Phuket Vs Yangon (Myanmar) - Same Same .. But Different

[hansgruber]

Would it be rude to ask what you're working on over there?

I'm just curious.

[Somtamnication]

Pics pics pics

[starkey_rich]

First time I was in Burma was back in 1982.That was some mission I can tell you.Paid for my entire trip swapping

an old crappy Walkman for a chunk of Jade.Those were the days.Been back many times love the place.I really hope they don't spoil the place too much.

I hear the asking prices for hotels are crazy money now

If you have time Simon get up the North.Some of the friendliest people I have ever met.I have some old photo's of the transport up there.Small wild west stage coaches.

[NamKangMan]

Would it be rude to ask what you're working on over there?

I'm just curious.

It will be interesting to see what types of work they will let us foreigners do over there.

Can you imaging being able to stand behind your OWN bar and serving a beer to a customer???? :) :)

[starkey_rich]

how's the law can buy land, house, condo, start company? and have thais any advantage in these areas or the same as us?

have a look at any South East, North, Central Asian or mainly muslim country and the answer is NO. from Japan to the sands of the kalahari westerners cannot own land in a foreign country......its a western tradition to let foreigners take your sovereignty

I think Malaysia is in Asia and foreigners can buy land there and Burma is looking into it.

[NamKangMan]

how's the law can buy land, house, condo, start company? and have thais any advantage in these areas or the same as us?

have a look at any South East, North, Central Asian or mainly muslim country and the answer is NO. from Japan to the sands of the kalahari westerners cannot own land in a foreign country......its a western tradition to let foreigners take your sovereignty

I think Malaysia is in Asia and foreigners can buy land there and Burma is looking into it.

Malaysia has some of the most liberal laws, regarding foreign ownership of land, in the region, and it's an Islamic country.

[snamos]

Would it be rude to ask what you're working on over there?

I'm just curious.

It will be interesting to see what types of work they will let us foreigners do over there.

Can you imaging being able to stand behind your OWN bar and serving a beer to a customer????

Imagine how many customers would actually notice this? or even care??

[snamos]

how's the law can buy land, house, condo, start company? and have thais any advantage in these areas or the same as us?

have a look at any South East, North, Central Asian or mainly muslim country and the answer is NO. from Japan to the sands of the kalahari westerners cannot own land in a foreign country......its a western tradition to let foreigners take your sovereignty

I think Malaysia is in Asia and foreigners can buy land there and Burma is looking into it.

'Make Malaysia my Second Home' Visas allow you to buy land in certain areas. Thats it.....note 'certain'

Edited July 22, 2012 by snamos

[stevehaigh]

I think Malaysia is in Asia

i think you are right, well spotted

[starkey_rich]

how's the law can buy land, house, condo, start company? and have thais any advantage in these areas or the same as us?

have a look at any South East, North, Central Asian or mainly muslim country and the answer is NO. from Japan to the sands of the kalahari westerners cannot own land in a foreign country......its a western tradition to let foreigners take your sovereignty

I think Malaysia is in Asia and foreigners can buy land there and Burma is looking into it.

'Make Malaysia my Second Home' Visas allow you to buy land in certain areas. Thats it.....note 'certain'

I have noted it.

So that means foreigners can buy land in Asia

[simon43]

I'll briefly reply to some of the questions since they are more Myanmar-related than Phuket related.

You do not need a work permit to work here, but you can only do the types of work that are stipulated in your business visa, (but that visa does not limit you to working for a specified company).

I am working right now as a teacher, but this is a means to an end. (BTW, I am a post-grad with teaching qualifications and teaching experience, so please don't feel sorry for the students that I teach...0

The reason for taking this teaching job is to allow me to get used to the country, culture and language etc. Thereafter, I hope to obtain employment in Myanmar in the NGO/Humanitarian aid sector. I also want to obtain my amateur radio licence over here, (and to do that, I have to live in the country).

Simon

[NamKangMan]

Would it be rude to ask what you're working on over there?

I'm just curious.

It will be interesting to see what types of work they will let us foreigners do over there.

Can you imaging being able to stand behind your OWN bar and serving a beer to a customer????

