Dozens Of Countries Aided U S Secret Detentions: Report

[SteeleJoe]

Making such remarks about Russia is very popular nowadays, but one simple fact we must not forget. For some years the U.S. has had the highest incarceration rate on the planet. Higher than the USSR ever had, higher than Russia now, higher than China, higher than Iran.

Not to defend, excuse, or explain that high incarceration rate but why compare incarceration to ILLEGAL detentions?

The high rate says certain things about the US, probably few or none them good but what does it have to do with Russia's history?

(By the way, I wasn't aware that it is "very popular nowadays" but when was it unpopular to do so? And is it wrong?)

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[wannascuba]

We can correctly criticize the overreaction of the USA and allies in response to 911. I certainly do. But to turn that justified criticism on it's head to justify SUPPORT of radical Islamic fundamentalist terrorism is a bridge WAY too far.

I concur

[BradinAsia]

What does the 4th Amendment have to do with enemy combatants captured on a foreign battlefield?

I'll you answer this question you"ll know the answer to yours:

What does kidnapping innocent people off the street have to do with enemy combatants?

Now that's a real head scratcher.. I won't respond other than to ask if your first word in your post was intended to be..."If"?

Yes, you are correct, it should have been "if" -- a senility induced type...

Edited February 7, 2013 by BradinAsia

[chuckd]

"Although I am not a U.S. citizen, I believe the U.S. government had the right and duty to destroy the people responsible, and organisation behind them, by any means possible."

I agree.

This quote is a misquote.

I did not and would not say such a ridiculous thing. This implies that the U.S. acts in good faith and respects human rights... who can believe that?

Permit me to 'splain this one. Your post, that Ulysses quoted, has only quotation marks around the offending statement with no reference to the original writer of the statement..

The original post was later deleted due to topic issues.

You did not say it originally, but it appears you did since you did not quote the original author.

Sorry to butt in but I remembered it from yesterday.

[Scott]

More off-topic posts deleted.

[BradinAsia]

"The world is in a state of perpetual war, a third world war. It is an economic and propaganda war, waged by transnational corporations, global financial institutions and national governments on the poor. This international war against the poor is real; but with enough courage and organization from the lower classes, it can be stopped. 911, the Occupy Movement, Anarchist actions, Worker's Strikes, Guerrilla Movements across India, Nepal, the Philippines are all symptoms of the disease of social injustice and inequality. The War on Terror will never be won until the War on Social Injustice is won."

+1

Very well said.

[BradinAsia]

Permit me to 'splain this one. Your post, that Ulysses quoted, has only quotation marks around the offending statement with no reference to the original writer of the statement..

The original post was later deleted due to topic issues.

You did not say it originally, but it appears you did since you did not quote the original author.

Sorry to butt in but I remembered it from yesterday.

Thanks, I quite understand.

[simple1]

"The world is in a state of perpetual war, a third world war. It is an economic and propaganda war, waged by transnational corporations, global financial institutions and national governments on the poor. This international war against the poor is real; but with enough courage and organization from the lower classes, it can be stopped. 911, the Occupy Movement, Anarchist actions, Worker's Strikes, Guerrilla Movements across India, Nepal, the Philippines are all symptoms of the disease of social injustice and inequality. The War on Terror will never be won until the War on Social Injustice is won."

+1

Very well said.

Idealistic crap. Extremist groups have nothing to do with social justice, but the attempt to gain power to implement their one & only true ideology & countenance no other. If they do gain power, they will in turn will become the "oppressor". Take a quick look at Iran and you will understand.

A great example of social justice. Killing, torture & imprisonment of comrades who are no longer considered to be the pure representatives of the group is de rigueur.

Edited February 7, 2013 by simple1

[SteeleJoe]

"The world is in a state of perpetual war, a third world war. It is an economic and propaganda war, waged by transnational corporations, global financial institutions and national governments on the poor. This international war against the poor is real; but with enough courage and organization from the lower classes, it can be stopped. 911, the Occupy Movement, Anarchist actions, Worker's Strikes, Guerrilla Movements across India, Nepal, the Philippines are all symptoms of the disease of social injustice and inequality. The War on Terror will never be won until the War on Social Injustice is won."

+1

Very well said.

Idealistic crap. Extremist groups have nothing to do with social justice, but the attempt to gain power to implement their one & only true ideology & countenance no other. If they do gain power, they will in turn will become the "oppressor". Take a quick look at Iran and you will understand.

A great example of social justice. Killing, torture & imprisonment of comrades who are no longer considered to be the pure representatives of the group is de rigueur.

I have spent quite a few years studying asymmetrical warfare - with an emphasis on radical Islamist movement- and I am a fairly serious student of modern history. As such, I have some opinions on the post from Bradinasia. But the fact is I'm exhausted and I'm not sure I need to add anything other than to say...

Simple1's post was one of my all time favorites.

Bravo.

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[Shantaram]

All States are founded on violence and terror or the threat of it.

