What'S Up At California Wow? Doors Closed...

[tropo]

Hi Just a heads up there is a sign now at the front desk of Tony;s Gym " stating price changes will occur on the 4.2.2013 which will benefit all members. I asked the lady and the front desk she told me everything is going up....

According to the notice some things are going up, others are going down, resulting in an overall benefit to members.

[tropo]

Hi Just a heads up there is a sign now at the front desk of Tony;s Gym " stating price changes will occur on the 4.2.2013 which will benefit all members. I asked the lady and the front desk she told me everything is going up....

Could that mean the return of towels and bottled water?

No it definitely means same revenue with less customers

He may have shot himself in the foot with too many lifetime specials. It doesn't seem too much busier after signing up more than 300 members. He may have inadvertently converted many yearly members to lifetime members. These lifetime specials are becoming so common that people on here have been asking when the next deal is.

[ray35ty]

I have my doubts about signing people up for a life time as you saw with california wow it doesnt work. A business like a gym needs constant cashflow. everything goes up over time. All it takes is for management to state they made a mistake and require all members to pay monthly or yearly and since there is no real competion it could work.

[tropo]

I have my doubts about signing people up for a life time as you saw with california wow it doesnt work. A business like a gym needs constant cashflow. everything goes up over time. All it takes is for management to state they made a mistake and require all members to pay monthly or yearly and since there is no real competion it could work.

Most people who take on cheap lifetime memberships are not naive enough to assume it's for an actual lifetime.

I shouldn't have to even mention this as it should be obvious, but when faced with a lifetime membership offer of 15,000 baht for a gym which costs 8000 per year to join, you're ahead if he stays open for a year and a day, aren't you?

It's an educated gamble with high odds in our favour.

It's a no-brainer to someone who lives here and trains year round.

How he stays afloat is his concern. His gyms are so run down already they can't get much worse. Nothing is maintained and so much equipment is unusable due to lack of maintenance.

If I get 2 years out of it I'm happy and I hope I don't have to keep training there for a lifetime. If he eventually closes, then that will make place for someone to open a real gym. Right now he has the market cornered with cheap gyms all over town and there's little chance for decent competition.

[Asiantravel]

I have my doubts about signing people up for a life time as you saw with california wow it doesnt work. A business like a gym needs constant cashflow. everything goes up over time. All it takes is for management to state they made a mistake and require all members to pay monthly or yearly and since there is no real competion it could work.

Most people who take on cheap lifetime memberships are not naive enough to assume it's for an actual lifetime.

I shouldn't have to even mention this as it should be obvious, but when faced with a lifetime membership offer of 15,000 baht for a gym which costs 8000 per year to join, you're ahead if he stays open for a year and a day, aren't you?

It's an educated gamble with high odds in our favour.

It's a no-brainer to someone who lives here and trains year round.

How he stays afloat is his concern. His gyms are so run down already they can't get much worse. Nothing is maintained and so much equipment is unusable due to lack of maintenance.

If I get 2 years out of it I'm happy and I hope I don't have to keep training there for a lifetime. If he eventually closes, then that will make place for someone to open a real gym. Right now he has the market cornered with cheap gyms all over town and there's little chance for decent competition.

You sound like the people who paid for the Thailand Elite card

when you pay any lump sum amount upfront, you are still a sucker because you are risking the establishment being there indefinitely.

And it is most certainly not an educated gamble because in this day and age you only have to look at how many scam artists there are out there and even the owner of this establishment looks like he was a scam artist all along.

[tropo]

I have my doubts about signing people up for a life time as you saw with california wow it doesnt work. A business like a gym needs constant cashflow. everything goes up over time. All it takes is for management to state they made a mistake and require all members to pay monthly or yearly and since there is no real competion it could work.

Most people who take on cheap lifetime memberships are not naive enough to assume it's for an actual lifetime.

I shouldn't have to even mention this as it should be obvious, but when faced with a lifetime membership offer of 15,000 baht for a gym which costs 8000 per year to join, you're ahead if he stays open for a year and a day, aren't you?

It's an educated gamble with high odds in our favour.

It's a no-brainer to someone who lives here and trains year round.

How he stays afloat is his concern. His gyms are so run down already they can't get much worse. Nothing is maintained and so much equipment is unusable due to lack of maintenance.

