Thailand Rejects Foreign Election Monitors

[Igor]

Hey, it's okay. I don't really have a lot of respect for him, either.

[vont]

Many of us(expats) posters seem to be bothered by the possibly(most likely ) dishonest elections. I really do not understand why?

Elections do not affect us(foreigners) in any way what so ever. We can not vote, our lives do not change. The only difference it may possibly make is another change in the visa regulations or more rules on house or business buying or running.

Saying that, those changes, if were ever even thought of would be be implemented anyway.

Perfect example, Thaksin changed the 30 days visa run, new government did not reverse it but rather tightened it.

Personally i am only bothered by the choice of language and words used by the country leader,which shows general attitude towards foreigners.

I am also bothered that someone in his position, supposedly with very very good education would use words such as "farang"

None of the lawyers i have ever used, or doctors or accountants ever used word "farang" (in my presence at least) and here a Nations leader blabbing it in public., which once again only shows his level of education and intelligence

I am even more bothered that no one in the government including PM, did not at least criticize his words and did not force him to apologize, even though i deeply believe he should be sacked.

Yes we were not sent here by force, nor brought in chains. However we are here and there is absolutely no reason to disrespect us.

The constant discrimination by the sellers and general business running is already enough, why add more wood to the fire.

We do not receive any social security or welfare, we do not enjoy any of the discounts that Thai's get, so really we are no burden on the country or society.

Any university graduate(Thai National) with degree from any Western University instantly gets higher pay then grad from local university.

Furthermore most smaller business owned and run by Thai do not even pay any taxes , while any business owned by a foreigner no matter how small always pays taxes and every other duty that exists.

kuffki and others thinking in the same direction:

May I ask if you have any vested pecuniary interest in any biz in Thailand?

Or do you have any control over any biz within Thai territory?

If you do, you probably won't talk nor think the way you do that

the election has nothing to do with farang.

Many of us farang do have vested financial interests in several Thai biz.

And the investment is sizable in the low 9 digits at the moment.

You bet your life, since we run legit biz every which way, the honesty of Thai official and Thai govt do have direct impact and direct implication on every fiber of our biz and the bottom line in particular.

However for the majority of farang in Thailand, it is probably business as usual regardless of who is in power. On this score, you are irreputable.

For your info, the word farang is a collective terminology used to refer to a collection of several races and countries including people from U.S., Euro, Italy, Norway, Sweden et al.

The word farang is not derogatory nor is it racist in any shape or form. When a Thai couldn't distinguish a citizen from U.S., or Euro, it is pretty safe for the Thai to use the collective word farang to refer to that entity.

imho, it is just a collective word used to call people from several continents without really distinguishing who is who.

Hope you get my point and be able to from now on discount the word farang as you encounter it in the future. :jap:

Edited March 25, 2011 by vont

[softgeorge]

Suthep's comments might seem a bit harsh and inappropriate (they are!), but if you ask any Thai - who isn't an ardent red shirt - how they feel about foreign election monitors, you'll probably get a similar response!

From various discussions with pretty well educated Thais about condominium investment and purchasing many said they were happy for other Thais (rich) to take advantage of them and accepted it as the way Thailand is, but were indignant about foreigners doing it as wrong and immoral.

You can only laugh...

or complain on internet forums.

Geez my Thai wife owns three properties in Melbourne Australia and that includes the land.

When you say she owns 3 properties it makes me wonder what her profession is, i hope she made it in an appropriate way or from marriage. As most thai that comes to europe makes it in an inappropriate way which includes rest of the world too.

I have already answered this. No she was not a whore or bar girl. She has her masters in Accounting obtained in Australia. She lived and worked in Australia for 20 yrs saving and investing her money. I think that is an appropriate way compared to laying on your back with your legs in the air. Not all thai women stoop to prostitution oh and yes I met her in Melbourne..

[Buchholz]

Here is a pretty accurate translation of the context of Suthep's remarks from the newspaper Thai Daily News http://www.thairath.co.th/content/pol/1583

Regarding whetherthe Democratic Alliance Against Dictatorship (DAAD) leaders wanting to inviteinternational organizations to observe the elections in Thailand, would behelpful in investigating have otherbenefits, Mr Suthep said, "The (redshirt) leaders have strange (ideas). They don't respect the sovereignty of their own (country). There are many Thai organizations. (Thai) media (representatives), universityprofessors or students or whatever. Whyshould anyone esteem westerners to thatextent? I don't like this sort ofthing. The (red shirts) like to getoutsiders involved in our internal affairs. I don't think they should. Itisn't appropriate.

