Another Approach To Consider: Intermittent Fasting, Etc.

[Jingthing]

Definitely food for thought:

http://io9.com/59795...le-bit-each-day

Personally, I would be concerned that fasting would backfire and slow down my already slow metabolism. But I could be wrong as these are some different approaches to just plain old fashioned fasting. These fasting ideas are more sophisticated.

We've been told since we were children that we need to eat three square meals a day. But new research shows that we don't need to be eating throughout the course of the day. And in fact, it might even be undermining our health. These insights have given rise to what's known as "intermittent fasting" — the daily restriction of meals and caloric intake. Here's why some health experts believe you should starve yourself just a little bit each day.

These ideas are not really so much for LOSING weight, but they may be of interest for people who have already lost weight, trying to fight the odds of gaining it back.

[robblok]

There are even a lot of bodybuilders that swear by intermittent fasting, read about it on bodybuilding forums. There is a lot of good information (and crap) about weight-loss there. Often a lot of info can be found there as there there are a lot of people combined willing to go to lengths to stay and become lean.

Anyway i have not really looked deep into it because it did not appeal to me. That does not mean i don't believe it.

[Jingthing]

I think its interesting and if I ever manage to get to a decent weight, I'd consider it. But right now I'm kind of convinced that the best thing I can do is not let my body think I'm starving it so it doesn't go into "desert famine survival mode", to keep the metabolism happening at some level throughout the day. I could be wrong of course.

[robblok]

I think its interesting and if I ever manage to get to a decent weight, I'd consider it. But right now I'm kind of convinced that the best thing I can do is not let my body think I'm starving it so it doesn't go into "desert famine survival mode", to keep the metabolism happening at some level throughout the day. I could be wrong of course.

JT because i was always worried about that too i did some research into it. There were some tests in the military (can't go that extreme on civilians) and it proved it was real hard to get into that desert famine survival mode. If i have time i look it up, the starvation mode was something that always scared the hell out of me.

[kurnell]

I fast most days between 6pm and 7am and it does nothing for me

[robblok]

http://fitnessblackbook.com/main/starvation-mode-why-you-probably-never-need-to-worry-about-it/

[Jingthing]

I think its interesting and if I ever manage to get to a decent weight, I'd consider it. But right now I'm kind of convinced that the best thing I can do is not let my body think I'm starving it so it doesn't go into "desert famine survival mode", to keep the metabolism happening at some level throughout the day. I could be wrong of course.

JT because i was always worried about that too i did some research into it. There were some tests in the military (can't go that extreme on civilians) and it proved it was real hard to get into that desert famine survival mode. If i have time i look it up, the starvation mode was something that always scared the hell out of me.

Well that's a bit literal but interesting. What I meant more broadly is that based on my experience at my current calorie/exercise level I managed to lose 5 pounds this month. Based on my past, my body will just adjust to what I have been doing, and a few months from now, the SAME calorie/exercise level will cause NO weight loss and maybe even weight gain. In other words, a vicious cycle that ends up being not sustainable and another FAIL. In my experience, that's why I remain terribly pessimistic about ever succeeding in satisfying weight loss. I'm trying again because of the gimmick I talked about in the other thread. If that really works in the long run, it would be almost miraculous given my history (metabolism/thyroid, etc.) but it seems worth a try.

[robblok]

JT that tems from the misconception that fat does not burn a thing, at your lower bodyweight you also need lower calories. You are lugging around less weight and burn less. But if you are really worried about starvation mode (as i once was) you could try calorie cycling (think you will love it) You don't have to count your calories but its better though.

Basically it means keeping your body guessing having a few low food days and then a high food day (making sure of course that that one high food day is not so high it cancels all the low food days).

But I really really understand your concerns as it is one of my bigger concerns too though after reading a lot about it I could not find real data about it.

