Thailand's Prostitution Image Is Embarrassing

[SteeleJoe]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Edited March 28, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[Thai at Heart]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl. It takes two to tango, but in the last year alone have had 5 friends in divorce court in less than 5 years of marriage. All jumped in with big wide eyes, but it seems that in isaan right now, the safest way to protect yourself is to pay for the lease of rubber land.

[SteeleJoe]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl.

There's no question of that as far as I'm concerned. Trust me, in 3 decades I've seen and heard enough stories but even beyond that it only stands to reason. As it happens, I don't personally know for sure of even one such successful marriage (a couple of couples I have known might have made it and seemed like they possibly could but I haven't kept in touch).

Not sure how my post lead to this topic - I was talking about the unfortunate fact that if you have a Thai partner who regardless of her background and even if she has no history as a sex worker, that assumption will be made about her by some people. I was not making a case for some bar girls being good people or not (let alone being good candidates for spouses). That has nothing to do with what I posted or was responding to when I posted.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Edited March 28, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[Thai at Heart]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl.

There's no question of that as far as I'm concerned. Trust me, in 3 decades I've seen and heard enough stories but even beyond that it only stands to reason. As it happens, I don't personally know for sure of even one such successful marriage (a couple of couples I have known might have made it and seemed like they possibly could but I haven't kept in touch).

Not sure how my post lead to this topic - I was talking about the unfortunate fact that if you have a Thai partner who regardless of her background and even if she has no history as a sex worker, that assumption will be made about her by some people. I was not making a case for some bar girls being good people or not (let alone being good candidates for spouses). That has nothing to do with what I posted or was responding to when I posted.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

It doesn't worry me or my wife at all, we are within 4 months of age so maybe we don't fit the stereotype. To a great degree, we expect it, and it is up to us to prove them wrong.

[SteeleJoe]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl.

There's no question of that as far as I'm concerned. Trust me, in 3 decades I've seen and heard enough stories but even beyond that it only stands to reason. As it happens, I don't personally know for sure of even one such successful marriage (a couple of couples I have known might have made it and seemed like they possibly could but I haven't kept in touch).

Not sure how my post lead to this topic - I was talking about the unfortunate fact that if you have a Thai partner who regardless of her background and even if she has no history as a sex worker, that assumption will be made about her by some people. I was not making a case for some bar girls being good people or not (let alone being good candidates for spouses). That has nothing to do with what I posted or was responding to when I posted.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

It doesn't worry me or my wife at all, we are within 4 months of age so maybe we don't fit the stereotype. To a great degree, we expect it, and it is up to us to prove them wrong.

As I've said previously, it's much less true than it used to be and it's only some people. I suppose the most common stereotype is the couple with a wide age gap but it's not exclusively so - certainly there are MANY Farangs in a relationship with an ex- sex worker who is within a few years of his age and that has helped to perpetuate the preconception that SOME have that ANY guy with a Thai woman is with a sex worker or an ex sex worker.

It would be stupid to spend much if any time worrying about it. However, I wish it NEVER happened (as it wouldn't if one were with a woman from the US, UK, etc) - and personally I think it's awful that the situation is such that a couple like you and your wife would feel that the onus is on you to prove your wife is not a former bar girl and that you have a genuine relationship.

Ultimately, it is extremely rare that I feel any compulsion or have any need to care what strangers think about my wife and I, but sometimes it matters and if and when they think that she or our relationship is less worthy of respect based on her nationality...well, that is intolerable. (Though in truth, I can't say that has noticeably happened much if at all).

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[DocN]

Prostitution is illegal apparently 555 and today I stumbled upon this beautifully shot YouTube advertisement for happy massage in Chiang Mai "Super Richy"

Wonder if the BIB will be round to close them down now this clear video proof of illegal services ?!?!?!

She could serve me happiness anytime she likes....

