Bangkok Bank Cannot Wire Baht To Hsbc Uk

[AbeSurd]

I'm a Brit and no banking expert. But I do my best to try and learn a little every now and then....

A few months ago, while back in the UK, I opened a Thai baht account with HSBC UK.

I returned to Thailand recently and today I decided to try an experiment, to see if I could wire Thai baht from my Bangkok Bank Thai baht account to my Thai baht account with HSBC UK.

I was interested to try this because Bangkok Bank had previously assured me I could wire Thai baht to a UK bank. On the other hand a couple of years ago some ThaiVisa posters - in particular 12DrinkMore - had warned me that whatever Thai banks said, it wouldn't happen: "You will not be able to transfer THB out of Thailand. The Thais convert it to the foreign currency before it leaves the shores. Believe me, I have tried and failed."

You can read more details on this thread I started 2 years ago:

http://www.thaivisa....to-a-thai-bank/

So today at midday I went to try out my experiment. I went along to my Bangkok Bank branch with my passbook and passport and filled out a form to wire a small amount of baht, as a test, from my Bangkok Bank Thai baht account to my HSBC-UK Thai baht account. Everything seemed okay. Yes, there were charges: a 300 baht ‘cover charge’ because I was sending baht and not converting it, plus a 400 baht ‘transfer fee’. No problem. Everything seemed fine, just as Bangkok Bank had said it would be 2 years earlier.

Then at 5pm I got a call from Bangkok Bank to say there was a problem and they couldn't do the transfer. They told me the problem is that they can’t send baht “because we no have Thai baht account with HSBC in UK”. I asked them which UK banks they did have a Thai baht account with. They said they'd have to call me back. 15 minutes later they called me back to say they only have Thai baht accounts in the UK with Barclays and Lloyds.

Ha ha. The funny thing is that I'm in process of moving my UK banking from Lloyds to HSBC because Lloyds told me they didn't do Thai baht accounts. And HSBC said they did.

So Bangkok Bank can have a Thai baht account with Lloyds but I can’t?? Ah, well, I'm just a little guy, I'm not a bank, I suppose it figures!

Question: I'm sure this comes down to my lack of understanding of how banking works, but why must Bangkok Bank have a Thai baht account with HSBC in order to send Thai baht to my HSBC Thai baht account? Is this a clearing bank issue?

Incidentally please understand I'm not knocking Bangkok Bank here, I generally find them to be very helpful. So if Ian or Dave from Bangkok Bank who post here sometimes could help explain I'd appreciate it.

In the meantime I nevertheless think: kudos to 12DrinkMore!

[chiang mai]

First of all, Bangkok Bank has a major branch in London thus there is no need for them to have another third party intermediary.

Secondly, I don not believe that we are allowed to transfer THB overseas and I think that's a function of the BOT regs, not BB, regardless of whatever excuses BB may come up with.

Finally, if it's not much of a personal question: why would you want to hold THB in London where the transfer in and transfer out charges are so high and you will never have any chance of getting a decent return on the deposited funds? Also, the currency conversion costs in the UK from THB to whatever will make an exchange there impractical, far better to hold THB in Hong Kong, if it's important to hold currency outside of Thailand.

[Pib]

The issue just may be simply restrictions on the transfer of funds out of Thailand, especially for foreigners. Other than certain transfers such as sale proceeds from a condo with the proper documentation, farangs generally have very limited reasons for transferring funds out of Thailand--Thailand likes your money a lot and wants to keep it here. A partial quote from the Bangkok Bank web site regarding transfer of funds out of Thailand which is based on Bank of Thailand regulations which applies to all Thai banks:

Partial Quote:

Funds can be transferred for any number of reasons, depending whether you are a Thai national or foreigner working in Thailand:

For Thai nationals

• Educational expenses
  
• Family support
  
• Living expenses
  
• Payment for goods
  
• Payment for services
  
• Travel expenses
  
• Personal expenses
  
• Gift
  
• Donation
  

For foreigners

• Salary repatriation
  

End Quote

[chiang mai]

Except the transferred funds (out) need to be in a foreign currency if over THB 50k equivalent, unless BOT approval received beforehand. Let's face it, non of the items on the list require payment in THB overseas.

