Israel and Palestine agree to cease fire after rocket attacks, airstrikes

[Wallaby]

I don't know some people think that the Palestinians have to bend over and take it before they are considered for inclusion as a country. Why is it that the Palestinians have to accept Israel's demands. If Israel wanted peace surely they too could have it by accepting the Palestinian demands.

But for some on here it is just one way traffic and can be no other way.

Fortunately, the majority of the world doesn't think like some on here, they already recognise Palestine, and the number is growing.

Even without any peace agreement with Israel they will still eventually have full international recognition. If Israel isn't careful, and doesn't start coming to the party, they may find that they are the ones that will end up with nothing.

[Ulysses G.]

But they still hit bugger all don't they?

And it seems Hamas wasn't involved so no point arguing about what they have done.

Are you for real?

Hamas runs Gaza, they are the so called elected government - even if they're not involved directly, they are responsible for keeping the peace or breaking it. Can't have it both ways, and it's not a question of whodunit:

Thousands of Islamic Jihad sympathizers participated in the group's victory rally celebrating the end of the current round of violence against Israel on Tuesday. The rally was attended by senior Islamic Jihad officials while the group's secretary-general, Ramadan Shallah, sent a video message from Damascus.

http://www.ynetnews....4202601,00.html

Ridiculous indeed. Hamas have a steel grip on Gaza and are responsible for everything that happens.

[Wallaby]

The so called Country of Palestine is split in two halfs, Hamas in Gaza and Fattah on the West Bank ,All through this thread Fattah has never been mentioned as showing violent tendencies towards Israel or Israel towards Fattah maybe this should spell it out EXACTLY what I wrote previously if Hamas just listened to Mahmoud Abbas and not their well heeled leaders who subscribe Jihad then there would be peace and a state called Palastine with months

BTW, I don't see the need to refer to it as a 'so called country'. The majority of the world already recognise it. Having to tiptoe around it should only be the reserve for pedants who have nothing but that argument to justify warmongering.

[Ulysses G.]

But for some on here it is just one way traffic and can be no other way.

True confessions.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Ulysses G.]

Thank you Pakboong for your most informative links ,as stated previously which was indicated quite plainly in the links ,it is NOT Palestine that is the problem but Hamas in Gaza ,not once did I read of Fattah in the West Bank ,as stated previously too the Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas is branded a traitor by Hamas, A traitor for wanting peace with Israel!!!, as for the targeted killings ,far better to target an individual deemed a threat to Israel's security than a fire rockets indiscriminately into a civilian area with no idea what or who they are going to hit .

But who do they hit? How many have been hit?

Are you saying they fire their rockets and pray to Allah they do not hit anyone or anything!

No, but they aren't very succesful are they. As UG says, their main objective is fear. So it isn't their main objective to kill.

So what? They hurt, maim and kill people and if they could figure out how to kill more, they would. They are terrorists and they target innocent civilians in any way that they can.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Wallaby]

So what? They hurt, maim and kill people and if they could figure out how to kill more, they would. They are terrorists and they target innocent civilians in any way that they can.

How many have they killed? Even you admitted that killing isn't their main objective.

How many have the Israelis killed?

[Colin Yai]

And the majority of the world agreeing with Palestine.

There is no country called Palestine to agree with, but there would be if they ever agreed to make peace.

I didn't say there was a country called Palestine. Please learn to read. Though I do accept that to jusify your argument you have to clutch at straws.

Your view is a minority and is wrong. The majority of the world knows you are wrong and agrees with the Palestinians. Put any spin on it you like and believe what you like. If you are happy being wrong then that's a matter for you.

Of course the "MAJORITY" once said the Earth was flat did,nt it

[chuckd]

But they still hit bugger all don't they?

And it seems Hamas wasn't involved so no point arguing about what they have done.

One reason they are not hitting much is because 75% of them are being intercepted by Iron Dome Missiles.

Wish I could hit 75% of fairways and greens.

_______________________________________________________

75% of Gaza rockets blocked by Israel’s ‘Iron Dome’ air-defence system

Agence France-Presse Mar 12, 2012 – 12:31 PM ET | Last Updated: Mar 12, 2012 12:36 PM ET

"From the article"

By Monday afternoon, Palestinians had fired more than 200 rockets and mortar rounds from Gaza into southern Israel since a latest round of fighting erupted on Friday, the military said.

