Phuket's Soi Dogs Launches 'Trade Of Shame' Campaign Against Dog-Meat Trade

[GeorgeO]

soi dogs are a big problem for hygiene and safety... if some thai people can get rid of the problem and make a quick buck exporting them for meat, personally, i do not see the problem

we had soi dog problems, entering our moo bahn, security agents just dont give a 2 cents to do their job

many are deseased and flee ridden and aggressive

The road leading to my house is 1 km long and is currently home to about 25 dogs. If I am not driving, then I have to run the gauntlet of shooing away these dogs when they start approaching me and growling at me. If I had a gun, I would deal with the problem very effectively myself.

Because of their religion, Thais cannot deal with this problem, so why don't they get someone from the outside to come in and humanely dispose of these unwanted, diseased and aggressive "wild" animals?

[chuenyongman]

Why does the government not do free de-sexing of all dogs over six months old except for dealers/ breeders. That would ease the problem of all these dogs roaming the streets and lying down in the middle of the roads.

[gand]

soi dogs are a big problem for hygiene and safety... if some thai people can get rid of the problem and make a quick buck exporting them for meat, personally, i do not see the problem

we had soi dog problems, entering our moo bahn, security agents just dont give a 2 cents to do their job

many are deseased and flee ridden and aggressive

The road leading to my house is 1 km long and is currently home to about 25 dogs. If I am not driving, then I have to run the gauntlet of shooing away these dogs when they start approaching me and growling at me. If I had a gun, I would deal with the problem very effectively myself.

Because of their religion, Thais cannot deal with this problem, so why don't they get someone from the outside to come in and humanely dispose of these unwanted, diseased and aggressive "wild" animals?

And yet, it does not prevent many from dealing with farangs they want to get rid of?

[geriatrickid]

Ahh, yes the old respect for customs argument.

Well, Idi Amin used to feast on the hearts of his opponents. North American indigeneous peoples would eat the flesh of those they killed in battle to gain the opponent's strength. South Pacific islanders did the same. I bet some of those arguing that we must respect local customs would condemn such acts. Surely, humans can evolve and behave in a more humane manner?

[simple1]

Why does the government not do free de-sexing of all dogs over six months old except for dealers/ breeders. That would ease the problem of all these dogs roaming the streets and lying down in the middle of the roads.

Such a program would have to funded by the individual Amphurs. Also can you visualise Thai's rounding up the millions of Soi dogs

? Don't think so...

[Peterocket]

The road leading to my house is 1 km long and is currently home to about 25 dogs. If I am not driving, then I have to run the gauntlet of shooing away these dogs when they start approaching me and growling at me. If I had a gun, I would deal with the problem very effectively myself.

Because of their religion, Thais cannot deal with this problem, so why don't they get someone from the outside to come in and humanely dispose of these unwanted, diseased and aggressive "wild" animals?

My soi is also about 1km long with about 25 Farangs on it, it would be nice if the dogs would dispose of these unwanted, diseased and aggressive "wild" animals!

[LivinginKata]

Post about another member's spelling and the reply removed.

[cowslip]

Soi Dogs

Many people have simply described their personal situation with Soi dogs. I can't see how that furthers to the discussion really; anyone who has stayed in Thailand for more than a few days is aware of the situation.

However, when it comes to addressing the problem many posters seem to be looking for a "single shot" solution; they blame religion, culture corruption and suggest culling and/or neutering. All of these are factors but cannot be addressed individually. What is needed is a concerted holistic approach.

The reality must surely be that a complete sea-change is needed. One has to address the animals their environment and the society they live and thrive in. It comes down to winning over public opinion and then subsequent actions.

Culling alone can only work on a limited dog population or the practicalities become overwhelming.

Sterilisation - this is very expensive and time consuming - one has to achieve a certain percentage of the dog population for it to be effective - given the numbers involved in Thailand this is probably an impractical proposition. It could be used on a reduced population although the dogs themselves can’t reproduce, once they die they are easily replaced by dogs from outside that can.

As for religion - well are all or only Buddhist countries dog-ridden? Or are there other more important underlying reasons?

Making merit by freeing birds, turtles and feeding dogs is a vey questionable habit given the appalling practices that accompany supplying this need. THis artificial practice needs to be reviewed and replaced with a more "genuine" process.

