Why Are There So Many Americans In Chiang Mai?

[MMan]

TIME and MONEY - American travelers usually have one or the other, but rarely both.

Thailand is a long journey from the states... for most it is 20 - 30 hours across 8 - 12 time zones. That makes it impractical for a one week holiday. You really need 2 weeks to do it right.

If you are gainfully employed in the American private sector you may only have 1 or 2 weeks vacation time per year (unlike many other western countries where it seems 4+ weeks is common). If you've been with the same employer many years you may get 3 weeks or more, however taking a vacation longer than 1 week is uncommon, and many bosses are not comfortable allowing you to do so. Even with a fairly high level position in a large well regarded company, I was only able to take a 2 week Asian trip by scheduling it over Thanksgiving Holiday, a short 3 day work week when little is going on in corporate America, and then staying in contact with the office daily via email and Skype. Even with that, my boss still let it be known he did not like it.

Those employed outside the private sector (education, government, military, religious / non-profit organizations) often do get more generous annual leave time, and may have positions that make it easier to take an extended holiday. However those jobs do not generally pay well. So those people go the Lonely Planet route, saving up and carefully planning their trip to get maximum bang for the least bucks... a road that leads to Chiang Mai. And those are the type of American you often find in Chiang Mai, along with young travelers who haven't yet settled into a career or taken on family obligations.

Working Americans with the resources for a 4 - 5 star beach holiday are more likely to be limited to considering a 1 week trip within North America.

[bonzersmom]

The Chiang Mai Expats club says that there are 2 brits for every american on their register. So I don't think we are exactly overrunning the place. My husband and I actually had planned to retire in Mexico until the drug violence got so bad that it became unviable. When a co-worker and his wife (Mexican nationals who had become American citizens) we had planned to go into business with in Mexico cancelled the plan due to the violence we cancelled our plans for Mexico/south America. Everybody talks about Ecuador - been there, done that - was a peace corps volunteer in 1970. NOT going back. So you start the search and Chiang Mai literally has it all.

1) Political stability,

2) generally tolerant culture, non-islamic - YES it DOES matter, in an islamic culture as an american you might as well paint a bulls eye on your back.

3)One of the few places outside the USA which has 2 hospitals with JCAHO accreditation,

4) the university with it's cultural influence,

5) The weather (except for the pollution but still better than a lot of american cities)

6) natural beauty

7) Amenities like great golf courses, spas, health clubs, etc.

A lot of guys who came here during Nam are returning because of the memories. According to the Pew Research center 10,000 Americans reach retirement age (65) EVERY DAY and this will continue for the next 19 years. Being in the first wave of of boomers (hubby is post WW2) be prepared. There are a whole bunch more of us coming. BBWWAHAHAHA (evil laugh).

[bonzersmom]

 

hml367, on 14 Apr 2013 - 14:19, said:

Without more details that surely should get the experts excited.

MSPain

Not really there are a certain amount of new Thai citizenship allowed here not many but a few.

As we can plainly see he by his alias here he is having a hard time of letting go of his American citizenship.

It was a lot easier than that.

Came to visit Thailand for the first time about a year ago, wanted to see if I could find any relatives (mother was Thai).

Had my original Thai birth certificate in my mothers trunk in the roof. Didn't even realise it entitled me to Thai citizenship until a Thai gf pointed it out.

Employed a Thai lawyer to do all the running around, and a few months later went to collect my Thai ID card.

Still American as well, but only when I enter a country on my American passport.

 

Good one. What are you when you are in an airplane flying over the middle of the ocean.

My guess is it would depend on whether the plane was being hijacked and they started taking passports. I've seriously thought about having a fake South African or Canadian passport made up for "special occasions". I'd bet the hijackers couldn't spot a decent fake from the real ones. Might save my life.

[daoyai]

Bonzersmom, do you have any personal experiences that would justify your paranoia?

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Bucket of moat water?

Who knows what that might cause.

[bobl]

The Chiang Mai Expats club says that there are 2 brits for every american on their register.

If (note, IF - I have no personal experience of it) the CM expat club is anything like the expat clubs I've encountered in Africa, they're full of sanctimonious snobs and bigots, so it'd be no great surprise if they've found twice as many English than Americans with sticks up their butts...