It is true however that your body likes a state of homo stasis (meaning no change), so a good thing is if you can keep being a certain weight it will become your new set point (i need to read more into that)

[NeverSure]

JT that tems from the misconception that fat does not burn a thing, at your lower bodyweight you also need lower calories. You are lugging around less weight and burn less. But if you are really worried about starvation mode (as i once was) you could try calorie cycling (think you will love it) You don't have to count your calories but its better though.

Basically it means keeping your body guessing having a few low food days and then a high food day (making sure of course that that one high food day is not so high it cancels all the low food days).

But I really really understand your concerns as it is one of my bigger concerns too though after reading a lot about it I could not find real data about it.

It is true however that your body likes a state of homo stasis (meaning no change), so a good thing is if you can keep being a certain weight it will become your new set point (i need to read more into that)

Is it possible that we have different metabolisms, and that what works for me might not work for someone else? I sure don't know.

I've been dieting and losing since about the first of September. I've posted before that I'm not allowed to exercise yet due to an injury which will heal just fine. So I eat (I am now up to) 1600 calories a day which will be less than my burn rate just to maintain life. So I lose. Then after about 4 or 5 days I get weak. I mean, my mind won't think and my body is weak and I am cold and so on. So then I blast myself with fat and carbs including sugar. Even if it's a peanut butter and jelly sandwich and a glass of milk. Even if that's two meals in a row because the first didn't fix it, I do it. Or, I go out for a meal and eat something that does the same.

Then I snap out of it and feel just fine and can diet again for a few days. In about 5 months with no exercise I've lost almost 25 pounds and 5 inches off my waist. I've had to put on smaller pants and belt and shirts. (I lose weight all over, not just in one place.)

I'll mention again that I take a testosterone supplement because I needed it. Without it I don't think I'd burn fat as well.

I'm in no hurry because this must last. I don't want to go to this effort only to gain it all back. But I'm dropping about a pound a week without ever suffering. I started on 1300 calories and that worked for a couple of months but eventually I ran out of steam on it. I had to learn that I need 1600 (for me) to not feel hungry all the time.

I hope we are all successful. There is daylight at the end of the tunnel, I hope.

[robblok]

I believe we are all different within a certain range. I believe i have read somewhere there is a 20% difference between the high metabolism people and the low ones. Day on day year on year that is a lot.

Also your testosterone supplement will help a lot for sure.

Anyway i am eating around 1800-2000 cals to loose weight i do exercise a lot too.

But i do believe some people respond different to some things, i am not sure there is a one thing for all. Sure there are of course basic guidelines and nobody will loose weight if they totally go against it.

[tropo]

There are even a lot of bodybuilders that swear by intermittent fasting, read about it on bodybuilding forums. There is a lot of good information (and crap) about weight-loss there. Often a lot of info can be found there as there there are a lot of people combined willing to go to lengths to stay and become lean.

Anyway i have not really looked deep into it because it did not appeal to me. That does not mean i don't believe it.

I don't think there's many bodybuilders who use intermittent fasting. I would bet no successful bodybuilders use it. I think the number was exaggerated recently because the guy who wrote a book about it started a thread on it in bodybuilding.com to promote it and it is in it's second 10,000 post run already. That's not difficult to do if you continue to reply in your own thread.

It just makes sense that it's much easier for the body to digest and absorb essential nutrients and protein if the consumption thereof is spaced out. Eating big heavy meals can leave you lethargic and can/will upset your digestive system.

[tropo]

I fast most days between 6pm and 7am and it does nothing for me

I usually fast for 10 hours per day minimum - at least 1 hour on each side of an 8 hour sleep.

[Valentine]

I have done a couple of fasting, detox programmes & come out the other side feeling great along with good weight loss. Unfortunately the weight went back on. My feeling now is that weight loss has to be slow & steady, basically to fool the body into getting used to lower weights. There is an interesting documentary on BBC Horizon called "Eat, Fast, Live Longer" which has an interesting concept towards fasting & better health.

