At Least 27 Dead In Connecticut School Shooting - Cbs News

[osiboy]

Called human nature when awful stuff hits home. Empathy. Don't be a sour pus who is the one making it about oneself from attention perspective. Empathy is more powerful than sympathy. The world needs more of it.

Yeah, this event made me think back to when I was in American elementary school in a school that looked like the one in Newtown. My generation had some traumas too and they were actually pretty bad at the time, but comparing them to what those kids in that school have dealt with is kind of mind blowing. My traumas in the 1960s were: the shock of a beloved president Kennedy assassinated; the Cuban missile crisis (I was in a target city, we had a bomb shelter, duck and cover, and I had nightmares about planes dropping bombs); one year a local serial killer of children was on the loose for months (fear and nightmares); then there was dodge ball . Childhood even in the best of times can be DARKER than most adults sentimentalize about. But again remembering my childhood nightmares and what it was like to be in elementary school, comparing to those kids, right now ... feeling very bad for those kids, obviously the dead but very much so for the living as well. Really, the idea of mass shooters at schools wasn't even close to being in people's consciousness then. Now, it is, when's the NEXT one gonna be?

I was 14 in 1964, when I returned to a school in Louisiana. One day I was sent to the principals office for some reason. In a corner of his office were several .22 caliber rifles and various shotguns.

I asked a friend about it. He told me it was squirrel season. Some of the kids would bring their rifle or shotgun to school so they could go hunting right after school let out. Each kid had to have a written note from their parents saying their child could go hunting squirrels after school.

The note had to have a telephone number that the principal could call to verify that the parent knew their child brought the squirrel gun to school and could go squirrel hunting after school. If the family did not have a telephone, then the note had to specify when a parent would stop by the school and speak with the principal.

If the kid forged a note or did not have a note giving him permission to bring the squirrel gun to school and/or to go hunting afterwards, then the kid was expelled from school and the parent had to pick up the gun. If a parent did not pick up the gun, then it was given to the local sheriff department and confiscated.

This was at a time when there were little if any government support services, only local church charity organizations that would help out people that were too poor to provide for themselves with money. The only time many families had meat or fish was when they shot or caught it themselves.

No child ever threatened anyone at school with a firearm at any time!

OMG !,............and i thought thailand was a wild and crazy place !

[endure]

I realise that there are strong feelings all round on this subject but you please stop insulting each other and calling each other names. It does you and your argument no good at all.

[radiochaser]

Called human nature when awful stuff hits home. Empathy. Don't be a sour pus who is the one making it about oneself from attention perspective. Empathy is more powerful than sympathy. The world needs more of it.

Yeah, this event made me think back to when I was in American elementary school in a school that looked like the one in Newtown. My generation had some traumas too and they were actually pretty bad at the time, but comparing them to what those kids in that school have dealt with is kind of mind blowing. My traumas in the 1960s were: the shock of a beloved president Kennedy assassinated; the Cuban missile crisis (I was in a target city, we had a bomb shelter, duck and cover, and I had nightmares about planes dropping bombs); one year a local serial killer of children was on the loose for months (fear and nightmares); then there was dodge ball . Childhood even in the best of times can be DARKER than most adults sentimentalize about. But again remembering my childhood nightmares and what it was like to be in elementary school, comparing to those kids, right now ... feeling very bad for those kids, obviously the dead but very much so for the living as well. Really, the idea of mass shooters at schools wasn't even close to being in people's consciousness then. Now, it is, when's the NEXT one gonna be?

I was 14 in 1964, when I returned to a school in Louisiana. One day I was sent to the principals office for some reason. In a corner of his office were several .22 caliber rifles and various shotguns.

I asked a friend about it. He told me it was squirrel season. Some of the kids would bring their rifle or shotgun to school so they could go hunting right after school let out. Each kid had to have a written note from their parents saying their child could go hunting squirrels after school.

The note had to have a telephone number that the principal could call to verify that the parent knew their child brought the squirrel gun to school and could go squirrel hunting after school. If the family did not have a telephone, then the note had to specify when a parent would stop by the school and speak with the principal.

