Pirates Free Thai Ship For US$5 Million

[blackthorn2005]

Don't expect any help from the Brits.....

When a Royal Navy warship captured a crew of Somali pirates, it seemed like a rare chance to strike back at the ruthless sea gangsters. The 17 outlaws were armed with an arsenal of AK 47s and rocket-propelled grenades, and had forced hostages on a hijacked fishing vessel to work as slaves for three months.

But instead of bringing them to justice, the British servicemen were ordered to provide the pirates halal meals, medical checks, cigarettes – and in one case even a nicotine patch – before releasing them in their own boats.

What bit of " the British servicemen were ordered" is it you do not understand?

[dean999]

Don't expect any help from the Brits.....

When a Royal Navy warship captured a crew of Somali pirates, it seemed like a rare chance to strike back at the ruthless sea gangsters. The 17 outlaws were armed with an arsenal of AK 47s and rocket-propelled grenades, and had forced hostages on a hijacked fishing vessel to work as slaves for three months.

But instead of bringing them to justice, the British servicemen were ordered to provide the pirates halal meals, medical checks, cigarettes – and in one case even a nicotine patch – before releasing them in their own boats.

I am in the British Royal Navy. I think it's funny when people make comments on things they know nothing about. But then with all the bashing on TV, some people don't care about the truth / fact. Only what they read in newspapers and they tell the truth don't they.

[RickBradford]

^^

You both missed my point, which is that the politicians () who give the orders to the Royal Navy, do everything to stop it doing what it does well -- i.e. putting these pirates out of action for good and making the waters safe for honest folk.

Rather the same as British police now do more 'diversity sensitivity training' (2 days per year at HQ, one at division, an 8-hour e-learning package, and reports on progress) than they do on safety training (1 day), or that the RAF's Typhoons are unable to drop bombs on Gaddafi forces because budget cuts mean they haven't been able to train pilots to drop the things.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/8446855/RAF-training-cuts-leave-Typhoons-idle.html

Edited April 13, 2011 by RickBradford

[LaoPo]

^^

You both missed my point, which is that the politicians () who give the orders to the Royal Navy, do everything to stop it doing what it does well -- i.e. putting these pirates out of action for good and making the waters safe for honest folk.

No Sir, YOU miss the point.

The British Royal Navy does NOT act on it's own in the fight against Somali pirates.

They act within the EU NAVFOR* and there are rules and laws all member have to follow. If every single EU country would act on it's own it would become a mess.

The USA, India, China, Japan are already acting on their own behalf and that's their own responsibility and task.

And, like member Dean999 already said, being with the British Royal Navy, lots of people talk about things they don't know about.

In this particular topic it's about the ransom paid for a Thai ship. Many ship- and cargo owners paid ransoms before and there are (unfortunately) more to follow.

But, the news that many navy forces prevented many many vessel attacks by pirates is NO news anymore; only if a ransom has been paid.

But, maybe some should read a little about the EU NAVFOR and one would understand a lot more about the good work by all navy forces in their battle against the Somali piracy!

http://www.eunavfor.eu/press/news/

LaoPo

[RickBradford]

The British Royal Navy does NOT act on it's own in the fight against Somali pirates.

They act within the EU NAVFOR* and there are rules and laws all member have to follow.

That is exactly the point I was making. The EU politicians make up 'rules and laws' which prevent the navies from putting these pirates out of action for good, and making the waters safe for honest folk.

[LaoPo]

The British Royal Navy does NOT act on it's own in the fight against Somali pirates.

They act within the EU NAVFOR* and there are rules and laws all member have to follow.

That is exactly the point I was making. The EU politicians make up 'rules and laws' which prevent the navies from putting these pirates out of action for good, and making the waters safe for honest folk.

OK; so what you propose is kill all pirates the EU NAVFOR encounters? Is that the way civilized western countries should act ?

If so, we could as well destroy all "enemies" with some nukes....

Will solve a lot of problems, won't it?

LaoPo

[chuckd]

OK; so what you propose is kill all pirates the EU NAVFOR encounters? Is that the way civilized western countries should act ?