When asked if theoversight of Thai elections was of a sufficiently high standard to ensure thateverything was done in a fair manner, Mr. Suthep said, "I don't esteemwesterners as being better than Thai people. Don't bring westerners here to control Thai people. I think our (own) Election Commission issufficient to the task. If you want tosupplement the oversight of the Election Commission or examine the ElectionCommission itself, then make use of the views of Thai people. The media, the academic sector, the privatesector, the business sector, and students (all) can contribute. (We should) do away with the notion that one ought to run and submit (oneself) to westerners for (the solution to all one's problems). [end translation]

I think it's pretty clear that he was trying to say that he didn't want outside interference and that Thailand was perfectly capable of solving its own political problems. Imagine what American politicians might say at the prospect of giving an international body oversight of American elections! The quote that "I don't respect farangs." is not reflective of the complete quote and does not convey his meaning well.

Thank you for that.

Problem is, now there are 200 posts or so that all need to rewritten or just plain retracted...

and still posts keeping coming...

It's too bad the above wasn't the OP. I would have enjoyed reading the likely total of 3 replies to it.

But then, there wouldn't have been a mass emailing with its subsequent 14,000 views and 230 posts.

Worth a bump as we sail past 300 posts and 17,000 views.

Amazing how successful an inflammatory and inaccurate mass emailing can be.

Still, I suppose it's been beneficial for those that very obviously had needed to vent their frustrations with living in a foreign country.

.

[kuffki]

Many of us(expats) posters seem to be bothered by the possibly(most likely ) dishonest elections. I really do not understand why?

Elections do not affect us(foreigners) in any way what so ever. We can not vote, our lives do not change. The only difference it may possibly make is another change in the visa regulations or more rules on house or business buying or running.

Saying that, those changes, if were ever even thought of would be be implemented anyway.

Perfect example, Thaksin changed the 30 days visa run, new government did not reverse it but rather tightened it.

Personally i am only bothered by the choice of language and words used by the country leader,which shows general attitude towards foreigners.

I am also bothered that someone in his position, supposedly with very very good education would use words such as "farang"

None of the lawyers i have ever used, or doctors or accountants ever used word "farang" (in my presence at least) and here a Nations leader blabbing it in public., which once again only shows his level of education and intelligence

I am even more bothered that no one in the government including PM, did not at least criticize his words and did not force him to apologize, even though i deeply believe he should be sacked.

Yes we were not sent here by force, nor brought in chains. However we are here and there is absolutely no reason to disrespect us.

The constant discrimination by the sellers and general business running is already enough, why add more wood to the fire.

We do not receive any social security or welfare, we do not enjoy any of the discounts that Thai's get, so really we are no burden on the country or society.

Any university graduate(Thai National) with degree from any Western University instantly gets higher pay then grad from local university.

Furthermore most smaller business owned and run by Thai do not even pay any taxes , while any business owned by a foreigner no matter how small always pays taxes and every other duty that exists.

kuffki and others thinking in the same direction:

May I ask if you have any vested pecuniary interest in any biz in Thailand?

Or do you have any control over any biz within Thai territory?

If you do, you probably won't talk nor think the way you do that

the election has nothing to do with farang.

Many of us farang do have vested financial interests in several Thai biz.

And the investment is sizable exceeding 9 digits at the moment.

You bet your life, since we run legit biz every which way, the honesty of Thai official and Thai govt do have direct impact and direct implication on every fiber of our biz and the bottom line in particular.

However for the majority of farang in Thailand, it is probably business as usual regardless of who is in power. On this score, you are irreputable.

Yes i do have a business and i really doubt you have 9 digits interests. Anyhow, how does election outcome change your life, your business or investment as a foreigner?

What has changed in your business or investment in the past say 8 years from Thaksin to Military to Somchai to Another Thaksin proxy to Vejjajiva?

[softgeorge]

This is my last post as a European business man here for 11years. How dare this brain dead politician make such a statement about us. No doubt he is driving a high end Germam car manufactured inThailand. Abhiset should demand an immediate apology from him or replace him with Korn.

Just out of curiosity is the guy a red shirt or yellow shirt. I don't know and was just wondering

[dbaron]

Reading some of my young Thai niece's schoolbooks it's no wonder they end up which such a twisted xenophobic view of reality. Taught (indoctrinated) from a very young age how special the Thai people are compared to everyone else.

Such a pity that such a beautiful country has such a high % of simpleminded fools populating it.

Have not read the entire thread yet and I am sure others have agreed to your post.

I agree 100% about the simple minded fools and I have been to Thailand 8 times. 6 in the last 3 years.

[Jingthing]

This is my last post as a European business man here for 11years. How dare this brain dead politician make such a statement about us. No doubt he is driving a high end Germam car manufactured inThailand. Abhiset should demand an immediate apology from him or replace him with Korn.

Just out of curiosity is the guy a red shirt or yellow shirt. I don't know and was just wondering

Neither, he's a Thai democrat not in PAD, but the reds would label him closer to yellow, if you insist on labels.

