A Female Luk Kruengs Viewpoint

[garrya]

Is it a dating agency questionairre ?

It does seem like..., nice try though

[garrya]

One thing to bear in mind, the bar girls might rip you off on the day, but some real thai women who you rely on deplate your entire budget.

Ok, not everyone just a little comparison

[tailspin]

a luk krung troll mayhaps?

[cardholder]

am a half Thai, half American 28-year-old female. I've grown up in five different countries including Thailand, but was raised primarily western.

I stop read here

This are the views of a mid-class western woman, not the views of a Thai woman

Nevertheless, she is perfectly entitled to her view - however flawed that may be.

[MrHammer]

Lets look at this realistically.

The Western attitudes towards guys in they're 40s and over, are that by middle age should be out of the game, give in and lay down to die.

If a middle-aged man of little wealth in the West becomes divorced or widowed then his chances of finding a nice desirable lady either for a relationship or as a permanent partner are virtually zilch. I say desirable, not solely for reasons of lust, but of course no one should be expected to live with a partner they don't fancy. This applies to male, female and gay relationships. They do have the choice of meeting someone closer to their own age groups, but that depends on whether a guy would prefer a mother figure or a lover? Because many of us not so young anymores are still young at heart and not ready to settle down by the fireside, smoking a pipe, wearing slippers and watching TV all day.

Many middle aged guys actually come to Thailand and other South East Asian countries believing that they going to find the nice girl of their dreams and rekindle they're younger days, a new beginning for them. But of course it doesn't always work this way. The girl's statement that there are lots of Thai woman seeking farang husbands that no need to be rich or handsome is true to a point. But there is little chance that a 20 or 30 something Thai female is going to fancy a 60 year old farang male. This is when the money factor kicks in and the relationship becomes a marriage of convenience for both parties. The older guy gets a desirable wife with a young outlook and the younger wife gains financial stability. Not my cup of tea, but the deal does suit some people.

In many cases these guys may seek solace within the bar scene or other types of adult establishments. Reason is that there are very few other options left open to them regarding romantic interactions with the opposite sex. A lady of ill repute or a nice middleclass educated girl, either way it`s going to cost them.

For those that like to regard these men as sad old losers should consider the alternatives for them, such as, feeding the ducks at a park or acting as the kindly old man telling fairy stories to children and so on.

The younger guys should take into consideration that in the not so distant future they will be middle aged and by Western attitudes be expected to gracefully bail out of the game.

It`s obvious that this American girl believes that men should abide by the unwritten rules of Western attitudes, what is considered decent and what is not, that every generation has they're role to play and should never deviate from how they are expected to act.

Total rubbish in my opinion. She is just another feministic hi so decency freak preaching her so called moral standards to what she considers as the perverted over here.

She`s got it completely wrong, it`s not so cut and dry as she believes.

Live and let live is my motto, provided we are not doing any harm to others.

Oh yes, good post, but you are shooting a bit over the mark. At 40-50 you can still be desirable to women in their 30's in the west though they would expect you to be accomplished in some form financial or academic or career. The old rule of age / 2 + 7 seems to be a good rule of thumb. A 60 year old man with a 20-25 year old girlfriend is just unrealistic. No young woman wants a man that old, not even if you're Donald Trump! Thai women stay fit even though they're older, I really can't see why you couldn't look for a woman closer your age and still have your fun in the bars with younger if that's what you're after. I don't think it's about judging anyone but about being a little more realistic about what's going on.

[Ulysses G.]

I would never do any of that.

Of course not.

[JurgenG]

Useless thread. It's just plain common sense.

A good read for the guy who started the other thread about moving to Thailand. So you know what is waiting for you here.

If you chose not to come, we will understand.

[GreenSnapper]

It`s obvious that this American girl believes that men should abide by the unwritten rules of Western attitudes, what is considered decent and what is not, that every generation has they’re role to play and should never deviate from how they are expected to act.

Total rubbish in my opinion. She is just another feministic hi so decency freak preaching her so called moral standards to what she considers as the perverted over here.

She`s got it completely wrong, it`s not so cut and dry as she believes.

Live and let live is my motto, provided we are not doing any harm to others.

Bravo, Beetlejuice!

Btw, if you are an older Western guy of some fame - Rock star or actor or so, then nobody makes a fuss if your GF is 40 years younger. It just shows the hypocrisy of the unwritten "rules".

[Scott]

An off-topic, inflammatory post has been removed.

