Thaksin's Italy Detention Just A 'Rumour': Thai FM Surapong

[nurofiend]

It warms my heart to think that T was detained, even if only for a few minutes, serving as a reminder to him that he's not untouchable, in some parts of the world at least.

i think it would have served him more of a reminder that he is untouchable more than anything, considering nothing at all happened, do you not think?

[bigbamboo]

Again you give totally dishonest and very misleading comment. The paymasters conviction was for abuse of power, an old and very serious law, which is there for good reason to protect the common wealth of all Thais from unscrupulous immoral politicians, nothing whatever to do with politics.

And further the case was heard, he was found guilt and a two year jial sentence imposed during the tenure of a paymaster puppet government.

Before accusing members of dishonesty it's best to be clear about the context.Although your post is rather hard to follow and very poorly expressed, I'm assuming you are making the point that Thaksin had serious charges against him that needed dealing with.I agree.However the point is, and one you seem slow to grasp, is that the pursuit against Thaksin was politically motivated but this is not inconsistent with Thaksin having legitimate charges to explain (though arguably less serious than those which hang over Abhiszit's head).I have already posted a link in this thread demonstrating that Interpol rebuffed the previous government on this matter.As to those who want me to reference Wikileaks please check this out for yourselves.I'm certainly not prepared to cut and paste and probably breach forum rules (for there is much sensitive material) but start with the American Ambassador of the time and take things from there...

Of course the Democrats were politically motivated to charge Thaksin with his crimes just as any political party would be with a rival. The point is he was convicted by a court of law, not politicians, and duly sentenced.

As for the Italians, if the story is true then they should be congratulated for being on the ball bearing in mind his previous form in Germany.

[GentlemanJim]

Again you give totally dishonest and very misleading comment. The paymasters conviction was for abuse of power, an old and very serious law, which is there for good reason to protect the common wealth of all Thais from unscrupulous immoral politicians, nothing whatever to do with politics.

And further the case was heard, he was found guilt and a two year jial sentence imposed during the tenure of a paymaster puppet government.

Before accusing members of dishonesty it's best to be clear about the context.Although your post is rather hard to follow and very poorly expressed, I'm assuming you are making the point that Thaksin had serious charges against him that needed dealing with.I agree.However the point is, and one you seem slow to grasp, is that the pursuit against Thaksin was politically motivated but this is not inconsistent with Thaksin having legitimate charges to explain (though arguably less serious than those which hang over Abhiszit's head).I have already posted a link in this thread demonstrating that Interpol rebuffed the previous government on this matter.As to those who want me to reference Wikileaks please check this out for yourselves.I'm certainly not prepared to cut and paste and probably breach forum rules (for there is much sensitive material) but start with the American Ambassador of the time and take things from there...

That's a complete cop out. No need to cut and paste, what is the link to the wikileaks page to add some credibility to your claim?

Exactly what charges should hang over Abhisits head? Ordering the Army to protect the Monarchy, the Nation and it's citizens from a mob that had already spent a month terrorizing the city and baying for it to be burnt to the ground? a mob that had been told to kill members of the Army? As many people on here would agree, when Hamas fire rockets from schoolyards, it is no surprise that kids get killed in the counter attack, and Hamas are to blame. When the Red leaders had hired mercenaries mingle and hide amongst old women and men it is no surprise that when they started shooting and firing RPG's that other red shirts were caught in the cross-fire, the Red leadership is to blame. Thaksins head should be on a pole. He and his family profited greatly from his tenure as PM, which is of course illegal (lets not forget his ordering of 2500 extra judicial killings). In your logic, when criminal charges are to be answered, simply because a politician agree's and calls for Thaksin's arrest it all becomes politically motivated?

[chuang]

[

...What I simply don't believe however is that Sirichoke had a "friend" in Interpol (who never had an interest in Thaksin anyway) who leaked this information

Just called the head of Interpol who said there is no standing arrest warrant on anyone by the name of Thaksin..its all cock and bull story..

[Insight]

Again you give totally dishonest and very misleading comment. The paymasters conviction was for abuse of power, an old and very serious law, which is there for good reason to protect the common wealth of all Thais from unscrupulous immoral politicians, nothing whatever to do with politics.

And further the case was heard, he was found guilt and a two year jial sentence imposed during the tenure of a paymaster puppet government.

Before accusing members of dishonesty it's best to be clear about the context.Although your post is rather hard to follow and very poorly expressed, I'm assuming you are making the point that Thaksin had serious charges against him that needed dealing with.I agree.However the point is, and one you seem slow to grasp, is that the pursuit against Thaksin was politically motivated but this is not inconsistent with Thaksin having legitimate charges to explain (though arguably less serious than those which hang over Abhiszit's head).I have already posted a link in this thread demonstrating that Interpol rebuffed the previous government on this matter.As to those who want me to reference Wikileaks please check this out for yourselves.I'm certainly not prepared to cut and paste and probably breach forum rules (for there is much sensitive material) but start with the American Ambassador of the time and take things from there...

