Progress Made On Red-Yellow Reconciliation, Surapong Tells UN Rights Body

[webfact]

Progress made on red-yellow reconciliation, Surapong tells UN rights body

Nuntida Puangthong

The Nation

Geneva

GENEVA: Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul yesterday told the United Nations Human Rights Commission that his government had made progress in reconciling the deep colour-coded political divide in Thailand.

The government has been fully supportive of the work of the Truth for Reconciliation Commission of Thailand (TRCT), he said.

The TRCT was set up by the previous government after a major military crackdown on red-shirt protesters left 91 people dead, including security officials, in April and May 2010.

A committee has been set up to coordinate with the TRCT to follow up on actions taken to implement its recommendations, Surapong said. A compensation package was recently approved for all sides in the political conflict on an equal basis.

Investigations are still ongoing to bring the perpetrators to justice and provide redress to the victims, he said.

The Independent Committee to Promote the Rule of Law is studying ways to ensure that the work of state agencies follows the intent of the law and is fair and free of double standards, he said.

"Human rights lie not only at the heart of Thailand's domestic policies, but also our foreign policy. We will deliver on what we have pledged. Indeed, some of these commitments have already been realised," he said.

In his speech to the UN human-rights watchdog, various issues of concern were brought up, such as the rights of ageing and disabled people, women, children and victims of trafficking as well as political and human-rights development in Burma and Sri Lanka.

However, his speech did not address the issue of lese majeste, which has drawn the attention of many international human-rights defenders.

New York-based Human Rights Watch last week expressed deep concern over a Thai court's rejection of the bail requests of 12 of those charged with lese majeste. The criteria used for the red shirts and yellow shirts are not the same, it said.

"Bail appears to be systematically denied to members of the red shirts while they await trial for lese majeste," said Brad Adams, Asia director for Human Rights Watch. "Denial of bail seems to be for punishment rather than for justified reasons."

TRTC chairman Kanit Na Nakhon has publicly called for judges to treat lese majeste offenders more leniently, but to no avail.

Three bail requests were turned down this month. Members of red-shirt groups are basically major supporters of the incumbent government of Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra, while the conservative yellow-shirt royalists are mostly its opponents.

-- The Nation 2012-02-28

[pimay11]

GENEVA: Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul yesterday told the United Nations Human Rights Commission that his government had made progress in reconciling the deep colour-coded political divide in Thailand.

The government has been fully supportive of the work of the Truth for Reconciliation Commission of Thailand (TRCT), he said.

That is good news. I'm sure they will not over look the following recommendation.

5.9 The TRCT sees the root cause of conflicts that took place from the time of

promulgation of the Constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand B.E. 2540 (1997) to the rampage in 2010 was the use of procedures that were against the rule of law and democratic procedure.

Since the time the law was distorted in the case involving hidden assets of Thaksin in 2004, the government has not carried out any investigation of the case to determine the underlying reasons for such a suspicious occurrence. Therefore, the TRCT propose that the government along with relevant social agencies examine this case according to the rule of law.

[Reasonableman]

GENEVA: Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul yesterday told the United Nations Human Rights Commission that his government had made progress in reconciling the deep colour-coded political divide in Thailand.

The government has been fully supportive of the work of the Truth for Reconciliation Commission of Thailand (TRCT), he said.

That is good news. I'm sure they will not over look the following recommendation.

5.9 The TRCT sees the root cause of conflicts that took place from the time of

promulgation of the Constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand B.E. 2540 (1997) to the rampage in 2010 was the use of procedures that were against the rule of law and democratic procedure.

Since the time the law was distorted in the case involving hidden assets of Thaksin in 2004, the government has not carried out any investigation of the case to determine the underlying reasons for such a suspicious occurrence. Therefore, the TRCT propose that the government along with relevant social agencies examine this case according to the rule of law.

Still waiting.

[animatic]

It is amazing he has the brass balls to say this to the UN.