Imagine how many customers would actually notice this? or even care??

The customers might not notice, or care, but I bet prespective business owners will. :)

[AndreDepaul]

Would it be rude to ask what you're working on over there?

I'm just curious.

It will be interesting to see what types of work they will let us foreigners do over there.

Can you imaging being able to stand behind your OWN bar and serving a beer to a customer????

Imagine how many customers would actually notice this? or even care??

The customers might not notice, or care, but I bet prespective business owners will.

I can't think of anything worse than the laws changing so every farang and his dog could open a two bit bar or business, what a nightmare. The same as if the land ownership laws changed, Thailand would become hell on earth rapidely IMO.

It's unfortunate that the genuine decent people can't own their own land or start a small business, but the sad reality is those people would be the minority. The vast majority would be unsavoury numpties, refusing to integrate in to Thai society. In no time huge areas of Thailand would be transformed in to Farang only ghettos.

You may have been the best landlord in town, but I for one am glad that we'll never know. The current system is frustrating for a lot of people but if you look at the big picture you will see it is for the best for Thais and (decent) Farang alike.

[NamKangMan]

@ AndreDepaul

Hospitality/tourism is only one industry. What about all the trades? Eg. electrician, plumber etc. The Myanmar Government will be issuing contracts to foreign companies. So will many NGO's.

What about industries such as mining/mineral exploration, financial sector, construction, manufacturing, retail, agriculture, medical, information technology, education, roads/transport etc etc etc etc. No occupation reserved for the locals because they need it all.

If foreigners can work in Myanmar, to get the country up and running, the opportunities will be worth considering, for many.

No work permit BS like here in Thailand. Enter on a "work" visa and start working/setting up your own business. The foreign ownership of land gives you the security to do this, or, they may consider 99 year leases or similar.

To feel welcome by the Myanmar Governemnt and the people, and to train the locals in a new trade/qualification/career, so they can improve their standard of living, whilst you are earning good money, I think would be quite satisfying.

It's all a bit bigger than a "two bit bar business."

Thailand has many highly skilled expat retirees here that would probably love to do a few days work here and there as a consultant, but they are not allowed to. Just look at the Bangkok floods. In a time of great need, America offered their assistance and Thailand declined. I don't think Myanmar will be like this. The whole country needs rebuilding.

Edited July 24, 2012 by NamKangMan

[AndreDepaul]

^ It sounds like you've made your mind up and a move to Myanmar is on the cards. I wish you all the best and would love to hear how you get on. The OP (very interesting read by the way ) has experience of both, it would be interesting to hear from others as and when they have too.

In the UK, highly experienced (Local) tradesmen have had serious problems in the last decade or so because of all the hordes of Eastern Europeans undercutting prices and working for peanuts. I know that's not the same as Farang working in Thailand but it's the same principle. The UK government could learn a thing or two from the Thais when it comes to immigration and labour laws IMO.

Every time you talk about it you are only looking at it from the selfish "what's can I get out of it" view point. Like when you say things like "I would love to serve behind my own bar" and "lots of retired expats that would love to do a few days work" etc etc. Thankfully the Thai government has the Thai peoples interests to heart when it comes to this and aren't too concerned with what's best for Expats, and nor should they be.

A developing country that would allow an expat from a developed country to come and earn money doing jobs locals are more than capable of doing, need their heads tested and thankfully is not the case in Thailand.

If Myanmar want to go down that road then that's up to them and good for people like you who are planning to move there, but in my experience when millions of people go to a developing country thinking "what can this place do for me" and "what can I get out of this place" it doesn't bode well for the locals. I believe the Thais have it spot on and as an unselfish person am happy to put up with the inconvenience it causes me for the greater good of the country and the Thai people.

Not to mention the fact that if you are married to a Thai you can own as much land as you like. It's hardly the Thai governments fault if a Farang marries someone they don't trust!!

Edited July 24, 2012 by AndreDepaul

[pagallim]

In the UK, highly experienced (Local) tradesmen have had serious problems in the last decade or so because of all the hordes of Eastern Europeans undercutting prices and working for peanuts. I know that's not the same as Farang working in Thailand but it's the same principle. The UK government could learn a thing or two from the Thais when it comes to immigration and labour laws IMO.

