Question About Consulate Income Cert Letter

[Genericnic]

Hi all.

I have an O-A retirement visa that is coming up for extension of the permission to stay in December. I'm setting all the appointments set up and putting all the documents together. I know I need the verification of income letter from the Chiang Mai consulate (much easier than bank accounts). The question I have is how fresh does the letter have to be? From all the discussions I have read, immigration gets cranky about bank documents and passbooks if they weren't done that day. With the certification from the consulate do you have a day, a week, a month, etc? I looked in the forums and didn't find an answer.

Thanks

David

[hellodolly]

I renewed mine last week and the certification from the U S consulate a week earlier.

Just my opinion but if you are allowed to file a month earlier for the Visa maybe they will give you the same time line on your certification. All I know for sure is a week difference was good for me.

[moe666]

the letter is suppose to be good for 1 month. I usually get my letter about 2 weeks before extension.

Edited October 2, 2012 by moe666

[Genericnic]

Thanks guys. That should do it.

David

[BB1955]

I was told by Thai immigration the letter had to be withing two weeks of my visit to extend . Didnt matter I had bank statements pension letters they want the affidavit as well as the other documents . Personally its a waste of $50.00 but oh well I ll get it again and pay just to be done with it .

[moe666]

I was told by Thai immigration the letter had to be withing two weeks of my visit to extend . Didnt matter I had bank statements pension letters they want the affidavit as well as the other documents . Personally its a waste of $50.00 but oh well I ll get it again and pay just to be done with it .

In Chiang Mai have never shown anything except the letter from US consulate, I do come prepared with credit union statements just in case they are asked for. I never ask at immigration what they want as who are you asking some trainee into his first week who just doesn't know.

[ProThaiExpat]

Last year at my renewal, I got talkative with the lady immigration officer who seems to be one of the regulars at the desk for non-immO renewals closest to the counter. In response to her idle question regarding what sources I had for my income, I mentioned I had documents supporting my income.

She then asked to see them and quickly copied them and attached them to the file package.

I will keep my mouth shut this year in that regard and not take supporting docs with me. Someday they may require them, but until they do, my mouth is shut while in immigration in this regard.

I was pleased to see she had her own copier and didn't require me to go to the copy shop in the back, as so many officers do, since they are not so equiped.

[hellodolly]

I was told by Thai immigration the letter had to be withing two weeks of my visit to extend . Didnt matter I had bank statements pension letters they want the affidavit as well as the other documents . Personally its a waste of $50.00 but oh well I ll get it again and pay just to be done with it .

In the six years I have gone in to extend it they have never asked fr any thing else but the letter from the US Consulate. Even in there they did not ask for proof of income just asked me how much my income a month is and then asked me to swear that I was telling the truth.

My first time in I brought out all the proof and the immigration ignored it. Never the less I do take it with me to both places.

[hellodolly]

Last year at my renewal, I got talkative with the lady immigration officer who seems to be one of the regulars at the desk for non-immO renewals closest to the counter. In response to her idle question regarding what sources I had for my income, I mentioned I had documents supporting my income.

She then asked to see them and quickly copied them and attached them to the file package.

I will keep my mouth shut this year in that regard and not take supporting docs with me. Someday they may require them, but until they do, my mouth is shut while in immigration in this regard.

I was pleased to see she had her own copier and didn't require me to go to the copy shop in the back, as so many officers do, since they are not so equiped.

She can be a pain. Fortunately last week when I got her my wife had copies of all my past extensions and she said she needed them.

While I was waiting I got to talking to a fellow who said she was realy pickey. I had my copies of income but did not show them and she did not ask for them.

I think she uses a extra tree a day to get her job done.

[Joop50]

She is always kind and calm to me, last time she made some copies I forgot by herself, indeed.

Like everyone she can have a bad day.

[ProThaiExpat]

The first time I had her a couple of years ago when there was only her working extensions, she was a bitch personified. Last year with two officers working and with an appointment, she was much more friendly and even smiled a couple of times. Perhaps she remembered me as a no trouble extender from the previous year.

I wonder about her motivation to ask for not required documents. Perhaps their regs require them to ask for copies of all documents mentioned in the interview? In the old days, one of the higher ranking officers in the back room did the interview, now it is one stop. I suspect the higher ranking officer approval is still required in the back room but we never see them now. With the appointment system, things move smoother for the appointment holder, but two officers working sure helps.

