Charity Debate.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Rip away flamer

[chownah]

Keep up the flaming. Go for it hero.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're the one stalking me.

You asked a question, I answered it.

And if you're talking about the goo goo gooogly eyes to the above post I actually was biting my tongue.

Would you like me to have ripped that "marketing scheme/hypothesis" apart?

No, so I didnt, but it is , just forget it, I bite lip.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'd like to hear you rip it apart...or even just comment on it nicely...having a wrong idea is no reason for derision...I'll bet that you even had a wrong idea once....but I won't be able to read your response until later so go ahead and take your time and give it your best shot.

Edited December 9, 2005 by chownah

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Well said Chownah.

[buadhai]

How long do you can keep this guy going?

[MilkPlus]

I'd like to hear you rip it apart...or even just comment on it nicely...having a wrong idea is no reason for derision...I'll bet that you even had a wrong idea once....but I won't be able to read your response until later so go ahead and take your time and give it your best shot.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK, first he’s (ORCHACHAI) not doing it for the promotion but because he is Buddhist.

And second the only part that I find "irrelevant" is the premise that,

They don't want to accumulate a 'life time supply' of aluminum very quickly because then this great promotional scheme would vanish....the longer it takes to collect the aluminum the longer the promotion lasts!!!

The promotion can last as long as they and the markets are willing to leave the collection boxes up.

The number of Landmine victims is not a static number, and there are thousands who don’t have artificial limbs so the "idea" that they would ever have their "life time supply" need met is .......I’m sorry I can’t find the write word.

Not to mention the fact that if they were to somehow meet this "lifetime supply" need they could certainly SELL the unused aluminum.

Your heart is in the right place, and so is the campaigns, but it could be improved, and I wouldn’t be surprised if there was monetary motive for not "giving" all the aluminum to the charity. But I don’t know a lot about Thailand’s waste management system, who owns it, who owns the recycle centers, etc etc. That’s just the conspiracy cynic side of me rearing its ugly head.

I’m pretty ###### sure that if we dug deep enough we would find out that it is somehow all George Bush's fault.

[Kringle]

I was wrong to call you a twerp in my initial response but now I just see you as someone that has the attitude that HE has to be right about everything. I didn't see anything about your ALL saving lady contributing anything to clear the minefields in this country. Of all the charities you listed, how much of ALL the money collected or donated REALLY gets to the people that need it?

Don't come into the forum downing people for trying to help in what ever way they can. A little here and a little there mounts up and does make a difference. I for one, would rather see small charity programs get the money because I believe that it is closer to the group that needs it. I don't like these big organizations that have all officers in charge making the money. Of the money that does get out of these organizations, how much do you think actually get s to the people? Not much , the leaders of these poor countries take it. Even when it is food or medication, it is sold again rather than going to the people.

As far as this so intelligent statement:

"I’m pretty ###### sure that if we dug deep enough we would find out that it is somehow all George Bush's fault."

It just proves, you're an idiot. What would Bush have to do with mines in the countries you showed your great charts of. I would be willing to bet a dime to a donut, that most of the boms and mines that are in Thailand and even the other countries were put there long before Bush, (father or son) came into office.

[MilkPlus]

I was wrong to call you a twerp in my initial response but now I just see you as someone that has the attitude that HE has to be right about everything. I didn't see anything about your ALL saving lady contributing anything to clear the minefields in this country. Of all the charities you listed, how much of ALL the money collected or donated REALLY gets to the people that need it?

Don't come into the forum downing people for trying to help in what ever way they can. A little here and a little there mounts up and does make a difference. I for one, would rather see small charity programs get the money because I believe that it is closer to the group that needs it. I don't like these big organizations that have all officers in charge making the money. Of the money that does get out of these organizations, how much do you think actually get s to the people? Not much , the leaders of these poor countries take it. Even when it is food or medication, it is sold again rather than going to the people.

As far as this so intelligent statement:  

"I’m pretty ###### sure that if we dug deep enough we would find out that it is somehow all George Bush's fault."

It just proves, you're an idiot. What would Bush have to do with mines in the countries you showed your great charts of. I would be willing to bet a dime to a donut, that most of the boms and mines that are in Thailand and even the other countries were put there long before Bush, (father or son) came into office.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow, just Wow.

That is the first time in ALL my years that someone has defended GWB toO ME.

(cap added for Dr. P's pleasure, see he is a good teacher!)

That was better than SEX, thank you.

Edited December 9, 2005 by MilkPlus

[cdnvic]

both of you be nice

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I was wrong to call you a twerp in my initial response but now I just see you as someone that has the attitude that HE has to be right about everything. I didn't see anything about your ALL saving lady contributing anything to clear the minefields in this country. Of all the charities you listed, how much of ALL the money collected or donated REALLY gets to the people that need it?

