21 Days Remaining?

[rawhod]

A great site...I have generally found answers to my questions by doing a search...however I have detailed question regarding the 21 days remaining for converting a Tourist Visa to a Non-Imm. O Visa for retirement. (I do meet the age and the income requirements)

I am from the UK and have a triple (3) entry Tourist Visa issued on 22 Oct 2010. "This visa must be utilised before 21 April 2011"

I have utilised 2 entries:-

1st 09 Nov 2010...original entry...60 days (admitted until 07 Jan 2011)

2nd 05 Jan 2011...Mai Sai visa run...60 days (admitted until 05 Mar 2011)

On 03 Mar 2011 I obtained a 30 day extension of stay from Chiang Mai Immigration until 04 Apr 2011.

I was proposing to utilise my 3rd entry on 03 April at Mai Sai and soon after that, apply for my change of visa to Non-Imm O for the reason of retirement and then apply for the retirement extension (at the same time if they would do it, or after 30 days if that is what they stipulate)

Finally, my question is:-

The 21 days remaining requirement for the change of visa from Tourist to Non-Imm O, is it based on:-

1. The "This visa must be utilised before date on the original Tourist Visa" ie. 21 April 2011.

or

2. The "Admitted until" date that I will receive from my visa run to Mai Sai. ie. approx 01 June 2011

If it is 1, I need to get moving.If it is 2, I have time in hand.

Thank you.

ps.sorry for the change in font size, damned compuers.

[Lite Beer]

No.2 within the final 21 days of your permision to stay.

Although there have been recent reports of success with less than 21 days remaining.

[Mario2008]

The 21 days is counted fom they day you have permission to stay in Thailand, that is the stamp you got when you arrived in Thailand. You do now that you can get a 30 day etension from immigration for 1,000 baht (and a passport photo)?

But the 21 day rule doesn't seem to be in pace any more, people with 10 days left have reported they culd convert.

Note that not all immigration office will convert, they might send you to Bangkok. If you live in Chiang Mai I believe they will convert based on retirement.

[rawhod]

Thank you...that does help.

It looks like I do have more time to do the juggling...to get the timing right for... a Visitor Visa application for my girlfiend to visit the UK...rearrange my Emirates flight at a cost of £75... and... make sure our proposed 3 month visit to the UK does not coincide with the final 30 day requirement for the retirement stay application (if that is what immigration require).

No doubt I will have other questions as the next few months unfolds

[Mario2008]

Thank you...that does help.

It looks like I do have more time to do the juggling...to get the timing right for... a Visitor Visa application for my girlfiend to visit the UK...rearrange my Emirates flight at a cost of £75... and... make sure our proposed 3 month visit to the UK does not coincide with the final 30 day requirement for the retirement stay application (if that is what immigration require).

No doubt I will have other questions as the next few months unfolds

If you have proof of travel, immigration often will extend a bit earlier than 30 days before your permission to stay ends. Alternatively, get a non-O in the Uk from the consulate in Hull while you are in the UK. Can apply by mail.

[rawhod]

Thank you...that does help.

It looks like I do have more time to do the juggling...to get the timing right for... a Visitor Visa application for my girlfiend to visit the UK...rearrange my Emirates flight at a cost of £75... and... make sure our proposed 3 month visit to the UK does not coincide with the final 30 day requirement for the retirement stay application (if that is what immigration require).

No doubt I will have other questions as the next few months unfolds

If you have proof of travel, immigration often will extend a bit earlier than 30 days before your permission to stay ends. Alternatively, get a non-O in the Uk from the consulate in Hull while you are in the UK. Can apply by mail.

I'd rather not take the risk on them refusing the retirement extension earlier than 30 days. My current flight date is 21 April, so I have a couple of week after my visa run on 3 April to do the change from tourist to non-O. I will then know when they will allow me to apply for the retirement extension of stay. I can then rearrange my travel with some certainty. I would prefer to do the change to non-O and the retirement extension whilst in Thailand rather than having the hassle of obtaining the non-O at Hull.

[rawhod]

Just one further question (if anyone who knows still follows this thread)...

When I convert my Tourist visa into a Non-O visa, what date is the Non-O valid from:-

The date of conversion

The date of last entry

The date of expiry of the last entry

or "an other date"

Thank you

[lopburi3]

It should be the date you do the conversion - some officers have allowed retirement extension of stay on that date if financial paperwork is in order (no more time in bank required).

[rawhod]

Thank you Lopburi...prompt and to the point as usual

[JimGant]

Based on a recent example, CM Immigration doesn't do same-day conversion and retirement extension -- even if the money's been in the bank for 2 months, or you've got an income letter. But, of course, it never hurts to try....

Assuming, then, that you'll have to come back 60 days after conversion for your retirement extension (i.e., during the last 30 days of your permission of stay), I'm not sure how you'll get your full 3 months vacation in the UK? Assuming you convert on or around 19 April, you'll need to be back in Thailand no later than the second week in July to get your retirement extension. So, you'll have to shave a few days off of that 3-mos vacation (unless Hull remains an option....). Oh, if you do convert, don't forget to get a re-entry permit -- or that Non Imm 90-day permission will evaporate upon re-entry to Thailand.

