folium Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Having spent a fair amount of time in Myanmar lately the simple conclusion I have arrived at is that Thailand, by comparison, has become rather like living in some rather soulless part of the US or Europe. Convenient and relatively well resourced but hardly exciting. 30 years ago Thailand had soul, character and a genuine feeling of being somewhere different and exotic. Now much of it resembles some shoddy area of SE Florida or the Spanish Costas. But what's special, unique or out of the ordinary in Thailand today? 30 years ago Thailand was the only viable option in SE Asia for foreigners. Sadly while the rest of the region has moved on, Thailand remains mired in its particular form of navel-gazing and self-absorption. Why is it that no Thai company has ever made it big beyond the boundaries of Thailand? The cosy, incestuous little nexus of Thai-Chinese business owners and military power has enriched some but has also ensured that the country slips into relative insignificance outside its territorial boundaries. No country is perfect, but as LOS increasingly comes to resemble a tired version of suburban sprawl, and its charms become concreted over in a sea of homogenous mediocrity, what is left? Seems to be a rerun of the UK in the 1950's, namely a country looking for a role and a purpose as the world changes rapidly around it , and leaving it in its dust. Perhaps it's all part of the growing up process and I am just lumbered by misguided nostalgia, but Thailand seems to be a place that's not very comfortable in its own skin at the moment. As its neighbours finally get their act together this feeling is only going to increase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daftpunker Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) Edited February 28, 2012 by daftpunker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovelaos Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Ssssshhhhhhh!! All them idiot expats might start coming to live here instead. Leave them where they are. I left there 8 years ago when I felt the same as you do now. Best thing I ever did. Thailand for me is a once a month shopping trip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marstons Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 could not have put it better myself. Trying to figure out which neighbouring country to go to. Ticket to Myanmar not until July unfurtunatly, coming for a look see. 160 baht each way had to be done and checked out. LOS Land Of Scams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balo Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Cambodia is more like Thailand 30 years ago. If I had to move , Cambodia would be my first option. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DP25 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Good idea, move to neighboring countries with rampant and grinding poverty on a scale far worse than Thailand had even 30 years ago. Sure to encounter no scams there and the bar girls go with you for almost nothing because you have such a kind heart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autan Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) I think some good points have been raised, especially concerning where Thailand is as a Tourist Center at the moment. IMHO Thailand needs to shrug off the sex tourism stereotype, drug fueled full moon party image, which could lead to a lifetime in a pretty orible place. Instead it needs to promote itself as a cheap, clean paradise destinations where English is widely spoken, the food is second to none and friendly to FAMILIES. This would re-energise the tourism industry far better than sex crazed dirty old men (no offence intended) roaming the streets of Pattaya looking for some. Or off your face in Ko Samui on Yabba and waking up in a police cell looking at a 10 stretch. Thailand needs to use its best assets, the people, the country and for God's sake devalue the currency. That will bring just the right sort of people to Thailand. Like I said, thats my opinion, your welcome to disagree. Edited February 28, 2012 by autan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookMan Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 I thought Myanmar was a 30 day entry only? is that not the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petesear Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Good idea, move to neighboring countries with rampant and grinding poverty on a scale far worse than Thailand had even 30 years ago. Sure to encounter no scams there and the bar girls go with you for almost nothing because you have such a kind heart Good to see you are sorting your priorities for living somewhere! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExpatJ Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Disagree with the original poster- Bloomberg just had an article pointing out Thailand manufacturing/industry is leading the world in several areas- e.g. Thailand overtook the US to be the biggest producer of pick up trucks this year and it is also global leader in producing/exporting agricultural products. Thailand is also ranked this year as the most attractive emerging market for invesmtent (after China) by Goldman Sachs if i recall. As to Thailand's neighbours- Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar- these are all WAY more corrupt,ineffiencient and standard of living is way lower for expats if you are looking for modern conveniences, stable elecricity and water supply, decent hospitals etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