Clearly a falsehood as daily life in Thailand makes clear.

Unless he means his team is in control so they feel that

means reconciliation or they are winning at the moment.

[sparebox2]

May be Red and Yellow should work together to stop future coups, and bring Thaksin home to serve his 2 years.

[Reasonableman]

May be Red and Yellow should work together to stop future coups, and bring Thaksin home to serve his 2 years.

Maybe not quite that easy, SB2, as I believe there are several other cases remaining outstanding that cannot be heard until his return.

So it could in fact be substantially more than the 2 years, depending on the outcomes of those cases.

[phiphidon]

GENEVA: Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul yesterday told the United Nations Human Rights Commission that his government had made progress in reconciling the deep colour-coded political divide in Thailand.

The government has been fully supportive of the work of the Truth for Reconciliation Commission of Thailand (TRCT), he said.

That is good news. I'm sure they will not over look the following recommendation.

5.9 The TRCT sees the root cause of conflicts that took place from the time of

promulgation of the Constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand B.E. 2540 (1997) to the rampage in 2010 was the use of procedures that were against the rule of law and democratic procedure.

Since the time the law was distorted in the case involving hidden assets of Thaksin in 2004, the government has not carried out any investigation of the case to determine the underlying reasons for such a suspicious occurrence. Therefore, the TRCT propose that the government along with relevant social agencies examine this case according to the rule of law.

Still waiting.

Bear in mind that this recommendation (from a committee set up by Abhisit) was published during the democrats time of office - the onus was on them to investigate it.

It makes one wonder why the Abhisit government didn't investigate this? They had plenty of time in power to do so and arguably, more motive.

Edited February 28, 2012 by phiphidon

[Reasonableman]

GENEVA: Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul yesterday told the United Nations Human Rights Commission that his government had made progress in reconciling the deep colour-coded political divide in Thailand.

The government has been fully supportive of the work of the Truth for Reconciliation Commission of Thailand (TRCT), he said.

That is good news. I'm sure they will not over look the following recommendation.

5.9 The TRCT sees the root cause of conflicts that took place from the time of

promulgation of the Constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand B.E. 2540 (1997) to the rampage in 2010 was the use of procedures that were against the rule of law and democratic procedure.

Since the time the law was distorted in the case involving hidden assets of Thaksin in 2004, the government has not carried out any investigation of the case to determine the underlying reasons for such a suspicious occurrence. Therefore, the TRCT propose that the government along with relevant social agencies examine this case according to the rule of law.

Still waiting.

Bear in mind that this recommendation (from a committee set up by Abhisit) was published during the democrats time of office - the onus was on them to investigate it.

It makes one wonder why the Abhisit government didn't investigate this? They had plenty of time in power to do so and arguably, more motive.

Yes, and still waiting.

[LuckyLew]

and a pig just flew by my window

[sparebox2]

GENEVA: Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul yesterday told the United Nations Human Rights Commission that his government had made progress in reconciling the deep colour-coded political divide in Thailand.

The government has been fully supportive of the work of the Truth for Reconciliation Commission of Thailand (TRCT), he said.

That is good news. I'm sure they will not over look the following recommendation.

5.9 The TRCT sees the root cause of conflicts that took place from the time of

promulgation of the Constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand B.E. 2540 (1997) to the rampage in 2010 was the use of procedures that were against the rule of law and democratic procedure.

Since the time the law was distorted in the case involving hidden assets of Thaksin in 2004, the government has not carried out any investigation of the case to determine the underlying reasons for such a suspicious occurrence. Therefore, the TRCT propose that the government along with relevant social agencies examine this case according to the rule of law.

Still waiting.

Bear in mind that this recommendation (from a committee set up by Abhisit) was published during the democrats time of office - the onus was on them to investigate it.

It makes one wonder why the Abhisit government didn't investigate this? They had plenty of time in power to do so and arguably, more motive.

Because Mark's govt is a NATO govt.

