Phuket Schools Relax Rules For Hiring English Teachers

[housepainter]

Interesting.

But then again they don't like foreigners.

Then there's .............. face. Can't be wrong, can't be corrected, can't show any ignorance, can't ask questions, and can't take any risks - even in learning!

The adult population doesn't speak English. The TAN network presenters [ Thai TV in English] can't pronounce the language and yet their strangled vowels are deamed acceptable for broadcast.

Add to the mix the low pay that won't attract any properly qualified English [EFL] teachers to Thailand. Add to that the simple fact that Thais don't want it badly enough to pay for it or move the slightest obstacle to achieve it.

I expect the holidaying pedos to apply in droves. Most likely they are already in post, hence visual aids usage confined to bananas and stock cupboards.

We are left with fine words then.

In Thai only. English remains the challenge. A bit like surmounting Everest in 1920 ........ along way off ever happening.

Edited November 14, 2011 by housepainter

[Scott]

Several replies to a series of deleted posts have been removed.

By the way, there is an exception to the wage requirements for teachers to get a Work Permit.

Edited November 14, 2011 by Scott
added

[starcatcher]

The problem is so much deeper: I have seen kids even not know about Latin letters, only Thai letters. But had to start learning English - also in written. It's like we have to start learning Thai by writing Thai without anyone tells anything about the Thai letters. That's not really motivating.

And how was it about jobs, Thais (believe) know already, how to do? Same as with skills in any jobs here in this country, most people never be able to deliver good quality of work (not as a chef for an Italian restaurant and even not for fixing motorbikes). And pronouncing of Thai English teachers is - nice said amazing.

So Thailand will fall much more behind, when you see the good quality of Khmer, Vietnamese and Burmese speaking and pronouncing English. Like few people said: Thailand gets what it wants. Som Nam Na

Edited November 14, 2011 by starcatcher

[khaowong1]

as far as I can see this has nothing to do with hiring foreigners to teach English, it is solely concerned with hiring Thai teachers?

Yes, thats what I'm reading into this article also. I may be wrong, but I would bet if you checked in Singapore or Malaysia, you would find a lot of native english speaking teachers. Thailand just doesn't get it.

[tominbkk]

One would think that Phuket, with all its tourism dollars, would have money to spend on quality teachers (I know, that makes too much sense). Seems to me if you offered around 50k a month you could easily get a decent crop of certified English instructors to live there. Less than that and you will be stuck with transients without the proper training. Even 50k is a little low, but I am sure there are plenty of teachers who would sacrifice extra income for being able to live at the beach. I don't think they even mention how much they are paying the teachers in the article, I suppose it is very little indeed.

As they say, if you pay in peanuts, you won't get much more than monkeys!

Edited November 14, 2011 by tominbkk

[rotary]

I hope they do not drop the standards too much in hiring english teachers.........remember this news from the past:

August 17, 2006A former schoolteacher confesses to being with the six-year-old child beauty queen JonBenet Ramsey when she died. John Mark Karr, an American who has been staying in Thailand, is under arrest and expected to be returned to the U.S. to face charges in the 10-year-old case.

[falangjim]

Pay peanuts, get monkeys. No teacher worth his salt would ever accept a 30K baht/month job unless they were just beginning and wanted a bit of experience. Thai schools want a few teachers with an "attractive degree" on staff, and then they don't care about the rest of the staff's qualifications. I remember managing a staff of foreigners in Bangkok and it was a nightmare recruiting talented staff at 35K baht a month. And all the hoops they made us jump through with documents, photos, letters of verification from previous universities, transcripts, police reports, health exams etc, etc. And the process was antiquated! I had to travel to a different country on my dime so I could obtain a 3 month visa to get all this crap done? No thank you. Modernize yourselves, Thailand. It is tiring and boring going to a government agency where they still use paper files. What took Thailand 3 months to do, Korea could do in a day.

For what it's worth, I've decided to take my teaching talents somewhere else--a place where I make a man's salary, get benefits and enough holiday to visit Thailand, but never want to work there again.

[block2]

By the way, there is an exception to the wage requirements for teachers to get a Work Permit.

Your a Global Mod..deleting posts and then you come out with the above statement....

....so what are the wage requirements for teachers to get a work permit...

surely many members would rather know the answer to the statement you made rather than how many posts you have deleted.