Don't come into the forum downing people for trying to help in what ever way they can. A little here and a little there mounts up and does make a difference. I for one, would rather see small charity programs get the money because I believe that it is closer to the group that needs it. I don't like these big organizations that have all officers in charge making the money. Of the money that does get out of these organizations, how much do you think actually get s to the people? Not much , the leaders of these poor countries take it. Even when it is food or medication, it is sold again rather than going to the people.

As far as this so intelligent statement:  

"I’m pretty ###### sure that if we dug deep enough we would find out that it is somehow all George Bush's fault."

It just proves, you're an idiot. What would Bush have to do with mines in the countries you showed your great charts of. I would be willing to bet a dime to a donut, that most of the boms and mines that are in Thailand and even the other countries were put there long before Bush, (father or son) came into office.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow, just Wow.

That is the first time in ALL my years that someone has defended GWB toO ME.

(cap added for Dr. P's pleasure, see he is a good teacher!)

That was better than SEX, thank you.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

in that sense it'd be 'to me' JUST TO

[mumbojumbo]

Its real simple, get a MAGNET!    

Think, use that noggin of yours.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This thread started by someone not knowing if the tabs were stainless steel or aluminum.

Mister know it all says to use a magnet. How will this work, when they are both non-magnetic??

[chownah]

I'd like to hear you rip it apart...or even just comment on it nicely...having a wrong idea is no reason for derision...I'll bet that you even had a wrong idea once....but I won't be able to read your response until later so go ahead and take your time and give it your best shot.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK, first he’s (ORCHACHAI) not doing it for the promotion but because he is Buddhist.

And second the only part that I find "irrelevant" is the premise that,

They don't want to accumulate a 'life time supply' of aluminum very quickly because then this great promotional scheme would vanish....the longer it takes to collect the aluminum the longer the promotion lasts!!!

The promotion can last as long as they and the markets are willing to leave the collection boxes up.

The number of Landmine victims is not a static number, and there are thousands who don’t have artificial limbs so the "idea" that they would ever have their "life time supply" need met is .......I’m sorry I can’t find the write word.

Not to mention the fact that if they were to somehow meet this "lifetime supply" need they could certainly SELL the unused aluminum.

Your heart is in the right place, and so is the campaigns, but it could be improved, and I wouldn’t be surprised if there was monetary motive for not "giving" all the aluminum to the charity. But I don’t know a lot about Thailand’s waste management system, who owns it, who owns the recycle centers, etc etc. That’s just the conspiracy cynic side of me rearing its ugly head.

I’m pretty ###### sure that if we dug deep enough we would find out that it is somehow all George Bush's fault.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good points. I wish someone would call up the Doctor in Chiang Mai and ask him why they only use the ring tabs....if I spoke Thai and lived in Chiang Mai I think I'd do it.

[Chang_paarp]

There are a couple of reasons they use the ring pull.

They use a relatively low tech method of melting the ring pull, (relatively) low temp gas (butane or methane), thus size, purity cleanliness and relative surface area matters.

The ring uses a different aloy, actually stronger than the body. (?)

They are used to make low cost limbs for land mine victims. I think it is used as par of one of the wearing parts.

This part is made "on site" as part of the fitting process, so the low tech option is needed.

We also asked if it would not be better to send ingots of the correct alloy, as we live on one of the larger deposits of bauxite (the raw material for aluminium). The responce was as above.

The collecting of part of a can also helps to remind people of what it is being use for.

All these and more questions were asked by members of Rotary clubs in my district when a project to colect the rings was started a few years ago. A well respected member of the district committee went to Chiang Mai to check out the final process. She met with the Doctor, sorry not all details at hand.

For the TV member who feels his lack of Thai will prevent communication, the doctor and many staff speak good English. I was invited to visit when I go to that part of the world.

I will follow up if anyone is interested.

[mumbojumbo]

There are a couple of reasons they use the ring pull.

They are used to make low cost limbs for land mine victims. I think it is used as par of one of the wearing parts.

I will follow up if anyone is interested.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thailand doesn't have any land mine victims. Have i been saving these things for umteen years for Laos/Cambodia people?? There are other ways to loose limbs besides land mines

[Sur_MÖSE]

There are a couple of reasons they use the ring pull.

They are used to make low cost limbs for land mine victims. I think it is used as par of one of the wearing parts.

I will follow up if anyone is interested.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thailand doesn't have any land mine victims. Have i been saving these things for umteen years for Laos/Cambodia people?? There are other ways to loose limbs besides land mines

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Said by the know it all who doesnt even know Stainless Steel is magnetic.