[farang000999]

Can someone who speaks Thai confirm that the translation is accurate and not taken out of context? He does not respect any foreigners in general or he does not trust them to supervisor Thai elections?

[61guitarman61]

Reading some of my young Thai niece's schoolbooks it's no wonder they end up which such a twisted xenophobic view of reality. Taught (indoctrinated) from a very young age how special the Thai people are compared to everyone else.

Such a pity that such a beautiful country has such a high % of simpleminded fools populating it.

"I totally agree.. The Thai have no clue about the rest of the world or life as it once was.. That is called HISTORY..

From the days of Abraham to Jesus, to Mohammed, to all these new in your face religions and leaders.. I ask one college kid if she knew of Ghandi, WWI and II as well as the Beatles Jagger, and Frank Sinatra.. She never heard of anyone or any time.. I call most of them just simply put.. BRAINDEAD"

"Thailand surrendered to the Japanese P.D.Q in 1941. Oh, they're not farangs. Wait a bit. Who did the Japanese surrender to? Didn't the Japanese also think that they were so much more superior?

BTW How much foreign aid does Thailand soak up? Who invented and supplies all the technology that Thailand enjoys?

I hope that all the farang Ambassadors cross this moron off the invite list next time they hold a shindig - paid for by farang taxes. That should please him no end, not having to share a room with the representatives of people that he doesn't respect.."

"and tell Tescos, Toyota, Big C, Boots and ALL the Embassies - and destroy his collections (which he UNDOUBTEDLY has) of Shakespeare, Mozart, Michaelangelo and all the other 'rubbish' that farangs have produced over the centuries - and show us all the great cultural 'contributions' the Thai's have produced to the world's libraries, art gallery's and museums."

"How does this guy always get his facts wrong about this government... all the MPs were legally elected whatever party they represent as by the constitution which Thaksin altered to suit himself but backfired......... its the MPs that voted in Abhisit... its because of the coalition that we have so much political corruption, lets hope one party manages to gain a majority after this coming election and stop the political blackmail that seems to be rife in Thai politics... lets just hope that winning party does not contain Jutaporn.. ( can someone send him a court jesters outfit ) Myself.... I like Newin.. but I dinna have a vote..."

Who do you all think you are? You have no stake in anything the Thai government does. You have no stake in anything the Thai people do. The only true rights any of you have are those GRANTED to you by the government of the country you are VISITING. You have no right to walk/fly/bus/sail into this country, as a VISITOR, and iterate all this blathering, whining, xenophobic, (to use one of the words used with regard to the Thai people in the first post above), and bigoted BS. As for any dissatisfaction with anything indigenous to Thailand, if you don't like it then GO HOME! No one is twisting your arm to stay here and endure the wonderful food, awesome climate, laid-back lifestyle, and OVERALL great people here. You all come in with your f....d up superiority complexes with your screwed up view of things, most likely based on your ability to act "rich", thus perpetuating the stereotypes we falang already have with the Thai's. The reality is that our own societies back in the west are just as screwed up as anything Thai or anywhere else on the planet, each with their own distinct set of quirks and eccentricities. These forums were originally intended for falang to help each other out with being in this truly foreign land. It has degenerated into a group of constant complainers. Complain about Thai politics. Complain about the Thai logic. Complain about Thai education. Complain about Thai culture. If all this really bothers you, why are you still here? One can only hope that there are not many Thai's who read the crap on this site. You people do not represent my views at all and if you taint how Thai people see the farang even more by reading posts in here you are not doing any of us any favors. Jeez..... were all of you this whiny back where you came from? These people are who they are and who they choose to be. That's their right. You can have your opinions for sure. It's just that some of your opinions are better left UNSAID. Especially when it is totally derogatory. How they do things? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. How they think? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. How government functions? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. How they choose to view us? Jerks like some of the posters on here do much to damage that view I'm sure. But in the end, NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. For the Americans reading in here: Do you like the Mexicans coming in and acting as though they own the joint? They refuse to speak English. They maintain their own little Mexican cliques. They eat their own types of food. They talk rubbish about Americans in Spanish and most of the time can get away with dissing us in our faces. How are the ugly farang who come here to Thailand any better?! They're not. Thailand owes you nothing. Thailand will be here with or without any of us. It is a fairly ancient land far older than lost western civilizations - 10 times as old as our grand old USA (or more - not shooting for accuracy right now). So grow up and get civilized. Be gracious GUESTS.

Guitarman you should be going for Thai Citizenship as you have the same defensive mindset. It makes me want to puke. We have every right to comment on the Thailand and the Thais as they have the right to comment when they visit the UK for eg......Seeing as i pay 37% tax for very limited benefit i think I am entitled to have an opnion. It's called FREEDOM of SPEECH! heard of it? Actually i posted before i read you pathetically defensive and predictable GO HOME comment. But you are a perfect example. Maybe the world doesnt think we need foreign monitors in UK for eg because you dont get politicians going around buying the vote for 200 baht and a packet of Mama....

