Canceled Work Permit, But Didn't Cancel Visa Extension

[bibide]

On November 1st of 2012, I was fired from my job. After being fired I was told that they would keep my work permit active until November 30th. However, when I went to immigration on December 1st, I found out that the company had canceled my work permit 2 weeks prior, and I was technically on overstay. Typically, I would have had to pay for 1 week overstay, as I believe you are given a 7 day grace period to leave the country. I explained my situation to the immigration officer there, and was informed that I should cancel my visa, but it would be dangerous, as if I am stopped by the cops upon leaving their office, I could face jail time. So instead, the immigration officer told me they would look the other way, and they would forget that they ever say me. They said I would be ok with just my extension stamp as it's valid till April 2013. Also, since being fired, I have not done the 90 days check in, and it is well overdue.

It's a complicated situation, and I have a flight out of the country in a few weeks. Here are my questions:

1. Are the work permit and visa extension tied to each other in an electronic record, i.e. will they flag my passport as having a canceled work permit at immigration when I'm at the airport?

2. My gf (non-Thai) just spoke to a consultancy about this situation, and they advised that I should do a 90 days report before my flight. My visa was issued by the BOI, and I'm currently in Chiang Mai, so that would mean a trip to Immigration at Chamchuri Square in BKK (the place that told me they would look the other way about canceling my visa/extension).

I'm worried that if I go do the 90 days, they would flag me as having a canceled work permit, and problems would arise. So, should I do the 90 days, or just wait till I get to the airport and sort it out there?

It's a mess, any advice would be much appreciated.

[Lite Beer]

Your overstay starts on the day your employment ends.

You are not given 7 days grace.

I will leave the rest to others who know about these things.

[PoorSucker]

There is no 7 day grace period, you can apply for 7 day extension.

You are on overstay, 500 baht/day, maximum 20.000 baht.

[lopburi3]

Actually your extension of stay ended the day your employment ended and you were required to cancel it with immigration that day. BOI does normally allow 7 days to leave but that is not the normal case for those not using that office (only if you apply for an extension of stay are you allowed that time). As to will you be found out you may or may not. But if you are and it is found when your employment ended you will be overstay from that date.

[bibide]

Your overstay starts on the day your employment ends.

You are not given 7 days grace.

I will leave the rest to others who know about these things.

There is no 7 day grace period, you can apply for 7 day extension.

You are on overstay, 500 baht/day, maximum 20.000 baht.

Thanks for the replies. My visa was issued from the BOI, I was informed by the officers that there is a 7 day grace period to arrange your exit. However, the grace period is not my primary concern -- it's whether or not the wp and visa extension are linked electronically.

[PoorSucker]

Thanks for the replies. My visa was issued from the BOI, I was informed by the officers that there is a 7 day grace period to arrange your exit. However, the grace period is not my primary concern -- it's whether or not the wp and visa extension are linked electronically.

Because it was issued by BOI, I suspect they cancelled your visa at the same time.

Normally it takes labour handles WP and Immigrations extensions.

[whybother]

Re: 90 day reporting, in the past, if you exit the country after the 90-day due date, they don't care. They only care when you actually do your 90-day report if you are late.

I am not sure if that has changed recently or not.

[Mario2008]

They do care, but when you exit the country it is normally not cheked if you did your 90 day report or not.

[IMA_FARANG]

Well, here;s the thing.

You came into Thailand on a VISA which you recieved at a Thai consulate somewhere.

That got you into Thailand.

Then you got a job and that visa was EXTENDED, maybe for a year, because of your job and that work permit,

You did NOT get a new visa with that Work Permit and that job, you recieved an extension of the visa you had then.

Therefore, when you left that job and the extension of the visa you had based on that job ended .... no matter that it says it is good until sometime later.

Bottom line .... your extension was based on your job and validated by your work permit, Job ended, visa EXTENSION also ended,

So technically you are on overstay the day after your job ended.

When did your original visa .... the one you got to enter into Thailand actually end? There should be a date on it, If that date is past .... not the date it was extended until, but the date on the original visa ... then you're on overstay from that date,

Will they notice it at departure immigration?

I just don't know .... but my gut instinct would say they will notice it.

I believe, but i don't know for certain, that these days the the visa exrension and your work permit will be linked in the computer records.

