Are You Part Of The Farang Detritus Layer?

[Phronesis]

There is a good deal of evidence to suggest that Thailand is continuing with its systematic approach to the removal low net worth foreigners who are attempting to live here long term.

The following are some relevant examples:

1. Reduction of VOA by land based border crossing to 15 days

2. Increased business and company compliance scrutiny (especially in Phuket)

3. Recent (and significant) changes to ED visa in Phuket

4. Refusal to issue multiple back to back double entry tourist visas

The Thai elite tolerate low net worth farangs from Myanmar, Cambodia and PI because they are exploited, en masse, in construction and other labour intensive industries.

However, low net worth farangs from Western countries have no utility within Thailand's labour market. They also provide little stimulus to the local tourism industry as they seek to live in the same social plan as workaday Thais.

If you are part of the farang detritus layer you need to start planning an exit strategy now. Do not stick your head in the sand and assume things will get better. They won't.

And so, to the point of this thread: Are you part of the farang detritus layer?

The answer is yes if you meet any of the following criteria:

1. You work here illegally without a WP

2. You work here with a WP that relies on sponsorship from a Visa company

3. You stay here on a ED visa and work illegally

4. You stay here on a tourist visa and work illegally

5. You assume that the exchange rate for the GBP will return to 70 THB

6. You are concerned about how to provide the funds to meet the qualification amounts of 400KTHB and 800KTHB for a marriage or retirement visa

[stoneyboy]

I guess I'm one of the lucky ones then.

[lazygourmet]

Are you writing this from Dubai OP ?!?

[JSixpack]

So?

Not understanding the point of the post and why you'd want to know who is and who isn't. We all know our own status.

[Jingthing]

I find referring to human beings as detritus to be unnecessarily trollish, but I get the gist of your question, and suggest you do a POLL about it.

[yermanee]

I find referring to human beings as detritus to be unnecessarily trollish, but I get the gist of your question, and suggest you do a POLL about it.

I don't think the poll would reflect the truth.

Who wants to publicly admit to being on the wrong side ?

Yermanee

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Foreigners play a vital and indispensable role in Thailand..

If it wasn't for blaming foreigners for everything from prostitution to obesity then Thai society would have to embrace reality.

[rct99q]

Thank you for pointing this out. Maybe the people you describe will take the hint and get out and leave the rest of us well adjusted and happy citizens living in peace.

[rct99q]

.....oh and if you happen to be living here yourself......don't let the door hit you on the way out.....

[rgs2001uk]

Shock, horror, country actually standing up for itself and deciding who should live within its borders, rather than being dictated to by others.

Great well done Thailand, way to go.

Perhaps you would be kind enough to forward this to the UKBA for them to consider.

I feel sure the good citizens of Lampedusa would welcome such an initiative.

[Phronesis]

The point of the post is this.

There are many people living here on little more than deluded optimism.

Optimism is a good thing.

Failing to acknowledge realities, and acting or planning accordingly, is not.

The criteria for Western farangs to stay here (long term) are going to continue to become more onerous in the immediate future.

ASEAN and inflation are in clear view on the horizon.

If you are part of the farang detritus layer you need to start planning your exit strategy NOW.

Alternatively, you need to start planning how you are going to raise yourself above the socio-economic layer of farangs that the Thai elite are systematically seeking to preclude from this nation.

Edited March 10, 2013 by Phronesis

[JLCrab]

Thailand provides one of the few advantages in life to being over age 50.

[Jingthing]

The F-rang Detritus Layer is now a brigade!

[canuckamuck]

I think the OP should declare his own financial status before asking for everyone else's.

Afterall the intention of this type of post is usually a wiener gauge.

[ThaidDown]

The changes in your first group were probably brought about by people in the second group (the so called 'detritus' ) taking the p*ss out of the regulations.

On balance I think major changes in the regs have actually helped more foreigners stay. The main ones being reduction of Retirement extension age from 55 to 50 years ago now, and an amazing godsend for the under 50/not married to a Thai brigade, the Ed Visa. I'm surprised that it's still so easily available without much testing .

As far as 'Detritus"

detritus (dɪˈtraɪtəs) —n 1. a loose mass of stones, silt, etc, worn away from rocks 2. an accumulation of disintegrated material or debris 3.

the organic debris formed from the decay of organisms

I am assuming you are using definition 3.

