Pardon For Thaksin: Thai Govt Takes Dangerous Path

[animatic]

Oddly enough it is easier for a government to to organise an amnesty for political actions which are tied to events and historical periods which are considered to have ended than it is to organise amnesties for economic offences which must be continually opposed. What is even more difficult to slough off are economic offences amassed during a period of political power. When someone is caught and convicted of committing money laundering offences while holding the position of PM, and the evidence is not disputed, there is a very serious issue, particularly when the offender goes on the run, does not admit their guilt and does not personally request a pardon. The problem for the government is two-fold: on practical grounds it is difficult to know what they can do, what they can frame to legitimise Thaksin's position while at the same time claiming that that it is not for him or about him. (As a side-bar the forum Thaksin apologists are always swerving about on the road going from a position of 'its not about Thaksin' to the other side declaiming that it is about him and should be amnestied/he's innocent etc....the swerving done by most of them with a po face). The other problem is that Thaksin chose the cabinet members and dare one say it the current PM precisely to carry out the task of bringing him back. Thaksin has their undated resignation letters in his pocket. It is this dilemma which sets and keeps the government on a dangerous path.

Indeed.

Even in the face of obvious opposition from all fronts, they would sent to the country, to hide indefinitely, if they so much as blick and deviate from the liege lords commands. So they keep doing what they are told... hoping that their graft skim % will eventually come their way before the whole mess explodes in their face.

Edited November 25, 2011 by animatic

[hanuman1]

The election is over; there's no need, for the moment, to stir up trouble.

Same as how the bombings on banks that held Thaksin's frozen assets ended after the verdict on the case (he got some of the money back).

Just as a reminder, there was a period of around 12 months before the election during which these 'terrorist cells' were apparently engaged in...well, nothing.

Or maybe it was Black Ops - the type of thing no-one ever knows about. As if it never happened...

The failed 'bombmaking 101' in Nonthaburi was on the 5th of October 2010, new elections were announced around the 5th of May 2011. Eight months.

Anyway as Dept. PM Chalerm has said a few times "I'll bring back k. Thaksin". He's been studying the law again. Being very busy with 'law and order' in general, 'anti-drug campaign', 'crime prevention and keeping roads open in BKK', but not directly involved with the flooding measures, (too) many capable men working on that already. All a matter of priority, people complaining about hardly a meter of water in their living room should spare a thought for k. Thaksin, waterless in the desert, poor man

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

[Buchholz]

Oct 5 - Nov 5 = 1 month

Nov 5 - Dec 5 = 1 month

Dec 5 - Jan 5 = 1 month

Jan 5 - Feb 5 = 1 month

Feb 5 - Mar 5 = 1 month

Mar 5 - Apr 5 = 1 month

Apr 5 - May 5 = 1 month

May 5 - Jun 5 = 1 month

Jun 5 - Jul 3 = 1 month

10 months

[AleG]

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

They had already accomplished what they had to do, produce enough bodies for the ghouls at the UDD and PTP to feed their election campaign, after that it was Phase Two, pretend that the Red Shirts were just peaceful protesters and deny any responsibility in the violence.

[elliss]

Unbelievable ... this could mark the start of a very dark era for Thailand

and the good news is ,

the baht may dround ,

oops, i mean go down .

55 bht= GBP , VELCOME BACK .

:jap:

[rubl]

The failed 'bombmaking 101' in Nonthaburi was on the 5th of October 2010, new elections were announced around the 5th of May 2011. Eight months.

Anyway as Dept. PM Chalerm has said a few times "I'll bring back k. Thaksin". He's been studying the law again. Being very busy with 'law and order' in general, 'anti-drug campaign', 'crime prevention and keeping roads open in BKK', but not directly involved with the flooding measures, (too) many capable men working on that already. All a matter of priority, people complaining about hardly a meter of water in their living room should spare a thought for k. Thaksin, waterless in the desert, poor man

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

No comment, 2011-04-21:

"At around the time the bombings stopped, the government pulled back its previous vigorous pursuit of Thaksin’s extradition from the United Arab Emirates (UAE), where the former premier has resided since fleeing a two-year jail term handed down by a Thai court in August 2008."

http://asiancorrespondent.com/52818/thaksins-deal-with-the-establishment/

[hanuman1]

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

They had already accomplished what they had to do, produce enough bodies for the ghouls at the UDD and PTP to feed their election campaign, after that it was Phase Two, pretend that the Red Shirts were just peaceful protesters and deny any responsibility in the violence.