[ratcatcher]

Prostitution is illegal apparently 555 and today I stumbled upon this beautifully shot YouTube advertisement for happy massage in Chiang Mai "Super Richy"

Wonder if the BIB will be round to close them down now this clear video proof of illegal services ?!?!?!

She could serve me happiness anytime she likes....

The interior decorating, especially in the reception area, leaves a lot to be desired. I mean,really, lime green against a red.

No doubt this exposure of the video clip on TVF might increase their business a bit.. Na ka.

[DocN]

Prostitution is illegal apparently 555 and today I stumbled upon this beautifully shot YouTube advertisement for happy massage in Chiang Mai "Super Richy"

Wonder if the BIB will be round to close them down now this clear video proof of illegal services ?!?!?!

She could serve me happiness anytime she likes....

The interior decorating, especially in the reception area, leaves a lot to be desired. I mean,really, lime green against a red.

No doubt this exposure of the video clip on TVF might increase their business a bit.. Na ka.

I was just talking about the friendly hoo...service personal. I personally don't appreciate brown wallpaper...but then again, I tend to close my eyes during a jer...a healthy Thai- massage....

[Thai at Heart]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl.

There's no question of that as far as I'm concerned. Trust me, in 3 decades I've seen and heard enough stories but even beyond that it only stands to reason. As it happens, I don't personally know for sure of even one such successful marriage (a couple of couples I have known might have made it and seemed like they possibly could but I haven't kept in touch).

Not sure how my post lead to this topic - I was talking about the unfortunate fact that if you have a Thai partner who regardless of her background and even if she has no history as a sex worker, that assumption will be made about her by some people. I was not making a case for some bar girls being good people or not (let alone being good candidates for spouses). That has nothing to do with what I posted or was responding to when I posted.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

It doesn't worry me or my wife at all, we are within 4 months of age so maybe we don't fit the stereotype. To a great degree, we expect it, and it is up to us to prove them wrong.

As I've said previously, it's much less true than it used to be and it's only some people. I suppose the most common stereotype is the couple with a wide age gap but it's not exclusively so - certainly there are MANY Farangs in a relationship with an ex- sex worker who is within a few years of his age and that has helped to perpetuate the preconception that SOME have that ANY guy with a Thai woman is with a sex worker or an ex sex worker.

It would be stupid to spend much if any time worrying about it. However, I wish it NEVER happened (as it wouldn't if one were with a woman from the US, UK, etc) - and personally I think it's awful that the situation is such that a couple like you and your wife would feel that the onus is on you to prove your wife is not a former bar girl and that you have a genuine relationship.

Ultimately, it is extremely rare that I feel any compulsion or have any need to care what strangers think about my wife and I, but sometimes it matters and if and when they think that she or our relationship is less worthy of respect based on her nationality...well, that is intolerable. (Though in truth, I can't say that has noticeably happened much if at all).

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

[SteeleJoe]

Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

1) I don't understand the question

2) I don't know why you are asking it.

3) I don't know why you are asking ME.

But I'll give it a go...

First of all, who could possibly say what everyone's perception would be? In my posts I repeatedly pointed out that I was speaking of SOME people's perceptions. So confining it to a some narrow minded and judgmental people:

.If they knew she was a porn star with a Harvard degree and that you were married to her, then their first perception would be...you were married to a porn star with a Harvard degree? That she knew a lot about sex AND a had a decent education? That she was a sleazy individual who was also a successful student? That you married her because she was a porn star?

If they didn't know she was a porn star with a Harvard degree, then I suppose that their perception would be that you had married a reasonably good looking blond woman with breast enhancements and a good tan? Or does your hypothetical porn star act and dress like a porn star wherever you go? Then they would think you married married a reasonably good looking blond woman with breast enhancements and a good tan but without much class.

I suppose I could hypothesize a lot more but I can't figure out why it is pertinent.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Edited March 29, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[Thai at Heart]

Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

1) I don't understand the question

2) I don't know why you are asking it.

