Obtaining Refund Of Tax Withheld On Thai Bank Fixed Savings Account

[asiaexpat]

I filed for refund at Paradise Park Tax office recently. The staff had no idea how to process my request and I spent several hours with two offices to get a refund that has not arrived yet. At first I was directed to the main office and the staff filled out a multi page form (a tax return report) then discovered I was not registered for a tax number even though I did this years ago. I was then sent to another office to register using my Pink Card ID number. The registrar could not accomplish this and finally used my passport to register me. This caused problems with the tax return. Finally get approval of my tax return and receipt showing refund. Not worth the effort ad will just take a foreign tax deduction on my home country taxes next year.

[GroveHillWanderer]

On 18/02/2018 at 2:37 PM, ChouDoufu said:

getting the vibe that the downstairs lady doesn't know how

to process foreigner forms, so the tax thing is her way of

saying get lost if you know what's best.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'foreigner forms' - it's the same standard tax return form (Por Ngor Dor 90) for anyone who's resident for tax purposes in Thailand, regardless of nationality.

 

Now, when I tried to do my first refund claim last year I did run into one official who seemed to think (and tried to tell me) that foreigners were not entitled to claim tax refunds. He was getting quite insistent about it and I didn't see the point in arguing so I just said thank you, went away, came back another day and dealt with a different (and very pleasant) lady who had no problems with creating my tax id number (TIN) and then processing the refund claim. Once I gave her the required documentation, she filled out all the forms for me, I pretty much just had to sit there and make small talk.

 

She did ask me if I was receiving any regular monthly income but once I told her I wasn't and was just living off accumulated savings, she went ahead without further ado. In the end, it could hardly have been simpler (once I found the right person).

[JimGant]

Quote

Not worth the effort ad will just take a foreign tax deduction on my home country taxes next year.

Actually, why not (but take the tax credit, not deduction). I assume you're US (based on previous posts), and here's what the instructions for Form 1116 (Foreign Tax Credit) say:

Quote

"Taxes paid to a foreign country that you don't legally owe, including amounts eligible for refund by the foreign country. If you don't exercise your available remedies to reduce the amount of foreign tax to what you legally owe, a credit for the excess amount isn't allowed."

But, if you run into a brick wall trying to get the refund, I think this says you "exercised your available remedies." Now, since you finally succeeded, going for the tax credit next year could be questionable (should have gone for a beer after first push back) -- the gent who got the "no can do for farang" should have gotten that in writing, then gone the tax credit route.

Anyway, you're not expected to fight incompetent bureaucracy all day long. That you just made an effort should be good enough (in the less than 1% chance you get audited). But, you do need to make some effort next year before you go the credit route.

[ChouDoufu]

***UPDATE***

 

after a couple weeks, the tax lady from lad phrao finally called us. 

she consulted with her lawyer who said i did not have to pay income

tax on savings brought into thailand.  good news.

 

more good news........okay to file for refund AND can file online.

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/300.0.html

 

went to the revenue department page, registered online using my new TIN. 

filled out the form 90 with help from a native speaker.    application was

accepted, and printed out a copy.  should receive a check at my home address.

can check status online in 3 days.

 

there is a link to english hidden at the bottom of the page.  this gets you to

downloadable forms and instructions in english:

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/56815.0.html

 

there was an option on the website for uploading a form OR using the

online thai system.  we opted to fill out the thai form online after filling

out and referencing the english form.

 

interest and dividends go in no. 3, section 40(4). there are two lines

where you choose type of income for 40(4).  the first one let us enter

dividends/interest for each payer along with the tax paid and payer tax id. 

there is a "+" icon at the bottom to add more payers.  the second 40(4)

option was for dividend payments directly from a thai corporation. 

tried that one first, could not get it to work.  after entering all interest

and dividends data, hit next and the system did all the calculations.

