Thai Charter Battle Moves To Constitutional Court

[webfact]

Charter battle moves to Constitutional Court
The Nation

The supporters and opponents of the charter change accused each other of violating the law.

BANGKOK: -- Senator Paiboon Nititawan yesterday warned that coalition MPs and pro-government senators might be removed from office for enacting a bill to amend Article 68 of the Constitution.

Paiboon, an appointed senator of the so-called Group of 40 Senators, said if the Constitutional Court ruled that an amendment to Article 68 was unconstitutional, MPs and senators who voted for the amendment, might be regarded as having violated the charter.

He said the parties of the MPs might be dissolved and the senators might be removed from office.

The Constitutional Court decided on Wednesday to proceed with a trial in the complaint against Parliament President Somsak Kiatsuranont and 311 coalition MPs and senators who supported Article 68 amendment.

The proposed amendment seeks to restrict the people's right to submit petitions to the Constitutional Court via the Office of the Attorney-General only.

Senator Somchai Sawaengkarn, who filed the complaint against Somsak and the 311 parliamentarians, alleged that the amendment would violate the charter as the Constitutional Court had earlier ruled that it had the power to receive complaints from the public directly. Somchai also alleged that the amendment to Article 68 was planned with ulterior motives.

Paiboon said it was expected that the bill would be sent back to Parliament for the second reading in June but he said if the Constitutional Court ruled that the amendment was unconstitutional, the deliberation process must stop.

He said if Constitutional Court rules against the amendment after the bill clears the third reading, the prime minister must not send the bill for a royal command.

If the court rules against the amendment, Article 154 might be invoked to remove MPs and senators who supported the amendment, from office, Paiboon said.

Paiboon said he had learned that civil society groups might also file criminal complaints against the MPs and senators with the National Anti-Corruption Commission.

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

Pichit alleged that the Constitutional Court judges who voted to try the case had violated the defendants' rights to receive a fair trial by indicating in their decision on Wednesday that the amendment appeared to be wrong.

Pichit said Article 40 guaranteed the rights of defendants to receive fair trial so the Constitutional Court judges apparently violated the article.

Pichit said the court's decision to proceed with the trial was also tantamount to a violation of the power of the legislative branch that has the authority to enact laws.

Pichit said the Pheu Thai might file complaints against the Constitutional Court judges with the Administrative Court and the courts of justice.

Pheu Thai MP from Ubon Ratchathani, Somkid Chueakong, said he and his colleague Worachai Hema would file a complaint with the police at Thung Song Hong Police Station today against the Constitutional Court for abusing its power. It was interfering in the legislative branch's power while it should not have accepted to rule in the case filed by Somchai.

The People's Alliance for Democracy yesterday threatened to rally against the proposed charter changes, saying they were aimed at protecting the vested interests of politicians.

After a meeting of the first and second generation of PAD leaders, spokesman Parnthep Pourpongpan issued a statement opposing the amendment of Articles 68, 111, 190 and 237 of the Constitution.

PAD leader Chamlong Srimuang said the yellow shirts would carefully evaluate the country's political situation before calling for a protest.

Parnthep said the movement supports the drafters of the 2007 Constitution in asking the National Counter-Corruption Commission to check the government's Bt2-trillion loan bill.

PAD has assigned its lawyers to consult with academics and legal advisers to seek more legal venues to bring offenders to justice, he said.


-- The Nation 2013-04-05

[chainarong]

Once again the Conststution is under attack, I have a distinct feeling ,the courts in this land of smiles , now toe the PTP line ,as in the Thaskin era, when it was the academic's ,who bravely, under constant threats , took centre stage and were the only voice of reason, I see that happening again.

[animatic]

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

Pichit alleged that the Constitutional Court judges who voted to try the case had violated the defendants' rights to receive a fair trial by indicating in their decision on Wednesday that the amendment appeared to be wrong.

Always a counter attack, no matter how illogical.

Threaten not, win not. PTP at work.

[yoshiwara]

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

'a legal expert of the Pheu Thai' Always need a good joke to start the day.

[muttley]

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

'a legal expert of the Pheu Thai' Always need a good joke to start the day.

Why is it a good joke? The Constitutional Court are acting outside of their remit, again - how can you honestly say that by amending the constitution articles the PTP are trying to overthrow the State? The Constitutional Court are acting irrationally by even agreeing to take the "case". Were the "democrat" party accused of overthrowing the state when they amended the constitution articles in parliament? The answer's No, and do not even bother with the infantile "but but" argument.

The PTP need the best lawyers they can get their hands on if only to fend off all the frivolous charges being made by the "democrat" party and the junta appointed gang of 40 senators (oh and the PAD on occasion).

If the "democrat" party put as much energy into a decent campaign for being elected as they do in all these stupid challenges more of the electorate may even respect them.