No Action, Talk Only govt.

[Reasonableman]

So this issue is being addressed promptly by the current proactive government. That's great. Another long-standing bone of contention is being processed towards reconciliation. Wonderful to see some real progress, isn't it?

Edited February 28, 2012 by Reasonableman

[hanuman1]

May be Red and Yellow should work together to stop future coups, and bring Thaksin home to serve his 2 years.

Maybe not quite that easy, SB2, as I believe there are several other cases remaining outstanding that cannot be heard until his return.

So it could in fact be substantially more than the 2 years, depending on the outcomes of those cases.

Does anyone know why Thaksin can't be tried in absentia for the outstanding cases?

One would imagine - after the lack of success in getting him to return home and stand trial over the past number of years - that seeing these outstanding cases settled one way or another would move the current impasse along.

[lannarebirth]

May be Red and Yellow should work together to stop future coups, and bring Thaksin home to serve his 2 years.

Maybe not quite that easy, SB2, as I believe there are several other cases remaining outstanding that cannot be heard until his return.

So it could in fact be substantially more than the 2 years, depending on the outcomes of those cases.

Does anyone know why Thaksin can't be tried in absentia for the outstanding cases?

One would imagine - after the lack of success in getting him to return home and stand trial over the past number of years - that seeing these outstanding cases settled one way or another would move the current impasse along.

One CAN be tried in absentia here provided they were present to hear charges laid against them; Thakisn was not.

[Reasonableman]

May be Red and Yellow should work together to stop future coups, and bring Thaksin home to serve his 2 years.

Maybe not quite that easy, SB2, as I believe there are several other cases remaining outstanding that cannot be heard until his return.

So it could in fact be substantially more than the 2 years, depending on the outcomes of those cases.

Does anyone know why Thaksin can't be tried in absentia for the outstanding cases?

One would imagine - after the lack of success in getting him to return home and stand trial over the past number of years - that seeing these outstanding cases settled one way or another would move the current impasse along.

One CAN be tried in absentia here provided they were present to hear charges laid against them; Thakisn was not.

Perhaps a phone-in could satisfy this requirement.

[hanuman1]

Maybe not quite that easy, SB2, as I believe there are several other cases remaining outstanding that cannot be heard until his return.

So it could in fact be substantially more than the 2 years, depending on the outcomes of those cases.

Does anyone know why Thaksin can't be tried in absentia for the outstanding cases?

One would imagine - after the lack of success in getting him to return home and stand trial over the past number of years - that seeing these outstanding cases settled one way or another would move the current impasse along.

One CAN be tried in absentia here provided they were present to hear charges laid against them; Thakisn was not.

Perhaps a phone-in could satisfy this requirement.

Flippant though your remark seems to be, I wonder why this is not considered as a possible way forward.

Presumably, both sides would want to resolve the issue of these outstanding charges and doing it as a trial in absentia seems a less contentious and volatile way than having Thaksin suddenly appear at Swampy, and a clear progression in this political stalemate that has been stifling the country's development for years now.

[Unkomoncents]

This has to be procedural. No one in the international community believes a word the Thai government says, because if you've lived in Thailand for any time, you know that honesty is about the least important social value in the country. Nevertheless, they have to go through the motions so that the Thai government can 'feel' like they're respected and listened to. If the UN doesn't help the Thai government gain face, they won't get ANY cooperation. So here we go again: the Thai government will tell us (as opposed to demonstrate) that it are committed to human rights and progress is being made.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Unkomoncents

[whybother]

Flippant though your remark seems to be, I wonder why this is not considered as a possible way forward.

Presumably, both sides would want to resolve the issue of these outstanding charges and doing it as a trial in absentia seems a less contentious and volatile way than having Thaksin suddenly appear at Swampy, and a clear progression in this political stalemate that has been stifling the country's development for years now.

Maybe because some people don't want the cases to go forward ... on both sides of the fence.