If the kid forged a note or did not have a note giving him permission to bring the squirrel gun to school and/or to go hunting afterwards, then the kid was expelled from school and the parent had to pick up the gun. If a parent did not pick up the gun, then it was given to the local sheriff department and confiscated.

This was at a time when there were little if any government support services, only local church charity organizations that would help out people that were too poor to provide for themselves with money. The only time many families had meat or fish was when they shot or caught it themselves.

No child ever threatened anyone at school with a firearm at any time!

OMG !,............and i thought thailand was a wild and crazy place !

I was in the 12th grade in San Antonio, Texas, 1968-1968. I was in the Junior Reserve Officer Training (ROTC) class . This was sponsored by the U.S. Army.

After the second month of the school year, I went to school 1 hour early every day to shoot 50 rounds with a .22 caliber rifle. I was on the ROTC rifle team. By the third month of the school year, I would go with the ROTC rifle team and shoot in competition at a University or College that had a College level ROTC course, every Saturday. The team I was on would compete against other high school ROTC shooting teams.

There were hundreds of rifles at both the high schools and colleges. No one ever shot anything except paper targets, there were no high school students at any of the schools, that I heard of, that shot anything other than paper targets.

That is two school that I attended where firearms were at school and no one was shot at school! It was not wild and it was not crazy. Even children as young as 12 years old and all of them were responsible firearm users.

Something or somethings has changed over the years. I do not know what, but it is a change for the worse. I think that people are not being held responsible for their actions is one thing, but not the only thing that has lead to what we have now. And that lack of responsibility is ingrained when a person is a child and leads to lack of responsibility as an adult.

I do not write responses in these forums in an effort to belittle any one. But I read too many posts that appear to me, to be emotional responses that do little to stop actual criminal acts.

As I see it, in general, a child that grows up committing childish acts that are wrong, without being held accountable for their actions, will grow up into an adult that will commit adult acts that are wrong and then they blame others for their lack of responsibility.

Be those acts simply not stopping at a stop sign, when the vehicle code requires them to stop and driving through an intersection, or be those acts the despicable action of killing another human being for no good fuc_king reason other than they can!

On an emotional level I detest people who kill other people with no good reason! Be it done with their fists and feet, brick or bat, a firearm, or with fire, or any other of thousands of ways to kill another person.

If a killing, a non justifiable homicide, is not done in defense of self or others when their or others lives are being threatened with great bodily harm or death, but merely because it was fun, easy, just because they could, or because they were dissed by someone who said something that the killer did not like or they looked at the killer in a way the killer thought was dis-respectful, then that killer is a despicable human being and not worthy of compassion or comfort for the rest of the killers life.

I write as both a victim of criminal acts, with relatives that are victims of criminal acts, and as an observer of the after affects of victims of criminal acts.

In all of these criminal acts committed against me and mine and those that I did not know, never once is it the firearm used that I see as the thing committing the criminal act, but the person committing the criminal act using a firearm (or knife, or as is I think it is called in some criminal statues, "strong arm").

I see the individual person as the committer (yeah, this is not a real word) of the crime not the weapon and I do not believe that more and restrictive laws added to the tens of thousands current laws will stop someone from the commission of a crime, what ever that crime may be!

[radiochaser]

A question from an outsider. Simple curiosity - no more. Different States have different laws so is it possible to buy guns in a State with lax laws and then simply take them over the border into a State with strict laws without any legal comeback?

A good question. For example Florida now has ONE MILLION concealed weapon licenses. I think they wouldn't apply outside Florida. It's probably a patchwork for different situations. There are federal laws and state laws for most any issue in the U.S. Just a comment -- sure the gun owners know a lot more!

Concealed Carry permits issued by the state of Florida are legal for concealed carry in several other states. If each state accepts the others permit then a reciprocal carry is allowed.

I, for instance, can legally carry my hand gun concealed in Florida and several other states as well.

Thanks for that. Worse than I thought.

Jingthing, I am a retired Federal Agent. I was charged with enforcing laws written by the United States Government. I am considered a responsible individual and as such, am allowed by law to carry in several states.

The only time I have ever shot anyone, was during the Vietnam war. I do know what the end results of my actions could be and I carry responsibly.

