Car Bomb Suspected In Hat Yai Hotel

[ttelise]

It is interesting to see that the Governor of Songkhla (red obviously) has said that if a head of family were killed during these blatant terrorist attacks the family will receive 50 000 baht, if a non head of family is killed they will get 25 000 baht. Meanwhile the same red backed Government is about to dish out 7.5 million baht each, to those Thais injured during the terrorist attacks on Bangkok while they were participating in trying to burn Bangkok down.

I have never seen my wife so angry. There are a lot of really pi**ed off Thais in this country at the moment.

Removed.

.

Interested in this tragedy. Can we drop all of the off topic political and self centered rhetoric here and focus on issue at hand. Be interesting to see if US or other countries assist in investigation in light of recent Iranian problem.

Looks like they were trying to drop a hotel ala initial world trade center attack. Can see many organization taking advantage if lax standards in places such as Thailand to advance terrorism. I would imagine their constant failures in more advanced countries is frusterating.

Edited April 1, 2012 by metisdead
Deleted post edited out of quoted post.

[Jerrytheyoung]

Its time the Thai govt admits to the secret they have been keeping this past 8 yrs. This is an insurgency sponsored in part by the govt of thailands southern neighbour. With insurgents receiving training on malaysia soil, syria and libya. If thailand wants control of the southern provinces better bring in properly trained counter insurgent enforcement staff to deal with the situation appropriately.

Fully wrong, Malaysia is helping Thailand. Even Dr Mahatir has tried a mediation around a year ago. Malaysian people are too much busy by doing business and developing their own country, they need a peaceful environment, having paid an heavy tribute years ago to the racial divisions. The current motto is "1 Malaysia". Malaysia is actively hunting for islamist extremists, jailing or killing them (as recently for an leader caught in Johor Bahru area)

In the current HatYai issue, one Malaysian has been killed and at least 17 injured.

If you want to know about the conflict read this (conflict in Southern Thailand SIPRI paper number 20) http://books.sipri.org/files/PP/SIPRIPP20.pdf

They are indeed going for '1 Malaysia', but it is not in the way you seem to infer. With open racism and discrimination to state position, with calls to now go over more fully to Sharia law and the erosion of the democratic foundation that they inherited from the British rule upon separation 50 years ago the nation is going towards '1 Malaysia' of one very specific type...

egads, I concur with Tawp. The reference to the former PM of Malaysia, Langkawi's pride and joy, Tun Mahaitir bin Mohammed opens a pandora's box of intrigue. This man without doubt sowed the seeds of violent repression and the trampling of basic human rights as he tried to retain power. Make no mistake, the man's been a fervent supporter of the expansion of "Islamic" dominance. His terrible track record with the Orang Asli and his poor response to the race riots that saw the ethnic Chinese suffer an attempted pogrom speak to a man with no concern except for muslim Malaysians. And this is the man that some think cares about peace on the border region with Thailand?

So why Abhisit asked Mahadir to attempt a mediation (which occured in langkawi)?

Dr Mahatir has retired from power in spite a huge pressure for staying in charge: it is not the kind of guy to retain power.

I have a good friend, sent by UK to Penang during the race riots for separing the two ethnies (events of the 13th May 1969), it was a butchery leaded by a minority of youngsters from both sides (chinese and Malays). His opinion (first hand) both communities were to blame. Those events occured before Mahatir became PM (1981-2004), so you cannot load him with those events. However it is tue that he has gotten the reputation to curb Civil rights as he has implemented an exception law: the ISA that is going to be dismantled only now.

In memory of those times, most of Malaysians are seeking peace and are strongly opposed to terrorism.

[wlcart]

What percentage of terrorist activity in the world, is carried out by Muslims?

I think there must be a connection.

Agree. It must be right up there.

98%?

a study by Duke University and the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill states that from 1980 to 2005 following percentages were true for culprits terrorist attacks in the US.

Latinos: 42%

Communist: 5%

Muslims:6%

Jewish:7%

left wind groups:24%

others:16%

There is a big difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.

[TAWP]

What percentage of terrorist activity in the world, is carried out by Muslims?

I think there must be a connection.

Agree. It must be right up there.

98%?

a study by Duke University and the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill states that from 1980 to 2005 following percentages were true for culprits terrorist attacks in the US.