Edited November 14, 2011 by block2

[munmick]

If the schools down there are only offering 'backpacker' salaries as someone stated, then that's surely all that they can hope to attract in the way of quality teaching...Who and where does the funding come from for the teaching positions anyway?Is it at an individual school admin' level or is the funding fom the local education authority?If the schools aren't serious they can not hope to fill positions with quality teachers going down this path!!

there is a minimum salary requirement for a work permit. i believe its 50k a month.

Yes that is right 50k a mounth,But if you are married to a thai then 40k per mounth..The school offer fee breaks the minimum wage law.so how can they work there...THEY CANT. The work permit requirments are the fiqures stated 50k and 40k.minimum.Lesss tax and social payment

[Thakkar]

<br />Burma was an English colony.<br />It has millions of English speakers train by the British (the real McCoy).<br />Why not just hire Burmese English Teachers. Cheap and good.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Hmmmm bring in the lowest regarded people in this region, by Thais, to teach Thai children English!

Even if it would save and line pockets with, millions upon millions of baht.

As good as an idea as it is, its not going to happen anytime soon if ever.

Sadly, you could be right. The biggest obstacle may be the predisposition to believe that only people from designated Western countries are capable of "true" English competency. Given the budget constraints, it would be far more fruitful to seek out qualified English teachers from places like Kenya, Zimbabwe, S.Africa, Pakistan, India, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Burma and the Philippines. To teachers from these countries, US$1,000 a month would be a good inducement and they would be here for the primary purpose of teaching, earning a living and building a career. In other words, more likely to be dedicated to their work. People from the West willing to work for US$1,000 a month will be more likely to have various other motives to be here. *

In high school, for a brief period, my French teacher was Dutch and my English teacher, a Sri Lankan. They were excellent, engaging teachers and we learned much from them. Alas, they were replaced by 'native' speakers of those languages whose accents were certainly impressive (I guess), but who were terrible, lazy, disdainful teachers who failed to engage us or impart any skills. So while proficiency is a necessary condition, it isn't a sufficient one. Knowing a subject does not automatically qualify one to teach that subject.

There are many qualified teachers from the former colonies who are proficient in English but lack the requisite "proper" accent. I'd say far better for Thai students to acquire reasonably good English skills albeit with a Filipino accent than inadequate skills with an American accent.

T

* It is not my intention to belittle the many excellent Western teachers here competently soldiering away at Baht 30k/month; just that, for the same inducement, the probability of finding a more dedicated teacher from Yangoon is higher than finding one from New York.

Edited November 14, 2011 by Thakkar

[csolgosz]

TEFL and all that; been there done that. Anyone who says teaching your own mother tongue is difficult or requires some form of 'special' expertise is pulling the wool. Teaching in Thailand is probably the most demotivating job I have ever done. Do Thais really want to learn about the outside world?

Quite interesting reading some of the comments here. Although I am a teacher in Thailand with a Master degree in Education, I agree with your comment about, "teaching your own mother tongue" (if we are only talking about teaching language) apart from a few things that go with that.

There is a reason that teachers are required to do a 3 or 4 year Education degree in the west, and it is that there is more to teaching than just having a handle on a language as a native speaker. I have worked around a lot of appalling 'backpacker' teachers in a previous job who were quite of the opinion that they were doing a great job - despite their inability to follow curriculum, achieve targets on time and come to work every day, and in an acceptable (sober and drug-free) state to teach students... Because these 'teachers' have had no police checks in their own country and have no proper teaching certification, some are even known pedophiles - one I know carries around the personal card of a senior police officer who protects his sorry arse. Just in case you thought the idea of having this trash teaching your kids was great...

Generally, the only category of schools who pay adequate money for REAL teachers in Thailand are the International schools - that is why China, Vietnam and other countries are taking so many qualified teachers from under Thailand's nose. Most University lecturers have no qualifications, but often have mere bachelor degrees in their own profession, for which they are usually paid a pittance. As a qualified teacher here, I feel absolutely NO respect from the Education System here towards teachers - a mutual feeling - and would have no qualms at jumping ship either if the opportunity beckoned.