3) I don't know why you are asking ME.

But I'll give it a go...

First of all, who could possibly say what everyone's perception would be? In my posts I repeatedly pointed out that I was speaking of SOME people's perceptions. So confining it to a some narrow minded and judgmental people:

.If they knew she was a porn star with a Harvard degree and that you were married to her, then their first perception would be...you were married to a porn star with a Harvard degree? That she knew a lot about sex AND a had a decent education? That she was a sleazy individual who was also a successful student? That you married her because she was a porn star?

If they didn't know she was a porn star with a Harvard degree, then I suppose that their perception would be that you had married a reasonably good looking blond woman with breast enhancements and a good tan? Or does your hypothetical porn star act and dress like a porn star wherever you go? Then they would think you married married a reasonably good looking blond woman with breast enhancements and a good tan but without much class.

I suppose I could hypothesize a lot more but I can't figure out why it is pertinent.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Sorry to offend. My point is that first perceptions are everything, no matter where you are. So, when the conversation turns to having a Thai wife, I don't take any offence if people generate an idea in their head.

It's human nature.

[SteeleJoe]

Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

1) I don't understand the question

2) I don't know why you are asking it.

3) I don't know why you are asking ME.

But I'll give it a go...

First of all, who could possibly say what everyone's perception would be? In my posts I repeatedly pointed out that I was speaking of SOME people's perceptions. So confining it to a some narrow minded and judgmental people:

.If they knew she was a porn star with a Harvard degree and that you were married to her, then their first perception would be...you were married to a porn star with a Harvard degree? That she knew a lot about sex AND a had a decent education? That she was a sleazy individual who was also a successful student? That you married her because she was a porn star?

If they didn't know she was a porn star with a Harvard degree, then I suppose that their perception would be that you had married a reasonably good looking blond woman with breast enhancements and a good tan? Or does your hypothetical porn star act and dress like a porn star wherever you go? Then they would think you married married a reasonably good looking blond woman with breast enhancements and a good tan but without much class.

I suppose I could hypothesize a lot more but I can't figure out why it is pertinent.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Sorry to offend. My point is that first perceptions are everything, no matter where you are. So, when the conversation turns to having a Thai wife, I don't take any offence if people generate an idea in their head.

It's human nature.

Wasn't offended. Thoroughly baffled. (Still can't figure out how being married to a porn star who graduated from Harvard Law is analogous to being married to a Thai woman).

I don't think first perceptions are everything. If they were the world would be even more fugged up and we'd have even more problems getting along.

I don't react to what people have in their head. Only when it manifests itself in word or deed.

If the conversation turns to having a Thai wife and someone assumes something unflattering about your wife and/or your relationship simply because she's Thai - but it doesn't bother you - well you are far more tolerant than I. Nonetheless I wasn't necessarily talking about conversations (which don't have much to do with "first perceptions", do they?) nor is it strictly assumptions about marriages that would bother me: I wouldn't like the negative assumptions made about my sister in law, my close friend, or my daughter - all of whom are Thai females (though my daughter looks enough like me to not always be seen as such).

Human nature? Indeed. Or at least SOME humans' nature. So is racism and various other ugliness that I wish weren't a part of life.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[ginjag]

One thing for sure is that the Thais profit very well from this image

I believe that BUT so many posters think that Thailand is not relient on this well DISTRIBUTED dosh,,and repeatedly say it is only 8% of income Ha Ha.

sent from my android LG 9.....bought with a visa card.

[Baerboxer]

1. There is NO prostitution in Thailand, by (Thai) definition. Just lots of really friendly women

2. It is my strong believe that anyone (Thai men for sure!) can have sex anywhere in Thailand, within 10 minutes, if so desired.

3. FACT: Farang sex business is just 5% of the total; that leaves 95% to the Thai

4. Prostitution is the OLDEST profession in the world

The red-light district in Amsterdam is just for the tourists; rarely you will see Dutch people there (unless they come from the province for a day Amsterdam) We just laugh about them

Embarrassing or not, it is just a fact of life in Thailand.