I had developed a good relationship with the master seargent who used to be on one of the desks for my first six or seven years doing renewals and he did admit being the longest serving officer at CM Immigration. Very friendly and remembered me and my details from year to year.No clue where he has gone?

[amexpat]

My first time in I brought out all the proof and the immigration ignored it. Never the less I do take it with me to both places.

Why?

She can be a pain. Fortunately last week when I got her my wife had copies of all my past extensions and she said she needed them.

While I was waiting I got to talking to a fellow who said she was realy pickey. I had my copies of income but did not show them and she did not ask for them.

Again? Why?

She is always kind and calm to me, last time she made some copies I forgot by herself, indeed.

Like everyone she can have a bad day.

My experience too. She's always been sweet.

Just a thought: A bad day could be provoked by suggestions about how to do one's job. Not saying that happened, just sayin.

[NancyL]

Are you guys who have encountered problems with that certain female immigration officer going for extensions due to retirement or marriage?

I've never heard of anyone asking for a retirement extension having a problem with her. In fact last time, she seemed pleased with me because I had all the right documents, in just the right order.

Amexpat -- it's just good planning to bring "extra" stuff with you, in case the I/O asks for evidence behind the income letter, proof of funds coming into Thailand, copies of every page of your passport, etc. No need to offer that stuff or grumble if it's not requested. Be prepared and keep smiling!

Edited October 2, 2012 by NancyL

[uptheos]

Like everyone she can have a bad day.

They take it in turns.

[mamborobert]

Does anybody know if the Honorary Consuls in CM produce these letters and whether Immigration accept them? Are there some Honorary Consuls that do and others that don't (realising that this is academic if Immigration will not accept them).

And just to add to the confusion will a Consul (Honorary or otherwise) for a country to which you are a national be willing to certify income if it is derive from another country?

CM specific as I wish to lodge in CM and consistency (in my experience) has not been that good between Immigration offices. CM have always been good to me though.

Edited October 2, 2012 by mamborobert

[amexpat]

Amexpat -- it's just good planning to bring "extra" stuff with you, in case the I/O asks for evidence behind the income letter, proof of funds coming into Thailand, copies of every page of your passport, etc. No need to offer that stuff or grumble if it's not requested. Be prepared and keep smiling!

I go prepared with the required docs. If you want to collect and copy unnecessary documents and haul them to immigration, up to you.

FWIW, these people know that the big or perpetual smile is not part of our culture and they can sometimes be put off by the apparent condescension.

Keep it simple. Keep it real. It all works out.

[Priceless]

Does anybody know if the Honorary Consuls in CM produce these letters and whether Immigration accept them? Are there some Honorary Consuls that do and others that don't (realising that this is academic if Immigration will not accept them).

And just to add to the confusion will a Consul (Honorary or otherwise) for a country to which you are a national be willing to certify income if it is derive from another country?

CM specific as I wish to lodge in CM and consistency (in my experience) has not been that good between Immigration offices. CM have always been good to me though.

The Swedish Honorary Consulate in Chiang Mai does produce e.g. statements of income, residence etc. These documents are accepted by immigration, DLT and so on.

/ Priceless

[BB1955]

I was told by Thai immigration the letter had to be withing two weeks of my visit to extend . Didnt matter I had bank statements pension letters they want the affidavit as well as the other documents . Personally its a waste of $50.00 but oh well I ll get it again and pay just to be done with it .

In Chiang Mai have never shown anything except the letter from US consulate, I do come prepared with credit union statements just in case they are asked for. I never ask at immigration what they want as who are you asking some trainee into his first week who just doesn't know.

On my last visit to renew my extention although I had the affidavit , I was asked to provide proof of pension from my pension office . The officer was not a trainee, she reached over to a stack of applications and pulled another pension letter and showed me what she wanted so I was not being singled out . The pevious year I did not need the proof just the affidavit and it was also a different immigration officer . It may it depends on which immigration officer you end up with .

[mesquite]

I was told by Thai immigration the letter had to be withing two weeks of my visit to extend . Didnt matter I had bank statements pension letters they want the affidavit as well as the other documents . Personally its a waste of $50.00 but oh well I ll get it again and pay just to be done with it .