 

you must enter the taxpayer id of the payer.  online system lets you add

entries for each payer. not sure you would handle that with the paper or

uploadable versions, as there is only one payer id space for all the possible

sources of income within no. 3.

 

only hiccup was the final check.  form was not accepted unless filled out

lines for "company" and "website."  those could not be left blank.

i used " เกษียณ " and "www.nowebsite.com"

[orientalist]

***UPDATE***
 
after a couple weeks, the tax lady from lad phrao finally called us. 
she consulted with her lawyer who said i did not have to pay income
tax on savings brought into thailand.  good news.
 
more good news........okay to file for refund AND can file online.
http://www.rd.go.th/publish/300.0.html
 
went to the revenue department page, registered online using my new TIN. 
filled out the form 90 with help from a native speaker.    application was
accepted, and printed out a copy.  should receive a check at my home address.
can check status online in 3 days.
 
there is a link to english hidden at the bottom of the page.  this gets you to
downloadable forms and instructions in english:
http://www.rd.go.th/publish/56815.0.html
 
there was an option on the website for uploading a form OR using the
online thai system.  we opted to fill out the thai form online after filling
out and referencing the english form.
 
interest and dividends go in no. 3, section 40(4). there are two lines
where you choose type of income for 40(4).  the first one let us enter
dividends/interest for each payer along with the tax paid and payer tax id. 
there is a "+" icon at the bottom to add more payers.  the second 40(4)
option was for dividend payments directly from a thai corporation. 
tried that one first, could not get it to work.  after entering all interest
and dividends data, hit next and the system did all the calculations.
 
you must enter the taxpayer id of the payer.  online system lets you add
entries for each payer. not sure you would handle that with the paper or
uploadable versions, as there is only one payer id space for all the possible
sources of income within no. 3.
 
only hiccup was the final check.  form was not accepted unless filled out
lines for "company" and "website."  those could not be left blank.
i used " เกษียณ " and "www.nowebsite.com"

Was there any field where you could enter your PromptPay ID for quicker refund payment?

Sent from my F5321 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ChouDoufu]

i recall a reference to promptpay somewhere, but not

exactly where.  sorry, can't say where....could have been

on main site, on the form, or a popup.  may have needed

a thai id number for that......but it's hazy now.

 

i found this on the downloaded english instructions

for the PDN 90, and on page 1 of the english form, but

no entry fields:

 

"Request for Tax Refund
If you wish to receive your tax refund, you shall sign in the space provided. The Revenue Department will refund the tax via prompt-pay system. For your convenience, you can use your National ID number to subscribe to the system with any banks providing such service in Thailand."

 

this is at left bottom of the form, so looks like the

electronic refund is a separate application on the

website:

 

"The Revenue Department provides electronic services
related to ภ.ง.ด.90 on the website www.rd.go.th as follows:
1. ภ.ง.ด.90 submission, tax payment or refund
request through the E-Filing system
2. Personal income tax calculation program"

 

the word "prompt" does not appear on the form 90

that i downloaded.

 

maybe check the links on this e-filing page:

http://rdserver.rd.go.th/publish/index.php

[GroveHillWanderer]

16 hours ago, orientalist said:

 

Was there any field where you could enter your PromptPay ID for quicker refund payment?

Sent from my F5321 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

At least according to the tax office in Hua Hin, payment via PromptPay is only available if you have a Thai-style ID number. Their system apparently does not allow the input of a phone number into the field used for this purpose.

[orientalist]

At least according to the tax office in Hua Hin, payment via PromptPay is only available if you have a Thai-style ID number. Their system apparently does not allow the input of a phone number into the field used for this purpose.

Ah, that explains why they didn't use mine the last two years. And of course the refund takes twice as long now because I 'don't have PromptPay'. [emoji34]

Sent from my cell phone using Thaivisa mobile app

[ChouDoufu]

**UPDATE**

 

applied for refund online saturday, today (thursday)

got an SMS to check status.  the main page will lead

you to   http://www.rd.go.th/publish/27942.0.html

where you can access your file.