And embarrassing for who??? For the girls? For the punters? For a thru and thru corrupt society and government?

Take your pick

And all those cosy little cottage brothels that pepper the rural south Holland countryside, who are those for?

Next you'll be saying the Dutch dope industry is just a tourist attraction.

[diddums]

Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

That she knows how to position herslef well.

[simple1]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl.

There's no question of that as far as I'm concerned. Trust me, in 3 decades I've seen and heard enough stories but even beyond that it only stands to reason. As it happens, I don't personally know for sure of even one such successful marriage (a couple of couples I have known might have made it and seemed like they possibly could but I haven't kept in touch).

Not sure how my post lead to this topic - I was talking about the unfortunate fact that if you have a Thai partner who regardless of her background and even if she has no history as a sex worker, that assumption will be made about her by some people. I was not making a case for some bar girls being good people or not (let alone being good candidates for spouses). That has nothing to do with what I posted or was responding to when I posted.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

It doesn't worry me or my wife at all, we are within 4 months of age so maybe we don't fit the stereotype. To a great degree, we expect it, and it is up to us to prove them wrong.

As I've said previously, it's much less true than it used to be and it's only some people. I suppose the most common stereotype is the couple with a wide age gap but it's not exclusively so - certainly there are MANY Farangs in a relationship with an ex- sex worker who is within a few years of his age and that has helped to perpetuate the preconception that SOME have that ANY guy with a Thai woman is with a sex worker or an ex sex worker.

It would be stupid to spend much if any time worrying about it. However, I wish it NEVER happened (as it wouldn't if one were with a woman from the US, UK, etc) - and personally I think it's awful that the situation is such that a couple like you and your wife would feel that the onus is on you to prove your wife is not a former bar girl and that you have a genuine relationship.

Ultimately, it is extremely rare that I feel any compulsion or have any need to care what strangers think about my wife and I, but sometimes it matters and if and when they think that she or our relationship is less worthy of respect based on her nationality...well, that is intolerable. (Though in truth, I can't say that has noticeably happened much if at all).

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

Lucky man

Edited April 8, 2013 by simple1

[GazR]

REPRESENTATIONAL PROBLEMS:

Thai prostitution is a representational problem. The exact nature of surrounding issues is unknown. What is known, is that sex-slavery is foremost an issue of poverty, and is run by politicians, business people, military generals, police chiefs and is supported by the World Bank, international airlines and hotel chains.

It is a cultural problem; an educational problem; a problem of political corruption; a problem of making the correct distinctions between sex-slaves and sex workers; a health problem; a problem of exploitation; a social problem; a problem of misdirected self-interests; a problem of carelessness; a problem of putting the economy before humanity. It is a problem that needs to be addressed both locally and internationally.

SURROUNDING ISSUES:

Prostitution is one of the oldest professions in the world, but that is not to say it is not a normal part of human social formation. So-called sex-work is prominent within sexually suppressed societies however, it is rare in societies that are otherwise sexually permissive. This difference illustrates that prostitution is not a universal social norm. Moreover, some experts argue that prostitution is an abnormal form of promiscuity that develops from strict governance of sexuality within a society.

Women who do not consider themselves sex-slaves resent organizations that deny them the right to make a living in the way they see fit. Some have argued that Western countries take a patronizing approach towards non-western women by ignoring sex-work as an issue of personal income and labor. Furthermore, placing all sex-workers into the same category, casting them as victims, denies them the chance of participating in the decision making process that affects their own future and does not respect for them as people who deserve positive rights.

Vigilantes have raided brothels in the past to rescue slaves but have not been aware of the fact that they put not only the lives of the sex-workers at risk but also their families. Many girls escape their rescuers for this reason, or because they did not consider themselves in need have being rescued in the first place. Some girls may even escape out of fear of being killed by brothel owners.