I believe the Thais have it spot on and as an unselfish person am happy to put up with the inconvenience it causes me for the greater good of the country and the Thai people.

You are of course referring to the entry to the European Union of Eastern European countries (Polish plumbers have become 'de rigueur' in the UK I believe), and the right to work and live in any EC country. What do you think the impact to Thailand will be in 2015 when the Asean Community (AC) comes into effect, allowing free movement of labour and equal terms to Asean nationals? Personally I foresee an influx of Filipino and Malaysian nationals (because of their better education and English language skills) to tourist areas such as Phuket (as an example).

Unfortunately, 'good of the country', in Thai terms, typically refers to the good of the few, not the masses. Nobody exploits the Thais better than the Thais themselves.

[KarenBravo]

What do you think the impact to Thailand will be in 2015 when the Asean Community (AC) comes into effect, allowing free movement of labour and equal terms to Asean nationals? Personally I foresee an influx of Filipino and Malaysian nationals (because of their better education and English language skills) to tourist areas such as Phuket (as an example).

I disagree. The movement of peoples will be the same as what happened to the UK. People from poorer countries will go to the richer countries.

There will be people going to Singapore and Malaysia. Not the other way around.

[pagallim]

What do you think the impact to Thailand will be in 2015 when the Asean Community (AC) comes into effect, allowing free movement of labour and equal terms to Asean nationals? Personally I foresee an influx of Filipino and Malaysian nationals (because of their better education and English language skills) to tourist areas such as Phuket (as an example).

I disagree. The movement of peoples will be the same as what happened to the UK. People from poorer countries will go to the richer countries.

There will be people going to Singapore and Malaysia. Not the other way around.

I agree in general with your point, though I also believe there will be an impact on specific areas (and micro economies) such as Phuket and Pattaya.

[PattayaPhom]

Exciting times and great opportunities for those that are willing to get in now. Keep the updates coming Simon

[simon43]

if you are married to a Thai you can own as much land as you like

That's news to me

Simon

[stevenl]

if you are married to a Thai you can own as much land as you like

That's news to me

Simon

That was a bit an unfair quote Simon, by leaving out the next sentence you have completely changed the meaning of what he was trying to say.

[NamKangMan]

^ It sounds like you've made your mind up and a move to Myanmar is on the cards. I wish you all the best and would love to hear how you get on. The OP (very interesting read by the way ) has experience of both, it would be interesting to hear from others as and when they have too.

In the UK, highly experienced (Local) tradesmen have had serious problems in the last decade or so because of all the hordes of Eastern Europeans undercutting prices and working for peanuts. I know that's not the same as Farang working in Thailand but it's the same principle. The UK government could learn a thing or two from the Thais when it comes to immigration and labour laws IMO.

Every time you talk about it you are only looking at it from the selfish "what's can I get out of it" view point. Like when you say things like "I would love to serve behind my own bar" and "lots of retired expats that would love to do a few days work" etc etc. Thankfully the Thai government has the Thai peoples interests to heart when it comes to this and aren't too concerned with what's best for Expats, and nor should they be.

A developing country that would allow an expat from a developed country to come and earn money doing jobs locals are more than capable of doing, need their heads tested and thankfully is not the case in Thailand.

If Myanmar want to go down that road then that's up to them and good for people like you who are planning to move there, but in my experience when millions of people go to a developing country thinking "what can this place do for me" and "what can I get out of this place" it doesn't bode well for the locals. I believe the Thais have it spot on and as an unselfish person am happy to put up with the inconvenience it causes me for the greater good of the country and the Thai people.

Not to mention the fact that if you are married to a Thai you can own as much land as you like. It's hardly the Thai governments fault if a Farang marries someone they don't trust!!

I don't have a need to move to Myanmar to work, but, for many guys back in their various countries that are working and sending money to their Thai girlfriends every month, working in Myanmar, and being with their Thai girlfriend, in the region, may be a great option for them. For many people currently working here under very stringent conditions, working in Myanmar may be a better option for them.