[robblok]

There are even a lot of bodybuilders that swear by intermittent fasting, read about it on bodybuilding forums. There is a lot of good information (and crap) about weight-loss there. Often a lot of info can be found there as there there are a lot of people combined willing to go to lengths to stay and become lean.

Anyway i have not really looked deep into it because it did not appeal to me. That does not mean i don't believe it.

I don't think there's many bodybuilders who use intermittent fasting. I would bet no successful bodybuilders use it. I think the number was exaggerated recently because the guy who wrote a book about it started a thread on it in bodybuilding.com to promote it and it is in it's second 10,000 post run already. That's not difficult to do if you continue to reply in your own thread.

It just makes sense that it's much easier for the body to digest and absorb essential nutrients and protein if the consumption thereof is spaced out. Eating big heavy meals can leave you lethargic and can/will upset your digestive system.

Tropo in this case i give in easy because i really don't know but there are other sites not bodybuilding dot com where they also discuss it a lot. I have real opinion about it because i have never tried it or read about the science (or not) behind it.

Your reasoning does counter some of your other reasoning that our body does not needs its food every 3 hours and is build to last and now your saying it works better if it is spaced out. Like i said i have no clear opinion about it as i haven't read enough about it.

[Tolley]

I am not a believer in intermitent fasting.

Smaller meals regularly spaced is a better approach.

Not eating for long periods leads to hypoglycemic problems. If you dont eat a proper breakfast you end up getting hypo. leading to agitation and mood swings etc.

Low blood sugar is a big undiagnosed problem with many people who eat irregularly and who dont eat a proper balanced diet.

[tropo]

Your reasoning does counter some of your other reasoning that our body does not needs its food every 3 hours and is build to last and now your saying it works better if it is spaced out. Like i said i have no clear opinion about it as i haven't read enough about it.

Eating every 3 - 4 hours is fine. I mostly eat like that, but it's small meals over a 12 - 14 hour period. The rest of the day is the preparation for sleep, sleep and waking up. That's more than enough fasting in any 24 hour period.

[robblok]

Your reasoning does counter some of your other reasoning that our body does not needs its food every 3 hours and is build to last and now your saying it works better if it is spaced out. Like i said i have no clear opinion about it as i haven't read enough about it.

Eating every 3 - 4 hours is fine. I mostly eat like that, but it's small meals over a 12 - 14 hour period. The rest of the day is the preparation for sleep, sleep and waking up. That's more than enough fasting in any 24 hour period.

Anyway i eat 3 meals a day and i feel its enough, have never tried fasting or looked deep into it so i cant really say too much.

[wpcoe]

It appears that Google ad placement may have a warped sense of humor? The page from the OP link as it displayed for me:

[rbrooks]

There is a great documentary film, Fat, Sick and Nearly Dead. Jim, an Australian guy went on a vegetable juicing fast for 60 days filming the effort while taking a road trip across America. He interviewed several people along the way asking their opinions on diet and successfully lost over 100 pounds surviving on only Vegetable juice while being closely monitored by doctors. Prior to and during his journey he was taking several medications for blood pressure, cholesterol and he had a skin rash that erupted weekly over his body that no doctor was able to control or cure. Jim admitted he saw many doctors about his poor health and all they could do was prescribe medication. After completing his fast he was totally off all meds and changed his lifestyle to eating mainly fruits/vegetables and exercising on a regular basis. He even managed to help a Truck driver he met along his tour lose over 200 pounds and get off all his meds as well. The documentary stressed that processed foods and lack of exercise are the prime health killers of modern society. A fasting and total change of diet and exercise will get you on the right track. Jim was a futures trader/broker who admitted that he focused on making his wealth and through the years ignored his health setting him on a path of self destruction.

[Jingthing]

Yes that was an excellent little film. However, realistically most modern people would rather BE dead than live for the rest of their life solely on raw vegetable juices. Just saying. I think the answer for the masses has got to be more ... PALATABLE!