Culture - well there is a culture of “being kind” to animals and unfortunately in parallel this is also a culture of extreme lack of education about animals, animal welfare and in parts of the population a total lack of empathy for other living creatures. This needs to be tackled in conjunction with all other problems.

Corruption - Several years back Pattaya gathered together several million baht to address the dog problem there - the program never started as somehow the money "disappeared"

To have any chance of a lasting solution steps must first be taken to reduce and manage the dog population......

The area that can support a sustainable "stray" dog population is dependent on the amount of food available to that population. As the food supplies dwindle, so does the population. Dogs like most other animals will reduce breeding or ceased to breed if food supplies become scarce.

This is where the sea-change is involved - the feeding of dogs needs to stop and the disposal of garbage needs to be changed to make it less accessible to the animals.

THEN and only then with a decreasing dog population will campaigns of sterilisation and putting down the deceased animals will have an effect.

It IS possible to make you area a place where dogs don't want to be; if they can't find food (or shelter) they won't come. Culling won't work on a local basis - other dogs will just replace them.

Check you bins to be dog proof, liaise with your neighbours - and here's the hard part - try to persuade them NOT to feed the dogs. Also try to persuade them to keep their pet dogs from roaming. There is a major problem here as some dogs have a "status half-way between "stray" and "pet"; "community dogs" are considered an asset to the area as they bark at intruders or anyone/thing they regard as unfamiliar - this is seen as a kind of burglar alarm amongst other things. These dogs often even have collars and are treated as friends by the locals. The problem is there is little or no care for these dogs and they are allowed to breed with whatever and whenever they want.

As you can see there is a lot to get over before any improvement can be achieved however if you do succeed you will notice after a short time that the animals (apart from the occasional prospector) have lost interest in your area it becomes cleaner, safer, healthier and less noisy at night.

You might even find that people in adjoining neighbourhoods will then come to you asking how to get their own neighbourhoods cleaned up.

Edited June 12, 2012 by cowslip

[cowslip]

If they want to eat dog that's their business. They just need to do it without any unnecessary suffering to the animal is all. All cultures all over the world eat things that aren't bred for mass consumption, that's irrelevant.

You don't think it's "a tradition worth carrying on" but they obviously do, otherwise it wouldn't carry on it would stop.

so to follow your dog logic

Do we accept cannibalism if as you suggest it is “if they want to eat each other that's their business”

[cowslip]

OK - eating dogs is repellant to most westerners, but I would submit that this isn't really the problem. The fact is that Thailand's attitude to animals in general is utterly out of step with civilised and humane practices.

The fact that there are 500,000 dogs bred or wandering around the streets is unacceptable in the first place....and it is this the Thai authorities should be dealing with. (small localised culls don't work BTW). Dogs spread diseases that are contractable by humans (a lot more than rabies) they can pose a direct danger of attack to humans, they cause motor accidents and interfere with garbage disposal and civic hygiene.

As far as eating these animals - this is clearly neither a humane or hygienic way of supplying meat for human consumption. In a society that is "siwilai", any animals (usually domesticated) that are used for humn consumption have to go through a pretty rigorous set of regulations and inspections - would you eat pork or beef treated like this? - if you are going to export dogs for food then they should be farmed regulated etc etc....... However I have to ask in this day and age if the eating of dog meat is anything more than a misguided idea of tradition - I very much doubt if the protein derived from this trade can't more easily be got elswhere.

I do mostly agree with the above post. There are things called spay and nueter which we promote in the USA.. If you can remove the market source, you can certainly reduce the problem. I t does come down to educating the Thai people and breaking the chain of learning by copying the parents' behavior. Too often, the oficials just talk about good ideas and then nothing is done. Why is it so difficult for Thai people to emulate cultures that have solved similar problems already. (The methods are there!)

I would love to see on Phuket 1) many less dogs running loose 2) the billboards come down as promise, and 3) pick up the stinking trash.

1 and 2 are directly linked. (and even 2 - those enormous billboards which use up so much wasted land give shelter for dogs to raise their pups)

Edited June 12, 2012 by cowslip

[gand]

What is that saying? "It's a dog-eat-dog world"

[KarenBravo]

Soi Dogs

Many people have simply described their personal situation with Soi dogs. I can't see how that furthers to the discussion really; anyone who has stayed in Thailand for more than a few days is aware of the situation.

However, when it comes to addressing the problem many posters seem to be looking for a "single shot" solution; they blame religion, culture corruption and suggest culling and/or neutering. All of these are factors but cannot be addressed individually. What is needed is a concerted holistic approach.

