2013 Kawasaki Ninjette 250 Breaks Cover!

[cbrer]

I will have to go put my deposit on an N650 today to hopefully lock in the old price. If it's going up 25-30%, that may change my decision as to whether I will get one.

25-30k. Not %. That would be a bit cheeky.

The tax increase on them is set to be 10% of value, whether Kawa pass all that onto the customer is yet unknown, but likely.

[nikster]

Thanks for clearing up the price list, I missed the 4k hike at the end of last year.

As others have pointed out the previous excise tax was 3%, and now it's 5%/10%, so net increase should be 2% for the 250 and 7% for the 650s.

Edited January 6, 2013 by nikster

[mania]

I have been following this thread, but I apparently missed the comments about the tax hike or any news of it. This is the first I have heard of it. My apologies. I may be old fashioned, but I still prefer hard evidence from the dealers mouth over internet forum post rumors.

Actually I think you did not miss it.

The info folks are talking about ( Tax Increase ) Was i believe posted in the CBR 500 thread.

Also Sumet was nice enough to post this info too...

[mania]

what is the top speed?

They run the same 2013 Ninja 250 in Indonesia

This guy posted his video at 170kmh

I have not pegged it & held it yet but can confirm

the starting roll up to 150 kmh is fairly quick & very smooth/linear no dips midrange

His Bike in all red is nice too.

Kind of wish we had the solids options here in Thailand

Edited January 6, 2013 by mania

[cbrer]

As others have pointed out the previous excise tax was 3%, and now it's 5%/10%, so net increase should be 2% for the 250 and 7% for the 650s.

I thought it was a new separate tax, and not just an increase on an existing tax.

[CBR250R]

what is the top speed?

They run the same 2013 Ninja 250 in Indonesia

This guy posted his video at 170kmh

I have not pegged it & held it yet but can confirm

the starting roll up to 150 kmh is fairly quick & very smooth/linear no dips midrange

His Bike in all red is nice too.

Kind of wish we had the solids options here in Thailand

Not trying to be a dick here, but why do people continue to advertise speedo top speeds which are well known to be notoriously inaccurate (often exaggerated by more than 10%) when gps is so readily available and considerably more accurate. Maybe it's because the speedo reading is typically much higher and makes for more favourable bragging rights. I've read countless anecdotal reports claiming that the 2008 gen of the Ninja 250R is a 100 mph+ bike (stock). Yet, any test review of the Ninja 250R I've read online or in print that uses a gps for top speed has never achieved a figure higher than the high 90s, and certainly none 100mph or greater.

[mania]

Not trying to be a dick here, but why do people continue to advertise speedo top speeds which are well known to be notoriously inaccurate (often exaggerated by more than 10%) when gps is so readily available and considerably more accurate. Maybe it's because the speedo reading is typically much higher and makes for more favorable bragging rights. I've read countless anecdotal reports claiming that the 2008 gen of the Ninja 250R is a 100 mph+ bike (stock). Yet, any test review of the Ninja 250R I've read online or in print that uses a gps for top speed has never achieved a figure higher than the high 90s, and certainly none 100mph or greater.

No problem & I don't see it as a dick comment at all

Tell you the truth I rarely ever look at a speedometer myself & mainly go by feel or tach if winding it for shifting.

I do have a GPS unit so at some point would like to verify the speedometer on this bike.

Not because of any empirical numbers but I have noticed 90-100kph feels much faster compared to the Wave 125i I bought the wife.

I would have expected it the other way since the Wave has less rubber on the ground, suspension, smoothness etc.

So would have guessed 90 on the Wave would feel frighteningly faster at 90-100kph

So I am more wondering about the Wave's speedometer accuracy. I am guessing it is reading well high.

Edited January 6, 2013 by mania

[dave_boo]

what is the top speed?

They run the same 2013 Ninja 250 in Indonesia

This guy posted his video at 170kmh

I have not pegged it & held it yet but can confirm

the starting roll up to 150 kmh is fairly quick & very smooth/linear no dips midrange

His Bike in all red is nice too.

Kind of wish we had the solids options here in Thailand

Not trying to be a dick here, but why do people continue to advertise speedo top speeds which are well known to be notoriously inaccurate (often exaggerated by more than 10%) when gps is so readily available and considerably more accurate. Maybe it's because the speedo reading is typically much higher and makes for more favourable bragging rights. I've read countless anecdotal reports claiming that the 2008 gen of the Ninja 250R is a 100 mph+ bike (stock). Yet, any test review of the Ninja 250R I've read online or in print that uses a gps for top speed has never achieved a figure higher than the high 90s, and certainly none 100mph or greater.