[Berkshire]

As far as the article writer's musings on farang men, she's right on several points but I think her lack of experience of one half of her heritage is obvious in some parts. Her generalization that Thai men are lazy, cheating drunks is seriously wide of the mark. It reads like grievances passed down from her mother or, perhaps, stories she's heard from other Thai women with a predilection for foreigners. The facts speak for themselves; if Thai women preferred farangs, there'd be a hell of a lot more "luk kreungs" hopping around.

As I said on another thread where the OP was seeking input with regard to impending nuptials with his Thai girlfriend, the overwhelming majority of Thai women would prefer a THAI man for obvious reasons including sharing same culture and language. Adolescent Thai girls don't fantasize about white or black men or pin posters of them on their walls; they have male idols who are distinctively Thai albeit covered with a couple of coats of Dulux Matt White emulsion.

From what I've seen, it is chiefly Thai women of a certain age who are, perhaps, raising one child or more alone that tend to give farang guys the green light since most financially-solid, respectable Thai men will be loathe to take on an over-ripe Thai woman and her spawn. Many farang guys, however, will.

This is a very accurate assessment of how things are in Thailand. +1 for accuracy and keen insight.

[farang000999]

i read this person's article and i would guess that it was written by a farang male. at no point did it feel like a female viewpoint or writing style. pretty sure it was just a troll saying that they were a woman. that said, there was hardly much controversy in the lines.

Edited December 13, 2011 by farang000999

[tonititan]

Btw, if you are an older Western guy of some fame - Rock star or actor or so, then nobody makes a fuss if your GF is 40 years younger. It just shows the hypocrisy of the unwritten "rules".

I don't necessarily think that's true. Celebrity couples of even 15, 20, 25 years difference often get gossiped about by the media and the general population. Just dig around a little online and you'll see that. And there's a lot of whispers, judging, and dirty looks that don't even make it onto news sites. The bigger the age difference, the worse the mocking. Look at Hugh Hefner and some of his ex-girlfriends who were 40-55 years younger than him....while some people might have thought "Go Hugh," a lot of other people seemed to find it disturbing. And Anna Nicole Smith with her rich old husband. I think that was a 60ish year age difference, but she got major ridicule for that. I know those are extreme cases, but I've certainly seen age differences that big here in Thailand at times.

I think that even in the West, when people see a 60 year old man with a 20 or 30 year old girl friend, most of them automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

[ludditeman]

I think that even in the West, when people see a 60 year old man with a 20 or 30 year old girl friend, most of them automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

I think anywhere in the world, when I see a man with his pretty girl friend, I automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

Why bring age or geography into the sentence.

[gregb]

The only problem I have with this essay is that the viewpoint is that of a luk kreung, raised with Western values. I'm sure she speaks and understands Thai and has Thai friends, but my experience with luk kruengs is that they don't capture the true Thai social values. She even admits she is Westernized. As such, I believe she misses the subtle issues that come up in any Thai/Farang relationship....chiefly that of money. Thais have a different view of it. In farangland (at least in the USA where I grew up), it is absolutely verboten for the most part to be asking family members for money. Everyone is expected to provide for themselves. That isn't to say you can't approach a relative in time of need or under extreme duress, but people are expected to provide for themselves.

The same is not true of Thailand, and this attitude creates much friction in mixed relationships. Need a new motorcycle to get to work but can't afford it? Ask the farang brother in law. Thai girl, wanting to be the good sister, dutifully passes on the request. After a couple of these the farang figures she must be a whore. Marrying a Thai woman, unless she is wealthy herself, will place you in a position of being expected to support the extended family to some degree, and that creates many conflicts. The woman may not be a whore, but her requests for money for the family, her expectations of receiving it, and a cultural bias that if you are a good man you will provide it, lead many to label all Thai women whores even if the relationship is not atypical for Thailand.

The most important part of finding a good Thai woman is to understand what her motivations are. Communication is absolutely essential if you are going to get past the problem. You can not have rigid Western values and find happiness in Thailand (unless you strictly go after Westernized luk kreungs who share your cultural biases.)

Be careful speaking with luk kreungs. Many of them know just enough about Thai culture to be dangerous, but they aren't necessarily Thai.

[farang000999]

it is strange how so many here think her view point is different than a middle class thai's.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Comes across as a bit of a bitter Western woman.

Shouldn't be any shortage of company for her when she moves here.

Or any shortage of bitter Western men, for that matter. One look at these pages shows that quite clearly.

Anyway, most of the OP was censored by the time I got to the topic, but I think someone has been trolling Stick's board. Already the name looks off: 'Look Krueng Ying' ?? That's not common Thai usage. If it is real then her Thai (and therefore likely her knowledge/opinion of Thailand) is about as relevant as most newbie forum members here. A Thai person might write 'Sao Look Krueng' or similar. Look Krueng Ying is just off, sorry.