The reality must surely be that a complete sea-change is needed. One has to address the animals their environment and the society they live and thrive in. It comes down to winning over public opinion and then subsequent actions.

Culling alone can only work on a limited dog population or the practicalities become overwhelming.

Sterilisation - this is very expensive and time consuming - one has to achieve a certain percentage of the dog population for it to be effective - given the numbers involved in Thailand this is probably an impractical proposition. It could be used on a reduced population although the dogs themselves can’t reproduce, once they die they are easily replaced by dogs from outside that can.

As for religion - well are all or only Buddhist countries dog-ridden? Or are there other more important underlying reasons?

Making merit by freeing birds, turtles and feeding dogs is a vey questionable habit given the appalling practices that accompany supplying this need. THis artificial practice needs to be reviewed and replaced with a more "genuine" process.

Culture - well there is a culture of “being kind” to animals and unfortunately in parallel this is also a culture of extreme lack of education about animals, animal welfare and in parts of the population a total lack of empathy for other living creatures. This needs to be tackled in conjunction with all other problems.

Corruption - Several years back Pattaya gathered together several million baht to address the dog problem there - the program never started as somehow the money "disappeared"

To have any chance of a lasting solution steps must first be taken to reduce and manage the dog population......

The area that can support a sustainable "stray" dog population is dependent on the amount of food available to that population. As the food supplies dwindle, so does the population. Dogs like most other animals will reduce breeding or ceased to breed if food supplies become scarce.

This is where the sea-change is involved - the feeding of dogs needs to stop and the disposal of garbage needs to be changed to make it less accessible to the animals.

THEN and only then with a decreasing dog population will campaigns of sterilisation and putting down the deceased animals will have an effect.

It IS possible to make you area a place where dogs don't want to be; if they can't find food (or shelter) they won't come. Culling won't work on a local basis - other dogs will just replace them.

Check you bins to be dog proof, liaise with your neighbours - and here's the hard part - try to persuade them NOT to feed the dogs. Also try to persuade them to keep their pet dogs from roaming. There is a major problem here as some dogs have a "status half-way between "stray" and "pet"; "community dogs" are considered an asset to the area as they bark at intruders or anyone/thing they regard as unfamiliar - this is seen as a kind of burglar alarm amongst other things. These dogs often even have collars and are treated as friends by the locals. The problem is there is little or no care for these dogs and they are allowed to breed with whatever and whenever they want.

As you can see there is a lot to get over before any improvement can be achieved however if you do succeed you will notice after a short time that the animals (apart from the occasional prospector) have lost interest in your area it becomes cleaner, safer, healthier and less noisy at night.

You might even find that people in adjoining neighbourhoods will then come to you asking how to get their own neighbourhoods cleaned up.

Hey......why don't we just cure the world of all known diseases and achieve world peace whilst we're at it?

Edited June 12, 2012 by KarenBravo

[Hostile17]

As an avid cyclist, I can attest that semi-feral dogs are an absolute menace. To date, I've avoided having skin broken by their fangs, but it's been close a couple of times. Would a campaign to sterilize these dogs, then return them to the streets, meet the confusing standard of humane treatment towards these animals? Wouldn't this be cost-effective, considering how much money is spent on rabies shots, aftermath of accidents, and the public feeding of these creatures? I am by NO means a dog person, but treating all living creatures decently should be on everyone's agenda.

Would all be fixed if the whole world spammed soi dog's email and phoneline with helpfull tips for their slowly processed ideas.

The only tip required would be: get out of the dam_n island and bring the dogs on a cheap large land in phang na where they wont bother anyone and where you wont need to beg for money and harass people in front of businesses with fake guilt trips.

Anyways, even education wont get rid of soi dogs. They are pickup trucks that drive around every minor street and empties at various places food for dogs. Most of these pickups have 5-10 massive bag of food that they slowly give out everyday on the same spots. I have told the one in my area that i will take a stick and **** up his pickup if i see him again, i didnt see him for a while but yesterday i saw him from far away and could not get to him. Now its a fight. My street is small and there is no need to feed the overfed dogs and he still came so you see? nothing will ever be fixed. Next time im gonna make a large bump into his car(he wont come down he was really scared with 4 of his friends) and he'll still keep on coming.

