Thai Citizenship

[autan]

Autan, you've had your problems over the years. I accept you now have your Thai citizenship. However, I can't be the only one questioning this route to it which sounds one helluva lot easier than the conventional route. Would be interested to hear some opinion from others on this who have some knowledge of it as its definitely a gap in my knowledge.

First to admit lots of gaps in my knowledge

I have had problems, no doubt. Hey i still have problems just different and new ones.

You need to ask questions. I am not sayimg its easy, you are making a financial decision for as long as it may take. You need to know hat your taking on and thats why on the surface it seems like an eas way t stop the visa runs, it actually benefits the thais more than us i a lot of ways. Talk to TV about it! the helped me a lot.

[telldem]

How can you get a Thai birth certificate, if you were not born in Thailand?

Sent from my iPhone 4S using Thaivisa Connect App

[Holysteel]

Im guessing he is a Luk Kreung.

[floridaguy]

How does one leave with the Thai passport. Assuming the UK passport was still stamped in by the system?

Get both stamped out on the exit ?? Then return with the Thai passport ??

You don't use the UK PP on entering Thailand, if you have dual Nationality.

No. What i mean is. For example. The OP has a Thai passport now. Assuming he entered with the UK Passport. He got his passport in Thai currently. On Exit, surely he have to leave with his UK PP.

When he return to Thailand. There is no exit stamp in his new Thai passport?

I had some small problems re-entering Thailand on my Thai passport because it did not have an exit stamp from the US. I used my US passport to leave Thailand because I had entered on my US passport, so needed to remove myself as a visiting American. When I left the US on returning, I used the US passport (which they don't stamp on exit or entry) and arrived at BKK using my Thai passport, with no entry or exit stamps (it was brand new). This caused some confusion, so I did show both passports, spoke to a supervisor, and she stamped me in and wrote a note in Thai that explained that it was a new passport. Subsequent trips should not cause any confusions.

So to the OP, your first trip you may have some issues, just be prepared to show both passports upon re-entry and explain your situation.

As for land crossing, I tried to do the same thing first by land to Cambodia, and was unsuccessful. The border agents told me that land crossings are a little more suspect as to the validity of the passport, and recommended that I fly anywhere and upon return show my Thai passport for re-entry and all should be well. Turned out to be good advice.

[necronx99]

Well done Autan, though I think the beach in front of the Centara is gross and full of broken glass.

This adoption, they adopted you in Thailand right? At the Amphur or somesuch?

[Arkady]

Congratulations on your Thai citizenship Autan.

Your case throws up interesting aspects of Thai law that are new to me. I was unaware that it was possible to be legally adopted as a grandchild. I was under the impression that children adopted by Thai parents (not taking into account grandparents) could only obtain Thai nationality, if there is evidence that they were born in Thailand. (I know someone who obtained his Thai nationality this way after being born stateless in Thailand to a Thai mother and a foreign father, who disappeared, before the law changed in 1992 to allow Thai mothers to transmit their nationality - now he would have been born Thai.) Many Thai couples have adopted foreign born children and tried in vain to obtain Thai citizenship for them. Since there is no provision for this in the Nationality Act, there is nothing that can be done for them legally.

I have a feeling that there is something about your case you are not telling us, e.g. you were born in Thailand and/or have a Thai parent. The adoption by grandparents, as I suggested above, is not a legal process, although there is nothing to people from entering into such an agreement informally. Certainly any undertakings to support the adoptive grandparents would not be legally binding. If you were born in Thailand to alien or stateless parents and were adopted by Thai parents, you might be able to obtain Thai nationality, although I would think this would be difficult for someone who is no longer a minor.

[daoyai]

Sounds to me like it is (as always) all about the money. Enough money makes almost anything possible.

[samran]

y

Sounds to me like it is (as always) all about the money. Enough money makes almost anything possible.

which would imply that the Thai embassy in London has been taking cash?

[bdw]

toe the line, not tow

[Soutpeel]

Congratulations on your Thai citizenship Autan.

