best 80/ in the world, the darkest nicotine stains, being opposite the art college, whatever. Perhaps the Theakstons brewery... SC
March 16, 201115 yr Lomatopo When in the UK try Weatherspoons(Witherspoons) pubs you'll find real at good prices They could be a chain of pubs selling top quality real ales showcasing the best of british food and being great places to visit. Only they are not. I'll leave it at that. They have their uses. The one in Swindon had an annual beer festival when they would have countless guest ales on sale. Roll in when the doors open Sunday morning and then try getting through every ale on sale. 1/2 pint at a time, amazingly cheap. Some of them were so strong we'd all be hammered by 5-ish, but one must continue until last orders. The day after was ne'er a productive day on the calendar.
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