Im a dog lover, now thanks to thai people i hate dogs more than african pirates

[F1fanatic]

BTW - does anyone remember the British TV docco about dog consumption? Legs are usually broken and tied behind their backs - they are then kept alive as long as possible as this keeps them fresh without the need for refrigeration.

then it showed a party of Koreans preparing a dog for slaughterThey hung it up in a tree for several hours and beat it whilst they were drinking - the object being to terrify the animal and make the flesh more tender.

I didn't see the documentary (I avoid anything that horrendous like the plague!), but received a circular with the photos from some animal welfare organisation many years ago. I thought it was Filipinos though?

I've never forgotten it, although I try v hard to do so. Despicable.

[F1fanatic]

As an avid cyclist, I can attest that semi-feral dogs are an absolute menace. To date, I've avoided having skin broken by their fangs, but it's been close a couple of times. Would a campaign to sterilize these dogs, then return them to the streets, meet the confusing standard of humane treatment towards these animals? Wouldn't this be cost-effective, considering how much money is spent on rabies shots, aftermath of accidents, and the public feeding of these creatures? I am by NO means a dog person, but treating all living creatures decently should be on everyone's agenda.

Would all be fixed if the whole world spammed soi dog's email and phoneline with helpfull tips for their slowly processed ideas.

The only tip required would be: get out of the dam_n island and bring the dogs on a cheap large land in phang na where they wont bother anyone and where you wont need to beg for money and harass people in front of businesses with fake guilt trips.

Anyways, even education wont get rid of soi dogs. They are pickup trucks that drive around every minor street and empties at various places food for dogs. Most of these pickups have 5-10 massive bag of food that they slowly give out everyday on the same spots. I have told the one in my area that i will take a stick and **** up his pickup if i see him again, i didnt see him for a while but yesterday i saw him from far away and could not get to him. Now its a fight. My street is small and there is no need to feed the overfed dogs and he still came so you see? nothing will ever be fixed. Next time im gonna make a large bump into his car(he wont come down he was really scared with 4 of his friends) and he'll still keep on coming.

Im a dog lover, now thanks to thai people i hate dogs more than african pirates

Your whole post proves that you are not (and never were) a 'dog lover'.

The odd soi dog (or pack) that become a problem by actually biting people are poisoned by the locals or Westerners. Buddhism doesn't come into it as the reasoning is 'they ate the poisoned food themselves, therefore I didn't kill them'... Not to mention the moslems who don't like dogs at the best of times.

[cowslip]

Soi Dogs

Many people have simply described their personal situation with Soi dogs. I can't see how that furthers to the discussion really; anyone who has stayed in Thailand for more than a few days is aware of the situation.

However, when it comes to addressing the problem many posters seem to be looking for a "single shot" solution; they blame religion, culture corruption and suggest culling and/or neutering. All of these are factors but cannot be addressed individually. What is needed is a concerted holistic approach.

The reality must surely be that a complete sea-change is needed. One has to address the animals their environment and the society they live and thrive in. It comes down to winning over public opinion and then subsequent actions.

Culling alone can only work on a limited dog population or the practicalities become overwhelming.

Sterilisation - this is very expensive and time consuming - one has to achieve a certain percentage of the dog population for it to be effective - given the numbers involved in Thailand this is probably an impractical proposition. It could be used on a reduced population although the dogs themselves can’t reproduce, once they die they are easily replaced by dogs from outside that can.

As for religion - well are all or only Buddhist countries dog-ridden? Or are there other more important underlying reasons?

Making merit by freeing birds, turtles and feeding dogs is a vey questionable habit given the appalling practices that accompany supplying this need. THis artificial practice needs to be reviewed and replaced with a more "genuine" process.

Culture - well there is a culture of “being kind” to animals and unfortunately in parallel this is also a culture of extreme lack of education about animals, animal welfare and in parts of the population a total lack of empathy for other living creatures. This needs to be tackled in conjunction with all other problems.

Corruption - Several years back Pattaya gathered together several million baht to address the dog problem there - the program never started as somehow the money "disappeared"

To have any chance of a lasting solution steps must first be taken to reduce and manage the dog population......

The area that can support a sustainable "stray" dog population is dependent on the amount of food available to that population. As the food supplies dwindle, so does the population. Dogs like most other animals will reduce breeding or ceased to breed if food supplies become scarce.

This is where the sea-change is involved - the feeding of dogs needs to stop and the disposal of garbage needs to be changed to make it less accessible to the animals.

