The Future Of Electric Cars?

[mogandave]

There will be no significant change in the viability electric vehicles until there is a fundamental breakthrough in conductors.

[IMHO]

^{the problem is that everyone wants EVs to be like "real" cars , with AC in the summer and a good heater in the freezing Northern USA-European winters.....}

^{plus throw in electric windows, electric power steering , radio etc and your driving range is very limited ,}

^{If you are happy with an electric "Golf Cart " then you can build them cheap ,}

^{a big jump will be a new battery design , something no one has thought of yet ,}

^{Check out some Top Gear shows , they tried to drive about 100 miles and had big problems , and the test of Tesla sports car ran the battery out after only a few miles of crazy track driving,}

^{A pure electric car is not ready for prime time yet........ hopefully soon}

^I answered before I read your post IMHO but seems we are of the same mind.

I think the problem is as much about infrastructure and more rapid charging stations at least initially as anything and clearly the governments of the world need to take the lead on this and then the private finance will come forward.

The answer is in some sort of electric magnetic charging strip wireless transfer system technology on the road surface in specific lanes to allow for recharging while still driving.. I'd venture a guess that if just few billion of the current military budgets world wide were sequestered and put towards the development of such a system with the balance of that budget going to the first government and or private contractor that developed a successful system there would plenty of offerings in short order..

The charge-as-you-go systems are technically viable, but would take a very long time to implement, and don't become widely useful until the task is largely completed. Also, think about countries where a pothole goes un-serviced for years - no way are they ready/able to maintain infrastructure like this

To me, the most workable solution is one where you don't own the batteries at all, nor do you charge them. Instead of popping into a gas station for more gasoline, you instead pop-in for a quick battery swap. This would be a much easier and faster proposition from a deploy perspective, suits existing business models with only modest investment, would allow recharging of batteries off-peak to ease strain on the grid, and also would make the initial vehicle cost lower as you're not buying lithium and other rare materials, only borrowing it.

At the same time it also solves the big resale problems existing EV's are going to have...

If already implemented, would also mean that all those people that bought Fisker's wouldn't been soon to be out in the cold with an unmaintainable car

Better Place tried to do this on their own, but failed in US and Australia. It needs government legislation to work properly (i.e. force all EV manufacturers to adopt standard battery form factors and also support it with incentives), but at least Better Place have proven the system & business model works in smaller scales for them (Denmark and Israel).

Edit: It would also mean that existign EV's could take advantage of new battery technologies as they become available too... Think about how far standard AAA/AA/C/D batteries have come, and how beautifully backwards compat they turned out to be

Edited April 11, 2013 by IMHO

[WarpSpeed]

^{the problem is that everyone wants EVs to be like "real" cars , with AC in the summer and a good heater in the freezing Northern USA-European winters.....}

^{plus throw in electric windows, electric power steering , radio etc and your driving range is very limited ,}

^{If you are happy with an electric "Golf Cart " then you can build them cheap ,}

^{a big jump will be a new battery design , something no one has thought of yet ,}

^{Check out some Top Gear shows , they tried to drive about 100 miles and had big problems , and the test of Tesla sports car ran the battery out after only a few miles of crazy track driving,}

^{A pure electric car is not ready for prime time yet........ hopefully soon}

^I answered before I read your post IMHO but seems we are of the same mind.

I think the problem is as much about infrastructure and more rapid charging stations at least initially as anything and clearly the governments of the world need to take the lead on this and then the private finance will come forward.

The answer is in some sort of electric magnetic charging strip wireless transfer system technology on the road surface in specific lanes to allow for recharging while still driving.. I'd venture a guess that if just few billion of the current military budgets world wide were sequestered and put towards the development of such a system with the balance of that budget going to the first government and or private contractor that developed a successful system there would plenty of offerings in short order..

The charge-as-you-go systems are technically viable, but would take a very long time to implement, and don't become widely useful until the task is largely completed. Also, think about countries where a pothole goes un-serviced for years - no way are they ready/able to maintain infrastructure like this

To me, the most workable solution is one where you don't own the batteries at all, nor do you charge them. Instead of popping into a gas station for more gasoline, you instead pop-in for a quick battery swap. This would be a much easier and faster proposition from a deploy perspective, suits existing business models with only modest investment, would allow recharging of batteries off-peak to ease strain on the grid, and also would make the initial vehicle cost lower as you're not buying lithium and other rare materials, only borrowing it.

At the same time it also solves the big resale problems existing EV's are going to have...

If already implemented, would also mean that all those people that bought Fisker's wouldn't been soon to be out in the cold with an unmaintainable car

Better Place tried to do this on their own, but failed in US and Australia. It needs government legislation to work properly (i.e. force all EV manufacturers to adopt standard battery form factors and also support it with incentives), but at least Better Place have proven the system & business model works in smaller scales for them (Denmark and Israel).