Not trying to be a dick either, but greater than 10%? From what I've gleaned from the board, and personal experience, most 'big bikes' sold in the Kingdom have a ~8% optimism factor built in.

And FWIW, the 08+ Ninja got me up over 160 km/h verified down AH1 with the only mods being the snorkel removal, Power Commander, and being shod with Pirelli tyres. And it's not like I'm terribly light weight. Still need to give the Grimms exhaust a workout to see what it adds.

[CBR250R]

what is the top speed?

They run the same 2013 Ninja 250 in Indonesia

This guy posted his video at 170kmh

I have not pegged it & held it yet but can confirm

the starting roll up to 150 kmh is fairly quick & very smooth/linear no dips midrange

His Bike in all red is nice too.

Kind of wish we had the solids options here in Thailand

Not trying to be a dick here, but why do people continue to advertise speedo top speeds which are well known to be notoriously inaccurate (often exaggerated by more than 10%) when gps is so readily available and considerably more accurate. Maybe it's because the speedo reading is typically much higher and makes for more favourable bragging rights. I've read countless anecdotal reports claiming that the 2008 gen of the Ninja 250R is a 100 mph+ bike (stock). Yet, any test review of the Ninja 250R I've read online or in print that uses a gps for top speed has never achieved a figure higher than the high 90s, and certainly none 100mph or greater.

Not trying to be a dick either, but greater than 10%? From what I've gleaned from the board, and personal experience, most 'big bikes' sold in the Kingdom have a ~8% optimism factor built in.

And FWIW, the 08+ Ninja got me up over 160 km/h verified down AH1 with the only mods being the snorkel removal, Power Commander, and being shod with Pirelli tyres. And it's not like I'm terribly light weight. Still need to give the Grimms exhaust a workout to see what it adds.

All of my bikes (2009 WR250R, 2009 CBR125R, 2011 CBR125R, 2011 CBR250R) are off 10% each. Granted, this doesn't mean all bikes are off by that amount. I purchased a speedohealer for each of them and have corrected the speedo to match the GPS speeds. In fact, I was a guinea pig for 12 O'clock Labs - they were kind enough to create a healer for my 2011+ CBR125R after I provided them with some wiring information. It is now available on their site, even though the U.S. does not import the CBR125R. Perhaps the bikes in LOS are different than the N. American bikes. And I wasn't referring to big or small bikes - just bikes in general. The American scooter review site "Just Gotta Scoot" suggests that many scooters show greater than 10% speedo exaggeration. The reviewer keeps track of such speedo/GPS inconsistencies in all the bikes he tests. The most recent review I clicked on suggests the same. See below:

http://www.justgottascoot.com/citycom2013.htm

Interestingly, he also tested a 2005 Ninja 250 and indicates in his review that the speedo is optimistic (close to 10%) verified by GPS. See below. Funny, he also tested the top speed and achieved a figure of 93 mph (GPS verified). I've read the the pre-2008 version of the Ninja 250R is supposed to have more top end too. Granted - there are many factors to consider here when testing top speed.

http://www.justgottascoot.com/commuterchallenge.htm

Remember, I was talking about a stock bike. Snorkel removal and Power Commander additions don't count. Did you import your bike - I didn't know that the 2008 Thai Ninja 250 was fuel-injected - which would be a prerequisite for a Power Commander. I thought it was carbed? And you mention that the speed was verified. How did you verify it? GPS? Some other method? Was it slightly downhill? Some tailwind?

[CBR250R]

Correction. I see that the 2008 Thai Ninja 250 is fuel-injected.

[dave_boo]

All of my bikes (2009 WR250R, 2009 CBR125R, 2011 CBR125R, 2011 CBR250R) are off 10% each. Granted, this doesn't mean all bikes are off by that amount. I purchased a speedohealer for each of them and have corrected the speedo to match the GPS speeds. In fact, I was a guinea pig for 12 O'clock Labs - they were kind enough to create a healer for my 2011+ CBR125R after I provided them with some wiring information. It is now available on their site, even though the U.S. does not import the CBR125R. Perhaps the bikes in LOS are different than the N. American bikes. And I wasn't referring to big or small bikes - just bikes in general. The American scooter review site "Just Gotta Scoot" suggests that many scooters show greater than 10% speedo exaggeration. The reviewer keeps track of such speedo/GPS inconsistencies in all the bikes he tests. The most recent review I clicked on suggests the same. See below:

http://www.justgotta...citycom2013.htm

Interestingly, he also tested a 2005 Ninja 250 and indicates in his review that the speedo is optimistic (close to 10%) verified by GPS. See below. Funny, he also tested the top speed and achieved a figure of 93 mph (GPS verified). I've read the the pre-2008 version of the Ninja 250R is supposed to have more top end too. Granted - there are many factors to consider here when testing top speed.

http://www.justgotta...erchallenge.htm

Remember, I was talking about a stock bike. Snorkel removal and Power Commander additions don't count. Did you import your bike - I didn't know that the 2008 Thai Ninja 250 was fuel-injected - which would be a prerequisite for a Power Commander. I thought it was carbed? And you mention that the speed was verified. How did you verify it? GPS? Some other method? Was it slightly downhill? Some tailwind?

