naggiej Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Good day to you, It's hard to find good breads or a good sandwich shop in Thailand. I'm an artisan baker. I want to open a small gourmet sandwich shop for westerners. My shop will bake our own bread (foccacia, ciabatta, white bread, multigrain, italian, french...you name it!). I have everything planned out, except for the location. I live in Bangkok but I don't mind moving to other province. Could anyone please suggest a location? I would like a place close to the office area or schools, where people can come over for lunch to have a nice sandwich and hot soup. A place where there is a demand for it. My target consumers will not be Thai, but westerners. Thai people most likely will not appreciate the type of sandwich I want to provide. Please be specific on the area. I know that sukhumvit rd is a high traffic area but it's a long road (and very expensive rent). So please be specific. Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Thank you very much. Best regards, Maggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michaelaway Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 Pattaya wants you...! So, come on down!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinChapman Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 I can't advise you on location, but please keep us posted on here when you open and I'll be a customer if you're in Bangkok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauljones Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 Pattaya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raro Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 yesyes Pattaya! Around the corner from where I live I was thinking for a while why not opening a sandwich shop...seriously! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 Suggest turkey/avocado as a sandwich option. Pattaya is good but there is existing competition of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naggiej Posted April 3, 2011 Author Share Posted April 3, 2011 Thank you soooo much for all the ideas and advices. I will keep you posted on my shop. I will look at both Pattaya and Bangkok. Again, thank you very much. Maggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazygourmet Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 For potential competition, check this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supaprik Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 For potential competition, check this one. Le Lapin....AROI MAK MAK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzbo Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 If you are -- as you say -- an artisanal baker that is something rare enough. You might also consider the route of just sticking with the breads, etc. and selling wholesale to other shops rather than going the retail route ... a much broader potential customer base regardless of where you locate your bakery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naggiej Posted April 4, 2011 Author Share Posted April 4, 2011 If you are -- as you say -- an artisanal baker that is something rare enough. You might also consider the route of just sticking with the breads, etc. and selling wholesale to other shops rather than going the retail route ... a much broader potential customer base regardless of where you locate your bakery. Thank you for your comment. Our plan is to do both wholesale and retails. I will keep everyone posted as we move along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokie36 Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Grated cheddar an pickle on seeded baguette please. :jap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Familyonthemove Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 In Bangkok I reckon the junction of Sukhumvit road and Soi 33 and 22 is the best location. Lots of ex-pats and passing trade. There's a Subway and a Pizza Company there ... but that's probably because it's the right area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokie36 Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 In Bangkok I reckon the junction of Sukhumvit road and Soi 33 and 22 is the best location. Lots of ex-pats and passing trade. There's a Subway and a Pizza Company there ... but that's probably because it's the right area? Yeah forget Lower Sukhumvit.....nearer the skytrain the better though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanaFoods Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 (edited) My company makes western food as well, albeit bottled... but I do know our best sales areas are Phuket, Pattaya, Chiangmai, and BKK - in no particular order. Best place to live per my experience and opinion is Chiangmai (I lived there for a year), though maybe not the best of the four areas mentioned above for sales. But who knows - I haven't seen too many decent bread and sandwich shops there last visit. But then again, its been awhile.... Phuket is really nice too, especially if you enjoy the beach environment - definitely one of our top sales areas, but I don't know about the bakery/sandwich market there. Pattaya is really good sales for us, though not my choice for living. If you love nightlife and excitement, then it would most certainly be better than living in BKK. But I do believe there is a good bit competition in your market there. BKK: My personal opinion is that I would avoid living in BKK at all costs, although it has great sales potential. I can't tolerate the traffic, noise, and congestion. I just get the feeling I'm putting my life into the hands of maniac drivers every time I step out to do anything. All a matter of your personal preferences, but that's my 2-cents Edited April 5, 2011 by NanaFoods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naggiej Posted April 5, 2011 Author Share Posted April 5, 2011 Grated cheddar an pickle on seeded baguette please. :jap: of course!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naggiej Posted April 5, 2011 Author Share Posted April 5, 2011 In Bangkok I reckon the junction of Sukhumvit road and Soi 33 and 22 is the best location. Lots of ex-pats and passing trade. There's a Subway and a Pizza Company there ... but that's probably because it's the right area? Thank you for your advise on the location. I will look into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyce Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) Pattaya , is not an option i would stay clear of the place as its' full of Bakers such as the continental bakery Chain and the Subway Chain. 