AIDS believed on rise again in Thailand

[george]

AIDS Believed on Rise Again in Thailand

BANGKOK: -- Thailand was once considered a model in the fight against AIDS, but the man behind that success says the country of 63 million has returned to the days of ignorance and that the disease is making a deadly comeback.

Mechai Viravaidya is widely known as Mr. Condom for the aggressive condom distribution and public education campaign he began in the 1990s. He believes there were 25,000 new infections last year, well over the official figure of 19,000.

While that is much less than the 143,000 infections the government counted in 1991, Mechai says the number is growing fast because of unprotected sex, especially among young people.

"It's clear that AIDS has returned to rise again ... . We've gone back to days of ignorance," said Mechai, who is conducting a second AIDS awareness campaign. "There's no reason why next year it won't be 100,000 new cases."

When Thailand recorded its first AIDS case in 1984, the country was believed to be on the verge of a huge AIDS epidemic due to its enormous sex industry. It was estimated that without action, an estimated four million people would be infected by 2002.

The government went into denial, and things changed only in the 1990s when Mechai, a senator and the chairman of a private population association, persuaded the prime minister to head the National AIDS Committee. The budget to fight the epidemic increased 50-fold, and radio and television stations were required to broadcast AIDS education.

The current government of Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra has spent considerable sums on caring for and providing free anti-retroviral drugs to HIV-positive people. But Thaksin has not attended meetings of the National AIDS Committee or mentioned AIDS in his statements to Parliament since he took office in February 2001.

"The government budget, the lack of the declaration, the prime minister's abdication from the role, and the consequent weak public education program has resulted in what we have today: a tremendous increase," Mechai said.

Thai government spokesman Suraphong Suebwonglee denied the government was neglecting AIDS but said officials have had to contend with other public health threats.

"In the past two to three years, there has also been bird flu and dengue fever prevention, as well as disease prevention because of food safety and cigarettes," Suraphong told The Associated Press.

He said Thaksin shares Mechai's concern that AIDS will spread among youth. On Saturday Thaksin announced a policy to prevent youth delinquency, including "inappropriate" sexual behavior.

In 2004, sexually transmitted diseases among youth shot up at least 30 percent, and Mechai believes AIDS is on a similar track.

The government estimates 1 million Thais have been infected with HIV and 500,000 have died; Mechai believes there have been 2 million infections and 800,000 HIV/AIDS deaths.

"We think it's underestimated. We don't want to be nasty and call it a lie, but I think it's pretty close to it," Mechai said.

The U.N. Development Program warned in July 2004 that there were clear signs of an AIDS resurgence, with government spending on HIV/AIDS programs dropping from $82 million in 1997 to $25 million in 2003.

Mechai has given up on the government and has started buying condoms to distribute wherever he goes, insisting Thailand need only repeat its earlier successful strategy of public education and condoms. Only 20 percent to 30 percent of young people use condoms consistently, he said.

"With the demise and disappearance of public education, people think it's gone. I've had some kids say to me, 'Is AIDS still around?'" Mechai said.

--AP 2005-10-04

[ilyushin]

Suggest a HIV check ( free or upto Baht 300) and also carry a supply of rubber helmets for safer sex. Have sex, but make it safe.

[otherstuff1957]

I'm helping plan a Summer Camp for some Mathayom 4 - 6 students. I suggested that we discretely put condoms in the drawers of the cabins before the camp starts. My Thai employers reacted with horror - they said the school administration would never OK such a thing.

With that kind of Bible-Belt attitude, it's no wonder that AIDS is on the rise. I wonder how many kids will have to die because of those misguided puritans.

[mpdkorat]

I'm helping plan a Summer Camp for some Mathayom 4 - 6 students.  I suggested that we discretely put condoms in the drawers of the cabins before the camp starts.  My Thai employers reacted with horror - they said the school administration would never OK such a thing. 

With that kind of Bible-Belt attitude, it's no wonder that AIDS is on the rise.  I wonder how many kids will have to die because of those misguided puritans. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There is just so much that could be done that is not being done to slow down this dreadful virus. Puritan attitudes amongst Thailands leaders is certainly one of them.