Edit: It would also mean that existign EV's could take advantage of new battery technologies as they become available too... Think about how far standard AAA/AA/C/D batteries have come, and how beautifully backwards compat they turned out to be

I agree in the shorter term your solution is definitely the way go but as well as was mentioned it's going to have to begin with governments getting involved first with proper regulations and the like. I wouldn't worry too much about the countries with poor roads as it's baby steps first as always, many of those countries didn't even have many cars up until recently either and if the rest of the world were to update and apply the technology it would still relieve billions of gallons of fossil fuels being used per day in those more advanced countries so the world as a whole would still benefit greatly in managing the loss of that fuel better and lowering exhaust emissions while they make an effort to catch up.

Edited April 11, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[Ace of Pop]

Do you remember when Hydrogen Power was the thing of the future.What happened to that idea.

[IMHO]

Do you remember when Hydrogen Power was the thing of the future.What happened to that idea.

Most hydrogen fuel cell research projects have been abandoned in the US, but there's still a few active ones in EU and JP...

It's still a great fuel for generating electricity on the fly, and would mean battery-less electric cars if/when they make a commercially viable system..

[IMHO]

^{the problem is that everyone wants EVs to be like "real" cars , with AC in the summer and a good heater in the freezing Northern USA-European winters.....}

^{plus throw in electric windows, electric power steering , radio etc and your driving range is very limited ,}

^{If you are happy with an electric "Golf Cart " then you can build them cheap ,}

^{a big jump will be a new battery design , something no one has thought of yet ,}

^{Check out some Top Gear shows , they tried to drive about 100 miles and had big problems , and the test of Tesla sports car ran the battery out after only a few miles of crazy track driving,}

^{A pure electric car is not ready for prime time yet........ hopefully soon}

^I answered before I read your post IMHO but seems we are of the same mind.

I think the problem is as much about infrastructure and more rapid charging stations at least initially as anything and clearly the governments of the world need to take the lead on this and then the private finance will come forward.

The answer is in some sort of electric magnetic charging strip wireless transfer system technology on the road surface in specific lanes to allow for recharging while still driving.. I'd venture a guess that if just few billion of the current military budgets world wide were sequestered and put towards the development of such a system with the balance of that budget going to the first government and or private contractor that developed a successful system there would plenty of offerings in short order..

The charge-as-you-go systems are technically viable, but would take a very long time to implement, and don't become widely useful until the task is largely completed. Also, think about countries where a pothole goes un-serviced for years - no way are they ready/able to maintain infrastructure like this

To me, the most workable solution is one where you don't own the batteries at all, nor do you charge them. Instead of popping into a gas station for more gasoline, you instead pop-in for a quick battery swap. This would be a much easier and faster proposition from a deploy perspective, suits existing business models with only modest investment, would allow recharging of batteries off-peak to ease strain on the grid, and also would make the initial vehicle cost lower as you're not buying lithium and other rare materials, only borrowing it.

At the same time it also solves the big resale problems existing EV's are going to have...

If already implemented, would also mean that all those people that bought Fisker's wouldn't been soon to be out in the cold with an unmaintainable car

Better Place tried to do this on their own, but failed in US and Australia. It needs government legislation to work properly (i.e. force all EV manufacturers to adopt standard battery form factors and also support it with incentives), but at least Better Place have proven the system & business model works in smaller scales for them (Denmark and Israel).

Edit: It would also mean that existign EV's could take advantage of new battery technologies as they become available too... Think about how far standard AAA/AA/C/D batteries have come, and how beautifully backwards compat they turned out to be

I agree in the shorter term your solution is definitely the way go but as well as was mentioned it's going to have to begin with governments getting involved first with proper regulations and the like. I wouldn't worry too much about the countries with poor roads as it's baby steps first as always, many of those countries didn't even have many cars up until recently either and if the rest of the world were to update and apply the technology it would still relieve billions of gallons of fossil fuels being used per day in those more advanced countries so the world as a whole would still benefit greatly in managing the loss of that fuel better and lowering exhaust emissions while they make an effort to catch up.

Agree, it's a great scenario, but think about Thailand implementing infrastructure like this - you may as well propose the govt makes all roads out of titanium

By the time the govt here agreed to take on infrastructure like this, Mr Fusion will probably be a reality and it can then just slot into your old world-standard vehicle battery slot

[WarpSpeed]

Do you remember when Hydrogen Power was the thing of the future.What happened to that idea.

It blew up in peoples faces.... Seriously the current world environment does not bode well for everyone driving around in their own private bomb factory..

Edited April 12, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[WarpSpeed]

I answered before I read your post IMHO but seems we are of the same mind.

^{the problem is that everyone wants EVs to be like "real" cars , with AC in the summer and a good heater in the freezing Northern USA-European winters.....}

^{plus throw in electric windows, electric power steering , radio etc and your driving range is very limited ,}

^{If you are happy with an electric "Golf Cart " then you can build them cheap ,}

^{a big jump will be a new battery design , something no one has thought of yet ,}

^{Check out some Top Gear shows , they tried to drive about 100 miles and had big problems , and the test of Tesla sports car ran the battery out after only a few miles of crazy track driving,}

^{A pure electric car is not ready for prime time yet........ hopefully soon}

I think the problem is as much about infrastructure and more rapid charging stations at least initially as anything and clearly the governments of the world need to take the lead on this and then the private finance will come forward.