[AbeSurd]

First of all, Bangkok Bank has a major branch in London thus there is no need for them to have another third party intermediary.

Ah, Kun Chiang Mai again. Hello, thank you for your input. I don't know what you mean by 'another third part intermediary'. FWIW: as of the last time I spoke to them, the London branch of BKKB only deals with business accounts - as I'm sure you're aware. Unlike the USA branch, it won't deal with personal 'little guy' accounts. So, as far as I can see, BKKB London is of no use to me at all.

Secondly, I don not believe that we are allowed to transfer THB overseas and I think that's a function of the BOT regs, not BB, regardless of whatever excuses BB may come up with.

Well, that's exactly what I was testing. Bangkok Bank told me - more than once - that I COULD wire baht. And today they even filled out the forms for me! Even now they seem to be suggesting if I had a Thai baht account with Barclays UK or Lloyds UK I might be able to wire baht.

Finally, if it's not much of a personal question: why would you want to hold THB in London where the transfer in and transfer out charges are so high and you will never have any chance of getting a decent return on the deposited funds? Also, the currency conversion costs in the UK from THB to whatever will make an exchange there impractical, far better to hold THB in Hong Kong, if it's important to hold currency outside of Thailand.

I thought this would come up. Not really relevant to my post but here goes....

Okay. You're correct that I get no interest on the funds and HSBC charge me a £5 a month fee. Are the transfer charges high? I think it's £30 to wire to Thailand? £8 to receive funds (this is purely theoretical anyway, HA HA HA)? Look at those figures: I think it depends how often you transfer as to whether you consider them high. A transfer once a year? Not high, I think.

Why in the UK? (1) Because, to me, the world banking system seems to be on an absolute precipice that ain't going away and just seems to get worse. (2) Because I'm a Brit and my Thai baht funds in the UK are covered by the UK government guarantee. You may feel the reference to the UK guarantee is laughable in the current global climate but I nevertheless feel I can assess that in terms of risk better than, say, Hong Kong. As I said to you before: in the current climate I'm not interested in the return ON my capital, I'm interested in the return OF my capital.

Besides, is there a Hong Kong guarantee? And, if there is, in the event of a total global meltdown would you - as a Brit - trust it more than the UK one?

What bank interest do Hong Kong pay on a baht account anyway?

Thank you for your input!

[chiang mai]

Let's take the BB London issue first: if a branch of BB in Thailand wants to transit funds to a foreign country it needs to have a clearing bank in that country, since BB already has a branch in London it can act as its own clearer before transferring the (theoretical) funds to HSBC London.

Second point on BB London: whist it may wish to sell itself as purely a business branch of BB, it does in fact transact quite extensively on the retail front also. UK holders of BB Thailand accounts can transfer GBP between Thailand and the UK using BB London and that's a well trodden path. So yes, BB London will deal with us little guys if pressed.

So BB Thailand (where ever) thinks it's OK to transfer THB out of the country and they even filled out the forms for you to do this? I'm not a gambling man but I'd be prepared to make an exception here and wager that BB doesn't know what it's talking about on this point and that if you push them they will realize they can't actually transfer THB out - perhaps ask them about the detailed BOT regulations on this point and see what happens!

I agree with your point about spreading your cash and putting as much as you can into safe havens, interestingly I'm doing the same thing at present but in reverse! My UK HSBC account is full and I've taken excess GBP and put it into THB (and others), I've spread the THB around three Thai banks at 2.5 and 2.7% instant access and made sure that no one bank has more than THB 650k of my money - that keeps me under the THAI compensation scheme levels and also ensures that no tax is deducted at source (max interest before tax deducted is THB 20k).

Finally, HSBC HK: whilst I realize that the financial world is a currently little more than a pyramid of dominoes that could collapse at any time, I reckon HSBC HK will be the last piece to fall and in that respect it's very very safe. Yes there are financial security guarantees offered by the government and whilst I don't recall immediately what they are, they're certainly higher than the UK's.