Well I've seen some foreigners looking rough round the edges but I think that's going a bit far.

[trainman34014]

Nice try but the worst of the chaff won't leave until they are literally shaken out of the bottom. I know of at least three blokes who are fully supported by their Thai wives and families and have no intention of leaving. Even their retirement visa funds are fronted by the Thai family's who do not want them to leave for various reasons.

[phuturatica]

Why do you want to know about everyone else though? What does it actually have to do with you?

I don't understand why this information is relevant to your interests. If you live here yourself, just enjoy your time here and keep your nose out of other people's business. It'll only get dirty if you don't.

[stoneyboy]

Nice try but the worst of the chaff won't leave until they are literally shaken out of the bottom. I know of at least three blokes who are fully supported by their Thai wives and families and have no intention of leaving. Even their retirement visa funds are fronted by the Thai family's who do not want them to leave for various reasons.

Not forgetting the overstayers who publicly flout the laws when selling and working at the local festivals and fairs selling shoddy kebabs on a daily basis.

[Phronesis]

I think the OP should declare his own financial status before asking for everyone else's.

Afterall the intention of this type of post is usually a wiener gauge.

Not my intention at all Canuckamuck.

I posted to...hopefully...prompt some of those out there...with their heads firmly stuck in the sand...into positive action...

With regard to my own situation, that is clearly recorded in my other posts and threads.

I am a self funded retiree who does not meet the criteria for the Thai retirement visa. It will be many years before I am 50.

And so...I am stuck on a ED visa...because there is no other long stay option available to me.

However, this week, some entirely ridiculous new requirements have been imposed by Phuket immigration for the ED visa.

It is manifestly obvious that these new requirements are aimed squarely at the Russians here in Phuket who are now openly working in restaurants as waiters and waitresses...working as prostitutes on Bangla...driving minibuses...and even busking for loose change at local markets.

So...if you must know...I too am now part of the detritus layer...not because I don't have money...but because I am a long way off 50...and my only long stay Thai visa option is being shut down because of it's abuse by Russians.

I am currently doing my due dilligence on a number of other countries including Cambodia and PI.

Before coming to Thailand to live full time, I only carried out my due dilligence upon issues of lifestyle and infrastructure. In hindsight, that was a significant mistake on my part. In the future, the first thing I will scrutinize prior to relocating to another country will be the simplicity of obtaining, and complying with, a long stay visa.

Lifestyle and infrastructure are entirely irrelevant if maintaining a long stay visa is impossible.

Edited March 10, 2013 by Phronesis

[Bagwan]

There is no denying that there are a substantial number of farangs living here who are sailing close to the wind if not in fact contravening Thai law and I for one would not object if they were rounded up and sent packing. However there are many who have married and settled and have done more for the less fortunate and less privileged element of the population than any Thai Government. My Thai family have been raised from the gutter existence that they endured for so many years and are grateful for my support. Thanks to ineffective UK Governments and the greed of bankers I have now had to implement greater financial control to ensure that I can continue to provide them with the necessities of life. Since it is clear that it is in the interests of many rural communities that farangs such as myself are not chased away, they might give some consideration to amending the financial qualifications having regard to the alarming fall in currency exchange rates.

[canuckamuck]

Ok OP I took your post the wrong way, I did not guess you were including yourself under the label detritus. I too fall short of the retirement age, but I have a wife and children so I get to stick around unless something changes.

[jamhar]

Foreigners play a vital and indispensable role in Thailand..

If it wasn't for blaming foreigners for everything from prostitution to obesity then Thai society would have to embrace reality.

Damn right we do! In fact a critical part!

They should pay us!

To the OP,

umm...........

any prize if we're 6 for 6?

[Phronesis]

Since it is clear that it is in the interests of many rural communities that farangs such as myself are not chased away, they might give some consideration to amending the financial qualifications having regard to the alarming fall in currency exchange rates.

I respect all that you have done for your family...and no doubt their community. But to be frank, you statement is a clear example of the head in the sand...and hope for a positive outcome...attitude that many need to snap out of...FAST

Despite your contributions to both your family, and Thailand, you are currently, AND ALWAYS HAVE BEEN, here on a user pay basis.

When you are no longer able to pay you will be moved on. Unceremoniously, and violently if required.

The user pay fee has been increasing expontentially in recent times...and it will continue to increase in the near future.