[Tolley]

Yes that was an excellent little film. However, realistically most modern people would rather BE dead than live for the rest of their life solely on raw vegetable juices. Just saying. I think the answer for the masses has got to be more ... PALATABLE!

It all depends on the person.

Some people see food as purely fuel for their body and get their kicks out of other things in life.

Other people live for food and love all the tastes sensations and food experiences life has to offer.

I am a big believer in the restorative properties of veggie juices. I regularly consumed a litre of carrot celery and beetroot juice for many years although I have stopped taking them out of laziness in the last few years. If you get run down or out of sorts veggie juices are fantastic for restoring vitality. I wouldnt recommend just veggie juices as i believe you still need protein in your diet.

[robblok]

Yes that was an excellent little film. However, realistically most modern people would rather BE dead than live for the rest of their life solely on raw vegetable juices. Just saying. I think the answer for the masses has got to be more ... PALATABLE!

It all depends on the person.

Some people see food as purely fuel for their body and get their kicks out of other things in life.

Other people live for food and love all the tastes sensations and food experiences life has to offer.

I am a big believer in the restorative properties of veggie juices. I regularly consumed a litre of carrot celery and beetroot juice for many years although I have stopped taking them out of laziness in the last few years. If you get run down or out of sorts veggie juices are fantastic for restoring vitality. I wouldnt recommend just veggie juices as i believe you still need protein in your diet.

Did you make it yourself.. or do you believe the stuff you can get here is good too ?

[Tolley]

Yes that was an excellent little film. However, realistically most modern people would rather BE dead than live for the rest of their life solely on raw vegetable juices. Just saying. I think the answer for the masses has got to be more ... PALATABLE!

It all depends on the person.

Some people see food as purely fuel for their body and get their kicks out of other things in life.

Other people live for food and love all the tastes sensations and food experiences life has to offer.

I am a big believer in the restorative properties of veggie juices. I regularly consumed a litre of carrot celery and beetroot juice for many years although I have stopped taking them out of laziness in the last few years. If you get run down or out of sorts veggie juices are fantastic for restoring vitality. I wouldnt recommend just veggie juices as i believe you still need protein in your diet.

Did you make it yourself.. or do you believe the stuff you can get here is good too ?

Juiced it myself. Use a cold press juicer as it keeps all the good enzymes in the veggies ie you basically hand press the juice much better than the machines. It is better if you can get organic veggies if possible. You should also munch the juice by swilling it around in your mouth for maximum benefit as it is better absorbed that way.

Dr Norman Walker was the king of vegetable juices who live to a ripe old age and championed the benefits of veggie juices. You can look up the benefits of veggie juices for different kind of ailments. It is especially good for weight loss and for Tropo there are many juices that can help regulate blood sugar levels. eg green been juice, broccoli, spinach, cranberry, tomato, even carrot which is a little high in sugar is supposed to be beneficial for blood sugar issues.

[tropo]

It all depends on the person.

Some people see food as purely fuel for their body and get their kicks out of other things in life.

Other people live for food and love all the tastes sensations and food experiences life has to offer.

I'm sure I'm not the only one in a 3rd group, who see food as fuel AND enjoy all the taste sensations as well. I aim for both - it doesn't have to be one or the other.

The only thing I consume daily which I don't like the taste of is a glass of kefir. Everything else must taste good.

Carrot juice and many other vegetable juices are not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. It's much better to eat the whole vegetable, and even then you have be careful with root vegetables.

This brings me to another issue - quality of life. I've given this a lot of thought over the years when reading about diabetics (in forums) who live on near zero carbohydrates in order to keep their blood sugar low without medication. If my condition was so bad that I couldn't handle even a small amount of carbs without medication I think I'd be happy enough to use the medication. My 82 year old mother does this and I wouldn't even suggest that she change her diet. I think the stress/distress of overhauling a lifetime diet which she considers is healthy would more likely kill her than help her.

[Tolley]

It all depends on the person.

Some people see food as purely fuel for their body and get their kicks out of other things in life.