Your case throws up interesting aspects of Thai law that are new to me. I was unaware that it was possible to be legally adopted as a grandchild. I was under the impression that children adopted by Thai parents (not taking into account grandparents) could only obtain Thai nationality, if there is evidence that they were born in Thailand. (I know someone who obtained his Thai nationality this way after being born stateless in Thailand to a Thai mother and a foreign father, who disappeared, before the law changed in 1992 to allow Thai mothers to transmit their nationality - now he would have been born Thai.) Many Thai couples have adopted foreign born children and tried in vain to obtain Thai citizenship for them. Since there is no provision for this in the Nationality Act, there is nothing that can be done for them legally.

I have a feeling that there is something about your case you are not telling us, e.g. you were born in Thailand and/or have a Thai parent. The adoption by grandparents, as I suggested above, is not a legal process, although there is nothing to people from entering into such an agreement informally. Certainly any undertakings to support the adoptive grandparents would not be legally binding. If you were born in Thailand to alien or stateless parents and were adopted by Thai parents, you might be able to obtain Thai nationality, although I would think this would be difficult for someone who is no longer a minor.

I am curious to how he got a Thai birth cerificate, even though it appears not born in Thailand or of Thai parentage and adopted....adoption certificate maybe, birth certificate cant see how legally

[samran]

Congratulations on your Thai citizenship Autan.

Your case throws up interesting aspects of Thai law that are new to me. I was unaware that it was possible to be legally adopted as a grandchild. I was under the impression that children adopted by Thai parents (not taking into account grandparents) could only obtain Thai nationality, if there is evidence that they were born in Thailand. (I know someone who obtained his Thai nationality this way after being born stateless in Thailand to a Thai mother and a foreign father, who disappeared, before the law changed in 1992 to allow Thai mothers to transmit their nationality - now he would have been born Thai.) Many Thai couples have adopted foreign born children and tried in vain to obtain Thai citizenship for them. Since there is no provision for this in the Nationality Act, there is nothing that can be done for them legally.

I have a feeling that there is something about your case you are not telling us, e.g. you were born in Thailand and/or have a Thai parent. The adoption by grandparents, as I suggested above, is not a legal process, although there is nothing to people from entering into such an agreement informally. Certainly any undertakings to support the adoptive grandparents would not be legally binding. If you were born in Thailand to alien or stateless parents and were adopted by Thai parents, you might be able to obtain Thai nationality, although I would think this would be difficult for someone who is no longer a minor.

I am curious to how he got a Thai birth cerificate, even though it appears not born in Thailand or of Thai parentage and adopted....adoption certificate maybe, birth certificate cant see how legally

I have friends who are adopted.BC's were re-issued to reflect the name of the adoptive parents. This was in NZ though.

[autan]

Congratulations on your Thai citizenship Autan.

Your case throws up interesting aspects of Thai law that are new to me. I was unaware that it was possible to be legally adopted as a grandchild. I was under the impression that children adopted by Thai parents (not taking into account grandparents) could only obtain Thai nationality, if there is evidence that they were born in Thailand. (I know someone who obtained his Thai nationality this way after being born stateless in Thailand to a Thai mother and a foreign father, who disappeared, before the law changed in 1992 to allow Thai mothers to transmit their nationality - now he would have been born Thai.) Many Thai couples have adopted foreign born children and tried in vain to obtain Thai citizenship for them. Since there is no provision for this in the Nationality Act, there is nothing that can be done for them legally.

I have a feeling that there is something about your case you are not telling us, e.g. you were born in Thailand and/or have a Thai parent. The adoption by grandparents, as I suggested above, is not a legal process, although there is nothing to people from entering into such an agreement informally. Certainly any undertakings to support the adoptive grandparents would not be legally binding. If you were born in Thailand to alien or stateless parents and were adopted by Thai parents, you might be able to obtain Thai nationality, although I would think this would be difficult for someone who is no longer a minor.

I can confirm, I am born in the UK. I have an English Parent and an Egyptian Parent. I can also confirm that I am more than a little old than 18. In fact if I has sex on my 18th Birthday and produced a child, that child would be considered an adult and over 18 years old.

I am not stateless, unless the something has happended to the UK, I wasnt aware of.

Like I said in my opening statement, I am not going to let the cat out of the bag, would you if you were in my position ?

Do the research, your almost there by yourself anyway.