Edited December 15, 2012 by radiochaser

[radiochaser]

A lot of missing the forest for the trees here.

These atrociously violent acts by young American males are the symptoms of an ill society. It's been painful realizing this only the latest in a consistent string of similar tragedies, continuously being produced through some faults in our American culture to which we are too blind or weak to notice. Expect Americans to widely attribute these events to poor implementation of some government policy, while failing to reflect on how they treat, lead, and value one another.

I agree that these are symptoms of an ill society and expect many loudly vocal people to attribute these acts to poor implementation of some government policy, but expect that those same people will not blame the person commiting those same acts as being the person responsible.

I think society as a whole, all over the world, is experiencing some thing going wrong. While I have some thoughts about the reasons and write about some of them, I really do not know what the actual reason or reasons are.

it grieves me to the core of my being when I take the time to think about it all.

Edited December 15, 2012 by radiochaser

[kangeroo]

The killings make me sick and i feel so sorry for everybody that is left to put up with this mess and the comment from the gun lobby not 24 hours after the shooting was if a teacher had a gun they could have shot the young guy who lost it .

crazy country . crazy laws .

[radiochaser]

Bushmaster, not pistols caused most of deaths. Medical examiner just gave statement. He examined 7 bodies of first graders. All had Bushmaster wounds were all shot between 3 and 11 times.

I had read an article earlier that stated the only firearms Lanza took into the school with him were pistols, that the police found the bushamster in his vehicle.

I wonder when we will get the real truth of this, if at all?

[Scott]

This story is still developing and we request that you stay on the topic of the OP. The general political discussion of guns, gun control and specifics about state's regulations can wait until later or another thread.

A number of posts and replies have been deleted.

Your cooperation is appreciated.

[F430murci]

Bushmaster, not pistols caused most of deaths. Medical examiner just gave statement. He examined 7 bodies of first graders. All had Bushmaster wounds were all shot between 3 and 11 times.

I had read an article earlier that stated the only firearms Lanza took into the school with him were pistols, that the police found the bushamster in his vehicle.

I wonder when we will get the real truth of this, if at all?

Watch news! As a fed agent you should understand preliminary reports on something like this gets pretty fouled up. They also said at first his mother was a teacher and he shot her in the class room. They said it was his sister he shot at home. I think they are being very up front and answering all questions during press releases I saw today. Maybe net rumors and stories are not best sources sometimes.

Why imply someone hiding something?

Seems like details are coming out better now and some sad stories. Poor dad of six year old little girl was on TV.

Edited December 16, 2012 by F430murci

[Mrjlh]

The US is a violent country. It's history is full of violence within the country and it seems constantly involved in violent conflict around the globe. Some of the most popular video games for kids re-enact warfare and violence. It's not a surprise then that the violence turns inward in horrible ways.

Where did you get that brilliant deduction? Guess you burried your head in the sands when it comes to Sudan, Libia, Syria, Afhganastan, Southern Thailand, Brazil, just to name a few. Better look into your own back door before saying the US is the most violent. Our wonderful press today paint a doomsday picture for everyone. If you think American movies are violent better check out novies made in China, Japan. and South Korea. Ands some Euorpean movies aren't exactly tame either.

[Scott]

Last chance for posters to get back to this topic.

[F430murci]

The US is a violent country. It's history is full of violence within the country and it seems constantly involved in violent conflict around the globe. Some of the most popular video games for kids re-enact warfare and violence. It's not a surprise then that the violence turns inward in horrible ways.

Where did you get that brilliant deduction? Guess you burried your head in the sands when it comes to Sudan, Libia, Syria, Afhganastan, Southern Thailand, Brazil, just to name a few. Better look into your own back door before saying the US is the most violent. Our wonderful press today paint a doomsday picture for everyone. If you think American movies are violent better check out novies made in China, Japan. and South Korea. Ands some Euorpean movies aren't exactly tame either.

US has some random weirdness for sure, but I have not l have not locked a door in years at either of residences. One in a large city and the other a popular beach area similar to Phucket. Thiskind of thing shocks because it dies nit matter where you are, something weird can happen. I am not worried at all about me. If anything happened to my children I would freak.