Latinos: 42%

Communist: 5%

Muslims:6%

Jewish:7%

left wind groups:24%

others:16%

There is a big difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.

Indeed - and you forgot to include full reference.

Btw, what is 'left wind groups'[sic]?

Should communists be included in these if they are left wing?

Terrorist attacks by Latinos?

Erhh...I think I want to see that study.

[folium]

@ AsianAdviser,

I'm curious about your comparison to the IRA situation. Was there an external connection between the IRA and an ideological or radical religious group? I think a big part of the problem here may be the connection with a radical, militant Islam that ties "true believers" with a global movement. I understand that teachers in the local Muslim schools are trained and probably radicalized in places such as Pakistan, Afghanistan, and the Middle East. They may be coming back and then making the schools recruiting grounds for more radical "true believers". Although i find your idea intriguing, it seems that the IRA parallels only go so far.

Actually the analogy with NI is very appropriate. The main point is that there can only be a political solution and that means all parties involved have to be brought to the table, grievances and issues addressed and a lasting political settlement achieved.

Tragically, exactly this was recommended in 2005. Former Prime Minister Anand Panyarachun was appointed as chairman of the National Reconciliation Commission (NRC), tasked with bringing peace back to the South.

Some of the NRC's main recommendations were:

to conduct a full and transparent enquiry into the 78 deaths at Tak Bai, and 19 alleged extra-judicial executions at Saba Yoi, both in 2004.

A trial of the four generals implicated in the Krue Se and Tak Bai incidents, to the fullest extent of the law, not merely disciplinary actions such as transfers.

Establish a special commission to investigate the disappearances in the southern provinces, many of which are suspected to be the result of kidnappings by state officials

Re-examine army and police rules of engagement in the south to better ensure human rights protection

End the unofficial policy of sending corrupt and failing officials to the southern provinces as a punishment post, thoroughly screen officials being transferred from other regions, and provide them with adequate cultural awareness training

Hire, where possible, local Malay Muslims in the local administration and security forces.

Not one of the NRC’s recommendations has ever been implemented or even revisited since.

[animatic]

It is interesting to see that the Governor of Songkhla (red obviously) has said that if a head of family were killed during these blatant terrorist attacks the family will receive 50 000 baht, if a non head of family is killed they will get 25 000 baht. Meanwhile the same red backed Government is about to dish out 7.5 million baht each, to those Thais injured during the terrorist attacks on Bangkok while they were participating in trying to burn Bangkok down.

I have never seen my wife so angry. There are a lot of really pi**ed off Thais in this country at the moment.

How about start blaming the army?they kill and rape on daily basis,and they kill innocents,not long ago the army killed 4 villagers,nobody of the army held responsible for it,all they said was"oops it was a miss understanding"The army makes billions of bath in south thailand with border trade,its the reason why they don't want to leave,2-3 former governments suggested they should leave,but the army said"no way"the army has to much power.They do what they want to do.Mr.Thaksin tried to take away power from the army,it's one reason why they sacked him

They would make the same money of the border moved.

Ilegal border trade would still happen.

[animatic]

'canuckamuck' timestamp='1333249324' post='5181764'

What percentage of terrorist activity in the world, is carried out by Muslims?

I think there must be a connection.

Agree. It must be right up there.

98%?

a study by Duke University and the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill states that from 1980 to 2005 following percentages were true for culprits terrorist attacks in the US.

Latinos: 42%

Communist: 5%

Muslims:6%

Jewish:7%

left wind groups:24%

others:16%

There is a big difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.

Indeed - and you forgot to include full reference.

Btw, what is 'left wind groups'[sic]?

Should communists be included in these if they are left wing?

Terrorist attacks by Latinos?

Erhh...I think I want to see that study.

I think if you changed this to

"

culprits terrorist attacks in the US. "INTERESTS.

Latinos: 42%

As in Columbia and the like.

Within Latinos is also 'left wing' and 'communist groups' and 'others'.

Lots of stuff happening south of the border against USA companies,

and interests.

Edited April 1, 2012 by animatic

[bigbamboo]

I would be very surprised if the Islamist-led Kelantan govt is not helping their brethren across the border.

This is the real world not Shangri-La.

Not according to TAT.