If so, we could as well destroy all "enemies" with some nukes....

Will solve a lot of problems, won't it?

LaoPo

It would seem if one kills all the pirates, there would be no more piracy.

Am I missing something here?

AARGH!

[Bagwan]

Yes Mister the Mariner of my Dreams, the range of operation of the pirats is over 1000 km. Convoy ? Mixing container ships at 25 knots with ULCC at 12 knots and 20 meters draft, and trawlers pulling their nets ? I donot quite see the "convoys" over the Atlantic during WW2 were safe. A good 50% of the ships sunk. Ships and crews. Even they were fitted with some heavy guns 105 mm, that a shell is enough to sink a lill' submarine like the Nazis had, and heavy duty machine guns too at 12,7 mm....

I bet you go a bit too heavy on VDO and booze, don't you ?

As another has pointed out, you are well off beam with casualty numbers sustained during the Battle of the Atlantic - but being French you wouldn't know a lot about that would you?

However, as a Master Mariner I would have thought that you would know that a 4" gun isn't a lot of use against a submerged U boat, nor incidentally is a heavy machine gun. Even if a U boat was caught on the surface ,hitting a submarine is no easy task, particularly with the gunnery fire control arrangements at that time. As you may, or may not know, the North Atlantic in winter does nothing to assist in maintaining a stable gun platform. Remote Power Control mountings were not fitted in RN destroyers until 1944.

P.S. I don't do Metric so you'll have to convert the 4" to whatever suits you. I also do ₤SD.

Edited April 13, 2011 by Bagwan

[LaoPo]

OK; so what you propose is kill all pirates the EU NAVFOR encounters? Is that the way civilized western countries should act ?

If so, we could as well destroy all "enemies" with some nukes....

Will solve a lot of problems, won't it?

LaoPo

It would seem if one kills all the pirates, there would be no more piracy.

Am I missing something here?

AARGH!

The pirates who seized the sailing yacht Quest* off the coast of Oman and later killed the 4 Americans on board, less than 2 months ago on Febraury 22nd, were taken to the US for trial**, not killed by the navy as a repercussion for the four murders.

If every country would kill all criminals for their actions, including murderers, the prisons would be empty.

Is that what we want?

*

** Judge refuses year delay for pirate trial

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2011/04/12/Judge-refuses-year-delay-for-pirate-trial/UPI-88631302654397/

The piracy problem is a worldwide problem since most countries, including North America, are depending on merchandise and oil on board of all vessels traveling to the Suez Canal.

Killing all pirates is a no-no for most countries involved but a solution HAS to be found and an interesting article about such a solution is in the next post.

LaoPo

[LaoPo]

We’re firing blanks in the war against piracy

By Praveen Swami World Last updated: April 12th, 2011

Heavily armed Somali pirates took 1,016 hostages last year (Photo: AFP) Photo in link, below*

In the autumn of 1816, Admiral Lord Exmouth arrived off the port of Algiers with five ships of the line, and orders to use nothing but shot to negotiate with the city’s pirates. In the battle that followed, the British lost 128 men, and their Dutch allies 13. But casualties among the enemy were monumentally greater, as Algiers’s fleet was destroyed and its fortifications levelled. Even though the corsairs of the Barbary coast continued to prey on merchant ships until 1830, when the French occupied Algiers, their backbone was broken – and tens of thousands of lives that would have been lost to the slave trade were saved.

This week, it has emerged that 17 Somali pirates captured by HMS Cornwall in February were given meals, medical check-ups and cigarettes (or, in one case, a nicotine patch) before being set free after the captain was advised that Britain had no legal framework to prosecute them.

<snip>

At the end of the article it says:

"That leaves just one option, which no one so far has wanted to take: punitive action against the pirates’ bases on the Somali coast. As in 1816, the risks are considerable. But it is increasingly clear that the easier, softer way is leading nowhere."

Article continues here (a recommended read for interested members)

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/praveenswami/100083579/we%E2%80%99re-firing-blanks-in-the-war-against-piracy/

Note:

"Punitive action"...as in 1816...

The question is: what does the writer mean with "punitive action" ? kill all pirates ?