The answer is in some sort of electric magnetic charging strip wireless transfer system technology on the road surface in specific lanes to allow for recharging while still driving.. I'd venture a guess that if just few billion of the current military budgets world wide were sequestered and put towards the development of such a system with the balance of that budget going to the first government and or private contractor that developed a successful system there would plenty of offerings in short order..

The charge-as-you-go systems are technically viable, but would take a very long time to implement, and don't become widely useful until the task is largely completed. Also, think about countries where a pothole goes un-serviced for years - no way are they ready/able to maintain infrastructure like this

To me, the most workable solution is one where you don't own the batteries at all, nor do you charge them. Instead of popping into a gas station for more gasoline, you instead pop-in for a quick battery swap. This would be a much easier and faster proposition from a deploy perspective, suits existing business models with only modest investment, would allow recharging of batteries off-peak to ease strain on the grid, and also would make the initial vehicle cost lower as you're not buying lithium and other rare materials, only borrowing it.

At the same time it also solves the big resale problems existing EV's are going to have...

If already implemented, would also mean that all those people that bought Fisker's wouldn't been soon to be out in the cold with an unmaintainable car

Better Place tried to do this on their own, but failed in US and Australia. It needs government legislation to work properly (i.e. force all EV manufacturers to adopt standard battery form factors and also support it with incentives), but at least Better Place have proven the system & business model works in smaller scales for them (Denmark and Israel).

Edit: It would also mean that existign EV's could take advantage of new battery technologies as they become available too... Think about how far standard AAA/AA/C/D batteries have come, and how beautifully backwards compat they turned out to be

I agree in the shorter term your solution is definitely the way go but as well as was mentioned it's going to have to begin with governments getting involved first with proper regulations and the like. I wouldn't worry too much about the countries with poor roads as it's baby steps first as always, many of those countries didn't even have many cars up until recently either and if the rest of the world were to update and apply the technology it would still relieve billions of gallons of fossil fuels being used per day in those more advanced countries so the world as a whole would still benefit greatly in managing the loss of that fuel better and lowering exhaust emissions while they make an effort to catch up.

Agree, it's a great scenario, but think about Thailand implementing infrastructure like this - you may as well propose the govt makes all roads out of titanium

By the time the govt here agreed to take on infrastructure like this, Mr Fusion will probably be a reality and it can then just slot into your old world-standard vehicle battery slot

Not if there's enough kick back in it for them.. And it's certain there would be plenty to go around ..

[Ace of Pop]

Do you remember when Hydrogen Power was the thing of the future.What happened to that idea.

It blew up in peoples faces.... Seriously the current world environment does not bode well for everyone driving around in their own private bomb factory..

Like Gas Tanks bolted under Salunas.

[WarpSpeed]

Do you remember when Hydrogen Power was the thing of the future.What happened to that idea.

It blew up in peoples faces.... Seriously the current world environment does not bode well for everyone driving around in their own private bomb factory..

Like Gas Tanks bolted under Salunas.

A little bit more potentially volatile then that ..

[mogandave]

Do you remember when Hydrogen Power was the thing of the future.What happened to that idea.

It blew up in peoples faces.... Seriously the current world environment does not bode well for everyone driving around in their own private bomb factory..

Seriously, it was the idiotic US government the killed the hydrogen-cell.

These silly e-cars crack me up.

[WarpSpeed]

Doubtful it was strictly one government? Unless the new world order was instituted without the public's knowledge already speaks pretty loudly about the meekness of the rest of the world to put it all on just one doesn't it?. But it's certain it needs to be looked at veeery carefully on many levels before the technology can be widely introduced..

[mogandave]

Plenty of companies still working on H-cells, they just no longer get subsidies from the US government. GM's H-cell was scratched when the UAW was bailed out.

[WarpSpeed]

What about an electric truck? Would you?

Is Tesla Motors (NASDAQ: TSLA ) really planning to build a new factory to make electric trucks -- inTexas?

"Planning" probably overstates things some. But the Silicon Valley-cool maker of electric cars seems to have a pickup in its future plans -- and its CEO said this week that a factory in Texas could be in the cards.

Tesla needs a favor in Texas
As always with Tesla, there's more to the story.

Here's the background: Tesla's rock-star CEO, Elon Musk, was in Austin this week, pressing Texas state lawmakers to pass a measure that would allow his company to sell its cars directly to consumers.

http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2013/04/13/will-tesla-motors-really-build-trucks-in-texas.aspx

Edited April 14, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[mogandave]

They can't sell the cars, so their strategy is to start building trucks, brilliant.

They'll

[WarpSpeed]

They can't sell the cars, so their strategy is to start building trucks, brilliant.

They'll

Well that's not exactly what the strategy is, not sure if you read the article or not but it

is trying to break into the Texas market by going around the dealership network and selling directly so using this prospect as a carrot to the legislature but it does beg the question I asked, what would the interest be if they were to go that route I wonder? As a truck an EV faces a lot of additional challenges in electronics and durability that don't present themselves to cars on good roads and not pulling loads for example..