That's a complete cop out. No need to cut and paste, what is the link to the wikileaks page to add some credibility to your claim?

Exactly what charges should hang over Abhisits head? Ordering the Army to protect the Monarchy, the Nation and it's citizens from a mob that had already spent a month terrorizing the city and baying for it to be burnt to the ground? a mob that had been told to kill members of the Army? As many people on here would agree, when Hamas fire rockets from schoolyards, it is no surprise that kids get killed in the counter attack, and Hamas are to blame. When the Red leaders had hired mercenaries mingle and hide amongst old women and men it is no surprise that when they started shooting and firing RPG's that other red shirts were caught in the cross-fire, the Red leadership is to blame. Thaksins head should be on a pole. He and his family profited greatly from his tenure as PM, which is of course illegal (lets not forget his ordering of 2500 extra judicial killings). In your logic, when criminal charges are to be answered, simply because a politician agree's and calls for Thaksin's arrest it all becomes politically motivated?

If Abhisit has a single charge thrown against him for taking any action against the red shirts, there will be utter chaos. To every non-red shirt that witnessed the events in Bangkok as they unfolded, the agenda of the red shirts was blatantly obvious.

What sort of movement of "peaceful protesters" fires battlefield war weapons in to a crowd of opposing protesters? Sick stuff.

[volk666]

Charges against Thaksin weren't brought by Democrats but by the coup appointed AEC, if people call them politically motivated they should at least point to the right source.

Actually, the land deal created an outcry when it first became public in 2003 and it had nothing to do with Thaksin's political orientation - it was a blatant conflict of interest. "Politically motivated" defense is a convenient excuse to throw around once you get elected, that way you can break any law with impunity and blame it on politics anytime someone says you are breaking the law.

It's a case of misdirection, just as discussing Interpol in this particular incident - whether Thaksin is or isn't on Interpol list is immaterial, it's just drawing attention away from the real problem for the government - someone at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs helped him out and ignored an outstanding warrant. Digging it up might lead all the way to the FM himself being sued for dereliction of duty.

Edited March 24, 2012 by volk666

[phiphidon]

Charges against Thaksin weren't brought by Democrats but by the coup appointed AEC, if people call them politically motivated they should at least point to the right source.

Actually, the land deal created an outcry when it first became public in 2003 and it had nothing to do with Thaksin's political orientation - it was a blatant conflict of interest. "Politically motivated" defense is a convenient excuse to throw around once you get elected, that way you can break any law with impunity and blame it on politics anytime someone says you are breaking the law.

It's a case of misdirection, just as discussing Interpol in this particular incident - whether Thaksin is or isn't on Interpol list is immaterial, it's just drawing attention away from the real problem for the government - someone at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs helped him out and ignored an outstanding warrant. Digging it up might lead all the way to the FM himself being sued for dereliction of duty.

Or did they. How can you dismiss the Interpol connection when it is the very crux of Sirichokes accusation - he cites them as his source!

Does it ever cross your mind that the democrats, being politicians, would likely use the same tactics as some poeople on this forum of shotgun scattering of accusations, no matter how ridiculous, in the hope that some will stick and influence the more hard of thinking people around?

Of course it didn't. Whatever the democrats say or do against Thaksin, or the PTP or the Red Shirts, its just right, isn't it, not even worth considering any alternative.

Edited March 24, 2012 by phiphidon

[GentlemanJim]

Charges against Thaksin weren't brought by Democrats but by the coup appointed AEC, if people call them politically motivated they should at least point to the right source.

Actually, the land deal created an outcry when it first became public in 2003 and it had nothing to do with Thaksin's political orientation - it was a blatant conflict of interest. "Politically motivated" defense is a convenient excuse to throw around once you get elected, that way you can break any law with impunity and blame it on politics anytime someone says you are breaking the law.

It's a case of misdirection, just as discussing Interpol in this particular incident - whether Thaksin is or isn't on Interpol list is immaterial, it's just drawing attention away from the real problem for the government - someone at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs helped him out and ignored an outstanding warrant. Digging it up might lead all the way to the FM himself being sued for dereliction of duty.

Or did they. How can you dismiss the Interpol connection when it is the very crux of Sirichokes accusation - he cites them as his source!

Does it ever cross your mind that the democrats, being politicians, would likely use the same tactics as some poeople on this forum of shotgun scattering of accusations, no matter how ridiculous, in the hope that some will stick and influence the more hard of thinking people around?

Of course it didn't. Whatever the democrats say or do against Thaksin, or the PTP or the Red Shirts, its just right, isn't it, not even worth considering any alternative.

What scattering of accusations are you talking about exactly? It would be interesting to know.