We simply can't go the way a nation could go 200 years ago.

LaoPo

[LaoPo]

Yes Mister the Mariner of my Dreams, the range of operation of the pirats is over 1000 km. Convoy ? Mixing container ships at 25 knots with ULCC at 12 knots and 20 meters draft, and trawlers pulling their nets ? I donot quite see the "convoys" over the Atlantic during WW2 were safe. A good 50% of the ships sunk. Ships and crews. Even they were fitted with some heavy guns 105 mm, that a shell is enough to sink a lill' submarine like the Nazis had, and heavy duty machine guns too at 12,7 mm....

I bet you go a bit too heavy on VDO and booze, don't you ?

As another has pointed out, you are well off beam with casualty numbers sustained during the Battle of the Atlantic - but being French you wouldn't know a lot about that would you?

However, as a Master Mariner I would have thought that you would know that a 4" gun isn't a lot of use against a submerged U boat, nor incidentally is a heavy machine gun. Even if a U boat was caught on the surface ,hitting a submarine is no easy task, particularly with the gunnery fire control arrangements at that time. As you may, or may not know, the North Atlantic in winter does nothing to assist in maintaining a stable gun platform. Remote Power Control mountings were not fitted in RN destroyers until 1944.

P.S. I don't do Metric so you'll have to convert the 4" to whatever suits you. I also do ₤SD.

It's simple:

An Inch is 2,54cm, so 4" is 10,16cms;

1 in = 1″ := 0,0254 m = 2,54 cm

LaoPo

[endure]

I think that all nations should take a lead from the way that the Russian Navy deals with these Pirates when they come across them - very, very, brutally. According to some media sources, when patrolling Russians identify offshore (in international waters) Pirates, they simply raid it for verification, and then just eliminate the boat and it's crew - I am led to understand, that old international sea laws, when bent a little , still permit this line of action. In contrast, the British Royal Navy, upon finding Pirates, sink their boat and guns, but return the crew, unharmed, to Somalian waters. During which time, the 'prisoners' are fed, watered, and given ciggaretes to keep them quiet. The philosophy being, don't antagonise these Pirates because they may start taking (Islamically justified) retribution on future hostages, and to date, hostages have been treated reasonably well in general. Personally, as a Brit, I preffer the Russian method. And I imagine most Brit's do too.

Any links...proof..articles of what you claim?

LaoPo

Of course not. 'According to some media sources' - 'I am led to understand' and other nonsensical nonsense. One thing in this thread is obvious - there are VERY few posters in it who've ever been to sea and who understand the logistics and conditions that apply to merchant ships in places like the Gulf of Aden.

I obtain most of my info from British broadsheet newspapers, and British documentary television, who, don't seem to have their reports disputed. And of course, one takes this information on face value (i.e. these media sources can't really afford the egg on their faces by getting their journalism totally wrong). Be my guest, do some searching of European origin, and bring yourself up to speed on international affairs ('not been to sea' - ha ha what planet are you from - Kentucky?)

No I'm someone from that planet who spent 14 years of his life working in places like the Gulf of Aden, the Malacca Straits, the Straits of Tiran, Hodeidah and all the other places that British broadsheet newspapers and the BBC write about but have never set foot in.

[RickBradford]

These Somali pirates are murderers, kidnappers and extortionists.

You do not fight them effectively by serving them sandwiches, tea, and nicotine patches, What next, a string quartet to play their favourite melodies so they don't get homesick before being released? Soon these pirate vessels will be queueing up to receive care packages from the Royal Navy.

At the end of the article that LaoPo quoted, it said: "But it is increasingly clear that the easier, softer way is leading nowhere."

That's because it almost never does. These pirates expect to be opposed by force, and regard as weak fools those people who mollycoddle them. That is the way to encourage more piracy, not prevent it.

[chuckd]

These Somali pirates are murderers, kidnappers and extortionists.

You do not fight them effectively by serving them sandwiches, tea, and nicotine patches, What next, a string quartet to play their favourite melodies so they don't get homesick before being released? Soon these pirate vessels will be queueing up to receive care packages from the Royal Navy.