[radiochaser]

Bushmaster, not pistols caused most of deaths. Medical examiner just gave statement. He examined 7 bodies of first graders. All had Bushmaster wounds were all shot between 3 and 11 times.

I had read an article earlier that stated the only firearms Lanza took into the school with him were pistols, that the police found the bushamster in his vehicle.

I wonder when we will get the real truth of this, if at all?

Watch news! As a fed agent you should understand preliminary reports on something like this gets pretty fouled up. They also said at first his mother was a teacher and he shot her in the class room. They said it was his sister he shot at home. I think they are being very up front and answering all questions during press releases I saw today. Maybe net rumors and stories are not best sources sometimes.

Why imply someone hiding something?

Seems like details are coming out better now and some sad stories. Poor dad of six year old little girl was on TV.

It was not my intent to imply that the media was lying, just wondering when the actual truth of events would come out. I have seen where the media does lie about events, but have also seen what I perceive to be lack of correct reporting of events due to any number of reasons.

I can see how my comment could imply that I was accusing the media of deception in this case, but again, I was not.

[maidu]

you think!?

yes

[tomyummer]

In a way, this thread needs to act as a release for everyone. There is little point disagreeing and slagging each other off over different viewpoints. In our own way, many of us need to grieve, because this is all far too close to home for many folks who frequent this board. I would almost ask that if we disagree with a view point just let it go and state your own point of view. In the last 24 hours, many innocent lives have been taken, and you know, no matter what the reason, it will never be good enough to satisfy anyone. It is impossible to try and understand why this has happened, because 99.9999999999% of us never can, because despite our differences and our online anonymous combatative ego's, we are all generally decent people.

This event will shake lives all over the world. I replied to this OP pretty much as soon as it came up last night as I was doing a final check of mails and admin before leaving home for a week. As soon as I read it, I welled up, I could not tell my wife lay next to me as I knew she would never sleep, nor could I return the intent of her warm embraces, feigning tiredness as my mind battled with the trauma being faced by so many parents, so far away, yet so close. Our small children safely asleep in the next room.

I was touched today to see a President stand up and deliver a press conference as a stately man and a Father. I care not for political persuasions at a time like this and think he represented the feelings of the vast percentage of American people. To be honest I hope nobody disagreed with what he said, and it showed a true compassion in a world where we so easily overlook it, due to our differences.

The town of Newtown will forever bear a scar that will never be removed. Theblether mentioned earlier in the thread how the small and beautiful village of Dunblane, Scotland showed that the soul of a nation resides in some of its smallest components, and the day the children were slaughtered there, was a day as dark as there has ever been. I remember a few years ago staying in a magnificent hotel in the Western Isles in Scotland, having breakfast looking out over the ocean in a small room, where the guests were all chatting table to table in what can only be described as a perfect occasion. An old couple sat closely on the table next to us and as we chatted away they asked where I was from and what i did, and I then returned the question, asking where they were from. The old woman aged 78 said 'Dunblane' and with that the small room fell silent. The old woman and her Husband immediately welled up and I touched and held her hand straight away, she just said 'Thank you Son'. We all realised the pain of these two, both born and bred and living in that town for 78 years and all moved on to the wonder and beauty of the sunrise and the day. They knew, and we knew. Now the residents of Newtown USA will experience the same, for decades and maybe more.

With that tale and this, it reminds me, that as theblether reminded me, we are mostly common with common feelings. theblether is a man whom I have recently fallen out with over a couple of threads on TV due to an embedded difference of view in both of us. Despite us communicating well on skype beforehand we let an issue that was proven today to be unimportant on the grand scale of things come between us, so to that end Blether, I offer unconditional apologies for my entrenched opposition to your entrenched opposition to our mutual views. As a big picture thing our difference is irrelevant compared to what people have experienced in the last 24 hours, so my hand is out and I hope we renew our friendship.

I am sat at swampy waiting to go far away and miss my family already. Of course there is never a good time of year for this to happen, but right now, with the focus on family and friends, the sensory overload of this tragedy is even more acute if you can understand that statement. Right now, gun laws and constitutions are irrelevant as I imagine the terror in the hearts of the teachers, guardians and of those terrified young children who were all shot down. Nothing else matters. I am a true Hitchins at heart, but tonight sees me praying for a truth in the reality and justice of a heaven and hell.