[

...What I simply don't believe however is that Sirichoke had a "friend" in Interpol (who never had an interest in Thaksin anyway) who leaked this information

Just called the head of Interpol who said there is no standing arrest warrant on anyone by the name of Thaksin..its all cock and bull story..

Really? You just called the Head of Interpol at 4 in the morning? If he did tell you that then he broke all the rules and if he knew that you had told everyone what he said he would be really pissed at you.

[volk666]

Interpol connection here is immaterial, it doesn't matter one way or another and is not the crux of the allegation, the crux is MoFA officials ignoring an arrest warrant that could potentially cost the FM his job if not land him in jail.

Taking people's attention away from this issue and directing it to Interpol is the crux of the defensive strategy.

[phiphidon]

Interpol connection here is immaterial, it doesn't matter one way or another and is not the crux of the allegation, the crux is MoFA officials ignoring an arrest warrant that could potentially cost the FM his job if not land him in jail.

Taking people's attention away from this issue and directing it to Interpol is the crux of the defensive strategy.

Read the other paper for a fuller explanation of what took place and you will see what I am talking about. The other paper had the story down last night - the Nation has just picked scraps from that report and rewritten it, badly.

[volk666]

Umm, it was the first English language piece that I have read and it ends with Sirichoke threatening to sue anyone at MoFA.

I'll repeat - Interpol's involvement is immaterial, it might warm someone's heart and that's it, it has only sentimental value. Bringing down an FM is on an entirely different level.

[h90]

Interpol was never interested because the Thai goverment at the time never requested Interpol to act, it has nothing to do with "policial motivation" at all.

Er, yes it did and was told to get lost.See the link I have posted on this thread.

Thailand sent a letter in Thai language....Interpol needed one in English.

But I read the letter Kasit sent in to Germany in German language (for the airplane) and I would say no matter in which language they send letters they get rejected......Most incompetent government I ever saw.

[theblether]

Interpol is a red herring. It is not their job to investigate or implicate, it is their job to enact and enable capture.

In effect, they are international arrest agents.

[phiphidon]

Umm, it was the first English language piece that I have read and it ends with Sirichoke threatening to sue anyone at MoFA.

I'll repeat - Interpol's involvement is immaterial, it might warm someone's heart and that's it, it has only sentimental value. Bringing down an FM is on an entirely different level.

If you have read it, I'm suprised you're still digging yourself a hole. And as for threatening to sue, I think you'll find the quote was he was thinking about suing the MoFA.

[nurofiend]

it's all a load of fluffy pink flowers with barbie dolls....

edited to avoid using profanity

[MikeOboe57]

That was close.

I just imagined Thaksin being detained by Italian immigration officials and put on the next plane to BKK - any redshirt's wet dream ( "the messiah is back!") and a nightmare for the current government.

[volk666]

The exact words are "planning to take legal action" and that's what I am personally looking forward to - how this legal aspect will play out. Talking about Interpol is useless in this regard and when/if Sirichoke starts a legal battle Interpol will be quickly forgotten.

[theblether]

That was close.

I just imagined Thaksin being detained by Italian immigration officials and put on the next plane to BKK - any redshirt's wet dream ( "the messiah is back!") and a nightmare for the current government.

That's a very valid point..........well spotted.

[hellodolly]

...What I simply don't believe however is that Sirichoke had a "friend" in Interpol (who never had an interest in Thaksin anyway) who leaked this information

Then where did it come from?

I think there are two possible sources - someone form Interpol/Italian immigration or someone at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

It might be (actually is, at the moment) only a rumor but it must have a source. How many news of goings on at Florence Immigration counters reach Thailand in general?

It may as you say not have even have been true.However if he was detained briefly your suggestion that MOF provided the info is very plausible.

Interpol isn't credible - just a profoundly deluded man's fantasy.

So now you say Interpol is not a credible organization. Can you supply documentation to that or is it just fantasy.

And what is the name of this one man who has made Interpol all up.

[nurofiend]

it's all a load of fluffy pink flowers with barbie dolls....

edited to avoid using profanity

i'll take a big risk

it's a load of poo poo

[nurofiend]

it's all a load of fluffy pink flowers with barbie dolls....

edited to avoid using profanity

i'll take a big risk

it's a load of poo poo

actually sorry if i caused offence... to the lots of children that post here

Edited March 24, 2012 by nurofiend

[rixalex]

it's all a load of fluffy pink flowers with barbie dolls....

edited to avoid using profanity

i'll take a big risk

it's a load of poo poo

How strange. Are you doing a one man role play?

[Buchholz]

whereas Sirichoke meeting Bout is on topic

Most people would assume that clarifying the source of the information was a discredited fantasist was completely on topic.

Likewise, the other source being Thaksin's cousin and gopher referenced in the OP is similarly completely on topic.

.