[chiang mai]

Just one further thought on the subject of moving money to the UK in order to protect it in the event of a financial collapse: it's looking increasingly likely that borders will be closed in the event of a banking/Euro collapse and that the UK in particular will restrict the movement of currency in and out. There's a risk therefore that if you place your money within the UK that you may not be able to get it out!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/8976204/Treasury-plans-for-euro-failure.html

[AbeSurd]

Just one further thought on the subject of moving money to the UK in order to protect it in the event of a financial collapse: it's looking increasingly likely that borders will be closed in the event of a banking/Euro collapse and that the UK in particular will restrict the movement of currency in and out. There's a risk therefore that if you place your money within the UK that you may not be able to get it out!

http://www.telegraph...ro-failure.html

Yes, fair enough. But this would probably be a worldwide crisis, so what if Hong Kong's borders were closed? I'd much rather have my money trapped in the UK.

[lopburi3]

I'd much rather have my money trapped in the UK.

In Baht currency - what could you use it for? The only country it could possibly be of value would be Thailand; and in a total meltdown it would be next to worthless even here.

[chiang mai]

It's all about risk and probability I think, the risk that the UK and Sterling will be negatively impacted by a Euro collapse is high and the probability is very likely. The likelihood that Hong Kong or Thailand and their respective currencies will be negatively affected, to the extent that local banks would collapse and borders closed, has to be quite low. Having said those things it's probably not a bad strategy to spread the risk as far and wide as possible, but I certainly wouldn't want to have all my eggs in a UK basket.

[panork]

Chiang Mai

Why do you think that no tax is deducted for interest payments totalling less than 20k Baht annually(?).

I have fixed deposit accounts and tax has always been deducted irrespective of the amount involved.

Edited December 28, 2011 by panork

[chiang mai]

Chiang Mai

Why do you think that no tax is deducted for interest payments totalling less than 20k Baht annually(?).

I have fixed deposit accounts and tax has always been deducted irrespective of the amount involved.

L&H Bank, Kasikorn and SCB in Chiang Mai have all agreed this is the case - in the event that it urns out in practice to not be the case I will simply (ha) reclaim the tax paid through the tax authorities, although I have confidence it will work.

I have three Thai accounts that pay interest and I keep each of them below the THB20k interest level per year so that means about THB 700k at 2.7%. If I were you I would go have a chat with your bank(s) about this aspect.

[chiang mai]

Chiang Mai

Why do you think that no tax is deducted for interest payments totalling less than 20k Baht annually(?).

I have fixed deposit accounts and tax has always been deducted irrespective of the amount involved.

L&H Bank, Kasikorn and SCB in Chiang Mai have all agreed this is the case - in the event that it urns out in practice to not be the case I will simply (ha) reclaim the tax paid through the tax authorities, although I have confidence it will work.

I have three Thai accounts that pay interest and I keep each of them below the THB20k interest level per year so that means about THB 700k at 2.7%. If I were you I would go have a chat with your bank(s) about this aspect.

I forgot to add to the above:

The above is only true of "Resident" accounts and is NOT true where the account is a fixed rate/term, account, the HSBC statement on this subject is:

"it's true however it applies only resident savings type of account. On Term deposit type, it is still subject to tax on any amount of interest".

.

[panork]

That does clarify the matter, and is my understanding as well. Nevertheless, I also understand that tax deducted from interest paid on term deposit accounts may be reclaimed. But I have not attempted to do that.

Happy New Year

Edited December 28, 2011 by panork

[chiang mai]

That does clarify the matter, and is my understanding as well. Nevertheless, I also understand that tax deducted from interest paid on term deposit accounts may be reclaimed. But I have not attempted to do that.

Happy New Year

Yes that is true, it can be reclaimed from the tax folks.

