8 Professions To Face Tough Competition From Foreigners: Thailand

[livinthailandos]

Here is a website that contains a PDF file that actually lists the Labor Divisions Across Hotel Services & Travel Services regarding the ASEAN Tourism Professionals Keep in mind its from january 2011, If you open the pdf file and click on page 51 you will see it listed

www.aseansec.org/documents/ATSP%202011-2015.pdf

Front Office

a. Front Office Manager

b. Front Office Supervisor

c. Receptionist

d. Telephone Operator

e. Bell Boy

Housekeeping

a. Executive Housekeeper

b. Laundry Manager

c. Floor Supervisor

d. Laundry Attendant

e. Room Attendant

f. Public Area Cleaner

Food Production

a. Executive Chef

b. Demi Chef

c. Comms Chef

d. Chef de Partie

Food and Beverage Services

F & B Director

F & B outlet Manager

Head Waiter

Bartender

Waiter

Travel Agencies

General Manager

Assistant General Manager

Senior Travel Consultant

Travel Consultant

Tour Operation

Product Manager

Sales and Marketing Manager

Credit Manager

Ticketing Manager

Tour Manager

sorry for the long list Just wanted to point it out though

[punisher]

i take exception to this persons statement about nurses pay soaring. My wife was a nurse for 17 years and there has been no increase in salary for 10 years. And even now is only 15,000 bht a month! could you live on that?. They do the work but the Doctors get the big money. About 80,000 bht a month!

our accounting gets 8000 bht per month and she can live on that. Motorbike guys get 6000 Baht and can live with that

I think you should rephrase the statement to 'survive' on 8000bht per month. At that income level that's all your doing, surviving hand to mouth. I bet many of the motorbike guys, especially in central bangkok get more like 60'000 a month. In the provinces perhaps 6'000 is a good estimate.

and why do they work for me for 6K?

As well we frequently rent the motorbike guys from the soi and it costs usually 300-800 Baht for all the day driving, incl. the gasoline.

So why would they work for me if they can make more than 2000 per day in central Bangkok.

Recall the minimum salary in Thailand is approx. 200 Baht/day in Bangkok and it is a big issue that many companies pay less than the minimum.

there is no accounting working for 8000bt,hmm 200 minimum is for factory workers,kfc,bla bla with out a bachelor degree,nobody in bkk with a bachelor degree works for 200bt a day

[NaithanWeigh]

According to National Statistics Office Thailand http://web.nso.go.th/ the average Monthly income per household Was 23,544 Baht (6 Month Of Yr.2011). The average household size is around 4, which makes the average income around 8,000 which seems about right to me.

[housepainter]

The Professionals World Wide:

doctors, dentists, nurses, engineers, architects, accountants and surveyors.

Thai style Professionals:

receptionists, laundry attendants, tour guides, cleaners and more.

I can only hazard a guess at the 'more' part: toilet attendants, rat-catchers, bin men, street sweepers and sewerage workers.

Thank god somebody's got to do it.

Some body else.

[pepi2005]

It is easy to tell and doesn't need expensive studies to tell which jobs will face tough competition:

it's the professions where better English than only primary school level is required.

I can already see the influx of Malaysian, Filipino, well today even Cambodian (!) workers,

competing with speechless (pun intended) Thais - and leaving them behind...

Yeah, like usual Thailand will try to protect its market with as many obstacles and bureaucratic

hurdles as possible, but regardless of that, the country (or better: the people!) will pay a high

price for centuries of intentional low-standard education.

Not even the elite seems to understand that the low standard of education they grant to the masses,

the corruption they allow and contribute to, and the bureaucracy they impose on the people who want

to make a living here (especially foreigners) also reduces their own long-term profit.

Edited January 17, 2012 by pepi2005

[Pseudolus]

"To date, most foreigners fail the test because of language/cultural barriers," Somsak said.

Based on this protectionist statement, they will only allow in those that do not pose a threat to Thai nationals. So basically, if you are really bad at your job, and you can not find work in Malaysia etc, then as long as you are worse than the worse Thai Doctor you will get through the door. If you might upset the status quo, then Sorry, your Thai language is not good enough OR, said to the fluent thai speak "culturally you do not make the grade". Mean while, all the exceptional Thai doctors of which their are many will find a home paying 10x as much up the road somewhere.