THEN and only then with a decreasing dog population will campaigns of sterilisation and putting down the deceased animals will have an effect.

It IS possible to make you area a place where dogs don't want to be; if they can't find food (or shelter) they won't come. Culling won't work on a local basis - other dogs will just replace them.

Check you bins to be dog proof, liaise with your neighbours - and here's the hard part - try to persuade them NOT to feed the dogs. Also try to persuade them to keep their pet dogs from roaming. There is a major problem here as some dogs have a "status half-way between "stray" and "pet"; "community dogs" are considered an asset to the area as they bark at intruders or anyone/thing they regard as unfamiliar - this is seen as a kind of burglar alarm amongst other things. These dogs often even have collars and are treated as friends by the locals. The problem is there is little or no care for these dogs and they are allowed to breed with whatever and whenever they want.

As you can see there is a lot to get over before any improvement can be achieved however if you do succeed you will notice after a short time that the animals (apart from the occasional prospector) have lost interest in your area it becomes cleaner, safer, healthier and less noisy at night.

You might even find that people in adjoining neighbourhoods will then come to you asking how to get their own neighbourhoods cleaned up.

Hey......why don't we just cure the world of all known diseases and achieve world peace whilst we're at it?

If you have a valid criticism of something in this post why not say it? If you don't have a point of view why make so obvious by irrelevant comments that seem to indicate you haven't really understood a single word.

[cowslip]

What is that saying? "It's a dog-eat-dog world"

A concept that is based on a completely erroneous interpretation of Darwinian theory.

As is "survival of the fittest". (originally Herbert Spencer's comment)

The incorrect use of these sort of phrases show how ill-equipped people are to deal with the problems presented by a large uncontrolled dog population.

Edited June 12, 2012 by cowslip

[cowslip]

As an avid cyclist, I can attest that semi-feral dogs are an absolute menace. To date, I've avoided having skin broken by their fangs, but it's been close a couple of times. Would a campaign to sterilize these dogs, then return them to the streets, meet the confusing standard of humane treatment towards these animals? Wouldn't this be cost-effective, considering how much money is spent on rabies shots, aftermath of accidents, and the public feeding of these creatures? I am by NO means a dog person, but treating all living creatures decently should be on everyone's agenda.

Would all be fixed if the whole world spammed soi dog's email and phoneline with helpfull tips for their slowly processed ideas.

The only tip required would be: get out of the dam_n island and bring the dogs on a cheap large land in phang na where they wont bother anyone and where you wont need to beg for money and harass people in front of businesses with fake guilt trips.

Anyways, even education wont get rid of soi dogs. They are pickup trucks that drive around every minor street and empties at various places food for dogs. Most of these pickups have 5-10 massive bag of food that they slowly give out everyday on the same spots. I have told the one in my area that i will take a stick and **** up his pickup if i see him again, i didnt see him for a while but yesterday i saw him from far away and could not get to him. Now its a fight. My street is small and there is no need to feed the overfed dogs and he still came so you see? nothing will ever be fixed. Next time im gonna make a large bump into his car(he wont come down he was really scared with 4 of his friends) and he'll still keep on coming.

Im a dog lover, now thanks to thai people i hate dogs more than african pirates

Don't blame the dogs! They're just doing what comes naturally - it is us the humans who are providing the environment for this to occur

[KarenBravo]

Soi Dogs

Many people have simply described their personal situation with Soi dogs. I can't see how that furthers to the discussion really; anyone who has stayed in Thailand for more than a few days is aware of the situation.

However, when it comes to addressing the problem many posters seem to be looking for a "single shot" solution; they blame religion, culture corruption and suggest culling and/or neutering. All of these are factors but cannot be addressed individually. What is needed is a concerted holistic approach.

The reality must surely be that a complete sea-change is needed. One has to address the animals their environment and the society they live and thrive in. It comes down to winning over public opinion and then subsequent actions.

Culling alone can only work on a limited dog population or the practicalities become overwhelming.

Sterilisation - this is very expensive and time consuming - one has to achieve a certain percentage of the dog population for it to be effective - given the numbers involved in Thailand this is probably an impractical proposition. It could be used on a reduced population although the dogs themselves can’t reproduce, once they die they are easily replaced by dogs from outside that can.

As for religion - well are all or only Buddhist countries dog-ridden? Or are there other more important underlying reasons?