You seem to be very well acquainted with the 'red shirt plans'. Are you getting some inside information? Or maybe you're saying it because it's just soooo obvious. Anyway, I'm glad we agree that for almost a year your so called 'terrorist organization' hasn't done anything 'terroristy' at all.

As for responsibility for the violence, that lies with the people who encouraged it and the people who carried it out. At least that's what the law says, if that helps you find your moral bearings more easily.

[yoshiwara]

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

They had already accomplished what they had to do, produce enough bodies for the ghouls at the UDD and PTP to feed their election campaign, after that it was Phase Two, pretend that the Red Shirts were just peaceful protesters and deny any responsibility in the violence.

You seem to be very well acquainted with the 'red shirt plans'. Are you getting some inside information? Or maybe you're saying it because it's just soooo obvious. Anyway, I'm glad we agree that for almost a year your so called 'terrorist organization' hasn't done anything 'terroristy' at all.

As for responsibility for the violence, that lies with the people who encouraged it and the people who carried it out. At least that's what the law says, if that helps you find your moral bearings more easily.

The thanks for forcing Thaksin's thug forces off the streets should go to the army for clearing them out last year and imprisoning the leaders such as Jatuporn and forcing Arisman to flee. It is difficult for the reds to switch violent tactics on and off like a tap and apart from the occasional red aspirant terrorist trying to blow himself up, the situation on the street has been mercifully quiet. What Thaksin did do, however, was to pressure for some of the thug elements to enter parliament and act as 'minders' to the occasionally wayward PT members who might want to wilt under pressure. Also Jatuporn's attempts to push ahead with the setting up of the red villagers nothing other than to have a militant force even if under leash. All a bit unhinged by the floods, but the failed attempt to action the pardon while knee-deep in water a first step to recapture initiative and step up the volume. Terrorists? Now what exactly has happened to those MK47s and other armoury seen being toted by the black shirts last year? Handed in? Or hidden? Nice attempt to take the crayons out and paint a picture of peaceful reds. So sweet.

[AleG]

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

They had already accomplished what they had to do, produce enough bodies for the ghouls at the UDD and PTP to feed their election campaign, after that it was Phase Two, pretend that the Red Shirts were just peaceful protesters and deny any responsibility in the violence.

You seem to be very well acquainted with the 'red shirt plans'. Are you getting some inside information? Or maybe you're saying it because it's just soooo obvious. Anyway, I'm glad we agree that for almost a year your so called 'terrorist organization' hasn't done anything 'terroristy' at all.

As for responsibility for the violence, that lies with the people who encouraged it and the people who carried it out. At least that's what the law says, if that helps you find your moral bearings more easily.

Yes, blindingly obvious.

I know for a fact that the Yellow Shirt leadership expected, nay, wanted to get a dozen or so deaths during their protests to use to club the government (you can read it directly from the horse's mouth on one of the wikileaks cables)

I don't expect the Red Shirt leaders and financiers to be any better, and also their actions speak clearly of their intent.

But then again there's none as blind as those who don't want to see.

[mcottage]

Only this week I was thinking why is Thaksin so silent during a period of such distress for Thailand. If he is so concerned over the welfare of Thais, why the silence? Well it is clear now that he has been staying under the radar as he is cooking his plans for his own benefit, and using the national distraction of the crisis to re-enter via the back door. This is as low as he has ever gone. I find it disgusting, up there with the Americans bombing their own embassies abroad during Clinton sex scandal. Thais need to react strongly to this, and ensure it goes no further and also need to discredit the Govt for allowing this to happen. You are living in misery and see how they rub your noses in it? This is disgusting behaviour.