[MunterHunter]

If the "democrat" party put as much energy into a decent campaign for being elected as they do in all these stupid challenges more of the electorate may even respect them.

So the opposition party should just shut up, not interfere with the Governments plans to rape and pillage the country and just focus on the general election in 2-3 years time? Thank God your kind isn't running the country... oh hang on, they are, that's why we are in this mess to start with!

[Locationthailand]

Let's hope the Constitution Court gets its day to debate article 68 and find against them. I don't think the case is a push over but for the sake of this country the 311 who voted for it will certainly be sitting on the edge of their seats.

[JetsetBkk]

Oh good grief! Let's have another army coup and be done with it.

[jcb2001]

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

'a legal expert of the Pheu Thai' Always need a good joke to start the day.

The Constitutional Court are acting irrationally by even agreeing to take the "case".

Are you serious? I believe this is the function of the Constitutional Court, ruling on constitutional matters. You've been brainwashed!

[muttley]

If the "democrat" party put as much energy into a decent campaign for being elected as they do in all these stupid challenges more of the electorate may even respect them.

So the opposition party should just shut up, not interfere with the Governments plans to rape and pillage the country and just focus on the general election in 2-3 years time? Thank God your kind isn't running the country... oh hang on, they are, that's why we are in this mess to start with!

I have nothing against them challenging the government, after all that's what they are there for. What I abhor is the hypocrisy demonstrated by them.

If the "democrat" party are right that means that no changes to the constitution can ever be made through the parliamentary system, ever. This despite a ruling (brought about by the last frivolous charge by the "democrat" party invoking Article 68) by the Constitutional Court that the way the Government are proceeding is not only above board but constitutionally correct.

Again because of the "democrat" party trying to stir things up the CC have made a rod for their own back and will now have to rule on every constitutional challenge thrown its way whether it be a "real" charge or purely muck spreading by the opposition.

"Plans to rape and pillage the Country" Oh the hyperbole!

[scorecard]

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

Pichit alleged that the Constitutional Court judges who voted to try the case had violated the defendants' rights to receive a fair trial by indicating in their decision on Wednesday that the amendment appeared to be wrong.

Always a counter attack, no matter how illogical.

Threaten not, win not. PTP at work.

Also, seems like the usual pt line, 'we won the election, therefore we have the right to enact anything we want'.

Edited April 5, 2013 by scorecard

[siampolee]

Oh good grief! Let's have another army coup and be done with it.

The last army coup was against a non legal Prime Minister and indeed popular feeling was with the military as the event's at that time clearly showed.

This time around, too many vested interests involved from Thaksin , the Red Shirts P.AD and a number of other shady groups and individuals who have their own agendas.

If there is a situation where civil strife may yet rise to the forefront again it's not going to be a pleasant time the struggle for power and control of this country ,its money and its peoples are serous matters for certain groups and there will be a lot more violence, wanton destruction of property and indeed blood flowing on the streets this time around.

The rat pack that wants total dominance will fight tooth and nail to achieve their sponsors aims, the splinter groups will indeed create assorted inter group strife to ensure that they get a crumb or two from the power struggle on the dining table which will be set out as Thailand.

The current maladministration is continuing to flaunt, distort and amend and also ignore the rule of law in their relentless pursuit of total dominance for their puppet master and his clan along with their brown nosing acolytes thus indeed leading Thailand along a twisting dangerous path as the peoples and the country's future is determined

On reflection a military coup might be for what it is worth the lesser of all the evils that we are currently facing.

Edited April 5, 2013 by siampolee

[muttley]

But Pichit Chuenban, a legal expert of the Pheu Thai, said Constitutional Court judges themselves would face a criminal probe for violating the charter by accepting the complaint against Somsak and the 311 other defendants.

'a legal expert of the Pheu Thai' Always need a good joke to start the day.

The Constitutional Court are acting irrationally by even agreeing to take the "case".

Are you serious? I believe this is the function of the Constitutional Court, ruling on constitutional matters. You've been brainwashed!

Of course I'm serious - let me spell it out for you again

"how can you honestly say that by amending the constitution articles the PTP are trying to overthrow the State?"

Go on, without the hyperbole or faux shock explain to me - and the Forum - how the amendment of the mentioned articles in the Constitution could be regarded as an attempt to "overthrow the democratic regime of government with the King as Head of State under this Constitution"

Please, I can't wait.

[MunterHunter]

I thought the Article 68 was there to protect peoples constitutional right to appeal to the courts... this is what the Government are trying to throw out, no?

So by amending this article, people will have no rights to petition the constitutional court on matters of the constitution. Paving the way for them to do a wholesale rewrite of the constitution where the electorate is not allowed to try and stop them.