Who benefits from free and fair elections? Foreigners? no the Thai people...duh! Do you not think we should have foreign observers in African countries where violence often present fair elections or is Thailand special because they have the luck of a good climate and the Portuguese brought them Chillis?

BTW the Thai Culture wont be around for much longer as they are busy trying to become western by chasing all the technology and lifestyle which admittedly makes those countries quite shallow.

Western elections are fair and honest? Are you serious? Corruption in western politics is legendary and yet no one would dare call for foreign monitors in any western election. Wouldn't make it to square one.

As for my "rant": one poster said he has rights as he works here and employs a handful of Thai nationals. Well, the Thai government certainly is grateful for your "contribution" to their financial well being I'm sure. Actually, you found a niche where you are able to maximize your profit margin by spending oodles less on labor and then importing on your own people at a greatly inflated price thus taking advantage of not one but two societies. Well done!

Others talk about how they are taxed and thus deserve rights as though they were immigrated citizens when in fact they will never denounce their homelands and seek citizenship with Thailand. A bit hypocritical isn't it?

The bottom line is that you DO NOT have the right to any sort of active opinion toward Thailand. You are ALL only visitors here most of whom are reeping many benefits in the form of hiding assets, evading taxes, escaping lives in the west, satisfying sexual fantasy tours, maximizing meager retirement accounts by living in this inexpensive land of "wine", women, and song. A minority are actually here for humanitarian or other non- selfcentered reasons. So spare me this "I have rights" bull. Most of you skating through to the end of your lives in a place that makes it all easy and pleasurable for you without having to pay any dues at all. And before you bring up visa fees or bank account mandates, they are in reality a cheap fee to pay in the end analysis. 2000 baht for 3 months = $60 USD. Wow! Sorry but that does not qualify. I am talking more about dues societally. But no one would want to really get involved even if they could. Only complain like armchair quarterbacks.

Comments about politics are fine. Comments about the people are fine. Comments about culture are fine. Making commentary on Thailand is wonderful. It is the racially charged bigoted comments that set me off. How dare you take an entire ethnic group and classify them as "stupid" or "BRAINLESS" or a hundred other derrogatory terms. I know many fine Thais who are neither stupid or brainless. In fact, they outshine most western acquaintences I have. I will go one further and say that there are more pretentious, self absorbed, brainless twits in the west then there are here. Am I stumping to be the next best friend of all Thais everywhere? Nope. I've seen the bad side of Thai people too. But I cannot abide MY people, westerners, being such dipwads. By the way, this is MY opinion that you seem to think we are all entitled to. Freedom of speech and all......................

[DP25]

Worth a bump as we sail past 300 posts and 17,000 views.

Amazing how successful an inflammatory and inaccurate mass emailing can be.

Still, I suppose it's been beneficial for those that very obviously had needed to vent their frustrations with living in a foreign country.

.

Oh, 300 posts is nothing. Certain people will probably be linking to this article, about something that wasn't said, for years to bash the government/political party/Thai people

[DP25]

Can someone who speaks Thai confirm that the translation is accurate and not taken out of context? He does not respect any foreigners in general or he does not trust them to supervisor Thai elections?

It's not accurate, look at the post by Buchholz quoted above you or go back to page 6. All he said was he doesn't worship farang and he doesn't think farang are better than Thai people

[Nisa]

Who is bashing? I was simply comparing national pride. Being an American I used them as an example as well as a line from an American movie called "Head of State" where one of the characters running for President often used the phrase, "God bless America and nowhere else" when he closed a speech.

The bottom line is that I highly doubt he said this to be taken in the context it being viewed by many people here. It is not uncommon for 2nd- in-command type people to make stupid comments. I'm sure his intention was a statement to do with national pride and trying to say it in a strong/emotional way to turn people against the Reds for suggesting outsiders be part of Thai election process.

I by no means am a fan of this guy and think he, again like many 2nd-in-command types, is not the sharpest tool in the shed.

So you want to equate a line in a piece of fiction, to a statement from the deputy PM of a country, are you really suggesting they amount to the same thing??

has any american politician ACTUALLY made that statement, or is it purely a work of a scriptwriter??

In your desire to keep the Thai tinted specs on you also seem to have not noticed that while wearing them all logic goes out of the window, I am worried about how Thai you are becoming, first you support all things Thai no matter how wrong they are, then you blame the farangs or say it is ok for Thais to do it as there was a line once in an american film, next you will be riding a bike without a helmet, picking your nose at the traffic lights, losing all concept of spacial awareness and stop reading books.