[IMA_FARANG]

I could be wrong but I suspect that your problem regarding transfering Thai Baht from your BBK Baht account in Thailand to a Thai Baht account with HSBC account in London is not the transfer...it's with you not documenting the source of the Baht funds, and not being able to show that any proof that any required Thai taxes were first paid on those funds.

The fact that it is only a small amount, and that any sum less than xxxxx baht or (whatever figure) baht may be exempted from Thai tax...your real problem is that you haven't demonstrated that yet to the Thai tax people.

I/m guessing that, if you find the right people, and they agree that no Thai tax is in fact required on your Thai Baht transfer...all your transfer problems will magically go away.

Until then, you're not going to be able to make such transfers...no matter what reason the bank or banks use to explain why your transfer can't be made.

Back in 1979, when I first came to Thailand I had a dollar denominated account with the then Thai branch of Chase Manhatten bank, New York which was then located in Bangkok, Siam Square.

With that account I could:

1. deposit money in New York and withdraw that money from the Bangkok Branch in dollars...no bank fee.

2. deposit dollars in the Bangkok Branch and withdraw it in New York....no bank fee

3 deposit Baht in New York, and witdraw that in baht in Bangkok...no bank fee.

4.deposit dollars in New York, and withdraw those funds in baht in Bangkok..no fee, but had to accept the daily dollar/baht exchange rate when I withdrew the funds in Baht in Thailand...(i.e. as if I had just walked in with dollar cash and wanted to exchange it for baht).

The one thing I could NOT do was:

Deposit baht in Bangkok and withdraw the funds in New York in dollars.

I was told this was because of the Thai tax laws...I had to prove the source of my baht and prove I had paid the required Thai tax on those funds (if required).

I only did this once (I had sold a computer, was paid in baht, and had a signed reciept from the purchaser).

To get the bank supplied form signed I had to go to the Thai tax people...the bank told me where...and have them sign and stamp that form.

Once that form was signed, the bank accepted it and sent to my baht account in New York in baht.

But until that tax clearance form was signed and stamped...I could not transfer baht from my Bangkok account to my New York account.

The laws have changed now, there is no longer a Chase Manhatten Bank in that building in Siam Square, but I'm willing to bet it's still impossible to send Thai baht outside Thailand...even to another baht account without that Thai tax clearance...however you get it today.

[Daveroc]

Abesurb,

i think most of your queries have been answered. There are no restrictions from the BOT as to which currency is used to transfer the funds offshore. The restriction comes from the reason to transfer and the source of the funds.

You have been informed that we can only send to three banks in the UK including our own office which is used to transfer funds through. We do not offer bank accounts at a number of our offshore branches and this is as much to do with the terms of our banking licences in these countries as it is to our commitment of resouces. To gain a full banking licence and then establish the infrastructure required to open and maintain accounts is a major exercise.

We have some two thousand banking relationships around the world. We open accounts with Banks where there is a demand for service generally from Importers and Exporters.

We look at the demand as to which types of currency accounts we open at these overseas Banks.Pretty much the same as an individual decides how many banks they will operate through. Banks then look at the demand of their customer base as to which foreign currency accounts they will offer to customers. In Thailand we offer 14 foreign currency accounts. However, because the thai Baht is not that activiely traded away from Thailand I suspect not many banks offer a THB account service.

[chiang mai]

Is it not the case that "the reason for transfer" is in fact a statement from BOT that THB cannot be transferred out? I understand that there is a list of allowable reasons for Thai nationals to send money overseas and most require an invoice of some sort, logically no overseas invoice would be billed in THB. So when you say there is no BOT rule about which currency is used for overseas transmission, the reality is that any currency is OK, except THB.

Also, the above seems to mesh with the BOT rules whereby no more than THB 50K (I believe) can be carried out of the country without BOT approval.

Also, when you hint that BB London does not offer retail services in the UK, it is true that BB Thailand offers Sterling denominated cheques drawn on BB London which are an effective method of transferring funds between the two countries, at the retail level..

Edited December 28, 2011 by chiang mai

[AbeSurd]

In Baht currency - what could you use it for? The only country it could possibly be of value would be Thailand;

I could always convert it back to sterling.

and in a total meltdown it would be next to worthless even here.