If I get 2 years out of it I'm happy and I hope I don't have to keep training there for a lifetime. If he eventually closes, then that will make place for someone to open a real gym. Right now he has the market cornered with cheap gyms all over town and there's little chance for decent competition.

You sound like the people who paid for the Thailand Elite card

when you pay any lump sum amount upfront, you are still a sucker because you are risking the establishment being there indefinitely.

And it is most certainly not an educated gamble because in this day and age you only have to look at how many scam artists there are out there and even the owner of this establishment looks like he was a scam artist all along.

You sound like a ****** (sorry, I couldn't type it out without the risk of taking a holiday )

15,000 baht compared to what? Millions?

Your comments are absurd and hardly worth replying to. Go back and do the math. Also consider how long Tony's has been in business and how he's expanding.

[jbrain]

You sound like a ****** (sorry, I couldn't type it out without the risk of taking a holiday )

Naah, there is no risk in typing travelagent on this forum............that's the word you had in mind, not ?

[toenail]

All the other "decent" fitness clubs are located at some of Pattaya's 5 star hotels (Dusit, Royal Cliff, Marriot, Hilton, Centara...) but you pay Western prices for them. Since I live here, I do not mind paying the 22,000 annual fee (my gym's fee) since this is my only outlet for staying fit (I do not golf ). I know that my gym will be airconditioned, clean, and with a trained, smiling staff that is NOT pushing more added membership options on me (plus, they know my name--- CA Wow never did though was also a member there for 3 years.) In order for CA Wow to succeed, they will have to raise the prices ...maybe this will discourage the "posers" and two week tourists becoming members that don't put the equipment away.

[tropo]

All the other "decent" fitness clubs are located at some of Pattaya's 5 star hotels (Dusit, Royal Cliff, Marriot, Hilton, Centara...) but you pay Western prices for them. Since I live here, I do not mind paying the 22,000 annual fee (my gym's fee) since this is my only outlet for staying fit (I do not golf ). I know that my gym will be airconditioned, clean, and with a trained, smiling staff that is NOT pushing more added membership options on me (plus, they know my name--- CA Wow never did though was also a member there for 3 years.) In order for CA Wow to succeed, they will have to raise the prices ...maybe this will discourage the "posers" and two week tourists becoming members that don't put the equipment away.

The price at Royal Cliff is 35K, Centara around 30K, Marriot is also around 35K. Royal Cliff and Centara are nice fitness clubs, but fitness clubs are not suitable for many people who prefer hardcore weight gyms. eg. World Gym, Gold's Gym. There is currently no replacement for California Wow here. Sending a bodybuilder to a hotel fitness club would be like sending a competition swimmer to a hotel pool for his training.

When California Wow first closed I did the rounds looking for a nice airconditioned gym where I could do squats, dead lifts, heavy barbell shrugs and presses. I needed a squat rack with an olympic bar and lots of 20kg plates. It wasn't worth 35K per year to not be able to do these exercises among other exercises I can also not do at the 5 star hotel gyms. Machines are nice to have and I use plenty of them, but I need more - more than hotel gyms can provide.

Edited January 31, 2013 by tropo

[Asiantravel]

Most people who take on cheap lifetime memberships are not naive enough to assume it's for an actual lifetime.

I shouldn't have to even mention this as it should be obvious, but when faced with a lifetime membership offer of 15,000 baht for a gym which costs 8000 per year to join, you're ahead if he stays open for a year and a day, aren't you?

It's an educated gamble with high odds in our favour.

It's a no-brainer to someone who lives here and trains year round.

How he stays afloat is his concern. His gyms are so run down already they can't get much worse. Nothing is maintained and so much equipment is unusable due to lack of maintenance.

If I get 2 years out of it I'm happy and I hope I don't have to keep training there for a lifetime. If he eventually closes, then that will make place for someone to open a real gym. Right now he has the market cornered with cheap gyms all over town and there's little chance for decent competition.

You sound like the people who paid for the Thailand Elite card

when you pay any lump sum amount upfront, you are still a sucker because you are risking the establishment being there indefinitely.

And it is most certainly not an educated gamble because in this day and age you only have to look at how many scam artists there are out there and even the owner of this establishment looks like he was a scam artist all along.