[folium]

Its time the Thai govt admits to the secret they have been keeping this past 8 yrs. This is an insurgency sponsored in part by the govt of thailands southern neighbour. With insurgents receiving training on malaysia soil, syria and libya. If thailand wants control of the southern provinces better bring in properly trained counter insurgent enforcement staff to deal with the situation appropriately.

While this sort of claim might appeal to islamophobes it has little grounding in reality.

A later post also claimed that Malaysia has never been impacted by islamist terrorism. Wrong again.

In 2000 the domestic al-Maunah group broke into an armoury, kidnapped and murdered 3 policemen and were subsequently captured by Malaysian SF.

Also in 2000 the Philippine Islamist group, Abu Sayyaf launched 2 raids in the Sipadan area of Malaysian Borneo, kidnapping 24 Malay and foreign nationals.

The Malay government and its SF (largely trained by Britain) have enjoyed continuing success against JI within Malaysia. Most recently the recapture of leading JI member Mas Selamat in 2009.

Malaysia is well on side when it comes to confronting terrorist groups and is far better trained and motivated than any Thai "counter-insurgency" organization.

The external backing for the Patani insurgents has historically come from largely-Indonesian groups such as JI, and from Aceh's GAM until its peace treaty in 2005.

[Steely Dan]

a study by Duke University and the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill states that from 1980 to 2005 following percentages were true for culprits terrorist attacks in the US.

Latinos: 42%

Communist: 5%

Muslims:6%

Jewish:7%

left wind groups:24%

others:16%

There is a big difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.

Really?

A hallmark of research is that it is neutral and thus open to unanticipated results and findings.

It seems as if researchers at Duke and the University of North Carolina got together to violate this cardinal principle of scholarly research in their report, "Anti-Terror Lessons of Muslim-Americans."

Read more on Newsmax.com: Duke-University of N.C. Terror Study Flawed

Important: Do You Support Pres. Obama's Re-Election? Vote Here Now!

[geriatrickid]

a study by Duke University and the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill states that from 1980 to 2005 following percentages were true for culprits terrorist attacks in the US.

Latinos: 42%

Communist: 5%

Muslims:6%

Jewish:7%

left wind groups:24%

others:16%

There is a big difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.

Please provide a proper citation. I have a problem with your statement: 2 religious groups are cited, then 2 political affiliations; communists and the left winded, and one demographic; latinos. A dog's breakfast that is illogical as the data you cite is akin to comparing tables, to beds, to futons to boxes. A muslim could be a latino and left winded. How would you account for that?

The issue is not the number of alleged terrorist attacks , but the targets and damage done. It also helps if one knows what the definition of "terrorism" is. The terrorism label gets used quite liberally in the USA and it is considered a convenient tool of suppression. A case in point is how acts of vandalism against real estate developers is classified as domestic terrorism.

Please go back and get the paper and read it.

If you are referring to the research from the Triangle Center on Terrorism and Homeland Security then their research supports the draconian laws implemented by the US government as muslim initiated terrorism is indeed on the decline. 20 Muslim-Americans committed or were arrested for terrorist crimes in 2011, down from 26 in 2010 and 49 in 2009. I suppose this justifies the billions spent and liberties curtailed, I don't know.

[geriatrickid]

So why Abhisit asked Mahadir to attempt a mediation (which occured in langkawi)?

Dr Mahatir has retired from power in spite a huge pressure for staying in charge: it is not the kind of guy to retain power.

I have a good friend, sent by UK to Penang during the race riots for separing the two ethnies (events of the 13th May 1969), it was a butchery leaded by a minority of youngsters from both sides (chinese and Malays). His opinion (first hand) both communities were to blame. Those events occured before Mahatir became PM (1981-2004), so you cannot load him with those events. However it is tue that he has gotten the reputation to curb Civil rights as he has implemented an exception law: the ISA that is going to be dismantled only now.

In memory of thosetimes, most of Malaysians are seeking peace and are strongly opposed to terrorism.

Huge pressure to stay in charge? I think not. There were mass protests to get him to go.

Give credit where it is due. The Chinese government warned Malaysia that if Chinese ethnic groups were the subject of an attempted genocide, China would intervene.