In Chiang Mai have never shown anything except the letter from US consulate, I do come prepared with credit union statements just in case they are asked for. I never ask at immigration what they want as who are you asking some trainee into his first week who just doesn't know.

On my last visit to renew my extention although I had the affidavit , I was asked to provide proof of pension from my pension office . The officer was not a trainee, she reached over to a stack of applications and pulled another pension letter and showed me what she wanted so I was not being singled out . The pevious year I did not need the proof just the affidavit and it was also a different immigration officer . It may it depends on which immigration officer you end up with .

The same thing happened to me.

[zippydedodah]

I was told by Thai immigration the letter had to be withing two weeks of my visit to extend . Didnt matter I had bank statements pension letters they want the affidavit as well as the other documents . Personally its a waste of $50.00 but oh well I ll get it again and pay just to be done with it .

In Chiang Mai have never shown anything except the letter from US consulate, I do come prepared with credit union statements just in case they are asked for. I never ask at immigration what they want as who are you asking some trainee into his first week who just doesn't know.

On my last visit to renew my extention although I had the affidavit , I was asked to provide proof of pension from my pension office . The officer was not a trainee, she reached over to a stack of applications and pulled another pension letter and showed me what she wanted so I was not being singled out . The pevious year I did not need the proof just the affidavit and it was also a different immigration officer . It may it depends on which immigration officer you end up with .

The same thing happened to me.

me three...except at that time (last year) i was told not to bother with sworn affidavit from US consulate for next time (this nov.)... However, this being thailand, i will go in advance and spend the $50 and have the consulate letter. Better safe than sorry.

[mcgriffith]

I had the above mentioned officer for my retirement extension a week or so ago., and had no issues with her at all. She was very fast, professional, and even smiled a few times. Took 10 minutes max to finish me, but it took another hour for the pooyais in the back to complete the process.

She remembered me from the previous year, I had all my previous extension copies, and there really was no issue with the US Consulate income statement letter.

However, my situation is different than most.

I use the combo method.

Meaning I have 400K in a Thai bank (not 800K), and show an income statement as well. The total is well over the minimum monthly requirement of 65K.

I have always brought all the financial statements to back up the income statement, but have never been asked to show them.

CM Imm is well aware that Australia, Canada and the US consulates (and perhaps other countries) do not ask for income verification when issuing income statement letters. It is not a surprise that they occasionally spot check by asking for some corroborating evidence.

As a Plan B, I bring a bank letter from another bank where I have additional monies that would more than qualify me, if somehow they rejected my consular income statement letter. I've never had to use this backup recourse.

[elektrified]

Each and every year I get the same guy who sits at the back desk. He always wears a dark uniform. He never asks me anything and hardly ever says a word to me and hardly ever looks up. When he speaks to me, he always speaks in Thai. He just hands me that one document that is written in Thai and knows that I understand to sign it. A bit odd but it works for me. Extension always goes without a hitch and I'm out of there in 10 minutes. I think the lady the others are talking about is the heavy set one if I'm not mistaken. Several times I have overheard her asking ex-pats where they get their money from.

[BillyBobThai]

I always get mine less than a week before I go to immigration and have never had a problem.

[mcgriffith]

Each and every year I get the same guy who sits at the back desk. He always wears a dark uniform. He never asks me anything and hardly ever says a word to me and hardly ever looks up. When he speaks to me, he always speaks in Thai. He just hands me that one document that is written in Thai and knows that I understand to sign it. A bit odd but it works for me. Extension always goes without a hitch and I'm out of there in 10 minutes. I think the lady the others are talking about is the heavy set one if I'm not mistaken. Several times I have overheard her asking ex-pats where they get their money from.

I've had that officer too in previous years; he's very quick and efficient.

The officer I refer to is not heavy set- that's the one who does matrimonial extensions who has a penetrating voice that reverberates all around the office.

She appears to keep people at her desk for ages, and seems to enjoy making farang/Thai couples sweat.

The one I'm referring to is youngish, and sits at the desk to the far right, immediately behind the 90 day address reporting counter.

Back on topic, I was told by the US Consul that the income statement letter is good for 1 month.

(For those using the seasoned money in Thai bank option, the letters from Thai banks are good for 7 days).

[cloudhopper]

(For those using the seasoned money in Thai bank option, the letters from Thai banks are good for 7 days).