In Thailand, children are the property of their parents and it is culturally acceptable for them to do with them whatever they wish to protect their livelihoods. Thailand’s government celebrates the economic benefits of prostitution, developing a highly successful national plan to support its “sex-tourist industry”, despite its connections to child prostitution. Thailand’s current period of dramatic economic growth – labeled the “Asian Miracle” is reliant on the sex-tourist industry. The demand for new prostitutes has increased, resulting in the widespread recruitment of child prostitutes through debt peonage arrangements in small brothels.

Many Thai foundations claim to help the victims of child prostitution but merely coerce them into sweatshop work by subjecting them to arrest without warrant.

Evangelical Christian's, exploit the issue of sex slavery to grow their follower base and political strength. Their captors and their rescuers so heavily exploit these women and children and as such, the line between captors and rescuers has become increasingly blurry. Hence, the true voice and story of these girls is unheard. Self-styled US vigilantes have raided brothels in the past to rescue women, which resulted in gun battles and other disappointing results. For example, girls rescued in these raids and similar escape from their rescuers within the first 24 hours. 678 girls reported that Trafcord [an anti-trafficking NGO] continually interrogated them as if they were hardened criminals and are threatened their release will be delayed if they do not reveal the identity of their traffickers.

The Thai State government depresses agricultural prices, which enables landowners and loan sharks to exploit farmers and accumulate capital. This is because Thailand did not have a history of technological development or capital formation. The ruling class sought to specialize in sex-tourism to stimulate the accumulation of capital. The growth of the Thai economy is based on impoverishment of peasants and intensive exploitation of labor. Peasants are indebted, incomes plummet as prices decline, forcing many into low paid industrial and 'service' employment.

Since prostitution is illegal in Thailand it is difficult to estimate exactly how many girls are work in the sex tourist industry. However, the total estimate is around 2,000,000. 800,000 of which are teenagers and children.

Where did you get that dodgy 80% figure ?

[manarak]

REPRESENTATIONAL PROBLEMS:

Thai prostitution is a representational problem. The exact nature of surrounding issues is unknown. What is known, is that sex-slavery is foremost an issue of poverty, and is run by politicians, business people, military generals, police chiefs and is supported by the World Bank, international airlines and hotel chains.

It is a cultural problem; an educational problem; a problem of political corruption; a problem of making the correct distinctions between sex-slaves and sex workers; a health problem; a problem of exploitation; a social problem; a problem of misdirected self-interests; a problem of carelessness; a problem of putting the economy before humanity. It is a problem that needs to be addressed both locally and internationally.

SURROUNDING ISSUES:

Prostitution is one of the oldest professions in the world, but that is not to say it is not a normal part of human social formation. So-called sex-work is prominent within sexually suppressed societies however, it is rare in societies that are otherwise sexually permissive. This difference illustrates that prostitution is not a universal social norm. Moreover, some experts argue that prostitution is an abnormal form of promiscuity that develops from strict governance of sexuality within a society.

Women who do not consider themselves sex-slaves resent organizations that deny them the right to make a living in the way they see fit. Some have argued that Western countries take a patronizing approach towards non-western women by ignoring sex-work as an issue of personal income and labor. Furthermore, placing all sex-workers into the same category, casting them as victims, denies them the chance of participating in the decision making process that affects their own future and does not respect for them as people who deserve positive rights.

Vigilantes have raided brothels in the past to rescue slaves but have not been aware of the fact that they put not only the lives of the sex-workers at risk but also their families. Many girls escape their rescuers for this reason, or because they did not consider themselves in need have being rescued in the first place. Some girls may even escape out of fear of being killed by brothel owners.