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[hellodolly]

The Chiang Mai Expats club says that there are 2 brits for every american on their register. So I don't think we are exactly overrunning the place. My husband and I actually had planned to retire in Mexico until the drug violence got so bad that it became unviable. When a co-worker and his wife (Mexican nationals who had become American citizens) we had planned to go into business with in Mexico cancelled the plan due to the violence we cancelled our plans for Mexico/south America. Everybody talks about Ecuador - been there, done that - was a peace corps volunteer in 1970. NOT going back. So you start the search and Chiang Mai literally has it all.

1) Political stability,

2) generally tolerant culture, non-islamic - YES it DOES matter, in an islamic culture as an american you might as well paint a bulls eye on your back.

3)One of the few places outside the USA which has 2 hospitals with JCAHO accreditation,

4) the university with it's cultural influence,

5) The weather (except for the pollution but still better than a lot of american cities)

6) natural beauty

7) Amenities like great golf courses, spas, health clubs, etc.

A lot of guys who came here during Nam are returning because of the memories. According to the Pew Research center 10,000 Americans reach retirement age (65) EVERY DAY and this will continue for the next 19 years. Being in the first wave of of boomers (hubby is post WW2) be prepared. There are a whole bunch more of us coming. BBWWAHAHAHA (evil laugh).

We are here to stop the Brits from colonizing Thailand,

[Thighlander]

I saw something interesting on Bloomberg last week. The United States accounts for 70% of the technology sector in the world. Asia 10%. That kind of explains why I don't have a single item in my home from Europe. And they bash our economy?

[elektrified]

The Chiang Mai Expats club says that there are 2 brits for every american on their register.

If (note, IF - I have no personal experience of it) the CM expat club is anything like the expat clubs I've encountered in Africa, they're full of sanctimonious snobs and bigots, so it'd be no great surprise if they've found twice as many English than Americans with sticks up their butts...

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I've never been to an ex-pat club in Africa but if you walked into the ex-pat club in C.M. you would find what resembles the activity room at an old folks home. I don't know the breakdown but the 2 times I went, there were Americans, Brits, Dutch, Australians and many other nationalities there. At least half of them were sleeping sitting up - I kid you not. I couldn't believe the conversations there, such as people discussing that it was time for the free coffee, juice, and pastry. Absolutely one of the most boring, pathetic things I have ever seen.

[Thighlander]

I've heard the same thing about the Expat Club. A lot of those folks were able to cash in on Roosevelt's plan for socialism, before the bean counters determined it is a massive ponzi scheme, relying on many more people paying in; than collecting. Their (usually government) pension plans also rely on 7% annual gains to remain solvent. Not easy to do in Obama's no growth economy. I've also found that these people really like to rub it in, and the way they do it is to bore you to death, just making sure you know that they get paid a lot for sitting on their asses. One day, a retiree called me for computer help, MS Windows 2000, with his outdated machine. I had helped him too many times before, and had never been paid. Unfortunately, I was having a bad day. I said something like this: "Your retired, make 70K per year for sitting on your ass, and even worse, you are retired from a computer company that bills the Federal Government 137 USD per hour for technical support, and you have an old piece of junk that someone gave you, and yet you call me, a person struggling to stay afloat, and want me to fix it for you again, and again. And you live in an area with more "IT Guys" than anywhere on the planet, most of whom are just a huge part of government expansion, and our huge deficit, so <deleted>? Call somebody else. Needless to say, my father wasn't real happy with me.

[klikster]

A few weeks ago while waiting to do some banking business here in Khon Kaen I got into a conversation with a Brit gent who lives part time in CM. One comment he made, "There must be several hundred Americans living in Chiang Mai but they mostly stay to themselves."

He then launched into a near tirade about how "America" was ruining the world .

Then he stated talking golf so I told him about the courses I knew from my time in Chiang Rai. He quickly followed up with a golf story of how he caught an American cheating in a local tournament.

I'm not surprised that the "several hundred" Americans in Chiang Mai tend to avoid him.