[somo]

i take exception to this persons statement about nurses pay soaring. My wife was a nurse for 17 years and there has been no increase in salary for 10 years. And even now is only 15,000 bht a month! could you live on that?. They do the work but the Doctors get the big money. About 80,000 bht a month!

our accounting gets 8000 bht per month and she can live on that. Motorbike guys get 6000 Baht and can live with that

I think you should rephrase the statement to 'survive' on 8000bht per month. At that income level that's all your doing, surviving hand to mouth. I bet many of the motorbike guys, especially in central bangkok get more like 60'000 a month. In the provinces perhaps 6'000 is a good estimate.

No motorcycle taxi driver makes more than 20,000 baht after expenses (mostly gas costs).

I've done the calculations in my neighborhood (Bangkok), and it is not possible, unless he works 30 days a month, 12 hours per day.

Most of them will make in the range of 10-15 thousand per month after expenses.

One extra expense is the 100-150 Baht/day they all pay the police for the privelage of working! Most of their rides pay just 20 Baht so they would need 50/day just to gross 1000Baht. None of them get that many rides. My brother in law does it occasionally when he has no other work and takes home about 200 Baht sometimes less.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I'd agree about the earlier poster's comment about the OP article being wrong about "soaring" salaries for nurses in Thailand.

Likewise, my wife works as a nurse's assistant at a large private hospital in BKK, and worked at several private and public hospitals prior. And while I can't speak about the doctors, the nurse and nurse assistant's salaries certainly haven't been soaring in the years I've known her.

[kevinellerton]

Hey guys, maybe you can help me with this.

I am currently working on earning an MD (medical doctorate) in the USA.

I lived in Thailand last year and I loved it. Since then, my plan has been to get my MD in the USA and then move back to Thailand to practice. I have heard from many sources that USA-trained MDs who work in Thailand make a lot lot lot of money (because of low insurance/tax ratio, high fees from private hospitals, and western fees from western insurance companies for western patients).

I am good with languages and pretty good with Thai already so I'm not too worried about passing the boards.

HOW WILL THIS ASEAN THING AFFECT SALARIES FOR AMERICAN TRAINED DOCTORS IN SE ASIA?

Does it mean I will face more competiton because of influx of malaysians? Or does it mean I will make a higher salary because the thai gvt needs to incentivize doctors to stay in Thailand? Does this "free trade" thing mean I will be able to switch between Thailand, Cambodia and Vietnam if I want to?

You guys seem pretty knowledgeable about this stuff so I hope you can clarify this for me. Thanks in advance.

[Skywalker69]

What is the average Thai policeman's wage per month, I hear it is between 8000 and 10,000 Baht.

Tea-money not included.

[TackyToo]

The knock on effect of this will be a mass exit of Proffessionals from Thailand which in turn will mean that in order to keep them here salaries will have to increase which in turn will raise taxes etc and Thailand with become either a very expensive place to live or have an economic melt down providing the latter won't have already happened by 2015, all in all it just looks pretty bad no matter how you look at it.

I take a wild guess and predict it is the second part of your opinion taking place. Why? Just have a look at what big shots in the industry have to say about the plan to get involved in Myanmar:

Tanit Sorat, vice-chairman of the Federation of Thai Industries, said:

"I think Dawei could be an option for Thai investors," Mr Tanit said, citing such upstream industries as oil and gas or steel to be developed there, plus the need to relocate to flood-free areas and away from the planned hike of the minimum daily wage to 300 baht.

Is the guy talking about a couple of Thai manufacturer or does this include the global players? At least Thai politicians will get their share of the moving costs.

This happened after they lured the buffalos to vote for them by making bogus promisses.

And the guy’s dream went on with this quote:

"By the time Dawei is in operation, industries in Thailand will be much more advanced than today," he said. "Thailand will move away from heavy industries such as petrochemicals and leave them to neighbouring countries."

Thailand will be much more advanced, while the other countries go back to dark ages?

In my opinion Thailand, with it's unrealistic ambitions is moving away from the AEC's dinner table before the others enjoy a superb dessert!