What do you think George maybe Thai Visa could play a small role, parhaps promote the Jai Dee appeal for the Camillian Centre in Rayong. I have visited there several times and it is a very worthy place to give some TV assistance to.

[Mighty Mouse]

Such alarmist reporting goes hand in glove with condom manufacturers who want to boost their sales.

The same applies to the Thai Govt. who want a larger than last year monetary hand out from the World Health Organisation so as to combat the "out of control" epidemic.

If truth be known, AIDS is probably no worse than it was ten years ago and more than likely has improved considerably.

[mpdkorat]

Such alarmist reporting goes hand in glove with condom manufacturers who want to boost their sales.

The same applies to the Thai Govt. who want a larger than last year monetary hand out from the World Health Organisation so as to combat the "out of control" epidemic.

If truth be known, AIDS is probably no worse than it was ten years ago and more than likely has improved considerably.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you are wrong there. Those of us who live in the provinces get to see this first hand. I was talking to another TV member a couple of days ago and he told me that 5 people in thier 20's died of the virus in his village this year. My wifes village had two die this year. It is a very real problem. Education and ARV drugs properly prescribed are really needed.

[marquess]

The trouble is that with a disease like this, you have to constantly be on your guard. Both as and individual and society as a whole, it hasn't gone away nor will it. Education, Edudation and more education is what is needed, without it people will die of ignorance!

[Mighty Mouse]

I think you are wrong there. Those of us who live in the provinces get to see this first hand. I was talking to another TV member a couple of days ago and he told me that 5 people in thier 20's died of the virus in his village this year. My wifes village had two die this year. It is a very real problem.  Education and ARV drugs properly prescribed are really needed.

According to statistics that are available in various parts of our planet on the AIDS death rate, I am wrong. These statistics show quite clearly that the AIDS death rate is increasing.

AIDS however, provides a money making opportunity for many charities. If the statistics are bad, very bad, the more money they can expect to roll in.

What percentage of these billions of dollars goes towards finding a cure?

I think we would all be very shocked if we knew the exact percentage. I suggest it would be quite low.

It's very sad when young people die of this disease, and I sympathise with those in your village who are affected by the local deaths.

If AIDS isn't bad enough, take a look at these statistics:

Health

* Every year six million children die from malnutrition before their fifth birthday.

* More than 50 percent of Africans suffer from water-related diseases such as cholera and infant diarrhea.

* Everyday HIV/AIDS kills 6,000 people and another 8,200 people are infected with this deadly virus.

* Every 30 seconds an African child dies of malaria-more than one million child deaths a year.

* Each year, approximately 300 to 500 million people are infected with malaria. Approximately three million people die as a result.

* TB is the leading AIDS-related killer and in some parts of Africa, 75 percent of people with HIV also have TB.

Hunger

* More than 800 million people go to bed hungry every day...300 million are children.

* Of these 300 million children, only eight percent are victims of famine or other emergency situations. More than 90 percent are suffering long-term malnourishment and micronutrient deficiency.

* Every 3.6 seconds another person dies of starvation and the large majority are children under the age of 5.

If this is nature's method of culling the worlds population, it just goes to show that we don't need to kill each other in wars, nature is doing a much better job.

[Diablo Bob]

I have a news paper clipping from the Los Angeles Times (Not necessarily a good source) circa 1997, which stated that Thailand had a 92% Condom use overall (Excludes married couples) and was the ONLY country in the world where the rate of infection to HIV was in the negative values.

I haven't been a client to Soi Nana or Cowboy in years (Happily married) but I would bet a beer that these girls are still using the condoms, it is the kids not involved with the sex industry who are responsible for this rise in the rate. In 1990, 7 of 10 boys intering the Thai Military tested positive for HIV......

Screw the statistics....... go back to education and free condoms, its cheaper in the long run. With Taksins health care policy the cost of education and condoms would be money well spent.