 

file had a message that i needed to upload some documents:

withholding statements, passport, and work permit.  could mail

in, fax in or upload online.  you must turn off your popup blocker

for the upload files popup window.

 

uploaded all the files (copy of visa instead of work permit) and

checked status again.  new message says files received, must

be checked.  gave a telephone number to call if any questions.

[ChouDoufu]

**UPDATE v2.0**

 

applied for tax refund online march 05

uploaded required documents march 08

application approved, check cut march 22

refund check received march 23

 

 

[Crisu]

**UPDATE v2.0**
 
applied for tax refund online march 05
uploaded required documents march 08
application approved, check cut march 22
refund check received march 23
 
 

Did you also applied for your thai tax no. online?

[ChouDoufu]

doubt it's possible to get tax number online.

went in person to tax office. 

very easy.....with translator assisting.

fill in form.  provide copy of passport and visa.

took maybe five minutes.

[ChouDoufu]

**UPDATE v2.1**

 

SMS sent from tax office to notify refund approved march 20

 

check covered refund for tax paid on fixed account

bank interest and tax paid on dividends.

[kiever]

On 3/3/2018 at 3:59 PM, ChouDoufu said:

***UPDATE***

 

after a couple weeks, the tax lady from lad phrao finally called us. 

she consulted with her lawyer who said i did not have to pay income

tax on savings brought into thailand.  good news.

 

more good news........okay to file for refund AND can file online.

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/300.0.html

 

went to the revenue department page, registered online using my new TIN. 

filled out the form 90 with help from a native speaker.    application was

accepted, and printed out a copy.  should receive a check at my home address.

can check status online in 3 days.

 

there is a link to english hidden at the bottom of the page.  this gets you to

downloadable forms and instructions in english:

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/56815.0.html

 

there was an option on the website for uploading a form OR using the

online thai system.  we opted to fill out the thai form online after filling

out and referencing the english form.

 

interest and dividends go in no. 3, section 40(4). there are two lines

where you choose type of income for 40(4).  the first one let us enter

dividends/interest for each payer along with the tax paid and payer tax id. 

there is a "+" icon at the bottom to add more payers.  the second 40(4)

option was for dividend payments directly from a thai corporation. 

tried that one first, could not get it to work.  after entering all interest

and dividends data, hit next and the system did all the calculations.

 

you must enter the taxpayer id of the payer.  online system lets you add

entries for each payer. not sure you would handle that with the paper or

uploadable versions, as there is only one payer id space for all the possible

sources of income within no. 3.

 

only hiccup was the final check.  form was not accepted unless filled out

lines for "company" and "website."  those could not be left blank.

i used " เกษียณ " and "www.nowebsite.com"

Hello friend. When I read your post I smile because I had exactly same experience yesterday. 

[kiever]

On 3/23/2018 at 12:10 PM, ChouDoufu said:

**UPDATE v2.1**

 

SMS sent from tax office to notify refund approved march 20

 

check covered refund for tax paid on fixed account

bank interest and tax paid on dividends.

Did you fill pnd90 form or another form to get withheld tax ? I think it should be standard pnd90 form for using personal income tax return ? You have no other income and only filled pnd90 form to claim tax return ? I will do same for next year also. I Just want to be sure. Very difficult to explain myself in local tax office. I think it is the best way to fill pnd90 online and wait until you get your refund cheque or tax office want you to upload something extra. 
 

and  taxpayer id of the payer is tax number of your bank ?

[ChouDoufu]

4 hours ago, kiever said:

taxpayer id of the payer is tax number of your bank ?

taxpayer id is the number you receive when you visit your local tax office and apply for a taxpayer identification number (TIN).  

 

if i recall, you need only your passport when you apply.  some have reported difficulty obtaining a TIN card, but no problem in bangkapi.  if they ask why, tell them you need to pay tax on your interest and dividends.