[IAMSOBAD]

Quote

"I don't respect 'farangs'. We do not have to surrender to them," he said, using the Thai word for "Westerners".

Monkeys dont respect humans!!!

[BuckarooBanzai]

Here is a pretty accurate translation of the context of Suthep's remarks from the newspaper Thai Daily News http://www.thairath.co.th/content/pol/1583

Regarding whetherthe Democratic Alliance Against Dictatorship (DAAD) leaders wanting to inviteinternational organizations to observe the elections in Thailand, would behelpful in investigating have otherbenefits, Mr Suthep said, "The (redshirt) leaders have strange (ideas). They don't respect the sovereignty of their own (country). There are many Thai organizations. (Thai) media (representatives), universityprofessors or students or whatever. Whyshould anyone esteem westerners to thatextent? I don't like this sort ofthing. The (red shirts) like to getoutsiders involved in our internal affairs. I don't think they should. Itisn't appropriate.

When asked if theoversight of Thai elections was of a sufficiently high standard to ensure thateverything was done in a fair manner, Mr. Suthep said, "I don't esteemwesterners as being better than Thai people. Don't bring westerners here to control Thai people. I think our (own) Election Commission issufficient to the task. If you want tosupplement the oversight of the Election Commission or examine the ElectionCommission itself, then make use of the views of Thai people. The media, the academic sector, the privatesector, the business sector, and students (all) can contribute. (We should) do away with the notion that one ought to run and submit (oneself) to westerners for (the solution to all one's problems). [end translation]

I think it's pretty clear that he was trying to say that he didn't want outside interference and that Thailand was perfectly capable of solving its own political problems. Imagine what American politicians might say at the prospect of giving an international body oversight of American elections! The quote that "I don't respect farangs." is not reflective of the complete quote and does not convey his meaning well.

Thank you for that.

Problem is, now there are 200 posts or so that all need to rewritten or just plain retracted...

.

What time was the translation made and how much can one depend on it's accuracy? The Farang Bully? How much money exchanged hands? Some would say you are a distributor of bull kee.

Edit - Sorry perhaps I should have quoted your later post but why bother?

Edited March 25, 2011 by BuckarooBanzai

[Nisa]

Can someone who speaks Thai confirm that the translation is accurate and not taken out of context? He does not respect any foreigners in general or he does not trust them to supervisor Thai elections?

It's not accurate, look at the post by Buchholz quoted above you or go back to page 6. All he said was he doesn't worship farang and he doesn't think farang are better than Thai people

If you are going to translate it all then it is probably best to replace the word "farang" with "westerner" or "foreigner" since some people have convinced themselves this Thai word is racist.

[Jingthing]

At the very least, a Thai hiso saying farang is being very impolite.

[connda]

Xenophobia is alive and well in Thailand. :jap:

"Multiculturalism means never having to go overseas to find an enemy."

- Anonymous

[kuffki]

Can someone who speaks Thai confirm that the translation is accurate and not taken out of context? He does not respect any foreigners in general or he does not trust them to supervisor Thai elections?

It's not accurate, look at the post by Buchholz quoted above you or go back to page 6. All he said was he doesn't worship farang and he doesn't think farang are better than Thai people

If you are going to translate it all then it is probably best to replace the word "farang" with "westerner" or "foreigner" since some people have convinced themselves this Thai word is racist.

Racist-NO

Impolite and Improper-YES

Slang of less educated and intelligent-YES

Can it be a derogatory term-YES

[BKK03]

Again, it is all about money, status, and keeping "have nots" under control. Drastic and far-reaching change is coming to Thailand. Government members who keep their brain in cigar boxes and cognac bottles are going to be washed away by the tide. Someone in the government needs to wake up and pay attention to what is happening in the world this morning. The days of getting ones ass massaged while bowing is close to being over.

Long live the red shirts, yellow shirts, and any other raggedy asses who have the guts to scrap for his or her personal freedom.

I agree with you-know-who. The very few people who have it all in Thailand should not trust western people or western governments. They should trust them selves and take responsibility for Thailand. And when the sh-t hits the fan, pay the price by making a well informed decision about which side to join, so that they can live and die for their real personal purpose.

[Buchholz]

Here is a pretty accurate translation of the context of Suthep's remarks from the newspaper Thai Daily News http://www.thairath.co.th/content/pol/1583

Regarding whetherthe Democratic Alliance Against Dictatorship (DAAD) leaders wanting to inviteinternational organizations to observe the elections in Thailand, would behelpful in investigating have otherbenefits, Mr Suthep said, "The (redshirt) leaders have strange (ideas). They don't respect the sovereignty of their own (country). There are many Thai organizations. (Thai) media (representatives), universityprofessors or students or whatever. Whyshould anyone esteem westerners to thatextent? I don't like this sort ofthing. The (red shirts) like to getoutsiders involved in our internal affairs. I don't think they should. Itisn't appropriate.