[autan]

How can you get a Thai birth certificate, if you were not born in Thailand?

Sent from my iPhone 4S using Thaivisa Connect App

You are not required to be born in Thailand to get a Thai birth certificate.

[autan]

Just to add a note here if I may regarding my opening statement.

I left Thailand on 23/8/2012. I did online check in using my BRITISH PASSPORT number on the QATAR website. However when I arrived at the checking desk (special queue for internet checkin), I presented both passports and said DUAL NATIONALITY. Another set of boarding passes were printed, luggage weighed and 3 x FAST LANE passes issued.

In the fast lane. The hand luggage was scanned (Remove IPAD'S,LAPTOPS ETC) went to the immigration/customs guy. Handed him my Thai Passport. He said, how do you have this passport, I said THAI CITIZEN. He said I need to see the passport you arrived in Thailand on. I showed him my UK Passport.

He just stamped out my UK passport and wrote the flight number on it.

He said, next time, dont use your UK passport to enter Thailand, if you are Thai, use your Thai Passport. The you can leave on your Thai Passport without a stamp.

He went on to say, if I dont stamp out your UK Passport, then technically you are breaking Thai Law.

(I dont know if that last bit was true)

Just to say, i didnt have a problem. Thanks everyone for the advice.

[autan]

Congratulations on your Thai citizenship Autan.

Your case throws up interesting aspects of Thai law that are new to me. I was unaware that it was possible to be legally adopted as a grandchild. I was under the impression that children adopted by Thai parents (not taking into account grandparents) could only obtain Thai nationality, if there is evidence that they were born in Thailand. (I know someone who obtained his Thai nationality this way after being born stateless in Thailand to a Thai mother and a foreign father, who disappeared, before the law changed in 1992 to allow Thai mothers to transmit their nationality - now he would have been born Thai.) Many Thai couples have adopted foreign born children and tried in vain to obtain Thai citizenship for them. Since there is no provision for this in the Nationality Act, there is nothing that can be done for them legally.

I have a feeling that there is something about your case you are not telling us, e.g. you were born in Thailand and/or have a Thai parent. The adoption by grandparents, as I suggested above, is not a legal process, although there is nothing to people from entering into such an agreement informally. Certainly any undertakings to support the adoptive grandparents would not be legally binding. If you were born in Thailand to alien or stateless parents and were adopted by Thai parents, you might be able to obtain Thai nationality, although I would think this would be difficult for someone who is no longer a minor.

I am curious to how he got a Thai birth cerificate, even though it appears not born in Thailand or of Thai parentage and adopted....adoption certificate maybe, birth certificate cant see how legally

I made an appointment with the Thai Embassy in London, they issued the birth certificate, they needed to speak to my Grandparents, to ensure the adoption was legal, which it is. (At least under English Law). Copies of the adoption were translated into Thai, which made it valid under Thai Law as if they were my legal parents. As legal parents, I am entitled to a birth certificate, passport, id card and to be entered on to house books.

If you do your homework, you will see how it all fits together, quite simple really.

[autan]

y

Sounds to me like it is (as always) all about the money. Enough money makes almost anything possible.

which would imply that the Thai embassy in London has been taking cash?

No brown paper envelops took place.

[samran]

Congratulations on your Thai citizenship Autan.

Your case throws up interesting aspects of Thai law that are new to me. I was unaware that it was possible to be legally adopted as a grandchild. I was under the impression that children adopted by Thai parents (not taking into account grandparents) could only obtain Thai nationality, if there is evidence that they were born in Thailand. (I know someone who obtained his Thai nationality this way after being born stateless in Thailand to a Thai mother and a foreign father, who disappeared, before the law changed in 1992 to allow Thai mothers to transmit their nationality - now he would have been born Thai.) Many Thai couples have adopted foreign born children and tried in vain to obtain Thai citizenship for them. Since there is no provision for this in the Nationality Act, there is nothing that can be done for them legally.

I have a feeling that there is something about your case you are not telling us, e.g. you were born in Thailand and/or have a Thai parent. The adoption by grandparents, as I suggested above, is not a legal process, although there is nothing to people from entering into such an agreement informally. Certainly any undertakings to support the adoptive grandparents would not be legally binding. If you were born in Thailand to alien or stateless parents and were adopted by Thai parents, you might be able to obtain Thai nationality, although I would think this would be difficult for someone who is no longer a minor.