Edited January 17, 2012 by TackyToo

[w11guy]

i take exception to this persons statement about nurses pay soaring. My wife was a nurse for 17 years and there has been no increase in salary for 10 years. And even now is only 15,000 bht a month! could you live on that?. They do the work but the Doctors get the big money. About 80,000 bht a month!

You think 80,000 baht is big money? LOL.

[KeyserSoze01]

"This is the eighth profession," Singhadej said. In the tourism industry, "professionals" will include receptionists, laundry attendants, tour guides, cleaners and more."

Since when are laundry attendants and maids considered professional?

Once the agreements are signed and in place, look for the Thai government to renege on a case-by-case basis.

[TackyToo]

"To date, most foreigners fail the test because of language/cultural barriers," Somsak said.

Based on this protectionist statement, they will only allow in those that do not pose a threat to Thai nationals. So basically, if you are really bad at your job, and you can not find work in Malaysia etc, then as long as you are worse than the worse Thai Doctor you will get through the door. If you might upset the status quo, then Sorry, your Thai language is not good enough OR, said to the fluent thai speak "culturally you do not make the grade". Mean while, all the exceptional Thai doctors of which their are many will find a home paying 10x as much up the road somewhere.

Even if a backpacker, on his one day visit takes the stage at an open mic event it is considered "working without a workpermit." They will always find a way to block farrangs from working here. After too many professionals passed the language test, they will come up with the request for profound knowledge of Buddhism, Thai"ness" Thai culture and their version of Thai history. If you pass all this, they will make you eat a bucket of chillies!

[Fookhaht]

What is the average Thai policeman's wage per month, I hear it is between 8000 and 10,000 Baht.

A head receptionist in the lobby of a 4-star hotel outside of BKK averages 6,000B/month. Before starting work, the new employee has to pay a "deposit" of 4,000B (80% of first month's salary) which covers damages for anything they may break while employed.

[Fookhaht]

i take exception to this persons statement about nurses pay soaring. My wife was a nurse for 17 years and there has been no increase in salary for 10 years. And even now is only 15,000 bht a month! could you live on that?. They do the work but the Doctors get the big money. About 80,000 bht a month!

You think 80,000 baht is big money? LOL.

In the "real" Thailand (anywhere outside of BKK), yes, that's a fortune. At 35,000 bht / month, my salary puts me into the upper middle class economic level among my neighbors, most of whom average 6k-13k/month. They think I'm filthy rich.

[LindsayBKK]

"Malaysian professionals will likely pose the biggest challenge to Thais."

Yes a lot of Doctors from Malaysia & Singapore, just to mention a few countries, that being Gay is not as accepted nor open as Thailand.

As for quality of care Malaysian Doctors have a reputation for being a bit rough with patients so I do not see a concern for Thai Doctors currently.

p.s

Doctors study many more years than nurses, do not compare salaries.

Plus nurses in this country spend more time reading magazines than working.

Good nurses make 1000baht a day + xmas Bonuses thankyou.

[Thai at Heart]

The knock on effect of this will be a mass exit of Proffessionals from Thailand which in turn will mean that in order to keep them here salaries will have to increase which in turn will raise taxes etc and Thailand with become either a very expensive place to live or have an economic melt down providing the latter won't have already happened by 2015, all in all it just looks pretty bad no matter how you look at it.

I take a wild guess and predict it is the second part of your opinion taking place. Why? Just have a look at what big shots in the industry have to say about the plan to get involved in Myanmar:

Tanit Sorat, vice-chairman of the Federation of Thai Industries, said:

"I think Dawei could be an option for Thai investors," Mr Tanit said, citing such upstream industries as oil and gas or steel to be developed there, plus the need to relocate to flood-free areas and away from the planned hike of the minimum daily wage to 300 baht.

Is the guy talking about a couple of Thai manufacturer or does this include the global players? At least Thai politicians will get their share of the moving costs.

This happened after they lured the buffalos to vote for them by making bogus promisses.

And the guy’s dream went on with this quote:

"By the time Dawei is in operation, industries in Thailand will be much more advanced than today," he said. "Thailand will move away from heavy industries such as petrochemicals and leave them to neighbouring countries."

Thailand will be much more advanced, while the other countries go back to dark ages?

