Motorbike Accident Near Wat Lamai Yesterday

[jamesbrock]

I just love these post's. I worried about my GF. If you were so worried you should have made sure she was wearing a helmet before going anywhere.

So I assume, John, that you've never ever allowed a girlfriend to ride anywhere with you without wearing a helmet? Or, if I assume wrong, and that's not what you're saying, you wouldn't think to save your girlfriend in the event of an accident?

As for speeding pickup that hit you bike if he was speeding he did well to stop in 20 meters.

He bragged that he was speeding to a mutual friend, and if you read my post more thoroughly, you'd see that I don't believe the speed he claimed. Nevertheless, even at 60 km/h, it only take 20 meters to stop - and that's not taking into account any speed loss due to collision forces, nor the friction caused by the motorbike jammed underneath it. And anyone would know that 60 is too fast for that part of the road.

Only lesson is learn and accept you made a big mistake.

Well, duh!

All up, you've made zero contribution to this thread, so why don't you go and troll somewhere else.

[Tropicalevo]

So you hit a patch of water, slid and came off the bike and a truck then hit the bike on the ground? Then apparently another bike hit the truck?

I must have this wrong since I don't see how anyone would be paying except maybe the truck driver for compounding the damage to your bike. Where am I getting this mixed up?

It's Thailand.

As a judge said to me once (in court) "Even if you are in the right, as a foreigner you will have to pay something."

[MattCinderey]

It's Thailand.

As a judge said to me once (in court) "Even if you are in the right, as a foreigner you will have to pay something."

Very true.

However, it's definitely worth having both a bike and car driving license here. A lot of the Thai's don't have them, so it may give you a slight advantage if anything ever went to court...

[insertmembernamehere]

If I read this right, someone (the truck driver) demanded compensation on the spot (or pretty much) and perhaps the mysterious "second bike" person as well.

I know it's all water under the bridge, but perhaps as a future note, I'd always advise letting the dust settle before even thinking of compensation (for or against you). As you can see, some/most/all Thais here see an accident even incidentally involving a foreigner as a brief chance to own the goose that lays the golden eggs.

I think one needs get as many particulars as possible before thinking of who "owes" who what.

As Matt pointed out, the truck driver might not even have a licence, the mystery bike person would have to be investigated, and a traffic report filed.

I don't know who demanded what in this case, but the "damage" to the truck should have been assessed by two (or three) garages before any offers were made.

Speaking of the police report, there must be something there that would indicate the series of events and the mystery bike's appearance. Perhaps one of the private ambulances came to take care of you? They might shed more light on the situation as well.

Basically, unless you are a tourist and on a tight schedule, I always advise taking your time when complicated situations arise here. Resist the urge to "wash your hands" of people on your back about compensation. Water wears down stone and waiting it out will not result in a more negative outcome, I believe.

[jamesbrock]

If I read this right, someone (the truck driver) demanded compensation on the spot (or pretty much) and perhaps the mysterious "second bike" person as well.

I know it's all water under the bridge, but perhaps as a future note, I'd always advise letting the dust settle before even thinking of compensation (for or against you). As you can see, some/most/all Thais here see an accident even incidentally involving a foreigner as a brief chance to own the goose that lays the golden eggs.

I think one needs get as many particulars as possible before thinking of who "owes" who what.

As Matt pointed out, the truck driver might not even have a licence, the mystery bike person would have to be investigated, and a traffic report filed.

I don't know who demanded what in this case, but the "damage" to the truck should have been assessed by two (or three) garages before any offers were made.

Speaking of the police report, there must be something there that would indicate the series of events and the mystery bike's appearance. Perhaps one of the private ambulances came to take care of you? They might shed more light on the situation as well.

Basically, unless you are a tourist and on a tight schedule, I always advise taking your time when complicated situations arise here. Resist the urge to "wash your hands" of people on your back about compensation. Water wears down stone and waiting it out will not result in a more negative outcome, I believe.

All very good advice, but when the vultures are waiting at the police station for you to be hurried out of one hospital, and the police demand you come straight to said police station before seeking competent medical attention at another hospital, you don't really have much choice.