[muchogra]

I've heard the same thing about the Expat Club. A lot of those folks were able to cash in on Roosevelt's plan for socialism, before the bean counters determined it is a massive ponzi scheme, relying on many more people paying in; than collecting. Their (usually government) pension plans also rely on 7% annual gains to remain solvent. Not easy to do in Obama's no growth economy. I've also found that these people really like to rub it in, and the way they do it is to bore you to death, just making sure you know that they get paid a lot for sitting on their asses. One day, a retiree called me for computer help, MS Windows 2000, with his outdated machine. I had helped him too many times before, and had never been paid. Unfortunately, I was having a bad day. I said something like this: "Your retired, make 70K per year for sitting on your ass, and even worse, you are retired from a computer company that bills the Federal Government 137 USD per hour for technical support, and you have an old piece of junk that someone gave you, and yet you call me, a person struggling to stay afloat, and want me to fix it for you again, and again. And you live in an area with more "IT Guys" than anywhere on the planet, most of whom are just a huge part of government expansion, and our huge deficit, so <deleted>? Call somebody else. Needless to say, my father wasn't real happy with me.

That doesn't seem a nice thing to tell your old man. Can you not think from another angle? Your old man is able to retire comfortably for the same reason that you seem to be criticizing him - devoted to his job and living a frugal life (not depriving himself, I hope). He called you for help, because you are his son and have the know-how! Has he not raised you and sacrificed for you?

Some younger people nowadays don't seem to share the same perspectives as older folks. That's for sure. I just came back from abroad today. Let me tell you a story about a youngster whom I knew since when we were young - in the teens. This youngster was left a proprietary business by his father and was rented out for USD20,000 a month about 8 years ago. The father passed away subsequently. He spent more than USD20,000 a week. He got many followers and was very loose "helping" out his acquanintances. The USD20,000 a month was not enough for him. He sold his father's business for 1m USD. That, of course, didn't last too long. If he had not sold, today, only a few years later, he could easily sell it for 7m USD The worst thing is not many people are looking up to him.

The point here is one needs to be content in life and never live beyond one's means! More importantly, don't criticize how older folks want to live their lives! I hope I get my message across to many who have voted for your post!

[muchogra]

The handle, Thighlander, isn't one that many older people would have had chosen! Btw, I ain't very old. In fact, just a year or so ago before I bought my house here, the masseur told my wife that her husband would have many ladies coming after him. But that depends on the man, doesn't it?

In CM, I have never met a "bad" Canadian yet! Even in the forum, Canadians seem quite nice. Most Canadians speak English just like many Americans do. I have also met some nice Australians. I have met some nice Brits and some not so good Brits. In fact, I am having trouble calling someone a Brit, for some like to be called an English, or Scott, or Welch, or whatever! I'm so confused! To me, who gives a <deleted>! Great Britain it is to me. Sorry for my ignorance!

[bobl]

I hope I get my message across to many who have voted for your post!

Loud and clear.

We're busy organising a search party for your sense of humour even as I type. Don't worry, if it ever existed we'll find it...

[hellodolly]

I've heard the same thing about the Expat Club. A lot of those folks were able to cash in on Roosevelt's plan for socialism, before the bean counters determined it is a massive ponzi scheme, relying on many more people paying in; than collecting. Their (usually government) pension plans also rely on 7% annual gains to remain solvent. Not easy to do in Obama's no growth economy. I've also found that these people really like to rub it in, and the way they do it is to bore you to death, just making sure you know that they get paid a lot for sitting on their asses. One day, a retiree called me for computer help, MS Windows 2000, with his outdated machine. I had helped him too many times before, and had never been paid. Unfortunately, I was having a bad day. I said something like this: "Your retired, make 70K per year for sitting on your ass, and even worse, you are retired from a computer company that bills the Federal Government 137 USD per hour for technical support, and you have an old piece of junk that someone gave you, and yet you call me, a person struggling to stay afloat, and want me to fix it for you again, and again. And you live in an area with more "IT Guys" than anywhere on the planet, most of whom are just a huge part of government expansion, and our huge deficit, so <deleted>? Call somebody else. Needless to say, my father wasn't real happy with me.