There is no dispute on the role of the Malaysian people: They are for the most part peaceful and not supporters of Thai insurgency groups. Tun bin Mohammed was a different case. His rhetoric became an embarrassment for Malaysians and it is with great relief that he was pushed aside. Abhisit's attempt to use Tun bin Mohammed speaks to Abhisit's poor judgement and nothing else.

[Steely Dan]

Well judging from the devastation and the number of casualties it looks like the m.o. of the separatists has changed to an Al-Quaeda, J.I style model - namely indiscriminate carnage. Jihad brings poverty and then ethnic cleansing sadly - mediation is not what is desired by the separatists, even if that was the original gripe I fear rent-a-jihaddist will only be happy reversing back to the 7th century.

[folium]

What percentage of terrorist activity in the world, is carried out by Muslims?

I think there must be a connection.

Agree. It must be right up there.

98%?

Not quite.

Islamic jihadists/extremists, have murdered just under 300 people in Europe over 30 years since 1982. The main incidents were the El Descano bombing, Spain,1985 (18 dead); 1995 Paris Metro bombings (8); 2004 Madrid train bombings (191); 2005 London bombings (52); and Merah's brutal spree, 2012 (7).

By comparison during the same 30 year period 1227 people were murdered during the conflict in Northern Ireland, even though it officially ended with the Good Friday Agreement in 1998 (1220 died 1982-1998).

Therefore over 4x as many people were murdered by socialist/catholic/"loyalist"/protestant extremists in 16 years just in a corner of the UK, compared to the number of people murdered by muslim extremists across the whole of Europe in 30 years.

You could do a similar exercise comparing murders by Islamic extremists in N. America (including 11th Sept 2001) over the same 30 years, with the drug war in Mexico since 2006 for another cold dose of reality. To give you an idea the casualty figures in the Mexican drug war currently stand at somewhere between 47,000-60,000 dead in less than 6 years, and Mexico was the bloodiest conflict in the world last year. Over 30 years islamists/islamist-inspired murderers have been responsible for the death of 37 people in the USA plus the 2977 killed on 11 September 2001. An average of almost 10,000 dead a year ( or 8000/year to take the lower estimate) in Mexico, against 100 a year killed by islamists.

I have no desire to belittle terrorism or murders committed by any group, but just seek to put things in context and perspective, otherwise demonization of any group only serves to further the terrorists intentions and help create their desired clash of civilizations.

If the murderers who committed these crimes in Pattani are really all about domination and taking control, please name me a single non-Muslim nation that has been been "captured" by jihadist/extremist muslims since the heyday of the Ottoman Empire in the 18th Century.

Claiming that the conflict in the southern provinces is solely to do with religion is as credible as saying that the conflict in N. Irleand is solely about religion. It certainly plays its part, but there's a lot more to it.

[Buchholz]

MFA advises against travel to Hat Yai, Yala after bomb blasts

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs (MFA) on Sunday issued a statement advising Singaporeans to postpone all non-essential trips to Thailand's troubled south.

Avoid going to Southern Thailand, Malaysians warned

Malaysia has issued a travel warning against Malaysians going to Southern Thailand following the bomb blasts.

Foreign minister Datuk Seri Anifah Aman cautioned Malaysians to avoid going there for the time being.

Steps urged to ease tourists' fears after South attacks

Car bomb attacks in Yala and Hat Yai district in Songkhla have badly affected tourism and local businesses, and a quick recovery is important in salvaging plunging visitor confidence in Thailand, hoteliers and business operators said yesterday.

A large number of tourists from Malaysia and Singapore who remain in Thailand have been relocated to other lodgings. While the heavily damaged Lee Gardens hotel is being inspected for safety and security, visitors' luggage and travel documents are being collected and returned to them, said Suraphol Kamphalanonthawat, head of tourism business in Songkhla.

"Panic among tourists is apparent and inevitable. It depends on how quickly we can rebuild their confidence in Thailand," he added.

The head of hotel business in Songkhla and Hat Yai, Somchart Phimthanaphoonphorn, said measures to draw tourists for preSongkran celebrations were being readjusted to get them back in two weeks. He added that 25,000 tourists booked Hat Yaibased rooms last year from April 1 until after the end of Songkran in midApril, generating around Bt300 million in income for local businesses.

"I'm not sure the figure can reach half that amount this year," he added.

Songkhla governor Krissada Bunraj said that apart from the damage to property, the economy and tourism in Songkhla had been badly affected, the public's confidence hurt and business opportunities lost.

Praphas Inthanapasat, a senior local Tourism Authority of Thailand official, said the Hat Yai Songkran Midnight Festival would continue as planned, to boost tourist confidence. He expressed belief in the capacity of officials to maintain security during the Songkran holiday break, which falls from April 1316 this year.

The secretary-general of the Federation of Thai Industries, Sommat Khunset, called for tighter control authorities, saying security and counterinsurgency operations in the three southernmost provinces were not enough to ensure overall safety in areas at risk of insurgent violence.

"The authorities must realise and make sure that such violence will not recur and the security issue in the South should be handled with importance equal to the ongoing water management planning to cope with floods this year," he added.

The chairman responsible for policies at the Tourism Council of Thailand, Kongkrit Hiranyakrit, dubbed the multiple car bombs the worst incident, greater even than the past travel advisory against coming to Thailand issued by many countries.

The mayor of Hat Yai municipality, Phrai Phatthano, said that rebuilding tourist confidence would require at least two years and negative media coverage of the blasts and followups would keep the issue hot. He called on Hat Yai residents to watch out for clues and suspicious signs.

-- The Nation 2012-04-02

Edited April 1, 2012 by Buchholz

[roamer]

Its time the Thai govt admits to the secret they have been keeping this past 8 yrs. This is an insurgency sponsored in part by the govt of thailands southern neighbour. With insurgents receiving training on malaysia soil, syria and libya. If thailand wants control of the southern provinces better bring in properly trained counter insurgent enforcement staff to deal with the situation appropriately.

Explain why the Thai's would keep this secret ?

And,

"If thailand wants control of the southern provinces better bring in properly trained counter insurgent enforcement staff to deal with the situation appropriately."

Reality check please.

[ttelise]

a study by Duke University and the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill states that from 1980 to 2005 following percentages were true for culprits terrorist attacks in the US.

Latinos: 42%

Communist: 5%

Muslims:6%

Jewish:7%

left wind groups:24%

others:16%

There is a big difference between anecdotal evidence and statistical evidence.

Indeed - and you forgot to include full reference.

Btw, what is 'left wind groups'[sic]?

Should communists be included in these if they are left wing?

Terrorist attacks by Latinos?

Erhh...I think I want to see that study.

Yeah, you can make studies show anything. My guess is the Latino would be all the violent drug cartel actions throughout Mexico, Columbia and etc. Very sad indeed, but a little different than Iranians going to Thailand and blowing up buildings or trying to take out a plane. Although Chavez did take out a plane once to assassinate someone. These guys are causing terror in their own country for money, power and to back down citizens from narcing them out. These guys usually go after certain people for a specific reason unlike middle eastern folks who just want a body count.

Haha, those "left winders" probably include our crazy middle eastern friends as do others.

[ttelise]

What percentage of terrorist activity in the world, is carried out by Muslims?

I think there must be a connection.

Agree. It must be right up there.

98%?

Not quite.

Islamic jihadists/extremists, have murdered just under 300 people in Europe over 30 years since 1982. The main incidents were the El Descano bombing, Spain,1985 (18 dead); 1995 Paris Metro bombings (8); 2004 Madrid train bombings (191); 2005 London bombings (52); and Merah's brutal spree, 2012 (7).

By comparison during the same 30 year period 1227 people were murdered during the conflict in Northern Ireland, even though it officially ended with the Good Friday Agreement in 1998 (1220 died 1982-1998).

Therefore over 4x as many people were murdered by socialist/catholic/"loyalist"/protestant extremists in 16 years just in a corner of the UK, compared to the number of people murdered by muslim extremists across the whole of Europe in 30 years.

You could do a similar exercise comparing murders by Islamic extremists in N. America (including 11th Sept 2001) over the same 30 years, with the drug war in Mexico since 2006 for another cold dose of reality. To give you an idea the casualty figures in the Mexican drug war currently stand at somewhere between 47,000-60,000 dead in less than 6 years, and Mexico was the bloodiest conflict in the world last year. Over 30 years islamists/islamist-inspired murderers have been responsible for the death of 37 people in the USA plus the 2977 killed on 11 September 2001. An average of almost 10,000 dead a year ( or 8000/year to take the lower estimate) in Mexico, against 100 a year killed by islamists.