I am curious to how he got a Thai birth cerificate, even though it appears not born in Thailand or of Thai parentage and adopted....adoption certificate maybe, birth certificate cant see how legally

I made an appointment with the Thai Embassy in London, they issued the birth certificate, they needed to speak to my Grandparents, to ensure the adoption was legal, which it is. (At least under English Law). Copies of the adoption were translated into Thai, which made it valid under Thai Law as if they were my legal parents. As legal parents, I am entitled to a birth certificate, passport, id card and to be entered on to house books.

If you do your homework, you will see how it all fits together, quite simple really.

So your wifes Granparents adopted you under English law, which was then recognised under Thai law, which in turn gave you the right to Thai citizenship? Clever. Though I don't know how long that loophole will last now that the cat is out of the bag!

[mania]

I made an appointment with the Thai Embassy in London, they issued the birth certificate, they needed to speak to my Grandparents, to ensure the adoption was legal, which it is. (At least under English Law). Copies of the adoption were translated into Thai, which made it valid under Thai Law as if they were my legal parents. As legal parents, I am entitled to a birth certificate, passport, id card and to be entered on to house books.

If you do your homework, you will see how it all fits together, quite simple really.

So your wifes Granparents adopted you under English law, which was then recognized under Thai law, which in turn gave you the right to Thai citizenship? Clever. Though I don't know how long that loophole will last now that the cat is out of the bag!

All very interesting

Also in another earlier post you intimated the grandparents benefit.

Did that mean you had to sign a financial well-being guarantee of sorts for them?

Edited August 29, 2012 by mania

[pigeonjake]

jesus, it wasnt his wifes grand perants, that adopted him,, read back,

well done mate any way i really hope all goes well for you now, you have my best wishes,

jake

[samran]

I made an appointment with the Thai Embassy in London, they issued the birth certificate, they needed to speak to my Grandparents, to ensure the adoption was legal, which it is. (At least under English Law). Copies of the adoption were translated into Thai, which made it valid under Thai Law as if they were my legal parents. As legal parents, I am entitled to a birth certificate, passport, id card and to be entered on to house books.

If you do your homework, you will see how it all fits together, quite simple really.

So your wifes Granparents adopted you under English law, which was then recognized under Thai law, which in turn gave you the right to Thai citizenship? Clever. Though I don't know how long that loophole will last now that the cat is out of the bag!

All very interesting

Also in another earlier post you intimated the grandparents benefit.

Did that mean you had to sign a financial well-being guarantee of sorts for them?

Half of Pattaya is hanging on the outcome of this thread. The inlaws in Buriram will be rubbing their hands.

[samran]

jesus, it wasnt his wifes grand perants, that adopted him,, read back,

well done mate any way i really hope all goes well for you now, you have my best wishes,

jake

you might be right....doesn't change the loophole though. Get someone to adopt you under UK law, Thailand recognises it, and off you go. A newly minted Thai citizen. Clever.

[mania]

jesus, it wasnt his wifes grand perants, that adopted him,, read back,

i really hope all goes well for you now, you have my best wishes,

Easy to be confused as he refers to them as grandparents many times.

That is not to say they are "his wifes" grandparents

I agree though very good & congratulations on a creative solution

No I am full British. Now a dual nationality. I have been adopted by my new Yai and Dar.

No i have not had to pass any Thai language test or even written test. just an interview with my adoptive grandparents.

Without letting the cat out of the bag.

my adaptive grandparents, very decent people adpoted me in return for me taking care of them in their old age.

Edited August 29, 2012 by mania

[pigeonjake]

there,ll be falangs running all over thailand looking for grandperents to adopt them,,lol,

it is clever, and well dont to that man, but youvegot to remember he had to take them to england if im reading it right, and i also read that you must take responsibility for the grandperents, with money ect to take care of them,,

so that in its self could be a mine field, as i understand they never had children apart from one adopted girl who assed away,

so if there are other siblings you couldalso end up supporting them so i would say be very carefull as i no that some will want to try and go down this route,

just my thought, jake

[Forethat]

Ehhh....you are adopted by your wife's grandparents. Technically speaking you're now married to your daughter? Or niece?