Gaza emergency services said that at least 23 Palestinians had been killed and 73 wounded since Friday as Israeli launched 36 air strikes against the territory.

On Monday, 31 rockets headed for urban centres were targeted by Iron Dome, which scored 23 hits, the military said, a 75 percent success rate.

“The system is working very well,” Brigadier General Doron Gavish briefed reporters at one of the batteries in the vicinity of Ashdod, 25 kilometres from the Gaza border.

http://news.national...defence-system/

[Wallaby]

And the majority of the world agreeing with Palestine.

There is no country called Palestine to agree with, but there would be if they ever agreed to make peace.

I didn't say there was a country called Palestine. Please learn to read. Though I do accept that to jusify your argument you have to clutch at straws.

Your view is a minority and is wrong. The majority of the world knows you are wrong and agrees with the Palestinians. Put any spin on it you like and believe what you like. If you are happy being wrong then that's a matter for you.

Of course the "MAJORITY" once said the Earth was flat did,nt it

Is that what you rely on as a defence?

[Colin Yai]

So what? They hurt, maim and kill people and if they could figure out how to kill more, they would. They are terrorists and they target innocent civilians in any way that they can.

How many have they killed? Even you admitted that killing isn't their main objective.

How many have the Israelis killed?

Obviously every time they use a hammer to drive a nail they break their thumbs ,either they are very stupid or getting well paid for doing so

[Wallaby]

But they still hit bugger all don't they?

And it seems Hamas wasn't involved so no point arguing about what they have done.

One reason they are not hitting much is because 75% of them are being intercepted by Iron Dome Missiles.

Wish I could hit 75% of fairways and greens.

_______________________________________________________

75% of Gaza rockets blocked by Israel’s ‘Iron Dome’ air-defence system

Agence France-Presse Mar 12, 2012 – 12:31 PM ET | Last Updated: Mar 12, 2012 12:36 PM ET

"From the article"

By Monday afternoon, Palestinians had fired more than 200 rockets and mortar rounds from Gaza into southern Israel since a latest round of fighting erupted on Friday, the military said.

Gaza emergency services said that at least 23 Palestinians had been killed and 73 wounded since Friday as Israeli launched 36 air strikes against the territory.

On Monday, 31 rockets headed for urban centres were targeted by Iron Dome, which scored 23 hits, the military said, a 75 percent success rate.

“The system is working very well,” Brigadier General Doron Gavish briefed reporters at one of the batteries in the vicinity of Ashdod, 25 kilometres from the Gaza border.

http://news.national...defence-system/

If we could hit that percentage of fairways and greens I doubt either of us would be on this forum. We'd be much happier out on the course.

[Wallaby]

So what? They hurt, maim and kill people and if they could figure out how to kill more, they would. They are terrorists and they target innocent civilians in any way that they can.

How many have they killed? Even you admitted that killing isn't their main objective.

How many have the Israelis killed?

Obviously every time they use a hammer to drive a nail they break their thumbs ,either they are very stupid or getting well paid for doing so

Can't argue with that at all. I agree, they ain't the brightest or best at it.

[Colin Yai]

I wonder why is it that Fattah on the West bank remains virtual unscathed from Israeli "attacks" ,and Hamas in Gaza is bearing the brunt,? Flying ,Wallaby? Curse the thought it could not be that Fattah on the West Bank want peace and Dialogue with the Israelis.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Colin Yai

[Wallaby]

I wonder why is it that Fattah on the West bank remains virtual unscathed from Israeli "attacks" ,and Hamas in Gaza is bearing the brunt,Wallaby?

Because Hamas are morons and not worth a pinch of shit and need to pull their heads in.

As do Israel with their building of settlements.

I'm not one sided, I'm anti those that think Israel are angels and can do no wrong.

[craigt3365]

A few posts were removed. Please keep it civil and please show respect to other members.

And yes, trying to figure out what to remove and what to leave is NOT easy!!!

[Colin Yai]

I wonder why is it that Fattah on the West bank remains virtual unscathed from Israeli "attacks" ,and Hamas in Gaza is bearing the brunt,Wallaby?