In my opinion Thailand, with it's unrealistic ambitions is moving away from the AEC's dinner table before the others enjoy a superb dessert!

What exactly does he propose to do with PTT? Surely not sell it to a foreign concern so that Thailand can move away from petrochemicals? Considering that the electronics industry has been decimated by the flood, now a head honcho of some quango proposes thailand move away from petrochemicals also????

What will be left, basket weaving?

[Nisa]

What is the average Thai policeman's wage per month, I hear it is between 8000 and 10,000 Baht.

It is like 7500 a month (starting pay) in Bangkok. They get no scheduled days off either. But I am pretty sure they can live in the barracks free with their families.

Edited January 17, 2012 by Nisa

[Nisa]

Average Monthly Salaries in Thailand by Job: http://www.worldsala.../thailand.shtml

There is a more updated version of this kind of thing somewhere online but I couldn't re-find it ... still an interesting link and worth checking out.

Edit: Keep in mind the exchange rate for US Dollars is the 2005 rate of about 40.

Edited January 17, 2012 by Nisa

[anterian]

The knock on effect of this will be a mass exit of Proffessionals from Thailand which in turn will mean that in order to keep them here salaries will have to increase which in turn will raise taxes etc and Thailand with become either a very expensive place to live or have an economic melt down providing the latter won't have already happened by 2015, all in all it just looks pretty bad no matter how you look at it.

Regarding the "mass exit" I partially agree. Only Thais who can speak another language fluently or near fluently will have a chance of getting a job in neighbouring AEC countries. Judging by their English I'd say very, very few have a decent chance...

There's another point here. I can tell you that many regional and international companies (operating n Thailand) have tried to get their promising Thai staff to go abroad for experience. Most refuse, mostly because 'it's too difficult to get Thai food',

" Most refuse, mostly because 'it's too difficult to get Thai food" I agree but with a caveat, make it ready to eat Thai food. Poor Thais eat street vendor food, rich Thais use restaurants, very few Thais can cook Thai food.

I live in Thailand yet eat "English food" every day, pork, chicken, fish, potatoes, carrots, onions, tomatoes, cabbage, eggs, bread, milk , flour, butter, margarine, etc, etc.

My personal experience with Thais in England (mostly students), is that they cannot survive without a daily dose of extended family, tribal, village gossip.

[Daewoo]

I am an telecom engineering professional... In the early 90's, Australia was a nett exporter of engineering skills to Asia, including Thailand... now Australia is an importer of skills, and it has become quite hard to find work in Asia... While Australia is importing skills from Asia (Malaysia, China x 10, Philippines, Singapore, Hong Kong) + India, very few staff are coming from Thailand... reason, generally very poor English skills, limited 'professional' skills beyond what they learnt from books at Uni... There is also a definate tie to family and community, that isn't as easily broken as it is with other nationalities...

[bkk_mike]

Isn't accountancy one of the royally prescribed occupations that can only be done by Thais?

I do know that Thais that I know who graduated in the US and work in business in the US would often like to come back and work in Thailand for family reasons, but the salary drop puts them off. This ASEAN agreement would open up Singapore to them with no work visa hassles and a trip home for the weekend to see the family is definitely more of an option from there.

[cutter007]

i take exception to this persons statement about nurses pay soaring. My wife was a nurse for 17 years and there has been no increase in salary for 10 years. And even now is only 15,000 bht a month! could you live on that?. They do the work but the Doctors get the big money. About 80,000 bht a month!

our accounting gets 8000 bht per month and she can live on that. Motorbike guys get 6000 Baht and can live with that

I think you should rephrase the statement to 'survive' on 8000bht per month. At that income level that's all your doing, surviving hand to mouth. I bet many of the motorbike guys, especially in central bangkok get more like 60'000 a month. In the provinces perhaps 6'000 is a good estimate.

Motorbike guys at the queue pull in between 15,000 - 20,000 per month.

If your making less than 10,000 in bangkok, your a sap, because it's a dangerous job.

[xthAi76s]

Isn't accountancy one of the royally prescribed occupations that can only be done by Thais?

