Move To Seek Royal Pardon For Ex-PM Thaksin Faces Protest

[webfact]

Move to seek royal pardon for ex-PM Thaksin faces protest

BANGKOK, Sept 14 - A group of anti-Red Shirt activists on Wednesday said it would rally in the capital on Friday to protest the move seeking a royal pardon for fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra this Friday.

Tul Sitthisomwong, a medical doctor and lecturer at Chulalongkorn University's Medical Sciences Faculty and a leader of the Network of Citizen Volunteers Protecting the Land, announced the group's stance following reports on the government's move to speed up the process of gaining a royal pardon for the deposed premier.

He said the network will rally Friday from 4.30 to 6.30pm at Victory Monument, a transport hub in central Bangkok, inviting the public to sign a petition which will be presented to Minister of Justice Pol Gen Pracha Promnok to suspend what the network called the "unlawful royal pardon petition."

Dr Tul said the network hopes to collect more than 3.6 million signatures affixed to the petition, outnumbering those signing the Red Shirt petition.

The network leader also noted that the Pheu Thai government has pushed Gen Pracha to raise the Red Shirt petition for Cabinet consideration to submit the case to His Majesty the King without concerning for what is right or wrong.

Following rumours that Ms Yingluck’s government is arranging for Mr Thaksin to receive a royal pardon, Dr Tul said the network will closely monitor the government's moves, and threatened to mobilise the group's supporters if Mr Thaksin is treated differently from other convicted felons.

The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) submitted the petition with about 3.5 millions seeking the royal pardon for Mr Thaksin in August, 2009. The Department of Corrections director-general at that time, Mr Chartchai Sutthiklom, recently said the verification of the names has completed with two millions eligible.

Mr Thaksin, ousted in a coup in 2006, was sentenced in absentia in 2008 to two years imprisonment for abuse of power by helping his then wife acquire a parcel of prime Bangkok labnd at a price far below the market value. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2011-09-14

[ratcatcher]

Let's wait and see if Khun Tul's group is not all smoke and no fire.

[bhakta]

I predict if by some crooked means, Yingluck's government pardons Thaksin, Thailand will be in for hellish times again. As per my direct knowledge, Thaksin is a criminal and because he jumped bail, he is a double criminal. His criminal conviction was upheld by the nine judge bench of the Supreme Court. What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

[Thai at Heart]

BANGKOK, Sept 14 - A group of anti-Red Shirt activists on Wednesday said it would rally in the capital on Friday to protest the move seeking a royal pardon for fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra this Friday.

Have they picked a colour yet?? First rule of marketing, it isn't enough to be "anti". I go with harlequin, quarters.

[rixalex]

What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

The popular vote. He and many of his supporters believe that because he effectively won the election, that means that he should be above the law. He and they think that the ballot box doubles up not only as a way of electing a party, but as way of determining innocence or guilt. Ridiculous you might think, but the judges that ruled in the assets concealment case of 2001 seemed to agree, when they admitted that they couldn't find him guilty because he was too popular.

And in 2006, with all the dodgy dealings surrounding the sale of his business surfacing and threatening to create difficulties for him, Thaksin looked to the ballot box to once again perform the neat trick of declaring a guilty man as innocent. It failed on that occasion thanks to those pesky Dems dropping out of the race, but perhaps now, in 2011, the ballot box can once again be used to defy justice. That is his hope.

[Jingthing]

BANGKOK, Sept 14 - A group of anti-Red Shirt activists on Wednesday said it would rally in the capital on Friday to protest the move seeking a royal pardon for fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra this Friday.

Have they picked a colour yet?? First rule of marketing, it isn't enough to be "anti". I go with harlequin, quarters.

I reckon BROWN, as in hitting the fan ...

[Thai at Heart]

BANGKOK, Sept 14 - A group of anti-Red Shirt activists on Wednesday said it would rally in the capital on Friday to protest the move seeking a royal pardon for fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra this Friday.

Have they picked a colour yet?? First rule of marketing, it isn't enough to be "anti". I go with harlequin, quarters.

I reckon BROWN, as in hitting the fan ...