Because Hamas are morons and not worth a pinch of shit and need to pull their heads in.

As do Israel with their building of settlements.

I'm not one sided, I'm anti those that think Israel are angels and can do no wrong.

Yeah Wallaby but this goes somewhat deeper than "illegal" settlements ,how much Land has Israel "stolen" from Iran or maybe the biggest backer of state sponsored terrorism Saudi Arabia?? never heard of the Wahhabi Islamic sect ?I seriously suggest you do a little research ,this "war" is against Jews and questions their right to exist pure and simple ,just the same as it was in the dark days of the Holocaust . Edited March 14, 2012 by Colin Yai

[Wallaby]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that or do you think in that in 10 or 20 years time Israel will need more land due to increasing population or whatever, and begin further settlements.

Of course there may be unthought of issues but generally speaking do you think the fighting would forever end?

[Colin Yai]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that or do you think in that in 10 or 20 years time Israel will need more land due to increasing population or whatever, and begin further settlements.

Of course there may be unthought of issues but generally speaking do you think the fighting would forever end?

Wallaby I seriously suggest you read in its entirety the Hamas "Covenant or Charter", its quite easy just type it in on Google, then give me your opinion, and I see I have no reply About the ultra extremist Wahhabi sect in Saudi Arabia.

[Pakboong]

But they still hit bugger all don't they?

And it seems Hamas wasn't involved so no point arguing about what they have done.

Are you for real?

Hamas runs Gaza, they are the so called elected government - even if they're not involved directly, they are responsible for keeping the peace or breaking it. Can't have it both ways, and it's not a question of whodunit:

Thousands of Islamic Jihad sympathizers participated in the group's victory rally celebrating the end of the current round of violence against Israel on Tuesday. The rally was attended by senior Islamic Jihad officials while the group's secretary-general, Ramadan Shallah, sent a video message from Damascus.

http://www.ynetnews....4202601,00.html

Ridiculous indeed. Hamas have a steel grip on Gaza and are responsible for everything that happens.

Several sources to include both Israeli news papers report that Hamas had nothing to do with the 200 rockets. I find that hard to believe also. It is a strange turn to say the least. I have no reason not to believe it otherwise.

"There's no doubt that one reason Islamic Jihad is continuing its rocket fire on southern Israel is its glaring lack of success. After firing more than 200 rockets at the Negev, they still haven't killed any Israelis."

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/the-reasons-behind-islamic-jihad-s-incessant-rocket-fire-at-israel-1.418075

You will have to pardon me if I don't take your word over theirs.

[Colin Yai]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that or do you think in that in 10 or 20 years time Israel will need more land due to increasing population or whatever, and begin further settlements.

Of course there may be unthought of issues but generally speaking do you think the fighting would forever end?

Just to set the record straight, Israels military superiority over Hamas in Gaza is so great that it does not need anyone's help to reduce Gaza to ashes within a week! ,just ask the Egyptians!, the Israelis could just carpet bomb them from miles up with undoubtedly the finest Airforce in the Middle East and quite possibly the finest military pilots in the world, whilst surrounding them with their Armour on land and their ships by sea ,and I ask again why on earth should the Israelis want to obliterate Fattah on the West Bank or are they not so called Palestinians too? Edited March 14, 2012 by Colin Yai

[Morch]

Obviously every time they use a hammer to drive a nail they break their thumbs ,either they are very stupid or getting well paid for doing so

If you want to talk obvious................More likely they are fired by folks upon themselves as excuse to clear more land for illegal settlements in retaliation/excuse

Sorry to be so blunt but if folks are so blind at times you want to throw a bone ya know?

Israel withdrew unilaterally from Gaza quite some time ago.

The settlements issue has more to do with the West Bank, nowadays.

[Morch]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that or do you think in that in 10 or 20 years time Israel will need more land due to increasing population or whatever, and begin further settlements.

Of course there may be unthought of issues but generally speaking do you think the fighting would forever end?

One thing a lot of Egyptians and Israelis agree on is that having as little to do with Gaza is probably best. This goes way back before the Hamas.

Israel never conquered territories due to population constraints, and actually gave back quite a chunk (Sinai peninsula) in return for peace. This was this was over 30 years ago, and doesn't look like an Israeli land grab is on the cards.