You sound like a ****** (sorry, I couldn't type it out without the risk of taking a holiday )

15,000 baht compared to what? Millions?

Your comments are absurd and hardly worth replying to. Go back and do the math. Also consider how long Tony's has been in business and how he's expanding.

California WOW – Have they just figured out it’s a scam?

A quick google search of other california fitness chains around the region (Hong Kong, Taiwan, Korea, Singapore, and Malaysia) will show you exactly what I’m referring to, in each of these countries the California Fitness gyms went bankrupt

http://thaicapitalis...out-its-a-scam/

Edited January 31, 2013 by Asiantravel

[tropo]

15,000 baht compared to what? Millions?

California WOW – Have they just figured out it’s a scam?

You're getting confused. You were comparing the payment of a lifetime membership at Tony's (15,000 baht) with the payment of an Elite card (millions).

It's hardly a valid comparison to make your original point that people who pay this are uneducated suckers.

[DCvincens]

I walked past there last night, and some gus were moving a lot of equipment out. I talked to the 'boss' of the lot, and he said its shut down for good. Move out everything. New gym in place with new owner in about 3 months..

Thats a bummer. Surely they cant sell too many new life/year memberships second time around.

Vince, chiropractor

[OMGImInPattaya]

I walked past there last night, and some gus were moving a lot of equipment out. I talked to the 'boss' of the lot, and he said its shut down for good. Move out everything. New gym in place with new owner in about 3 months..

Thats a bummer. Surely they cant sell too many new life/year memberships second time around.

Sure they can...to the same daft people who bought in the first time around...I mean, it's a life-time membership isn't it!

[tropo]

Sure they can...to the same daft people who bought in the first time around...I mean, it's a life-time membership isn't it!

I was one of those daft people. I paid 10,000 baht for 3 years of gym use (July 2009 to July 2012). It was the most daft thing I ever did.

From where I'm sitting the daft people are the ones who don't get the lifetime memberships when they're available for the right price.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Sure they can...to the same daft people who bought in the first time around...I mean, it's a life-time membership isn't it!

I was one of those daft people. I paid 10,000 baht for 3 years of gym use (July 2009 to July 2012). It was the most daft thing I ever did.

From where I'm sitting the daft people are the ones who don't get the lifetime memberships when they're available for the right price.

Tell that to the guy who bought one the week before it closed.

[tropo]

Sure they can...to the same daft people who bought in the first time around...I mean, it's a life-time membership isn't it!

I was one of those daft people. I paid 10,000 baht for 3 years of gym use (July 2009 to July 2012). It was the most daft thing I ever did.

From where I'm sitting the daft people are the ones who don't get the lifetime memberships when they're available for the right price.

Tell that to the guy who bought one the week before it closed.

You didn't draw any distinction... you called us all "daft". Buying lifetime memberships is a bit like buying stocks. It's not a pure gamble.

Anyone who bought a California Wow membership a week before it closed was indeed "daft", or half asleep. It had closed for 2 weeks a month earlier.

When I joined up in 2009 I took a one year gamble because I liked the gym very much. 10K was a very good deal for even a year there. Compare that with 8K at Tony's - a virtual dump.

(P.S. Keep up the good work - we're nearly at #1000 on this thread. )

Edited January 31, 2013 by tropo

[Halfaboy]

I walked past there last night, and some gus were moving a lot of equipment out. I talked to the 'boss' of the lot, and he said its shut down for good. Move out everything. New gym in place with new owner in about 3 months..

Thats a bummer. Surely they cant sell too many new life/year memberships second time around.

Vince, chiropractor

Can you tell me where 'there' is. I.e. is it Pattaya or Bangkok. Would be interesting for me as my membership at one of the hotels in Pattaya is about to end.

[DCvincens]

Oh, sorry. This was at California Wow in Pattaya, in Avenue.

Im one of those suckers btw, i bought a year membership for 13 000 (lol) and they closed 2 months later. No more year/life cards for me.

Vince, chiropractor

[toenail]

There is such a demand for a decent fitness center that you would think Fitness First or Clark Hatch would take place of CA Wow. I suppose the owner of the failing Avenue, is requireing too much rent. Typical chinese-Thai buisness man not realizing the people it brings in for the other surrounding businesses. Only thinking of "saving face" by charging too much rent and having empty shops instead.