Eerie.

Edited August 29, 2012 by Forethat

[Pseudolus]

Good on you Autan. Now stick it to them and buy millions of square miles of land and selling 49% of it to the EU treasury fund.

[autan]

Ehhh....you are adopted by your wife's grandparents. Technically speaking you're now married to your daughter? Or niece?

Eerie.

I have not been adopted by my Wife relatives, so this is a mute point.

[autan]

there,ll be falangs running all over thailand looking for grandperents to adopt them,,lol,

it is clever, and well dont to that man, but youvegot to remember he had to take them to england if im reading it right, and i also read that you must take responsibility for the grandperents, with money ect to take care of them,,

so that in its self could be a mine field, as i understand they never had children apart from one adopted girl who assed away,

so if there are other siblings you couldalso end up supporting them so i would say be very carefull as i no that some will want to try and go down this route,

just my thought, jake

Yes, there is the cost aspect of getting them to the UK and doing the paperwork etc. The interview wasnt exactly a piece of cake either. The Thais are world champions of triplicate and notarised translated copies. Just get all your paperwork in order before make the appointment or you WILL waste your own time.

The arrangement I have made is genuine and I have already taken care of my Grandparents, so that their feet need never touch the ground again. Medical cover with Bupa International, an allowance paid direct to their account to spend as they wish, they can call on me as my parents any time they want. They are now truely my family.

When you are in the interview, if you come across as just looking for Thai Citizenship, you will fail. Your actions must be sincere as mine are. In fact my next step is to get my Yai and Dar into the UK, with leave to remain. I have been assured, this will present little problem.

Good luck everyone and remember what I said about the passport.

Leave the UK (or source country) on your Thai Passport. Enter Thailand on your Thai Passport. Leave on your Thai Passport, but be prepared to show your British Passport to check in when you leave Thailand. Use your Thai Passport all the way back to the UK, when you join the queue for EU citizens when you finally show your British Passport again.

[samran]

there,ll be falangs running all over thailand looking for grandperents to adopt them,,lol,

it is clever, and well dont to that man, but youvegot to remember he had to take them to england if im reading it right, and i also read that you must take responsibility for the grandperents, with money ect to take care of them,,

so that in its self could be a mine field, as i understand they never had children apart from one adopted girl who assed away,

so if there are other siblings you couldalso end up supporting them so i would say be very carefull as i no that some will want to try and go down this route,

just my thought, jake

Yes, there is the cost aspect of getting them to the UK and doing the paperwork etc. The interview wasnt exactly a piece of cake either. The Thais are world champions of triplicate and notarised translated copies. Just get all your paperwork in order before make the appointment or you WILL waste your own time.

The arrangement I have made is genuine and I have already taken care of my Grandparents, so that their feet need never touch the ground again. Medical cover with Bupa International, an allowance paid direct to their account to spend as they wish, they can call on me as my parents any time they want. They are now truely my family.

When you are in the interview, if you come across as just looking for Thai Citizenship, you will fail. Your actions must be sincere as mine are. In fact my next step is to get my Yai and Dar into the UK, with leave to remain. I have been assured, this will present little problem.

Good luck everyone and remember what I said about the passport.

Leave the UK (or source country) on your Thai Passport. Enter Thailand on your Thai Passport. Leave on your Thai Passport, but be prepared to show your British Passport to check in when you leave Thailand. Use your Thai Passport all the way back to the UK, when you join the queue for EU citizens when you finally show your British Passport again.

Congrats again. Very clever.

Just a quick question, all the interviewing was at the Thai embassy in London?

What I don't get (and please don't take this the wrong way as I am sure your motives are 200% legit in wanting to support your new parents), what safeguards exist to stop people exploiting this path?

[BabyJebus]

you might be a drunk but you definitely outsmarted thousands of expats with the loophole you found and successfully used.

Good job

[maxme]

you might be a drunk but you definitely outsmarted thousands of expats with the loophole you found and successfully used.

Good job

All fair play in a lawless country like this...