[itishothere]

All very good advice, but when the vultures are waiting at the police station for you to be hurried out of one hospital, and the police demand you come straight to said police station before seeking competent medical attention at another hospital, you don't really have much choice.

Of course you have a choice. A polite request to the police officer to hang on a couple of days untill the swelling goes down will I am sure do the trick. And you can perhaps suggest that whilst he is waiting, he can get ready the copies of the license, insurance certificate and residents address of the guy you ran into, and also 3 written quotations from reputable car repair garages for the damage you inflicted for your immediate consideration. Oh, and maybe as you seem to not have a 100% recollection of how you managed to end up in a wheelchair, perhaps the officer would be so kind as to check the CCTV footage from the local shops to find out who this mysterious extra biker might be.

I am sure that will work.

[angryfarang]

All very good advice, but when the vultures are waiting at the police station for you to be hurried out of one hospital, and the police demand you come straight to said police station before seeking competent medical attention at another hospital, you don't really have much choice.

Of course you have a choice. A polite request to the police officer to hang on a couple of days untill the swelling goes down will I am sure do the trick. And you can perhaps suggest that whilst he is waiting, he can get ready the copies of the license, insurance certificate and residents address of the guy you ran into, and also 3 written quotations from reputable car repair garages for the damage you inflicted for your immediate consideration. Oh, and maybe as you seem to not have a 100% recollection of how you managed to end up in a wheelchair, perhaps the officer would be so kind as to check the CCTV footage from the local shops to find out who this mysterious extra biker might be.

I am sure that will work.

Comedy Genius.

[jamesbrock]

All very good advice, but when the vultures are waiting at the police station for you to be hurried out of one hospital, and the police demand you come straight to said police station before seeking competent medical attention at another hospital, you don't really have much choice.

Of course you have a choice. A polite request to the police officer to hang on a couple of days untill the swelling goes down will I am sure do the trick. And you can perhaps suggest that whilst he is waiting, he can get ready the copies of the license, insurance certificate and residents address of the guy you ran into, and also 3 written quotations from reputable car repair garages for the damage you inflicted for your immediate consideration. Oh, and maybe as you seem to not have a 100% recollection of how you managed to end up in a wheelchair, perhaps the officer would be so kind as to check the CCTV footage from the local shops to find out who this mysterious extra biker might be.

I am sure that will work.

You're right! In my discomfort I didn't think to do that!

I guess now I should write a formal letter of complaint to the appropriate authority to convey my disappointment at my maltreatment by the Nathon Hospital, namely: ignoring my pleas that my leg and toe were broken, insisting that it was "just grazing" (even though the toe had already been dressed); reluctantly X-raying me after insisting that I had multiple broken bones, except they X-rayed my knees despite only one of them being slightly grazed, and me not mentioning any soreness in them at all; assuring me that nothing was broken, and I was ok to go; then discharging me whilst still unable to stand with nary a paracetamol, leaving my injured girlfriend to commandeer a wheelchair so I could move from the gurney.

I'm sure said appropriate authority will launch a full investigation, and I trust I will be compensated for pain and suffering, and for the treatment costs I incurred at Bangkok International Hospital.

Edited March 30, 2012 by jamesbrock

[insertmembernamehere]

This is sort of what I was driving at (no pun intended...).

The police cannot force you to do anything and by the sound of it, your foot/leg was clearly in need of attention. I have never been in an accident like that (touch wood) but in similar situations where I was being intimidated by authorities, I always take a mental step back and make it clear to whomever that what will transpire will do so at the pace I determine. I am not trying to be flippant but just say, "No," and do what you need to do. Have someone escort you if they think you are trying to pull a runner (or limper).

So who wanted money for what reasons?

[itishothere]

jamesbrock .... I'm glad that you are alive and well and able to share a joke.

Edited March 30, 2012 by itishothere

[jamesbrock]

This is sort of what I was driving at (no pun intended...).

The police cannot force you to do anything and by the sound of it, your foot/leg was clearly in need of attention. I have never been in an accident like that (touch wood) but in similar situations where I was being intimidated by authorities, I always take a mental step back and make it clear to whomever that what will transpire will do so at the pace I determine. I am not trying to be flippant but just say, "No," and do what you need to do. Have someone escort you if they think you are trying to pull a runner (or limper).