“To be GOVERNED is to be watched, inspected, spied upon, directed, law-driven, numbered, regulated, enrolled, indoctrinated, preached at, controlled, checked, estimated, valued, censured, commanded, by creatures who have neither the right nor the wisdom nor the virtue to do so. To be GOVERNED is to be at every operation, at every transaction noted, registered, counted, taxed, stamped, measured, numbered, assessed, licensed, authorized, admonished, prevented, forbidden, reformed, corrected, punished. It is, under pretext of public utility, and in the name of the general interest, to be place under contribution, drilled, fleeced, exploited, monopolized, extorted from, squeezed, hoaxed, robbed; then, at the slightest resistance, the first word of complaint, to be repressed, fined, vilified, harassed, hunted down, abused, clubbed, disarmed, bound, choked, imprisoned, judged, condemned, shot, deported, sacrificed, sold, betrayed; and to crown all, mocked, ridiculed, derided, outraged, dishonored. That is government; that is its justice; that is its morality." ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon

Never heard of this man so looked him up. The thinkers who he claimed were the main influences on his political philosophy contributed to Marxism, including Marx himself - His idealism didn't quite work out did it?

Proudhon was a founder of modern Anarchism along with Bakunin and Kropotkin. Anarchist theory and praxis are seeing a resurgence in popularity in the 21st Century as an alternative to the monstrous slavery brought about by Marxist State Control and the terrible injustice bred from Capitalism.

"Sociialism without Freedom is Slavery, Freedom without Socialism is Injustice".

Anarchists have been, and are, in the forefront of the great struggle of humanity for freedom and justice against the twin headed hydra of Communism and Capitalism.

Now, getting back to the point... and my point was that ALL States base their power on terror or the threat of terror. Only a hypocrite could argue that any nation state is worthy of taking the moral high ground against non state terrorists and justify their torture whether through proxies (in the case of the USA and Thailand) or not. Unfortunately, the people who will suffer in this misconceived and absurd War on Terror are expats like us (for example in the recent Algerian Hostage Crisis). Given our situation we are bound to take sides in order to protect ourselves, however that does not obviate the need to see through the lies and propaganda of our rulers and face the consequences of the historical actions of the nation states from which many of us have fled in search of a better life.

[Scott]

Some interesting, but off-topic posts have been removed. This thread is about the countries that aided the US. That seems to have been missed in the last 4 pages.

[HeijoshinCool]

Some people are obviously demented. To actually believe the Iraq was attacked for the oil is way out of reason. The cost of that war exceeded the value of all the oil in Iraq. Be an American basher if you want but try to be somewhat logical.

And I'll bet the profits made by American weapons manufacturers exceeded both.

[BradinAsia]

"The world is in a state of perpetual war, a third world war. It is an economic and propaganda war, waged by transnational corporations, global financial institutions and national governments on the poor. This international war against the poor is real; but with enough courage and organization from the lower classes, it can be stopped. 911, the Occupy Movement, Anarchist actions, Worker's Strikes, Guerrilla Movements across India, Nepal, the Philippines are all symptoms of the disease of social injustice and inequality. The War on Terror will never be won until the War on Social Injustice is won."

+1

Very well said.

Idealistic crap. Extremist groups have nothing to do with social justice, but the attempt to gain power to implement their one & only true ideology & countenance no other. If they do gain power, they will in turn will become the "oppressor". Take a quick look at Iran and you will understand.

A great example of social justice. Killing, torture & imprisonment of comrades who are no longer considered to be the pure representatives of the group is de rigueur.

I have spent quite a few years studying asymmetrical warfare - with an emphasis on radical Islamist movement- and I am a fairly serious student of modern history. As such, I have some opinions on the post from Bradinasia. But the fact is I'm exhausted and I'm not sure I need to add anything other than to say...

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SteeleJoe,

I'm not sure which post of mine you are referring to, but in the one you quote here the only part that is mine is the +1 and "Very well said." The other part is not mine.

[SteeleJoe]

"The world is in a state of perpetual war, a third world war. It is an economic and propaganda war, waged by transnational corporations, global financial institutions and national governments on the poor. This international war against the poor is real; but with enough courage and organization from the lower classes, it can be stopped. 911, the Occupy Movement, Anarchist actions, Worker's Strikes, Guerrilla Movements across India, Nepal, the Philippines are all symptoms of the disease of social injustice and inequality. The War on Terror will never be won until the War on Social Injustice is won."

+1

Very well said.

Idealistic crap. Extremist groups have nothing to do with social justice, but the attempt to gain power to implement their one & only true ideology & countenance no other. If they do gain power, they will in turn will become the "oppressor". Take a quick look at Iran and you will understand.

A great example of social justice. Killing, torture & imprisonment of comrades who are no longer considered to be the pure representatives of the group is de rigueur.

I have spent quite a few years studying asymmetrical warfare - with an emphasis on radical Islamist movement- and I am a fairly serious student of modern history. As such, I have some opinions on the post from Bradinasia. But the fact is I'm exhausted and I'm not sure I need to add anything other than to say...

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SteeleJoe,

I'm not sure which post of mine you are referring to, but in the one you quote here the only part that is mine is the +1 and "Very well said." The other part is not mine.

My apologies. Perhaps you failed to use the quote function.

Allow me to rephrase the part that referenced you in error:

"As such, I have some opinions on the post that Bradinasia foolishly agrees with and thinks was very well said despite the fact that it was fallacious and cliche lefty rhetoric of the kind that only brings disrepute to those of us on the left side of the political spectrum"

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Edited February 8, 2013 by SteeleJoe