I was agreeing with everything you said until you became delusional with your statement about American involvement of embassy bomings being a distraction from the Clinton sex scandal....I don't know what your politics are and I'm no fan of Clinton or his wife for many reasons, but for you to suggest something so absurd you should be banned from making statements due to your being a complete imbicil.

[PaulBax]

all we have here is a continuation of the "big lie theory"

1.The bigger the lie, the more likely people are to believe it.

Simply put, tell a lie large enough and people will assume that it’s true

because you couldn’t possibly have the audacity to say such a ridiculous thing if it wasn’t true.

2.Never allow the public to cool off. By keeping the public in a frenzy over an issue,

nobody gets a chance to stop and really think about what they’re being told. On the off-chance

that someone does realize what they’re being told, having a frenzied public keeps the person “in-the-know” from being heard.

3.Never leave room for alternatives. By opening the door to the possibility that there might be

another option, you allow for “your enemy” to plan their attacks. If you make it clear that

there are no other options, you reduce the choice to a simple yes or no.

4. Concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong.

5.If you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.

sounds just like many posters on this site!

[yoshiwara]

Only this week I was thinking why is Thaksin so silent during a period of such distress for Thailand. If he is so concerned over the welfare of Thais, why the silence? Well it is clear now that he has been staying under the radar as he is cooking his plans for his own benefit, and using the national distraction of the crisis to re-enter via the back door. This is as low as he has ever gone. I find it disgusting, up there with the Americans bombing their own embassies abroad during Clinton sex scandal. Thais need to react strongly to this, and ensure it goes no further and also need to discredit the Govt for allowing this to happen. You are living in misery and see how they rub your noses in it? This is disgusting behaviour.

I was agreeing with everything you said until you became delusional with your statement about American involvement of embassy bomings being a distraction from the Clinton sex scandal....I don't know what your politics are and I'm no fan of Clinton or his wife for many reasons, but for you to suggest something so absurd you should be banned from making statements due to your being a complete imbicil.

I must admit a trifle strange. It all appears a bit made up.

[yoshiwara]

all we have here is a continuation of the "big lie theory"

1.The bigger the lie, the more likely people are to believe it.

Simply put, tell a lie large enough and people will assume that it’s true

because you couldn’t possibly have the audacity to say such a ridiculous thing if it wasn’t true.

2.Never allow the public to cool off. By keeping the public in a frenzy over an issue,

nobody gets a chance to stop and really think about what they’re being told. On the off-chance

that someone does realize what they’re being told, having a frenzied public keeps the person “in-the-know” from being heard.

3.Never leave room for alternatives. By opening the door to the possibility that there might be

another option, you allow for “your enemy” to plan their attacks. If you make it clear that

there are no other options, you reduce the choice to a simple yes or no.

4. Concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong.

5.If you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.

sounds just like many posters on this site!

The biggest lies of course come out of Thaksin's mouth.

Most unfortunate for his supporters.

[PaulBax]

all we have here is a continuation of the "big lie theory"

1.The bigger the lie, the more likely people are to believe it.

Simply put, tell a lie large enough and people will assume that it's true

because you couldn't possibly have the audacity to say such a ridiculous thing if it wasn't true.

2.Never allow the public to cool off. By keeping the public in a frenzy over an issue,

nobody gets a chance to stop and really think about what they're being told. On the off-chance

that someone does realize what they're being told, having a frenzied public keeps the person "in-the-know" from being heard.

3.Never leave room for alternatives. By opening the door to the possibility that there might be

another option, you allow for "your enemy" to plan their attacks. If you make it clear that

there are no other options, you reduce the choice to a simple yes or no.

4. Concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong.

5.If you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.

sounds just like many posters on this site!

The biggest lies of course come out of Thaksin's mouth.

Most unfortunate for his supporters.

you prove my point exactly!

[yoshiwara]

all we have here is a continuation of the "big lie theory"

1.The bigger the lie, the more likely people are to believe it.

Simply put, tell a lie large enough and people will assume that it's true

because you couldn't possibly have the audacity to say such a ridiculous thing if it wasn't true.