[Just1Voice]

I was talking online to a woman the other night. She's from the Philippines, living and teaching English at a school in Chiang Rai. Her and her cousin. According to her she teaches "primary (beginner) English", but when talking to her I'm amazed at how she is unable to carry on a decent conversation, and often times asks the meaning of words or things I have said. Makes me think that if someone such as this is teaching "beginner English", I feel sorry for the students.

Edited November 14, 2011 by Just1Voice

[Tanaka]

I could be wrong on this, but I read somewhere that even the current Foreign Minister cannot speak English!

I'm afraid you are wrong on this, though the rest of your post was very interesting.

Dr Surapong has a masters and a doctorate from the United States and has taught at university level in the US. (Doesn't mean he's the right man for the job, of course.)

I think the previous Democrat Education Minister and the Deputy Minister of Education did not speak English. I heard both of them make a terrible mess of speeches written for them in English at a World Teachers' Day forum before an international gathering. On another occasion, at an English-medium (World Bank) seminar I attended the minister gave the introductory speech entirely in Thai. This is the same minister who said English could not be an official language for teaching purposes here because other countries would think Thailand had been colonized!

Thanks for the correction. As I said, I wasn't sure, as the article was some months back, so memory may have failed me a bit.

(Doesn't mean he's the right man for the job, of course.) Now, Thailand actually does have "the right man for the job" in many cases. Unfortunately, the "right man" is usually ignored and the position given to someone from the family, or a political crony, who knows nothing about the job.

I remember the comment the Minister made about how English could not be an official language as other countries would think Thailand had been colonized. That one had me laughing for a very long time. Made me wonder if anyone had ever pointed out to him that both Hong King and Singapore were once colonies, but look at how far ahead of Thailand they are in just about every area?

He would just have answered that a comparison between Thailand and those countries was not possible. Period. (Meaning of course that Thailand is superior anyway).

[Warhammer820]

A lot of this has to do with the wages. I know a guy that teaches at Uni level and get less than 30K a month. But a lot of it has to do with location... we have an ELS and we're offering 60K a month... but when you say it's in Surin they're not interested. Still needing two TESOL teachers...

You're school is offering 60,000 baht a month in Surin and no one is interested? I would love to stay in contact with you if you are still offering that salary when I get my degree next May. I will graduate with an education degree and would like to have that position. Surin is actually a neat city in my opinion.

[Rumpole]

pay more and you will get better teachers who will want to stay and teach also maybe make the visa a little bit easier to get for teachers,

if Thailand really wants the better teachers for their children they should at least look at these things for a start

I'd be willing to wager that they do nothing whatever of the sort, though. Thais wouldn't recognize a good teacher if he or she jumped up and bit them on the derriere. Even if by some miracle they DO manage to recruit a few decent ones, they will then have to contend with the deeply ingrained xenophobia and mistrust of anything 'foreign', and the complacent, soporific, inertia of the Thai 'education' system. The Laos, Cambodians and Burmese walk (had to select my verb carefully here) all over the Thais when it comes to learning foreign languages.

[Route21]

There is obviously a problem with teaching pupils in the english language, at least in Phetchabun province, since no one in my wife's family can speak a single word of English.

Ditto in my case - also from Phetchabun.

R21

[thailife69]

as far as I can see this has nothing to do with hiring foreigners to teach English, it is solely concerned with hiring Thai teachers?

Here is the very first sentence.

'The Phuket Primary Education Area Office has relaxed the requirements for foreigners to be hired as English-language teachers at government schools in Phuket.'

Take the time to read all the article, understand what is written, "comprehension and clear thinking" you will quickly discover that the person you are being critical of is actually correct. The education department has decided to relax the requirements on foreigners because they are unable to source enough locally qualified teachers for the reasons stated.

Let's hope you are not intending on applying for a job until 6th. grade English has been attained. It is safe to assume that Phuket will be sourcing teachers that comprehend the English language.

Thanks for the entertainment.

Reading yours and other posts it amazes how self important so many are. Why would they assume that the only people capable of speaking and teaching the English language come from western countries.

I imagine there would be thousands of of teachers out there that do not expect to received over inflated salaries to teach in a foreign country. If they the westerners were competent enough as teachers they would still be teaching in their country of origin. As many western education departments now expect results from teacher, it is safe to assume that the majority of western teachers teaching in Thailand are doing so because they cannot gain suitable employment elsewhere.