I guess they can't, but the alternative was an escorted trip to the main station in Chaweng, where higher ranking officers would have wanted their cut, and then a trip to court, where more people would have wanted a cut. Don't mistake my veridicality for bitterness; I choose to live in this Kingdom, so I accept that this behaviour prevails.

Oh, and I was being carried at that stage...

So who wanted money for what reasons?

Well, as far as I know, I paid the driver for the damage to his pick-up, his boss for loss of earnings while the pick-up was in being repaired, and the owner of the second motorbike for damage. The driver told a mutual friend that his cut was 7000 baht. I assume the police received a cut, and - don the tinfoil hats - I reckon the Nathon hospital (or at least the treating doctor) received something for getting me out in under an hour (couldn't have them all waiting at the police station all afternoon now, could we?).

jamesbrock .... I'm glad that you are alive and well and able to share a joke.

Thanks. I am too!

[Tropicalevo]

jamesbrock .... I'm glad that you are alive and well and able to share a joke.

Smokey Robinson said it better than I could, when he sang "I second that emotion......."

[evadgib]

Some interesting car or bike-mounted gadgets applicable to this thread:)

http://www.techmoan.com/

(ignore the first few & see the in depth review videos to the right)

Edited March 31, 2012 by evadgib

[robblok]

Strange story, i was rear ended on my bike and it was my mistake. I only had to pay for the first car (truck) all the other cars that hit that truck were fined for being to close behind the truck. Normally no compensation if you rear gate someone.

Now i got decent insurance on my bike and car so i wont have to worry about that again.

[jamesbrock]

Strange story, i was rear ended on my bike and it was my mistake. I only had to pay for the first car (truck) all the other cars that hit that truck were fined for being to close behind the truck. Normally no compensation if you rear gate someone.

Now i got decent insurance on my bike and car so i wont have to worry about that again.

I don't believe you for a second!

You're saying some drivers were fined for following too closely?? I thought that was in the road rules here!

[insertmembernamehere]

A couple of things. First, did you not have the registration on the bike (and insurance) up to date? I thought this was why one kept the tags up to date, for the insurance. If there was real damage to the truck, would not the insurance have covered that?

This whole compensation thing stinks. I know you disagree, but I am pretty hard-headed when it comes to this stuff and would have just said no. Nothing gets done until I get proper medical treatment and then we will begin the process of assessing fault. Everyone who thinks they are involved has an address and phone number. Time will only make things clearer, as opposed to heat of the moment assessments.

It's a common Asian tactic: put immediate pressure on the confused foreigner before he has a chance to clear his head and follow proper procedure. Threaten him so he pays without stopping to think things though. Time is the extortionists' enemy.

I am sure you did what you felt was appropriate at the time, but these shake-downs really piss me off. My sympathies to you. You seem to be taking all this BS in good stride.

Can you post the photos you do have?

[jamesbrock]

A couple of things. First, did you not have the registration on the bike (and insurance) up to date? I thought this was why one kept the tags up to date, for the insurance. If there was real damage to the truck, would not the insurance have covered that?

It was a rented motorbike. It had stickers on it, but I never checked whether they were valid or not. The owner never once mentioned any insurance.

She wanted 56,000 baht for it (it was a one year old Suzuki Hayate), but my gf got her down to 42,000, and we get ownership of the damaged one. The shop it is in (I don't know which) says it will cost 30,000 to fix. Thing is, I was renting it as I was tossing up between it and a Yamaha Nouvo Elegance - I guess my decision is made. I really do like the bike.

This whole compensation thing stinks. I know you disagree, but I am pretty hard-headed when it comes to this stuff and would have just said no. Nothing gets done until I get proper medical treatment and then we will begin the process of assessing fault. Everyone who thinks they are involved has an address and phone number. Time will only make things clearer, as opposed to heat of the moment assessments.

It's a common Asian tactic: put immediate pressure on the confused foreigner before he has a chance to clear his head and follow proper procedure. Threaten him so he pays without stopping to think things though. Time is the extortionists' enemy.