When asked if theoversight of Thai elections was of a sufficiently high standard to ensure thateverything was done in a fair manner, Mr. Suthep said, "I don't esteemwesterners as being better than Thai people. Don't bring westerners here to control Thai people. I think our (own) Election Commission issufficient to the task. If you want tosupplement the oversight of the Election Commission or examine the ElectionCommission itself, then make use of the views of Thai people. The media, the academic sector, the privatesector, the business sector, and students (all) can contribute. (We should) do away with the notion that one ought to run and submit (oneself) to westerners for (the solution to all one's problems). [end translation]

I think it's pretty clear that he was trying to say that he didn't want outside interference and that Thailand was perfectly capable of solving its own political problems. Imagine what American politicians might say at the prospect of giving an international body oversight of American elections! The quote that "I don't respect farangs." is not reflective of the complete quote and does not convey his meaning well.

Thank you for that.

Problem is, now there are 200 posts or so that all need to rewritten or just plain retracted...

What time was the translation made and how much can one depend on it's accuracy? The Farang Bully? How much money exchanged hands? Some would say

Did you read the article linked?

Do you dispute the posted translation based on what is written in the Thai report?

Do you accept that what Suthep said was in Thai?

Do you accept that the OP itself is a translation that you "depend on it's accuracy" of what he said in Thai?

Some would say, "Next?"

.

Edited March 25, 2011 by Buchholz

[lungmi]

Don't forget the US Elections for Bush II , the manager of a second class football team manager to become President of US.

The vote bill machines were made by a company where Bush I hade assets,

International survisors for the votes in US would be acceped in US? Think about before before you post rubbish.

[Seanextra]

Ah yes once again, some people dont realise some do, fact never changes STUPID MONKEY COUNTRY!

[MILT]

Reading some of my young Thai niece's schoolbooks it's no wonder they end up which such a twisted xenophobic view of reality. Taught (indoctrinated) from a very young age how special the Thai people are compared to everyone else.

Such a pity that such a beautiful country has such a high % of simpleminded fools populating it.

"I totally agree.. The Thai have no clue about the rest of the world or life as it once was.. That is called HISTORY..

From the days of Abraham to Jesus, to Mohammed, to all these new in your face religions and leaders.. I ask one college kid if she knew of Ghandi, WWI and II as well as the Beatles Jagger, and Frank Sinatra.. She never heard of anyone or any time.. I call most of them just simply put.. BRAINDEAD"

"Thailand surrendered to the Japanese P.D.Q in 1941. Oh, they're not farangs. Wait a bit. Who did the Japanese surrender to? Didn't the Japanese also think that they were so much more superior?

BTW How much foreign aid does Thailand soak up? Who invented and supplies all the technology that Thailand enjoys?

I hope that all the farang Ambassadors cross this moron off the invite list next time they hold a shindig - paid for by farang taxes. That should please him no end, not having to share a room with the representatives of people that he doesn't respect.."

"and tell Tescos, Toyota, Big C, Boots and ALL the Embassies - and destroy his collections (which he UNDOUBTEDLY has) of Shakespeare, Mozart, Michaelangelo and all the other 'rubbish' that farangs have produced over the centuries - and show us all the great cultural 'contributions' the Thai's have produced to the world's libraries, art gallery's and museums."

"How does this guy always get his facts wrong about this government... all the MPs were legally elected whatever party they represent as by the constitution which Thaksin altered to suit himself but backfired......... its the MPs that voted in Abhisit... its because of the coalition that we have so much political corruption, lets hope one party manages to gain a majority after this coming election and stop the political blackmail that seems to be rife in Thai politics... lets just hope that winning party does not contain Jutaporn.. ( can someone send him a court jesters outfit ) Myself.... I like Newin.. but I dinna have a vote..."