At the end of the article that LaoPo quoted, it said: "But it is increasingly clear that the easier, softer way is leading nowhere."

That's because it almost never does. These pirates expect to be opposed by force, and regard as weak fools those people who mollycoddle them. That is the way to encourage more piracy, not prevent it.

Very well said.

[dean999]

These Somali pirates are murderers, kidnappers and extortionists.

You do not fight them effectively by serving them sandwiches, tea, and nicotine patches, What next, a string quartet to play their favourite melodies so they don't get homesick before being released? Soon these pirate vessels will be queueing up to receive care packages from the Royal Navy.

At the end of the article that LaoPo quoted, it said: "But it is increasingly clear that the easier, softer way is leading nowhere."

That's because it almost never does. These pirates expect to be opposed by force, and regard as weak fools those people who mollycoddle them. That is the way to encourage more piracy, not prevent it.

Very well said.

I agree to, but you have to remember the UK armed forces have a protocol to engage any enemy / threat. I can't go in to specifics to much but we are only allowed to use reasonable force. i.e. if the pirates are attacking with weapons, be it ships or human life, then we can engage them with the same. But as soon as they no longer are a threat we can't engage. The pirates know this. You also have to remember everyone has the right to be treated like a human being, even if some or most don't agree.

Could you imagine, one of the pirates has just killed your mate onboard and now because he no long is a threat you have to treat him well. F_cked up I know, but then this is why we have some of the best armed forces, because we are professional and very well trained and follow the correct protocol for each situation, even if we don't agree.

[LaoPo]

These Somali pirates are murderers, kidnappers and extortionists.

You do not fight them effectively by serving them sandwiches, tea, and nicotine patches, What next, a string quartet to play their favourite melodies so they don't get homesick before being released? Soon these pirate vessels will be queueing up to receive care packages from the Royal Navy.

At the end of the article that LaoPo quoted, it said: "But it is increasingly clear that the easier, softer way is leading nowhere."

That's because it almost never does. These pirates expect to be opposed by force, and regard as weak fools those people who mollycoddle them. That is the way to encourage more piracy, not prevent it.

Right, and so are millions of prisoners, (also criminals, murderers, kidnappers, child abusers and extortionists) worldwide, also in YOUR own country, who are having three meals per day as well.

What you and a few others suggest is to KILL all of those pirates or did I miss something?

I'm glad you and your fellow members aren't the ones to decide over life and death.

I have suggested on more than one occasion to install a prison in their own desert somewhere in Africa, guarded my multi-nation forces/guards where they can do hard labor for decades to come where family members can visit them once a year so they can spread the word about the miserable conditions they have to work and survive in, in order to be able to tell their youth backhome it doesn't pay off to be a pirate.

Killing them is no solution and inhuman. This world is no more "an-eye-for-an-eye..." era, like it was in barbaric ages.

Bringing them to one of our own western prisons is alo no option since it will cost our society and taxpayers hundreds of millions $'s.

LaoPo

[katana]

Russian way of dealing with supected Somali pirates:

[LaoPo]

Russian way of dealing with supected Somali pirates:

..and what's so special about the Russian way of dealing with Somali pirates?

I tell you: NOTHING.

It is exactly the same system ALL other navies use: capture a pirate vessel, mother ship or small speedboat, capture the pirates, seize the weapons and destroy* the vessel.

* If the seized vessel is a pirated fishing trawler or other small dhow or even a larger vessel, it will be returned to the legal owners, mostly from Oman, Yemen, India etc.

Simple, so there's absolutely nothing special with the "Russian" way.

One of the last examples was with the EU NAVFOR Finnish warship FNS POHJANMAA which destroyed a dhow-typed pirate vessel, 5 days ago on April 9th:

http://www.eunavfor....e-action-group/

edit:

* another example, this time a Spanish warship: http://www.eunavfor.eu/2011/04/eu-navfor-warship-disrupts-suspected-pirate-whaler/

* and another, also Spanish warship: http://www.eunavfor.eu/2011/03/eunavfor-spanish-warship-disrupts-suspected-pirates-north-west-of-seychelles/

LaoPo

Edited April 14, 2011 by LaoPo

[dean999]

Russian way of dealing with supected Somali pirates:

..and what's so special about the Russian way of dealing with Somali pirates?