Pick a colour any colour, but either way, this pardon is going to happen, and no amount of foot stomping is going to stop it. It ain't right, but it is absolutely inevitable. If they don't get it this way, they are going to get it some other way. Who really knows how many skeletons any of these protagonists have in their cupboard?

[DP25]

What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

He has a personal militia that can engage in large scale terrorist actions if he doesn't get his way

[tlansford]

I predict if by some crooked means, Yingluck's government pardons Thaksin, Thailand will be in for hellish times again. As per my direct knowledge, Thaksin is a criminal and because he jumped bail, he is a double criminal. His criminal conviction was upheld by the nine judge bench of the Supreme Court. What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

Going back hundreds of years in Thai Kings traditionally had a bell outside the palace. The Thai people were able to use this as a direct appeal to the king. If they felt they had been wronged, they came, rang the bell, and the king would hear their grievance. It was in this tradition that the UDD collected the signatures in order to appeal for a pardon for the former PM.

[Insight]

BANGKOK, Sept 14 - A group of anti-Red Shirt activists on Wednesday said it would rally in the capital on Friday to protest the move seeking a royal pardon for fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra this Friday.

Have they picked a colour yet?? First rule of marketing, it isn't enough to be "anti". I go with harlequin, quarters.

I reckon BROWN, as in hitting the fan ...

Pick a colour any colour, but either way, this pardon is going to happen, and no amount of foot stomping is going to stop it. It ain't right, but it is absolutely inevitable. If they don't get it this way, they are going to get it some other way. Who really knows how many skeletons any of these protagonists have in their cupboard?

I'm pretty sure if the skeletons were damaging enough we would of started seeing them by now. Not released in Thailand, of course, but through his "lawyer" friend over in Canada. All what we've seen so far is unsubstantiated gossip from all sides.

/edit to add - a few days before Thaksin's red shirts started their armed siege of the city last year,

there was a photo which featured on several newspapers containing Abhisit and somebody else pretty well known (along with his pet dog). The conversation between the two people is also the subject of much gossip, with (IIRC) Asia Times attributing it to this whole pardon affair and how unlikely it is ever going to happen.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Insight

[Who, me ?]

Interesting!

Here is the first protest since the clone has taken office.

I remember her saying that red shirts will deal with protests... so, let's see what will happen.

[nong38]

What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

He has a personal militia that can engage in large scale terrorist actions if he doesn't get his way

That is just the excuse the army need to uphold the law of the land. Just how long will it be before someone knocks him off and then the problem is solved. Maybe thats the real reason he is no hurry to come back, he would always have to be watching his back. Not that I am advocating this personally but surely I am not alone in thinking of this possibly happening

[Jingthing]

Going back hundreds of years in Thai Kings traditionally had a bell outside the palace. The Thai people were able to use this as a direct appeal to the king. If they felt they had been wronged, they came, rang the bell, and the king would hear their grievance. It was in this tradition that the UDD collected the signatures in order to appeal for a pardon for the former PM.

Had those seeking appeal fled the country as criminal fugitives?

[rixalex]

I predict if by some crooked means, Yingluck's government pardons Thaksin, Thailand will be in for hellish times again. As per my direct knowledge, Thaksin is a criminal and because he jumped bail, he is a double criminal. His criminal conviction was upheld by the nine judge bench of the Supreme Court. What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

Going back hundreds of years in Thai Kings traditionally had a bell outside the palace. The Thai people were able to use this as a direct appeal to the king. If they felt they had been wronged, they came, rang the bell, and the king would hear their grievance. It was in this tradition that the UDD collected the signatures in order to appeal for a pardon for the former PM.

One signature would have been quite sufficient, especially if the appeal was being made on reasonably grounds and with the backing of evidence. Compiling the long list of a couple of million signatures was intended to apply pressure and make up for the fact that there is no reasonable grounds, nor is there any evidence. Shucks, nevermind no evidence of innocence, there's not even a claim of it. Just the old politically motivated chestnut that politicians feel their right to use any time someone should dare find them guilty.