You may be lucky and get away with not paying .... but I would be ready to pay the 20K Baht overstay fee.

Perhaps the immigration official at the airport will not be paying attention ... he or she is busy ... and he or she misses it,

But I expect you're going to have to pay overstay.

What is critical is if that original visa is still valid or not. Not the extension you recieved but the original visa that brought you into Thailand.

If that visa is still valid .... then you're NOT on overstay, If your original visa is still valid, you're sill here legally.

But if it is past it's expiration date .... you're on overstay.

[visarunner]

When is the extension officially finished and do you have a multiple re-entry?

[Spoonman]

Well, here;s the thing.

You came into Thailand on a VISA which you recieved at a Thai consulate somewhere.

That got you into Thailand.

Then you got a job and that visa was EXTENDED, maybe for a year, because of your job and that work permit,

You did NOT get a new visa with that Work Permit and that job, you recieved an extension of the visa you had then.

Therefore, when you left that job and the extension of the visa you had based on that job ended .... no matter that it says it is good until sometime later.

Bottom line .... your extension was based on your job and validated by your work permit, Job ended, visa EXTENSION also ended,

So technically you are on overstay the day after your job ended.

When did your original visa .... the one you got to enter into Thailand actually end? There should be a date on it, If that date is past .... not the date it was extended until, but the date on the original visa ... then you're on overstay from that date,

Will they notice it at departure immigration?

I just don't know .... but my gut instinct would say they will notice it.

I believe, but i don't know for certain, that these days the the visa exrension and your work permit will be linked in the computer records.

You may be lucky and get away with not paying .... but I would be ready to pay the 20K Baht overstay fee.

Perhaps the immigration official at the airport will not be paying attention ... he or she is busy ... and he or she misses it,

But I expect you're going to have to pay overstay.

What is critical is if that original visa is still valid or not. Not the extension you recieved but the original visa that brought you into Thailand.

If that visa is still valid .... then you're NOT on overstay, If your original visa is still valid, you're sill here legally.

But if it is past it's expiration date .... you're on overstay.

Visa's are not extended.

[whybother]

Well, here;s the thing.

You came into Thailand on a VISA which you recieved at a Thai consulate somewhere.

That got you into Thailand.

Then you got a job and that visa was EXTENDED, maybe for a year, because of your job and that work permit,

You did NOT get a new visa with that Work Permit and that job, you recieved an extension of the visa you had then.

Therefore, when you left that job and the extension of the visa you had based on that job ended .... no matter that it says it is good until sometime later.

Bottom line .... your extension was based on your job and validated by your work permit, Job ended, visa EXTENSION also ended,

So technically you are on overstay the day after your job ended.

When did your original visa .... the one you got to enter into Thailand actually end? There should be a date on it, If that date is past .... not the date it was extended until, but the date on the original visa ... then you're on overstay from that date,

Will they notice it at departure immigration?

I just don't know .... but my gut instinct would say they will notice it.

I believe, but i don't know for certain, that these days the the visa exrension and your work permit will be linked in the computer records.

You may be lucky and get away with not paying .... but I would be ready to pay the 20K Baht overstay fee.

Perhaps the immigration official at the airport will not be paying attention ... he or she is busy ... and he or she misses it,

But I expect you're going to have to pay overstay.

What is critical is if that original visa is still valid or not. Not the extension you recieved but the original visa that brought you into Thailand.

If that visa is still valid .... then you're NOT on overstay, If your original visa is still valid, you're sill here legally.

But if it is past it's expiration date .... you're on overstay.

You're on overstay from when the work permit was cancelled, not from when the original visa ended.

Otherwise people might be on 10 years overstay if their work permit was cancelled.

[Mario2008]

What is critical is if that original visa is still valid or not. Not the extension you recieved but the original visa that brought you into Thailand.

If that visa is still valid .... then you're NOT on overstay, If your original visa is still valid, you're sill here legally.

But if it is past it's expiration date .... you're on overstay.

One can have a valid visa and an extension of stay. In that case the extension of stay is invalidated and you would need to leave the country or be on overstay, but the visa itself might still be valid and one could re-enter on that.

[whybother]

Visa's are not extended.

"Extension of Stay" ... "Visa Extension" ... same thing isn't it?