So, with the exception of your CBR250R, none of your bikes have actually been sold through a dealer in LOS? I.E., the comments about the bikes being sold in Thailand and your personal experience from an apparent foreign country don't necessarily match?

With the exception of USA and a few select far east countries the 2008+ Ninja 250 has been FI. The bike was GPS (Garmin Zumo) verified along this stretch of road: https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=Phahon+Yothin+Rd%2FRoute+1%2FAH1%2FAH2&daddr=Route+1116&hl=en&ll=16.701971,99.472961&spn=0.714231,1.234589&sll=16.822617,99.19075&sspn=0.178446,0.308647&geocode=FcL6AAEdx1voBQ%3BFZ5k-wAdrTHuBQ&t=p&mra=dme&mrsp=0&sz=12&z=10

You of course can zoom in and check elevation changes, but it was held at >160 for some 8 minutes thus negating any questions about going downhill or not as it held at least that speed the entire time.

Finally a PC does little on the top end (was doing even less as the stock exhaust was there) but definitely helps out the mid-range.

[wantan]

CBR250R, i agree with you. But you are a nitpicker

Who really believes videos on youtube? Or talking about top speeds in a bike forum? Some people will tell the craziest things about how fast _their_ bikes are. And they will fight for it because they believe it. Many people confuse top speed with "the highest speed they ever reached on a nearly flat piece of road". But that is not what the term "top speed of a bike" usually means. The real top speed should be reproduceable at any time. And for this it neeeds a clearly defined test environment.

I wrote this a few days before and just copy it here to make my thoughts a bit clearer :

>>>

Is there a "real top speed"? Doesn't top speed depend on a lot of things, even on the same, totally stock bike? Size and weight of the rider. Clothes he is wearing. Fully tucked in or "normal" riding position. Tire pressure. Wind of course. And maybe even the weather, humid or dry, air pressure maybe. I don't know, it doesn't interest me very much. But most top speeds i hear from the owners are very "optimistic" imo. I only believe what i read on my real GPS, a Garmin 60CSx, not a dubious smartphone app.

<<<

And the less power a bike has, the more the difference is in what people measure as "their personal top speed". Don't want to start a silly fight about top speed of the Ninjette. Is it really important if the top speed is 150kmh or 170kmh? Who is wrong, who is right? Imo nobody

[CBR250R]

CBR250R, i agree with you. But you are a nitpicker

Who really believes videos on youtube? Or talking about top speeds in a bike forum? Some people will tell the craziest things about how fast _their_ bikes are. And they will fight for it because they believe it. Many people confuse top speed with "the highest speed they ever reached on a nearly flat piece of road". But that is not what the term "top speed of a bike" usually means. The real top speed should be reproduceable at any time. And for this it neeeds a clearly defined test environment.

I wrote this a few days before and just copy it here to make my thoughts a bit clearer :

>>>

Is there a "real top speed"? Doesn't top speed depend on a lot of things, even on the same, totally stock bike? Size and weight of the rider. Clothes he is wearing. Fully tucked in or "normal" riding position. Tire pressure. Wind of course. And maybe even the weather, humid or dry, air pressure maybe. I don't know, it doesn't interest me very much. But most top speeds i hear from the owners are very "optimistic" imo. I only believe what i read on my real GPS, a Garmin 60CSx, not a dubious smartphone app.

<<<

And the less power a bike has, the more the difference is in what people measure as "their personal top speed". Don't want to start a silly fight about top speed of the Ninjette. Is it really important if the top speed is 150kmh or 170kmh? Who is wrong, who is right? Imo nobody

Thanks wantan. To be honest, I really don't care what the top speed of a bike is. I guess I was just pointing out that any top speed claims that use the speedo for verification are at risk of being inaccurate. And as I mentioned previously (which also buttresses what you are saying) - there are many factors to consider. And I love the Ninja 250R. I would like to sample the new Ninja 300. I'm planning on selling my CBR250R this spring. It's too easy to ride - more power than I need - I just don't find it as engaging as my CBR125R (with Thai 2011 CBR150R engine swap). My current 2011 CBR125R is in the shop right now getting the 150R transplanted from the 2009 CBR. Not trying to fight about the top speed - hope it didn't come across that way - only debating the evidenced used to support a top speed claim.