Who do you all think you are? You have no stake in anything the Thai government does. You have no stake in anything the Thai people do. The only true rights any of you have are those GRANTED to you by the government of the country you are VISITING. You have no right to walk/fly/bus/sail into this country, as a VISITOR, and iterate all this blathering, whining, xenophobic, (to use one of the words used with regard to the Thai people in the first post above), and bigoted BS. As for any dissatisfaction with anything indigenous to Thailand, if you don't like it then GO HOME! No one is twisting your arm to stay here and endure the wonderful food, awesome climate, laid-back lifestyle, and OVERALL great people here. You all come in with your f....d up superiority complexes with your screwed up view of things, most likely based on your ability to act "rich", thus perpetuating the stereotypes we falang already have with the Thai's. The reality is that our own societies back in the west are just as screwed up as anything Thai or anywhere else on the planet, each with their own distinct set of quirks and eccentricities. These forums were originally intended for falang to help each other out with being in this truly foreign land. It has degenerated into a group of constant complainers. Complain about Thai politics. Complain about the Thai logic. Complain about Thai education. Complain about Thai culture. If all this really bothers you, why are you still here? One can only hope that there are not many Thai's who read the crap on this site. You people do not represent my views at all and if you taint how Thai people see the farang even more by reading posts in here you are not doing any of us any favors. Jeez..... were all of you this whiny back where you came from? These people are who they are and who they choose to be. That's their right. You can have your opinions for sure. It's just that some of your opinions are better left UNSAID. Especially when it is totally derogatory. How they do things? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. How they think? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. How government functions? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. How they choose to view us? Jerks like some of the posters on here do much to damage that view I'm sure. But in the end, NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. For the Americans reading in here: Do you like the Mexicans coming in and acting as though they own the joint? They refuse to speak English. They maintain their own little Mexican cliques. They eat their own types of food. They talk rubbish about Americans in Spanish and most of the time can get away with dissing us in our faces. How are the ugly farang who come here to Thailand any better?! They're not. Thailand owes you nothing. Thailand will be here with or without any of us. It is a fairly ancient land far older than lost western civilizations - 10 times as old as our grand old USA (or more - not shooting for accuracy right now). So grow up and get civilized. Be gracious GUESTS.

Guitarman you should be going for Thai Citizenship as you have the same defensive mindset. It makes me want to puke. We have every right to comment on the Thailand and the Thais as they have the right to comment when they visit the UK for eg......Seeing as i pay 37% tax for very limited benefit i think I am entitled to have an opnion. It's called FREEDOM of SPEECH! heard of it? Actually i posted before i read you pathetically defensive and predictable GO HOME comment. But you are a perfect example. Maybe the world doesnt think we need foreign monitors in UK for eg because you dont get politicians going around buying the vote for 200 baht and a packet of Mama....

Who benefits from free and fair elections? Foreigners? no the Thai people...duh! Do you not think we should have foreign observers in African countries where violence often present fair elections or is Thailand special because they have the luck of a good climate and the Portuguese brought them Chillis?

BTW the Thai Culture wont be around for much longer as they are busy trying to become western by chasing all the technology and lifestyle which admittedly makes those countries quite shallow.

Western elections are fair and honest? Are you serious? Corruption in western politics is legendary and yet no one would dare call for foreign monitors in any western election. Wouldn't make it to square one.

As for my "rant": one poster said he has rights as he works here and employs a handful of Thai nationals. Well, the Thai government certainly is grateful for your "contribution" to their financial well being I'm sure. Actually, you found a niche where you are able to maximize your profit margin by spending oodles less on labor and then importing on your own people at a greatly inflated price thus taking advantage of not one but two societies. Well done!

Others talk about how they are taxed and thus deserve rights as though they were immigrated citizens when in fact they will never denounce their homelands and seek citizenship with Thailand. A bit hypocritical isn't it?

The bottom line is that you DO NOT have the right to any sort of active opinion toward Thailand. You are ALL only visitors here most of whom are reeping many benefits in the form of hiding assets, evading taxes, escaping lives in the west, satisfying sexual fantasy tours, maximizing meager retirement accounts by living in this inexpensive land of "wine", women, and song. A minority are actually here for humanitarian or other non- selfcentered reasons. So spare me this "I have rights" bull. Most of you skating through to the end of your lives in a place that makes it all easy and pleasurable for you without having to pay any dues at all. And before you bring up visa fees or bank account mandates, they are in reality a cheap fee to pay in the end analysis. 2000 baht for 3 months = $60 USD. Wow! Sorry but that does not qualify. I am talking more about dues societally. But no one would want to really get involved even if they could. Only complain like armchair quarterbacks.

Comments about politics are fine. Comments about the people are fine. Comments about culture are fine. Making commentary on Thailand is wonderful. It is the racially charged bigoted comments that set me off. How dare you take an entire ethnic group and classify them as "stupid" or "BRAINLESS" or a hundred other derrogatory terms. I know many fine Thais who are neither stupid or brainless. In fact, they outshine most western acquaintences I have. I will go one further and say that there are more pretentious, self absorbed, brainless twits in the west then there are here. Am I stumping to be the next best friend of all Thais everywhere? Nope. I've seen the bad side of Thai people too. But I cannot abide MY people, westerners, being such dipwads. By the way, this is MY opinion that you seem to think we are all entitled to. Freedom of speech and all......................

What you said Guitarman

[IAMSOBAD]

So if farang means all these people you mention...then he is a biggot racist who doesnt respect anyone not Thai!

Many of us(expats) posters seem to be bothered by the possibly(most likely ) dishonest elections. I really do not understand why?

Elections do not affect us(foreigners) in any way what so ever. We can not vote, our lives do not change. The only difference it may possibly make is another change in the visa regulations or more rules on house or business buying or running.