If the baht became worthless even in Thailand then it would probably be time for me to head back to the UK for good!!

[AbeSurd]

I could be wrong but I suspect that your problem regarding transfering Thai Baht from your BBK Baht account in Thailand to a Thai Baht account with HSBC account in London is not the transfer...it's with you not documenting the source of the Baht funds, and not being able to show that any proof that any required Thai taxes were first paid on those funds.

The fact that it is only a small amount, and that any sum less than xxxxx baht or (whatever figure) baht may be exempted from Thai tax...your real problem is that you haven't demonstrated that yet to the Thai tax people.....

The source of the funds is documented. Bangkok Bank know that the money I'm trying to wire back to the UK originally came directly to them from one of my sterling bank accounts in the UK.

So the Thai taxman is not the issue. (Incidentally I'm retired here, I don't work in Thailand.)

In my OP I provide a link to another thread that explains more about all this.

[AbeSurd]

Also, the above seems to mesh with the BOT rules whereby no more than THB 50K (I believe) can be carried out of the country without BOT approval.

The test amount I was trying to send from Bangkok Bank to HSBC-UK was only 5000 baht!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

The issue just may be simply restrictions on the transfer of funds out of Thailand, especially for foreigners. Other than certain transfers such as sale proceeds from a condo with the proper documentation, farangs generally have very limited reasons for transferring funds out of Thailand--Thailand likes your money a lot and wants to keep it here. A partial quote from the Bangkok Bank web site regarding transfer of funds out of Thailand which is based on Bank of Thailand regulations which applies to all Thai banks:

Partial Quote:

Funds can be transferred for any number of reasons, depending whether you are a Thai national or foreigner working in Thailand:

For Thai nationals

• Educational expenses
  
• Family support
  
• Living expenses
  
• Payment for goods
  
• Payment for services
  
• Travel expenses
  
• Personal expenses
  
• Gift
  
• Donation
  

For foreigners

• Salary repatriation
  

End Quote

Pib, the language you're quoting above from BKK Bank pertains to their requirements for using their online banking system to send funds abroad... where you basically have to get pre-approved.

That's a different process than doing a traditional wire transfer, where you go into the branch and fill out paperwork, etc etc... They have a different description and requirement for the wire transfers route.

Supporting document (Thai citizens – A document stating the purpose of the fund transfer; Foreigners - A document stating the source of the income).

I've never done a traditional wire transfer out of Thailand. But I do believe it's possible, even if the funds are not sourced from salary earned inside Thailand.

But that aside, if there has been some clear answer provided to the OP here, I'm not sure what it's been. I've read a lot of back and forth above... but nothing that seems to settle the issue.

I couldn't tell whether the underlying problem here for the OP is his attempt to wire Thai baht from Thailand into a Thai baht account in the UK....or separately, whether he was simply having a problem providing the basic documentation required for a normal outbound wire transfer.

[AbeSurd]

I've never done a traditional wire transfer out of Thailand. But I do believe it's possible, even if the funds are not sourced from salary earned inside Thailand.

In my OP I provide a link to another thread. There I explain how two years ago Siam Commercial assured me I could repatriate the money I had sent over from the UK for my living expenses here in Thailand - just so long as I didn't move the money out of my account(s) with Siam Commercial. However Siam Commercial told me I could only send it back as sterling. Whereas at the same time Bangkok Bank gave me the same assurance, but added that I could send the money back as baht, if I wanted to. It's this assurance from Bangkok Bank that I was trying to test last week.

But that aside, if there has been some clear answer provided to the OP here, I'm not sure what it's been. I've read a lot of back and forth above... but nothing that seems to settle the issue.

I agree! However I get the impression from the post from Dave from Bangkok Bank that the issue may lie with Bangkok Bank London. It seems to me that Bangkok Bank London do not or will not act as a clearing bank in matters like these. It was a test so I was only trying to send back 5000 baht. Maybe it's too much trouble for them for such a small amount of money. I don't know.