[tigermonkey]

What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

He has a personal militia that can engage in large scale terrorist actions if he doesn't get his way

I think that your response has more to do with hysteria than with facts. What is the basis of your claim ? Where is this para-military force stationed ? Maybe a few thugs or bodyguards, but not "militia" and not "large scale". Soon we will be hearing that he is nuclear capable.

[Orac]

I predict if by some crooked means, Yingluck's government pardons Thaksin, Thailand will be in for hellish times again. As per my direct knowledge, Thaksin is a criminal and because he jumped bail, he is a double criminal. His criminal conviction was upheld by the nine judge bench of the Supreme Court. What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

Going back hundreds of years in Thai Kings traditionally had a bell outside the palace. The Thai people were able to use this as a direct appeal to the king. If they felt they had been wronged, they came, rang the bell, and the king would hear their grievance. It was in this tradition that the UDD collected the signatures in order to appeal for a pardon for the former PM.

One signature would have been quite sufficient, especially if the appeal was being made on reasonably grounds and with the backing of evidence. Compiling the long list of a couple of million signatures was intended to apply pressure and make up for the fact that there is no reasonable grounds, nor is there any evidence. Shucks, nevermind no evidence of innocence, there's not even a claim of it. Just the old politically motivated chestnut that politicians feel their right to use any time someone should dare find them guilty.

I am not sure evidence of innocence is a requirement for a pardon though I am sure i will be quickly corrected if i am wrong. As far as as I am aware a royal pardon is not an overuling of a legal decision but something that sits outside it and provide an option to take into account such things as national interest and previous actions. In this particular case it could be argued that Thaksin previous services to the country should be enough to give consideration to what is, in this case, a fairly minor charge.

[rixalex]

Going back hundreds of years in Thai Kings traditionally had a bell outside the palace. The Thai people were able to use this as a direct appeal to the king. If they felt they had been wronged, they came, rang the bell, and the king would hear their grievance. It was in this tradition that the UDD collected the signatures in order to appeal for a pardon for the former PM.

One signature would have been quite sufficient, especially if the appeal was being made on reasonably grounds and with the backing of evidence. Compiling the long list of a couple of million signatures was intended to apply pressure and make up for the fact that there is no reasonable grounds, nor is there any evidence. Shucks, nevermind no evidence of innocence, there's not even a claim of it. Just the old politically motivated chestnut that politicians feel their right to use any time someone should dare find them guilty.

I am not sure evidence of innocence is a requirement for a pardon though I am sure i will be quickly corrected if i am wrong. As far as as I am aware a royal pardon is not an overuling of a legal decision but something that sits outside it and provide an option to take into account such things as national interest and previous actions. In this particular case it could be argued that Thaksin previous services to the country should be enough to give consideration to what is, in this case, a fairly minor charge.

I was going from tlansford post in which he stated about Thai people being able to appeal to the King in situations where they feel they have been wronged. To have been wronged, implies to me having been accused of something one did not do, but perhaps there's a more convoluted way of looking at this to dodge around the whole pesky guilty as charged business - such as the one you offer about for the good of the country.

[daninthai]

BANGKOK, Sept 14 - A group of anti-Red Shirt activists on Wednesday said it would rally in the capital on Friday to protest the move seeking a royal pardon for fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra this Friday.

Have they picked a colour yet?? First rule of marketing, it isn't enough to be "anti". I go with harlequin, quarters.

I reckon BROWN, as in hitting the fan ...

Pick a colour any colour, but either way, this pardon is going to happen, and no amount of foot stomping is going to stop it. It ain't right, but it is absolutely inevitable. If they don't get it this way, they are going to get it some other way. Who really knows how many skeletons any of these protagonists have in their cupboard?

He won't get the pardon. Without serving time and showing remorse he is just dreaming. PTP/reds would be very stupid to actually apply for it. Have ANY of them considered the consequences if it is refused?

[CNXBKKMAN]

What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

He has a personal militia that can engage in large scale terrorist actions if he doesn't get his way

I think that your response has more to do with hysteria than with facts. What is the basis of your claim ? Where is this para-military force stationed ? Maybe a few thugs or bodyguards, but not "militia" and not "large scale". Soon we will be hearing that he is nuclear capable.