[kiever]

2 hours ago, ChouDoufu said:

taxpayer id is the number you receive when you visit your local tax office and apply for a taxpayer identification number (TIN).  

 

if i recall, you need only your passport when you apply.  some have reported difficulty obtaining a TIN card, but no problem in bangkapi.  if they ask why, tell them you need to pay tax on your interest and dividends.

thank you for your answer. i have tax id already (TIN)
this is pnd90 form below . in this section i marked as red, i should write my tax id also ?
i have 4000 baht interest for example and 600 baht withhelding .so i should fill like that ? 
you also used same pnd90 form ?

[ChouDoufu]

15 minutes ago, kiever said:

thank you for your answer. i have tax id already (TIN)
this is pnd90 form below . in this section i marked as red, i should write my tax id also ?
i have 4000 baht interest for example and 600 baht withhelding .so i should fill like that ? 
you also used same pnd90 form ?

you are the taxpayer.  enter your TIN.

well, i assume that's what they mean here.

(unless 'payer' means the institution that payed you interest, but that seems unlikely as there could be multiple payers)

 

***wait, what's that note below???***

"able to save payer numbers the only one that pays the most (according to the withholding tax certificate)"

 

okay, now that looks like you enter the TIN for the bank or other institution that paid you the largest amount, which you would find on the tax certificate.

 

 

that looks correct to me, but i'm no expert.

didn't file last year, seems to have been some changes to the form.  i don't recall the interest/dividends section being so clear, rather it was hidden within a half-page wall of confusing text.

[kiever]

thank you so much for your time and answers.

[ChouDoufu]

 

"able to save payer numbers the only one that pays the most (according to the withholding tax certificate)"

 

okay, now that looks like you enter the TIN for the bank or other institution that paid you the largest amount, which you would find on the tax certificate.

 

[YT3k72Em]

Oh, the form is in English this year?  I think it was only Thai last year.

[kiever]

not english but you can use google translate and keep your thai girlfriend with you to translate popups

[YT3k72Em]

Ahh... you got my hopes up that it was in English.  Anyway, there is an app too for people who have simple tax returns, you can do it all in the app.  Named RDSmartTax which does support English, but is missing some of the options on the website.

 

[Stese]

Can tax on a monthly paying interest account not be stopped at source. I thought it could, providing you are under the 20k interest earnt threshold. But i am struggling to get my bank to do this.

 

I have a tax ID and papers from the local revenue office.

 

My bank will give me a breakdown of interest earnt which i then take to the revenue office who process the claim manually but it would be better for me if it was done at source!

[Sophon]

13 minutes ago, Stese said:

Can tax on a monthly paying interest account not be stopped at source. I thought it could, providing you are under the 20k interest earnt threshold. But i am struggling to get my bank to do this.

 

I have a tax ID and papers from the local revenue office.

 

My bank will give me a breakdown of interest earnt which i then take to the revenue office who process the claim manually but it would be better for me if it was done at source!

Tax can be stopped at source on savings accounts, but not on fixed deposits. What bank and account type do you have?

[Pib]

17 minutes ago, Stese said:

Can tax on a monthly paying interest account not be stopped at source. I thought it could, providing you are under the 20k interest earnt threshold. But i am struggling to get my bank to do this.

 

I have a tax ID and papers from the local revenue office.

 

My bank will give me a breakdown of interest earnt which i then take to the revenue office who process the claim manually but it would be better for me if it was done at source!

Yes, tax withholding on interest paid monthly can be stopped just like semi-annual or annual.   My Krungsri MTD acct pays interest monthly and was withholding tax monthly also "until I provided them my Thai tax ID number" which immediately stopped the tax withholding.   

 

Edit: now if your acct is a "fixed" savings acct then the 15% tax withholding will occur with or without Thai tax ID number on file...and even for amounts far under Bt20K interest earned per year.  But fixed accts are normally 3 months and longer so since you said your interest is being paid monthly I expect you have a non-fixed acct.