Yeah, seems 'democratic' to me... Not! First remove the public's ability to challenge the government, then forge ahead with whatever changes they want to... didn't one of the PTP muppets already confirm this to be the case? And the Office of the Attorney General is a politically influenced position, and will favour the Pay-Master over peoples rights.

[backtonormal]

Oh good grief! Let's have another army coup and be done with it.

The last army coup was against a non legal Prime Minister and indeed popular feeling was with the military as the event's at that time clearly showed.

This time around, too many vested interests involved from Thaksin , the Red Shirts P.AD and a number of other shady groups and individuals who have their own agendas.

If there is a situation where civil strife may yet rise to the forefront again it's not going to be a pleasant time the struggle for power and control of this country ,its money and its peoples are serous matters for certain groups and there will be a lot more violence, wanton destruction of property and indeed blood flowing on the streets this time around.

The rat pack that wants total dominance will fight tooth and nail to achieve their sponsors aims, the splinter groups will indeed create assorted inter group strife to ensure that they get a crumb or two from the power struggle on the dining table which will be set out as Thailand.

The current maladministration is continuing to flaunt, distort and amend and also ignore the rule of law in their relentless pursuit of total dominance for their puppet master and his clan along with their brown nosing acolytes thus indeed leading Thailand along a twisting dangerous path as the peoples and the country's future is determined

On reflection a military coup might be for what it is worth the lesser of all the evils that we are currently facing.

On reflection...this is why this country is still in the dark ages because you are your like keep advocating the army takes over. Thailands ratings are up, the currency is strong, ASEAN around the corner, stable government, international companies have pledged money to create jobs etc. and you would rather have the men in khaki run the country for their amart bosses and return us back 50 years where the poor have to doff their caps to the gentry. Save your fingerprints, stop typing this nonsense. You much like the PAD, The Green party etc are in an insignificant minority.

The game purpetrated for the last century is nearing an end, you lead everybody to believe that corruption started and ended with Thaksin. Thaksin is small fry in the money grabbing stakes compared to the theft that has occurred from state coffers in the last 50 years

[muttley]

Oh good grief! Let's have another army coup and be done with it.

The last army coup was against a non legal Prime Minister and indeed popular feeling was with the military as the event's at that time clearly showed.

This time around, too many vested interests involved from Thaksin , the Red Shirts P.AD and a number of other shady groups and individuals who have their own agendas.

If there is a situation where civil strife may yet rise to the forefront again it's not going to be a pleasant time the struggle for power and control of this country ,its money and its peoples are serous matters for certain groups and there will be a lot more violence, wanton destruction of property and indeed blood flowing on the streets this time around.

The rat pack that wants total dominance will fight tooth and nail to achieve their sponsors aims, the splinter groups will indeed create assorted inter group strife to ensure that they get a crumb or two from the power struggle on the dining table which will be set out as Thailand.

The current maladministration is continuing to flaunt, distort and amend and also ignore the rule of law in their relentless pursuit of total dominance for their puppet master and his clan along with their brown nosing acolytes thus indeed leading Thailand along a twisting dangerous path as the peoples and the country's future is determined

On reflection a military coup might be for what it is worth the lesser of all the evils that we are currently facing.

The last military coup overthrew a caretaker Prime Minister whose party was gearing up for a royally endorsed election just weeks away when the coup was launched - but don't let the facts get in the way of your stories.

I'm still awaiting your thoughts on just exactly how the proposed amendments to the constitution is just a veiled attempt to provide an amnesty for Thaksin but I feel I'll be waiting a long time as you have no thoughts on it , just plain hatred and bitterness which clouds your judgement and leads to "shoot from the lip" posts such as that above.

And back to your thoughts on another coup - the final "reset button" for the hard of thinking brigade. Heedless of the correlation between the last coup and the divided Nation that exists today, the call is out for another coup.

Perhaps you should divert over to this thread

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/630877-locked-in-suspicion-over-thai-charter-change/#entry6271965

where you could read this

All sides agree on the untold damage inflicted by the 2006 coup. Hence, it is ironic, even absurd, that relevant parties are citing the coup as a pretext to push for their respective agendas.

and maybe learn something about coups.

[scorecard]

Oh good grief! Let's have another army coup and be done with it.

The last army coup was against a non legal Prime Minister and indeed popular feeling was with the military as the event's at that time clearly showed.

This time around, too many vested interests involved from Thaksin , the Red Shirts P.AD and a number of other shady groups and individuals who have their own agendas.

If there is a situation where civil strife may yet rise to the forefront again it's not going to be a pleasant time the struggle for power and control of this country ,its money and its peoples are serous matters for certain groups and there will be a lot more violence, wanton destruction of property and indeed blood flowing on the streets this time around.