The personal militia is the armed red shirts. The ones with M16's , rocket propelled grenades, explosives etc. If you have forgotten last year they were tossing grenades into the yellow shirt camps. Killing Royal Thai Army soldiers, even marking them with laser pointers before firing. Bombs in bins all over the place. Didn't they fire a RPG at the Dusit Thani hotel in BKK? The list goes on. Your question where is this force stationed? They don't have a formal base like the regular army. They live in normal houses and gather and group when ordered.

[rixalex]

What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

He has a personal militia that can engage in large scale terrorist actions if he doesn't get his way

I think that your response has more to do with hysteria than with facts. What is the basis of your claim ? Where is this para-military force stationed ? Maybe a few thugs or bodyguards, but not "militia" and not "large scale". Soon we will be hearing that he is nuclear capable.

The basis of his claim i believe is the violent red protests, of which there have been a number. Were you perchance in Bangkok in 2009 and 2010 to witness these few thugs and bodyguards you mention burning buses, throwing molotov cocktails, tossing grenades, firing AK47s, razing buildings, hijacking gas tanker, firing slingshots?

[siampolee]

As has already been stated "this is or could be an interesting time if the rally goes ahead.""

Will we see the Red Shirt regiments of vigilantes howling or striking down the rally members, if so it would indeed be interesting to see who could or would have sanctioned such an action?

Or will we see a rally where the right of free speech is acknowledged?

[kutjebu]

Interesting!

Here is the first protest since the clone has taken office.

I remember her saying that red shirts will deal with protests... so, let's see what will happen.

Watch what you're saying.Immigration is watching you about bad talking over the Prime minister.

[rubl]

Interesting!

Here is the first protest since the clone has taken office.

I remember her saying that red shirts will deal with protests... so, let's see what will happen.

Semantics, I think. We had a few red-shirt / UDD "rallies" to commemorate events. Like the coming 'rally' to mark the fifth anniversary of the Sept 19, 2006 coup, UDD chairwoman Thida Thavornseth said today. Also don't forget the protests by various agricultural and landless groups. The last protest had a government spokesperson saying Ms Yingluck is not in to receive you, but all her guards were still present

Edited September 14, 2011 by rubl

[JurgenG]

A bit of background on this "Network of Citizen Volunteers Protecting the Land".

From Wiki : The Network of Citizen Volunteers Protecting the Land (Thai: กลุ่มประชาชนเพื่อพิทักษ์ชาติ ศาสน์ กษัตริย์ or เครือข่ายพลเมืองอาสาปกป้องแผ่นดิน), is commonly known as Multicolor Shirts. Since this day, the movement has held demonstrations nearly every day. In September 2010, the network started a signature collection against a bill granting amnesty to anyone prosecuted for actions connected to the 2010 political protests.^[6] In addition to rallies in public, the movement's leader, Dr. Tul, regularly files complaints before the Election Commission and the National Anti-Corruption Commission (NACC), and lawsuits against prominent "Red Shirt" activists and Pheu Thai Party politicians, including controversial MP Jatuporn Prompan, and Prime Minister-elect Yingluck Shinawatra.^[7] After the Election Commission endorsed the parlamentarian's status of Jatuporn, the movement also announced to sue the EC itself.^[8]

In short, it's a gang of dingbats, with 4 members, the "professor", his wife, the janitor and a retard undergraduate student.

Important note : there is a typo in the number of signatures they've collected so far, it's 3.6, not millions, just 3.6, because the retard student counts only for 0.6.

[Sharp]

Coup coup

said a little birdy

[softgeorge]

I predict if by some crooked means, Yingluck's government pardons Thaksin, Thailand will be in for hellish times again. As per my direct knowledge, Thaksin is a criminal and because he jumped bail, he is a double criminal. His criminal conviction was upheld by the nine judge bench of the Supreme Court. What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

But if he is pardoned then all is clean and good. People will not be able to bicker about a pardon.

[rubl]

A bit of background on this "Network of Citizen Volunteers Protecting the Land".