[CBR250R]

All of my bikes (2009 WR250R, 2009 CBR125R, 2011 CBR125R, 2011 CBR250R) are off 10% each. Granted, this doesn't mean all bikes are off by that amount. I purchased a speedohealer for each of them and have corrected the speedo to match the GPS speeds. In fact, I was a guinea pig for 12 O'clock Labs - they were kind enough to create a healer for my 2011+ CBR125R after I provided them with some wiring information. It is now available on their site, even though the U.S. does not import the CBR125R. Perhaps the bikes in LOS are different than the N. American bikes. And I wasn't referring to big or small bikes - just bikes in general. The American scooter review site "Just Gotta Scoot" suggests that many scooters show greater than 10% speedo exaggeration. The reviewer keeps track of such speedo/GPS inconsistencies in all the bikes he tests. The most recent review I clicked on suggests the same. See below:

http://www.justgotta...citycom2013.htm

Interestingly, he also tested a 2005 Ninja 250 and indicates in his review that the speedo is optimistic (close to 10%) verified by GPS. See below. Funny, he also tested the top speed and achieved a figure of 93 mph (GPS verified). I've read the the pre-2008 version of the Ninja 250R is supposed to have more top end too. Granted - there are many factors to consider here when testing top speed.

http://www.justgotta...erchallenge.htm

Remember, I was talking about a stock bike. Snorkel removal and Power Commander additions don't count. Did you import your bike - I didn't know that the 2008 Thai Ninja 250 was fuel-injected - which would be a prerequisite for a Power Commander. I thought it was carbed? And you mention that the speed was verified. How did you verify it? GPS? Some other method? Was it slightly downhill? Some tailwind?

So, with the exception of your CBR250R, none of your bikes have actually been sold through a dealer in LOS? I.E., the comments about the bikes being sold in Thailand and your personal experience from an apparent foreign country don't necessarily match?

With the exception of USA and a few select far east countries the 2008+ Ninja 250 has been FI. The bike was GPS (Garmin Zumo) verified along this stretch of road: https://maps.google....sp=0&sz=12&z=10

You of course can zoom in and check elevation changes, but it was held at >160 for some 8 minutes thus negating any questions about going downhill or not as it held at least that speed the entire time.

Finally a PC does little on the top end (was doing even less as the stock exhaust was there) but definitely helps out the mid-range.

Actually - I believe my 2011 CBR125 has virtually identical cluster, digital layout, and electronics compared to the 2011 CBR150R sold in LOS. The bikes appear to be identical. The motor mounts are exactly the same. And when the CBR150R engine was shipped over to me - I was also given the entire cluster. As mentioned above, My new 2011 CBR125R is in the shop right now getting fitted with the Thai CBR150R engine. The speedo on my CBR125R was 10% off compared to my GPS. Once again - there could be regional differences at play here. For instance, the U.S. CBR250Rs apparently have an extremely accurate speedo. Online reports suggest that it matches GPS readings perfectly. However, our Canadian CBR250R speedos appear to be 10% optimistic in their readings.

[dave_boo]

CBR250R, i agree with you. But you are a nitpicker

Who really believes videos on youtube? Or talking about top speeds in a bike forum? Some people will tell the craziest things about how fast _their_ bikes are. And they will fight for it because they believe it. Many people confuse top speed with "the highest speed they ever reached on a nearly flat piece of road". But that is not what the term "top speed of a bike" usually means. The real top speed should be reproduceable at any time. And for this it neeeds a clearly defined test environment.

I wrote this a few days before and just copy it here to make my thoughts a bit clearer :

>>>

Is there a "real top speed"? Doesn't top speed depend on a lot of things, even on the same, totally stock bike? Size and weight of the rider. Clothes he is wearing. Fully tucked in or "normal" riding position. Tire pressure. Wind of course. And maybe even the weather, humid or dry, air pressure maybe. I don't know, it doesn't interest me very much. But most top speeds i hear from the owners are very "optimistic" imo. I only believe what i read on my real GPS, a Garmin 60CSx, not a dubious smartphone app.

<<<

And the less power a bike has, the more the difference is in what people measure as "their personal top speed". Don't want to start a silly fight about top speed of the Ninjette. Is it really important if the top speed is 150kmh or 170kmh? Who is wrong, who is right? Imo nobody

If you've been around for a while you know that I'm not Kawasaki's biggest fan. I do appreciate veracity however and can assure you that the posting I made earlier is entirely true.

A couple of other points of reference. That run was done with a backpack on as it was the return from a trip up Goat Mountain and down to Mae Sot and back. I was wrapped around the bike as best I could. I have approximately a 40" chest and a helmet that a Yorkie could take a nap in. And that's not getting on about my weight which has less to do with top speed than the drag my body creates.