I have no desire to belittle terrorism or murders committed by any group, but just seek to put things in context and perspective, otherwise demonization of any group only serves to further the terrorists intentions and help create their desired clash of civilizations.

If the murderers who committed these crimes in Pattani are really all about domination and taking control, please name me a single non-Muslim nation that has been been "captured" by jihadist/extremist muslims since the heyday of the Ottoman Empire in the 18th Century.

Claiming that the conflict in the southern provinces is solely to do with religion is as credible as saying that the conflict in N. Irleand is solely about religion. It certainly plays its part, but there's a lot more to it.

Haha, that just shows how inept or stupid these Iranian and middle Eastern terrorist are if they are getting out done by Mexico's drug cartel in such a big way. Haha, these middle eastern extremist live and literally die to kill innocent people yet the drug cartel just lives for wealth and power and murder anyone who crosses them or gets in the way. I definitely would rather have those crazy Iranains chasing me than the Mexican drug cartel. The later will skin you alive, cut off your genitalia and let you die a slow miserable death.

Edited April 1, 2012 by ttelise

[ttelise]

Not quite.

Islamic jihadists/extremists, have murdered just under 300 people in Europe over 30 years since 1982. The main incidents were the El Descano bombing, Spain,1985 (18 dead); 1995 Paris Metro bombings (8); 2004 Madrid train bombings (191); 2005 London bombings (52); and Merah's brutal spree, 2012 (7).

By comparison during the same 30 year period 1227 people were murdered during the conflict in Northern Ireland, even though it officially ended with the Good Friday Agreement in 1998 (1220 died 1982-1998).

Therefore over 4x as many people were murdered by socialist/catholic/"loyalist"/protestant extremists in 16 years just in a corner of the UK, compared to the number of people murdered by muslim extremists across the whole of Europe in 30 years.

You could do a similar exercise comparing murders by Islamic extremists in N. America (including 11th Sept 2001) over the same 30 years, with the drug war in Mexico since 2006 for another cold dose of reality. To give you an idea the casualty figures in the Mexican drug war currently stand at somewhere between 47,000-60,000 dead in less than 6 years, and Mexico was the bloodiest conflict in the world last year. Over 30 years islamists/islamist-inspired murderers have been responsible for the death of 37 people in the USA plus the 2977 killed on 11 September 2001. An average of almost 10,000 dead a year ( or 8000/year to take the lower estimate) in Mexico, against 100 a year killed by islamists.

I have no desire to belittle terrorism or murders committed by any group, but just seek to put things in context and perspective, otherwise demonization of any group only serves to further the terrorists intentions and help create their desired clash of civilizations.

If the murderers who committed these crimes in Pattani are really all about domination and taking control, please name me a single non-Muslim nation that has been been "captured" by jihadist/extremist muslims since the heyday of the Ottoman Empire in the 18th Century.

Claiming that the conflict in the southern provinces is solely to do with religion is as credible as saying that the conflict in N. Irleand is solely about religion. It certainly plays its part, but there's a lot more to it.

Haha, that just shows how inept or stupid these Iranian and middle Eastern terrorist are if they are getting out done by Mexico's drug cartel in such a big way. Haha, these middle eastern extremist live and literally die to kill innocent people yet the drug cartel just lives for wealth and power and murder anyone who crosses them or gets in the way. I definitely would rather have those crazy Iranains chasing me than the Mexican drug cartel. The later will skin you alive, cut off your genitalia and let you die a slow miserable death.

ttelise

I think you have too many 'ha ha's' in your post for it to sit comfortably within this subject matter!

follum

Excellent post. Can I just add that all those killed by terrorists in Northern Ireland were killed by terrorists who were funded to the tune of $25 Million plus per year to arm themselves with weapons and training by non other than ....the NORAID in United States, founded in 1969. In total over 3000 deaths in the UK were funded by an open and legal group in the USA.

The bombing in Hat Yai is a tragedy for the South. The people in the city are lovely and of mixed faiths. The dramatic drop in tourism will impact the lives of many many people, and unfortunately, unlike the Arabic nations, Muslims in SE Asia are amongst the poorest of the poor. Life is about to get a lot harder for the traders in the Market around the central hub that was attacked. I am just amazed and grateful that there were so few deaths. A miracle really.