[lannarebirth]

Flippant though your remark seems to be, I wonder why this is not considered as a possible way forward.

Presumably, both sides would want to resolve the issue of these outstanding charges and doing it as a trial in absentia seems a less contentious and volatile way than having Thaksin suddenly appear at Swampy, and a clear progression in this political stalemate that has been stifling the country's development for years now.

Maybe because some people don't want the cases to go forward ... on both sides of the fence.

That's probably part of it, but I think the real issue is the whole process has to be seen as unfair and a witchhunt, as there is no further appeal for the crime he has already been convicted of. He's not going to do that time, so he needs to establish himself as a political victim and somehow get it all thrown out.

[animatic]

This has to be procedural. No one in the international community believes a word the Thai government says, because if you've lived in Thailand for any time, you know that honesty is about the least important social value in the country. Nevertheless, they have to go through the motions so that the Thai government can 'feel' like they're respected and listened to. If the UN doesn't help the Thai government gain face, they won't get ANY cooperation. So here we go again: the Thai government will tell us (as opposed to demonstrate) that it are committed to human rights and progress is being made.

Pretty much, even when they are in the right, no one is sure it isn't BS. and that goes for ANY and ALL Thai governments.

[phiphidon]

Still waiting.

Bear in mind that this recommendation (from a committee set up by Abhisit) was published during the democrats time of office - the onus was on them to investigate it.

It makes one wonder why the Abhisit government didn't investigate this? They had plenty of time in power to do so and arguably, more motive.

Yes, and still waiting.

So do you have an answer as to why the democrats ignored this important part of the reconcilliation process or are you going to just blame the present government?

[Reasonableman]

Still waiting.

Bear in mind that this recommendation (from a committee set up by Abhisit) was published during the democrats time of office - the onus was on them to investigate it.

It makes one wonder why the Abhisit government didn't investigate this? They had plenty of time in power to do so and arguably, more motive.

Yes, and still waiting.

So do you have an answer as to why the democrats ignored this important part of the reconcilliation process or are you going to just blame the present government?

They both share responsibility for the inaction, wouldn't you agree? Where did I only blame the current government alone? Still waiting. In your case, however, you tried to duck-shove the "blame" entirely onto the Democrats, and thereby disavow the responsibility of the current government. That was unbalanced, and deserving of a response.

Anyway, still waiting....

Edited February 28, 2012 by Reasonableman

[lannarebirth]

Still waiting.

Bear in mind that this recommendation (from a committee set up by Abhisit) was published during the democrats time of office - the onus was on them to investigate it.

It makes one wonder why the Abhisit government didn't investigate this? They had plenty of time in power to do so and arguably, more motive.

Yes, and still waiting.

So do you have an answer as to why the democrats ignored this important part of the reconcilliation process or are you going to just blame the present government?

Well, you answered your own question in one of your earlier posts. They do have the stronger motive and of course any findings would be labeled as "political" rather than "reconciliatory". Just like this government sees the opening of it's Red Shirt Villages as reconciliatory, which is an even more blatant and obscene example.

BTW, I ran into one of theR.S. villages here in Chiang Mai. 7 red flags flying at various heights with a picture of Thaksin centered between them. I thought he said he wasn't affiliated with the Red Shirts? Say, didn't he just have YET ANOTHER phone in to them the other day?

You putting any of these pieces together on what the end game is here or are you just content to add your back biting to posts about various news clips that appear here daily?

[Orac]

It is amazing he has the brass balls to say this to the UN.

Clearly a falsehood as daily life in Thailand makes clear.

Unless he means his team is in control so they feel that

means reconciliation or they are winning at the moment.

It is a pretty easy claim to make since the bar was set rather low by the previous government - I haven't seen any protesters shot in the street lately.

[whybother]

It is amazing he has the brass balls to say this to the UN.

Clearly a falsehood as daily life in Thailand makes clear.

Unless he means his team is in control so they feel that

means reconciliation or they are winning at the moment.