I am sure you did what you felt was appropriate at the time, but these shake-downs really piss me off. My sympathies to you. You seem to be taking all this BS in good stride.

It stinks to high heaven; but I choose to live here, so I have to take the good with the bad.

Can you post the photos you do have?

Gimme a minute.

Edited April 1, 2012 by jamesbrock

[robblok]

Strange story, i was rear ended on my bike and it was my mistake. I only had to pay for the first car (truck) all the other cars that hit that truck were fined for being to close behind the truck. Normally no compensation if you rear gate someone.

Now i got decent insurance on my bike and car so i wont have to worry about that again.

I don't believe you for a second!

You're saying some drivers were fined for following too closely?? I thought that was in the road rules here!

I really don't care if you believe me or not. This is the way it happened. Mind you this was not in tourist central but in Nothaburi. I only had to pay for the truck that hit me (and that was right because i was at fault). The other 3 cars that hit the truck got fined (except for the off duty cop) So 2 fines were given for tailgating.

[jamesbrock]

I really don't care if you believe me or not. This is the way it happened. Mind you this was not in tourist central but in Nothaburi. I only had to pay for the truck that hit me (and that was right because i was at fault). The other 3 cars that hit the truck got fined (except for the off duty cop) So 2 fines were given for tailgating.

Apologies for my non-use of smileys, but I was being facetious. I meant I don't believe people actually got fined!

[jamesbrock]

Can't add photos...

Edited April 1, 2012 by jamesbrock

[robblok]

I really don't care if you believe me or not. This is the way it happened. Mind you this was not in tourist central but in Nothaburi. I only had to pay for the truck that hit me (and that was right because i was at fault). The other 3 cars that hit the truck got fined (except for the off duty cop) So 2 fines were given for tailgating.

Apologies for my non-use of smileys, but I was being facetious. I meant I don't believe people actually got fined!

AH.. yes they were fined.. actually i was surprised too. They really did not try to shift all the blame to me and compensation never surfaced. The guy who hit me with his truck even helped me transport my broken (big bike) back to a place where it could be repaired.

They were real concerned about me as i was in shock, only later did i start to think clear again. I refused to go to a hospital before everything was settled. I had a gash above my eye. Anyway i was lucky that that was the only damage i suffered myself.. I mean a truck hit me quite hard.The bike cost 20k to repair.

[jamesbrock]

Can you post the photos you do have?

Sorry, it appears I can not yet load pictures. (Or I'm too dumb to work out how to!)

[jamesbrock]

AH.. yes they were fined.. actually i was surprised too. They really did not try to shift all the blame to me and compensation never surfaced. The guy who hit me with his truck even helped me transport my broken (big bike) back to a place where it could be repaired.

They were real concerned about me as i was in shock, only later did i start to think clear again. I refused to go to a hospital before everything was settled. I had a gash above my eye. Anyway i was lucky that that was the only damage i suffered myself.. I mean a truck hit me quite hard.The bike cost 20k to repair.

Yep, a real difference in the type of people you get up there, and we get in the tourist areas...

[jamesbrock]

Ok, so it turns out I am a dolt, and I just wasn't looking in the right place!

So here they are:

The motorbike in happier times:

After being pulled out from under the pick-up:

The scene. The bike is sitting in almost the exact place we set off from; the souvenir shop, in front of which we landed, is top left of the image.

[insertmembernamehere]

I'd probably sell the bike as is to a shop for parts and buy a new one. 30K seems dear to me, I mean the engine and clutch and transmission and brakes are fine, by the photos. But is it really worth putting money into?

By the way, the first photo does have the 2555 tax sticker on it, and you can't get that without also getting the mandatory insurance. So that's worth looking into. I just renewed the tags on my two bikes and that's why I know it's mandatory. Sounds like the rental shop is not being totally transparent with you.

[jamesbrock]

I'd probably sell the bike as is to a shop for parts and buy a new one. 30K seems dear to me, I mean the engine and clutch and transmission and brakes are fine, by the photos. But is it really worth putting money into?

That I don't know. We have had a trusted friend, who knows more than I do about this subject, accompany my gf to all the dealings with the shop; I trust her judgement. And 30K for a one year old Hayate doesn't sound too bad to me (provided the repairs are up to standard), although I could sell it and put the proceeds towards a new Elegance...