Haha, yeah I get that. I just think it's funny how bad these middle eastern terrorist FAIL and get pawned by Mexico drug cartel even though their main purpose in life is to kill and injure others. Seems like they would be better at it. Dudes blow themselves up and constantly get busted before they can even complete a suicide mission. Haha. Fail.

That being said, I do feel for Thailand and countries like Thailand who lack trrrirism intelligence or refuse to listen to US intelligence and become easy targets.

[jmdelan5]

muslims practice the religion of peace????? But it's wrong to profile......

[Colin Yai]

Well judging from the devastation and the number of casualties it looks like the m.o. of the separatists has changed to an Al-Quaeda, J.I style model - namely indiscriminate carnage. Jihad brings poverty and then ethnic cleansing sadly - mediation is not what is desired by the separatists, even if that was the original gripe I fear rent-a-jihaddist will only be happy reversing back to the 7th century.

Your last two posts just about sums up the reality of the situation ,nothing more nothing less.

[Scott]

Please stick to the topic of the OP.

Off-topic posts and replies removed.

[Colin Yai]

There must be many "moderate"Muslims in the South who know the whereabouts of these murderers ,do you think they will turn them in?, IMHO NOT A SNOWBALLS IN HELLS CHANCE, perhaps a 20 million baht reward for information leading to there capture may provide a bit of stimulus ,there is nothing worse for a criminal/ terrorist to know that there is a price on his head!. they could start by nailing wanted posters in every village ,even put them on TV like they do in the US which appears very successful in apprehending lawbreakers.

[jackr]

I have no desire to belittle terrorism or murders committed by any group, but just seek to put things in context and perspective, otherwise demonization of any group only serves to further the terrorists intentions and help create their desired clash of civilizations.

Different kettle of fish and it would be unwise to appease them either - if they had the means and know-how, they'd sooner have any who don't think like them destroyed (meaning all of us) with little objection/sympathy from the others.

[folium]

There must be many "moderate"Muslims in the South who know the whereabouts of these murderers ,do you think they will turn them in?, IMHO NOT A SNOWBALLS IN HELLS CHANCE, perhaps a 20 million baht reward for information leading to there capture may provide a bit of stimulus ,there is nothing worse for a criminal/ terrorist to know that there is a price on his head!. they could start by nailing wanted posters in every village ,even put them on TV like they do in the US which appears very successful in apprehending lawbreakers.

Sadly the brutal and ill-disciplined approach of the Thai military has done a first-class job of alienating most of the local population in the Pattani region, and simultaneously boosted the appeal of the insurgents.

As ever a political solution is the only solution.

[folium]

I have no desire to belittle terrorism or murders committed by any group, but just seek to put things in context and perspective, otherwise demonization of any group only serves to further the terrorists intentions and help create their desired clash of civilizations.

Different kettle of fish and it would be unwise to appease them either - if they had the means and know-how, they'd sooner have any who don't think like them destroyed (meaning all of us) with little objection/sympathy from the others.

Appeasement is a very loaded word, but whatever term you wish to use, if Thailand wants to see peace in its southern provinces it will have to sit down and talk with these terrorists and even undertake some of the sensible and likely highly effective recommendations of Anand's 2005 NRC (see post #67).

The British government had to sit down with 2 terrorist murderers (Adams & McGuinness) to bring about a settlement in Northern Ireland. Concessions had to be made and unpalatable gestures offered but at least it got the job done and 30 years of bloodshed was brought to an end (with a few holdouts sadly).

[Colin Yai]

There must be many "moderate"Muslims in the South who know the whereabouts of these murderers ,do you think they will turn them in?, IMHO NOT A SNOWBALLS IN HELLS CHANCE, perhaps a 20 million baht reward for information leading to there capture may provide a bit of stimulus ,there is nothing worse for a criminal/ terrorist to know that there is a price on his head!. they could start by nailing wanted posters in every village ,even put them on TV like they do in the US which appears very successful in apprehending lawbreakers.

Sadly the brutal and ill-disciplined approach of the Thai military has done a first-class job of alienating most of the local population in the Pattani region, and simultaneously boosted the appeal of the insurgents.