[gamini]

I don't understand why they want native born English speakers when many Indians, Sri Lankans and Malays speak better English than the average English person., especially those with provincial accents.

[griser]

I don't understand why they want native born English speakers when many Indians, Sri Lankans and Malays speak better English than the average English person., especially those with provincial accents.

They may speak English but the Indian, Sri lankan accents are atrocious. Of course some of the Brits I've heard are just as bad. A person with a bad Accent in English is actually making matters worse for a student.

Imagine a Thai English accent with a Indian accent thrown in. totally unrecognizable as English. That's why they want native English speakers. So they can be understood!

Greg

[falangjim]

I don't understand why they want native born English speakers when many Indians, Sri Lankans and Malays speak better English than the average English person., especially those with provincial accents.

"...better than your average English person?" You sure about that? And why would an educated Indian bother teaching Thais English anyway?

[bkkadam5040]

Good article about the awareness of teaching here in Thailand. First, there needs to be a failure policy. Let's start simply with this. I'm sure all you expats(someone not from Thailand) has this in their school system back in their country. There's much to implement this policy but the people in power will(might) lose face? It's not until the higher-ups that make the decisions to make this so. who can get more pay($$$) based upon their teacher's passing rate. Like America, they have what's called PTA. I know, this IS difficult to do here. But, if the true teachers here, the ones that actually have a curriculum, can make a stand with there issues to their 'bosses' and propose more $! First step is CURRICULUM, do WE? (Thailand have one?). However, I do believe the ones that can actually teach DO deserve more money($).

Just because you have a Bachelors, Masters, or Doctorate doesn't mean SH*%! It's the ability to teach, inspire, and help others who are in want/need for intellect. <br>

[pranburipete]

A lot of this has to do with the wages. I know a guy that teaches at Uni level and get less than 30K a month. But a lot of it has to do with location... we have an ELS and we're offering 60K a month... but when you say it's in Surin they're not interested. Still needing two TESOL teachers...

do you have the contact details of the school as im in thailand and have a diploma and tesol certificate...and like surin?

[mezzy]

Hi, I'm a highly qualified teacher, currently working at Singapore American School, and looking to transfer to Thailand. I'm interested in hearing more about this position..

If you're a qualified teacher why on earth would you be looking at 30,000thb a month job? Bottom of the rung teacher with full teaching degree starts at 80,000thb a month here in Phuket at one of the the International Schools. There are several here: Phuket International Day Academy, British International School, Quality International School (huge franchise) and Headstart IS. There are heaps of International Schools all over Thailand.

You won't get people with a Bachelor of Education or Grad Dip in Education at such low wages. Maybe TEFL or TESOL people, but even they are getting sick of being exploited and ripped off by dodgy companies that make all these promises and then take your passport and don't pay you.

Edited November 14, 2011 by mezzy

[bkkadam5040]

Presentation is EVERYTHING. Have something to provide to teach the children. Or just simply, show a degree, have fun and hahahahaha, and enjoy. Happy travels(let me guess dreds?) Yes, I just judged.

[thailife69]

I could be wrong on this, but I read somewhere that even the current Foreign Minister cannot speak English!

I'm afraid you are wrong on this, though the rest of your post was very interesting.

Dr Surapong has a masters and a doctorate from the United States and has taught at university level in the US. (Doesn't mean he's the right man for the job, of course.)

I think the previous Democrat Education Minister and the Deputy Minister of Education did not speak English. I heard both of them make a terrible mess of speeches written for them in English at a World Teachers' Day forum before an international gathering. On another occasion, at an English-medium (World Bank) seminar I attended the minister gave the introductory speech entirely in Thai. This is the same minister who said English could not be an official language for teaching purposes here because other countries would think Thailand had been colonized!

Thanks for the correction. As I said, I wasn't sure, as the article was some months back, so memory may have failed me a bit.

(Doesn't mean he's the right man for the job, of course.) Now, Thailand actually does have "the right man for the job" in many cases. Unfortunately, the "right man" is usually ignored and the position given to someone from the family, or a political crony, who knows nothing about the job.

I remember the comment the Minister made about how English could not be an official language as other countries would think Thailand had been colonized. That one had me laughing for a very long time. Made me wonder if anyone had ever pointed out to him that both Hong King and Singapore were once colonies, but look at how far ahead of Thailand they are in just about every area?