That doesn't seem a nice thing to tell your old man. Can you not think from another angle? Your old man is able to retire comfortably for the same reason that you seem to be criticizing him - devoted to his job and living a frugal life (not depriving himself, I hope). He called you for help, because you are his son and have the know-how! Has he not raised you and sacrificed for you?

Some younger people nowadays don't seem to share the same perspectives as older folks. That's for sure. I just came back from abroad today. Let me tell you a story about a youngster whom I knew since when we were young - in the teens. This youngster was left a proprietary business by his father and was rented out for USD20,000 a month about 8 years ago. The father passed away subsequently. He spent more than USD20,000 a week. He got many followers and was very loose "helping" out his acquanintances. The USD20,000 a month was not enough for him. He sold his father's business for 1m USD. That, of course, didn't last too long. If he had not sold, today, only a few years later, he could easily sell it for 7m USD The worst thing is not many people are looking up to him.

The point here is one needs to be content in life and never live beyond one's means! More importantly, don't criticize how older folks want to live their lives! I hope I get my message across to many who have voted for your post!

I can understand the poster calling it a Ponzi scheme. We grew up with the idea that if we contributed to SS it would go into a fund that would pay us money when we retired. That is the way it worked and was working until along comes George Bush and converts it into a way to get money to fight unwinable wars.

As to why so many Americans. Well that is obvious there are so many Brits here we are trying to protect Thailand from British colonization.

[Thakkar]

Here's a thought.

This needless and energy-wasting bickering and animosity among our Brit and American cousins can be pacified with a nachos and beer and cucumber sandwich party. Once face-to-face and with a couple of beers in the belly, we'll all be pleasantly surprised that the other guy isn't as big a <deleted> as we thought and that quite a few are almost annoyingly pleasant.

I propose that Chiangmai's quintessentially British pub get together with Chiangmai's quintessentially American restaurant (whoever these may be) to organize such an event. We might even allow those Irish plebs, Ozzie loudmouths, boring Canadians and incomprehensible South Africans to join us!

T

[hellodolly]

Here's a thought.

This needless and energy-wasting bickering and animosity among our Brit and American cousins can be pacified with a nachos and beer and cucumber sandwich party. Once face-to-face and with a couple of beers in the belly, we'll all be pleasantly surprised that the other guy isn't as big a <deleted> as we thought and that quite a few are almost annoyingly pleasant.

I propose that Chiangmai's quintessentially British pub get together with Chiangmai's quintessentially American restaurant (whoever these may be) to organize such an event. We might even allow those Irish plebs, Ozzie loudmouths, boring Canadians and incomprehensible South Africans to join us!

T

I think one beer would not be sufficient.

[klikster]

"In CM, I have never met a "bad" Canadian yet! Even in the forum, Canadians seem quite nice."

I think the best farang I ever knew in Thailand was a young Canadian guy, worked in Chiang Rai in the early 90's .. one of the Canadian development programs. He knew baseball and (gridiron) football, and educated me a bit re ice hockey. He was one of those guys you were always happy to chat with.

He could be a bit irritating at times .. like when spoke 99% perfect Thai -- or started filling out some form in Thai script and doing so a little faster than I can write Latin script.

[Ulysses G.]

Anyone remember the Canadian guy who used to own Linda Bar on Loi Kroh Road back in the early/mid 90s? He sold it to three different people all at the same time before skipping town. He had a confederate flag on the wall of the bar, a heroin habit and was as much of an Ugly American as anyone from USA. However, generally Canadians are pretty mellow.

[theDukes]

I would have to say that if there were so many Americans that maybe the American are smarter than everyone else?

[Loptr]

A few weeks ago while waiting to do some banking business here in Khon Kaen I got into a conversation with a Brit gent who lives part time in CM. One comment he made, "There must be several hundred Americans living in Chiang Mai but they mostly stay to themselves."

He then launched into a near tirade about how "America" was ruining the world .

Then he stated talking golf so I told him about the courses I knew from my time in Chiang Rai. He quickly followed up with a golf story of how he caught an American cheating in a local tournament.

I'm not surprised that the "several hundred" Americans in Chiang Mai tend to avoid him.