If your strategy moving forward is to wait for the Thai elite to acknowledge that you are a good bloke and amend your user pay fee accordingly...you are entirely deluded.

Edited March 10, 2013 by Phronesis

[rgs2001uk]

The point of the post is this.

There are many people living here on little more than deluded optimism.

Optimism is a good thing.

Failing to acknowledge realities, and acting or planning accordingly, is not.

The criteria for Western farangs to stay here (long term) are going to continue to become more onerous in the immediate future.

ASEAN and inflation are in clear view on the horizon.

If you are part of the farang detritus layer you need to start planning your exit strategy NOW.

Alternatively, you need to start planning how you are going to raise yourself above the socio-economic layer of farangs that the Thai elite are systematically seeking to preclude from this nation.

Great thread Phronesis....true to your username...wink..wink

..exit strategies......ermmm

It all depends on a number of factors but I think the most important are AGE and MONEY.

If I was under 50 and considering Thailand today...I wouldn't live here...long term that is..

...but if I was rich and/or highly skilled I would...although other countries would, indeed, offer better choices.

Pensioners who have been here awhile but suffer from depreciating currencies...it might be a good idea to stick around and adjust...new beginnings at 67 and with limited means are not promising..better the devil you know

It's a very complicated affair overall....individual circumstances differ vastly.

Truth is, the thai govt has been making life difficult for us.....chances are, the trend will continue....

Younger people, take note..

Truth is, the thai govt has been making life difficult for us.

Care to give some examples within say the last 10 years.

If anything the gov't has made it easier, eg student visas.

[mrtoad]

The answer is no. OP, you having visa problems?

[NeverSure]

I find referring to human beings as detritus to be unnecessarily trollish, but I get the gist of your question, and suggest you do a POLL about it.

I don't think the poll would reflect the truth.

Who wants to publicly admit to being on the wrong side ?

Yermanee

Yermanee, Please get rid of that avatar. I'd really like to scroll on down the page and read the other posts, please.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

What are the new ED visa requirements in Phuket?

Actually attending the school?

[diddums]

Your questions are flawed.

I come under one of them categories ...yet I don't think I am 'detritus'...however I do not know what that means.....can you explain it....also if this question has been asked previously and answered...I did not see it cos I did not read past the first post.

[MrWorldwide]

Is this another 'Lets all run away to Cambodia' thread ? You'll be back by CNY, 2014

[JurgenG]

I think the OP should declare his own financial status before asking for everyone else's.

Afterall the intention of this type of post is usually a wiener gauge.

Not my intention at all Canuckamuck.

I posted to...hopefully...prompt some of those out there...with their heads firmly stuck in the sand...into positive action...

With regard to my own situation, that is clearly recorded in my other posts and threads.

I am a self funded retiree who does not meet the criteria for the Thai retirement visa. It will be many years before I am 50.

And so...I am stuck on a ED visa...because there is no other long stay option available to me.

However, this week, some entirely ridiculous new requirements have been imposed by Phuket immigration for the ED visa.

It is manifestly obvious that these new requirements are aimed squarely at the Russians here in Phuket who are now openly working in restaurants as waiters and waitresses...working as prostitutes on Bangla...driving minibuses...and even busking for loose change at local markets.

So...if you must know...I too am now part of the detritus layer...not because I don't have money...but because I am a long way off 50...and my only long stay Thai visa option is being shut down because of it's abuse by Russians.

I am currently doing my due dilligence on a number of other countries including Cambodia and PI.

Before coming to Thailand to live full time, I only carried out my due dilligence upon issues of lifestyle and infrastructure. In hindsight, that was a significant mistake on my part. In the future, the first thing I will scrutinize prior to relocating to another country will be the simplicity of obtaining, and complying with, a long stay visa.

Lifestyle and infrastructure are entirely irrelevant if maintaining a long stay visa is impossible.

Blame the Russians, blame the Chinese, blame the "Thai Elite" (??! )

Blame everybody but ...

You admit being here under false pretense then you manage to blame others for doing the same thing and then the administration for trying to close a loophole.

Fortunately at the end you say "In the future, the first thing I will scrutinize prior to relocating to another country will be the simplicity of obtaining, and complying with, a long stay visa."

Doing things legally may actually be not such a bad idea.

_

Edited March 10, 2013 by JurgenG