4 shops already in pattaya. Also dont forget the the German Bakers in pattaya , aslo crime in pattaya i lived there for 7 years and i'm glad to be away from the place, Surin has no crime. http://www.continent...erypattaya.com/ Google subway for some reason it wont paste. Also there' s foodland, and friendship, supermarkets to contend with http://www.pattaya-f...k.com/m1639.htm the competition is ferce , i would look at Surin the Issan one, there is not a Bakery around this area apart from Big C if that's competition there's none i have lived here in Surin for 3 years and the place is crying out for some quality Bakery and a good Sandwitch Shop in the area witch is full of expats ,i have a friend who has a new Resort who was asking for a Baker to supply the Resort with Pastiries and Bread just recently you can email me for any infomation naggiej on Surin on [email protected] Just think no competion. Regards Boyce Edited April 7, 2011 by Boyce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonobo Posted April 9, 2011 Share Posted April 9, 2011 Just an alternative viewpoint: there are many foreigners in both the Pin Klao and Phasi Charoen areas across the river in Thonburi, and other than one Villa Market on Rapprapruek Road, there is really nothing there aimed at the foreign population. If you are going to be doing both wholesale and retail, both locations are convenient for the wholesale biz, and I think there are enough people around who would die for a western food place to make the retail lunch biz. Somewhere on the Suk would undoubtedly have more potential lunch customers, but prices are higher and competition more fierce. And don't discount your Thai potential for your breads. At the Mall Bang Khae and at Central Pin Klao, the two Japanese bakeries selling western bread are usually mobbed by Thais. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steven100 Posted April 9, 2011 Share Posted April 9, 2011 As mentioned earlier , somewhere between Sukhumvit Soi 31 & 35 on the same side .... ( not across the other side of sukhumvit ) There is a growing number of office workers in this area and lunch times are very crowded.... There are a couple of high rise office blocks on the corner at soi 31 and as well , any location up to soi 35 should be good. Try for a vacant shop along the front thereby staying out of the high rises ... the rent will be alot less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naggiej Posted April 9, 2011 Author Share Posted April 9, 2011 Thank you soooo much for all the advise. Seriously, I wouldn't even thought about many of the places without your advise. My initial thought was somewhere in Bangkok and Phuket because I live in Bangkok. For Phuket, I went there for vacation and saw a market potential. Initially, I actually didn't think about Pattaya as a potential place (I just didn't think about it!!). Now I see that there are demands, however, there are a lot of competitors. It's also not my favorite place to live. I actually didn't think about Surin neither. I went to Surin couple times. you are right, it is hard to find a good bakery there! Bonobo, thank you for your advise around Pinklao. I actually live around that area. My goal for this bakery is for westerner. So, yes, I discounted my Thai customers. That's why I didn't think that Pinklao could be a good place. However, now you make my head a little more clear that there might be some potential here....and I SHOULDN't discount my Thai customers. I'm really looking at Sukhumvit. However, it's very risky to do business there. I'm really in a dilemma. Again, thank you so much for all your advises. Everyone gave me valuable information and ideas for the shop. I'll keep my ears open and searching for the right locations. Thank you, Maggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyce Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 (edited) Any updates on your new venture Maggie . Edited April 15, 2011 by Boyce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brodychach Posted April 18, 2011 Share Posted April 18, 2011 Hi Maggie, Im also an aritsan bread baker and was curious what kind of flour you are planning on using? The Thai flours are all highly bleached and are of inferior quality to European and US flours, but the Eurpoean flours are prohibitively expensive. My advice in terms of location would be to attach yourself to a pre-existing living complex where there are a guaranteed constant of foreigners. In Bangkok, I would advise Nichada which is out in Chaeng Wattana which is a massive housing complex of foreigners with many stay at home moms and very few good food options.... In Phuket, there is something similar though not quite as large called Laguna which is comprised ot several different hotel chains as well as short/long term houses with lots of foreigners... There you could try to get a space inside or just outside the complex in an area called Chern Talay good luck B Thank you soooo much for all the advise. Seriously, I wouldn't even thought about many of the places without your advise. My initial thought was somewhere in Bangkok and Phuket because I live in Bangkok. For Phuket, I went there for vacation and saw a market potential. Initially, I actually didn't think about Pattaya as a potential place (I just didn't think about it!!). Now I see that there are demands, however, there are a lot of competitors. It's also not my favorite place to live. I actually didn't think about Surin neither. I went to Surin couple times. you are right, it is hard to find a good bakery there! Bonobo, thank you for your advise around Pinklao. I actually live around that area. My goal for this bakery is for westerner. So, yes, I discounted my Thai customers. That's why I didn't think that Pinklao could be a good place. However, now you make my head a little more clear that there might be some potential here....and I SHOULDN't discount my Thai customers. I'm really looking at Sukhumvit. However, it's very risky to do business there. I'm really in a dilemma. Again, thank you so much for all your advises. Everyone gave me valuable information and ideas for the shop. I'll keep my ears open and searching for the right locations. Thank you, Maggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted April 23, 2011 Share Posted April 23, 2011 