He got quite the response though, I always kind of respect that.

[DocN]

Oooooooooh- kay, here we go again: a "good woman" doesn't smoke, doesn't drink, doesn't have sex before marriage, takes good care of your family , is polite...blah, blah and...oh yes...blah!

Sam bull- crab we here in the arch- catholic places in the west.

They don't dress "sexy"? Yep...a thai- woman who actually feels self confident and sexy about her body- plain disgusting!

BTW: I worked at Thai CC on Sathorn. 50% of the "good office women" there dress in extreme short skirts and high heels.

I like it and I might say: welcome to the 21st century!

[tonititan]

I think that even in the West, when people see a 60 year old man with a 20 or 30 year old girl friend, most of them automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

I think anywhere in the world, when I see a man with his pretty girl friend, I automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

Why bring age or geography into the sentence.

I only brought geography into the sentence in response to the previous poster, who was making the case that people only "make a fuss" of huge age differences in Thailand, but not in the west. As for age, that was the whole point of our conversation. If you think that pretty girls in the west only go for guys with money, regardless of age and other factors, then I'm sad for you, but know that your opinion will probably never change.

[gregb]

it is strange how so many here think her view point is different than a middle class thai's.

Depends on your definition of "middle class" I guess. A family earning 20,000 baht per month is middle class in Thailand. What many farangs here call middle class, most Thais would term wealthy.

The definition of words can sometimes be important in discussions like this. I would agree with your argument if you changed the word "middle class" to "upper middle class" or wealthy. There is little distinction between lower middle class and the relatively poor in Thailand. Distinctions only begin to appear with significant wealth.

[lovelaos]

I'm just glad I'm not married to the OP. Pretentious snob

[StreetCowboy]

I'm just glad I'm not married to the OP. Pretentious snob

not as glad as she is, though.

SC

[lovelaos]

I'm just glad I'm not married to the OP. Pretentious snob

not as glad as she is, though.

SC

[DP25]

am a half Thai, half American 28-year-old female. I've grown up in five different countries including Thailand, but was raised primarily western.

I stop read here

This are the views of a mid-class western woman, not the views of a Thai woman

I guarantee this was written by a white dude and not a woman at all. That entire reader submissions section of that site is a bizarre exercise in creative writing. This submission reads like a bunch of stereotypes some middle age white dude thinks after finally getting a chick who isn't a bar girl.

Edited December 13, 2011 by DP25

[Berkshire]

By the way, just noticed that this piece is from Feb 2003....

[473geo]

I think that even in the West, when people see a 60 year old man with a 20 or 30 year old girl friend, most of them automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

I think anywhere in the world, when I see a man with his pretty girl friend, I automatically assume it's all about money for her, pride for him.

Why bring age or geography into the sentence.

And a man with a not so pretty girlfriend? ...........falls into what category in the assumption range?

[Ulysses G.]

He has no taste. She has a lot of money. He is just plain desperate or is an average tourist from back home?

Edited December 13, 2011 by Ulysses G.

[pattayadingo]

There are lots of wonderful Thai women who want farang husbands. Every time I am there on vacation and women find out I have a farang boyfriend and live in the west, they ask me to help them find a husband. These women aren't hookers nor are they so very high class that you have to be very rich or handsome either. They are sweet everyday women that work in hair salons, restaurants, stores and travel agencies.

So very true. It's depressing how many westerners come here and marry whores when there are so many good Thai women (better looking and better morals) who would like to marry them. I think it's a combination of the guy's low self-esteem and a lack of understanding of Thai society and culture.

Although times are changing, "good" women don't go to bars, don't drink and don't smoke.

What nonsense! Although they don't go to "farang bars", many of them certainly love to party and drink and even smoke.

Agree 100%

[aehn]

wow, one of the worst posts I have read this year, this female clearly does not have a clue about anything.

And she says she goes to stickman in order to learn about Thailand!? roflmao

[doggie888888]

I'm just glad I'm not married to the OP. Pretentious snob

The original poster did not write the artricle, she merely posted the link. So why is the OP a pretentious snob? By all means tell us your reasons for disagreeing, don't just resort to flaming. It just makes the forum so tedious to come across childish name-calling.

:jap:

[lovelaos]

I'm just glad I'm not married to the OP. Pretentious snob

The original poster did not write the artricle, she merely posted the link. So why is the OP a pretentious snob? By all means tell us your reasons for disagreeing, don't just resort to flaming. It just makes the forum so tedious to come across childish name-calling.

:jap:

The person who wrote the article is the person I was refering to. I do apologise if I confused you. :jap: