Anti-government Rally Thread 13-25 March

[Jai Dee]

Prime minister says he is not worried about an issue where he gets elected from the electoin but did not have a full House of Representatives

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra has affirmed he was not worried about an issue where he gets elected in the election but might not have a full number of members of the House of Representatives. Policemen and soldiers were reported to have increased in number at the premier's residence upon his return, after rumors the anti-Thaksin mob could move their demonstration site to the Chansongla (จันทร์ส่องหล้า) residence.

Mr. Thaksin said he would not feel heavy-hearted should less than 500 House members be yielded from the April 2nd election, as he believed the law of the country would provide an exit for the situation. In response to suggestions by academics proposing that the premier take a break from politics, Mr. Thaksin said such announcement would also mean an announcement to take a break in democracy.

Reporters say the number of security officials at the prime minister's Chansongla home on Charansanitwong (จรัญสนิทวงศ์) Road has doubled from normal.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 25 March 2006

[Jai Dee]

Some photographs from The Manager:

[MrSnrang]

Off topic but...

[Jai Dee]

[Plus]

Somehow this little piece slipped through Jai Dee's net:

Banharn rebuffs Thaksin

Published on Mar 25, 2006

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra failed to gain the support of Chat Thai Party leader Banharn Silpa-archa in his bid to end the opposition's election boycott, a Thai Rak Thai Party official said yesterday.

During his hospital visit on Thursday, Thaksin asked ailing Banharn to rejoin the electoral process and reason with the other two opposition parties, Democrat and Mahachon, to follow his lead.

"In exchange for the ending of the election boycott, Thaksin offered to delay the April 2 vote for 100 days, freeze his political career for one four-year term and name his ally, Bhokin Bhalakula, as interim successor," the party official said.

The official said Banharn had refused to cooperate on the grounds that it was too late to mend fences and reminded Thaksin not to overly rely on his three political cronies Newin Chidchob, Yongyuth Tiyapairat and Padung Limcharoenrat, who he said had given bad advice. Many executives of the ruling party said Bhokin and party executive Somkid Jatusripitak were strong contenders to succeed Thaksin.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Hope it's not retracted tomorrow.

Another thing, people always say "small minority". Let's see how small it is on April 2. Even in the last elections Opposition managed to fill a quarter of the House. Let's see how "small" anti-Thaksin movement is now. I think even if Thaksin wins against "no vote", the MARGIN will be small, or even very small.

[Plus]

And more on predictions.

Everybody realises now that the elections can't be stopped. Everybody is waiting for the results (where are the polls? why there are no polls?).

When the result is known, and Thaksin wins, PAD will retreat. Anti-Thaksin crowd will admit defeat and go home. They will feel deep resentment against their countrymen who chose a rascal for their leader.

Then something will come up and they will take to the streets, more determined than ever. Shin sale was a big thing, but hiring fake candidates might be even bigger affront to people's conscience. If that issue gets enough public attention and the EC shows total incomptence/obedience to TRT, it will be BIG.

What next? Civil disobedience and general strikes? Strikes are nothing for French, they have two strikes for breakfast, but it's unheard of in Thailand. What will Thaksin say? More elections?

That's the point - whatever happens on April 2, LARGE segment of the population WILL NOT accept Thaksin as the PM and their protests will only escalate (barring Thaksin completely changes his persona and modus operandi)

[h90]

plus first I wanted to write that that anti-toxin will not go home, but now I am not sure, maybe they go home. But if they go home an new one come or not Thailand will not be the same...

look like big troubles.....

And more on predictions.

Everybody realises now that the elections can't be stopped. Everybody is waiting for the results (where are the polls? why there are no polls?).

When the result is known, and Thaksin wins, PAD will retreat. Anti-Thaksin crowd will admit defeat and go home. They will feel deep resentment against their countrymen who chose a rascal for their leader.

Then something will come up and they will take to the streets, more determined than ever. Shin sale was a big thing, but hiring fake candidates might be even bigger affront to people's conscience. If that issue gets enough public attention and the EC shows total incomptence/obedience to TRT, it will be BIG.

What next? Civil disobedience and general strikes? Strikes are nothing for French, they have two strikes for breakfast, but it's unheard of in Thailand. What will Thaksin say? More elections?

That's the point - whatever happens on April 2, LARGE segment of the population WILL NOT accept Thaksin as the PM and their protests will only escalate (barring Thaksin completely changes his persona and modus operandi)

[sriracha john]

Easy there, big guy... no need to insult anyone... I never requested the official website for the Thai Secret Service, nor anything detailing all of it's operations... I just requested to see some mention somewhere that it, in fact, exists... a newspaper article... a simple ministerial departmental listing...anything that just refers to it... something...anything... anywhere...

I also made no mention of "intelligence agencies"... that's an entirely different matter.

Definition for 'secret service':

secret service

n.

1.

1. Intelligence-gathering activities conducted secretly by a government agency.

2. A government agency engaged in intelligence-gathering activities.

And you want to still argue that Thailand does not have such a thing, considering everything that is going on here?

What do you think those polite blokes in black jackets, things in their ear and speakers in their collar are that surround Thaksin wherever he goes? Or the blokes in civil that check any stranger coming close to Thaksin and who order normal cops around?

These people for sure are not the sort of hired thugs in shades that surround Sondhi.

hahaha... nice characterizations...

so a thingy in one's ear makes one an "agent"... loads of bodyguard services have them, even bodyguards for celebrities use such electronic gadgetry.... but nevermind.

While I can appreciate your definition, it is, however, actually a bit more complicated than that.

wikipedia.com

There is some difficulty in separating the definitions of secret service, secret police, intelligence agency etc. For instance a country may establish a secret service which has some policing powers (such as surveillance) but not others. A secret police may also be said to be a secret service. The powers and duties of a government organisation may be partly secret and partly not. The organisation may be said to operate openly at home and secretly abroad, or vice versa.

The most prominent organization bearing this title is the United States Secret Service, but it is a law enforcement and protective agency, and not a secret police or intelligence agency. The CIA fulfills that role, to some degree.

The British secret intelligence service, MI6, is sometimes referred to as a "secret service."

I just requested to see some mention somewhere that it, in fact, exists... a newspaper article... a simple ministerial departmental listing...anything that just refers to it... something...anything... anywhere...

so I guess the final answer then, is "no"... fair enough

[jdinasia]

lol ... particles are so messy .... "a secret service" The Secrest Service"

[ColPyat]

so I guess the final answer then, is "no"... fair enough

The final answer is that i am getting bored with your arguments about pure semantics. If you don't believe that Thailand has was is defined as a secret service, then continue to do so. Most likely you will also not further your knowledge on this and other subjects by shooting your mouth on the internet, and relying on what you might find in the net.

I will keep on drinking tea with a few buddies who are special branch with protection duties. And no, i can't tell you anything about their set up as this is a topic they obviously do not talk about with me.

[jdinasia]

Cool! .... I am gonna sit down for tea with Batman and Superman tonight too! (They won't tell me dick about the Justice League either!)

[sriracha john]

so I guess the final answer then, is "no"... fair enough

The final answer is that i am getting bored with your arguments about pure semantics. If you don't believe that Thailand has was is defined as a secret service, then continue to do so. Most likely you will also not further your knowledge on this and other subjects by shooting your mouth on the internet, and relying on what you might find in the net.

I will keep on drinking tea with a few buddies who are special branch with protection duties. And no, i can't tell you anything about their set up as this is a topic they obviously do not talk about with me.

Actually, it would seem that semantics IS the whole basis of our disagreement. I'm surprised you can't see that. I'm used to seeing the term Secret Service used to described an established agency within a government and you apparently are not. Once again, fair enough... but my request for further information actually DOES come from a desire to become more knowledgeable of other forms this term might take... and not from some desire "to shoot my mouth off"

such as ...it's a pity your tea-drinking buddies that belong to a "special branch" won't discuss it with you... I'd be curious if this branch has a name? Do they fall under the military or police, etc.

But obviously... you're way past the point of being willing to discuss the matter any further in a polite and courteous manner, so I won't pursue it. I just hope the tea can help you to calm down.

Edited March 25, 2006 by sriracha john

[Jai Dee]

The anti-Thaksin rally gathers outside Government House last night, demanding that caretaker prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra step down. It is estimated that close to 200,000 protesters joined the rally - The Nation.

[Jai Dee]

King the only hope for end to deadlock, say PAD protesters

Rally draws biggest crowd yet, but not all support call for royal intervention; leaders warn situation may turn violent

A massive crowd gathered on Bangkok's Rajdamnoen Avenue yesterday to support the People's Alliance for Democracy's (PAD) call for royal intervention to remove caretaker Premier Thaksin Shinawatra and end the political deadlock.

Meanwhile, about 200 supporters of the embattled premier went to his house on Charoen Sanitwong Road last night to show support for him.

At press time, some 700 anti-Thaksin demonstrators from Ramkamhaeng University were heading towards the Thai Rak Thai Party's headquarters on New Petchaburi Road.

At Rajdamnoen Avenue, PAD leaders read a petition to be submitted to HM the King, asking him to enforce Article 7 of the Constitution to end the political crisis and avoid possible violence.

"The situation is now deadlocked, we see no alternative to avoid violence so we would submit the petition to HM the King," PAD leader Sondhi Limthongkul said. The media firebrand also called for 500,000 people to join a rally today. Protesters will meet at National Stadium and then march to Siam Paragon shopping complex, he said.

Chamlong Srimuang, a PD leader, estimated the crowd at about 300,000 people.

The alliance hopes a new caretaker premier will be appointed to oversee political reform and call a new general election.

"Long Live the King," an announcer on the stage shouted before leading protesters in a salute of HM the King and a rendition of the royal anthem, which was followed by other songs composed by the Monarch.

Legal experts, however, said royal intervention would be possible only after Thaksin resigned.

Banjerd Singkaneti of Thammasat University noted the situation was now risky and violence should be avoided.

PAD spokesperson Suriyasai Katasila said the crowds gathering underlined the fact there is widespread support for the alliance's proposal for royal intervention.

"We are now waiting and will launch a public campaign to explain why we need royal intervention," he said.

However, many protesters told The Nation they did not support the PAD's move.

"I disagree with the PAD on this since it is not a democratic way, but there is no other place to express my disapproval of Thaksin," said one protester who declined to be named.

A lawyer who asked not to be named said he only wanted to unseat Thaksin and had no idea about the call to invoke Article 7.

A group of youngsters from Nakhon Si Thammarat said they did not care who the next leader would be. "Just not Thaksin," they said emphatically. The youths said they arrived in Bangkok from their hometown on Friday to attend the Democrat Party's rally.

Source: The Nation - Sun, March 26, 2006

[Jai Dee]

MASS MARCH IN BANGKOK

Bangkok could see the largest anti-government demonstration in its history today (Sunday), as leaders of the protest to force the resignation of Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra have called for half a million people to march on Sukhumvit Road.

The groups seeking Mr Thaksin's political head are to march today from the luxury Siam Paragon mall to the up-scale Emporium, passing through a major tourist shopping and business area on Rama I, Ploenchit and Sukhumvit Roads.

The march will be the last hurrah in a series of public protests which began last October in Lumpini Park.

Early voting in the general election for the Lower House of parliament already have begun, and the main voting day is next Sunday.

Last night, the rally drew an estimated 100,000, although police put the crowd at closer to 50,000. If organisers can get anything close to their optimistic call for 500,000 marchers today, it will be the biggest such demonstration in Thai history.

Organisers have unanimously called for a peaceful march. There has been no violence in the entire extended campaign by Bangkok opponents against Mr Thaksin.

The march is to support the latest twist in tactics to force the end of the Thaksin government - to campaign for a royally-bestowed government. Leaders say it might take three or four days to enlist public support for the proposal.

Source: Bangkok Post - Sun, March 26, 2006

[Jai Dee]

Rally renews call for King to step in

100,000 protesters turn out to increase pressure on Thaksin; donations of B15m raised; march on Sukhumvit Rd planned for today

More than 100,000 demonstrators turned up at a rally against caretaker Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra last night, stepping up calls for royal intervention to end the political crisis. After hours of shouting and screaming for Mr Thaksin to step down, the fiery activities on the main stage wound down as People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) leader Sondhi Limthongkul read out a petition seeking the King's intervention.

After reading the petition, Mr Sondhi solemnly led the crowd to repeat the petition _ which appealed for the monarch to appoint an interim prime minister _ after him, line after line.

''We, the demonstrators, see no solutions to end the crisis without bloodshed other than appealing for His Majesty's help and asking him to consider invoking article 7 of the constitution and appointing an interim government,'' read the petition.

Wutthipong Priabchariyawat, Millennium Institute director, said the demonstrators placed their hope in His Majesty.

''The prime minister never listens to the people. Article 7 [of the constitution] is His Majesty's whisper, and that's the whisper in public,'' he said.

After reading the petition, the demonstrators lit candles and sang praises to His Majesty. And the intense activities on the main stage resumed once again.

The gathering of demonstrators was apparently a response to the PAD's call for a royally-bestowed government ahead of the election next Sunday.

People waving flags and placards streamed into the protest venue in the late afternoon and the crowd kept growing.

Before the five PAD leaders took the stage last night, the protesters spilled out to cover the area outside Ratchadamnoen boxing stadium.

The rally ground was jam-packed, prompting the organisers to put up more projector screens and amplifiers to broadcast the activities.

The demonstrators came in droves for the final push to oust Mr Thaksin, who yesterday visited the Motor Show in the Bang Na area.

Some 250 policemen armed with shields and teargas had to be deployed at the Thai Rak Thai headquarters on Petchaburi Road following reports a group of Ramkhamhaeng University students were planning to protest in front of the party headquarters late last night.

Some 1,000 university students were reportedly involved in the march following reports that the government had tried to prevent them from joining the anti-Thaksin rally.

The students staged a separate rally at their campus earlier in the day and were planning to join the PAD-led demonstration in the evening.

The group became angry after learning that some government figures had lobbied with van operators not to provide transportation services for them.

Suriyasai Katasila, a PAD leader, said yesterday the PAD would not lead the crowd on a march to Mr Thaksin's residence on Charan Sanitwong road to pressure him to resign, and said it would instead appeal to the people to join its call for His Majesty to appoint a new prime minister.

Around 15 million baht has been collected in donations so far by the PAD.

He said the PAD leaders would lead the protesters on a march along Sukhumvit road today to campaign for a royally-bestowed government. He said it would take three or four days to enlist public support for the proposal.

At the same time, the PAD is asking protesters to fill out a questionnaire on political reforms they want to see in the post-Thaksin era. It is the PAD's first survey of demonstrators' opinions.

Working with the NGO Coordinating Committee and the civic committee studying free trade area agreements, the PAD plans to gather the opinions of 10,000 people. The demonstrators are being asked to pick three out of 11 reforms listed in the questionnaire or make their own suggestions. Among the 11 issues listed in the survey are free-trade agreements, privatisation of state enterprises, health and social welfare, and public scrutiny of the government.

Source: Bangkok Post - Sun, March 26, 2006

[Jai Dee]

Click this link for a slideshow of photographs of last night's rally taken by The Manager.

[Jai Dee]

PAD leaders led their group in lighting candles for HM and to display their pure intention in the demonstration

The leaders of the People's Alliance for Democracy led demonstrators in lighting candles to wish His Majesty the King well, and also to display their pure intention in the demonstration.

All 5 core figures of the PAD went on stage at about 9.50 pm to lead the demonstrators in lighting the candles. The core figures agreed to have Sondhi Limthongkul (สนธิ ลิ้มทองกุล) take the lead in the ceremony, which involved the reading of a petition to His Majesty the King calling for a royally-appointed government. The group then, in full volume, sang a song in commemorating His Majesty, whilst they were facing the grand palace. Thai flags were waved throughout the signing and coupled with the candle lights, made for an exquisite sight.

After the ceremony, academics ascended onto stage and spoke on the neccessities for requesting a royally-appointed administration. A performance mocking politics was then staged by students from Thammasat University.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 26 March 2006

[Jai Dee]

Poor people's caravan at Chatuchak pleased with performances by Lukthung singers who sang in support of premier

The demonstration of the poor people's caravan for democracy at Chatuchak (จตุจักร) park immediately livened up via performances by musicians with the content portraying support for the prime minister.

Throughout the night, activities circulated for people that attended the pro-Thaksin gathering at Chatuchak. The demonstrators were noticeably pleased when Lookthung (ลูกทุ่ง) musicians perform their pieces with content in support of the premier.

Leaders of the group who made speeches tonight again declared they will not let any single group lead them on, and also asked that the People's Alliance for Democracy stop strolling along the roads. The core figures also reiterated to the demonstrators urging them to go to the polling stations on April 2nd, in order to contribute to pushing forth the country's democratic regime.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 26 March 2006

[boppia]

The TRT have to keep the PAD members away as they might offer information to the TRT's captives. As long as the TRT can keep the people there away from the other sides information they will always have the option of using them in some sort of extreme protest in the end. Maybe they could threaten a mass suicide if Thaksin doesn't stay in. They can join the moron that was in the paper a few days ago. Or they could use them to attack the people who don't accept the corrupt government.

[Thaible]

Rally renews call for King to step in

''We, the demonstrators, see no solutions to end the crisis without bloodshed other than appealing for His Majesty's help and asking him to consider invoking article 7 of the constitution and appointing an interim government,'' read the petition.

Source: Bangkok Post - Sun, March 26, 2006

Sounds like the PAD are starting to threaten violence.

I hope it's an empty threat - the demonstrations have been amazingly peaceful so far considering how large they are.

Edited March 26, 2006 by Thaible

[lukamar]

Rally renews call for King to step in

''We, the demonstrators, see no solutions to end the crisis without bloodshed

Sounds like the PAD are starting to threaten violence.

I hope it's an empty threat - the demonstrations have been amazingly peaceful so far considering how large they are.

You can probably take intervention by the monarchy out of the equation as General Prem voted in the advanced pole yesterday. In Thailand an action like this speaks volumes.

Goading the government into some form of bloodshed may be the only option left to PAD they have tried everything else. If they can make the government appear to be using unnecessary force it may spark something else to happen to affect the election outcome.

The rallies have been peaceful and I hope they stay that way. The closer to the election date the worse i feel for a peaceful outcome.

[boppia]

Th PAD are nonviolent. They expect the governemnt to crack down on them using violence as time passes by. If the government doesn't use force the protests will continue for the rest of Thaksin's term.

A strange note:

Hasn't Thaksin trying to get weapons out of the hands of average citizens since he has been in office? I think my relative in Isarn had to give up some kind of a cheap rifle he had to shoot birds. Anyone know about this?

[sriracha john]

Rally renews call for King to step in

''We, the demonstrators, see no solutions to end the crisis without bloodshed other than appealing for His Majesty's help and asking him to consider invoking article 7 of the constitution and appointing an interim government,'' read the petition.

Source: Bangkok Post - Sun, March 26, 2006

Sounds like the PAD are starting to threaten violence.

I hope it's an empty threat - the demonstrations have been amazingly peaceful so far considering how large they are.

Thaksin was the first to voice the threatening language:

Published on Mar 21, 2006

Vows to 'reclaim' compound after winning election, if his opponents don't vacate area

"If they [the protesters] don't budge, I'll ask all of you to send me to Government House," Thaksin said during an evening election rally in Chiang Rai.

He asked the audience if they would help him into his office if the protesters besieging the compound did not allow him in after the election victory. The response was a resounding "Yes!"

Using fiery language, he attacked his opponents and members of the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD), which has been staging a continuous anti-Thaksin rally outside Government House since last Tuesday.

The premier said he would protect democracy with his life and would never allow anyone to disrupt Thai democracy.

The Nation

[boppia]

The people of Thailand upcountry generally do not know the complaints against Thaksin as the media is controlled. The people lack information. Once the people get information they will turn on the Thaksin.

[sriracha john]

Rally renews call for King to step in

''We, the demonstrators, see no solutions to end the crisis without bloodshed

Sounds like the PAD are starting to threaten violence.

I hope it's an empty threat - the demonstrations have been amazingly peaceful so far considering how large they are.

You can probably take intervention by the monarchy out of the equation as General Prem voted in the advanced pole yesterday. In Thailand an action like this speaks volumes.