Maybe Siam/Emporium/Thonglo areas? Lots of foreign people around those areas. They'd be willing to pay for some decent baked goods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naggiej Posted April 24, 2011 Author Share Posted April 24, 2011 I haven't checked back at this website lately. However, thank you very much for all the advises. We're still in the planning and location hunting stage. We are planning to open a shop by the end of this year. B, I have a flour supplier that I worked with. I believe they use a blend of Canadian and US flour. Thank you, Maggie Hi Maggie, Im also an aritsan bread baker and was curious what kind of flour you are planning on using? The Thai flours are all highly bleached and are of inferior quality to European and US flours, but the Eurpoean flours are prohibitively expensive. My advice in terms of location would be to attach yourself to a pre-existing living complex where there are a guaranteed constant of foreigners. In Bangkok, I would advise Nichada which is out in Chaeng Wattana which is a massive housing complex of foreigners with many stay at home moms and very few good food options.... In Phuket, there is something similar though not quite as large called Laguna which is comprised ot several different hotel chains as well as short/long term houses with lots of foreigners... There you could try to get a space inside or just outside the complex in an area called Chern Talay good luck B Thank you soooo much for all the advise. Seriously, I wouldn't even thought about many of the places without your advise. My initial thought was somewhere in Bangkok and Phuket because I live in Bangkok. For Phuket, I went there for vacation and saw a market potential. Initially, I actually didn't think about Pattaya as a potential place (I just didn't think about it!!). Now I see that there are demands, however, there are a lot of competitors. It's also not my favorite place to live. I actually didn't think about Surin neither. I went to Surin couple times. you are right, it is hard to find a good bakery there! Bonobo, thank you for your advise around Pinklao. I actually live around that area. My goal for this bakery is for westerner. So, yes, I discounted my Thai customers. That's why I didn't think that Pinklao could be a good place. However, now you make my head a little more clear that there might be some potential here....and I SHOULDN't discount my Thai customers. I'm really looking at Sukhumvit. However, it's very risky to do business there. I'm really in a dilemma. Again, thank you so much for all your advises. Everyone gave me valuable information and ideas for the shop. I'll keep my ears open and searching for the right locations. Thank you, Maggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JibNattavadee Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 I would like to introduce you guys a good sandwich place. They have baker on-site, yes of course they bake their own bread. Just doesn't like others. Everythig there is home made even their garnishings. It's on sukhumvit soi 53. can check the facebook at f<b>acebook.com/bezobangkok </b> <br>I can't advise you on location, but please keep us posted on here when you open and I'll be a customer if you're in Bangkok.<br><br><br><br> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maprao Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 Is the original poster (naggiej) and avatar Ballentyne one and the same????? Your writing style, wording is too close to be a coincidence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billaaa777 Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Please do not consider Pattaya. These exact same posters that want you to open here, will soon be knocking you for your high prices. Anything over 50 Baht and they will be complaining. Just read the post on restaurants in the Pattaya section of this forum and you will see what I mean. I once did a review on a sandwich shop here where I had a French Dip, Homemade Onion Rings, and a Coke which cost 300 Baht. Of course, beef and cheese is expensive in Thailand and the sandwich was excellent. I had posters saying they would NEVER pay that much and would rather buy a Pre-Made sandwich from a 7-11for 30 Baht and sit on the sidewalk and eat it. Location, Location, Location is everything. I think one of the places that does best in Pattaya is a Subway that is located in a shoebox size store right on the corner of Walking Street. Every night when people leave Walking Street the place is packed. Good luck with your hunt. I used to own a sandwich shop in the US. They do great at lunch time if you are in an office area, and then nothing the rest of the day. If you want your place to be a huge financial success you are going to have to find a store front with low rent, that has both afternoon and evening traffic. That will not be easy, but it can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theseahorse Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 I'm not sure if Bangkok is the place to do it either. There's already a lot of very good bakers here. When people say that it's hard to find good bread in Bangkok they obviously haven't been looking. There are lots of very good quality bakers in the city, you just need to pay a bit extra for the bread. You don't even need to go to thier shop as some even deliver. A decent loaf of bread here will be about 100- 150 baht, but a decent loaf of bread in the UK is at least 2.50p. Same same. Anywhere in BK with a large farang population working nearby will already have an Au Bon Pain or similar. I have no doubt your artisan breads will be much nicer but with the rent in theses areas you'd have no choice but to either use mass produced bread (au bon pain) or charge so much to cover your costs that people wouldn't pay the price. This is why the numerous good quality bakers here are either part of a hotel or do a deliver service from a kitchen (with low rent) away from the busy areas. Good luck with your venture though and make sure you let us know where you set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherWilliamsBKK Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 Le Petit Boulangere is excellent for sandwiches (call chefsxp) mortadella, goats cheese, pastrami, sundried tomatos etc. excellent fillings - not sure if they sell bread only though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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