I couldn't tell whether the underlying problem here for the OP is his attempt to wire Thai baht from Thailand into a Thai baht account in the UK....or separately, whether he was simply having a problem providing the basic documentation required for a normal outbound wire transfer.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'basic documentation'? Bangkok Bank didn't ask for any documentation. They know I sent the original money over from one of my sterling accounts in the UK ("purpose - living expenses"), the records are in their computer systems. They know the money then stayed in one of my baht accounts at Bangkok Bank. Now I want to send some of it back to the UK, preferably as baht! But I can't! End of story.

This is exactly as 12DrinkMore predicted two years ago in the previous thread (link in my OP).

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

You're getting at the basic question I raised above.....

BKK Bank obviously is saying NO to you as regards your particular request in this instance...

But I can't tell from what you've recounted whether what they're saying NO to is:

A. sending any international wire transfer with your funds and situation. [There seemed to be some suggestion in the info above that you wouldn't be having the same problem if you were trying to send into a UK sterling or pounds or whatever account (instead of into a HSBC THB UK account).]

or

B. only sending an international wire in THB from BKK Bank Thailand, as you'd sought to do, to a THB account with HSBC in the UK.

A is a broad and general funds transfer practice. B is a specific bank to a specific bank transfer in one specific currency that you desire. Just because you're having trouble with B doesn't mean that A isn't do-able.

My reference to "documentation" above is exactly what BKK Bank lists on their web site for sending international wire transfers outbound from Thailand.

Foreigners - A document stating the source of the income.

I've never done an outbound wire transfer with BKKB, so I don't personally know what kind of document their web site is referring to.

http://www.bangkokbank.com/Bangkok%20Bank/Personal%20Banking/Transfering%20Funds/Transferring%20out%20of%20Thailand/Pages/How%20to%20transfer%20funds%20overseas.aspx

But the fact they have an info page on the subject of sending outbound wire transfers, and it isn't limited to just repatriating Thailand-earned salary by farangs, would seem to suggest it's possible to arrange such wire transfers through them.

[AbeSurd]

But I can't tell from what you've recounted whether what they're saying NO to is:

A. sending any international wire transfer with your funds and situation. [There seemed to be some suggestion in the info above that you wouldn't be having the same problem if you were trying to send into a UK sterling or pounds or whatever account (instead of into a HSBC THB UK account).]

or

B. only sending an international wire in THB from BKK Bank Thailand, as you'd sought to do, to a THB account with HSBC in the UK.

They're saying NO to B.

I haven't tested them with repatriating my money as sterling. Yet!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I'm not entirely sure...but what DaveRoc from BKK Bank may have been getting at above, is something like...

Yes, BKK Bank has a London branch, but for the average Joe, it's really just a pass-through branch for purposes of UK to Thailand funds transfers.... You send from another UK bank, it goes thru the BKK Bank London Branch, and then onward to your BKK Bank account in Thailand.

But on the reverse direction, and I'm just guessing here, you can't as a UK citizen have a BKK Bank account based at the London branch, and presumably they don't offer retail banking services there.... As in, you can't just walk in, go up to a counter and say, OK, I'm here to pick up my wire transfer funds sent from Thailand.

If the analogy helps at all, BKK Bank also has a branch office in New York. Americans can't have accounts there and they don't do retail banking there. But Americans can wire transfer funds from their U.S. bank via the BKK Bank New York Branch and then onward to their BKK Bank Thailand account.

But, likewise in the reverse direction, Americans can't wire transfer funds from Thailand direct to the BKKB New York branch and then onward to their regular U.S. bank accounts. However, they ought to be able to wire transfer funds from a BKK Bank account in Thailand to a specified U.S. bank account by sending dollars that are converted from baht en route.

[chiang mai]

I'm not entirely sure...but what DaveRoc from BKK Bank may have been getting at above, is something like...

Yes, BKK Bank has a London branch, but for the average Joe, it's really just a pass-through branch for purposes of UK to Thailand funds transfers.... You send from another UK bank, it goes thru the BKK Bank London Branch, and then onward to your BKK Bank account in Thailand.