[Morch]

Several sources to include both Israeli news papers report that Hamas had nothing to do with the 200 rockets. I find that hard to believe also. It is a strange turn to say the least. I have no reason not to believe it otherwise.

"There's no doubt that one reason Islamic Jihad is continuing its rocket fire on southern Israel is its glaring lack of success. After firing more than 200 rockets at the Negev, they still haven't killed any Israelis."

http://www.haaretz.c...israel-1.418075

You will have to pardon me if I don't take your word over theirs.

Not a case of taking someone words over another, we're talking about two different things here.

The Hamas wasn't doing the shooting this time.

The Hamas is in control in Gaza and therefore being held responsible as well.

[Jingthing]

Yep, Israel doesn't need very much land. The settler types are more into religious fanaticism and there are also security issues defending such a small land. Yes many settlers in the west bank are also attracted by low cost housing, but that is something greater Israel COULD negotiate away (and will probably need to). Israeli Zionism in fact has demographic issues with low birth rates, international intermarriage (only children of Jewish mothers are considered Jewish), and lukewarm interest in Aliyah. Also, of course, any caving in to the unconditional right of return to all Palestinians into Israel would mean the end of the state of Israel, whose raison d’être is to be the homeland of the Jewish people.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Jingthing

[Wallaby]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that or do you think in that in 10 or 20 years time Israel will need more land due to increasing population or whatever, and begin further settlements.

Of course there may be unthought of issues but generally speaking do you think the fighting would forever end?

Wallaby I seriously suggest you read in its entirety the Hamas "Covenant or Charter", its quite easy just type it in on Google, then give me your opinion, and I see I have no reply About the ultra extremist Wahhabi sect in Saudi Arabia.

No I haven't commented on Wahhabi as Saudi Arabia is not the topic of this thread.

I asked what I thought was quite a simple question yet your response has nothing to do with my question. In your second response you again didn't answer.

I am not trying to be a smartass in asking you, it is a genuine question. If you don't wish to answer then that is fine, but please don't quote my question if your response has nothing to do with it.

[Scott]

One conspiracy post has been reported and deleted.

[Ulysses G.]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that

Certainly. Israel has traded land for peace already.

[Wallaby]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that

Certainly. Israel has traded land for peace already.

Fair enough, thank you for answering.

[Colin Yai]

I don't know some people think that the Palestinians have to bend over and take it before they are considered for inclusion as a country. Why is it that the Palestinians have to accept Israel's demands. If Israel wanted peace surely they too could have it by accepting the Palestinian demands.

But for some on here it is just one way traffic and can be no other way.

Fortunately, the majority of the world doesn't think like some on here, they already recognise Palestine, and the number is growing.

Even without any peace agreement with Israel they will still eventually have full international recognition. If Israel isn't careful, and doesn't start coming to the party, they may find that they are the ones that will end up with nothing.

According to Hamas the state of Israel does not exist!.and just what are Hamas's demands according to their own charter,and just What are Israels demands??? Edited March 14, 2012 by Colin Yai

[Colin Yai]

Colin, can I ask you for an honest opinion.

If the UN bombed the crap out of Gaza and there was no more Hamas. No rockets fired into Israel. No more hate speach etc etc. The Palestinians just wanted to be left alone and go about their business on the land they now occupy.

Do you think Israel would forever abide by that or do you think in that in 10 or 20 years time Israel will need more land due to increasing population or whatever, and begin further settlements.

Of course there may be unthought of issues but generally speaking do you think the fighting would forever end?

Wallaby I seriously suggest you read in its entirety the Hamas "Covenant or Charter", its quite easy just type it in on Google, then give me your opinion, and I see I have no reply About the ultra extremist Wahhabi sect in Saudi Arabia.

No I haven't commented on Wahhabi as Saudi Arabia is not the topic of this thread.

I asked what I thought was quite a simple question yet your response has nothing to do with my question. In your second response you again didn't answer.

I am not trying to be a smartass in asking you, it is a genuine question. If you don't wish to answer then that is fine, but please don't quote my question if your response has nothing to do with it.

Has The Hamas Charter or Covenant nothing to do with the present problems between Hamas and Israel?