[mpdkorat]

I think you are wrong there. Those of us who live in the provinces get to see this first hand. I was talking to another TV member a couple of days ago and he told me that 5 people in thier 20's died of the virus in his village this year. My wifes village had two die this year. It is a very real problem.  Education and ARV drugs properly prescribed are really needed.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

According to statistics that are available in various parts of our planet on the AIDS death rate, I am wrong. These statistics show quite clearly that the AIDS death rate is increasing.

AIDS however, provides a money making opportunity for many charities. If the statistics are bad, very bad, the more money they can expect to roll in.

What percentage of these billions of dollars goes towards finding a cure?

I think we would all be very shocked if we knew the exact percentage. I suggest it would be quite low.

It's very sad when young people die of this disease, and I sympathise with those in your village who are affected by the local deaths.

If AIDS isn't bad enough, take a look at these statistics:

Health

* Every year six million children die from malnutrition before their fifth birthday.

* More than 50 percent of Africans suffer from water-related diseases such as cholera and infant diarrhea.

* Everyday HIV/AIDS kills 6,000 people and another 8,200 people are infected with this deadly virus.

* Every 30 seconds an African child dies of malaria-more than one million child deaths a year.

* Each year, approximately 300 to 500 million people are infected with malaria. Approximately three million people die as a result.

* TB is the leading AIDS-related killer and in some parts of Africa, 75 percent of people with HIV also have TB.

Hunger

* More than 800 million people go to bed hungry every day...300 million are children.

* Of these 300 million children, only eight percent are victims of famine or other emergency situations. More than 90 percent are suffering long-term malnourishment and micronutrient deficiency.

* Every 3.6 seconds another person dies of starvation and the large majority are children under the age of 5.

If this is nature's method of culling the worlds population, it just goes to show that we don't need to kill each other in wars, nature is doing a much better job.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes there are many problems in this world and yes the HIV virus at the moment is not the biggest world killer. With regard to statistics I'm always sceptical of them no matter which way they point.

Thai Visa is a Thai based Forum with many of it's members living or regularly visiting the Kingdom. HIV/Aids is a very real and current problem in Thailand and just throwing money at it in itself will not solve the problem. Education and opening your eyes is also required. This is where organizations such as the Camillian Centre come into it and by God they do need money, and a never ending supply of it.

Father Giovanni managed to get the centre kids into local schools after the centre had stabilize them, that I can assure was no mean feet. Even having the bodies cremated was a major headache. The problems are never ending. Father G and the centre staff do need help and the best way we can help is to give a little money. 20.000 members * $1 = a nice amount of money that will go straight to the route of the problem. I for one will give a dollar or two

[richardb]

I recently had some first hand experience. Please read this if you have not already done so.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=44144

As for father G and the Camillian Centre a charity Drunkatholon is orgainsed for the end of november again please read the above thread if you have already done so.

Richard

[britmaveric]

Diablo Bob - not so sure about the condom bit. A mate of mine was telling me he took a gal for a few days and she really seemed to like him. She told him she would allow no condom if they both get HIV test. This alone is a dangerous attitude to have unless you are going to both keep an eye one another and last I checked the window was a few months.

Somehow I get the feeling if you throw enough dosh at BG(s) - they will for go the condom. However that being said anyone who resorts to this sort of behaviour is absolutely mental.

[Ijustwannateach]

It's like that business last year (or was that the previous year) with the Boy Scout Jubilee. NGO observers suggested that condoms be available; the Thai reaction was "what need is there for condoms? They're all boys!" And of course, there are no gay boy scouts (it's against the rules) although at my first scout camp in Thailand the featured campfire entertainment was a ladyboy Moulin-Rouge lip sync.

Kids are expected to toe the party line about "I'm saving myself for marriage." Given the importance of face over reality here, it may require truly unbelievable levels of infection before social mores begin to change. It's kinda hard to deal with a sexual epidemic when you can't even admit that people have sex.

I do have to say that despite all this gloom and doom talk, I have met very, very few folks here either straight or gay, Thai or expat who seem to the best of my observation or suspicion to be HIV+, even after having known many of them for a long time. I *did* date someone about 4 years ago who I found out later died in a rather suspicious manner (30 year old soldier, in the hospital with unspecified lung problems). Poor man.