[jbrain]

There is such a demand for a decent fitness center that you would think Fitness First or Clark Hatch would take place of CA Wow. I suppose the owner of the failing Avenue, is requireing too much rent. Typical chinese-Thai buisness man not realizing the people it brings in for the other surrounding businesses. Only thinking of "saving face" by charging too much rent and having empty shops instead.

Wasn't there a poster sometime ago, actually 6 months ago, who was very well connected to the Avenue management and knew how succesful the new business plan was.

So how are all those disco's going ?

I guess there must be queue's to get in by now.

[tropo]

There is such a demand for a decent fitness center that you would think Fitness First or Clark Hatch would take place of CA Wow. I suppose the owner of the failing Avenue, is requireing too much rent. Typical chinese-Thai buisness man not realizing the people it brings in for the other surrounding businesses. Only thinking of "saving face" by charging too much rent and having empty shops instead.

Wasn't there a poster sometime ago, actually 6 months ago, who was very well connected to the Avenue management and knew how succesful the new business plan was.

So how are all those disco's going ?

I guess there must be queue's to get in by now.

That would be Seadoo. Perhaps he'll make an appearance soon and fill us in on the latest developments.

[seadoo]

Not sure I am overseas on Business returning soon.

To answer another persons comment about Thai-Chinese rents etc.

As mentioned previously all the vacant shops were originally leased on up to 30 year leases at super cheap rates but the lease did not stipulate that they actually had to open so they now have a group of Bangkok shop owners squatting on their leases and the centre owners can't do anything about it - this problem came because a high profile property agent in Pattaya who had sole management of the original leases did not do due diligence on lease contracts and simply took the money and ran so to speak.

All the new spaces being developed were not on the plan and they are using common areas to make new shops so they can get shops open.

So I wouldn't blame the centre owners for holding out for big rents its the lease holders screwing the place over.

[tropo]

I believe all the equipment has been taken out. One member reported trucks full of gear exiting the site one morning several weeks ago.

[jbrain]

Not sure I am overseas on Business returning soon.

To answer another persons comment about Thai-Chinese rents etc.

As mentioned previously all the vacant shops were originally leased on up to 30 year leases at super cheap rates but the lease did not stipulate that they actually had to open so they now have a group of Bangkok shop owners squatting on their leases and the centre owners can't do anything about it - this problem came because a high profile property agent in Pattaya who had sole management of the original leases did not do due diligence on lease contracts and simply took the money and ran so to speak.

All the new spaces being developed were not on the plan and they are using common areas to make new shops so they can get shops open.

So I wouldn't blame the centre owners for holding out for big rents its the lease holders screwing the place over.

I don't understand your explanation.

If someone doesn't pay lease, I'm sure the management can kick them out same as they did with Cawow.

I also don't believe that many shop owners pay lease for many years, even if it's super cheap, and don't open the shop or lease it to someone else.

[seadoo]

The leases were prepaid at time of signing. Simply walk around and call the telephone numbers posted on the closed shops and you'll get different lease owners answering.

The dentists that has the lease on the shop next to pizza pizza wants 450k per month to sub lease that's nuts.

As I said the so called high profile pattaya property company that handled the leases at start up wanted lump sum prepayments and due diligence was not forthcoming on the agreements - it was all about the money.

If you are still not convinced knock on the centre management door on the up ramp to the car park and ask K Kaew the Manageress.

[TheWalkingMan]

The dentists that has the lease on the shop next to pizza pizza wants 450k per month to sub lease that's nuts.

That is insane!

[seadoo]

Sad to announce that Shenanigans at The Avenue has now closed

[tropo]

Sad to announce that Shenanigans at The Avenue has now closed

Hopefully the writing is not on the wall for Villa Market. That would be sad.

[Halfaboy]

Sad to announce that Shenanigans at The Avenue has now closed

Have they moved to elsewhere ?

[yoslim]

Sad to announce that Shenanigans at The Avenue has now closed

Hopefully the writing is not on the wall for Villa Market. That would be sad.

Villa is stil quite busy, not a big crowd but always a few shoppers around when I go there