Smoke, Smog, Dust 2012 Chiang Mai

[Tywais]

Here are the values (24-hour averages) that I have in my database,

That's the difference. I'm using 1 hour peaks rather than a daily average. There are certain dangers for 1 hour exposure and for 24 hour average exposures based on standard definitions.

[Priceless]

Here are the values (24-hour averages) that I have in my database,

That's the difference. I'm using 1 hour peaks rather than a daily average. There are certain dangers for 1 hour exposure and for 24 hour average exposures based on standard definitions.

Though it becomes a little odd comparing these values to the 120 µg/m³ limit, since that is set for a 24-hour average. Also, for your graph in post #485 you appear to have used the 24-hour values for the years up to, and including, 2011. Doesn't that make using 1-hour values for 2012 somewhat misleading?

Incidentally, I haven't seen any standards for 1-hour exposure to PM10, though there are such standards for other pollutants.

/ Priceless

[mesquite]

Many villagers burn at night, easier to get away with it! Got that straight from the horses mouth! Hence it is very smoky often early morning.

Well put. Your post says it all.

Hopefully the amateur data analysts can come to the same conclusion: It's very smoky.

We'll see.

Edited March 8, 2012 by mesquite

[Thailand]

Many villagers burn at night, easier to get away with it! Got that straight from the horses mouth! Hence it is very smoky often early morning.

Well put. Your post says it all.

Hopefully the amateur data analysts can come to the same conclusion: It's very smoky.

We'll see.

And next you will be trying to tell us you came to that conclusion simply by sight & smell,can't see how that is possible without reams of data and analytics.

[chiang mai]

Many villagers burn at night, easier to get away with it! Got that straight from the horses mouth! Hence it is very smoky often early morning.

Well put. Your post says it all.

Hopefully the amateur data analysts can come to the same conclusion: It's very smoky.

We'll see.

And next you will be trying to tell us you came to that conclusion simply by sight & smell,can't see how that is possible without reams of data and analytics.

Sure that's funny but: I think it's useful to understand when the majoirty of the burning does take place, specifically what time of day approximately does it start and that's where the data is very useful. If we understand that part of the problem we can perhaps better understand the limitations of law enforcement to prevent some of it from happening. Fore example, if you look at the graph in post 477 you'll see that Friday/Saturday are peak days, why is that?

Edited March 9, 2012 by chiang mai

[Thailand]

Any farangs actually called the fire hotline and if so what was the response?

I ask because yesterday playing golf at Hang Dong there were 2 large fires burning in an orchard next to the course. I asked the caddies if they would like to make a few thousand baht by calling the hotline and they basically said they would get in to trouble for reporting them, not encouraging.They certainly would not leave their names even if they did which appeared to be just as unlikely.

If the locals have those concerns would you call and leave your name?

[naboo]

Well from my office today, another line of trees has disappeared. So its the smokiest day of the year today by my amateur measurements.

[Tywais]

Well from my office today, another line of trees has disappeared. So its the smokiest day of the year today by my amateur measurements.

And a PM>120 of 293.79 at 0600 AM and my eyes are messed up again. BTW, plenty of Thais at work complaining about this also.

[naboo]

Well from my office today, another line of trees has disappeared. So its the smokiest day of the year today by my amateur measurements.

Its a clearer afternoon, the trees are back!

[WinnieTheKhwai]

I don't understand why it fluctuates so much during the day. Where does the haze go in the afternoon? With the old system this was never very obvious as it only reported averages; I did notice in past years that the afternoons seemed clearer than mornings, but I suspected it was just because of the position of the sun, allowing me to see the mountain clearer in the afternoon. That is not the case.

(I do know the fluctuations aren't caused by fires in the immediate area; there just isn't a correlation with local fires, including forest fires)

[Priceless]

I don't understand why it fluctuates so much during the day. Where does the haze go in the afternoon? With the old system this was never very obvious as it only reported averages; I did notice in past years that the afternoons seemed clearer than mornings, but I suspected it was just because of the position of the sun, allowing me to see the mountain clearer in the afternoon. That is not the case.

(I do know the fluctuations aren't caused by fires in the immediate area; there just isn't a correlation with local fires, including forest fires)

I can't claim to know the answer, just a guess:

When the air starts cooling in the afternoon, the ground stays hot for longer. This causes the air near the ground to be warmer than that slightly higher up. As a consequence the lower air rises, taking part of the pollution with it.