In Thailand, children are the property of their parents and it is culturally acceptable for them to do with them whatever they wish to protect their livelihoods. Thailand’s government celebrates the economic benefits of prostitution, developing a highly successful national plan to support its “sex-tourist industry”, despite its connections to child prostitution. Thailand’s current period of dramatic economic growth – labeled the “Asian Miracle” is reliant on the sex-tourist industry. The demand for new prostitutes has increased, resulting in the widespread recruitment of child prostitutes through debt peonage arrangements in small brothels.

Many Thai foundations claim to help the victims of child prostitution but merely coerce them into sweatshop work by subjecting them to arrest without warrant.

Evangelical Christian's, exploit the issue of sex slavery to grow their follower base and political strength. Their captors and their rescuers so heavily exploit these women and children and as such, the line between captors and rescuers has become increasingly blurry. Hence, the true voice and story of these girls is unheard. Self-styled US vigilantes have raided brothels in the past to rescue women, which resulted in gun battles and other disappointing results. For example, girls rescued in these raids and similar escape from their rescuers within the first 24 hours. 678 girls reported that Trafcord [an anti-trafficking NGO] continually interrogated them as if they were hardened criminals and are threatened their release will be delayed if they do not reveal the identity of their traffickers.

The Thai State government depresses agricultural prices, which enables landowners and loan sharks to exploit farmers and accumulate capital. This is because Thailand did not have a history of technological development or capital formation. The ruling class sought to specialize in sex-tourism to stimulate the accumulation of capital. The growth of the Thai economy is based on impoverishment of peasants and intensive exploitation of labor. Peasants are indebted, incomes plummet as prices decline, forcing many into low paid industrial and 'service' employment.

Since prostitution is illegal in Thailand it is difficult to estimate exactly how many girls are work in the sex tourist industry. However, the total estimate is around 2,000,000. 800,000 of which are teenagers and children.

Where did you get that dodgy 80% figure ?

doesn't matter, because the whole thing is bull.

[tomyummer]

It's not so much that the prostitution exists, it's the fact how the sex is sold through the images and locations such as sleazy Patpong, Nana, Soi Cowboy, and in Pattaya. All neon lights, in your face punters, and no real zoning as far as distance to residential or high traffic public areas. Prostitution is legal in places such as Singapore and Holland, yet you don't associate it as much as Thailand.

Thailand sells it well, then denies it. It's funny how a few of the big political families are tied to prostitution properties in Bangkok. Hypocrites.

[connda]

Much ado about nothing. Get over it.

[sandgroper3]

I think many lwas are written in Thailand just for them to sound like they care or are doing something, heard the latest that they will carry the largest written warning on their cigarettes, "hey - that Thailand, what a brilliant country" SHUT UP, anyone here longer than 5mins know all the laws passed around are a joke, many used on temporary basis to line pockets. During my 4yrs in Pattaya (many moons ago) I rekon half the bars I frequented around Soi2/3 and 7/8 were owned by local police, ie they were the pimps, if you take a bar fine for a girl you're a pimp, that's immoral.

As for the plight of the young poor classes it's bull shit there is no work, anyone with a business up here in the north-east will tell you how hard it is to get or keep staff, they just want an easy life, and their lack of morales makes it easy for them to open their legs for a fast buck.

Thai ministers don't care about prostitution, in fact they positively want it to remain, it keeps their pathetically run country turning over, they just don't want to know or hear that they are being laughed at. I don't want prostitution in Thailand, I wish it could clean up its act, it ain't no fun when you take your wife back to your home land and have people sniggering behind your back, but I say to my wife "Thai people over generations have caused this and there ain't nothing we (us two) can do to stop it"

PS - never paid for sex never will, never pimped a girl, never will, and I would never expect a girl to be with me who's old enough to be my daughter - this is not just aimed at falang, in the north-east I frequent mainly Thai establishments, the girls here leave me alone (skin too white) but I see exactly the same sick crap going on among the Thai men with their Mia-noys - incidentally, do we really believe these married men go out night after night to visit the mia-noy and the wife hasn't got a clue? I think they know, so they stay with their cheating spouse for the security, prostitution is a grey area me thinks!

what business up there in the north-east do you run??