As ever a political solution is the only solution.

You write "most" it only needs "one" to blow the whistle and its game over for these maniacs, 20 million Baht may achieve quite a few wagging tongues, concessions to these people are just seen as a sign of weakness. Edited April 2, 2012 by Colin Yai

[folium]

Well judging from the devastation and the number of casualties it looks like the m.o. of the separatists has changed to an Al-Quaeda, J.I style model - namely indiscriminate carnage. Jihad brings poverty and then ethnic cleansing sadly - mediation is not what is desired by the separatists, even if that was the original gripe I fear rent-a-jihaddist will only be happy reversing back to the 7th century.

Actually their MO is little different from previous "spectaculars" (aka major terrorist incident designed to cause mass casualties and seize headlines).

April 2005 Songkla triple bombing using 2 bags and a bike killed 2 and injured 66.

Sept 2006 Hat Yai attacks saw 6 bombs attached to bikes killing 4 and injuring 82. One of the targets was the same Lee Garden Hotel attacked again this weekend.

So the MO of multiple bomb attacks designed to cause mass casualties and staged either just before Songkran (2005,2012) or a military "peace rally" (2006), remains much the same. On this occasion they used vehicles and therefore presumably larger devices and thus inflicted more murder and mayhem.

As can be seen in Aceh negotiations and deals can be done, even with islamists, but the longer you leave it.....

[Steely Dan]

There must be many "moderate"Muslims in the South who know the whereabouts of these murderers ,do you think they will turn them in?, IMHO NOT A SNOWBALLS IN HELLS CHANCE, perhaps a 20 million baht reward for information leading to there capture may provide a bit of stimulus ,there is nothing worse for a criminal/ terrorist to know that there is a price on his head!. they could start by nailing wanted posters in every village ,even put them on TV like they do in the US which appears very successful in apprehending lawbreakers.

Ah, the search for the 'moderate' Muslim, it reminds me of the situation in theoretical physics where all the models suggest there must be loads of dark matter in the universe, however proving it is always problematic. I suppose self preservation has something to do with it, and informers do get killed if they are found or even suspected.

However I think any separatist group can't get anywhere unless it has the tacit consent of a good proportion of the population it represents, though again this tacit support is helped by a little terror and intimidation as any totalitarian fascist regime knows only too well.

[xray]

What percentage of terrorist activity in the world, is carried out by Muslims?

I think there must be a connection.

Agree. It must be right up there.

98%?

Not quite.

Islamic jihadists/extremists, have murdered just under 300 people in Europe over 30 years since 1982. The main incidents were the El Descano bombing, Spain,1985 (18 dead); 1995 Paris Metro bombings (8); 2004 Madrid train bombings (191); 2005 London bombings (52); and Merah's brutal spree, 2012 (7).

By comparison during the same 30 year period 1227 people were murdered during the conflict in Northern Ireland, even though it officially ended with the Good Friday Agreement in 1998 (1220 died 1982-1998).

Therefore over 4x as many people were murdered by socialist/catholic/"loyalist"/protestant extremists in 16 years just in a corner of the UK, compared to the number of people murdered by muslim extremists across the whole of Europe in 30 years.

You could do a similar exercise comparing murders by Islamic extremists in N. America (including 11th Sept 2001) over the same 30 years, with the drug war in Mexico since 2006 for another cold dose of reality. To give you an idea the casualty figures in the Mexican drug war currently stand at somewhere between 47,000-60,000 dead in less than 6 years, and Mexico was the bloodiest conflict in the world last year. Over 30 years islamists/islamist-inspired murderers have been responsible for the death of 37 people in the USA plus the 2977 killed on 11 September 2001. An average of almost 10,000 dead a year ( or 8000/year to take the lower estimate) in Mexico, against 100 a year killed by islamists.

More true statistics. However, the Irish 'troubles' are ended (hopefully permanently) and I believe the posters quoted in your rebuttal were speaking to real/present time. The atrocities being commited in Mexico don't make some of the terrorist incident lists; not sure why this is so, maybe the situation in Mexico is not considered to be international terrorism.

Statistics aside, there is only one form of terrorism being commited today which I feel is of significant danger to myself and most Thaivisa members, and that is terrorism perpetrated by Islamic extremists.