Making merit by freeing birds, turtles and feeding dogs is a vey questionable habit given the appalling practices that accompany supplying this need. THis artificial practice needs to be reviewed and replaced with a more "genuine" process.

Culture - well there is a culture of “being kind” to animals and unfortunately in parallel this is also a culture of extreme lack of education about animals, animal welfare and in parts of the population a total lack of empathy for other living creatures. This needs to be tackled in conjunction with all other problems.

Corruption - Several years back Pattaya gathered together several million baht to address the dog problem there - the program never started as somehow the money "disappeared"

To have any chance of a lasting solution steps must first be taken to reduce and manage the dog population......

The area that can support a sustainable "stray" dog population is dependent on the amount of food available to that population. As the food supplies dwindle, so does the population. Dogs like most other animals will reduce breeding or ceased to breed if food supplies become scarce.

This is where the sea-change is involved - the feeding of dogs needs to stop and the disposal of garbage needs to be changed to make it less accessible to the animals.

THEN and only then with a decreasing dog population will campaigns of sterilisation and putting down the deceased animals will have an effect.

It IS possible to make you area a place where dogs don't want to be; if they can't find food (or shelter) they won't come. Culling won't work on a local basis - other dogs will just replace them.

Check you bins to be dog proof, liaise with your neighbours - and here's the hard part - try to persuade them NOT to feed the dogs. Also try to persuade them to keep their pet dogs from roaming. There is a major problem here as some dogs have a "status half-way between "stray" and "pet"; "community dogs" are considered an asset to the area as they bark at intruders or anyone/thing they regard as unfamiliar - this is seen as a kind of burglar alarm amongst other things. These dogs often even have collars and are treated as friends by the locals. The problem is there is little or no care for these dogs and they are allowed to breed with whatever and whenever they want.

As you can see there is a lot to get over before any improvement can be achieved however if you do succeed you will notice after a short time that the animals (apart from the occasional prospector) have lost interest in your area it becomes cleaner, safer, healthier and less noisy at night.

You might even find that people in adjoining neighbourhoods will then come to you asking how to get their own neighbourhoods cleaned up.

Hey......why don't we just cure the world of all known diseases and achieve world peace whilst we're at it?

If you have a valid criticism of something in this post why not say it? If you don't have a point of view why make so obvious by irrelevant comments that seem to indicate you haven't really understood a single word.

I think my single sentence says exactly what I mean. Was it too subtle for you?

Your solution is totally impractical, unworkable and a complete litany of wishful thinking, that will never happen.

There! Is that plain enough for you?

[Hostile17]

Would all be fixed if the whole world spammed soi dog's email and phoneline with helpfull tips for their slowly processed ideas.

The only tip required would be: get out of the dam_n island and bring the dogs on a cheap large land in phang na where they wont bother anyone and where you wont need to beg for money and harass people in front of businesses with fake guilt trips.

Anyways, even education wont get rid of soi dogs. They are pickup trucks that drive around every minor street and empties at various places food for dogs. Most of these pickups have 5-10 massive bag of food that they slowly give out everyday on the same spots. I have told the one in my area that i will take a stick and **** up his pickup if i see him again, i didnt see him for a while but yesterday i saw him from far away and could not get to him. Now its a fight. My street is small and there is no need to feed the overfed dogs and he still came so you see? nothing will ever be fixed. Next time im gonna make a large bump into his car(he wont come down he was really scared with 4 of his friends) and he'll still keep on coming.

Im a dog lover, now thanks to thai people i hate dogs more than african pirates

Don't blame the dogs! They're just doing what comes naturally - it is us the humans who are providing the environment for this to occur

No its you and your friends. Im not part of this. I respect other people and i respect dogs enough not to feed them in a shitty environement. If all your ****** didnt feed them they would simply walk away in the forest and live a happy life without bitting the kids

[LivinginKata]

Ok, enough of the inflammatory posts. One post now removed, and i am reviewing some earlier posts.

[HongKongPhooey]

If they want to eat dog that's their business. They just need to do it without any unnecessary suffering to the animal is all. All cultures all over the world eat things that aren't bred for mass consumption, that's irrelevant.