Sorry for going on, I needed to grieve and nobody in the lounge will listen, but some of you old dogs just might.

Love those close to you tonight just a little bit more, and put your differences both political and personal in perspective.

Got to love ThaiVisa for these posts.

[MaxYakov]

Called human nature when awful stuff hits home. Empathy. Don't be a sour pus who is the one making it about oneself from attention perspective. Empathy is more powerful than sympathy. The world needs more of it.

Yeah, this event made me think back to when I was in American elementary school in a school that looked like the one in Newtown. My generation had some traumas too and they were actually pretty bad at the time, but comparing them to what those kids in that school have dealt with is kind of mind blowing. My traumas in the 1960s were: the shock of a beloved president Kennedy assassinated; the Cuban missile crisis (I was in a target city, we had a bomb shelter, duck and cover, and I had nightmares about planes dropping bombs); one year a local serial killer of children was on the loose for months (fear and nightmares); then there was dodge ball . Childhood even in the best of times can be DARKER than most adults sentimentalize about. But again remembering my childhood nightmares and what it was like to be in elementary school, comparing to those kids, right now ... feeling very bad for those kids, obviously the dead but very much so for the living as well. Really, the idea of mass shooters at schools wasn't even close to being in people's consciousness then. Now, it is, when's the NEXT one gonna be?

I was 14 in 1964, when I returned to a school in Louisiana. One day I was sent to the principals office for some reason. In a corner of his office were several .22 caliber rifles and various shotguns.

I asked a friend about it. He told me it was squirrel season. Some of the kids would bring their rifle or shotgun to school so they could go hunting right after school let out. Each kid had to have a written note from their parents saying their child could go hunting squirrels after school.

The note had to have a telephone number that the principal could call to verify that the parent knew their child brought the squirrel gun to school and could go squirrel hunting after school. If the family did not have a telephone, then the note had to specify when a parent would stop by the school and speak with the principal.

If the kid forged a note or did not have a note giving him permission to bring the squirrel gun to school and/or to go hunting afterwards, then the kid was expelled from school and the parent had to pick up the gun. If a parent did not pick up the gun, then it was given to the local sheriff department and confiscated.

This was at a time when there were little if any government support services, only local church charity organizations that would help out people that were too poor to provide for themselves with money. The only time many families had meat or fish was when they shot or caught it themselves.

No child ever threatened anyone at school with a firearm at any time!

OMG !,............and i thought thailand was a wild and crazy place !

Wild and crazy, huh? In my high school kids (rural Nevada) would park their pickups in the school parking lot with a rifle or shotgun mounted in the rear window. Sport was several kids with shotguns in a jeep chasing jackrabbits at night on the desert and rolling cars for fun using sagebrush mounds. I thought the cross-desert jackrabbit hunt was pretty risky at the time, since shooters in the back were shooting over the heads of those sitting on the hood. My best friend would tend his traps at the local slough carrying a 12-gauge pump shotgun across his bicycle's handlebars. He often accompanied his dad on vacation deer hunting trips with converted 30.06 Mauser rifles near Elko. Beefs between kids were settled by fisticuffs or a drag race.

Ironically, the only classmate death was a well-liked kid who got hit in the temple by a wild pitch during a PE baseball game. Sure, he was wearing a protective helmet, but he died within hours of a brain hemorrhage. There was at least one very serious football game injury that I recall. If there had been any gun-related deaths or injuries, the whole town would have known about it, of course.

Edited December 16, 2012 by MaxYakov

[NovaBlue05]

Bushmaster, not pistols caused most of deaths. Medical examiner just gave statement. He examined 7 bodies of first graders. All had Bushmaster wounds were all shot between 3 and 11 times.

I had read an article earlier that stated the only firearms Lanza took into the school with him were pistols, that the police found the bushamster in his vehicle.

I wonder when we will get the real truth of this, if at all?

Watch news! As a fed agent you should understand preliminary reports on something like this gets pretty fouled up. They also said at first his mother was a teacher and he shot her in the class room. They said it was his sister he shot at home. I think they are being very up front and answering all questions during press releases I saw today. Maybe net rumors and stories are not best sources sometimes.

Why imply someone hiding something?

Seems like details are coming out better now and some sad stories. Poor dad of six year old little girl was on TV.

It was not my intent to imply that the media was lying, just wondering when the actual truth of events would come out. I have seen where the media does lie about events, but have also seen what I perceive to be lack of correct reporting of events due to any number of reasons.

I can see how my comment could imply that I was accusing the media of deception in this case, but again, I was not.

Todays modern media has to missions. The first is to scoop their competition and the 2nd is to report events with accuracy. The 2nd is a distant second. In order to achieve the prime directive, they take gossip and rumour, roll the dice and put it out there. The crime scene is active and still being documented. There's no way those bozo's you see on TV are privy to anything definitive. In another few days, Investigators will start to release the real info.

[simple1]

Seems to be a common thread with these mass killings at schools by members of the Goth sub culture. Anyone have any insight on this why this is so? Quote from the following link "a US Secret Service study of 37 premeditated school shootings found that bullying had played a major role in more than two-thirds of the attacks"

http://www.stabroeknews.com/2012/opinion/editorial/07/21/americas-gun-violence-is-not-unique/

[brianP]

My son is much less violent and angry here, in fact he is content and creative. Hmmmm, 1 year not watching USA's violent TV and movies simulating thousands of acts of death destruction and treachery, as well as a lot of bad cussing and loud obnoxious aggressive selfish behavior encouraging materialism and wealth,power.

I was exposed to hours of that crap and commercials too, it's being consumed daily and spreading more violence. I miss the 1950's...

[Ferangled]

Is it to much to ask that the US goes the same way as the UK , apparently so.

Let's hope something positive can come from this tragedy such as a ban on gun ownership in the USA.

The Yanks really need to follow the UK's example and end these needless massacres.

No can't do that. It's all about the constitution. The Right to Bear Arms. That's how we were able to defeat England in the War of 1812.

What a bizarre comment. In the annuls of British history these events are scarcely even remembered , eclipsed by the scale of the Napoleonic Wars in Europe raging at the time. The right to bear arms? No actually it was down to the French...

A terrible tragedy to which the responses on here range from the strange to the totally insane. Take away the guns and people will stop shooting people. It really is that simple.

[Ferangled]

In a way, this thread needs to act as a release for everyone. There is little point disagreeing and slagging each other off over different viewpoints. In our own way, many of us need to grieve, because this is all far too close to home for many folks who frequent this board. I would almost ask that if we disagree with a view point just let it go and state your own point of view. In the last 24 hours, many innocent lives have been taken, and you know, no matter what the reason, it will never be good enough to satisfy anyone. It is impossible to try and understand why this has happened, because 99.9999999999% of us never can, because despite our differences and our online anonymous combatative ego's, we are all generally decent people.

This event will shake lives all over the world. I replied to this OP pretty much as soon as it came up last night as I was doing a final check of mails and admin before leaving home for a week. As soon as I read it, I welled up, I could not tell my wife lay next to me as I knew she would never sleep, nor could I return the intent of her warm embraces, feigning tiredness as my mind battled with the trauma being faced by so many parents, so far away, yet so close. Our small children safely asleep in the next room.

I was touched today to see a President stand up and deliver a press conference as a stately man and a Father. I care not for political persuasions at a time like this and think he represented the feelings of the vast percentage of American people. To be honest I hope nobody disagreed with what he said, and it showed a true compassion in a world where we so easily overlook it, due to our differences.

The town of Newtown will forever bear a scar that will never be removed. Theblether mentioned earlier in the thread how the small and beautiful village of Dunblane, Scotland showed that the soul of a nation resides in some of its smallest components, and the day the children were slaughtered there, was a day as dark as there has ever been. I remember a few years ago staying in a magnificent hotel in the Western Isles in Scotland, having breakfast looking out over the ocean in a small room, where the guests were all chatting table to table in what can only be described as a perfect occasion. An old couple sat closely on the table next to us and as we chatted away they asked where I was from and what i did, and I then returned the question, asking where they were from. The old woman aged 78 said 'Dunblane' and with that the small room fell silent. The old woman and her Husband immediately welled up and I touched and held her hand straight away, she just said 'Thank you Son'. We all realised the pain of these two, both born and bred and living in that town for 78 years and all moved on to the wonder and beauty of the sunrise and the day. They knew, and we knew. Now the residents of Newtown USA will experience the same, for decades and maybe more.