"Steven"

[Noel]

I do have to say that despite all this gloom and doom talk, I have met very, very few folks here either straight or gay, Thai or expat who seem to the best of my observation or suspicion to be HIV+, even after having known many of them for a long time.  I *did* date someone about 4 years ago who I found out later died in a rather suspicious manner (30 year old soldier, in the hospital with unspecified lung problems).  Poor man.

"Steven"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Whilst it is clear from your words that you are empathetic to HIV/AIDS sufferers, your comments about your 'observation or suspicion' concerning those who may or may not be HIV positive are actually part of the problem.

There is no way as far as I am aware that you can identify someone who is HIV positive purely from their physical appearance.

If that were possible, I am quite sure that the rate of infection would be dramatically less.

Once your observation leads you to suspect someone is HIV positive, I would suggest the chances are that the person concerned may be in the more advanced stages of the syndrome and has been categorized as suffering from 'full blown AIDS' as it is known.

People can carry HIV for years and appear perfectly healthy. It is only when the immune system starts to break down and AIDS defining opportunistic infections arise that people will look visibly unwell.

Perhaps the most obvious visual indicator is weight loss, but this wasting process tends to occur in the very advanced stages of full blown AIDS.

Weighing up people's possible HIV status by merely looking at them, in my humble opinion, is just not realistic.

And just to pre-empt comments about testing, as HIV is a virus there can by definition be no incubation period as many will claim.

Incubation periods concern bacterial infections.

HIV infection occurs at the moment the virus enters the bloodstream. The three month ‘window period’ refers to the time it takes the body to create enough antibodies to enable detection.

It is therefore conceivable that a blood test today will show HIV negative status, whereas the person was actually infected many weeks prior.

I am aware that there is ongoing research being made to enable earlier detection, but I believe the general school of thought still supports the three month window theory.

Perhaps a tad extreme some may say, but it would be wiser to assume that everyone is HIV positive until proven otherwise.

[Mighty Mouse]

"There is no way as far as I am aware that you can identify someone who is HIV positive purely from their physical appearance.

If that were possible, I am quite sure that the rate of infection would be dramatically less."

You can't tell from their physical appearance but you can carry out the bread test.

Take one slice of white bread.

Insert it into the appropriate opening.

Wait 30 seconds and pull it out.

If it's toasted, she's HOT.

[Noel]

You can't tell from their physical appearance but you can carry out the bread test.

Take one slice of white bread.

Insert it into the appropriate opening.

Wait 30 seconds and pull it out.

If it's toasted, she's HOT.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What a retard...

[aidon]

You can't tell from their physical appearance but you can carry out the bread test.

Take one slice of white bread.

Insert it into the appropriate opening.

Wait 30 seconds and pull it out.

If it's toasted, she's HOT.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What a retard...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Agreed, but I would also like to add on the other part of the quote:

"The current government of Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra has spent considerable sums on caring for and providing free anti-retroviral drugs to HIV-positive people. But Thaksin has not attended meetings of the National AIDS Committee or mentioned AIDS in his statements to Parliament since he took office in February 2001."

My wife is a nurse at a Health Center in the northern province of Udonthani and they have no anti-retroviral drugs. Most HIV-positive people in the provinces die earlier because of this and have no quality of life.

It is indeed a sad situation and although it can be managed and prevented it takes a constant media program to make sure that all people are aware of the dangers of both this disease and Hepatitis C.

Hope that the Health Department steps in and takes responsibility rather than private individuals like Meechai.

[Ijustwannateach]

Noel, you're correct, but what I was trying to say is that among people I know well (well enough that I would know if they had more than routine health problems, or would expect them to tell me about their HIV status) no one seems to be HIV positive to the best of my knowledge. I use the word "seems" because of the very thing you mention- it's hard to tell without being told directly or observing unusual health problems (like weight loss or unexplained pneumonia).

[Noel]

Noel, you're correct, but what I was trying to say is that among people I know well (well enough that I would know if they had more than routine health problems, or would expect them to tell me about their HIV status) no one seems to be HIV positive to the best of my knowledge.  I use the word "seems" because of the very thing you mention- it's hard to tell without being told directly or observing unusual health problems (like weight loss or unexplained pneumonia).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I do believe we essentially agree, but part of the point I was making is that people can be HIV positive without any ostensible signs of health problems whatsoever, even to themselves let alone others.