[chownah]

There are a couple of reasons they use the ring pull.

They are used to make low cost limbs for land mine victims. I think it is used as par of one of the wearing parts.

I will follow up if anyone is interested.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thailand doesn't have any land mine victims. Have i been saving these things for umteen years for Laos/Cambodia people?? There are other ways to loose limbs besides land mines

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Said by the know it all who doesnt even know Stainless Steel is magnetic.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Some stainless steel is magnetic and some is not....I'm using the common definition for 'magnetic' here, meaning attracted by a magnet.

[mumbojumbo]

There are a couple of reasons they use the ring pull.

Said by the know it all who doesnt even know Stainless Steel is magnetic.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Austenitic Grades

All austenitic grades have very low magnetic permeabilities and hence show almost no response to a magnet when in the annealed condition; the situation is, however, far less clear when these steels have been cold worked by wire drawing, rolling or even centreless grinding, shot blasting or heavy polishing. After substantial cold working Grade 304 may exhibit quite strong response to a magnet, whereas Grades 310 and 316 will in most instances still be almost totally non-responsive.

The change in magnetic response is due to atomic lattice straining and formation of martensite. In general, the higher the nickel to chromium ratio the more stable is the austenitic structure and the less magnetic response that will be induced by cold work. Magnetic response can therefore be used as a method for sorting grades of stainless steel, but considerable caution needs to be exercised.

Austenitic stainless steels comprise over 70% of total stainless steel production. They contain a maximum of 0.15% carbon, a minimum of 16% chromium and sufficient nickel and/or manganese to retain an austenitic structure at all temperatures from the cryogenic region to the melting point of the alloy. A typical composition is 18% chromium and 10% nickel, commonly known as 18/10 stainless is often used in flatware. Similarly 18/0 and 18/8 is also available. “Superaustenitic” stainless steels, such as alloy AL-6XN, exhibit great resistance to chloride pitting, crevice corrosion and stress-corrosion cracking over the 300 series.

[Sur_MÖSE]

70% but 100% of steel pop tabs are magnetic.

Good work there Blacksmith Bob!

Edited December 10, 2005 by Sur_MÖSE

[mumbojumbo]

But the thing is, in discussion yesterday, some say the ringpulls are made from stainless steel, while others say they are made from pure aluminium. Which is it?

                                              Cheers .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Here is the original question. If they were iron steel, they would rust. If they are ss, then they might be attracted to a magnet and might not.

[mumbojumbo]

70% but 100% of steel pop tabs are magnetic.

Good work there Blacksmith Bob!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Gee Sur Mose, What happened to MilkPlus???? You forgot to read the forum rules before you joined twice.

"Please respect other members, no flame wars. All the rules in the thaivisa.com forum guidelines still apply in this forum, however it is the least moderated allowing open discussion or comments".

Have a happy one

Are you French??

[chownah]

I've been googling about aluminum cans and the aluminum can industry is constantly looking for better ways to make cans so the alloys of the various components and design keep changing. Tabs are currently made of an aluminum alloy and it is different from the end piece and the body is made from yet another aluminum alloy. I have a very strong magnet and an empty aluminum beverage can which used to hold Schweppe's Sparkling Manao Soda and no part of it is attracted by the magnet...not the body....not the end...not the tab....which is not surprising since they are all made from aluminum alloy.

I also found that Ronald McDonald House accepts can tabs as donations for recycling and they say that the tabs are a higher grade of aluminum so it is worth it to recycle them seperately...but frankly I can't imagine that this is true...I was not able to find any information on the relative prices of scrap aluminum of different alloys....if anyone would like to do some looking, the tab is evidentally made from alloy #5042.

[Sur_MÖSE]

70% but 100% of steel pop tabs are magnetic.

Good work there Blacksmith Bob!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Gee Sur Mose, What happened to MilkPlus???? You forgot to read the forum rules before you joined twice.

"Please respect other members, no flame wars. All the rules in the thaivisa.com forum guidelines still apply in this forum, however it is the least moderated allowing open discussion or comments".

Have a happy one

Are you French??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow, would you &lt;deleted&gt;?

You were wrong 3 post ago and now you're being a Hall Monitor, talk about being french.

[mumbojumbo]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow, would you &lt;deleted&gt;?

You were wrong 3 post ago and now you're being a Hall Monitor, talk about being french.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow. I was wrong three post ago for saying that many ss are not detected by a regular magnet-sorry. We know that you have a $10,000 electro magnet in your shop than can detect minute amounts of ferrous material in ss. My freind only has one of those$1 horshoe magnets and it doesn't detect anything. Could you send him your machine so he can win this 2-beer bet??