With that tale and this, it reminds me, that as theblether reminded me, we are mostly common with common feelings. theblether is a man whom I have recently fallen out with over a couple of threads on TV due to an embedded difference of view in both of us. Despite us communicating well on skype beforehand we let an issue that was proven today to be unimportant on the grand scale of things come between us, so to that end Blether, I offer unconditional apologies for my entrenched opposition to your entrenched opposition to our mutual views. As a big picture thing our difference is irrelevant compared to what people have experienced in the last 24 hours, so my hand is out and I hope we renew our friendship.

I am sat at swampy waiting to go far away and miss my family already. Of course there is never a good time of year for this to happen, but right now, with the focus on family and friends, the sensory overload of this tragedy is even more acute if you can understand that statement. Right now, gun laws and constitutions are irrelevant as I imagine the terror in the hearts of the teachers, guardians and of those terrified young children who were all shot down. Nothing else matters. I am a true Hitchins at heart, but tonight sees me praying for a truth in the reality and justice of a heaven and hell.

Sorry for going on, I needed to grieve and nobody in the lounge will listen, but some of you old dogs just might.

Love those close to you tonight just a little bit more, and put your differences both political and personal in perspective.

Got to love ThaiVisa for these posts.

2nd that, brilliant post GentlemanJim. Helps renew faith in our fellow man.

[KuhnPaen]

Wow...if a guy jumps off of a balcony in Pattaya, there are all these people posting RIP.

20 little kids get gunned down at a school and everybody argues about gun control.

RIP little ones.

[fame1nexpleta]

Is it to much to ask that the US goes the same way as the UK , apparently so.

Let's hope something positive can come from this tragedy such as a ban on gun ownership in the USA.

The Yanks really need to follow the UK's example and end these needless massacres.

No can't do that. It's all about the constitution. The Right to Bear Arms. That's how we were able to defeat England in the War of 1812.

What a bizarre comment. In the annuls of British history these events are scarcely even remembered , eclipsed by the scale of the Napoleonic Wars in Europe raging at the time. The right to bear arms? No actually it was down to the French...

A terrible tragedy to which the responses on here range from the strange to the totally insane. Take away the guns and people will stop shooting people. It really is that simple.

Despite the incredibly callous sensation I feel when saying it at the moment, I can't imagine further legislating the ownership of guns as being the answer. The cat is out of the bag, and we have to deal with the fact that there are more guns in America than people. If we truly wanted to prevent these increasingly prevalent acts, we would have examined the culture that failed these children. Given that these acts have been historically perpetrated by intelligent, albeit poorly adjusted, males, it's difficult to say that removing guns from the equation would change the outcome. Guns have only been a means to an end for these deeply troubled young Americans.

Several deviations from the norm lies a very unnoticed and potentially dangerous segment of society that warrants more attention. We can either address this segment, or try to further tighten the lid of the proverbial "cookie jar" of weapons. Given the emotional impulses of my countrymen, and the desire for immediate action, I doubt we will see the necessary introspection. Rather, I suspect these attacks will continue despite the increased regulation of guns. Expect to see an ever increasingly puzzled and fearful American public, one that fails to see the violence as byproduct of its culture, and more of a failure of not enough force.

[metisdead]

A post commenting on moderation has been removed.

[Ferangled]

Despite the incredibly callous sensation I feel when saying it at the moment, I can't imagine further legislating the ownership of guns as being the answer. The cat is out of the bag, and we have to deal with the fact that there are more guns in America than people. If we truly wanted to prevent these increasingly prevalent acts, we would have examined the culture that failed these children. Given that these acts have been historically perpetrated by intelligent, albeit poorly adjusted, males, it's difficult to say that removing guns from the equation would change the outcome. Guns have only been a means to an end for these deeply troubled young Americans.