Other people live for food and love all the tastes sensations and food experiences life has to offer.

I'm sure I'm not the only one in a 3rd group, who see food as fuel AND enjoy all the taste sensations as well. I aim for both - it doesn't have to be one or the other.

The only thing I consume daily which I don't like the taste of is a glass of kefir. Everything else must taste good.

Carrot juice and many other vegetable juices are not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. It's much better to eat the whole vegetable, and even then you have be careful with root vegetables.

This brings me to another issue - quality of life. I've given this a lot of thought over the years when reading about diabetics (in forums) who live on near zero carbohydrates in order to keep their blood sugar low without medication. If my condition was so bad that I couldn't handle even a small amount of carbs without medication I think I'd be happy enough to use the medication. My 82 year old mother does this and I wouldn't even suggest that she change her diet. I think the stress/distress of overhauling a lifetime diet which she considers is healthy would more likely kill her than help her.

Who recommends that you dont have veggie juices for glucose intolerance? BTW I think even watermelon which is high sugar is recommended for blood sugar issues.

One way for sure to find out is to test yourself I suppose.

[robblok]

It all depends on the person.

Some people see food as purely fuel for their body and get their kicks out of other things in life.

Other people live for food and love all the tastes sensations and food experiences life has to offer.

I'm sure I'm not the only one in a 3rd group, who see food as fuel AND enjoy all the taste sensations as well. I aim for both - it doesn't have to be one or the other.

The only thing I consume daily which I don't like the taste of is a glass of kefir. Everything else must taste good.

Carrot juice and many other vegetable juices are not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. It's much better to eat the whole vegetable, and even then you have be careful with root vegetables.

This brings me to another issue - quality of life. I've given this a lot of thought over the years when reading about diabetics (in forums) who live on near zero carbohydrates in order to keep their blood sugar low without medication. If my condition was so bad that I couldn't handle even a small amount of carbs without medication I think I'd be happy enough to use the medication. My 82 year old mother does this and I wouldn't even suggest that she change her diet. I think the stress/distress of overhauling a lifetime diet which she considers is healthy would more likely kill her than help her.

Who recommends that you dont have veggie juices for glucose intolerance? BTW I think even watermelon which is high sugar is recommended for blood sugar issues.

One way for sure to find out is to test yourself I suppose.

Falling of my chair laughing here, you got Tropo with his own tests (and of course i agree about testing)

Hmmm so getting the juice is quite a job, as im still not retired i will have to look into it now i spend as little time as possible on preparing food. I work, workout, and some other things but in my busy periods (once every fiscal quarter) i have hardly time to do anything else then work. Good thing my gym is in my home else i surely would not have time for that.I mainly buy loads of frozen veggies (got a big freezer) and frozen beef or chicken burgers), not to mention loads of frozen berries and yoghurt that keeps for 2 weeks and a few days. So i really minimize my shopping and food preparation times.

But i do enjoy what I eat, i love my oatmeal, love my yoghurt and even my burgers (na sauce of course and all grilled without oil) with veggies are good.

[tropo]

Who recommends that you dont have veggie juices for glucose intolerance? BTW I think even watermelon which is high sugar is recommended for blood sugar issues.

One way for sure to find out is to test yourself I suppose.

Anything high in sugar is not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. The reason is obvious - they shoot the blood sugar up high. Carrot juice and watermelon juice will both shoot blood sugar high.

[Tolley]

Who recommends that you dont have veggie juices for glucose intolerance? BTW I think even watermelon which is high sugar is recommended for blood sugar issues.

One way for sure to find out is to test yourself I suppose.

Anything high in sugar is not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. The reason is obvious - they shoot the blood sugar up high. Carrot juice and watermelon juice will both shoot blood sugar high.

Here is something from the Gerson Institute that might interest you.

They deal with alternative methods of treating cancer and other chronic conditions including diabetes primarily using organic cold pressed juices, supplements and low protein diet.

Here is an extract from their website.