Also for consideration is the fact that sitting bolt upright (that is pegs in the valley between the heels and forefoot of my boots and back straight) I always hit 133 km/h with the throttle pinned on a flat stretch. Cocking the elbows down so my body is angled more gives me another 10 or so.

[CBR250R]

CBR250R, i agree with you. But you are a nitpicker

Who really believes videos on youtube? Or talking about top speeds in a bike forum? Some people will tell the craziest things about how fast _their_ bikes are. And they will fight for it because they believe it. Many people confuse top speed with "the highest speed they ever reached on a nearly flat piece of road". But that is not what the term "top speed of a bike" usually means. The real top speed should be reproduceable at any time. And for this it neeeds a clearly defined test environment.

I wrote this a few days before and just copy it here to make my thoughts a bit clearer :

>>>

Is there a "real top speed"? Doesn't top speed depend on a lot of things, even on the same, totally stock bike? Size and weight of the rider. Clothes he is wearing. Fully tucked in or "normal" riding position. Tire pressure. Wind of course. And maybe even the weather, humid or dry, air pressure maybe. I don't know, it doesn't interest me very much. But most top speeds i hear from the owners are very "optimistic" imo. I only believe what i read on my real GPS, a Garmin 60CSx, not a dubious smartphone app.

<<<

And the less power a bike has, the more the difference is in what people measure as "their personal top speed". Don't want to start a silly fight about top speed of the Ninjette. Is it really important if the top speed is 150kmh or 170kmh? Who is wrong, who is right? Imo nobody

If you've been around for a while you know that I'm not Kawasaki's biggest fan. I do appreciate veracity however and can assure you that the posting I made earlier is entirely true.

A couple of other points of reference. That run was done with a backpack on as it was the return from a trip up Goat Mountain and down to Mae Sot and back. I was wrapped around the bike as best I could. I have approximately a 40" chest and a helmet that a Yorkie could take a nap in. And that's not getting on about my weight which has less to do with top speed than the drag my body creates.

Also for consideration is the fact that sitting bolt upright (that is pegs in the valley between the heels and forefoot of my boots and back straight) I always hit 133 km/h with the throttle pinned on a flat stretch. Cocking the elbows down so my body is angled more gives me another 10 or so.

I believe you. This isn't a case of me questioning the veracity of your claim. With a modified bike (snorkel mod and Power Commander mapping) it is completely tenable that the ningette could break 100 mph. But it comes back to my original point that I've never seen or read any objective evidence of a "completely stock" Ninja 250R breaking 100 mph. Perhaps there are some legitimate GPS verified examples out there. If there are - I haven't encountered them - but I've been eagerly searching.....

[mania]

But it comes back to my original point that I've never seen or read any objective evidence of a "completely stock" Ninja 250R breaking 100 mph. Perhaps there are some legitimate GPS verified examples out there. If there are - I haven't encountered them - but I've been eagerly searching.....

Will try to get back to you soon on that if possible & let you

know what I see.

I use a Garmin Edge so it is nice as I do not need to dink with it or even look at it.

When I get home I just connect it to the computer & all the info

that was recorded is there. Top Speed, Distance, AVG, Elevations,etc.

even heart rate which could be fun if I should wear the strap

[BirdsandBooze]

But it comes back to my original point that I've never seen or read any objective evidence of a "completely stock" Ninja 250R breaking 100 mph. Perhaps there are some legitimate GPS verified examples out there. If there are - I haven't encountered them - but I've been eagerly searching.....

Will try to get back to you soon on that if possible & let you

know what I see.

I use a Garmin Edge so it is nice as I do not need to dink with it or even look at it.

When I get home I just connect it to the computer & all the info

that was recorded is there. Top Speed, Distance, AVG, Elevations,etc.

even heart rate which could be fun if I should wear the strap

How does the Garmin Edge perform on your bike Mania? I know Garmin advertise it as a cycle GPS so is it suitable for M/Cs as well?

[cbrer]

CBR250R, i agree with you. But you are a nitpicker

Who really believes videos on youtube? Or talking about top speeds in a bike forum? Some people will tell the craziest things about how fast _their_ bikes are. And they will fight for it because they believe it. Many people confuse top speed with "the highest speed they ever reached on a nearly flat piece of road". But that is not what the term "top speed of a bike" usually means. The real top speed should be reproduceable at any time. And for this it neeeds a clearly defined test environment.

I wrote this a few days before and just copy it here to make my thoughts a bit clearer :

>>>

Is there a "real top speed"? Doesn't top speed depend on a lot of things, even on the same, totally stock bike? Size and weight of the rider. Clothes he is wearing. Fully tucked in or "normal" riding position. Tire pressure. Wind of course. And maybe even the weather, humid or dry, air pressure maybe. I don't know, it doesn't interest me very much. But most top speeds i hear from the owners are very "optimistic" imo. I only believe what i read on my real GPS, a Garmin 60CSx, not a dubious smartphone app.