By the way, the first photo does have the 2555 tax sticker on it, and you can't get that without also getting the mandatory insurance. So that's worth looking into. I just renewed the tags on my two bikes and that's why I know it's mandatory. Sounds like the rental shop is not being totally transparent with you.

Would not surprise me at all. Thanks, we'll look into it.

[angryfarang]

Just looked at the pictures, you're a lucky guy James.

[itishothere]

Have to say this all sounds a bit odd.

Fistly, 3rd party insurance here is compulsary. OK, not everyone buys it, but in order to get the tax disc, you need to show a valid insurance document. So that angle is worth pursuing.

Secondly, when you told us of the accident, and the damage, I have to admit I was expecting to see the bike in a worse state of repair. Your injuries were bad, no doubt at all about that, but the bike, well is it really going to cost THB 30,000 to repair it? I am no expert, but it doesn't look like it should cost that much - especially when compared to the price you have bought it from the owner. I am guessing the owner of the bike has sold it to you at a price she considers to be its' replacement value prior to the accident, together with a mark-up and probably compensation for loss of earnings etc. So a similar second hand bike should cost you perhaps between 30-35,000? And yet the repair shop says it wants 30,000 to put it right?

Like I say, I am not diminishing your injuries, and I am not an expert, but I would get another opinion before proceeding.

[jamesbrock]

Just looked at the pictures, you're a lucky guy James.

Indeed I am.

Have to say this all sounds a bit odd.

Fistly, 3rd party insurance here is compulsary. OK, not everyone buys it, but in order to get the tax disc, you need to show a valid insurance document. So that angle is worth pursuing.

Secondly, when you told us of the accident, and the damage, I have to admit I was expecting to see the bike in a worse state of repair. Your injuries were bad, no doubt at all about that, but the bike, well is it really going to cost THB 30,000 to repair it? I am no expert, but it doesn't look like it should cost that much - especially when compared to the price you have bought it from the owner. I am guessing the owner of the bike has sold it to you at a price she considers to be its' replacement value prior to the accident, together with a mark-up and probably compensation for loss of earnings etc. So a similar second hand bike should cost you perhaps between 30-35,000? And yet the repair shop says it wants 30,000 to put it right?

What, the motorbike rental woman wanting the faring to pay for the motorbike he crashed, and collecting the insurance on the same motorbike? That sounds odd? It sounds normal practice for Thailand if you ask me.

That being said, I don't know how she'd go claiming on the insurance, seeing as though the ownership has already been transferred to my gf's name. Maybe it's just a case of the motorbike rental woman being as clueless as me when it comes to insurance in Thailand.

The 42,000 baht replacement price was determined after checking prices of similar aged Hayates, and with the assistance of the Suzuki dealership here on Samui. Sure, you could probably find a few in Bangkok for a few thousand lower, but the fact is I destroyed her bike, and wanted to make sure she wasn't out of pocket too much (we had a good relationship and I'd like to keep it that way despite what happened), and, most importantly, it was a price I was comfortable paying.

As for the disappointing damage, perhaps my mate should have shot the side that was scraped down the bitumen for 20 odd meters...

My gf took a picture of it in the shop (since deleted, as she doesn't like to think of it and didn't want to see the picture on her phone), and the only salvageable parts - as insertmembernamehere suggested - were the engine/transmission, and rear wheel; everything else was either damaged beyond repair, or damaged so much that repairing it would cost more than replacing it. RRP for this model Hayate is 52,000 baht; of course being Samui, the price we were quoted here is 56,000 baht, so paying just over half the new price for a one year old bike (with just over 5,000 km on the clock, and many many new parts) doesn't seem that bad at all IMO.

Like I say, I am not diminishing your injuries, and I am not an expert, but I would get another opinion before proceeding.

I understand you're not diminishing my injuries, and I do value your input; but all decisions regarding the bike have been made with other opinions.

Edited April 2, 2012 by jamesbrock

[PoorSucker]

The basic insurance does not cover damage to your bike.

It's only cover damage to third party and hospital up to 15.000 baht.