From Wiki : The Network of Citizen Volunteers Protecting the Land (Thai: กลุ่มประชาชนเพื่อพิทักษ์ชาติ ศาสน์ กษัตริย์ or เครือข่ายพลเมืองอาสาปกป้องแผ่นดิน), is commonly known as Multicolor Shirts. Since this day, the movement has held demonstrations nearly every day. In September 2010, the network started a signature collection against a bill granting amnesty to anyone prosecuted for actions connected to the 2010 political protests.^[6] In addition to rallies in public, the movement's leader, Dr. Tul, regularly files complaints before the Election Commission and the National Anti-Corruption Commission (NACC), and lawsuits against prominent "Red Shirt" activists and Pheu Thai Party politicians, including controversial MP Jatuporn Prompan, and Prime Minister-elect Yingluck Shinawatra.^[7] After the Election Commission endorsed the parlamentarian's status of Jatuporn, the movement also announced to sue the EC itself.^[8]

In short, it's a gang of dingbats, with 4 members, the "professor", his wife, the janitor and a retard undergraduate student.

Important note : there is a typo in the number of signatures they've collected so far, it's 3.6, not millions, just 3.6, because the retard student counts only for 0.6.

In short, you don't like this particular group. Fine, no problem with that. With UDD /red-shirts called terrorists, I guess I won't complain about the description 'dingbats'

BTW what are you mumbling about 3.6, 0.6, ... The OP clearly said

"Dr Tul said the network hopes to collect more than 3.6 million signatures affixed to the petition, outnumbering those signing the Red Shirt petition."

Edited September 14, 2011 by rubl

[AleG]

He won't get the pardon. Without serving time and showing remorse he is just dreaming. PTP/reds would be very stupid to actually apply for it. Have ANY of them considered the consequences if it is refused?

I'm quite sure they have considered the consequences and the people behind this political plot wouldn't be much troubled with inciting even more unrest as a result of it. Lest we forget about some Red Shirt publications waxing poetic about the Russian Revolution and such things.

[scorecard]

I predict if by some crooked means, Yingluck's government pardons Thaksin, Thailand will be in for hellish times again. As per my direct knowledge, Thaksin is a criminal and because he jumped bail, he is a double criminal. His criminal conviction was upheld by the nine judge bench of the Supreme Court. What basis other than his gigantic wealth does he have to ask for a pardon?

Going back hundreds of years in Thai Kings traditionally had a bell outside the palace. The Thai people were able to use this as a direct appeal to the king. If they felt they had been wronged, they came, rang the bell, and the king would hear their grievance. It was in this tradition that the UDD collected the signatures in order to appeal for a pardon for the former PM.

One signature would have been quite sufficient, especially if the appeal was being made on reasonably grounds and with the backing of evidence. Compiling the long list of a couple of million signatures was intended to apply pressure and make up for the fact that there is no reasonable grounds, nor is there any evidence. Shucks, nevermind no evidence of innocence, there's not even a claim of it. Just the old politically motivated chestnut that politicians feel their right to use any time someone should dare find them guilty.

I am not sure evidence of innocence is a requirement for a pardon though I am sure i will be quickly corrected if i am wrong. As far as as I am aware a royal pardon is not an overuling of a legal decision but something that sits outside it and provide an option to take into account such things as national interest and previous actions. In this particular case it could be argued that Thaksin previous services to the country should be enough to give consideration to what is, in this case, a fairly minor charge.

"minor charge". Not true.

[rubl]

One signature would have been quite sufficient, especially if the appeal was being made on reasonably grounds and with the backing of evidence. Compiling the long list of a couple of million signatures was intended to apply pressure and make up for the fact that there is no reasonable grounds, nor is there any evidence. Shucks, nevermind no evidence of innocence, there's not even a claim of it. Just the old politically motivated chestnut that politicians feel their right to use any time someone should dare find them guilty.

I am not sure evidence of innocence is a requirement for a pardon though I am sure i will be quickly corrected if i am wrong. As far as as I am aware a royal pardon is not an overuling of a legal decision but something that sits outside it and provide an option to take into account such things as national interest and previous actions. In this particular case it could be argued that Thaksin previous services to the country should be enough to give consideration to what is, in this case, a fairly minor charge.

"minor charge". Not true.

Also it would be nice if the fugitive convict would show some remorse. That's the part which is really lacking