Any takers?

/ Priceless

[Greenside]

I thought today was the worst this season so far. When you notice the haze in town looking down a short street things are getting bad. Was impossible to see Airport Plaza with any clarity from the SW corner of the moat. Miserable.

[Priceless]

I thought today was the worst this season so far. When you notice the haze in town looking down a short street things are getting bad. Was impossible to see Airport Plaza with any clarity from the SW corner of the moat. Miserable.

Spot the typo: 'According to the Ministry of Natural Resources and Environment, the amount of tiny dust particles in the nine provinces was very high in late February and early March this year. It has been on the decline in Chiang Mai and Lamphun, since March 5.'

( http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__5120286 )

Correct, it says 'decline' where it should have said 'increase'.

/ Priceless

Edited March 9, 2012 by Priceless

[Mapguy]

Where are the fires? Certainly to say the fires are a regional SE phenomenon is true enough, but it is interesting to get some sense of what's been going on (at least recently).

Locally, the FIRMS report for the past week has been miserable for Doi Suthep-Pui. No surprise there.

Looking further out, using Firemapper (which uses the Aqua and Terra satellites),the heaviest concentrations of fires in the past seven days have been in Thailand, both roughly equidistant north and south of Mueng Chiang Mai. There's been a belt of blazes close to the borders of Myanmar and Laos in Mae Hong Song, Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, Payao and Nan provinces to the north and to the south of Chiang Mai City centering east of Omkoi, Chiang Mai Province. Firemapper is at:

http://firefly.geog.umd.edu:8080/firemap/?x=99.30937499999999&y=18.009375000000005&z=7&g=g&v=1&r=5&i=er&l=ad,ct

Looking at airport reports of surface winds around the north in the past week, they have been calm-to-light and variable. They do swing around quite a bit, really as much from the south as from the north, which I'm guessing is due to a transitional period from one monsoon to the other. Regardless of wind direction, however, it appears there is not much of a breeze. That's no surprise.

The fire pattern changes day-to-day, week-to-week, so these observations are really only valid for the past week. Correlate them, as you will, with your own observations and those of others including the PM<10 reports.

Remember the satellites don't pick up all blazes for a variety of reasons (e.g., cloud cover, extent and duration of the fires), but those who have been fiddling with the PCD PM<10 counts of the past week might be interested in the above.

Then, of course, there is the topography to consider, shifts in low and high pressure... I hear the crackle of Excel spreadsheets out there!! Okay, who's into multivariate analysis ?!

[scotbeve]

I don't understand why it fluctuates so much during the day. Where does the haze go in the afternoon? With the old system this was never very obvious as it only reported averages; I did notice in past years that the afternoons seemed clearer than mornings, but I suspected it was just because of the position of the sun, allowing me to see the mountain clearer in the afternoon. That is not the case.

(I do know the fluctuations aren't caused by fires in the immediate area; there just isn't a correlation with local fires, including forest fires)

I can't claim to know the answer, just a guess:

When the air starts cooling in the afternoon, the ground stays hot for longer. This causes the air near the ground to be warmer than that slightly higher up. As a consequence the lower air rises, taking part of the pollution with it.

Any takers?

/ Priceless

What is the wind doing? Speed? Direction?

[khunphil]

Hmmm and now the site aqmthai.com is password protected ... or is it only me ?

P.

[Priceless]

What is the wind doing? Speed? Direction?

I didn't look last afternoon/night, but on the whole there has been very little wind lately. At 7:00 am this morning it was reported by TMD as 'calm' and at 9:30 the airport reports 110 degrees at 1 knot.

/ Priceless

[scotbeve]

What is the wind doing? Speed? Direction?

I didn't look last afternoon/night, but on the whole tthere has been very little wind lately. At 7:00 am this morning it was reported by TMD as 'calm' and at 9:30 the airport reports 110 degrees at 1 knot.

/ Priceless

Hmmm... surely not enough wind speed to make a difference during that period.....

[chiangmaicharlies]

Just looked at two weather forecasts for next week in CM. The Thai Visa one indicated rain from Saturday to Tuesday and Weather Channel said scattered thunderstorms from Saturday to Wednesday. I hope so, but as it approaches midday Saturday all I can see outside is very heavy SMOG

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Hmmm and now the site aqmthai.com is password protected ... or is it only me ?

P.

Some security / malware software reports that the site has malware on it. Could it be that this is the page you get, not actually the aqmthai site?