<<<

And the less power a bike has, the more the difference is in what people measure as "their personal top speed". Don't want to start a silly fight about top speed of the Ninjette. Is it really important if the top speed is 150kmh or 170kmh? Who is wrong, who is right? Imo nobody

If you've been around for a while you know that I'm not Kawasaki's biggest fan. I do appreciate veracity however and can assure you that the posting I made earlier is entirely true.

A couple of other points of reference. That run was done with a backpack on as it was the return from a trip up Goat Mountain and down to Mae Sot and back. I was wrapped around the bike as best I could. I have approximately a 40" chest and a helmet that a Yorkie could take a nap in. And that's not getting on about my weight which has less to do with top speed than the drag my body creates.

Also for consideration is the fact that sitting bolt upright (that is pegs in the valley between the heels and forefoot of my boots and back straight) I always hit 133 km/h with the throttle pinned on a flat stretch. Cocking the elbows down so my body is angled more gives me another 10 or so.

I believe you. This isn't a case of me questioning the veracity of your claim. With a modified bike (snorkel mod and Power Commander mapping) it is completely tenable that the ningette could break 100 mph. But it comes back to my original point that I've never seen or read any objective evidence of a "completely stock" Ninja 250R breaking 100 mph. Perhaps there are some legitimate GPS verified examples out there. If there are - I haven't encountered them - but I've been eagerly searching.....

I thought Dave's ninjette had a snorkle mod, DBS full-system pipe, and power-commander fuel controller. So basically both the full air and fuel systems modified. Hardly an example of a stock bike out of the box.

[dave_boo]

CBR250R, i agree with you. But you are a nitpicker

Who really believes videos on youtube? Or talking about top speeds in a bike forum? Some people will tell the craziest things about how fast _their_ bikes are. And they will fight for it because they believe it. Many people confuse top speed with "the highest speed they ever reached on a nearly flat piece of road". But that is not what the term "top speed of a bike" usually means. The real top speed should be reproduceable at any time. And for this it neeeds a clearly defined test environment.

I wrote this a few days before and just copy it here to make my thoughts a bit clearer :

>>>

Is there a "real top speed"? Doesn't top speed depend on a lot of things, even on the same, totally stock bike? Size and weight of the rider. Clothes he is wearing. Fully tucked in or "normal" riding position. Tire pressure. Wind of course. And maybe even the weather, humid or dry, air pressure maybe. I don't know, it doesn't interest me very much. But most top speeds i hear from the owners are very "optimistic" imo. I only believe what i read on my real GPS, a Garmin 60CSx, not a dubious smartphone app.

<<<

And the less power a bike has, the more the difference is in what people measure as "their personal top speed". Don't want to start a silly fight about top speed of the Ninjette. Is it really important if the top speed is 150kmh or 170kmh? Who is wrong, who is right? Imo nobody

If you've been around for a while you know that I'm not Kawasaki's biggest fan. I do appreciate veracity however and can assure you that the posting I made earlier is entirely true.

A couple of other points of reference. That run was done with a backpack on as it was the return from a trip up Goat Mountain and down to Mae Sot and back. I was wrapped around the bike as best I could. I have approximately a 40" chest and a helmet that a Yorkie could take a nap in. And that's not getting on about my weight which has less to do with top speed than the drag my body creates.

Also for consideration is the fact that sitting bolt upright (that is pegs in the valley between the heels and forefoot of my boots and back straight) I always hit 133 km/h with the throttle pinned on a flat stretch. Cocking the elbows down so my body is angled more gives me another 10 or so.

I believe you. This isn't a case of me questioning the veracity of your claim. With a modified bike (snorkel mod and Power Commander mapping) it is completely tenable that the ningette could break 100 mph. But it comes back to my original point that I've never seen or read any objective evidence of a "completely stock" Ninja 250R breaking 100 mph. Perhaps there are some legitimate GPS verified examples out there. If there are - I haven't encountered them - but I've been eagerly searching.....

I thought Dave's ninjette had a snorkle mod, DBS full-system pipe, and power-commander fuel controller. So basically both the full air and fuel systems modified. Hardly an example of a stock bike out of the box.

You quoted me where I mentioned, to be fair in passing, that I have not yet seen what the exhaust does for the bike...and was very clear earlier that the only mods at the time terminal speed for my bike with me on it, were the PCIV, removed snorkel and the different profile (and lighter?) tyres.

[mania]

How does the Garmin Edge perform on your bike Mania? I know Garmin advertise it as a cycle GPS so is it suitable for M/Cs as well?