All I am saying is, it would be worth monitoring to see if good opportunities arise there in the very near future. I would suggest, as multi-national companies flock there, they will be sending their own managers and contractors over to get their operation up and running. It reminds me a little of when many companies set up call centers in India and Philippines - but Myanmar will most probably allow this across any, and all industries.

I am certainly not being selfish, or asking "what can Myanmar do for me." It's a "win win" for Myanmar and the farang that may go there to work. This is something Thailand has never been able to see. The comparison with England and the Eastern Europeans is not applicable here. Myanmar will be similar to what we have seen in Dubai. They will welcome westerners from all industries to build the country, properly, the first time.

You may be satisfied having an unqualified builder construct a house for you in Thailand, because you have no other choice, but Myanmar may prefer to have their locals trained up, on the job, by foreign tradesman and therefore, the quality of the construction will be to western standards, rather than the poor workmanship you get here. A "win win" situation for all. The locals a taught a trade, to western standards, and the home owner gets a properly constructed house, build to western standards, and built to last. Gee, the shower water may actually run into the drain because it's been tiled properly.

If the Thai Government has the Thai people's interest at heart, why do we have such a great divide between the rich and the poor here???? The wealthy Thai elite have been exploiting poorer Thai's, and farang, for years. Why do you think about 95% of the "working girls" in Thailand come from Issan????

You say a developing country that allows expats to come in and work needs their head read. That's a strange comment when it was Thailand that allowed America to build bombing base runways, to run sorties out of, and slaughter millions of Vietnamese people, in U-tapao, Ubon and Udon - then, welcomes all the American GI's to Pattaya for alcohol and sex. The Vietnam war started tourism in Thailand. Myanmar might be able to start their tourism by allowing foreign workers in, rather than foreign soldiers.

The one thing I really don't get about your post is that Thailand allows thousands of Burmese workers into Thailand, but only to do the minimum wage jobs, and hard labour jobs that the lazy Thai's refuse to do. These Burmese workers are exploited as well. Thailand only let in workers that they can make money out of, not workers that can make any money from working in Thailand.

Your comment that if you are married to a Thai you can own as much land as you want is simply an untruth. At Thai Law, even when married, a foreigner can not own land. It has nothing to do with "trust" and everything to do with where a foreigner stands within Thai Law, as to foreign ownership of land here, which is nowhere. Myanmar may offer a better deal to foreigners for land ownership and the security that goes with it.

Andre, you seem like quite a "Savvy" guy. I think we have met before in "Hong Kong" and "Bang Tao."

Edited July 25, 2012 by NamKangMan

[Payboy]

The 'ladies' are more 'rotund' than Thai women, closer to Indian body shape.

Note to self - cross Yangon off the itinerary.

[Old Croc]

Good call NKM.

The more he starts to expand his viewpoint the more obvious it becomes.

[LivinginKata]

<snip>

Andre, you seem like quite a "Savvy" guy. I think we have met before in "Hong Kong" and "Bang Tao."

Mmm - we won't be hearing from Andre again.

[NamKangMan]

Good call NKM.

The more he starts to expand his viewpoint the more obvious it becomes.

I give him full credit for coming up with unusual usernames. Very creative. :)

[doubleeight]

how's the law can buy land, house, condo, start company? and have thais any advantage in these areas or the same as us?

have a look at any South East, North, Central Asian or mainly muslim country and the answer is NO. from Japan to the sands of the kalahari westerners cannot own land in a foreign country......its a western tradition to let foreigners take your sovereignty

No You can buy and own land in Malaysia.

[petercallen]

how's the law can buy land, house, condo, start company? and have thais any advantage in these areas or the same as us?

have a look at any South East, North, Central Asian or mainly muslim country and the answer is NO. from Japan to the sands of the kalahari westerners cannot own land in a foreign country......its a western tradition to let foreigners take your sovereignty

No You can buy and own land in Malaysia.

Correct, but would you want to live there

[Guest]

No You can buy and own land in Malaysia.

Correct, but would you want to live there

Why not?

[KarenBravo]

Because it's one of the most boring countries in SE Asia?