A majority of people suffering from age‐onset diabetes are found to actually produce adequate levels of insulin. In other words, this disease is not caused by lack of or insufficient insulin.

It has been found that in those people who have adequate insulin, yet have diabetes, the problem is that their insulin is unable to be utilized in the cell, where it is needed, because the

insulin receptors in the cell are blocked by cholesterol.

With this in mind, the Gerson Therapy has been shown in some cases to be capable of overcoming the problem. The Therapy is:

1. Totally devoid of cholesterol (animal fats)

2. Capable of dissolving and reducing cholesterol deposits

3. Allowing the available insulin to reach the insulin receptors within each cell

It is unwise, if a patient is actually on insulin, to discontinue it immediately. As the Gerson Therapy becomes effective, insulin can be reduced, as shown by results in blood analyses. For those people who are using oral hypoglycemic medication, this will also need to be adjusted and blood sugar drops. It is important to monitor daily with a glucometer. The modifications below are applied to the protocol outlined in Chapter 19 pages 205 and 206 Table 19‐1 in the book

Healing the Gerson Way.

Initially fruit is avoided. The amount of potato may need to be reduced. In severe cases, the oatmeal has to be omitted for the first few days, and raw salads, Gerson soup, etc. has to be used for breakfast.

 The apple is eliminated from the carrot juice and the number of carrot juices is reduced, and those juices are replaced by the green juices (see book).

 For example, instead of the usual five 8‐z. glasses of carrot juice, use only three. Three or 4 green juices with a small amount of apple, if needed for taste, can be added. With the morning fruit juice this will make a total of 7 or 8 juices to start.

 Instead of orange juice at breakfast, use grapefruit juice which contains less sugar.

 The thyroid, Lugols’s and potassium are taken in reduced amounts. No more than 1 grain of thyroid, 2-3 drops of Lugol’s and 1 tsp of potassium in each juice, if not contraindicated for other reasons. It is also recommended to add 3 capsules of 200 mcg chromium picolinate or GTF chromium a day with meals. Take one with each meal. This can be reduced usually within a week or two when blood sugar lowers and remains stable.

 As blood sugar reaches a normal level, return to apple/carrot juices and the regular Therapy, including oatmeal with fruit for breakfast and also orange juice. Avoid dried fruit and bananas for a longer period of time.

This information does not take the place of the advice of your medical doctors. If the condition is severe and has existed for some time, it is recommended to start the Therapy under the supervision of a Gerson trained physician or visit the Gerson clinic. Once a patient has been started on dialysis, the Gerson Therapy cannot be used.

[tropo]

Anything high in sugar is not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. The reason is obvious - they shoot the blood sugar up high. Carrot juice and watermelon juice will both shoot blood sugar high.

Here is something from the Gerson Institute that might interest you.

They deal with alternative methods of treating cancer and other chronic conditions including diabetes primarily using organic cold pressed juices, supplements and low protein diet.

Here is an extract from their website.

A majority of people suffering from age‐onset diabetes are found to actually produce adequate levels of insulin. In other words, this disease is not caused by lack of or insufficient insulin.

It has been found that in those people who have adequate insulin, yet have diabetes, the problem is that their insulin is unable to be utilized in the cell, where it is needed, because the

insulin receptors in the cell are blocked by cholesterol.

I started to read it, but I was turned off after reading the introduction:

"A majority of people suffering from age‐onset diabetes are found to actually produce adequate levels of insulin. In other words, this disease is not caused by lack of or insufficient insulin.

It has been found that in those people who have adequate insulin, yet have diabetes, the problem is that their insulin is unable to be utilized in the cell, where it is needed, because the

insulin receptors in the cell are blocked by cholesterol."

It is well known that people suffering from "age-onset diabetes" are normally producing a lot of insulin. This is nothing groundbreaking and I'm sure most diabetics know this (or they should). Obviously their insulin production is still not enough though, because their cells are insulin resistant. This is where an insulin-c-peptide test is important in many cases, in order to ascertain whether the person is producing enough insulin.