You don't think it's "a tradition worth carrying on" but they obviously do, otherwise it wouldn't carry on it would stop.

so to follow your dog logic

Do we accept cannibalism if as you suggest it is “if they want to eat each other that's their business”

That's about the only example you could possibly give to prove your point, and as you well know is completely different kettle of fish. Having said that, cannibalism is all but a thing of the past. Explorers have to travel to the most remote villages in places like Borneo and even then they have to travel to even smaller villages to find examples of where it's happened in the last 10/20 years. We're talking about the most remote humans on the planet and they've put cannibalism in the past, so a pretty silly comparison wouldn't you say?

Ask me the same about any other animal and I will give you the same answer. If it isn't endangered, and it doesn't suffer unnecessarily, then people can eat whatever they desire, it's as simple as that.

Lots of indigenous people like to Witchetty grubs. Not because they need to through hunger but because they are a delicacy. A huge amount of people eat horse, South Americans eat guinea pigs, lots of people eat wild rats, etc etc.

My point was, that there is nothing wrong with the actual act of eating dog meat as you implied. Nor do I believe there is anything wrong with European traditions of eating game as you also implied. I regularly enjoy a rabbit pie in the UK. There are obviously a lot of problems in the industry, but that is a completely separate argument to the wrongs and rights of eating the meat.

The incorrect use of these sort of phrases show how ill-equipped people are to deal with the problems presented by a large uncontrolled dog population.

No offence but it seems it is you who is ill-equipped to deal with the soi dog problem. It's up to the Thais to deal with the problem as and when (if) they ever see fit to do so. If Thai people don't mind them, why would they be in a hurry to get rid of them? Just to keep you and all your Farang buddies happy?

[Hostile17]

well said. I dont think i'll ever eat dog meat as i would probably not eat cow meat if i had had a cow pet in my youth. Lots of problem in those industry and as shown in the phuket news this week, you can even give pigs a pleasant life before slaughter than it does not matter. They never suffer, their unconcious lives just end faster and the cycle starts over for them.

[cowslip]

If they want to eat dog that's their business. They just need to do it without any unnecessary suffering to the animal is all. All cultures all over the world eat things that aren't bred for mass consumption, that's irrelevant.

You don't think it's "a tradition worth carrying on" but they obviously do, otherwise it wouldn't carry on it would stop.

so to follow your dog logic

Do we accept cannibalism if as you suggest it is “if they want to eat each other that's their business”

That's about the only example you could possibly give to prove your point, and as you well know is completely different kettle of fish. Having said that, cannibalism is all but a thing of the past. Explorers have to travel to the most remote villages in places like Borneo and even then they have to travel to even smaller villages to find examples of where it's happened in the last 10/20 years. We're talking about the most remote humans on the planet and they've put cannibalism in the past, so a pretty silly comparison wouldn't you say?

Ask me the same about any other animal and I will give you the same answer. If it isn't endangered, and it doesn't suffer unnecessarily, then people can eat whatever they desire, it's as simple as that.

Lots of indigenous people like to Witchetty grubs. Not because they need to through hunger but because they are a delicacy. A huge amount of people eat horse, South Americans eat guinea pigs, lots of people eat wild rats, etc etc.

My point was, that there is nothing wrong with the actual act of eating dog meat as you implied. Nor do I believe there is anything wrong with European traditions of eating game as you also implied. I regularly enjoy a rabbit pie in the UK. There are obviously a lot of problems in the industry, but that is a completely separate argument to the wrongs and rights of eating the meat.

The incorrect use of these sort of phrases show how ill-equipped people are to deal with the problems presented by a large uncontrolled dog population.

No offence but it seems it is you who is ill-equipped to deal with the soi dog problem. It's up to the Thais to deal with the problem as and when (if) they ever see fit to do so. If Thai people don't mind them, why would they be in a hurry to get rid of them? Just to keep you and all your Farang buddies happy?

Sorry but I think your point of view is quite facile. ....and in fact unconnected with the post you have quoted.

BUT

your interpretation of the situation is baseless - lots of Thai people hate dogs -

i work with about 4000 Thai people and a vast number not only don't like days, but are scared having been bitten or chased by them.

Furthermore to divide problems on the basis of nationality or nation is quite frankly, ludicrous.

I work here and it affects me directly, but it also affects visitors and therefore tourism and associated industries. In fact you will find many organisations all over the world that deal with problems in countries other than their own, whether concerned with animals, humanitarian aid or finance. No country is and isolated entity and if you think that you really should review your perception of the world.