Saying that, those changes, if were ever even thought of would be be implemented anyway.

Perfect example, Thaksin changed the 30 days visa run, new government did not reverse it but rather tightened it.

Personally i am only bothered by the choice of language and words used by the country leader,which shows general attitude towards foreigners.

I am also bothered that someone in his position, supposedly with very very good education would use words such as "farang"

None of the lawyers i have ever used, or doctors or accountants ever used word "farang" (in my presence at least) and here a Nations leader blabbing it in public., which once again only shows his level of education and intelligence

I am even more bothered that no one in the government including PM, did not at least criticize his words and did not force him to apologize, even though i deeply believe he should be sacked.

Yes we were not sent here by force, nor brought in chains. However we are here and there is absolutely no reason to disrespect us.

The constant discrimination by the sellers and general business running is already enough, why add more wood to the fire.

We do not receive any social security or welfare, we do not enjoy any of the discounts that Thai's get, so really we are no burden on the country or society.

Any university graduate(Thai National) with degree from any Western University instantly gets higher pay then grad from local university.

Furthermore most smaller business owned and run by Thai do not even pay any taxes , while any business owned by a foreigner no matter how small always pays taxes and every other duty that exists.

kuffki and others thinking in the same direction:

May I ask if you have any vested pecuniary interest in any biz in Thailand?

Or do you have any control over any biz within Thai territory?

If you do, you probably won't talk nor think the way you do that

the election has nothing to do with farang.

Many of us farang do have vested financial interests in several Thai biz.

And the investment is sizable in the low 9 digits at the moment.

You bet your life, since we run legit biz every which way, the honesty of Thai official and Thai govt do have direct impact and direct implication on every fiber of our biz and the bottom line in particular.

However for the majority of farang in Thailand, it is probably business as usual regardless of who is in power. On this score, you are irreputable.

For your info, the word farang is a collective terminology used to refer to a collection of several races and countries including people from U.S., Euro, Italy, Norway, Sweden et al.

The word farang is not derogatory nor is it racist in any shape or form. When a Thai couldn't distinguish a citizen from U.S., or Euro, it is pretty safe for the Thai to use the collective word farang to refer to that entity.

imho, it is just a collective word used to call people from several continents without really distinguishing who is who.

Hope you get my point and be able to from now on discount the word farang as you encounter it in the future. :jap:

[trisailer]

What a bunch of pathetic, pretentious cry babies.

Sticks and stones may break my bones but names will never hurt me. I learned that when I was five. Apparently the education of farang is not all it's cracked up to be.

It is their country.

[witsawakorn]

I agree with the deputy PM's assessment as well. Western NGOs and their members are often as crooked as they come and fronts for intelligence agencies.

I agree too. Having been in the US during the 2000 elections I was shocked to put it mildly when Gore was announced on TV news as the winner only to be overturned later when they found some more Bush votes to count in Florida which just happened to have GW's brother as governor. If the US is supposed to set the standard for free and fair elections why would any country want to let people in who potentially could have bee involved in the US 2000 elections?

[Jingthing]

Don't forget the US Elections for Bush II , the manager of a second class football team manager to become President of US.

The vote bill machines were made by a company where Bush I hade assets,

International survisors for the votes in US would be acceped in US? Think about before before you post rubbish.

Yes they were after 2000 because yes 2000 was scandalous. Read the thread. Bush, baseball (it's like cricket), not football (it's like rugby).

Edited March 25, 2011 by Jingthing

[Nisa]

Can someone who speaks Thai confirm that the translation is accurate and not taken out of context? He does not respect any foreigners in general or he does not trust them to supervisor Thai elections?

It's not accurate, look at the post by Buchholz quoted above you or go back to page 6. All he said was he doesn't worship farang and he doesn't think farang are better than Thai people

If you are going to translate it all then it is probably best to replace the word "farang" with "westerner" or "foreigner" since some people have convinced themselves this Thai word is racist.

Racist-NO

Impolite and Improper-YES

Slang of less educated and intelligent-YES

Can it be a derogatory term-YES

I agree given his his stature he could have used a different word but I don't believe the word farang is not slang or impolite and that is us putting our political correct standard on another culture.

Edited March 25, 2011 by Nisa

[lungmi]

I agree with the deputy PM's assessment as well. Western NGOs and their members are often as crooked as they come and fronts for intelligence agencies.

I agree too. Having been in the US during the 2000 elections I was shocked to put it mildly when Gore was announced on TV news as the winner only to be overturned later when they found some more Bush votes to count in Florida which just happened to have GW's brother as governor. If the US is supposed to set the standard for free and fair elections why would any country want to let people in who potentially could have bee involved in the US 2000 elections?

Right, the US elections. The machines to count the voters were made by a company of Bush Father.