Arguably, it these people who are most likely to spread the virus as they will often be unaware they carry it, as indeed would be those most at risk of getting it from them.

When the more classic opportunistic infections such as pneumonia, TB and so forth start, the immune system has already been under prolonged attack and is likely to be in more rapid decline. The likelihood of them being infected is therefore more readily identifiable (inconclusively of course) by their physical appearance or by the fact they have been ill.

All that said, just because someone contracts TB or pneumonia, it does not automatically follow that they are HIV positive as I am sure you will agree.

However, nor does the fact that they look a picture of health mean that they are not HIV positive.

One positive (no pun intended) observation I can make on the subject is that at least the antiretrovral drugs now available are much improved and more accessible than in the past.

Of course, what is deperately needed is a cure, but if or when that will be available is sadly anyone's guess.

[mpdkorat]

"There is no way as far as I am aware that you can identify someone who is HIV positive purely from their physical appearance.

If that were possible, I am quite sure that the rate of infection would be dramatically less."

You can't tell from their physical appearance but you can carry out the bread test.

Take one slice of white bread.

Insert it into the appropriate opening.

Wait 30 seconds and pull it out.

If it's toasted, she's HOT.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Helpful comment!

I presume you will be making some form of contribution to the Camillian Centre?

[OZONE]

I believe it should start with the parents not being so shy to talk to their kids about sex. In Thailand this is a taboo issue. If the parents took the initiative to teach their kids about safe sex, better yet, abstinence from sex than eventually aids could be controlled. Thai parents just need to get with the program and stop being so "old fashion thai" about this issue.

[mpdkorat]

I believe it should start with the parents not being so shy to talk to their kids about sex.  In Thailand this is a taboo issue.  If the parents took the initiative to teach their kids about safe sex, better yet, abstinence from sex than eventually aids could be controlled. Thai parents just need to get with the program and stop being so "old fashion thai" about this issue.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Quite right. Again back to education.

[mumbojumbo]

I recently lived in a village (small town actually) for 5 years and it seemed that there was a funeral once a week for an aids person. They were ususally 18-25 and male. This was from IV and homosexuallity i assumed. Very rarely was it a female. Do any of you stat people have any male/female figures.

[Johpa]

I recently lived in a village (small town actually) for 5 years and it seemed that there was a funeral once a week for an aids person.  They were ususally 18-25 and male.  This was from IV and homosexuallity i assumed.  Very rarely was it a female.  Do any of you stat people have any male/female figures.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In my wife's home tambon north of Chiang Mai the perceived number of AIDS related deaths has droppped over the past several years. There is no longer a funeral every week which is AIDS related although there is still perhaps one every month or two. There have been plenty of women in our area who died of AIDS, usually contracted from their husband who also died of AIDS. My wife's best friend is now dieing of AIDS contracted from her now dead from AIDS husband, her sole sexual partner in life, a Thai policeman when he was alive who just had to have a low end mia noi where he was stationed so as not to lose face with his compatriots in the police force. I have also attended funerals of young children who died after contracting AIDS at birth. On the other hand I have a good friend, another woman who contracted AIDS from her now dead husband, who has survived for 15 years.

I know small groups of men who died of AIDS after having sex with the same low end prostitute. Who knows if it is a matter of personal hygiene (Thai men tend to get drunk and suddenly force themselves on their wives or cheap hookers and thus get open blisters) or they shared a needle? I know of one small village that lost 7 young men of the same age from a similar "shared" event.

Bottom line is that although men are in the majority, there are also plenty of women and kids dieing to make those occurences common rather than rare events.

[britmaveric]

Education in the schools is the key - however that being said most young ones leave so early hard to get the needed info to them.

Anything like my parents - never heard a peep from them, and be honest I'd be embarrassed as they would. I learned everything I needed to know from school, media, mates ect.