I tell you: NOTHING.

It is exactly the same system ALL other navies use: capture a pirate vessel, mother ship or small speedboat, capture the pirates, seize the weapons and destroy* the vessel.

* If the seized vessel is a pirated fishing trawler or other small dhow or even a larger vessel, it will be returned to the legal owners, mostly from Oman, Yemen, India etc.

Simple, so there's absolutely nothing special with the "Russian" way.

One of the last examples was with the EU NAVFOR Finnish warship FNS POHJANMAA which destroyed a dhow-typed pirate vessel, 5 days ago on April 9th:

http://www.eunavfor....e-action-group/

edit:

* another example, this time a Spanish warship: http://www.eunavfor....-pirate-whaler/

* and another, also Spanish warship: http://www.eunavfor....-of-seychelles/

LaoPo

I totally agree with your post. That video is exactly what the British navy do as well. The navies are there as a deterrent and to protect / help the merchant ships.

If you ask yourself this, how long is it going to take before that group of pirates are back in action? One day, two days. So how many ships and personnel has that saved.

I think Katana is just impressed because one of the pirates was hurt. The video does not show how he was hurt and by whom. Could of fallen over and shot himself. Things that you see are not always what they seem.

[katana]

Here the Russians shot one pirate in the leg and were leaving him to bleed unattended at the end of a barrel while barking orders at the other pirates. Perhaps Laopao can find some videos on youtube where other navies do that. Guess he'll think twice about being a pirate again.

I can only guess dean, who said he was in the British navy, was stung by the earlier posts criticising the Brit navy for being too soft and giving the pirates ciggies, rum and tea etc before sending them on their way lol

[Macmundi]

They are only releasing this news to encourage the other ship owners to pay up. Thai people are good at making deals. In this case deal with the devil so that they can save their own asses with no regards to how the others can get out of their captivity.

[LaoPo]

Here the Russians shot one pirate in the leg and were leaving him to bleed unattended at the end of a barrel while barking orders at the other pirates. Perhaps Laopao can find some videos on youtube where other navies do that. Guess he'll think twice about being a pirate again.

That's an assumption and is no proof; I didn't see anybody shoot anyone in that video. Unattended? the video is 7,5 minutes long; what do you know what happened after?

Barking orders? what do you expect those Russian navy chaps would say to the pirates? Ask them politely what they wish to eat for dinner ?

Get real.

LaoPo

[Seismic]

I think that all nations should take a lead from the way that the Russian Navy deals with these Pirates when they come across them - very, very, brutally. According to some media sources, when patrolling Russians identify offshore (in international waters) Pirates, they simply raid it for verification, and then just eliminate the boat and it's crew - I am led to understand, that old international sea laws, when bent a little , still permit this line of action. In contrast, the British Royal Navy, upon finding Pirates, sink their boat and guns, but return the crew, unharmed, to Somalian waters. During which time, the 'prisoners' are fed, watered, and given ciggaretes to keep them quiet. The philosophy being, don't antagonise these Pirates because they may start taking (Islamically justified) retribution on future hostages, and to date, hostages have been treated reasonably well in general. Personally, as a Brit, I preffer the Russian method. And I imagine most Brit's do too.

Any links...proof..articles of what you claim?

LaoPo

No, but I can give you a first hand account if that would help. We were transiting from Tuticorin in India to malta, along the way we had 6 russian special forces rappel down onto our vessel as "security".

We asked them what would happen of pirates approached our vessel and they smiled and said we will finish them. Good enough for me. I have been at sea 30 years and have already been through one pirate attack on the way from balikpapan to Singapore, so laopo you can stuff your bleeding heart politically correct sentimentalism where the sun doesnt shine.

When the russians told us that we all applauded. Stopping piracy is the same as stopping terrorism or any other major illegal act, take the gloves off and do the job. If 50 pirate boats go out and none of them return then it will stop pretty quick.

building a jail in africa wont help, they will still get better treatment than what they have in their lives now. Install a functioning working government in Somalia, back it up with a little force and a shoot to kill policy...now maybe you will see results

But taking them prisoner and treating them under the UNCHR or other agreements...please get real, you have absolutely no bloody idea and you really need to shut up.