I do know that Thais that I know who graduated in the US and work in business in the US would often like to come back and work in Thailand for family reasons, but the salary drop puts them off. This ASEAN agreement would open up Singapore to them with no work visa hassles and a trip home for the weekend to see the family is definitely more of an option from there.

Singapore is quite competitive, and, as far as I'm aware, does not suffer from shortage of highly skilled labor force -- esp as Singapore 'lures' first world expats. Japan's economy is contracting, and many Japanese are trying to get into places like Singapore and Hong Kong. I don't know. Singapore is small. How many Thais would make it in Singapore ... ? Probably not many. I don't think Singapore would have much impact on the overall situation in Thailand.

[hellodolly]

The requirement of Thai language fluency will knock most other nationalities out of the race for professional positions, such as doctors. Only those already living long-term in Thailand, who should possess satisfactory Thai-language skills, may have better opportunities.

+1

[bkk_mike]

Isn't accountancy one of the royally prescribed occupations that can only be done by Thais?

I do know that Thais that I know who graduated in the US and work in business in the US would often like to come back and work in Thailand for family reasons, but the salary drop puts them off. This ASEAN agreement would open up Singapore to them with no work visa hassles and a trip home for the weekend to see the family is definitely more of an option from there.

Singapore is quite competitive, and, as far as I'm aware, does not suffer from shortage of highly skilled labor force -- esp as Singapore 'lures' first world expats. Japan's economy is contracting, and many Japanese are trying to get into places like Singapore and Hong Kong. I don't know. Singapore is small. How many Thais would make it in Singapore ... ? Probably not many. I don't think Singapore would have much impact on the overall situation in Thailand.

The Thai I'm thinking of is doing pretty well in NYC at a major bank in the US. I'm not talking about someone moving to Singapore from Thailand...

[xthAi76s]

Isn't accountancy one of the royally prescribed occupations that can only be done by Thais?

I do know that Thais that I know who graduated in the US and work in business in the US would often like to come back and work in Thailand for family reasons, but the salary drop puts them off. This ASEAN agreement would open up Singapore to them with no work visa hassles and a trip home for the weekend to see the family is definitely more of an option from there.

Singapore is quite competitive, and, as far as I'm aware, does not suffer from shortage of highly skilled labor force -- esp as Singapore 'lures' first world expats. Japan's economy is contracting, and many Japanese are trying to get into places like Singapore and Hong Kong. I don't know. Singapore is small. How many Thais would make it in Singapore ... ? Probably not many. I don't think Singapore would have much impact on the overall situation in Thailand.

The Thai I'm thinking of is doing pretty well in NYC at a major bank in the US. I'm not talking about someone moving to Singapore from Thailand...

I see. Yes, those elite people in the workforce (of which are very few) have the flexibility to go to many countries. I know several in finance in NYC and a guy who is moving to China where you can make a good money and life like a king. It has always been true that elite people in, say, investment banking, are rather free to move around ... But, there are so few ...

[wintermute]

ASEAN will fail for the principle reason that nearly all the countries involved are just as corrupt as Thailand is, if not more so. No one is seriously committed to actual free trade. Just look at how the Thai government weasels its way out of ASEAN trade agreements such as low import tariffs etc.. The cross border employment scheme is nothing but an opium pipe dream by delusional bureaucratic bigwigs and their corporate masters who get sweaty palms at the idea of being able to hire and fire at will from any country.

The reality is that Thailand will engage in protectionism and xenophobic hiring practices to block out foreign labor...as it has always been done. All the rest of the SEA countries will follow suit. Besides the only countries worth talking about in ASEAN in the future tense is Singapore, Malaysia, and Vietnam. The rest will wallow in permanent mediocrity protecting their little corrupt fiefdoms until the sun finally grows into a red giant and life ends on earth.

Philippines, Indonesia, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar, and yes even Thailand are absolute jokes. Thailand is not as bad as the others but it has been regressing hard the past few years. I wouldn't be surprised if 10 years from now we have a new military junta.

Edited January 19, 2012 by wintermute

[ludditeman]

Philippines, Indonesia, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar, and yes even Thailand are absolute jokes. Thailand is not as bad as the others but it has been regressing hard the past few years. I wouldn't be surprised if 10 years from now we have a new military junta.

I wouldn't be surprised if NEXT YEAR we have a new military junta.