Goading the government into some form of bloodshed may be the only option left to PAD they have tried everything else. If they can make the government appear to be using unnecessary force it may spark something else to happen to affect the election outcome.

The rallies have been peaceful and I hope they stay that way. The closer to the election date the worse i feel for a peaceful outcome.

I think the intepreting Prem's voting as any indication of what His Majesty The King Bhumibol Adulyadej will or will not do is way too open to conjecture.

Without knowing how he voted, it could just as easily be used by the other side with the same level of conjecture, that he voted, "No Vote"...

It's a shame really that Prem doesn't reside in Samut Sakhon... then we would know exactly how he voted....

I too hope things remain peaceful on both sides and that if the protestors are still there in Bangkok after the election that Thaksin doesn't follow through on his own threats.

[marshbags]

Rally renews call for King to step in

''We, the demonstrators, see no solutions to end the crisis without bloodshed other than appealing for His Majesty's help and asking him to consider invoking article 7 of the constitution and appointing an interim government,'' read the petition.

Source: Bangkok Post - Sun, March 26, 2006

Sounds like the PAD are starting to threaten violence.

I hope it's an empty threat - the demonstrations have been amazingly peaceful so far considering how large they are.

Come off it Thaible since when do any of the leaders subscribe or indeed want a violent senario.

Most sensible people know that the PAD are not offering violence and are referring to what many of us fear may eventually happen due to third party interference.

That is the constant threat over hanging this powder keg situation and a possible repeat of past demonstrations when the going gets tough is not very encouraging or reassuring.

We do not want one drop of blood spilled and a peaceful, just solution.

Should bloodshed occur at a later stage there is only one person that has the power to prevent this.

This peaceful demonstration deserves better than just being constantly referred to as a mob.

Coming from Thaksin this is pathetic and insulting to Thai democracy and all the citizens that

have shown restraint from every insult.

Finally it is not in anyones interest , especially the demonstrators and the spokes people in charge to even think of this. They are peaceful organisations.

marshbags

Edited March 26, 2006 by marshbags

[Jai Dee]

One protester killed after overrun by van

A protester who was sleeping on the road in front of the Makkawan stage near Government House was fatally overrun by a van early Sunday morning.

The man, Narongchai Thanthong, 62, from Si Sa Ket, was sleeping on the left lane on Rajdamnoen Road in front of the stage at the Makkawan Rangsan Bridge when a van came in and overran him at 3 am.

The van sped off immediately.

Police said the section of the road was closed to traffic so they did not understand why it could come into the area.

Narongchai died at the Vatchira Hospital.

The van sped away toward the direction of Rajdamnoen Boxing Stadium and police were hunting for it.

Source: The Nation - Breaking News - Last updated 07:56 am (Thai local time)

[Jai Dee]

REAL-TIME UPDATE FROM THE NATION

Another historic march for democracy

The People's Alliance for Democracy holds another historic march from the National Stadium to Sukhumvit Road to urge more people to come out to support the calls for a royal intervention in the political crisis.

The PAD declared victory Saturday night after over 150,000 people come out to show support for its appeal to His Majesty to grant an interim government to carry out political reform.

The PAD plans to march protesters from the stadium past Siam Square and Siam Paragon shopping areas to Sukhumvit Road to highlight its cause.

The Nation keeps you updated as the historic event unfolds:

10:06 am: Protesters are seen carrying umbrella, national flags, signs in criticism of Thaksin while forming the line. The procession begins to move.

10:03 am: People start forming line of parade.

10:00 am: Protesters shout "Thaksin get out" now and then while waiting for the march to begin.

9:58 am: ASTV reports that the ground in the front part of the National Stadium's compound is already fully occupied. It says people come out to wait to join the march since 8 am and many carry water bottles with them.

9:55 am: Manager Online reports that dozens of policemen are keeping security outside the house of Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra on Soi Charansanitwonge 69 from the mouth of the soi throughout the soi.

9:19 am: Inside the National Stadium's compound starts to get crowded with protesters coming to join the march, Manager Online reports. It says several TV stations puts up camera to broadcast the event.

7:50 am: The People's Alliance for Democracy starts gathering protesters remaining at the Makkawan Bridge stage to parade to the National Stadium.

[Jai Dee]