He was a Brit, what do you expect? Their national pastime is to whinge. Never known one not to whinge at the slightest provocation. Just sayin'.

As far as Americans in Chiang Mai, why not? It is a lovely city which in a lot of ways reminds Americans of retirement age of the way it used to be in the US. Where you didn't have to worry about locking your house even when at home, you are not worried about home invasions, not worried about the authorities sticking their nose in every aspect of your live, not being taxed to death, not being exposed to the media blitz, etc... Many wind up in CM after they have already explored the other locales in Thailand and decide a bit slower pace is what they desire. This too shall change once the high speed rail is in place. Watch for the demographic to change substantially after this happens.

[hellodolly]

A few weeks ago while waiting to do some banking business here in Khon Kaen I got into a conversation with a Brit gent who lives part time in CM. One comment he made, "There must be several hundred Americans living in Chiang Mai but they mostly stay to themselves."

He then launched into a near tirade about how "America" was ruining the world .

Then he stated talking golf so I told him about the courses I knew from my time in Chiang Rai. He quickly followed up with a golf story of how he caught an American cheating in a local tournament.

I'm not surprised that the "several hundred" Americans in Chiang Mai tend to avoid him.

He was a Brit, what do you expect? Their national pastime is to whinge. Never known one not to whinge at the slightest provocation. Just sayin'.

As far as Americans in Chiang Mai, why not? It is a lovely city which in a lot of ways reminds Americans of retirement age of the way it used to be in the US. Where you didn't have to worry about locking your house even when at home, you are not worried about home invasions, not worried about the authorities sticking their nose in every aspect of your live, not being taxed to death, not being exposed to the media blitz, etc... Many wind up in CM after they have already explored the other locales in Thailand and decide a bit slower pace is what they desire. This too shall change once the high speed rail is in place. Watch for the demographic to change substantially after this happens.

It will be a long time before the fast rail gets to Chiang Mai. The Government has it figured to be done in three stages the first one they will pay for and the next two they are figuring on private enterprise to do it.

They were going to do it all but after figuring the corruption money would go into their closets they realized it would not be enough money left to do the job.

[britgent]

Theore Americans I meet the more I understand american foreign policy.

[CMNightRider]

Theore Americans I meet the more I understand american foreign policy.

What is your understanding of American foreign policy?

[muchogra]

Well, it seems that our TV members are quite mellow afterall (borrowing the word 'mellow' from Ulysses G). Nobody has locked horns so far. That's good, cos it's really, to me, not necessary. We are all in a foreign land and we should really be glad that we, at least, speak a common language. Call me uneducated if I say I don't like debating and locking horns. Who are we going to kid thinking you can debate anyone of our age and experience to conform to your thinkings? One thing I do not like is speaking ill of one's parents - that's all!

[Dante99]

A few weeks ago while waiting to do some banking business here in Khon Kaen I got into a conversation with a Brit gent who lives part time in CM. One comment he made, "There must be several hundred Americans living in Chiang Mai but they mostly stay to themselves."

He then launched into a near tirade about how "America" was ruining the world .

Then he stated talking golf so I told him about the courses I knew from my time in Chiang Rai. He quickly followed up with a golf story of how he caught an American cheating in a local tournament.

I'm not surprised that the "several hundred" Americans in Chiang Mai tend to avoid him.

He was a Brit, what do you expect? Their national pastime is to whinge. Never known one not to whinge at the slightest provocation. Just sayin'.

As far as Americans in Chiang Mai, why not? It is a lovely city which in a lot of ways reminds Americans of retirement age of the way it used to be in the US. Where you didn't have to worry about locking your house even when at home, you are not worried about home invasions, not worried about the authorities sticking their nose in every aspect of your live, not being taxed to death, not being exposed to the media blitz, etc... Many wind up in CM after they have already explored the other locales in Thailand and decide a bit slower pace is what they desire. This too shall change once the high speed rail is in place. Watch for the demographic to change substantially after this happens.

And when is this "High speed rail" planned for completion? I assume of course that you are referring to the high speed rail that is planned to travel from Singapore to Shanghai.