Maybe that's true for CM but Mae Hong Song immo insists that the bank letter be written the very same day.

[mcgriffith]

(For those using the seasoned money in Thai bank option, the letters from Thai banks are good for 7 days).

Maybe that's true for CM but Mae Hong Song immo insists that the bank letter be written the very same day.

CM definitely 7 days.

Been told that by both Imm and the banks for 7 yrs now.

Got a letter from 2 banks on Thursday Sept 20.

Used one of them Monday Sept 24.

Officer checked the date, and didn't say a word.

[Sophon]

>snipped<

However, my situation is different than most.

I use the combo method.

Meaning I have 400K in a Thai bank (not 800K), and show an income statement as well. The total is well over the minimum monthly requirement of 65K.

>snipped<

When using the combo method the target is not 65k per month but a total of 800k (sum of yearly income plus bank deposit). I know not a problem for you since you are well over, but for people close to the limit the distinction could be the difference between getting the extension and being denied.

Sophon

[mcgriffith]

>snipped<

However, my situation is different than most.

I use the combo method.

Meaning I have 400K in a Thai bank (not 800K), and show an income statement as well. The total is well over the minimum monthly requirement of 65K.

>snipped<

When using the combo method the target is not 65k per month but a total of 800k (sum of yearly income plus bank deposit). I know not a problem for you since you are well over, but for people close to the limit the distinction could be the difference between getting the extension and being denied.

Sophon

You are quite correct, and thanks for the clarification.

[anselpixel]

I went in at 6AM to win position number 30 on today's list.

Got to the desk of the above-mentioned lady at 11AM. I hadn't dealt with her before.

I had the papers in order, and she began shuffling them around. Finally, she took my passport to the office copier and came back telling me next time I should try to have all the copies. She pointed out there was an office out back that specialized in such. I suggested she speak to them about it, as I'd had all the copies done there only three hours earlier.

She did a lot of stamping and shuffling. Then she looked at my address one last time. She asked if I owned or rented my condo. I said I rented. She then requested some proof, which is understandable, but not something I've been asked before. Fortunately, I did have copies of everything even remotely related to my life in Thailand, and I gave her a copy of my lease. She wasn't unfriendly or obstructive, but she wasn't at all like the people I've dealt with before. My sense of her is that the less one says, the better.

My income statement from the consulate was three weeks old. Nothing was said about that. It's always been my understanding that the document is considered legitimate for 30 days, and I've used it each time. No one has ever asked me any questions about my income or its source.

[Mapguy]

Lots of useful information above about time limits for letters.

Absolutely a good idea to have some back-up bank records to confirm pensions. As noted above, Thai Immigration is well aware of the games that expats play. Really quite tolerant, when you think about it.

Regarding long-stay retirement renewals, actually simpler to put 800k in one or more fixed deposit accounts and keep it such accounts. The combination method (noted above by McG) basically provides the same security, but it is more lenient for those who have smaller pensions. It is basically emergency money. Of course, Thailand does not require that you keep financial security funds there for longer than three months before renewal but what happens if you have a medical emergency and need funds? Or have to be repatriated? If you can't do this, or are playing games with short term loans, et cetera to cover long-stay visa financial security provisions, then you are really tempting fate.

The bottom line basically is that an immigration officer can ask for any proof they want. Spot checking is perfectly understandable, especially given all the dodgy games expatriates play with which Immigration as well as the banks and the consulates are fully familiar. Immigration is remarkably tolerant in my view. If they really wanted to get serious, my hunch is that the airlines back to Down Under, Europe and America would have to lay on a few extra 747s!

Can you imagine working a whole day in the immigration office ?! In several years I have never had a problem with an immigration officer. That includes those referred to above. I don't chat them up; just come prepared with a smile and some patience. If you've been around long enough, the old hands do occasionally remember faces. Some days they might be really (and legitimately) annoyed by some clowns who might have preceded you. Given some of the expatriate characters I've seen, I think we ought to dub the office "The Circus!"

The efficiency of the office has improved substantially over the years. Certainly they could still, I think, make things easier for themselves and expatriates procedurally (such as better instructions in English and other major languages on the web site and in the office to avoid confusion), but the office has not been spinning wheels . One of these days, maybe a new building! And parking !!!!! Maybe a McDonalds ?!

But if you will excuse me, I have to get to the latest hamburger thread!