But on the reverse direction, and I'm just guessing here, you can't as a UK citizen have a BKK Bank account based at the London branch, and presumably they don't offer retail banking services there.... As in, you can't just walk in, go up to a counter and say, OK, I'm here to pick up my wire transfer funds sent from Thailand.

That is exactly the way it works and the US branch is almost identical in terms of its operation. BB does not have a retail banking license in either location but that does not prevent it acting as a clearer.

Edited January 1, 2012 by chiang mai

[ianguygil]

I've been letting this one run while busy but maybe this can help.

Only a small number of banks in the UK offer THB accounts.

Our normal business is for us to be the THB counterparty in funds transfers and we setup our correspondent relationships to ensure that this works well in most countries in the world. I wrote a whole explanation a few years ago about how correspondent accounts work, also known as Due To/Due From or Nostro/Vostro.

So normally for inbound transfers we are receiving funds in other currencies and converting these to THB for final credit either to a BBL account or to an account with another Thai bank (in which case we would be an intermediary bank). So we would receive the foreign funds in our Due From account (in the case of the UK probably GPB) and we would credit to a THB account in Thailand.

For outbound transfers we are normally sending funds by crediting THB to a Due To account for one of our Correspondents overseas and asking them to credit a foreign currency to one of their account holders, or to an account holder at another bank in their country (in which case they are the intermediary bank).

So asking us to transfer THB to a THB account in the UK is not a "standard" transaction. While it can be done, it is not usual. It is up to each bank to decide what accounts they offer in which currencies, but THB is not a major international trading currency. As discussed before, an account is a promise to pay a certain amount in a certain currency on a certain date with certain conditions (interest rate, maturity dates etc.). So they UK banks who offer THB account almost definitely do this by keeping an aggregate account with a Thai bank (Due From from their perspective, Due To from the Thai bank perspective).

We are the largest THB correspondent. As Dave said we have thousands of Correspondent relationships, it is possible that for THB that HSBC is not one of them, while the other 3 UK banks mentioned are. So this would explain why we cannot transfer THB to them, while we could transfer GPB to them (via an intermediary in the UK if they are not a Correspondent).

So, assuming for now that HSBC is not a correspondent (I have not taken the time to check this) the path would be BBL credits THB to the Due To for UK Bank A and sends a SWIFT instruction to UK Bank A asking them to credit xxx GBP to HSBC in the UK, they will do this via the local clearing system in the UK. So UK Bank A is our Intermediary.

Please note that the same cannot be done for THB as you cannot clear this currency via CHAPS or BACS or the newer payment system in the UK.

I hope this makes sense. If you need more of my time on this please PM me and I will do this via email. You can post whatever you want. Thank you.

As for all the other opinions about what we can do in our London branch, some are pretty far off. You can open an account. It is insured by the FSCS insurance scheme (like the FDIC in the UK) and it is available to both business and individual customers. Most people don't do this as it is not so easy to access your money via ATM etc, but it is a service offered.

http://www.bangkokbank.com/Bangkok%20Bank/About%20Bangkok%20Bank/About%20Us/International%20Branches/Pages/Branch%20in%20UK.aspx

Important Information about Compensation Arrangements

Bangkok Bank (London Branch) is covered by the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS). The FSCS can pay compensation to depositors if a bank is unable to meet its financial obligations.

Most depositors - including most individuals and small businesses - are covered by the scheme.

In respect of deposits, an eligible depositor is entitled to claim up to £85,000.00. For joint accounts each account holder is treated as having a claim in respect of their share so, for a joint account held by two eligible depositors, the maximum amount that could be claimed would be £85,000.00 each (making a total of £170,000.00). The £85,000.00 limit relates to the combined amount in all the eligible depositor's accounts with the bank, including their share of any joint account, and not to each separate account.