2.Never allow the public to cool off. By keeping the public in a frenzy over an issue,

nobody gets a chance to stop and really think about what they're being told. On the off-chance

that someone does realize what they're being told, having a frenzied public keeps the person "in-the-know" from being heard.

3.Never leave room for alternatives. By opening the door to the possibility that there might be

another option, you allow for "your enemy" to plan their attacks. If you make it clear that

there are no other options, you reduce the choice to a simple yes or no.

4. Concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong.

5.If you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.

sounds just like many posters on this site!

The biggest lies of course come out of Thaksin's mouth.

Most unfortunate for his supporters.

you prove my point exactly!

Probably the biggest lie pushed out to supporters is the one that when things turn out badly they are the responsibility of 'fake' reds.

Thaksin is quite happy to push this one out time and time again.

The current big lie is to claim that amnesty has nothing to do with him. It is not his initiative.

[hanuman1]

The election occurred on 3rd July, so it was 10 months between bomb-making 101 and the election. My point was that there had been a significant amount of time before the election results during which there was no discernable 'terrorist activity'. AleG was only counting from the time of the election result, but the lack of terrorist activity goes significantly further back than that. Far enough back to invalidate the risible comments made on this forum about the red shirt movement being a terrorist organization.

They had already accomplished what they had to do, produce enough bodies for the ghouls at the UDD and PTP to feed their election campaign, after that it was Phase Two, pretend that the Red Shirts were just peaceful protesters and deny any responsibility in the violence.

You seem to be very well acquainted with the 'red shirt plans'. Are you getting some inside information? Or maybe you're saying it because it's just soooo obvious. Anyway, I'm glad we agree that for almost a year your so called 'terrorist organization' hasn't done anything 'terroristy' at all.

As for responsibility for the violence, that lies with the people who encouraged it and the people who carried it out. At least that's what the law says, if that helps you find your moral bearings more easily.

The thanks for forcing Thaksin's thug forces off the streets should go to the army for clearing them out last year and imprisoning the leaders such as Jatuporn and forcing Arisman to flee. It is difficult for the reds to switch violent tactics on and off like a tap and apart from the occasional red aspirant terrorist trying to blow himself up, the situation on the street has been mercifully quiet. What Thaksin did do, however, was to pressure for some of the thug elements to enter parliament and act as 'minders' to the occasionally wayward PT members who might want to wilt under pressure. Also Jatuporn's attempts to push ahead with the setting up of the red villagers nothing other than to have a militant force even if under leash. All a bit unhinged by the floods, but the failed attempt to action the pardon while knee-deep in water a first step to recapture initiative and step up the volume. Terrorists? Now what exactly has happened to those MK47s and other armoury seen being toted by the black shirts last year? Handed in? Or hidden? Nice attempt to take the crayons out and paint a picture of peaceful reds. So sweet.

I agree with you as far as the law of Thailand agrees with you. Thaksin needs to do time in jail, as do those who incited and perpetrated violence 18 months ago. Unfortunately it is either an overly emotional response on your part, or just plain prejudice that dictates to you that I can't both condemn Thaksin and Red Shirt leaders to the extent that Thai law does, and yet not find that thousands of red shirt supporters are terrorists, also in agreement with Thai law.

You and your fellow anti-red/gov/Thaksin fanatics make great play of bringing legal frameworks to bear when condemning your favorite targets, but happily ignore them when your emotion/prejudice decides that thousands of people you know next to nothing about are suddenly terrorists.

Put up or shut up - are you aligned with the Thai legal system, or are you in this debate for more partisan reasons?

Edited November 27, 2011 by hanuman1

[Ricardo]

Probably the biggest lie pushed out to supporters is the one that when things turn out badly they are the responsibility of 'fake' reds.

Thaksin is quite happy to push this one out time and time again.

The current big lie is to claim that amnesty has nothing to do with him. It is not his initiative.

But "Thaksin Doesn't Think, Pheu Thai Acts", just doesn't have quite the same ring-of-credibility to it, does it ?