Edited April 14, 2011 by Seismic

[LaoPo]

I think that all nations should take a lead from the way that the Russian Navy deals with these Pirates when they come across them - very, very, brutally. According to some media sources, when patrolling Russians identify offshore (in international waters) Pirates, they simply raid it for verification, and then just eliminate the boat and it's crew - I am led to understand, that old international sea laws, when bent a little , still permit this line of action. In contrast, the British Royal Navy, upon finding Pirates, sink their boat and guns, but return the crew, unharmed, to Somalian waters. During which time, the 'prisoners' are fed, watered, and given ciggaretes to keep them quiet. The philosophy being, don't antagonise these Pirates because they may start taking (Islamically justified) retribution on future hostages, and to date, hostages have been treated reasonably well in general. Personally, as a Brit, I preffer the Russian method. And I imagine most Brit's do too.

Any links...proof..articles of what you claim?

LaoPo

No, but I can give you a first hand account if that would help. We were transiting from Tuticorin in India to malta, along the way we had 6 russian special forces rappel down onto our vessel as "security".

We asked them what would happen of pirates approached our vessel and they smiled and said we will finish them. Good enough for me. I have been at sea 30 years and have already been through one pirate attack on the way from balikpapan to Singapore, so laopo you can stuff your bleeding heart politically correct sentimentalism where the sun doesnt shine.

When the russians told us that we all applauded. Stopping piracy is the same as stopping terrorism or any other major illegal act, take the gloves off and do the job. If 50 pirate boats go out and none of them return then it will stop pretty quick.

building a jail in africa wont help, they will still get better treatment than what they have in their lives now. Install a functioning working government in Somalia, back it up with a little force and a shoot to kill policy...now maybe you will see results

But taking them prisoner and treating them under the UNCHR or other agreements...please get real, you have absolutely no bloody idea and you really need to shut up.

Oh, right...I am very impressed mr. touch guy Seismic...not.......

and WHY didn't we ever hear about brutal killings by those tough Russian guys you had on board, and many other ships before and after you?

There are NO reports whatsoever about Russian tough guys shooting and killing pirates and blowing them off the face of the sea/earth so to speak....

You belong to the group of people who want to kill everybody who gets in the way, the way of whomever....criminals, murderers, pirates, burglars....

That's not the way to build a civilized world; those pirates are NOT civilized since they don't even know what that means but I agree that the problem would be solved rather quickly if "we" would kill all pirates.

But why not kill all the criminals "we" have in our world prisons ? Most of these pirates are not murderers, only a few. They steal and cause enormous (economical) problems; all of us agree on that, but.....

Why doesn't the western world immediately eliminate and kill their own murderers, burglars and other criminals who steal and rob instantly the moment we capture them?

Oh, and, I always try to discuss in a polite way; that's also something you have to learn about.

Be polite and don't tell me to shut up; I have the same rights as you have:

Write an opinion but it shows who and what you are, telling me to shut up. I'm not impressed by your class act.

LaoPo

[sweden4ever]

I like the russian style

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDmdtcyDVlg&feature=related

[Bagwan]

It's simple:

An Inch is 2,54cm, so 4" is 10,16cms;

1 in = 1″ := 0,0254 m = 2,54 cm

LaoPo

I am indebted to you, as others are I am sure, for your demonstration of arithmetic skill. I would never have been able to work that out for myself, at least not before I had reached the age of 8 years.

Since the original metric references were 105 mm and 12.7 mm perhaps you could oblige those less gifted by converting into cms. :jap:

All those years ago when at school I learnt about feet and inches, chains and furlongs, and rod, pole and perch, I would never have bothered if I had know that a bunch of foreign johnnies were going to impose an entirely different system on my little world. It would be all too easy to put the metric system down to catering to those who cannot count above the number ten.

Similar with decimal currency. Locked in my little cocoon of yesteryear I still convert prices into pound , shillings and pence. Why should I change? Does God ever bother to speak in any language other than English?