folium Posted February 29, 2012 Author Share Posted February 29, 2012 Disagree with the original poster- Bloomberg just had an article pointing out Thailand manufacturing/industry is leading the world in several areas- e.g. Thailand overtook the US to be the biggest producer of pick up trucks this year and it is also global leader in producing/exporting agricultural products. Thailand is also ranked this year as the most attractive emerging market for invesmtent (after China) by Goldman Sachs if i recall. As to Thailand's neighbours- Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar- these are all WAY more corrupt,ineffiencient and standard of living is way lower for expats if you are looking for modern conveniences, stable elecricity and water supply, decent hospitals etc Think you are missing the point here. If you wanted to live/visit a place with car manufacturing, engineering output and a good investment climate, combined with modern conveniences, stable utilities and decent healthcare, Europe or the US meet those requirements pretty well (at least in the long term re investments). The irony here is that Thailand is becoming increasingly similar in many ways, in many places, to what foreign western immigrants to Thailand left behind in the first place. Similar to a survey undertaken in the UK as to what would constitute the perfect holiday. The runaway winner was the option of transplanting your local pub with all your friends to a tropical beach. Funny sounds like Pattaya, Koh Samui or Phuket. Aspirational middle-class Thais are chasing the American dream of a suburban mini-McMansion with 2 cars in the drive. There's nothing wrong in all this and none of it is particularly surprising, and for many foreign people Thailand provides exactly what they seek, namely familiarity and convenience with better weather. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JurgenG Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 First time I came to Thailand, it was as a kid with my parents in the early 80's. Now I'm 30 years older and a professional "expat". As a kid and as a teenager I wanted Thailand to be a land of adventure. Now I want first world infrastructures. Thailand evolution suits my personal evolution. No complains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gweiloman Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Disagree with the original poster- Bloomberg just had an article pointing out Thailand manufacturing/industry is leading the world in several areas- e.g. Thailand overtook the US to be the biggest producer of pick up trucks this year and it is also global leader in producing/exporting agricultural products. Thailand is also ranked this year as the most attractive emerging market for invesmtent (after China) by Goldman Sachs if i recall. As to Thailand's neighbours- Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar- these are all WAY more corrupt,ineffiencient and standard of living is way lower for expats if you are looking for modern conveniences, stable elecricity and water supply, decent hospitals etc Think you are missing the point here. If you wanted to live/visit a place with car manufacturing, engineering output and a good investment climate, combined with modern conveniences, stable utilities and decent healthcare, Europe or the US meet those requirements pretty well (at least in the long term re investments). The irony here is that Thailand is becoming increasingly similar in many ways, in many places, to what foreign western immigrants to Thailand left behind in the first place. Similar to a survey undertaken in the UK as to what would constitute the perfect holiday. The runaway winner was the option of transplanting your local pub with all your friends to a tropical beach. Funny sounds like Pattaya, Koh Samui or Phuket. Aspirational middle-class Thais are chasing the American dream of a suburban mini-McMansion with 2 cars in the drive. There's nothing wrong in all this and none of it is particularly surprising, and for many foreign people Thailand provides exactly what they seek, namely familiarity and convenience with better weather. I like the points you raised in your original post and subsequent reply to the above. However, are you focusing only on the bigger cities like Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Phuket, Pattaya? I currently work and live in Bangkok but take every opportunity to spend weekends in a small mooban 600 kms away in Isaan. The life there cannot be any more different than in Bangkok. Playing badminton / paddle ball on the street, sitting cross legged eating Thai BBQ with all the neighbours (or any one just passing by for that matter). Taking the motorsai and just riding out to the paddy fields. Gazing up to the sky at night and seeing more stars than I've even seen in the last 30 years of living in Zurich / London / Hong Kong / Singapore. And at the same time, still within easy driving distance of all the modern conveniences that we need. I will still take Thailand, despite all it's warts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackdawson Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 some rather soulless part of the US Hey, that's not fair to Arizona. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurnell Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Thailand is way better than it was 30 years ago. Why the flock would I want to sit in traffic for hours, shop in shoddy department stores, eat unpalatable farang food and drink low grade beer? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llso Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Thailand has certainly changed dramatically in the last 10-15 years. It has undergone a very rapid modernization , and along with that comes increased regulation, inflation, and a higher standard of living for some. I first arrived in 2000 which I believe was the end of the "Golden Age". Expectations are higher among the general population and consumerism has reared it's ugly head. I have found attitudes are more mercenary and everyone is looking for a "piece of the pie". Western tourists are not the majority anymore as Arabs and other Asians have begun to displace them. Global Economics and currency trends have also played a part with the weakening of the US Dollar and Euro. I have been to other countries, Laos, Burma , Cambodia, and Malaysia during my time in Thailand. None of these countries have the mass appeal to the casual tourist as of yet as Thailand. As these other countries continue to develop ther infrastructure and attrct more resident Expat populations this wil change . LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSixpack Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 (edited) Thailand's better than ever 'cause it offers much more variety and appeals to more markets than it ever has. You