It's actually an over-production of insulin to cope with insulin resistance that causes overuse and ultimately damage to the insulin producing cells of the pancreas. It's a viscous circle which can only be corrected by addressing the insulin resistance.

I don't know about cholesterol blocking insulin receptors, but I doubt that. My cholesterol levels are normal (total, HDL, LDL and VLDL) yet I have insulin resistance.

My main point in here was that people with pre-diabetes and diabetes should not be consuming high sugar vegetable juices to try to solve their problem. It will make it worse. By all means consume low sugar vegetable juices and test after consuming them. As long as a person can consume a juice and stay within a healthy blood sugar range, they may be beneficial. Personally I stay away from juices and consume the whole fruit and vegetables only.

If a person has cancer then natural methods may not work. What was the name of that Australian lecturer (PhD in environmental science) you introduced in another thread whose wife died of cancer because they refused any modern medical treatments?

[Tolley]

Anything high in sugar is not recommended for people with glucose intolerance. The reason is obvious - they shoot the blood sugar up high. Carrot juice and watermelon juice will both shoot blood sugar high.

Here is something from the Gerson Institute that might interest you.

They deal with alternative methods of treating cancer and other chronic conditions including diabetes primarily using organic cold pressed juices, supplements and low protein diet.

Here is an extract from their website.

A majority of people suffering from age‐onset diabetes are found to actually produce adequate levels of insulin. In other words, this disease is not caused by lack of or insufficient insulin.

It has been found that in those people who have adequate insulin, yet have diabetes, the problem is that their insulin is unable to be utilized in the cell, where it is needed, because the

insulin receptors in the cell are blocked by cholesterol.

I started to read it, but I was turned off after reading the introduction:

"A majority of people suffering from age‐onset diabetes are found to actually produce adequate levels of insulin. In other words, this disease is not caused by lack of or insufficient insulin.

It has been found that in those people who have adequate insulin, yet have diabetes, the problem is that their insulin is unable to be utilized in the cell, where it is needed, because the

insulin receptors in the cell are blocked by cholesterol."

It is well known that people suffering from "age-onset diabetes" are normally producing a lot of insulin. This is nothing groundbreaking and I'm sure most diabetics know this (or they should). Obviously their insulin production is still not enough though, because their cells are insulin resistant. This is where an insulin-c-peptide test is important in many cases, in order to ascertain whether the person is producing enough insulin.

It's actually an over-production of insulin to cope with insulin resistance that causes overuse and ultimately damage to the insulin producing cells of the pancreas. It's a viscous circle which can only be corrected by addressing the insulin resistance.

I don't know about cholesterol blocking insulin receptors, but I doubt that. My cholesterol levels are normal (total, HDL, LDL and VLDL) yet I have insulin resistance.

My main point in here was that people with pre-diabetes and diabetes should not be consuming high sugar vegetable juices to try to solve their problem. It will make it worse. By all means consume low sugar vegetable juices and test after consuming them. As long as a person can consume a juice and stay within a healthy blood sugar range, they may be beneficial. Personally I stay away from juices and consume the whole fruit and vegetables only.

If a person has cancer then natural methods may not work. What was the name of that Australian lecturer (PhD in environmental science) you introduced in another thread whose wife died of cancer because they refused any modern medical treatments?

I agree that it may be too late to use natural methods depending on the type of cancer and how far advanced it is etc.

Nonetheless the Gerson therapy is quite popular and can be effective and I assume they must know something about conditions like diabetes as well.

Dr Mercola's diabtetes treatment is probably more suitable for most people and has proved very effective. I think you read his blog which is based on avoiding grains and limiting carbs with higher protein etc etc which is what you do i think.

I posted this one because it seems interesting and they have had some success with cancer treatments although their regime is so strict most people could never stick to it. eg organic veggie juices 13 times a day with coffee enemas tree times a day and no animal protein or sugar etc for two years to be cured etc