[luckizuchinni]

I know this wouldn't rescue the hostages, but I have never understood how we can sit by and let a hijacked ship sit in some port. I mean, these ships are not small, and the Somali coast is not that big. If the US can track Russian subs, if Russian can keep tabs on US ships, well, why can't we use the assets to locate these ships in port, and go in and take them back.

Also, I would think a 6-man team of any trained military and armed to the teeth would be able to turn back any attack by any pirate. Many years ago, I had to sneak aboard a Navy vessel as part of an exercise, and that vessel was at port. If that vessel had been at sea, there is no quiet way I could have done that. Moving from a small fast mover to board one of these huge commercial ships is not easy, and with fighting men onboard to repel the pirates, well, I would lay my money on the merchant ship.

Edited April 15, 2011 by luckizuchinni

[creck]

It would seem the governments/navies of the world are not really trying!

For the money that could be saved, an all out campaign to remove this scourge, could make sea transport safe again.

Surely, air/satellite surveillance could identify the mother ships and ports. The pirate's infrastructure must be removed. Even in this century, criminal actions can be opposed! The surveillance record could provide intelligence for search and arrest and evidence in courts. As the previous poster has said, trained military men could easily take on and beat the pirates.

At the moment, the 'protection' centres on attempting to win each of the numerous little sea battles. With that strategy, the problem will not go away the pirates will always win enough to survive.

A prison in Africa sounds an excellent idea. Why should it be soft? They should be a big effort to divert these people to some other trade, by retraining and fear of going back to 'that place'.

Exactly the background to the motivation should be found and tackled. That may be the most difficult problem but the only effective, long term solution.

Edited April 15, 2011 by creck

[dean999]

I like the russian style

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

Very good video. Even though it was made to look like they were killing pirates. Does not matter what navy you are in, if you were to kill pirates that way you would be in a political sh_t storm because it would be murder.

All they were doing was sinking that boat. We do the same.

[dean999]

I think that all nations should take a lead from the way that the Russian Navy deals with these Pirates when they come across them - very, very, brutally. According to some media sources, when patrolling Russians identify offshore (in international waters) Pirates, they simply raid it for verification, and then just eliminate the boat and it's crew - I am led to understand, that old international sea laws, when bent a little , still permit this line of action. In contrast, the British Royal Navy, upon finding Pirates, sink their boat and guns, but return the crew, unharmed, to Somalian waters. During which time, the 'prisoners' are fed, watered, and given ciggaretes to keep them quiet. The philosophy being, don't antagonise these Pirates because they may start taking (Islamically justified) retribution on future hostages, and to date, hostages have been treated reasonably well in general. Personally, as a Brit, I preffer the Russian method. And I imagine most Brit's do too.

Any links...proof..articles of what you claim?

LaoPo

No, but I can give you a first hand account if that would help. We were transiting from Tuticorin in India to malta, along the way we had 6 russian special forces rappel down onto our vessel as "security".

We asked them what would happen of pirates approached our vessel and they smiled and said we will finish them. Good enough for me. I have been at sea 30 years and have already been through one pirate attack on the way from balikpapan to Singapore, so laopo you can stuff your bleeding heart politically correct sentimentalism where the sun doesnt shine.

When the russians told us that we all applauded. Stopping piracy is the same as stopping terrorism or any other major illegal act, take the gloves off and do the job. If 50 pirate boats go out and none of them return then it will stop pretty quick.

building a jail in africa wont help, they will still get better treatment than what they have in their lives now. Install a functioning working government in Somalia, back it up with a little force and a shoot to kill policy...now maybe you will see results

But taking them prisoner and treating them under the UNCHR or other agreements...please get real, you have absolutely no bloody idea and you really need to shut up.

Like I said in a previous post. If they killed the pirates as they were attempting to board the ship, this would be justified because they would be protecting human life. This is the correct protocol which I was on about.

If a merchant sailor hit a pirate over the head as he was climbing onboard and killed him, he would be in the right to because this is self defence. So as you say about the Russians saying, they will finish them; Well you could too.