For further information about the scheme (including the amounts covered and eligibility to claim) please refer to the FSCS website www.FSCS.org.uk

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

As for all the other opinions about what we can do in our London branch, some are pretty far off. You can open an account. It is insured by the FSCS insurance scheme (like the FDIC in the UK) and it is available to both business and individual customers. Most people don't do this as it is not so easy to access your money via ATM etc, but it is a service offered.

http://www.bangkokba...%20in%20UK.aspx

That's interesting.... So the London operation is significantly different than the New York branch in that regard.

[chiang mai]

I've been letting this one run while busy but maybe this can help.

Only a small number of banks in the UK offer THB accounts.

Our normal business is for us to be the THB counterparty in funds transfers and we setup our correspondent relationships to ensure that this works well in most countries in the world. I wrote a whole explanation a few years ago about how correspondent accounts work, also known as Due To/Due From or Nostro/Vostro.

So normally for inbound transfers we are receiving funds in other currencies and converting these to THB for final credit either to a BBL account or to an account with another Thai bank (in which case we would be an intermediary bank). So we would receive the foreign funds in our Due From account (in the case of the UK probably GPB) and we would credit to a THB account in Thailand.

For outbound transfers we are normally sending funds by crediting THB to a Due To account for one of our Correspondents overseas and asking them to credit a foreign currency to one of their account holders, or to an account holder at another bank in their country (in which case they are the intermediary bank).

So asking us to transfer THB to a THB account in the UK is not a "standard" transaction. While it can be done, it is not usual. It is up to each bank to decide what accounts they offer in which currencies, but THB is not a major international trading currency. As discussed before, an account is a promise to pay a certain amount in a certain currency on a certain date with certain conditions (interest rate, maturity dates etc.). So they UK banks who offer THB account almost definitely do this by keeping an aggregate account with a Thai bank (Due From from their perspective, Due To from the Thai bank perspective).

We are the largest THB correspondent. As Dave said we have thousands of Correspondent relationships, it is possible that for THB that HSBC is not one of them, while the other 3 UK banks mentioned are. So this would explain why we cannot transfer THB to them, while we could transfer GPB to them (via an intermediary in the UK if they are not a Correspondent).

So, assuming for now that HSBC is not a correspondent (I have not taken the time to check this) the path would be BBL credits THB to the Due To for UK Bank A and sends a SWIFT instruction to UK Bank A asking them to credit xxx GBP to HSBC in the UK, they will do this via the local clearing system in the UK. So UK Bank A is our Intermediary.

Please note that the same cannot be done for THB as you cannot clear this currency via CHAPS or BACS or the newer payment system in the UK.

I hope this makes sense. If you need more of my time on this please PM me and I will do this via email. You can post whatever you want. Thank you.

As for all the other opinions about what we can do in our London branch, some are pretty far off. You can open an account. It is insured by the FSCS insurance scheme (like the FDIC in the UK) and it is available to both business and individual customers. Most people don't do this as it is not so easy to access your money via ATM etc, but it is a service offered.

http://www.bangkokba...%20in%20UK.aspx

Important Information about Compensation Arrangements

Bangkok Bank (London Branch) is covered by the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS). The FSCS can pay compensation to depositors if a bank is unable to meet its financial obligations.

Most depositors - including most individuals and small businesses - are covered by the scheme.

In respect of deposits, an eligible depositor is entitled to claim up to £85,000.00. For joint accounts each account holder is treated as having a claim in respect of their share so, for a joint account held by two eligible depositors, the maximum amount that could be claimed would be £85,000.00 each (making a total of £170,000.00). The £85,000.00 limit relates to the combined amount in all the eligible depositor's accounts with the bank, including their share of any joint account, and not to each separate account.

For further information about the scheme (including the amounts covered and eligibility to claim) please refer to the FSCS website www.FSCS.org.uk

Did your collegue Daveroc not tell us that the UK did not have a retail license and by implication, cannot open retail accounts?

"We do not offer bank accounts at a number of our offshore branches and this is as much to do with the terms of our banking licences in these countries as it is to our commitment of resouces. To gain a full banking licence and then establish the infrastructure required to open and maintain accounts is a major exercise".