The rat pack that wants total dominance will fight tooth and nail to achieve their sponsors aims, the splinter groups will indeed create assorted inter group strife to ensure that they get a crumb or two from the power struggle on the dining table which will be set out as Thailand.

The current maladministration is continuing to flaunt, distort and amend and also ignore the rule of law in their relentless pursuit of total dominance for their puppet master and his clan along with their brown nosing acolytes thus indeed leading Thailand along a twisting dangerous path as the peoples and the country's future is determined

On reflection a military coup might be for what it is worth the lesser of all the evils that we are currently facing.

The last military coup overthrew a caretaker Prime Minister whose party was gearing up for a royally endorsed election just weeks away when the coup was launched - but don't let the facts get in the way of your stories.

I'm still awaiting your thoughts on just exactly how the proposed amendments to the constitution is just a veiled attempt to provide an amnesty for Thaksin but I feel I'll be waiting a long time as you have no thoughts on it , just plain hatred and bitterness which clouds your judgement and leads to "shoot from the lip" posts such as that above.

And back to your thoughts on another coup - the final "reset button" for the hard of thinking brigade. Heedless of the correlation between the last coup and the divided Nation that exists today, the call is out for another coup.

Perhaps you should divert over to this thread

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/630877-locked-in-suspicion-over-thai-charter-change/#entry6271965

where you could read this

>>All sides agree on the untold damage inflicted by the 2006 coup. Hence, it is ironic, even absurd, that relevant parties are citing the coup as a pretext to push for their respective agendas.

and maybe learn something about coups.

You quote something in bold font but with no name, but not difficult to go back to the opinion piece from journalist Khun Avudh from the nation:

- It's his opinion, not fact. Can you provide some evidence that 'all sides agree on the untold damage inflicted by the 2006 coup.....'

IMHO (opinion) that's not true.

- It's against forum rules to change fonts, colours, etc of other peoples posts.

But perhaps you also suscbise to the values of 'do whatever makes you happy / no respect for laws, principles, etc'.

Edited April 5, 2013 by scorecard

[muttley]

I thought the Article 68 was there to protect peoples constitutional right to appeal to the courts... this is what the Government are trying to throw out, no?

So by amending this article, people will have no rights to petition the constitutional court on matters of the constitution. Paving the way for them to do a wholesale rewrite of the constitution where the electorate is not allowed to try and stop them.

Yeah, seems 'democratic' to me... Not! First remove the public's ability to challenge the government, then forge ahead with whatever changes they want to... didn't one of the PTP muppets already confirm this to be the case? And the Office of the Attorney General is a politically influenced position, and will favour the Pay-Master over peoples rights.

No, No,No.

Read the constitution - I've provided the first part of Article 68, the important part. Actually, no forget it, believe what you read on here - you will anyway. By the way if the AG is such a politically influenced position why do you think that the PTP has left the AG in position when he was appointed by abhisit? Or is it that these people only turn politically motivated under the PTP government?

[rubl]

Still waiting for good reasoning why the articles should be amended and why amended as proposed. Just "well, it was dictated by the Junta" ot "Thaksin said to push for it" is not good enough a justification

[dcutman]

Still waiting for good reasoning why the articles should be amended and why amended as proposed. Just "well, it was dictated by the Junta" ot "Thaksin said to push for it" is not good enough a justification

It appears Thaksin is trusting enough. He only wants the best for Thailand. You can see in these pictures the sincerity in his face.

[siampolee]

How amusing to see the valiant staunch defenders of a morally bankrupt exile and a convicted bail jumping felon ;defend him and his clan and their brown nosing acolytes.

Wonderful comments yet no substance to back those comments up.

Strangely enough I didn't advocate a military coup backtonormal.

I made a passing comment that indeed the options on offer werwe and are frightening and the inter faction strife would indeed cause great distress to this country and its people.

The military option is focused on one target and the opposition to that move would also be focused on one target one would know where the enemy was and who the enemy is so to speak.

Living here as I have for some 22 years I've seen many comings and goings strangely enough though I haven't noticed theft and deception and the crusade to destroy what little democracy there is here now on any scale like it is now.

Revolutions are not pleasant look at the history of the French Revolution and the fact that the true aim was lost and a dreadful price was paid in human life.If things go wrong here that is the road that Thailand and its people will be dragged down as they are only pawns in one person and his family and their brown nosing acolytes plans.

The military option might not be the best but the human cost would be nil, just like the last time a despot was removed from power here in Thgailand

.

I have no desire to see any form of civil disorder however the fuses have been lit by a number of assorted groups none of which I have any political affiliation or liking for so please do not judge me according to your dogmas and your somewhat rouge tinted googles either backtonormal and of course your sidekick muttely .

Your myopic views certainly indicate that your ideas of democracy are indeed a trifle flawed. as are your arguments..