[Noel]

I believe it should start with the parents not being so shy to talk to their kids about sex.  In Thailand this is a taboo issue.  If the parents took the initiative to teach their kids about safe sex, better yet, abstinence from sex than eventually aids could be controlled. Thai parents just need to get with the program and stop being so "old fashion thai" about this issue.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree.

Moreover, they would do well to also warn them about 'over friendly' cousins and uncles...

[camerata]

Mechai Viravaidya is widely known as Mr. Condom for the aggressive condom distribution and public education campaign he began in the 1990s. He believes there were 25,000 new infections last year, well over the official figure of 19,000.

 

While that is much less than the 143,000 infections the government counted in 1991, Mechai says the number is growing fast because of unprotected sex, especially among young people.

"He believes"...? It was this kind of fuzzy statistics in the media that caused me to do some serious research into HIV/AIDS in Thailand in the mid-90s. I suspected a cover-up because of wildly inconsistent figures for AIDS and HIV, but I quickly discovered that newspaper reporters didn't have a clue what they were writing about and didn't understand how the data was collected.

The government doesn't know how many new HIV infections there are because under a UN agreement doctors aren't required to report them. The statistics are gathered from tests given to military conscripts every 6 months and a national figure is then extrapolated. But conscripts tend to be from the lower socio-economic strata of society, with low education and a tendency to have sex with brothel prostitutes.

The media used to publish these conscript stats every 6 months and then suddenly it stopped. I discovered this was a "benign cover-up" that everyone was in on (government, NGOs, WHO) except the public. What had happened was the safe-sex campaign was working and the new infections were starting to decrease. No one wanted people to become complacent and go back to unprotected sex again, and the WHO didn't want other countries to see the improvement in Thailand and slack off on their own anti-HIV measures.

Eventually, of course the news did come out and HIV/AIDS statistics stopped being news. So it wouldn't surprise me at all if everyone is getting complacent and the danger is increasing again. Mechai is definitely the guy who would know the real situation.

[Abandon]

good post Cam

[Noel]

For the benefit of those members who do not visit the Pattaya Forum or have not read the DYING GIRLFRIEND? thread:

Thanks go to Ken and mpdkorat for being the first Thaivisa.com members to support the

2005 JAIDEE APPEAL JW DRUNKATHOLON: IN MEMORY OF AOM initiative.

We hope they will be the first of many.

For those who may be unaware, The JAIDEE APPEAL is an ongoing initiative to raise money for the Camillian Centre in Rayong that cares predominantly for children orphaned by and/or born with HIV.

For further information on the current fundraiser, please click on: 2005 JAIDEE APPEAL JW DRUNKATHOLON: IN MEMORY OF AOM

Should you wish to make a donation to the appeal directly to the Camillian Centre, please go to: CAMILLIAN CENTRE BAHTBUS.COM JAIDEE APPEAL and then click on: Make a Donation to the Camillian Center

There are several alternative ways in which donations can be made including bank deposits and ATM transfers in Thailand and via Post Office money orders and credit cards anywhere in the world.

No donation is too small and anonymity is assured, unless members themselves make the fact they have donated or a pledging to do so known.

PLEDGES TO 10th October 2005:

SUMMARY:

108,000

53,000

12,000

173,000

DETAIL:

10 July 2005 AXE WOUND 10,000

13 July 2005 JOHNNIE WALKER 10,000

14 July 2005 FOSSIL 10,000

21 July 2005 SWEENEY TODD 10,000

1 Aug 2005 AIRPORTWO 10,000

18 Sept 2005 WAIRU VALLEY TAVERN 23,000

18 Sept 2005 NOEL THOMAS 10,000

23 Sept 2005 RICHARDB 10,000

23 Sept 2005 AUNTY 10,000

24 Sept 2005 CHOPPER 5,000

30 Sept THAILAND-UK.COM 53,000

6 Oct 2005 KEN (THAIVISA.COM) 8,000

7 Oct 2005 MPDKORAT (THAIVISA.COM) 4,000

TOTAL TO DATE [‘plus change’ courtesy of Mrs. Wound ] 173,000

[Noel]

Anyone interested in further localised focus on the topic in other Forums, please click: HERE! and THERE!