[hellodolly]

A few weeks ago while waiting to do some banking business here in Khon Kaen I got into a conversation with a Brit gent who lives part time in CM. One comment he made, "There must be several hundred Americans living in Chiang Mai but they mostly stay to themselves."

He then launched into a near tirade about how "America" was ruining the world .

Then he stated talking golf so I told him about the courses I knew from my time in Chiang Rai. He quickly followed up with a golf story of how he caught an American cheating in a local tournament.

I'm not surprised that the "several hundred" Americans in Chiang Mai tend to avoid him.

He was a Brit, what do you expect? Their national pastime is to whinge. Never known one not to whinge at the slightest provocation. Just sayin'.

As far as Americans in Chiang Mai, why not? It is a lovely city which in a lot of ways reminds Americans of retirement age of the way it used to be in the US. Where you didn't have to worry about locking your house even when at home, you are not worried about home invasions, not worried about the authorities sticking their nose in every aspect of your live, not being taxed to death, not being exposed to the media blitz, etc... Many wind up in CM after they have already explored the other locales in Thailand and decide a bit slower pace is what they desire. This too shall change once the high speed rail is in place. Watch for the demographic to change substantially after this happens.

And when is this "High speed rail" planned for completion? I assume of course that you are referring to the high speed rail that is planned to travel from Singapore to Shanghai.

The one the government is talking about will never happen in are life time. I am presuming maybe incorrectly we are all 30 years or more old. the Government proposal is a three part one they will pay for the first part and then they expect private industries to pay for the next two parts.

Stop and think about it they haven't got the approval for the money yet and have no idea where they would run it until they sent out surveyors. Then they would have to buy private land build overpasses. All this by 2018

[enjoybeing]

I played golf with an Australian last week, and he happened to comment that whilst there were a lot of Americans in Chiang Mai, most western golfers seemed to be Australian, European or Canadian.

On discussion we all agreed that whilst we might know 50 odd golfers here, only one or two were American. So why do they not play golf?

Because the Americans in general who retire to Chang Mai are the baby boomers of the hippy culture descent, That is the area most accommodating and resembling this attribute.. very few hippies play golf..

[enjoybeing]

Pretty simple. There are over 300 million Americans. They should equal almost all the Europeans combined.

Not really or that would hold true and be the case in any tourist destination in Thailand. I live in Patong and see on avg. only 1 or 2 Americans per year, other than the military. Most traveling Americans are attracted to that area because the culture of the area of Chang Mai mostly represents and reflects the culture of those visiting.. mostly the traveling hippies, adventurers and the retiring baby boomers (also mostly old hippies).. They aren't really the type to chase around ladies but more looking for a chill-lax type of environment with good coffee and the acceptance of their ideals.. such as people not into bearing glitz, upscale dress codes or luxurious living accommodations . It seems more natural and wholesome to them.

[enjoybeing]

A few weeks ago while waiting to do some banking business here in Khon Kaen I got into a conversation with a Brit gent who lives part time in CM. One comment he made, "There must be several hundred Americans living in Chiang Mai but they mostly stay to themselves."

He then launched into a near tirade about how "America" was ruining the world .

Then he stated talking golf so I told him about the courses I knew from my time in Chiang Rai. He quickly followed up with a golf story of how he caught an American cheating in a local tournament.

I'm not surprised that the "several hundred" Americans in Chiang Mai tend to avoid him.

Yes, Maybe they'd avoid him with his outright criticizing and their cognitive dissonance but as an American i realize that he may be offering some constructive criticism at that. It's time people know and many are realizing we are not the America of 50 or 100 years ago. We Americans are poisoning the world with our Fast foods and GMO's.. We are trying to police the world constantly and what other nation do you know that has had so many indefinite wars going on? How about our Drone bombing or removal of Habeus Corpus? Our creation of 50,000+ new laws every year does not make us land of the free anymore but now we are more likely to be termed land of the caged, as we do have more prisoners than ANY other country on Earth. Then we tell other countries if they don't impose our laws we will cut their funding trying to make the whole world tow our line. As in the infamous words of GWB, "If you're not with us, you're against us" Obama is no different than GWB and in many cases even worse.

Edited May 26, 2013 by enjoybeing