want a more primitive, rural life, Thailand still has a VAST area of countryside that hasn't changed much in centuries except most villages have internet, cellular service, and fairly reliable power. But you can turn it off if you wish. Other countries "moving on" is nonsense except that it really means that they are making progress in becoming more like Thailand. I think the OP is just whinging 'cause Thailand's not as poor as it was and so doesn't make him feel like a big, rich, important Great White Hope, which fragile egos and small wallets need. And given worldwide inflation and the decline of the dollar, the OP's probably feeling the pinch. So it's really all about the OP losing his mojo and projecting that misfortune onto Thailand itself. Sorry! After you've lived in SE Asia a while, it no longer feels particularly exotic. That has always been true. Politically, Thailand has always been relatively unstable, that's not new. Time to move along, nothing to see here. Edited February 29, 2012 by JSixpack 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berkshire Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Disagree with the original poster- Bloomberg just had an article pointing out Thailand manufacturing/industry is leading the world in several areas- e.g. Thailand overtook the US to be the biggest producer of pick up trucks this year and it is also global leader in producing/exporting agricultural products. Thailand is also ranked this year as the most attractive emerging market for invesmtent (after China) by Goldman Sachs if i recall. As to Thailand's neighbours- Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar- these are all WAY more corrupt,ineffiencient and standard of living is way lower for expats if you are looking for modern conveniences, stable elecricity and water supply, decent hospitals etc Think you are missing the point here. If you wanted to live/visit a place with car manufacturing, engineering output and a good investment climate, combined with modern conveniences, stable utilities and decent healthcare, Europe or the US meet those requirements pretty well (at least in the long term re investments). The irony here is that Thailand is becoming increasingly similar in many ways, in many places, to what foreign western immigrants to Thailand left behind in the first place. Similar to a survey undertaken in the UK as to what would constitute the perfect holiday. The runaway winner was the option of transplanting your local pub with all your friends to a tropical beach. Funny sounds like Pattaya, Koh Samui or Phuket. Aspirational middle-class Thais are chasing the American dream of a suburban mini-McMansion with 2 cars in the drive. There's nothing wrong in all this and none of it is particularly surprising, and for many foreign people Thailand provides exactly what they seek, namely familiarity and convenience with better weather. I think you may be missing the point. I'm sure you realize that Myanmar aspires to be like Thailand. To put it another way--if Myanmar was a guy--he'd give his right nut to be like Thailand. But he's got a long, LONG way to go. It seems like you dislike Thailand because of the progress made, that you'd prefer Thailand to be more backwards like Myanmar, Cambodia, and other neighbors. But ExpatJ is right. Thailand's neighbors are way behind with the only redeeming feature being lower cost. Everything else is pretty much advantage Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
folium Posted February 29, 2012 Author Share Posted February 29, 2012 Thailand's better than ever 'cause it offers much more variety and appeals to more markets than it ever has. You want a more primitive, rural life, Thailand still has a VAST area of countryside that hasn't changed much in centuries except most villages have internet, cellular service, and fairly reliable power. But you can turn it off if you wish. Other countries "moving on" is nonsense except that it really means that they are making progress in becoming more like Thailand. I think the OP is just whinging 'cause Thailand's not as poor as it was and so doesn't make him feel like a big, rich, important Great White Hope, which fragile egos and small wallets need. And given worldwide inflation and the decline of the dollar, the OP's probably feeling the pinch. So it's really all about the OP losing his mojo and projecting that misfortune onto Thailand itself. Sorry! After you've lived in SE Asia a while, it no longer feels particularly exotic. That has always been true. Politically, Thailand has always been relatively unstable, that's not new. Time to move along, nothing to see here. Shame that you feel the need to resort to arrogant assumptions about my gender, race, nationality, source of wealth and level of wealth. And by the way you score 0/5, definite fail. If Thailand ticks every box on your wishlist fantastic. Personally I feel Thailand has lost a lot of its particular charm and appeal as it has "developed" in the last 30 years. It's not that I seek rural poverty as some glorious backdrop, and every country in the region and beyond has its issues, but I just feel that an element of what made this country special has been lost. If you disagree, that's your absolute right, you just don't need to be rude about it. The perils of anonymity. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chops Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Well, Thailand has a pretty good infrastructure. The only countries in SEA that are liveable for most expats are Singapore, Thailand and Malaysia. Been to a hospital in Myanmar or Laos? Rather scary experiences... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richmeister Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Its a massive disappointment to me. I cant wait to leave. This place sucks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
londoedan Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 (edited) Well, Thailand has a pretty good infrastructure. The only countries in SEA that are liveable for most expats are Singapore, Thailand and Malaysia. Been to a hospital in Myanmar or Laos? Rather scary experiences... I would add Indonesia to that list. Edited February 29, 2012 by londoedan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