If you look at countries with a dog problem you'll see that in general as the country gets wealthier the dog problems et addressed and the problem dwindles - to dismiss Thailand as an exception is to ignore the evidence and make sweeping and inaccurate generalisations about the Thai people.

[cowslip]

"Lots of indigenous people like to Witchetty grub" - as someone who has worked with indigenous Australians, I find your comments quite risible.

It is really difficult, in fact pointless to put an argument to someone of your ilk as i get the feeling most of this is beyond you as your arguments are shallow, without thought or substance.

Edited June 13, 2012 by cowslip

[Sayonarax]

Why stop a good trade, not like anyone in the country does anything about soi dogs. Maybe i should start a dog farm, seriously untapped market here.

[cowslip]

Why stop a good trade, not like anyone in the country does anything about soi dogs. Maybe i should start a dog farm, seriously untapped market here.

so cruelty to animals and selling unhygienic meat is a good trade?

[KarenBravo]

so cruelty to animals and selling unhygienic meat is a good trade?

Definitely. Just ask the French about their lucrative Fois Gras industry.

[HongKongPhooey]

your interpretation of the situation is baseless - lots of Thai people hate dogs -

i work with about 4000 Thai people and a vast number not only don't like days, but are scared having been bitten or chased by them.

Furthermore to divide problems on the basis of nationality or nation is quite frankly, ludicrous.

Because you work in Thailand doesn't give you any right to have an input in to how the authorities do things, ergo it's a Thai problem for Thai people to sought out. The authorities will do what they see fit, if your 4000 buddies from work don't like it then they need to stand up and do something about it and make things change. You bitching on a forum is going to change a the Thai dog situation how exactly. This is Thailand, if Thai people, authorities or general public, want to do something about the soi dogs they will. Until then you accept it or you don't who really cares, not me, not most of the Thais, and certainly not the dogs.

I work here and it affects me directly, but it also affects visitors and therefore tourism and associated industries. In fact you will find many organisations all over the world that deal with problems in countries other than their own, whether concerned with animals, humanitarian aid or finance. No country is and isolated entity and if you think that you really should review your perception of the world.

That old chestnut. I've got a problem with something, so lets say it affects the tourists so my pointless argument seems a lot more effective. What percentage of tourists do you really think are affected by soi dogs?

"Lots of indigenous people like to Witchetty grub" - as someone who has worked with indigenous Australians, I find your comments quite risible.

You said people shouldn't eat dog or Game, because they weren't farmed, they weren't starving, and were just silly traditions, or words to that effect. How is me pointing out a long list of other, wild, non commercially farmed food, eaten by people all over the world who aren't starving, not a relevant point. Indigenous Australians shouldn't eat big fat worms because it's a silly tradition they should let go of? Or do they eat them because they like the taste and they are a part of their culture. If dogs weren't being tortured what would be the difference exactly in a Vietnamese person eating dog meat for the same reason, except that it doesn't sit right with your delicate sense of right and wrong. You never did explain why exactly it is I shouldn't eat rabbit pie by the way?

It is really difficult, in fact pointless to put an argument to someone of your ilk

your arguments are shallow, without thought or substance.

your comments are risible

your points are quite facile

You're lowering yourself intellectually, yet here you are on Thai Visa every day. Why would someone so Intellectually superior bother wasting their time on a low brow forum?

I normally like a good discussion but I find your attitude so horrendously pompous that I just can't be bothered to have anything to do with you, which is most unlike me, so it says a lot. I get the feeling that I feel the same about you as a lot of other members feel about me.

At the end of the day I'm in a win win situation. Even if my argument was wrong I still win because I'm not the one bitching about a few mutts. They don't bother me in the slightest. It must be horrible to spend life so het up about such tiny, unimportant things.

One last thing, as I'm bored of you and this thread, (9 people liked my posts on this thread, that's good enough for me) If you are so intellectually superior to argue with someone of my ilk, shouldn't you know the difference between their and there by now.(post #25)

[simple1]

Congrats on receiving 9 likes for your posts; no doubt from dog lovers. In my opinion you're the one who's being pompous and arrogant. Uncontrolled dogs are a problem in Thailand whether you're Thai or falang. Just look at the dogs defecating on the beaches with the associated heath issues, do you believe the it's doesn't bother anyone, including you? Another example, in a restaurant and some mange /disease ridden dog begging for food from your table and then some fool feeding it from the table. Also dogs barking during the night keeping you awake. Guess what, it's the Thais who are poisoning them,