Of course, if you're adverse to Hull, you could forget converting prior to vacation, re-enter Thailand on a 30-day exempt stamp, then convert from that. You'd get your full vacation (but you'd need to buy a refundable onward ticket out of Bangkok, or face possible denied boarding out of England).

And, you could possibly convert tomorrow -- assuming CM doesn't adhere to the 21-day rule. However, that would cut even further into your vacation. (Unless, somehow, you got lucky with a same-day retirement extension. Plus, that would save you a border run.)

[rawhod]

Based on a recent example, CM Immigration doesn't do same-day conversion and retirement extension -- even if the money's been in the bank for 2 months, or you've got an income letter. But, of course, it never hurts to try....

Assuming, then, that you'll have to come back 60 days after conversion for your retirement extension (i.e., during the last 30 days of your permission of stay), I'm not sure how you'll get your full 3 months vacation in the UK? Assuming you convert on or around 19 April, you'll need to be back in Thailand no later than the second week in July to get your retirement extension. So, you'll have to shave a few days off of that 3-mos vacation (unless Hull remains an option....). Oh, if you do convert, don't forget to get a re-entry permit -- or that Non Imm 90-day permission will evaporate upon re-entry to Thailand.

Of course, if you're adverse to Hull, you could forget converting prior to vacation, re-enter Thailand on a 30-day exempt stamp, then convert from that. You'd get your full vacation (but you'd need to buy a refundable onward ticket out of Bangkok, or face possible denied boarding out of England).

And, you could possibly convert tomorrow -- assuming CM doesn't adhere to the 21-day rule. However, that would cut even further into your vacation. (Unless, somehow, you got lucky with a same-day retirement extension. Plus, that would save you a border run.)

Jim...thank you for taking the time to read and reply. Your thoughts and suggestions are very much appreciated. It's useful to have someone unconnected to give advice.

My original intention was to get the maximum out of my three entry Tourist visa by doing a further visa run (60 days) and then rearrange my flight to the UK to the week 20 - 26 June. As my 60 days were expiring, I would do an extension at CM Immigration (30 days) giving me a total of 90 days which would take me to about 28 June. That would give time to make the UK Tourist Visa application at the beginning of June and take up the rearranged flight for a 3 month visit to the UK..Then, whilst in the UK, I would do, as you suggest and get a non-O from Hull, return to to Thailand and apply for the retirement extension.

But then I thought...If I take up my 3rd entry on my Tv, I can get 90 days on a non-O whilst in Thailand, by converting my Tv. to non-O (having easily exceeded the 21 days remaining requirement). Then, after 60 days, around 1 June, apply for the retirement extension, make the UK Visa application and take up my rearranged flight the week 20 - 26 June for our 3 month visit to the UK.

That way I have the retirement extension in place before our return to Thailand.

I assume I need a re-entry if I leave Thailand on a retirement extension, and on my return I will get a further 90days before having to report.

Just a thought, would it cause any problems that I am out of Thailand when I should do my first 90 day report., or would my first 90 day report, be 90 days after I return again to Thailand?

[beechguy]

Yes, you need a re-entry permit to keep your permission to stay valid when leaving Thailand, single is 1,000 Baht, multi is 3,800 Baht. The 90 day addresss report is for those remaining in Thailand 90 days or more, if not here, no report is due. The period will start again when you enter Thailand.

[lopburi3]

and on my return I will get a further 90days before having to report.

A re-entry permit only allow use of current permitted to stay time - it does not mean a new entry or deferring time. If your permitted to stay is July 22 now a re-entry permit will have that date and on return that date will be your permitted to stay.

Now if you are talking about 90 day address reports then yes - a return resets that clock to day 1.

[rawhod]

and on my return I will get a further 90days before having to report.

A re-entry permit only allow use of current permitted to stay time - it does not mean a new entry or deferring time. If your permitted to stay is July 22 now a re-entry permit will have that date and on return that date will be your permitted to stay.

Now if you are talking about 90 day address reports then yes - a return resets that clock to day 1.

That has confused me a little...

Assuming everything goes to plan and I convert my Tv to a Non-O, and subsequently get a 1 year retirement extension, there is a requirement to report every 90 days. Is this what you are referring to as the 90 day address report?

Having got my retirement extension, I will then apply for a re-entry permit, exit Thailand for a 3 month visit to the UK and then return to Thailand, obviously missing my first 90 day report Will my re-entry then reset the clock regarding the 90 day report requirement?

[lopburi3]

Yes those are 90 day address reports and are not made when out of country - only after being in country without leaving for 90 days. So the clock starts at day one on any entry. You use a TM.47 for this reporting requirement.

[rawhod]

Yes those are 90 day address reports and are not made when out of country - only after being in country without leaving for 90 days. So the clock starts at day one on any entry. You use a TM.47 for this reporting requirement.

Thank you