Hi B&B

Well just got back from a short test ride & have to say the edge performs beautifully as expected.

I have had it for years & used it for cycling mainly but it works equally well in a car or running, walking & now motorcycling.

Not trying to be a dick here, but why do people continue to advertise speedo top speeds which are well known to be notoriously inaccurate (often exaggerated by more than 10%) when gps is so readily available and considerably more accurate. Maybe it's because the speedo reading is typically much higher and makes for more favourable bragging rights. I've read countless anecdotal reports claiming that the 2008 gen of the Ninja 250R is a 100 mph+ bike (stock). Yet, any test review of the Ninja 250R I've read online or in print that uses a gps for top speed has never achieved a figure higher than the high 90s, and certainly none 100mph or greater.

Let me start by saying this is the smallest "Street" motorcycle cc wise I have owned.

I have no previous experience with Ninja 250's so do not know what the old ones could

or could not do.

But yesterday when you said this I was a little surprised as my seat of the pant is pretty accurate &

from what little riding I have done on it I thought it surprising as my seat of pants tells me this bike

has some legs

I will post a top end chart when I get an open road.

But today I just used the freeway from Payap to Chiang Mai as I had to go there.

Time was around 3pm so too many cars/trucks etc.

First off Speedo accuracy

The Ninja 250 speedo reads 3-KMH high

So not bad really & I saw this at many various speeds.

20,40,60,80,100

All read 3 KPH higher on the N250 speedo than the GPS

Now remember the GPS does in fact have a slight lag so it could be closer actually IMHO

Now as for top speed....I will say I feel this bike is going to have no problem cracking 100 mph

I think I can safely guarantee that.

On these graphs which I got from my garmin I did both kph & mph

The 76-78 MPH was no problem at all & I only goosed it between cars.

I was already in 6th gear & cruising low rpm as you can see.

So just a throttle roll on & never went above 9k or so RPM

You can even see the hard braking at various times due to traffic stopping

The bike is not even breathing hard yet & in fact around 8.5-9k RPM

At the end when I was almost home I had a few spots I could roll on between groups of cars

There is plenty of legs left.

I will scout a road in the next day or two that lets me open it up a bit.

Today is a poor example & as you can see by the graph I am in traffic most of the time.

When almost home there was a little gap between groups of cars so

it is just a 6th gear roll on the throttle from below 7000

RPM to about 9k

Anyway will see but I am thinking no problem breaking 100 not that

it is important to me.

The fun with bikes like these never was in top speeds for me.

Regardless if it is this N250 or my 600 & 900RR's in the US

The fun is in the twisties. As such it is the acceleration I look for from turn to turn

that gives me the biggest grins. If your doing much over a hundred you are probably

on a pretty boring road. Although it was fun watching the speedo sweep

past 150mph on the 900RR, It was on a boring straight road

Here are screen shots of today's short ride

As you can see from all the braking spikes down it was no road for speed tests

But was a good accuracy indicator for the speedo on the Ninja

Edited January 7, 2013 by mania

[BirdsandBooze]

How does the Garmin Edge perform on your bike Mania? I know Garmin advertise it as a cycle GPS so is it suitable for M/Cs as well?

Hi B&B

Well just got back from a short test ride & have to say the edge performs beautifully as expected.

I have had it for years & used it for cycling mainly but it works equally well in a car or running, walking & now motorcycling.

Not trying to be a dick here, but why do people continue to advertise speedo top speeds which are well known to be notoriously inaccurate (often exaggerated by more than 10%) when gps is so readily available and considerably more accurate. Maybe it's because the speedo reading is typically much higher and makes for more favourable bragging rights. I've read countless anecdotal reports claiming that the 2008 gen of the Ninja 250R is a 100 mph+ bike (stock). Yet, any test review of the Ninja 250R I've read online or in print that uses a gps for top speed has never achieved a figure higher than the high 90s, and certainly none 100mph or greater.

Let me start by saying this is the smallest "Street" motorcycle cc wise I have owned.

I have no previous experience with Ninja 250's so do not know what the old ones could

or could not do.

But yesterday when you said this I was a little surprised as my seat of the pant is pretty accurate &

from what little riding I have done on it I thought it surprising as my seat of pants tells me this bike

has some legs

I will post a top end chart when I get an open road.

But today I just used the freeway from Payap to Chiang Mai as I had to go there.

Time was around 3pm so too many cars/trucks etc.

First off Speedo accuracy

The Ninja 250 speedo reads 3-KMH high

So not bad really & I saw this at many various speeds.