Your comparisons are based on pointless assumptions. Let's try listing the countries that had been or have been colonised and you soon discover how detrimental it has been to them. Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar,Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, all of Africa, Central and South America but to name a few. Did the people of HK have any rights? No! Do they now? Very few! Did Singapore? No! Does Singapore now, it's improving, but you still wouldn't want to live there.

The importance of English is declining as world language. It used to be French until they became overly self-indulgent, English is not far behind. If a country wants to be at the fore front of a modern advancing world,they would be better advised to instruct Chinese or Indian. These so called advanced western industrialised countries are swiftly becoming nobodies as they spend the next few centuries paying off debt due to greed and the costs of sustaining imperialism.

It's a myth that Thailand has not been colonised, they tend to overlook the Burmese, Chinese who own and run the country, Japanese and now the Americans. It helps if you understand a little more than 60 years of Thai history. There is another 7 centuries before the devastating effect of allowing the USA to colonise Thailand during the Vietnam massacre and US advancement of imperialism into South East Asia.

To this day American's are amazed that the Japanese attacked. Brainless fools. Might have something to do with the invasion of Japan by the USA in the 19th century solely for the purpose of gaining access to goods that they had squandered, whale oil for their industrialized growth.They had already killed off their own supplies. Ring any bells? Texas dry, let's meddle in the Middle East then. Prior to the US invasion, Japan was a peaceful insular country. Before the American invasion of Thailand, Pattaya was not the world's largest brothel. Am convinced syphilis has made Americans brain dead.

What the Thais learnt from these imperialist was that they were and still are an easy touch. Thailand made billions and continues to do so, yet the imperialists still believe they are a superior civilisation. The communists control their people for the greater good of all, while the Americans control their citizens for the greater good of a few. Walk outside of the tourist spots of the USA and you soon realise what a disgraceful state that country actually is in and has been for decades. All in the name of GOD.

Edited November 14, 2011 by thailife69

[Friendlyisle]

I've rarely seen a shortage of any kind of employee if the salary is right.

Yes, but still a step in the right direction. In fact, it is one of the most intelligent actions I have heard of by government at any level in Thailand to address an obstacle to Thailand's ability to compete with other emerging economies of the world. All Thailand really has to to do is copy what other's (i.e. Singapore) have done for years now. The trouble seems to be that those with power and money don't want any changes. Thailand is getting "left in the dust" with their short-sighted thinking! Too bad - they could have been so prosperous! The jewel of S.E. Asia, even. . . .

[ALFREDO]

Burma was an English colony.

It has millions of English speakers train by the British (the real McCoy).

Why not just hire Burmese English Teachers. Cheap and good.

A joke?

That was in the 60is, so a than trained 20+ year young English teacher is now at least 70+

[ALFREDO]

There is obviously a problem with teaching pupils in the english language, at least in Phetchabun province, since no one in my wife's family can speak a single word of English.

-Udon Thani- -Chayaphum-

Everybody learns English in his school, 2 hours a week?

Anyway, nearly nobody from that students-Schoolboys, girls can talk English!

[anon467367354]

Give the foreigners a green card, let them try to work where ever they wish. Obviously if they don't speak the language they won't get a job at the 7-11, but if they can get a job, any freaking job then let them have it. Pay them whatever the Thai people make doing the same job, and if the boss doesn't like their performance they can be fired and have a nice day. The Thai that go to English speaking countries to teach Thai, if that ever happens I don't know, I'm sure would not be making 2 and 3 times what the westerners make. This might raise some hackles, but why do we get paid so dam_n much? If you can't afford to live here, then you shouldn't live here. The Thai manage, why can't the foreigners? The problem is for the most part teaching sucks. The students don't care, the teachers don't care, the school doesn't care as long as it looks good to have a Farang on the premises. The realization is for most, that if you don't teach, you can't live here, and knowing that is the reason I chose to pursue internet marketing. But until the Thai get off their high horse about only people from India and Orientals can work here easily, they are shooting themselves in the foot.

Without diversity there is no strength. Thailand is such a homogenized country, it's no wonder they are behind in so many areas like maturity.

[anon467367354]

I don't understand why they want native born English speakers when many Indians, Sri Lankans and Malays speak better English than the average English person., especially those with provincial accents.

Huh?