Edited March 24, 2012 by Buchholz

[scorecard]

Again you give totally dishonest and very misleading comment. The paymasters conviction was for abuse of power, an old and very serious law, which is there for good reason to protect the common wealth of all Thais from unscrupulous immoral politicians, nothing whatever to do with politics.

And further the case was heard, he was found guilt and a two year jial sentence imposed during the tenure of a paymaster puppet government.

Before accusing members of dishonesty it's best to be clear about the context.Although your post is rather hard to follow and very poorly expressed, I'm assuming you are making the point that Thaksin had serious charges against him that needed dealing with.I agree.However the point is, and one you seem slow to grasp, is that the pursuit against Thaksin was politically motivated but this is not inconsistent with Thaksin having legitimate charges to explain (though arguably less serious than those which hang over Abhiszit's head).I have already posted a link in this thread demonstrating that Interpol rebuffed the previous government on this matter.As to those who want me to reference Wikileaks please check this out for yourselves.I'm certainly not prepared to cut and paste and probably breach forum rules (for there is much sensitive material) but start with the American Ambassador of the time and take things from there...

If you find my post hard to follow, perhaps you need to atttend reading comprehension lessons at elementary level.

[animatic]

Again you give totally dishonest and very misleading comment. The paymasters conviction was for abuse of power, an old and very serious law, which is there for good reason to protect the common wealth of all Thais from unscrupulous immoral politicians, nothing whatever to do with politics.

And further the case was heard, he was found guilt and a two year jial sentence imposed during the tenure of a paymaster puppet government.

Before accusing members of dishonesty it's best to be clear about the context.Although your post is rather hard to follow and very poorly expressed, I'm assuming you are making the point that Thaksin had serious charges against him that needed dealing with.I agree.However the point is, and one you seem slow to grasp, is that the pursuit against Thaksin was politically motivated but this is not inconsistent with Thaksin having legitimate charges to explain (though arguably less serious than those which hang over Abhiszit's head).I have already posted a link in this thread demonstrating that Interpol rebuffed the previous government on this matter.As to those who want me to reference Wikileaks please check this out for yourselves.I'm certainly not prepared to cut and paste and probably breach forum rules (for there is much sensitive material) but start with the American Ambassador of the time and take things from there...

Of course the Democrats were politically motivated to charge Thaksin with his crimes just as any political party would be with a rival. The point is he was convicted by a court of law, not politicians, and duly sentenced.

As for the Italians, if the story is true then they should be congratulated for being on the ball bearing in mind his previous form in Germany.

And he was convicted when his own PPP government wis the ruling government.

It is a accurately labeled dishonest red-herring to say it was purely political,

when it happened IN SPITE of Thaksin holding the political power of the time.

He just couldn't manipulate the courts and his attempted "Pastry Gate" affair,

is proof the bribe attempt was made and rebuffed.

And Thaksin's 3 pet lawyers did time for it.

He was legitimately convicted and he himself refused to file a final appeal.

He doesn't have a legal leg to stand on. Just a propped up propaganda one.

Edited March 24, 2012 by animatic

[animatic]

it's all a load of fluffy pink flowers with barbie dolls....

edited to avoid using profanity

i'll take a big risk

it's a load of poo poo

How strange. Are you doing a one man role play?

with three internalize characters

and one pretending to try and stay submerged.

It's like United States Of Tara, but less well acted.

[jayboy]

So now you say Interpol is not a credible organization.

OK that's it I'm out of here, the patients have taken over the asylum.

But as a parting shot I would just say it's hard to understand how someone would think I was questioning Interpol's credibility as opposed to that of Sirichoke who gave it as a source.

[GentlemanJim]

So now you say Interpol is not a credible organization.

OK that's it I'm out of here, the patients have taken over the asylum. But as a parting shot I would just say it's hard to understand how someone would think I was questioning Interpol's credibility as opposed to that of Sirichoke who gave it as a source.

Afore ye go! You still have not provided the link to back up your claim that wikileaks has documents stating that the prosecution of Thaksin was a politically motivated occurrence. There is no need to cut and paste anything of the text, so you wont breach fair use policy, just give us the link please, it is your claim after all.

[Buchholz]

OK that's it I'm out of here, the patients have taken over the asylum.

Enjoy the overnight pass and we'll see ya back 'round, tomorrow.

[hellodolly]

So now you say Interpol is not a credible organization.

OK that's it I'm out of here, the patients have taken over the asylum.

But as a parting shot I would just say it's hard to understand how someone would think I was questioning Interpol's credibility as opposed to that of Sirichoke who gave it as a source.

It was just a part of a copy from a post you made why are you so upset. Also why did you not print it all.

And while you are pouting rather than admit you screwed up (normal procedure for you) can you tell me that if what Thaksin was convicted of for political reasons would it be legal for me to do it. I am not involved in politics.