[Tywais]

Visa's are not extended.

"Extension of Stay" ... "Visa Extension" ... same thing isn't it?

When you enter you are given a permission to stay stamp based on the visa. That (permission to stay) is what is getting extended not the Visa. AFAIK

[Mario2008]

Visa's are not extended.

"Extension of Stay" ... "Visa Extension" ... same thing isn't it?

In layman terms, yes. But in reality it are two different things and using the wrong term is confusing and can lead to wrong advise.

A visa is never extended.

[monty]

Visa's are not extended.

"Extension of Stay" ... "Visa Extension" ... same thing isn't it?

Not necessarily, one can get an extension while not having a visa at all.

For most Western countries you have a "visa exempt" stay of 30 days so you get only a permit to stay until stamp.

The terminology is actually quite confusing for the uninitiated, so we try to use the proper terms whenever possible.

And basically immigration give you a permission to stay based on your visa (if you have one), and it is the stay which gets extended, not the visa.

[monty]

And to the OP.

Immigration records are not electronically linked to the labor department. Unless at the one stop center an employee from labor immediately informed an officer of immigration. So no guarantees in your case whether immigration has your records from employment or not.

However, even if immigration is not electronically updated, the officer at the border might very well notice that your extension is based on employment, your permission of stay is still a few months valid and you do not hold a re-entry permit. In this case he will likely ask you if you forgot your re-entry as you will lose your extension and non immigrant status by leaving the country. Once questions are getting asked, it will likely become clear to the officer something is not correct!

Additionally, if you plan on ever coming back to work in Thailand, on subsequent WP applications and/or extension applications it might become clear your previous stay/departure has not been handled properly and may create problems then.

The normal procedure would be to go to immigration, do 90 day reporting (with or without late fines), cancel your stay and pay overstay fines. In such cases immigration will also charge you a 1900 Baht extension fee, after which you will have 7 days to leave the country.

[Colabamumbai]

I do not believe that they are connected, many people in your situation, job has finished, but visa stamp shows validity.

Immigration and Labour are two different organizations, like brother and sister, but I don't think that they are having sex with each other (sharing Information). You may not pay a fine, just keep your fingers crossed and enough cash to pay an overstay fine, if they feel that you have overstayed.

[bibide]

When is the extension officially finished and do you have a multiple re-entry?

The extension expires in April of this year. Yes, I have a multiple entry stamp.

And to the OP. Immigration records are not electronically linked to the labor department. Unless at the one stop center an employee from labor immediately informed an officer of immigration. So no guarantees in your case whether immigration has your records from employment or not. However, even if immigration is not electronically updated, the officer at the border might very well notice that your extension is based on employment, your permission of stay is still a few months valid and you do not hold a re-entry permit. In this case he will likely ask you if you forgot your re-entry as you will lose your extension and non immigrant status by leaving the country. Once questions are getting asked, it will likely become clear to the officer something is not correct! Additionally, if you plan on ever coming back to work in Thailand, on subsequent WP applications and/or extension applications it might become clear your previous stay/departure has not been handled properly and may create problems then. The normal procedure would be to go to immigration, do 90 day reporting (with or without late fines), cancel your stay and pay overstay fines. In such cases immigration will also charge you a 1900 Baht extension fee, after which you will have 7 days to leave the country.

Yeah, I've decided to just see what happens at immigration in the airport. Gonna just smile, wear a Thai t-shirt, and keep the fingers firmly crossed! At Immigration in Bangkok, they also informed me that I might have problems if I wanted to work again in Thailand. I really have no qualms with that, as my plan now is simply to exit the country gracefully and cheaply.

I do not believe that they are connected, many people in your situation, job has finished, but visa stamp shows validity. Immigration and Labour are two different organizations, like brother and sister, but I don't think that they are having sex with each other (sharing Information). You may not pay a fine, just keep your fingers crossed and enough cash to pay an overstay fine, if they feel that you have overstayed.

That's a bit relieving to hear. Gonna prepare just to be safe.

[PoorSucker]

Please report back for future reference.

[bibide]

Please report back for future reference.

I know this is an old thread, but just in case somebody in the future needs some info: I was able to leave the country without issue. I'm not sure about the situation if I were to return to Thailand, as it's more strict.

Anywho, YMMV.