20,40,60,80,100

All read 3 KPH higher on the N250 speedo than the GPS

Now remember the GPS does in fact have a slight lag so it could be closer actually IMHO

Now as for top speed....I will say I feel this bike is going to have no problem cracking 100 mph

I think I can safely guarantee that.

On these graphs which I got from my garmin I did both kph & mph

The 76-78 MPH was no problem at all & I only goosed it between cars.

I was already in 6th gear & cruising low rpm as you can see.

So just a throttle roll on & never went above 9k or so RPM

You can even see the hard braking at various times due to traffic stopping

The bike is not even breathing hard yet & in fact around 8.5-9k RPM

At the end when I was almost home I had a few spots I could roll on between groups of cars

There is plenty of legs left.

I will scout a road in the next day or two that lets me open it up a bit.

Today is a poor example & as you can see by the graph I am in traffic most of the time.

When almost home there was a little gap between groups of cars so

it is just a 6th gear roll on the throttle from below 7000

RPM to about 9k

Anyway will see but I am thinking no problem breaking 100 not that

it is important to me.

The fun with bikes like these never was in top speeds for me.

Regardless if it is this N250 or my 600 & 900RR's in the US

The fun is in the twisties. As such it is the acceleration I look for from turn to turn

that gives me the biggest grins. If your doing much over a hundred you are probably

on a pretty boring road. Although it was fun watching the speedo sweep

past 150mph on the 900RR, It was on a boring straight road

Here are screen shots of today's short ride

As you can see from all the braking spikes down it was no road for speed tests

But was a good accuracy indicator for the speedo on the Ninja

Thanks for the info Mania, I`ll have to drop into Gadget Trend in BKK and have a look - 15500 Baht with Thailand street map included. What you say about riding a small displacement bike is true and much of the pleasure derived from riding a revvy little bike is trying to keep it on the boil in the twisties. I wish Kawasaki would listen to me and release a modern 250cc two stroke triple .

[mania]

Thanks for the info Mania, I`ll have to drop into Gadget Trend in BKK and have a look - 15500 Baht with Thailand street map included. What you say about riding a small displacement bike is true and much of the pleasure derived from riding a revvy little bike is trying to keep it on the boil in the twisties. I wish Kawasaki would listen to me and release a modern 250cc two stroke triple .

Oh that would be wild!

You know even a modern 2 stroke twin would just kill

[mania]

I would like to know what the KM/L is, from an actual rider not the dealer.

I thought I posted this yesterday but maybe did not hit the post button?

I thought I would give you a heads up after a few refills.

It is not perfect because there is no way of refilling at the "exact"

spot but what I have done is add as soon as I hit one bar left

on the digital fuel gauge.

It does seem to agree & looks like I have gone 208-214 km

for each 7.7 liters I have added

So average of 211km / 7.7 liters = 27.4 km per liter

Or

131.1 miles on 2.03 gallons or 64.5 miles per gallon

I also keep track of my Wave125i mileage which we have had for 6 months

That gets right about double the mileage per liter

But I have of course been riding the 250 much differently than the wave

Plus the obvious doubled displacement

The Ninja mileage could probably be a lot better with less spirited riding

Edited January 10, 2013 by mania

[BirdsandBooze]

I would like to know what the KM/L is, from an actual rider not the dealer.

I thought I posted this yesterday but maybe did not hit the post button?

I thought I would give you a heads up after a few refills.

It is not perfect because there is no way of refilling at the "exact"

spot but what I have done is add as soon as I hit one bar left

on the digital fuel gauge.

It does seem to agree & looks like I have gone 208-214 km

for each 7.7 liters I have added

So average of 211km / 7.7 liters = 27.4 km per liter

Or

131.1 miles on 2.03 gallons or 64.5 miles per gallon

I also keep track of my Wave125i mileage which we have had for 6 months

That gets right about double the mileage per liter

But I have of course been riding the 250 much differently than the wave

Plus the obvious doubled displacement

The Ninja mileage could probably be a lot better with less spirited riding

That's not bad, and looks even better if you convert to real gallons

[mania]

That's not bad, and looks even better if you convert to real gallons

Yeah my thoughts exactly

At first I only remembered the Wave & thought hmm but hey Ninja is twice

as big & 10x the fun

Then I thought about my Dodge Truck I had in the US & its 15/mpg

& it sounded great lol

[macknife]

I wish mine would hurry up and arrive.

[mania]

I wish mine would hurry up and arrive.

I feel for ya Mac

Not easy waiting for new stuff.

Hope you get yours soon too

I am really enjoying it & you will too I bet

[YipYipYa123]

whats the waitinig list like on kawasakis thesedays ?

[mania]

whats the waitinig list like on kawasakis thesedays ?

I don't know about other places but in Chiang Mai I know they have a red & a black ....maybe two?

I think if they were sold they would be gone already