Several deviations from the norm lies a very unnoticed and potentially dangerous segment of society that warrants more attention. We can either address this segment, or try to further tighten the lid of the proverbial "cookie jar" of weapons. Given the emotional impulses of my countrymen, and the desire for immediate action, I doubt we will see the necessary introspection. Rather, I suspect these attacks will continue despite the increased regulation of guns. Expect to see an ever increasingly puzzled and fearful American public, one that fails to see the violence as byproduct of its culture, and more of a failure of not enough force.

Agree with much of what you say and yes it was an overly simplistic and naive comment given the reality of how widespread guns are in American society. In a way that's my clumsy point; if guns weren't so widely available you wouldn't have these issues; lock 10 men in a box with 10 guns, someone would likely get shot, 10 men in a box with a video game, beer and some crisps and they'll probably have a good time. It really is a 2+2 =4 situation but the solution clearly isn't anything like as simple and straight forward.

I don't believe that American society is inherently morally corrupt, all societies have mentally unstable people within them, but not all societies have such cheap, ready access to guns and widespread gun ownership as a result. We see such tragic incidents in many different countries, as has been mentioned on here, but not with such devastating frequency as we see in the US.

We have two other current threads running at the moment on here concerning public shootings in the US, one opening fire on Xmas shoppers in a mall, another in the lobby of a hotel casino. Surely it's about time to at least recognise that there is a problem and start seriously considering how to begin to address it. These sorts of incidents rock the entire world, let alone the effect to those close to the events, and if they start a dialogue about the issue one can only hope that change is brought about as a result, some positive from all the devastation and misery caused.

Echoing the sentiments of others on here, my heart goes out to the families and loved ones of those lost, may they rest in peace.

[Mosha]

Perhaps if the media denied the perpetrator their week in the limelight, and concentrated more on the victims. We might see less of these incidents. I wonder if more Americans know the names of the guilty than know any of the victims names?

[F430murci]

Perhaps if the media denied the perpetrator their week in the limelight, and concentrated more on the victims. We might see less of these incidents. I wonder if more Americans know the names of the guilty than know any of the victims names?

News channels are only mentioning victims' names. Not mentioning scum bag name and only pictured showed of the dirt bag was from 2005.

[NeverSure]

I don't know who is more mentally Ill, the Americans who want to buy automatic weapons or the government for allowing them to do so.

Terrible.

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Do you even <deleted> know what an automatic weapon is? It's a machine gun. It's called select-fire. Pull the trigger once and hold it and the gun empties the magazine at a very rapid fire rate.

The military has such guns, such as the M-16. Most US troops carry that or something very similar. So do troops in every country I know of.

This feature is also necessary for a gun to be called an "assault" rifle. It is used in military assaults.

The guns that US civilians own, such as the AR-15, are semi-automatic. They are NOT assault rifles. That means the gun fires only once every time the trigger is pulled. Many guns do that.

Did you ever stop to think that an old double action revolver will do that? Every time you pull the trigger, and without the need to cock the gun, it will fire.

Most modern handguns are semi-automatic. Even my Ruger .22 pistol is semi-automatic. AR-15's and AR-10's are semi-automatic. They are not assault rifles.

Many sporting rifles are semi-automatic. They may have beautiful walnut stocks and be show pieces. But paint the gun black and everyone freaks out.

All of this crap about the type of gun is just that. Crap from people who don't know guns.

[NeverSure]

I forgot to add. I have never seen an AK-47 in the US. A very few with special permits do have them, but they are rare, expensive, and hard to get a permit for. They are banned in many states in the US.

What civilians can actually have and some don't even know it, is an AKM-47. It is the semi-automatic, non-assault rifle version of the fully automatic, machine gun style AK-47.

[wellred]

To those who advocate the right to bear arms I think it's time to start thinking about taking a step back and taking away this right. Yes I know it's only a few crazy people that do these sorts of things but the point is the people themselves cannot be pre emptively stopped so you need to take away the right to bear arms.

And auto or semi auto doesn't make a shred of difference either. Both are capable of killing the only difference ja how many squeezes of the trigger get pulled off.

Edited December 16, 2012 by wellred