[givenall]

What prostitution. No one will admit there is one

[Thai at Heart]

So these finest people on the planet, the ones that you admire and respect so much ,were they prostitutes ?

I didn't call anyone "finest people on the planet", now did I? That'd be just a bit presumptuous. I referred to my wife as someone whom I admire and respect (after 20 years of being impressed and inspired by her strength, wisdom, kindness and fierce loyalty) and not that it's any of your business or even of any import in this context, it happens that she was not a prostitute. I also wrote of women who are among the finest people I've ever met; a couple of them were at the time or had been prostitutes, as a matter of fact. But in 31 years I've met a lot of Thai people from all different strata of Thai society and have found good and bad among each socio-economic tier and irrespective of profession.

Why do you ask?

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Good and bad is one thing, but in my observed experience, the odds are not in favour of having a happy and long marriage with a bar girl.

There's no question of that as far as I'm concerned. Trust me, in 3 decades I've seen and heard enough stories but even beyond that it only stands to reason. As it happens, I don't personally know for sure of even one such successful marriage (a couple of couples I have known might have made it and seemed like they possibly could but I haven't kept in touch).

Not sure how my post lead to this topic - I was talking about the unfortunate fact that if you have a Thai partner who regardless of her background and even if she has no history as a sex worker, that assumption will be made about her by some people. I was not making a case for some bar girls being good people or not (let alone being good candidates for spouses). That has nothing to do with what I posted or was responding to when I posted.

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It doesn't worry me or my wife at all, we are within 4 months of age so maybe we don't fit the stereotype. To a great degree, we expect it, and it is up to us to prove them wrong.

As I've said previously, it's much less true than it used to be and it's only some people. I suppose the most common stereotype is the couple with a wide age gap but it's not exclusively so - certainly there are MANY Farangs in a relationship with an ex- sex worker who is within a few years of his age and that has helped to perpetuate the preconception that SOME have that ANY guy with a Thai woman is with a sex worker or an ex sex worker.

It would be stupid to spend much if any time worrying about it. However, I wish it NEVER happened (as it wouldn't if one were with a woman from the US, UK, etc) - and personally I think it's awful that the situation is such that a couple like you and your wife would feel that the onus is on you to prove your wife is not a former bar girl and that you have a genuine relationship.

Ultimately, it is extremely rare that I feel any compulsion or have any need to care what strangers think about my wife and I, but sometimes it matters and if and when they think that she or our relationship is less worthy of respect based on her nationality...well, that is intolerable. (Though in truth, I can't say that has noticeably happened much if at all).

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Well, if I was married to a Porn star with a Harvard law degree, what would people's first perception be?

Lucky man

Beers on a Friday in the local would never be the same.

[Signature2013]

I agree it's embarrassing for me to be in a room alone with 2 x Naked Thai Ladies whos combined age is less than mine.....my embarassment often spins out to absolute shame.

I often ask myself how I get over such anxiety.....but somehow I do!

The article is crap and gives a western perspective on an asian norm; westerners still think the true time of the day only exists in their home country. Remember we are the strangers...and to many asians we are also very strange.

Thai Prostitution for foreigners is TINY compared to the same activities within Thai Society.

I'm just helping pay the bills!!

[maprao]

My wife is a uni student. Same same but different

[thaibeachlovers]

My wife is a uni student. Same same but different

Does she wear shirts 2 sizes too small and a skin tight mini skirt that barely reaches crotch level?

I don't know how male uni profs can teach anything with all the pulchitrude that sits in front of them every day

[Thingamabob]

Prostitution exists in every country in the world, hugely so in the USA.

What makes prostitution in Thailand popular is the fun element, unlike the sordid atmosphere in most other places.

[ElwoodP]

11 year old thread ..... Locked.