londoedan Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Its a massive disappointment to me. I cant wait to leave. This place sucks. Bye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Nostalgia's crap nowadays. People should revert to jungle poverty for my holidays SC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSixpack Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 (edited) Personally I feel Thailand has lost a lot of its particular charm and appeal as it has "developed" in the last 30 years. It's not that I seek rural poverty as some glorious backdrop, and every country in the region and beyond has its issues, but I just feel that an element of what made this country special has been lost. You've had plenty of opportunity to say what it is EXACTLY that has been "lost" and haven't so far except SOME areas that were poor aren't so poor any longer. And as I've noted, you can still find throughout Thailand plenty of that same ol' grinding poverty that everyone would love to escape IF they had opportunity. Of course, you can find much more of it in even less developed countries, and that's what feels so good to you personally. Humble, simple, ignorant, superstitious, brown-skinned people living their short lives in abject poverty struggling to get by while you watch above it all. Ah! And I'm the arrogant one around here? It's really all about you "feel" as you repeated twice in the above paragraph. Sorry you lost your mojo and believe, falsely, it's game over for you. But do live in cheaper Burma and "feel" good. Get a serious illness and of course you'll stay right there and let a Burmese hospital treat it. Of course you will. BTW, your gender or nationality is irrelevant. Clearly you ain't Thai though. Edited February 29, 2012 by JSixpack 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanForbes Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Nostalgia's crap nowadays. People should revert to jungle poverty for my holidays SC Well, there's always something for everyone. It's all about personal choices. I used to be happy doing this... And the fact was I had one of my best night's sleep anywhere on a bow bed of cut branches. Now I've grown soft and upgraded to a camper with gas heating, a fridge and stove... And, I'm quite happy doing the same thing in Thailand... sitting on plastic chairs or stools in front of a campfire.. Only the big centipedes and scorpions in the morning are a bit of a nuisance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongThaimer Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Well, Thailand has a pretty good infrastructure. The only countries in SEA that are liveable for most expats are Singapore, Thailand and Malaysia. Been to a hospital in Myanmar or Laos? Rather scary experiences... I would add Indonesia to that list. Manila is alright to live ............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanForbes Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Well, Thailand has a pretty good infrastructure. The only countries in SEA that are liveable for most expats are Singapore, Thailand and Malaysia. Been to a hospital in Myanmar or Laos? Rather scary experiences... I would add Indonesia to that list. Manila is alright to live ............ As long as you have a personal body guard with an automatic rifle. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExpatJ Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Disagree with the original poster- Bloomberg just had an article pointing out Thailand manufacturing/industry is leading the world in several areas- e.g. Thailand overtook the US to be the biggest producer of pick up trucks this year and it is also global leader in producing/exporting agricultural products. Thailand is also ranked this year as the most attractive emerging market for invesmtent (after China) by Goldman Sachs if i recall. As to Thailand's neighbours- Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Myanmar- these are all WAY more corrupt,ineffiencient and standard of living is way lower for expats if you are looking for modern conveniences, stable elecricity and water supply, decent hospitals etc Think you are missing the point here. If you wanted to live/visit a place with car manufacturing, engineering output and a good investment climate, combined with modern conveniences, stable utilities and decent healthcare, Europe or the US meet those requirements pretty well (at least in the long term re investments). The irony here is that Thailand is becoming increasingly similar in many ways, in many places, to what foreign western immigrants to Thailand left behind in the first place. Similar to a survey undertaken in the UK as to what would constitute the perfect holiday. The runaway winner was the option of transplanting your local pub with all your friends to a tropical beach. Funny sounds like Pattaya, Koh Samui or Phuket. Aspirational middle-class Thais are chasing the American dream of a suburban mini-McMansion with 2 cars in the drive. There's nothing wrong in all this and none of it is particularly surprising, and for many foreign people Thailand provides exactly what they seek, namely familiarity and convenience with better weather. i was responding to your paragraph about thai companies, navel gazing etc- to show infact that its the opposite . Plus making the point that whatever thailands mojo is, it is far more mojorific than its neighbours in every category- at least in terms of being expat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExpatJ Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Nostalgia's crap nowadays. People should revert to jungle poverty for my holidays SC Well, there's always something for everyone. It's all about personal choices. I used to be happy doing this... And the fact was I had one of my best night's sleep anywhere on a bow bed of cut branches. Now I've grown soft and upgraded to a camper with gas heating, a fridge and stove... And, I'm quite happy doing the same thing in Thailand... sitting on plastic chairs or stools in front of a campfire.. Only the big centipedes and scorpions in the morning are a bit of a nuisance. Very nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now