Anyway I use either Mac OSX or Windows 7 so I'm completely immune to malware as long as I don't actively do something stupid. So I just continue to the site.

[Tywais]

Hmmm and now the site aqmthai.com is password protected ... or is it only me ?

P.

Some security / malware software reports that the site has malware on it. Could it be that this is the page you get, not actually the aqmthai site?

Anyway I use either Mac OSX or Windows 7 so I'm completely immune to malware as long as I don't actively do something stupid. So I just continue to the site.

There appears to be an error in their Google Map API from the message I get indicating it (API registration) isn't registered at the moment. Clearing the error message and it comes up but I still have to use a VPN to get to them.

[khunphil]

Hmmm and now the site aqmthai.com is password protected ... or is it only me ?

P.

Some security / malware software reports that the site has malware on it. Could it be that this is the page you get, not actually the aqmthai site?

Anyway I use either Mac OSX or Windows 7 so I'm completely immune to malware as long as I don't actively do something stupid. So I just continue to the site.

This is OK now ... Firefox and Linux ;-)

P.

[Mapguy]

Scotbreve,

At your service:

Chiang Mai Winds: http://www.windguru.cz/int/index.php?sc=116783

But this site is primarily for windsurfers.

Also have to look at other factors (e.g, barometric pressure patterns, temperature inversions). LOTS of web sites of varying complexity.

These two on temperature inversion topped a Google search a couple of minutes ago. The second one gives a brief illustrated but relevant explanation including reference to wood fires and mountains.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inversion_(meteorology)

http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/slc/climate/TemperatureInversions.php

[Mapguy]

Regarding general meterological data available in Thailand,here is a very recent short (not very technical) report. Basically there are 122 stations in Thailand, almost all recording surface, not high altitude, conditions.

http://www.jma.go.jp/jma/en/Activities/qmws_2010/CountryReport/CS303_Songkran_Agsorn(Thailand).pdf

[Mapguy]

The URL above re met stations did not load well. Here it is again:

http://www.jma.go.jp...Agsorn(Thailand).pdf

If it still doesn't work, Google "meteorlogical stations thailand"

Note the two spellings of the word. Google drops the second letter "o"

[MESmith]

TMD radar site is showing a few showers to south & east, outside of CM valley, Lampang province. Fingers crossed.....

Edited March 10, 2012 by MESmith

[jaideecm]

No debate, Tywalis! It's bad out there (and not just for PM<10. The question before us is what to do about it. Granted the group here at TV TV Chiang Mai have limited capacity, but what can we as individuals do --- and I don'd mean heading for the beach. Regrettably, not so many have the freedom or the wherewithal to do that! Nor staying here, the knowledge and/or wherewithal to have air conditioning or HEPA filters.

I just came back from 3 days at Doi Inthanon staying at bungalows around 1600 meters. The air is much cleaner there and very nice temperatures at night. Came back to Chiang Mai today and it is sooo bad I will go back tomorrow for a few more days until the mango rains come which could be any day now.

Near the summit of Doi Inthanon you can look down into the valleys and see the layer of dark brown haze. Above beautiful blue sky and some mountain tops. Go to Doi Inthanon national park and chill, hike mountain trails, swim under waterfalls and in clear streams, enjoy the hospitality of the Karen people.

[Thailand]

No debate, Tywalis! It's bad out there (and not just for PM<10. The question before us is what to do about it. Granted the group here at TV TV Chiang Mai have limited capacity, but what can we as individuals do --- and I don'd mean heading for the beach. Regrettably, not so many have the freedom or the wherewithal to do that! Nor staying here, the knowledge and/or wherewithal to have air conditioning or HEPA filters.

I just came back from 3 days at Doi Inthanon staying at bungalows around 1600 meters. The air is much cleaner there and very nice temperatures at night. Came back to Chiang Mai today and it is sooo bad I will go back tomorrow for a few more days until the mango rains come which could be any day now.

Near the summit of Doi Inthanon you can look down into the valleys and see the layer of dark brown haze. Above beautiful blue sky and some mountain tops. Go to Doi Inthanon national park and chill, hike mountain trails, swim under waterfalls and in clear streams, enjoy the hospitality of the Karen people.

Any idea if we could take our dogs up there?

[Card]

Oh now I know why there is all this smoke around - it's the Ozzies whats to blame.

[harrry]

New business oportunity in Thailand. Send us your salmon and we will smoke it.