It is a pretty easy claim to make since the bar was set rather low by the previous government - I haven't seen any protesters shot in the street lately.

Not many people being blown up by grenades recently either.

[bigbamboo]

Not sure how setting up thousands of Red shirt villages is progress.

[Orac]

It is amazing he has the brass balls to say this to the UN.

Clearly a falsehood as daily life in Thailand makes clear.

Unless he means his team is in control so they feel that

means reconciliation or they are winning at the moment.

It is a pretty easy claim to make since the bar was set rather low by the previous government - I haven't seen any protesters shot in the street lately.

Not many people being blown up by grenades recently either.

Exactly. And no shoot to kill on druggies though I did see a thread on here about some Rohingya being rounded up so everything isn't totally rosy just yet!

Edited February 28, 2012 by Orac

[rubl]

The first interim report of TRTC from April 2011 I only have in Thai, but Robert A.'s site has a reasonable translation, including

"On 6th July, 2010, the Cabinet endorsed the Regulation of the Office of the Prime Minister on the Truth for National Reconciliation (TRCT) which formally established the Commission, allocated a period of two years for the Commission to complete its investigation (commencing from 17 July 2010 and extending to 16 July, 2012) ..."

http://robertamsterdam.com/thailand/?p=664

The second interim report from December 2011 is here:

http://nationmultimedia.com/home/admin/specials/sound/file/TrctReportEng.pdf

[BigJohnnyBKK]

All the farang blow-hards here on their high horses need to recognize that there are very few people on either side that give 2¢ for true "justice", rule of law or any other abstract concepts like the welfare of the common people - it's 99.9% a struggle for control of wealth and power. There is no need from a realpolitik POV for Thaksin's team to take any conciliatory steps towards the goals of the opposition, as they hold all the cards.

Reconciliation in effect means the opposition accepting the fact that Thaksin is in charge, and if they try anything effective against him there will be full-blown civil war. To the extent they refuse to accept that situation, the effectiveness of the government will be hindered by his need to exercise his control remotely from overseas.

Of course that suits the opposition just fine - remember very few with real power actually care about the welfare of the country as a whole - so we are likely to continue in this stalemate for quite some time.

[AleG]

All the farang blow-hards here on their high horses need to recognize that there are very few people on either side that give 2¢ for true "justice", rule of law or any other abstract concepts like the welfare of the common people - it's 99.9% a struggle for control of wealth and power. There is no need from a realpolitik POV for Thaksin's team to take any conciliatory steps towards the goals of the opposition, as they hold all the cards.

Reconciliation in effect means the opposition accepting the fact that Thaksin is in charge, and if they try anything effective against him there will be full-blown civil war. To the extent they refuse to accept that situation, the effectiveness of the government will be hindered by his need to exercise his control remotely from overseas.

Of course that suits the opposition just fine - remember very few with real power actually care about the welfare of the country as a whole - so we are likely to continue in this stalemate for quite some time.

You must be absolutely delightful as a hostage on an armed heist.

[animatic]

May be Red and Yellow should work together to stop future coups, and bring Thaksin home to serve his 2 years.

Maybe not quite that easy, SB2, as I believe there are several other cases remaining outstanding that cannot be heard until his return.

So it could in fact be substantially more than the 2 years, depending on the outcomes of those cases.

Does anyone know why Thaksin can't be tried in absentia for the outstanding cases?

One would imagine - after the lack of success in getting him to return home and stand trial over the past number of years - that seeing these outstanding cases settled one way or another would move the current impasse along.

One CAN be tried in absentia here provided they were present to hear charges laid against them; Thakisn was not.

Which is why he stays abroad and doesn't do the short sentence he has gotten. In jail he can't stop them bringing him to court to face the charges first. It's never been about the Racha case, but about the 7 other much more serious charges he has stalled.

Reconciliation for him is he gots off scot free on all charges.

Edited February 29, 2012 by animatic